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 Short Review on the Exora Bold

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TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 10:55 AM, updated 14y ago

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QUOTE
Today (16/12/2011) is quite a significant date for Proton, as their latest child, the Exora Bold and Exora Prime is officially launched. To the uninitiated, the Exora Bold and Exora Prime is now power by the new Campro CFE 1.6 turbocharged engine. I managed to have a go in an Exora Bold today.

Upon starting the Exora, the first thing I noticed was the new redesigned meter clusters. It looks very much like those Toyota Optitron meter, white and bright. I did notice the gear shifter was a tad bit tall, not sure if it was a defect or just eases gear shifting. Upon letting loose on the highways, the Exora Bold’s 205nm of torque is unleashed from 2000rpm onwards. You can hear the turbo sound if your radio is not turned on. Not exactly a bad thing, as it’s a subtle hint of what lies under the bonnet. Mated with a CVT gearbox from Punch Powertrain, the Exora Bold surprises me with it’s pulling power. Without much ado, the Exora Bold reaches 110km/h and keeps going. I managed somewhere around 120km/h before I ran out of safe roads. Wind noise and tire noise were almost nonexistent. Stopping power is provided by 4 disc brakes all round, coupled with ABS+EBD for that extra safety. Just so you guys know, the Exora Bold has rubbers from GTRadial. Sure the name is cool, but did you know that GTRadial actually comes from Gajah Tunggal in Indonesia? Thumbs up for that creative name. Besides the stopping power, the Exora Bold’s steering offers much feedback, in comparison to the Nissan Grand Livina’s EPS one. Although the EPS assists a lot in low speed cornering, high speeds on highways can get rather scary and unnerving; due to the lack of feedback the EPS offers (or does not). Suspension wise, there was no official word from Proton saying that it was retuned or carried over from the Exora, but the (now) Proton Ride and Handling really prevails itself. When driven on bumpy roads, the Exora Bold managed to keep occupants nice and comfy, while high speeds on highways does not get bouncy at all. Thumbs up for the excellent suspension set up. The Inspira has the same feel as the Exora, although the Exora tends to exhibit a bit of body roll when pushed into corners hard.

As for the feature set, now the Exora Bold comes with a rear camera parking assist. It’s a similar system used in the Kia Forte, and really helps parking in tight spots. Leather seats are also available on the Exora Bold. I won’t touch oher features like the driving position, aircon blowers etc as they are carried over from the previous Exora. Spaces are aplenty in the Exora.

Proton sure has a winner in the MPV segment. For a 1.6L MPV, this is one of the most powerful and has the most torque, when comparing against local favourites, including the Perodua Alza, Nissan Grand Livina and the Toyota Innova. There are only 2 setbacks that I foresee. One is Proton’s brand image. Due to Proton’s past, not many people would want to consider a Proton as a new car, but recent offerings from Proton seems to have changed that a lot, and hopefully the Exora Bold can do that. The second is that the reliability of the turbo system. I dare not say how reliable the turbo system fitted into the Exora Bold would be, but if their engineers has done their homework properly, it should last up to 150,000km with little fuss. I’d give the Exora Bold a 17/20.
user posted image
Front view

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Can you spot it? brows.gif

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CVT Cooler

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You'll get used to seeing this more often

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Indeed

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Nice comfy leather seats

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Rubbers from GTRadial

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New gearbox



This post has been edited by ericmaxman: Dec 18 2011, 09:26 AM
-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 10:57 AM

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zzzz Why no paragraph. Hard to read ler
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 10:58 AM

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QUOTE(-cmi- @ Dec 17 2011, 10:57 AM)
zzzz Why no paragraph. Hard to read ler
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Fixed.
sg999
post Dec 17 2011, 11:00 AM

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essay~~~~
alieamin
post Dec 17 2011, 11:02 AM

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fuuuhh tempting drool.gif

FC how ah?
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 11:02 AM

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QUOTE(alieamin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:02 AM)
fuuuhh tempting drool.gif

FC how ah?
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Proton quoted 8.3L/100km.
turbocharged
post Dec 17 2011, 11:03 AM

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if you can control your leg biggrin.gif
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 11:05 AM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Dec 17 2011, 11:03 AM)
if you can control your leg biggrin.gif
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Press 3/4 throttle, speed climbing liek mad.

Reach 110km/h with ease

shocking.gif
alieamin
post Dec 17 2011, 11:10 AM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 17 2011, 11:02 AM)
Proton quoted 8.3L/100km.
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woah... hope the price wont hit 80k.
-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 11:10 AM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 17 2011, 11:05 AM)
Press 3/4 throttle, speed climbing liek mad.

Reach 110km/h with ease

shocking.gif
*
You already test drive it? I went to showroom just to have a look on Proton new model (Saga FLX SE & Proton Exora Bold). So far so good. If Proton able to hire creative interior designer, i bet this car can sell really well.
But Bold interior isn't that bad actually. Just still can't fight with Korean designer.



QUOTE(alieamin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:10 AM)
woah...  hope the price wont hit 80k.
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Price is RM80k for Bold

This post has been edited by -cmi-: Dec 17 2011, 11:11 AM
alieamin
post Dec 17 2011, 11:12 AM

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The long-awaited Campro Charge Fuel Efficiency (CFE) engine powers the Exora Bold Premium and the range-topping Exora Prime. This CFE engine puts out 138 hp at 5,000 rpm and 205 Nm of torque from 2,000 to 4,000 rpm from 1.6 litres. Paired to a CVT gearbox, top speed is 185 km/h and 0-100 km/h is done in 13.3 seconds. Claimed fuel consumption is 7.8 litres per 100 km.


aiya mana 1 betul ini doh.gif
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 11:13 AM

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QUOTE(-cmi- @ Dec 17 2011, 11:10 AM)
You already test drive it? I went to showroom just to have a look on Proton new model (Saga FLX SE & Proton Exora Bold). So far so good. If Proton able to hire creative interior designer, i bet this car can sell really well.
*
Yup, driven already smile.gif

QUOTE(alieamin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:12 AM)
The long-awaited Campro Charge Fuel Efficiency (CFE) engine powers the Exora Bold Premium and the range-topping Exora Prime. This CFE engine puts out 138 hp at 5,000 rpm and 205 Nm of torque from 2,000 to 4,000 rpm from 1.6 litres. Paired to a CVT gearbox, top speed is 185 km/h and 0-100 km/h is done in 13.3 seconds. Claimed fuel consumption is 7.8 litres per 100 km.
aiya mana 1 betul ini doh.gif
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user posted image

Proton cant spell TORQUE.

laugh.gif

This post has been edited by ericmaxman: Dec 17 2011, 11:14 AM
alieamin
post Dec 17 2011, 11:13 AM

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QUOTE(-cmi- @ Dec 17 2011, 11:10 AM)
You already test drive it? I went to showroom just to have a look on Proton new model (Saga FLX SE & Proton Exora Bold). So far so good. If Proton able to hire creative interior designer, i bet this car can sell really well.
But Bold interior isn't that bad actually. Just still can't fight with Korean designer.
Price is RM80k for Bold
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yes just read about it tongue.gif

There will be a “Proton 4 U Day” from December 16-18 (this weekend) at all Proton sales outlets nationwide, with door gifts for those who test drive the Exora Bold. The Exora Prime however, will not be available for test drive, and can only be viewed at selected Crystal Showrooms in Juru (Penang), Plentong (Johor) and Mutiara Damansara (PJ).
Last but not least, prices. Proton has officially released a tentative OTR price list, where the 1.6 Standard MT retails for RM59,998, the Bold 1.6 Executive MT for RM70,998, the Bold 1.6 Executive AT for RM74,998 and the Bold 1.6 Premium CVT for RM79,998. The Exora Prime is priced at RM88,998.



TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 11:15 AM

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QUOTE(alieamin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:13 AM)
yes just read about it tongue.gif

There will be a “Proton 4 U Day” from December 16-18 (this weekend) at all Proton sales outlets nationwide, with door gifts for those who test drive the Exora Bold. The Exora Prime however, will not be available for test drive, and can only be viewed at selected Crystal Showrooms in Juru (Penang), Plentong (Johor) and Mutiara Damansara (PJ).
Last but not least, prices. Proton has officially released a tentative OTR price list, where the 1.6 Standard MT retails for RM59,998, the Bold 1.6 Executive MT for RM70,998, the Bold 1.6 Executive AT for RM74,998 and the Bold 1.6 Premium CVT for RM79,998. The Exora Prime is priced at RM88,998.
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got myself the door gift tongue.gif
lunchtime
post Dec 17 2011, 11:20 AM

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which model is without the fake wood ?
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 11:21 AM

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QUOTE(lunchtime @ Dec 17 2011, 11:20 AM)
which model is without the fake wood ?
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Exora BOLD
-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 11:32 AM

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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Word 'comparison' is wrong too shakehead.gif
Anyone take pic of real Exora Prime? I heard the real wood look better than pic that Proton released.


Anyway, Proton really need to hire some quality staff. Or give quality training program to all their staff member.
I ask SA about the upcoming Proton Tuah and surprisingly, he don't have any idea about it doh.gif He even think i talk about Proton Jebat doh.gif When i ask him about Persona replacement, he point out about current Persona. He try to avoid my question and masuk their office.

I bet i got better knowledge about this Proton car than those SA shakehead.gif

This post has been edited by -cmi-: Dec 17 2011, 11:44 AM
Volfeed
post Dec 17 2011, 11:54 AM

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QUOTE(-cmi- @ Dec 17 2011, 11:32 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Word 'comparison' is wrong too  shakehead.gif
Anyone take pic of real Exora Prime? I heard the real wood look better than pic that Proton released.
Anyway, Proton really need to hire some quality staff. Or give quality training program to all their staff member.
I ask SA about the upcoming Proton Tuah and surprisingly, he don't have any idea about it  doh.gif  He even think i talk about Proton Jebat  doh.gif When i ask him about Persona replacement, he point out about current Persona. He try to avoid my question and masuk their office.

I bet i got better knowledge about this Proton car than those SA  shakehead.gif
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Staffs are not supposed to talk about company secret, even if they know about it.

Wish I have the time to test drive it today.. sweat.gif
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post Dec 17 2011, 11:57 AM

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QUOTE(Volfeed @ Dec 17 2011, 11:54 AM)
Staffs are not supposed to talk about company secret, even if they know about it.

Wish I have the time to test drive it today..  sweat.gif
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Really? But upcoming Proton Tuah model is well known on public already. Nothing secret about that.
If he can't provide me the detail about when it gonna release, at least he should give better answer.
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post Dec 17 2011, 12:20 PM

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QUOTE(-cmi- @ Dec 17 2011, 11:57 AM)
Really? But upcoming Proton Tuah model is well known on public already. Nothing secret about that.
If he can't provide me the detail about when it gonna release, at least he should give better answer.
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Well known but not official. Even for the Exora CFE, if you ask any SA (or even your neighbour Proton staff) before the official press release, they won't tell you about it.
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post Dec 17 2011, 12:22 PM

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TORGUE & CAMPARISON. laugh.gif
And it should be km/h, not km only..

QUOTE(Volfeed @ Dec 17 2011, 11:54 AM)
Staffs are not supposed to talk about company secret, even if they know about it.

Wish I have the time to test drive it today..  sweat.gif
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Not secret since they announce themselves of these models. Even if it is for prototype only at least they should know about it.
dares
post Dec 17 2011, 12:44 PM

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QUOTE(Volfeed @ Dec 17 2011, 12:20 PM)
Well known but not official. Even for the Exora CFE, if you ask any SA (or even your neighbour Proton staff) before the official press release, they won't tell you about it.
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Not necessarily true. My sa gave me the brochure for flx se a week before official launch and even let me test drive the display unit 2 days before the official launch / public press release.


It is true though most sa know very little info about the new cars simplybecause proton have not pass down much information to the dealers. Even i knew that proton was shipping out the showroom units before my sa found out.
V12Kompressor
post Dec 17 2011, 12:48 PM

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Those SA who knows nothing doesn't have the initiative to korek info themselves. Keep on rely from Proton punya Sales Training slides only. sleep.gif
-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 01:02 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 17 2011, 12:44 PM)
Not necessarily true. My sa gave me the brochure for flx se a week before official launch and even let me test drive the display unit 2 days before the official launch / public press release.
It is true though most sa know very little info about the new cars simplybecause proton have not pass down much information to the dealers. Even i knew that proton was shipping out the showroom units before my sa found out.
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Yerp. I don't think the detail about future product is secret. Especially, if Proton already announce about this product to media press. In fact, it always good if SA can take extra mile and explain about the future product. But of course, with right information.
TripleJ104
post Dec 17 2011, 01:15 PM

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http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1875124/+2340#bottom

Pls read post no #2355..




kadajawi
post Dec 17 2011, 01:18 PM

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0-100 in 13s doesn't sound terribly impressive, but the review does. Reads a bit like my experience with the VW Touran or the Ford Galaxy... just without the huge price tag. (Mh... the Touran did 180 with ease though, the Galaxy at least 160 with ease).
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post Dec 17 2011, 01:22 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 17 2011, 01:18 PM)
0-100 in 13s doesn't sound terribly impressive, but the review does. Reads a bit like my experience with the VW Touran or the Ford Galaxy... just without the huge price tag. (Mh... the Touran did 180 with ease though, the Galaxy at least 160 with ease).
*
Base on Proton Edar specs, Exora Bold did 0-100 in 11.3 sec.
Don't know which one is true rclxub.gif

SOS
kadajawi
post Dec 17 2011, 02:03 PM

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Mh, I'm a bit disappointed by the lack of ESP and more airbags (ESP in a car this hight would make a lot of sense, and more airbags for a family car too), but then again there is the price, guess you can't expect too much.

And yeah, Proton needs to get the brochures sorted out before releasing them to the public. It's a bit embarrassing.

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 17 2011, 02:04 PM
rcracer
post Dec 17 2011, 03:45 PM

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The matter of the fact is

In that class and that price, the engine and gearbox is unbeatable by any other make in Malaysia
nazri86a
post Dec 17 2011, 03:49 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 17 2011, 02:03 PM)
Mh, I'm a bit disappointed by the lack of ESP and more airbags (ESP in a car this hight would make a lot of sense, and more airbags for a family car too), but then again there is the price, guess you can't expect too much.

And yeah, Proton needs to get the brochures sorted out before releasing them to the public. It's a bit embarrassing.
*
eps already hv in proton juara 10 years ago..

i think if put esc (electronic stability control) more better value because if road slippery can control more confident

SUSMatrix
post Dec 17 2011, 04:20 PM

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I think i have the same concern as the reviewer....Campro+Turbo+Cvt is a new combo...how reliable will it be??? This gotta wait and see....
theanswer
post Dec 17 2011, 05:12 PM

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better wait til neo get this engine.
mutt
post Dec 17 2011, 05:12 PM

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I have test-driven one this morning at Glenmarie 3S center. I managed to drive on a windy road with slight uphill and downhill (it somehow like a 'jalan belakang' road). To my surprise the handling is superb! at least superior than my dad's Chevy Nabira. I don't think EPS is really needed. The setup for the steering is already good. Not heavy nor light, just right. You can really feel the torque. There's sudden urge of power when reached 2000rpm. The NVH, is the best among other Proton I believe. Very quite even at 100kmh. I didn't even notice that I already reached that speed. Braking is very responsive. I just step a little a bit on the pedal and already feel the braking power to stop this MPV. The only thing that I dislike is CVT since I am a petrol head tongue.gif. I can almost have no feel that the car is moving. Thought this car is slow but actually it's the good NVH and no gear shifting feel. At the price tag of RM80k, Exora Bold is the most worth for money MPV in our market currently. If I have 3 children I'm sure go for Exora rather than Inspira. The only downside is the logo. If this car has T or H or N or M sure will be a big hit biggrin.gif Well I think Proton already gained their market back since the the launch of Saga and Persona. Exora besides the underpowered engine, the quality seems ok. Never heard any complaint. And now Proton has came up with CFE which solved the underpowered problem. Hope they will keep up the momentum. Way to go Proton!
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 05:14 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 17 2011, 05:12 PM)
I have test-driven one this morning at Glenmarie 3S center. I managed to drive on a windy road with slight uphill and downhill (it somehow like a 'jalan belakang' road). To my surprise the handling is superb! at least superior than my dad's Chevy Nabira. I don't think EPS is really needed. The setup for the steering is already good. Not heavy nor light, just right. You can really feel the torque. There's sudden urge of power when reached 2000rpm. The NVH, is the best among other Proton I believe. Very quite even at 100kmh. I didn't even notice that I already reached that speed. Braking is very responsive. I just step a little a bit on the pedal and already feel the braking power to stop this MPV. The only thing that I dislike is CVT since I am a petrol head tongue.gif. I can almost have no feel that the car is moving. Thought this car is slow but actually it's the good NVH and no gear shifting feel. At the price tag of RM80k, Exora Bold is the most worth for money MPV in our market currently. If I have 3 children I'm sure go for Exora rather than Inspira. The only downside is the logo. If this car has T or H or N or M sure will be a big hit biggrin.gif  Well I think Proton already gained their market back since the the launch of Saga and Persona. Exora besides the underpowered engine, the quality seems ok. Never heard any complaint. And now Proton has came up with CFE which solved the underpowered problem. Hope they will keep up the momentum. Way to go Proton!
*
Good car, right? brows.gif

Now, how to convince my mom to ditch her Grand Livina and get this?

whistling.gif
mutt
post Dec 17 2011, 05:20 PM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 17 2011, 02:03 PM)
Mh, I'm a bit disappointed by the lack of ESP and more airbags (ESP in a car this hight would make a lot of sense, and more airbags for a family car too), but then again there is the price, guess you can't expect too much.

And yeah, Proton needs to get the brochures sorted out before releasing them to the public. It's a bit embarrassing.
*
I don't think ESP is really needed. The setup is already good. Well I am not a fan of ESP because I think it's dangerous (at least for me). Without ESP you can train your hand to be more firm. And yes, Proton should add more airbags to the MPV. Minimum 4 with optional 6 airbags. Is the brochure really an official one? I asked the SA they said the brochure will be distributed in a week time.


Added on December 17, 2011, 5:26 pm
QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 17 2011, 05:14 PM)
Good car, right? brows.gif

Now, how to convince my mom to ditch her Grand Livina and get this?

whistling.gif
*
I have driven Livina 1.8 before. Somehow I feel that 1.6C CFE is more responsive. I think because of the characteristic of car with turbo is different from NA. The 'sudden urge' feeling is addicting tongue.gif

Not to forget that Exora is 'man' enough compare to Livina soft looking haha..

Another thing I wanna add is the third row seat. It's surprising me that I feel comfort sitting at the 3rd row. I am quite big though.

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 17 2011, 05:26 PM
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post Dec 17 2011, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(nazri86a @ Dec 17 2011, 03:49 PM)
eps already hv in proton juara 10 years ago..

i think if put esc (electronic stability control)  more better value because if road slippery can control more confident
*
Ah sorry, I meant ESP (how Merc calls it) = ESC. That is the thing that stopped the A class from going turtle during an evasive maneuver and from cars losing control in general when going too fast through a corner.
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post Dec 17 2011, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 17 2011, 05:20 PM)
I don't think ESP is really needed. The setup is already good. Well I am not a fan of ESP because I think it's dangerous (at least for me). Without ESP you can train your hand to be more firm. And yes, Proton should add more airbags to the MPV. Minimum 4 with optional 6 airbags. Is the brochure really an official one? I asked the SA they said the brochure will be distributed in a week time.
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Imo exora not need esp...handling already superb, like driving a sedan (proton only laugh.gif).

Mutt i got the brochure.
dares
post Dec 17 2011, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 17 2011, 05:14 PM)
Good car, right? brows.gif

Now, how to convince my mom to ditch her Grand Livina and get this?

whistling.gif
*
1. Drive her Grand Livina into a ditch (you friend V12k may be able to help)

2. Claim total loss, insurance.

3. Buy Exora Bold.

4. Profit.

rclxms.gif
mutt
post Dec 17 2011, 05:35 PM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(TripleJ104 @ Dec 17 2011, 05:30 PM)
Imo exora not need esp...handling already superb, like driving a sedan (proton only laugh.gif).

Mutt i got the brochure.
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how come johor branch got the brochure already? I went to proton 3s at glenmarie. The nearest center from coe mad.gif

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 17 2011, 05:36 PM
-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 05:40 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 17 2011, 05:35 PM)
how come johor branch got the brochure already? I went to proton 3s at glenmarie. The nearest center from coe mad.gif
*
Conspiracy i think brows.gif
kadajawi
post Dec 17 2011, 05:51 PM

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QUOTE(TripleJ104 @ Dec 17 2011, 05:30 PM)
Imo exora not need esp...handling already superb, like driving a sedan (proton only laugh.gif).

Mutt i got the brochure.
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Sedan can also get out of control. smile.gif
denfire
post Dec 17 2011, 06:05 PM

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Since it is a turbo charging engine, I wonder how's the maintenance will be? Hmm.. Most of the turbo charged car's maintenance is higher then normal engine cars..
amir_tengkorak
post Dec 17 2011, 06:07 PM

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pegi test drive tak ajak.. dry.gif
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 06:09 PM

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QUOTE(amir_tengkorak @ Dec 17 2011, 06:07 PM)
pegi test drive tak ajak.. dry.gif
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peksan with tebooo
soonlee33
post Dec 17 2011, 06:21 PM

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QUOTE(amir_tengkorak @ Dec 17 2011, 06:07 PM)
pegi test drive tak ajak.. dry.gif
*
exora is for family man. tak sesuai for u yet blush.gif
mutt
post Dec 17 2011, 06:39 PM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(soonlee33 @ Dec 17 2011, 06:21 PM)
exora is for family man. tak sesuai for u yet  blush.gif
*
during my test driving session i didnt feel like a family man at all. The feeling juz like driving a sedan. No am not joking. The good handling wont make u feel u driving an mpv. so no prob for amir to drive exora. He can thrash this mpv like he always do with his powderful satria at genting sepah tongue.gif
amir_tengkorak
post Dec 17 2011, 06:39 PM

Wow..Amazing...
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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 17 2011, 06:09 PM)
peksan with tebooo
*
torque tinggi siot..nyamnyamnyam..

QUOTE(soonlee33 @ Dec 17 2011, 06:21 PM)
exora is for family man. tak sesuai for u yet  blush.gif
*
i suka bila bawak mpv turbo tapao some ah beng mia kereta..kekekeke

V12Kompressor
post Dec 17 2011, 06:39 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 17 2011, 05:35 PM)
how come johor branch got the brochure already? I went to proton 3s at glenmarie. The nearest center from coe mad.gif
*
lol, means that proton edar owner connection not kuat. tongue.gif

the showroom I tested, not only provides food, but also brochure and even READY STOCK! shocking.gif
rcracer
post Dec 17 2011, 08:32 PM

?????
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QUOTE(denfire @ Dec 17 2011, 11:05 AM)
Since it is a turbo charging engine, I wonder how's the maintenance will be? Hmm.. Most of the turbo charged car's maintenance is higher then normal engine cars..
*
Not true, running cost same as normal engine. Service like normal only.

The turbo is water and oil cooled for maximum reliability
salimbest83
post Dec 17 2011, 08:42 PM

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nice short review..
if wih extra picture su can make official topic already..

ps: when Potong wanna put CFE on BLM and Persona..
Vroom..Vrommm

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post Dec 17 2011, 08:52 PM

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This post has been edited by sg999: Dec 17 2011, 08:54 PM
MR_alien
post Dec 17 2011, 08:53 PM

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QUOTE(salimbest83 @ Dec 17 2011, 08:42 PM)
nice short review..
if wih extra picture su can make official topic already..

ps: when Potong wanna put CFE on BLM and Persona..
Vroom..Vrommm
*
saga...not gonna happen
the GB cannot handle it and somemore can the car handle that much torque also dn't know
the 1.6 FLX SE already fast enough with its 1.6L engine + CVT
put in CFE...that car will split apart...lol

persona.....not so sure...if persona got "reset"...thn possible
but proton already said the new model releasing next june isn't persona replacement..its a new model


Added on December 17, 2011, 8:55 pm
QUOTE(sg999 @ Dec 17 2011, 08:52 PM)
eps is kinda shit
luckily did not implement on proton car
if wan put EHPS
that the best thumbup.gif
*
proton will not use EPS if they want the proton handling/lotus handling
becuz EPS reportedly have a delay....myvi, grand livina all reported say have
somemore lotus car itself doesn't even uses EPS....hydraulic ones still best

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Dec 17 2011, 08:55 PM
dadurtyz
post Dec 17 2011, 09:09 PM

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so jelly, already test drive? so fast..
TSericmaxman
post Dec 17 2011, 09:28 PM

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pics to be updated tonight smile.gif
soonlee33
post Dec 17 2011, 09:36 PM

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alza tak laku d afta dis xD
samwongjyhhorng
post Dec 17 2011, 09:40 PM

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0-100 according official figure is 11.3sec(i think can do within 10sec by user)..fuel comsuption is 7.8L/100km..0-100 can easily tapau most of 2.0NA car..if tis engine put in like persona or satria neo,i think can do around 7-8sec..hehe
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post Dec 17 2011, 09:46 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 17 2011, 08:53 PM)
saga...not gonna happen
the GB cannot handle it and somemore can the car handle that much torque also dn't know
the 1.6 FLX SE already fast enough with its 1.6L engine + CVT
put in CFE...that car will split apart...lol

persona.....not so sure...if persona got "reset"...thn possible
but proton already said the new model releasing next june isn't persona replacement..its a new model


Added on December 17, 2011, 8:55 pm
proton will not use EPS if they want the proton handling/lotus handling
becuz EPS reportedly have a delay....myvi, grand livina all reported say have
somemore lotus car itself doesn't even uses EPS....hydraulic ones still best
*
The BMW 5 series (F10/11) has EPS, and I don't think the steering feel is that bad.

Anyway I was talking about ESP/ESC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcZBNJbu3aQ
The Fiat has it, the otherwise pretty much identical Citroen doesn't.
salimbest83
post Dec 17 2011, 10:14 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 17 2011, 08:53 PM)
saga...not gonna happen
the GB cannot handle it and somemore can the car handle that much torque also dn't know
the 1.6 FLX SE already fast enough with its 1.6L engine + CVT
put in CFE...that car will split apart...lol

persona.....not so sure...if persona got "reset"...thn possible
but proton already said the new model releasing next june isn't persona replacement..its a new model


Added on December 17, 2011, 8:55 pm
proton will not use EPS if they want the proton handling/lotus handling
becuz EPS reportedly have a delay....myvi, grand livina all reported say have
somemore lotus car itself doesn't even uses EPS....hydraulic ones still best
*
but if tey wanna make more power enthusiast give eye to proton again..
they shud do it..
for the sake "we can do it"


-cmi-
post Dec 17 2011, 10:19 PM

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QUOTE(salimbest83 @ Dec 17 2011, 10:14 PM)
but if tey wanna make more power enthusiast give eye to proton again..
they shud do it..
for the sake "we can do it"
*
Of course they will do it but not by putting it on Saga.
It's on upcoming Proton new model. Maybe will be lunch no June 2012. I really hope Proton can release this car with both good exterior and interior (since they plan to export this car into global market actively).
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post Dec 17 2011, 11:01 PM

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I wonder what they mean by global though... they sold cars in Germany for a while (Wira and Satria, and it seems also some Saga/Iswara), but they had a hard time competing. Price alone wasn't enough, and without new models it got hard competing against an increasingly sophisticated competition.

The new whatever it is might have a chance... but the price has to be good. And who will maintain the cars? Unless they will only sell them in the UK, there are no Proton dealers.

Lets say they try to sell the Exora in Germany... a Nissan Qashqai +2 (7 seater is a bit above 20k Euro), Touran also around that area. A Ford Galaxy with massive discounts can be bought for 21k (registered already so a little less warranty, but otherwise new). The Exora would have to be significantly cheaper than that, while remaining almost as safe. If it only gets 3 EuroNCAP stars people might just buy a Dacia Logan MCV for 9k (almost empty box, but 7 seats and huge amounts of space, plus old well proven Renault tech). Not very refined, but very cheap. How is Proton going to compete?! And that's just the 7 seater MPV/van market, something the size of the new Proton world car has even more competition, ranging from the Dacia Logan (6k) to the Korean and French ones (cheap but decent), then Japanese (a bit expensive and dull, but reliable) and German ones. And except for the Logan they all are at least 4, mostly 5 EuroNCAP stars.
People are also not as hesitant to buy a 1 year old second hand car to save a lot of money.

Needless to say I'm curious to find out what they will come up with, how good it is, and where they want to sell it.
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post Dec 17 2011, 11:17 PM

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90km/h dah 8.3L/100km ...if 120km/h on highway garenti > 10L

i think a lot 1.6 and 2.0 cars can make it below 8L/100 km at 120km/h
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post Dec 17 2011, 11:26 PM

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QUOTE(bobbychin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:17 PM)
90km/h dah 8.3L/100km ...if 120km/h on highway garenti > 10L

i think a lot 1.6 and 2.0 cars can make it below 8L/100 km at 120km/h
*
Proton oledi ammend to 7.8l/100km.0 to 100 is 11.3sec
Aquariusdenz
post Dec 17 2011, 11:27 PM

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Nice looking
sg999
post Dec 17 2011, 11:35 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 17 2011, 10:46 PM)
The BMW 5 series (F10/11) has EPS, and I don't think the steering feel is that bad.

Anyway I was talking about ESP/ESC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcZBNJbu3aQ
The Fiat has it, the otherwise pretty much identical Citroen doesn't.
*
the best is EHPS biggrin.gif
mutt
post Dec 17 2011, 11:50 PM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(samwongjyhhorng @ Dec 17 2011, 11:26 PM)
Proton oledi ammend to 7.8l/100km.0 to 100 is 11.3sec
*
And that figure come from a 1.5tonne MPV with CVT. What will the figure would be if it's from a 1.2 tonne sedan or hatchback with Manual gearbox drool.gif

Heard Proton going to make CFE variant with more power brows.gif

Proton bashers sure cakap 'keep dreaming dude..' tongue.gif
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post Dec 18 2011, 12:07 AM

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QUOTE(bobbychin @ Dec 17 2011, 11:17 PM)
90km/h dah 8.3L/100km ...if 120km/h on highway garenti > 10L

i think a lot 1.6 and 2.0 cars can make it below 8L/100 km at 120km/h
*
Ford Galaxy 1.6 diesel, 115 hp (huge 7 seater MPV, comfortable and well spec'ed, 1.7 ton and 4.82m long) I managed to average around 7-8L driving 160-180. thumbup.gif And that car is wider, longer, heavier and taller than the Exora.
MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 12:08 AM

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what proton means by global is that the car mean global safety standards
like 6 air bags...ABS + EBD...ESP...etc etc
if global specs thn its endless
but yeah..many ppl say if sold in germany thn it would be hard to compete cuz many cheaper cars there
but we'll have to see what they priced it when its sold overseas...not the price that we bought in malaysia cuz proton and perodua have to pay tax for the car as well...just not as much as other brand of cars


Added on December 18, 2011, 12:11 am
QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 17 2011, 11:50 PM)
And that figure come from a 1.5tonne MPV with CVT. What will the figure would be if it's from a 1.2 tonne sedan or hatchback with Manual gearbox  drool.gif

Heard Proton going to make CFE variant with more power  brows.gif

Proton bashers sure cakap 'keep dreaming dude..'  tongue.gif
*
the only way to do that is to change the turbo chargers...the campro is unchanged
they will just change the soft turbo to a REAL turbo....but need time to research for the reliability of those true turbo that increase HP
didn't they last time acquire a few super charger...said for satria neo..wonder where did that go

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Dec 18 2011, 12:11 AM
SUSMatrix
post Dec 18 2011, 12:15 AM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 18 2011, 12:07 AM)
Ford Galaxy 1.6 diesel, 115 hp (huge 7 seater MPV, comfortable and well spec'ed, 1.7 ton and 4.82m long) I managed to average around 7-8L driving 160-180.  thumbup.gif And that car is wider, longer, heavier and taller than the Exora.
*
Smart lar u...compare diesel car with petrol car....
mutt
post Dec 18 2011, 12:29 AM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(Matrix @ Dec 18 2011, 12:15 AM)
Smart lar u...compare diesel car with petrol car....
*
Well.. bashers nowadays have next to no point to bash Proton cars biggrin.gif They also started to compare Proton make with conti. No more Japanese or Korean cool2.gif I hope that Proton can do more improvement at a fast pace. They have the momentum already but need to be fast flex.gif
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post Dec 18 2011, 12:42 AM

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In Germany they will have to pay 19% tax afaik, and it is similar to other countries as well. How high is the tax for P1 and P2 here? Some more when the car is imported to Europe rather than produced there then shipping costs will be high too (the Japanese have a problem with this and with the high yen, that's why Daihatsu will cease operations at least in Germany. Japan built cars are just too expensive, especially since Daihatsu is a budget oriented brand).

Why would P1 make a car with high safety standards just for the Malaysian market? Toyota can sell any ... they want at high prices, and people will still buy them, despite a total disregard towards safety. Unless they want to advertise the car with a high safety standard to go against the Fiesta, Forte, ... at a lower price? Could be interesting, but I'm not sure they would want to start a safety race, because many of their other cars are exactly safe.

Furthermore if you consider the spec that for example the Fiesta has it is actually rather affordable. 82k for a car that is as well equipped as the Fiesta sedan, with that engine? You pay a similar amount in Germany (not counting any discounts...), but without DSG. So including DSG which is usually a maybe 2000 Euro option minus the discount you get you'll to a similar price.

I believe the Malaysian government sets a price at which the car can be sold, but the spec is open to the importer. So lets say a small car, size of a Saga or perhaps Persona must be significantly more expensive than the P1/P2 alternative... so instead of 40-60k, it will be 80k. However, they may not earn a lot in taxes. As I mentioned such a Fiesta in Germany would, if it were available (no sedan available, no DSG available) also be somewhere around 80k. We know that the tax is 19%, so it might be safe to assume that the car will be taxed somewhere in that region too (although Ford might make a nice profit on the options in Europe).

The reason why cars are cheaper in Europe is because you can buy them naked. No aircon, no powered windows, no anything (it's not _that_ bad anymore, but I can easily double or triple the price of many cars just by choosing a bigger engine and ticking all the options, especially if it is a German car (the French, Koreans and sometimes Japanese have fewer boxes to tick...)). Usually the safety standard is still rather high, even the Dacia has a minimum of 2 airbags, and that's very much the low end. A Daihatsu Sirion (MyVi) comes with a minimum of 4 airbags, my almost base spec Citroen Xsara from 2002 had 6.
A VW here is usually pretty much top of the line, except for a few options (heated seats or a sat nav for which there are probably no Malaysian maps) that won't make sense, and without having tried it I think it should be around the same price as what you would pay for a similar car in Germany. Citroens may be a bit different, they seem to cost more than they would in Germany (again, I haven't checked, but I don't remember them having many optional options... most things are included). As if the government tests the car, says... mh, this is intended for rich people, high end car, feels expensive, so we'll have to price it very high, regardless of the actual price.

@mutt: Not really trying to bash P1, I quite like their newer efforts, might even buy one if I didn't have a car already. Also, when they start competing with contis that's a good sign, not?

@Matrix: Admittedly it's not very fair to compare the Proton to a diesel. The VW Touran 1.4 TSI with 140 hp is supposed to be around 7-8L (officially 6.8, but that's a bit optimistic, as always), so comparable to the Exora (it's a bit smaller, between Alza and Exora). Not bad.

Btw., in Europe the Japanese sell different cars. Something like the Avanza wouldn't stand a chance there, it would be unsellable. No Corolla, no Vios, no Avanza, no Camry, no Wish, ... only the Hilux, Prius (Rush available as a Daihatsu).

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 18 2011, 12:58 AM
MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 02:24 AM

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@kadajawi
until now proton only said that its their 1st global car
they never said anything abt germany or any specific country
only said its a global car
usually global car mean its equipped with safety equipment that meet international standard
everything else are assumed by us...proton never said anything
i think proton is just to there to meet the international standard so that other ppl would be more confident buying them
proton mostly sells in australia and egypt...especially in egypt which saga is a good seller there
everything else have to wait proton to announced or wait till they act

ps: even in malaysian market...avanza cannot stand a chance as well..ppl buy it becuz its a toyota not becuz its a good car
avanza is worst than p1 and p2 car....avanza is actually a cut cost car aiming for low income family(apparently not very low income)
mutt
post Dec 18 2011, 02:29 AM

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@kadajawi

that's a good sign indeed. that's why I said Proton need to have more improvement at a fast pace, to compete with the conti's. more bashes and critics are needed to give Proton more pressure to be a better company and produce good cars. I love Proton and supporting them but I hate when they make low quality car.


Added on December 18, 2011, 2:33 amSeriously the excitement driving Exora CFE really makes me almost book the MPV already. But I have to wait until the Persona Replacement coming out first. Well, I am just a father for a 2 years old baby though. What a joke to get a mid-sized MPV..lol

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 18 2011, 02:33 AM
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post Dec 18 2011, 06:52 AM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 18 2011, 02:29 AM)
@kadajawi

that's a good sign indeed. that's why I said Proton need to have more improvement at a fast pace, to compete with the conti's. more bashes and critics are needed to give Proton more pressure to be a better company and produce good cars. I love Proton and supporting them but I hate when they make low quality car.


Added on December 18, 2011, 2:33 amSeriously the excitement driving Exora CFE really makes me almost book the MPV already. But I have to wait until the Persona Replacement coming out first. Well, I am just a father for a 2 years old baby though. What a joke to get a mid-sized MPV..lol
*
Make more babies NOW and book an Exora!!!! biggrin.gif I wanna test drive Exora very badly also...but again, my family small, no need for MPV....haha.

Due to the much improved torque, i'll daresay the Exora will have much better FC than old Campro CPS Exora during city drive as you won't need to burn so much fuel with start/stop situation. Let's just wait and see for feedback.

This post has been edited by Matrix: Dec 18 2011, 06:55 AM
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post Dec 18 2011, 09:26 AM

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SKY233
post Dec 18 2011, 09:34 AM

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QUOTE(Matrix @ Dec 18 2011, 06:52 AM)
Make more babies NOW and book an Exora!!!! biggrin.gif  I wanna test drive Exora very badly also...but again, my family small, no need for MPV....haha.

Due to the much improved torque, i'll daresay the Exora will have much better FC than old Campro CPS Exora during city drive as you won't need to burn so much fuel with start/stop situation. Let's just wait and see for feedback.
*
laugh.gif
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post Dec 18 2011, 09:48 AM

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post Dec 18 2011, 09:52 AM

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Seems good... I am an innova owner and honesly I see proton did quite well with this car... But I will wait for some ppl bought the car and run it for a year to give comment....
I am just bait affraid their turbo engine will have some reliability issue.
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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 18 2011, 02:24 AM)
@kadajawi
until now proton only said that its their 1st global car
they never said anything abt germany or any specific country
only said its a global car
usually global car mean its equipped with safety equipment that meet international standard
everything else are assumed by us...proton never said anything
i think proton is just to there to meet the international standard so that other ppl would be more confident buying them
proton mostly sells in australia and egypt...especially in egypt which saga is a good seller there
everything else have to wait proton to announced or wait till they act

ps: even in malaysian market...avanza cannot stand a chance as well..ppl buy it becuz its a toyota not becuz its a good car
avanza is worst than p1 and p2 car....avanza is actually a cut cost car aiming for low income family(apparently not very low income)
*
I see. I was just speculating... it'd be interesting if they intend to enter Europe... that means the car has to be good, otherwise it wouldn't stand a chance. Which would be good for us in Malaysia too, I guess. In Australia and China I think higher safety standards can boost sales, Malaysia maybe, Singapore too.

But for us alone Proton doesn't have to improve the safety of their cars, just look at Toyota, they don't have to either.
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post Dec 18 2011, 10:16 AM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 18 2011, 12:42 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
good sharing!

no wonder those engineers in germany are driving cheap toyotas only, they are not patriotic tongue.gif
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post Dec 18 2011, 11:42 AM

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lol. I don't think people are that patriotic in Germany. Some yes, but not all. If a foreign car is better, why not buy it? For many years we've only bought French cars. Affordable and decent smile.gif As all cars are taxed the same the manufacturers have to compete, which also helps them as they have to develop competitive products. P1 for a long time didn't have to, only since P2 came up.

Btw., Toyotas are not that cheap. Korean cars are cheap, French ones are relatively cheap, Romanian are very cheap (Dacia), ... Toyota is rather expensive, as is VW. And then of course the premium brands like Volvo, BMW, Mercedes, Audi, ...

Image plays a somewhat big role... Toyota has worked hard to get the image that they are reliable, though IMHO they might not deserve it anymore. Still good, but not class leading. The Germans have suffered IIRC when the models during the late 90s early 00s weren't very reliable anymore, but of course they still have a good image. The hatchback segment is called Golf-Klasse for a reason, the resale value the Golf achieves is mind boggling, and while the Golf is good (I learned driving in a Mk IV, drove a Mk V) I think it's not deserved.
On the other end of the spectrum Korean and French (worse yet Italian) cars have the image to be unreliable, which means they had to offer a very good price. The Koreans AFAIK have managed to shake that off a bit, Kia is offering 7 (!) years warranty. Proton will have to do the same I'm afraid, should they attempt to enter that market. French and Italian cars have improved a lot, and I didn't think ours were particularly unreliable (there are things where I wonder what were they thinking, like placing several important wires under the driver seat, exposed, in a way that they easily get lose, thus for example deactivating the airbag. Really?!?)

Btw., P2 should bring in the Aygo as a Viva replacement. It's meant to be cheap to produce, easy to maintain, it's relatively solid/safe and reliable. Designed by Toyota and PSA.
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post Dec 18 2011, 12:27 PM

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QUOTE(0300078 @ Dec 18 2011, 09:52 AM)
Seems good... I am an innova owner and honesly I see proton did quite well with this car... But I will wait for some ppl bought the car and run it for a year to give comment....
I am just bait affraid their turbo engine will have some reliability issue.
*
this is where many car manufacturer wins toyota...warranty!
if u scared the reliability of the turbo....and already bought it...theres always warranty there to cover it...long warranty
as long as u service at SC...you'll have warranty
how much warranty did toyota give...a VERY VERY short time only and to maintain that warranty..have to service at SC and u should know service in toyota SC is extremely expensive
so its all not worthed
and plus its not a turbo engine...the engine is normal campro...the turbo it bolted on...both are separate
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post Dec 18 2011, 02:24 PM

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uz test again exora cfe today..i juz comment here about the power and handling here..based of the video tat i snap,from0-100,i rev maintain 3k to 4k rpm wit SAT on,can hit 0-100 around 13sec wit aircond off..in D drive mode,from 0-100 can hit around 11 to 12sec wit SAT OFF(no record video,based on butt feeling)and aircond off too..from 50-140 onli need around 19sec(with SAT off) wit aircond on..i manage hit 150kmh during test drive..and the SA oso got fetch me to test the abs and handling..he drove to 100kmh and direct full press the brake pedal and abs kick in..the car still damn stable and juz need short distance to stop the car..he oso constant drive 70kmh and do the cornering like snake..i can feel the car body roll still under control and quite stable..after v go test top speed again..tis time can hit 160kmh..but from 120-160 actuali the feel quite same as PE(if v reali press hard too)..i oso test drove the saga flx 1.6 cvt..the power totally same as exora cfe even saga dun have turbo(bcoz of light body)..i manage can hit 160kmh(same distance as i test exora cfe onli can hit 150kmh)..as highlighted,the exora cfe was use GT radial tyre..





mat_tepets
post Dec 18 2011, 03:48 PM

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aku baru jer test drive tadi bawak bini ngan anak, anak baru satu jer. haha memang best la bawak rilek jer tekan skit tgk2 meter dah 80km/h. aku terus booking tadi kat proton edar baiduri auto ttdi jaya shah alam.
Area51SE
post Dec 18 2011, 09:52 PM

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Well done Proton! rclxms.gif rclxms.gif
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 09:57 PM

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Move over Alza?


MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 10:08 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 09:57 PM)
Move over Alza?
*
how can alza fight it?
power - proton has it..CFE..turbo
GB - proton use CVT - smooth, fast pickup, low FC
size - exora bigger than alza
pretty much everything exora > alza...can't fight
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 10:12 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 18 2011, 10:08 PM)
how can alza fight it?
power - proton has it..CFE..turbo
GB - proton use CVT - smooth, fast pickup, low FC
size - exora bigger than alza
pretty much everything exora > alza...can't fight
*
That's why i say move over Alza doh.gif


MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 10:24 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 10:12 PM)
That's why i say move over Alza  doh.gif
*
yours got a "?" at the end...its a question..lol
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 10:35 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 18 2011, 10:24 PM)
yours got a "?" at the end...its a question..lol
*
Yeah, it's was a question where I kindly ask Alza to move over and go transform back in to a car. And let Exora be the main MPV.
salimbest83
post Dec 18 2011, 10:36 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 10:12 PM)
That's why i say move over Alza  doh.gif
*
dlm bahasa melayunya..
"nyah ketepilah engkau, alza"

ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 10:42 PM

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QUOTE(salimbest83 @ Dec 18 2011, 10:36 PM)
dlm bahasa melayunya..
"nyah ketepilah engkau, alza"
*
English and Malay wordings in some sentence cannot be put into the same sense.

On topic please, so will i guess Perodua will come out something in return to match against the Exora Bold.


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post Dec 18 2011, 10:46 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 10:42 PM)

On topic please, so will i guess Perodua will come out something in return to match against the Exora Bold.
*
No, they dont.

Toyota will never approve a Daihatsu/Perodua which will compete with their own Innova.
dares
post Dec 18 2011, 10:50 PM

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I always wondered how P2 got greenlit the Alza since it was in the same price range as Avanza.
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post Dec 18 2011, 10:54 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 18 2011, 10:50 PM)
I always wondered how P2 got greenlit the Alza since it was in the same price range as Avanza.
*
alza is way way better car thn avanza..i still dn't know why ppl still buy avanza
A2Z2U
post Dec 18 2011, 10:57 PM

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Nice review here

Turbocharged Proton Exora Bold tested
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post Dec 18 2011, 10:58 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 10:42 PM)
English and Malay wordings in some sentence cannot be put into the same sense.

On topic please, so will i guess Perodua will come out something in return to match against the Exora Bold.
*
i dont think so, since what i know their father was Daihatsu, and daihatsu now are produce affordable and reliable maintenance car, (correct me if i'm wrong).
and yes daihatsu got turbo engine at past.

This post has been edited by dadurtyz: Dec 18 2011, 10:59 PM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 18 2011, 11:00 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 18 2011, 10:50 PM)
I always wondered how P2 got greenlit the Alza since it was in the same price range as Avanza.
*
Because in Japan there's no Avanza but there's Passo Sette/Sirion Luminas so Perodua have the reason to assemble it here as Alza.

Avanza is part of Toyota IMV project which never include Japan as their market preference.

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Dec 18 2011, 11:01 PM
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 11:01 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 18 2011, 10:46 PM)
No, they dont.

Toyota will never approve a Daihatsu/Perodua which will compete with their own Innova.
*
Just because the Alza is copied from Toyota doesn't mean that Perodua will not create a new model from scratch to go head to head with the Exora.

Even though i am much more of a Proton fan / owner but i will not take for granted that Perodua engineers and designers aren't doing something new to catch the consumer from other manufacturers currently. A bit of friendly rivalry is always healthy.
dares
post Dec 18 2011, 11:15 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 18 2011, 11:00 PM)
Because in Japan there's no Avanza but there's Passo Sette/Sirion Luminas so Perodua have the reason to assemble it here as Alza.

Avanza is part of Toyota IMV project which never include Japan as their market preference.
*
But what about the local market? from Toyota's POV there was no need to bring in those models since there already was Avanza here. Even though it is sold under a different brand name, isn't it pitting their own product against each other?

QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:01 PM)
Just because the Alza is copied from Toyota doesn't mean that Perodua will not create a new model from scratch to go head to head with the Exora.

Even though i am much more of a Proton fan / owner but i will not take for granted that Perodua engineers and designers aren't doing something new to catch the consumer from other manufacturers currently. A bit of friendly rivalry is always healthy.
*
P2 have no in-house engineering and design capacity to create a car from scratch. All their cars are rebadged Daihatsus. The only way currently for P2 to compete with Exora is to rebadge the Innova from Toyota.
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post Dec 18 2011, 11:15 PM

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hahahaa... Perodua will NEVER create a new model from scratch. lol
They dont have that capability and even if they can, sushi people will say no.

Take a glace over Perodua and Toyota's vehicle line up and you'll know how Toyota earns money with the Myvi via Daihatsu JV at Perodua and at the same time how they protect their own interest in the Malaysia market.

Even the upcoming Avanza is going more "upmarket" and the price is at least RM10k more expensive than the Alza.
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post Dec 18 2011, 11:20 PM

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I always wondered why the Avanza was sold as a Toyota and not as a Perodua... clearly it is a cheap product along the lines of a Rusa. The Alza however was meant for the Japanese market too, so it is a rather up market car, compared to the Avanza (why isn't the Avanza available in Japan or Europe? Because it isn't good enough.)

Do Perodua even have enough engineers? They have a few designers (which are actually rather decent), but developing a new car? I'd rather see them making the Verso... still not quite as big as the Exora, but also a relatively modern car, with stronger engines (still, can't compete with the Exora, but better than the Alza). Has Perodua ever done something on their own, except for some minor design changes?
V12Kompressor
post Dec 18 2011, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 18 2011, 11:15 PM)
But what about the local market? from Toyota's POV there was no need to bring in those models since there already was Avanza here. Even though it is sold under a different brand name, isn't it pitting their own product against each other?
*
When the Alza was intoduced to the malaysian market, the Avanza is already a very very old product. Sales is diminishing and gets hit harder when Nissan launched the Grand Livina. Toyota knew they couldn't and won't get the new Avanza replaced in time since they need to refresh the big three IMVs first since these are more important (Innova, Hilux & Fortuner) and therefore they greenlit Perodua to assemble it here.

Furthermore, the Alza was introduced when the general MPV (below RM 100k) frenzy hits the market with the launch of Grand Livina, Exora CPS and also the refreshed Chery Eastar. Not to mention that time Naza was busy dumping off the Citra at dirt cheap price.

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Dec 18 2011, 11:23 PM
Vervain
post Dec 18 2011, 11:26 PM

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for a moment, i thought CFE means carbon fiber engine.
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post Dec 18 2011, 11:36 PM

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But why didn't they release the Avanza as a Perodua in the first place? Apart from them having to assemble it here in that case... The Alza is the better product, at a lower price.

I also wonder why brands like Renault and Citroen gave up the Malaysian market... the 7 seater Kangoo could easily compete with the Avanza (except for the badge), though it was more expensive back then. IIRC the Kangoo was around 70k, i.e. Alza and Exora money. The new versions of these models (almost every continental manufacturer has a Kangoo-like car... Ford, Opel, Renault, Citroen, Peugeot, Fiat, VW, for a while Mercedes, and Toyota had the more consumer oriented Sienta) have all been vastly improved and grew in size. As they are perceived as panel vans by the population they might not get taxed as high as a continental 7 seater van.
MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 11:37 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:01 PM)
Just because the Alza is copied from Toyota doesn't mean that Perodua will not create a new model from scratch to go head to head with the Exora.

Even though i am much more of a Proton fan / owner but i will not take for granted that Perodua engineers and designers aren't doing something new to catch the consumer from other manufacturers currently. A bit of friendly rivalry is always healthy.
*
they can't...engine and GB are from toyota or daihatsu
those 2 company won't provide those 2 things for perodua to produce a new model
becuz it competes with their own model
this is the bad thing being under other ppl's company
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 11:39 PM

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I don't know about Toyota's control of Perodua and how Toyota is making money from Myvi via Daihatsu joint venture but an improved version of the Alza can be done.
salimbest83
post Dec 18 2011, 11:41 PM

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QUOTE
Forget the foreign made with superior brand priced up to RM 150k, this is the MPV you'll ever need!
thumbup.gif thumbup.gif thumbup.gif good job Proton
MR_alien
post Dec 18 2011, 11:42 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:39 PM)
I don't know about Toyota's control of Perodua and how Toyota is making money from  Myvi via Daihatsu joint venture but an improved version of the Alza can be done.
*
how improved can it be?
turbocharged CVVT?...dn't think so...that would beat any toyota MPV already
CVT GB? - dn't think so either...none of toyota model ever comes with CVT..i mean local ones
better handling? - toyota never cares abt handling AT ALL..even if they did...can't beat lotus
low price? - how is toyota going to survive
no matter how...an "improved" alza is not going to happen

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Dec 18 2011, 11:45 PM
dares
post Dec 18 2011, 11:47 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:39 PM)
I don't know about Toyota's control of Perodua and how Toyota is making money from  Myvi via Daihatsu joint venture but an improved version of the Alza can be done.
*
Toyota owns daihatsu, daihatsu owns 35% of perodua. To them, perodua is merely the means to sell their cars here without the exorbitant taxes.

What perodua sells is entirely on the whim of toyota.
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post Dec 18 2011, 11:49 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 18 2011, 11:36 PM)
But why didn't they release the Avanza as a Perodua in the first place? Apart from them having to assemble it here in that case... The Alza is the better product, at a lower price.

I also wonder why brands like Renault and Citroen gave up the Malaysian market... the 7 seater Kangoo could easily compete with the Avanza (except for the badge), though it was more expensive back then. IIRC the Kangoo was around 70k, i.e. Alza and Exora money. The new versions of these models (almost every continental manufacturer has a Kangoo-like car... Ford, Opel, Renault, Citroen, Peugeot, Fiat, VW, for a while Mercedes, and Toyota had the more consumer oriented Sienta) have all been vastly improved and grew in size. As they are perceived as panel vans by the population they might not get taxed as high as a continental 7 seater van.
*
One solid reason is before the Myvi exist, Perodua is supposedly only to assemble hatchbacks (Kelisa, Kenari, Kancil) only.

Another reason is due to the Innova has moved upmarket and there is a need to address the Unser owners and potential MPV buyers who couldn't afford an Innova, hence Toyota need a new lower cost MPV to retain back these old Unser customers. Back then on 2003, there are hardly any brand in Malaysian market which sells MPV.

The Citroen Berlingo, Peugeot Partner and Renault Kangoo wasn't a great hit due to the Malaysian market which are generally a bunch of skeptics towards French vehicles.

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Dec 18 2011, 11:49 PM
ben3085
post Dec 18 2011, 11:50 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 18 2011, 11:42 PM)
how improved can it be?
turbocharged CVVT?...dn't think so...that would beat any toyota MPV already
CVT GB? - dn't think so either...none of toyota model ever comes with CVT..i mean local ones
better handling? - toyota never cares abt handling AT ALL..even if they did...can't beat lotus
low price? - how is toyota going to survive
no matter how...an "improved" alza is not going to happen
*
Well, since most of you saying that is not going to happen than let it be, so Perodua will not make an improved version of the Alza and they are doom to the same boring model till the end of their lives.

Plus i did mention i am guessing/ only that Perodua may come out with a model to compete with the Exora. So my guess is wrong and do i get a banned from this?
dares
post Dec 18 2011, 11:54 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:50 PM)
Well, since most of you saying that is not going to happen than let it be, so Perodua will not make an improved version of the Alza and they are doom to the same boring model till the end of their lives.

Plus i did mention i am guessing/ only that Perodua may come out with a model to compete with the Exora. So my guess is wrong and do i get a banned from this?
*
Dont be so serious,we are all just sharing info, not criticizing you. smile.gif

This post has been edited by dares: Dec 18 2011, 11:56 PM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 18 2011, 11:57 PM

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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:50 PM)
Well, since most of you saying that is not going to happen than let it be, so Perodua will not make an improved version of the Alza and they are doom to the same boring model till the end of their lives.

Plus i did mention i am guessing/ only that Perodua may come out with a model to compete with the Exora. So my guess is wrong and do i get a banned from this?
*
No, you wont be banned because of this, lol. These are merely a conversation of changing and sharing opinion. A little debate is healthy. No need to feel bad about it.

I am no Toyota insider nor Perodua employee. I am just a teenager enjoying his final 22nd year. The reason I could cook up all these cock and bull stories is due to my exposure to the automotive world since 10 years ago. What I'm saying is all based from experience and also a bit of data analysis. I dare not say my theories here are 100% true, but I dare to say that it is 100% making sense.
mutt
post Dec 19 2011, 12:01 AM

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alza is considerably new in the market. I dont think there will be a REAL improved version besides facelifting. They dont need to do so because alza will continue selling like a hot cakes. P2 will always be seen as Toyota. Let the wannabes keep dreaming with their so called Toyota in disguise laugh.gif
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:01 AM

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QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Dec 18 2011, 10:57 PM)
I wish there was a commenting feature though... there are plenty of MPVs the size of an Exora with 1.6L engines... Ford Galaxy (4.8m) is available as a 1.6 with 160 hp and a 1.6 diesel with 115 hp (driven that one, enough power already for such a big car... it's not a sports car after all). The Ford S-Max has the same 1.6L engine. The VW Sharan/Seat Alhambra (4.85m) has a 1.4 with 150 hp. Opel Zafira (4.66m) has a 1.4 with 120 or 140 hp (and a 1.8 with 115... lol).
So Proton joins a nice group of cars with the Exora, though 138 hp from a 1.6 is not as extreme as what some others do.
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:03 AM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 19 2011, 12:01 AM)
I wish there was a commenting feature though... there are plenty of MPVs the size of an Exora with 1.6L engines... Ford Galaxy (4.8m) is available as a 1.6 with 160 hp and a 1.6 diesel with 115 hp (driven that one, enough power already for such a big car... it's not a sports car after all). The Ford S-Max has the same 1.6L engine. The VW Sharan/Seat Alhambra (4.85m) has a 1.4 with 150 hp. Opel Zafira (4.66m) has a 1.4 with 120 or 140 hp (and a 1.8 with 115... lol).
So Proton joins a nice group of cars with the Exora, though 138 hp from a 1.6 is not as extreme as what some others do.
*
For the second time, please stop making a comparison with the models you get at Germany.
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:07 AM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 19 2011, 12:03 AM)
For the second time, please stop making a comparison with the models you get at Germany.
*
+1

we're talking about Malaysia market which all the models mentioned are not selling here except the zafira/nabira (i occasionally drive this car).
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QUOTE(ben3085 @ Dec 18 2011, 11:50 PM)
Well, since most of you saying that is not going to happen than let it be, so Perodua will not make an improved version of the Alza and they are doom to the same boring model till the end of their lives.

Plus i did mention i am guessing/ only that Perodua may come out with a model to compete with the Exora. So my guess is wrong and do i get a banned from this?
*
they are and they won't
they won't becuz there will still be ppll buying alza for the sack of it's a toyota...typical
they are becuz they're not facelifting it with anything brand new....only the design different only...everything else will always be the same
at least proton have a policy of renewing a model every 5 years and 1-2 times facelifting it within that period(with new equipment and techs)
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:11 AM

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Feels like i am getting a banned just from making a guess with all the nice healthy debate going on here. So as long i getting some info, i'm always serious about it.
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:17 AM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 18 2011, 11:49 PM)
One solid reason is before the Myvi exist, Perodua is supposedly only to assemble hatchbacks (Kelisa, Kenari, Kancil) only.

Another reason is due to the Innova has moved upmarket and there is a need to address the Unser owners and potential MPV buyers who couldn't afford an Innova, hence Toyota need a new lower cost MPV to retain back these old Unser customers. Back then on 2003, there are hardly any brand in Malaysian market which sells MPV.

The Citroen Berlingo, Peugeot Partner and Renault Kangoo wasn't a great hit due to the Malaysian market which are generally a bunch of skeptics towards French vehicles.
*
Thanks for the info, good to know. smile.gif

That still leaves VW with the admittedly booooring looking Caddy (they might put in that lovely 1.4 TSI...?) and Skoda with the Roomster (it was on Top Gear today), they would have to fit 2 more seats though. Both are from VW so perhaps people trust them more (or is VW not interested in offering a "cheap" vehicle to avoid hurting their premium image? What about Skoda Roomster... powered by VW or something like that?).

Sadly I'm not sure the Bold will help Proton... the image is too damaged, and Perodua really seems to profit from being attached to Toyota. Plus Toyota seem to be rather lazy... as long as they can they will milk the cow offering sub-par vehicles at high prices, just like the 1 airbag Avanza (which in less than 2 weeks, despite not being available yet, will be illegal to sell?!). Maybe one day it will bite back... I hope so. Kia is offering the Forte for a bit more than Vios money with 6 airbags, the next Proton might have 6 airbags (and I doubt it will be more than 80k), the Fiesta sedan has 6 and is competitively priced, ... yet the Vios has 2. That may hurt Toyota. Probably not though, resale value is more important than their own life...

@V12Kompressor: The reviewer mentioned the world wide market, and there such cars are available. I also think it is nice that Proton is actually trying to compete with those cars in some areas. (Isn't the S-Max available here? 2x the price of the Exora though...). Didn't try to offend anyone. Sorry guys.

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 19 2011, 12:24 AM
dares
post Dec 19 2011, 12:29 AM

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Focusing back on the exora. Along with the new line of saga and the upcoming new proton model, i would like to give the designers at proton a good pat at the back.

Good job, now do better.biggrin.gif
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post Dec 19 2011, 12:31 AM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 18 2011, 11:36 PM)
But why didn't they release the Avanza as a Perodua in the first place? Apart from them having to assemble it here in that case... The Alza is the better product, at a lower price.

I also wonder why brands like Renault and Citroen gave up the Malaysian market... the 7 seater Kangoo could easily compete with the Avanza (except for the badge), though it was more expensive back then. IIRC the Kangoo was around 70k, i.e. Alza and Exora money. The new versions of these models (almost every continental manufacturer has a Kangoo-like car... Ford, Opel, Renault, Citroen, Peugeot, Fiat, VW, for a while Mercedes, and Toyota had the more consumer oriented Sienta) have all been vastly improved and grew in size. As they are perceived as panel vans by the population they might not get taxed as high as a continental 7 seater van.
*
the avanza is a "rush" job by toyota to conquer the small MPV market in this region and they managed to successfully conquer the market until other car-makers begins to attack this segment.

now that this segment of the market is congested, (Exora, Alza, Cherry, Livinia all sub-100k MPV), there is no point for toyota to come up with a new vehicle just for this segment.
Designing a chassis will take up alot of funds and looking at the competition in this segment now, from a business sense of view, it will not be worth it.

After all they already made enough when there is no player at this segment when Avanza is launched.
So what they are doing now is just to refresh / facelift the avanza and just add it to their product line-up.
After all there will be hard-core toyota supporters buying this avanza. TOYOTA branding is strong ma (at least in this part of the region)

All the other MPV rides better (more comfortable) due to their more car like chassis as compared to the avanza truck chassis...
wink.gif
ZenGTMM
post Dec 19 2011, 01:36 AM

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Bro ericmaxman.. Kasi tumpang ur thread to post my review.. smile.gif

Proton Exora Bold Premium CFE 1.6 CVT
Aquariusdenz
post Dec 19 2011, 01:58 AM

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QUOTE(ZenGTMM @ Dec 19 2011, 01:36 AM)
Bro ericmaxman.. Kasi tumpang ur thread to post my review.. smile.gif

Proton Exora Bold Premium CFE 1.6 CVT
*
Nice review smile.gif
ZenGTMM
post Dec 19 2011, 02:04 AM

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QUOTE(Aquariusdenz @ Dec 19 2011, 01:58 AM)
Nice review smile.gif
*
Thanks. smile.gif Couldnt come up with a more in-depth technical review due to the limitation of time and testing equipments as I was in JB. But I hope this would help a person understand better of the car with a more layman term approach.
kadajawi
post Dec 19 2011, 02:26 AM

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QUOTE(kcng @ Dec 19 2011, 12:31 AM)
the avanza is a "rush" job by toyota to conquer the small MPV market in this region and they managed to successfully conquer the market until other car-makers begins to attack this segment.

now that this segment of the market is congested, (Exora, Alza, Cherry, Livinia all sub-100k MPV), there is no point for toyota to come up with a new vehicle just for this segment.
Designing a chassis will take up alot of funds and looking at the competition in this segment now, from a business sense of view, it will not be worth it.

After all they already made enough when there is no player at this segment when Avanza is launched.
So what they are doing now is just to refresh / facelift the avanza and just add it to their product line-up.
After all there will be hard-core toyota supporters buying this avanza. TOYOTA branding is strong ma (at least in this part of the region)

All the other MPV rides better (more comfortable) due to their more car like chassis as compared to the avanza truck chassis...
wink.gif
*
Hm, yeah, I can see that. Toyota wouldn't necessarily have to develop a completely new car though, in some markets (I know I know... but we are talking about Toyota's need to develop a small'ish MPV, where IMHO they have one) they offer the Verso, which should be more premium than the Alza and might go against the Exora (which still offers more space though... the Verso is 4.44m, the dimensions are nearly identical to the Livina).

The Verso is positioned beneath the Wish but above the Alza, so that might actually work and fill in where the Avanza currently is (the Innova would have a hard time though...). At least in case Toyota is desperate to get the sub 100k MPV market covered. It might not be as cheap to produce, but it seems to be based on the Avensis, which is the European Camry (not sure they have much in common, but the handling will be a lot better than that of the Avanza.

Just pure speculation, I doubt that Toyota will start making the Verso for the ASEAN market. At least not as long as they can move enough Avanza (surely that car is making a decent profit, and the Verso will probably be more expensive to produce).

@ZenGTMM: I agree with Aquariusdenz, good review smile.gif

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 19 2011, 02:32 AM
A2Z2U
post Dec 19 2011, 03:35 AM

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QUOTE(ZenGTMM @ Dec 19 2011, 01:36 AM)
Bro ericmaxman.. Kasi tumpang ur thread to post my review.. smile.gif

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Good review bro. Looks like proton finally got it right.
JLean
post Dec 19 2011, 12:34 PM

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I have some information on it just to share yeah. Just my 2 cents.

Check out the all new Proton Exora Bold & Prime @
http://undercoverproject.blogspot.com/2011...-be-amazed.html
kadajawi
post Dec 19 2011, 01:12 PM

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QUOTE(JLean @ Dec 19 2011, 12:34 PM)
I have some information on it just to share yeah. Just my 2 cents.

Check out the all new Proton Exora Bold & Prime @
http://undercoverproject.blogspot.com/2011...-be-amazed.html
*
May I ask what you mean by illuminating meters?

Electric folding mirrors, nice smile.gif
V12Kompressor
post Dec 19 2011, 01:24 PM

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BTW, there's another feature on this car which I will find most people who went for the test drive tend to overlook;

there is a built in buzzer that will buzz when you forgot to turn off the headlights after you switched off the engine. Good for wimminz drivers. tongue.gif

and the door lock button will not lock the doors when one of the doors is still ajar.

neo1point3
post Dec 19 2011, 01:31 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 19 2011, 01:24 PM)
BTW, there's another feature on this car which I will find most people who went for the test drive tend to overlook;

there is a built in buzzer that will buzz when you forgot to turn off the headlights after you switched off the engine. Good for wimminz drivers. tongue.gif

and the door lock button will not lock the doors when one of the doors is still ajar.
*
This one my previous 1991 saga aeroback also got lah brader tongue.gif

V12Kompressor
post Dec 19 2011, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(neo1point3 @ Dec 19 2011, 01:31 PM)
This one my previous 1991 saga aeroback also got lah brader  tongue.gif
*
but this feature somehow "died" after numerous cost cutting measures deployed by those Mahathir's maggots. Now it is back. thumbup.gif
imin
post Dec 19 2011, 02:26 PM

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what's the interest rate offered for this exora bold?
xiphone4
post Dec 19 2011, 03:30 PM

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2.88% for 7 years
simonhar
post Dec 19 2011, 04:27 PM

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Hi guys, the Exora Bold is pretty good, more powerful and looks better now. Check out my little review smile.gif

http://www.simonhar.com/2011/12/driven-pro...old-16-cfe.html
SUSMatrix
post Dec 19 2011, 04:43 PM

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QUOTE(ZenGTMM @ Dec 19 2011, 02:04 AM)
Thanks. smile.gif  Couldnt come up with a more in-depth technical review due to the limitation of time and testing equipments as I was in JB. But I hope this would help a person understand better of the car with a more layman term approach.
*
Nice review. i think Proton has stated the torque chart...max out around 5k RPM, which probably explain it didn't gain more pushing power after that limit.
A2Z2U
post Dec 19 2011, 04:43 PM

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QUOTE(simonhar @ Dec 19 2011, 04:27 PM)
Hi guys, the Exora Bold is pretty good, more powerful and looks better now. Check out my little review smile.gif

http://www.simonhar.com/2011/12/driven-pro...old-16-cfe.html
*
Nice review bro. I like white exora very much. Yea, the lack of chrome badge is a bit annoying. Looks like even proton is not confident with its own products.
simonhar
post Dec 19 2011, 05:09 PM

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QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Dec 19 2011, 04:43 PM)
Nice review bro. I like white exora very much. Yea, the lack of chrome badge is a bit annoying. Looks like even proton is not confident with its own products.
*
Thanks bro smile.gif the lack of a chrome badge is not to say annoying, it's just doesn't give people the feel and outlook of elegance and luxury.
I mean how expensive can making a chrome badge be? A steering wheel with chrome badge (or at least coloured badge) can make a huge difference to the cabin!
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 05:18 PM

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i sat inside, i must say, this is going to be a seller.

the only only thing that makes/break the deal, will be the badge.

but come on, those mature/old buyer should not be blinded by the badge.

get alphard if they wanna showoff.

but innova at rm100k is a serious contender, only rm10k extra ( but innova interior very plain )
MR_alien
post Dec 19 2011, 05:22 PM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Dec 19 2011, 05:18 PM)
i sat inside, i must say, this is going to be a seller.

the only only thing that makes/break the deal, will be the badge.

but come on, those mature/old buyer should not be blinded by the badge.

get alphard if they wanna showoff.

but innova at rm100k is a serious contender, only rm10k extra ( but innova interior very plain )
*
innova still far from this exora...power cannot win..even can win, FC will still be high since 2.0L
handling isn't as good
like u said..interior very plain..not worth the price
and innova isn't using CVT as well
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 05:27 PM

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the 6 seater is very impressive, the captain seat, oh.
SUSkimsim
post Dec 19 2011, 05:45 PM

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So far got any you guy to booking blod premium model?
Worth buy or keep on decide others brand MPV?
simonhar
post Dec 19 2011, 07:22 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 19 2011, 05:22 PM)
innova still far from this exora...power cannot win..even can win, FC will still be high since 2.0L
handling isn't as good
like u said..interior very plain..not worth the price
and innova isn't using CVT as well
*
Agree! One thing I gotta admit is Exora's handling is superb. Based on power-to-weight ratio, Exora wins Innova (by a bit), and design wise also better than Innova. It's just that the badges that make the difference...
kadajawi
post Dec 19 2011, 07:40 PM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Dec 19 2011, 05:18 PM)
i sat inside, i must say, this is going to be a seller.

the only only thing that makes/break the deal, will be the badge.

but come on, those mature/old buyer should not be blinded by the badge.

get alphard if they wanna showoff.

but innova at rm100k is a serious contender, only rm10k extra ( but innova interior very plain )
*
How can the Innova based on a truck compete with the Exora, other than through the badge?

I don't know... I quite like the lack of a chrome badge on the steering wheel. Looks kinda subtle, different... however the headlights are not exactly pretty or modern to me. Something like this http://robson.m3rlin.org/cars/wp-content/u...0x1200-copy.jpg would be a lot cooler. Projector headlights with LEDs for the indicators, as eyelids. Or perhaps http://www.streetcar.dk/images/show/213051.jpg

I think I'd buy the Exora if I needed a new MPV and couldn't afford a Touran (twice the price for a car that's not nearly twice as good? hmm.gif )
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 07:43 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 19 2011, 07:40 PM)
How can the Innova based on a truck compete with the Exora, other than through the badge?

I don't know... I quite like the lack of a chrome badge on the steering wheel. Looks kinda subtle, different... however the headlights are not exactly pretty or modern to me. Something like this http://robson.m3rlin.org/cars/wp-content/u...0x1200-copy.jpg would be a lot cooler. Projector headlights with LEDs for the indicators, as eyelids. Or perhaps http://www.streetcar.dk/images/show/213051.jpg

I think I'd buy the Exora if I needed a new MPV and couldn't afford a Touran (twice the price for a car that's not nearly twice as good? hmm.gif )
*
mate, similar price range wink.gif

and toyota badge has a halo effect
kadajawi
post Dec 19 2011, 07:48 PM

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Yeah, I know, similar price. Which means the Innova is terribly overpriced. biggrin.gif
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 07:49 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 19 2011, 07:48 PM)
Yeah, I know, similar price. Which means the Innova is terribly overpriced. biggrin.gif
*
welcome to malaysia!! smile.gif truly asia~~!!(ripping u off the asian style)
SUSkimsim
post Dec 19 2011, 07:56 PM

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Why nobody compare to Kia Rando?
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 07:58 PM

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er.....biggrin.gif ok, lets talk about something else.
sct
post Dec 19 2011, 09:37 PM

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Me too find this exora good. however why u all compare it to g-livina/avanza/alza? if only b'cos similar $ range then u r getting the wrong pic.
I drive avanza,my colleague innova. He so "jealous" my avanza 'cos his innova simply too big for daily use. his wife intimidate by the size until no confidence to drive out.he has to travel along to work, carrying 6 fullsize empty chairs daily from Kajang to kl, 'cos his wife insist to swap his ori myvi. Only during weekend then may be the innova is filled. wat's d point ??
Avanza is shorter than iswara.Very practical to use as daily car. Excellent to go market/school, & sit full 7 if for short distance though long dist is a big no-no.but ask urself, how often u travel long dist with full 7??
Same goes to Inpira/vios/city & saga/viva. Not everybody want the size + features+ big cc even though similar price. Different cars for diff need.
mutt
post Dec 19 2011, 10:05 PM

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QUOTE(sct @ Dec 19 2011, 09:37 PM)
Me too find this exora good. however why u all compare it to g-livina/avanza/alza? if only b'cos similar $ range then u r getting the wrong pic.
I drive avanza,my colleague innova. He so "jealous" my avanza 'cos his innova simply too big for daily use. his wife intimidate by the size until no confidence to drive out.he has to travel along to work, carrying 6 fullsize empty chairs daily from Kajang to kl, 'cos his wife insist to swap his ori myvi. Only during weekend then may be the innova is filled. wat's d point ??
Avanza is shorter than iswara.Very practical to use as daily car. Excellent to go market/school, & sit full 7 if for short distance though long dist is a big no-no.but ask urself, how often u travel long dist with full 7??
Same goes to Inpira/vios/city & saga/viva. Not everybody want the size + features+ big cc even though similar price. Different cars for diff need.
*
Because a family with at least 3 children will compare to those you mentioned when they're looking for an MPV. If I have 3 children will definitely go for Exora Bold. No doubt about it. In fact, me and wifey already tempted to buy even we're just a family of 3 biggrin.gif . I rather wait than buying GL or Alza right now.
dadurtyz
post Dec 19 2011, 10:06 PM

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QUOTE(sct @ Dec 19 2011, 09:37 PM)
Me too find this exora good. however why u all compare it to g-livina/avanza/alza? if only b'cos similar $ range then u r getting the wrong pic.
I drive avanza,my colleague innova. He so "jealous" my avanza 'cos his innova simply too big for daily use. his wife intimidate by the size until no confidence to drive out.he has to travel along to work, carrying 6 fullsize empty chairs daily from Kajang to kl, 'cos his wife insist to swap his ori myvi. Only during weekend then may be the innova is filled. wat's d point ??
Avanza is shorter than iswara.Very practical to use as daily car. Excellent to go market/school, & sit full 7 if for short distance though long dist is a big no-no.but ask urself, how often u travel long dist with full 7??
Same goes to Inpira/vios/city & saga/viva. Not everybody want the size + features+ big cc even though similar price. Different cars for diff need.
*
u will need to consider mine also, i bough a sedan, but occupied only by me everyday, in-term of size and purpose i must choose small car like kancil or kelisa because only drive to work everyday. but i rather sacrifices my long investment to something i will not regret for now and maybe future.
for your case avanza not look like MPV for me, why u bough avanza? since you got a-lot of choice others car. their comparing the price tag and class, and i beg many of malaysian will consider the brand rather than the purpose.

turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 10:14 PM

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just buy a porsche boxster to work.

and leave the econobox for weekend family outing!!!
sct
post Dec 19 2011, 10:32 PM

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Never buy/never used/never own/never know.
My colleague,he tot innova more proper mpv than avanza, which is very true in paper.He has 3 children + a maid+stay nearby parents/auntie/uncle so very good chance to fully use the seats, but well, end up who is enjoying more daily?i not say extra space is bad,i also not say avanza better than alza/livina,but buy wat u need frequently,not occasionally until bcome white elephant.
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 10:34 PM

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Er I prefer alza
sct
post Dec 19 2011, 10:40 PM

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Bck to exora. y d compression ratio so low 1?I tot soft turbo no matter how soft still turbo ma so should be higher, eg12~13:1?if current true then no high compress oso can gv tis good toq, would be good 4 d engine longevity d. knapa??
turbocharged
post Dec 19 2011, 10:41 PM

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Turbo always low compression la. Only Myvi is high compression.

You mean low boost is it?
archonixm
post Dec 19 2011, 10:44 PM

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13:1 then prepare for RON100 la..ish....
sct
post Dec 19 2011, 11:03 PM

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oic. having read a bit on wiki,turbo already compress air b4 enter cylinder,so CR similar to NA,but with air/fuel compressed,right?so if the turbo spoilt,the exora will behave like normal 1.6?
actually no interest on turbo b4,but once testdrove d exora,interest grow rolleyes.gif very smooth & nice power it has.
mutt
post Dec 19 2011, 11:15 PM

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QUOTE(sct @ Dec 19 2011, 11:03 PM)
oic. having read a bit on wiki,turbo already compress air b4 enter cylinder,so CR similar to NA,but with air/fuel compressed,right?so if the turbo spoilt,the exora will behave like normal 1.6?
actually no interest on turbo b4,but once testdrove d exora,interest grow  rolleyes.gif  very smooth & nice power it has.
*
once you test drive sure you feel like 'damn I want this MPV!' especially for a poor guy like me biggrin.gif Me and wifey already put Exora Bold on our wishlist and start to save more money. Looking to get this mpv by end of next year icon_idea.gif
kadajawi
post Dec 19 2011, 11:23 PM

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QUOTE(sct @ Dec 19 2011, 09:37 PM)
Avanza is shorter than iswara.Very practical to use as daily car. Excellent to go market/school, & sit full 7 if for short distance though long dist is a big no-no.but ask urself, how often u travel long dist with full 7??
Same goes to Inpira/vios/city & saga/viva. Not everybody want the size + features+ big cc even though similar price. Different cars for diff need.
*
You have a point there. I love and enjoy how nimble the Kangoo is (<4m), very easy to park smile.gif And still enough space for 7 adults (not too long legs of course) + about 2 suitcases or 1 wheel chair. But if you want a not too big car... Alza? Just 10 cm more...

The Exora is much longer... those who consider it should also consider the external dimensions. When I drove the Galaxy I nearly pooped in my pants laugh.gif The road suddenly seemed small and no parking space big enough.
sct
post Dec 19 2011, 11:43 PM

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d small radiator inside left bumper 4 turbo or cvt?noticed it has 2 fans too which is rare.
With the turbo min has to use semi oil,no more mineral?
MR_alien
post Dec 19 2011, 11:57 PM

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QUOTE(sct @ Dec 19 2011, 11:43 PM)
d small radiator inside left bumper 4 turbo or cvt?noticed it has 2 fans too which is rare.
With the turbo min has to use semi oil,no more mineral?
*
i think that one is the CVT cooler
this exora did come with 2 radiator
not rare...my dad's waja also got 2 big fans there
and proton has been using semi syn oil all along

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Dec 19 2011, 11:59 PM
rcracer
post Dec 20 2011, 01:35 AM

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no intercooler?
Vervain
post Dec 20 2011, 01:39 AM

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watercooled i think.
imin
post Dec 20 2011, 03:02 AM

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QUOTE(xiphone4 @ Dec 19 2011, 03:30 PM)
2.88% for 7 years
*
thanks. how about the interest rate for 5 years. is it the same, or lower?
mat79
post Dec 20 2011, 03:59 AM

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kadajawi, u can go to malaysian customs website for info n howmuch the tax n go to maa website to make it easy for u to understand the tax.
Basically for every car below 1800 in malaysia, they have to pay 75% excise duty n 10% sales duty including prtn n perodua. But for ckd, they have to pay extra 10% import duty while cbu have to pay 30% import duty.
For mpv between 1500cc to 1800cc, excise duty is 65% n sales tax is 10%. Cbu n ckd import tax is flat rate at 30% for cbu, 10% for ckd for any segment n any capacity engine according to customs n maa.
Fyi, avanza 1.3 paying less tax than our local alza n exora coz for 1500cc n below mpv, ckd import tax is waved n only pay for 60% for excise duty n 10% sales tax n yet they expensive, even have less 5% tax than our local.
Ckd only 10% higher tax than local, but the price,is higher. Can anyone justify vios will be the same price as persona if only pay 10% more tax than persona? For me, it just becoz of cif n also toyota want high profit.

Generally,all local cars need to pay 85% tax, while exora n alza paying 75% tax.
All ckds' just add 10% n cbus 30%. Thats why nowadays conti n korean are cars cheaper than japs in msia such as fiesta, forte, recently launch citroen c4 n etc coz they r just take normal profit margin n add all the taxes. U just think how civic 2.0 can be far expensive than cbu pug 308thp156 n citroen c4thp156 when the conti offer more equipment level n better pwrtrain dept than hondas even civic is ckd? Same as lancer gt 2.0 cbu versus civic 2.0 n altis 2.0(both ckd, suppose to pay 20% less tax) but get same pricing in malaysia.

So kadajawi, just go to website i mentioned before. So, 19% in germany oppose 85% tax on locals in malaysia, what do u think? So, how much is exora bold without tax? I leave it to u to do the calculation.


Added on December 20, 2011, 4:40 amand why toyota@daihatsu gave perodua rebadged passo sette@ luminas.
My opinion, 1st profit. Why profit coz will jeoperdize avanza sales? The question is how much avanza sales before n after the arrival of grandlivina n exora? So, fyi, and i believe everybody is well informed that sales of myvi in malaysia only already beat sales of sirion n passo in entire japan, can u imagine that, myvi sales is better than what they are getting from their own country. If u ask me where gets the fact, just google, if lazy, search in paultan, there is a special post on that.
Tyota own daihatsu, daihatsu has stakes in perodua. Not only daihatsu gain profit coz they r the shareholders, n u must know that this is rebadge exercise, so that perodua has to pay rebadged royalty as agreement. N the mother off all profit gainer, toyota coz they own daihatsu.
So, killing 2 birds in 1 stone ha..gain profit from alza n at the same time has extra bonus selling avanza since not rugi for toyota, even assemble avanza at perodua. Kira side bonus jelah, klu dia xkuar avanza, mgkin bkal pembeli avanza akn beli glivina@exora. Alang2,mkn sini,mkn sana.

That is how business minded think. The same thing happen to mitsu, lancer sales loose bad with civic,altis even fote. Cannot sell well, prtn want to rebadged, opportunity come, no need pening2 nak hantar kete cbu byk2 kat stok yard, dah kena bayo cif, so duk goyang kaki, dpt mkn royalti dr inspira..tp klu lancer top seller kat msia,jgn hrpler mitsu nk bg.


Added on December 20, 2011, 4:50 amif ford smax double the price of exora in msia, so meaning that, even compete with the same local tax apply to local cars, they r still expensive coz import duty only 30% from value of the car without tax. So, if smx cost u 160k, that is already including everything plus accesories,road tax, insurance n all insurance,profit dealer, so it supposed to be around 18k max( assuming value of the car 60k in malaysia before all the tax n dealer profit . Etc). So, 160k minus 18k, u got rm142k, which is still expesive than locals.this is same level playing fill condition where smax being tax the same as locals.
By the, the price of smax 160 just a sample coz somebody say before it price twice exora in msia,lazy to google for the price.

This post has been edited by mat79: Dec 20 2011, 04:50 AM
ethan99
post Dec 20 2011, 06:47 AM

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Thanks very good info sharing....

QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 20 2011, 03:59 AM)
kadajawi, u can go to malaysian customs website for info n howmuch the tax n go to maa website to make it easy for u to understand the tax.
Basically for every car below 1800 in malaysia, they have to pay 75% excise duty n 10% sales duty including prtn n perodua. But for ckd, they have to pay extra 10% import duty while cbu have to pay 30% import duty.
For mpv between 1500cc to 1800cc, excise duty is 65% n sales tax is 10%. Cbu n ckd import tax is flat rate at 30% for cbu, 10% for ckd for any segment n any capacity engine according to customs n maa.
Fyi, avanza 1.3 paying less tax than our local alza n exora coz for 1500cc n below mpv, ckd import tax is waved n only pay for 60% for excise duty n 10% sales tax n yet they expensive, even have less 5% tax than our local.
Ckd only 10% higher tax than local, but the price,is higher. Can anyone justify vios will be the same price as persona if only pay 10% more tax than persona? For me, it just becoz of cif n also toyota want high profit.

Generally,all local cars need to pay 85% tax, while exora n alza paying 75% tax.
All ckds' just add 10% n cbus 30%. Thats why nowadays conti n korean are cars cheaper than japs in msia such as fiesta, forte, recently launch citroen c4 n etc coz they r just take normal profit margin n add all the taxes. U just think how civic 2.0 can be far expensive than cbu pug 308thp156 n citroen c4thp156 when the conti offer more equipment level n better pwrtrain dept than hondas even civic is ckd? Same as lancer gt 2.0 cbu versus civic 2.0 n altis 2.0(both ckd, suppose to pay 20% less tax) but get same pricing in malaysia.

So kadajawi, just go to website i mentioned before. So, 19% in germany oppose 85% tax on locals in malaysia, what do u think? So, how much is exora bold without tax? I leave it to u to do the calculation.


Added on December 20, 2011, 4:40 amand why toyota@daihatsu gave perodua rebadged passo sette@ luminas.
My opinion, 1st profit. Why profit coz will jeoperdize avanza sales? The question is how much avanza sales before n after the arrival of grandlivina n exora? So, fyi, and i believe everybody is well informed that sales of myvi in malaysia only already beat sales of sirion n passo in entire japan, can u imagine that, myvi sales is better than what they are getting from their own country. If u ask me where gets the fact, just google, if lazy, search in paultan, there is a special post on that.
Tyota own daihatsu, daihatsu has stakes in perodua. Not only daihatsu gain profit coz they r the shareholders, n u must know that this is rebadge exercise, so that perodua has to pay rebadged royalty as agreement. N the mother off all profit gainer, toyota coz they own daihatsu.
So, killing 2 birds in 1 stone ha..gain profit from alza n at the same time has extra bonus selling avanza since not rugi for toyota, even assemble avanza at perodua. Kira side bonus jelah, klu dia xkuar avanza, mgkin bkal pembeli avanza akn beli glivina@exora. Alang2,mkn sini,mkn sana.

That is how business minded think. The same thing happen to mitsu, lancer sales loose bad with civic,altis even fote. Cannot sell well, prtn want to rebadged, opportunity come, no need pening2 nak hantar kete cbu byk2 kat stok yard, dah kena bayo cif, so duk goyang kaki, dpt mkn royalti dr inspira..tp klu lancer top seller kat msia,jgn hrpler mitsu nk bg.


Added on December 20, 2011, 4:50 amif ford smax double the price of exora in msia, so meaning that, even compete with the same local tax apply to local cars, they r still expensive coz import duty only 30% from value of the car without tax. So, if smx cost u 160k, that is already including everything plus accesories,road tax, insurance n all insurance,profit dealer, so it supposed to be around 18k max( assuming value of the car 60k in malaysia before all the tax n dealer profit . Etc). So, 160k minus 18k, u got rm142k, which is still expesive than locals.this is same level playing fill condition where smax being tax the same as locals.
By the, the price of smax 160 just a sample coz somebody say before it price twice exora in msia,lazy to google for the price.
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kochin
post Dec 20 2011, 10:06 AM

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can anybody recommend me the best place to get exora bold premium?
best place as in offering the best, biggest discount and super duper highest trade in for an old junk.
thanks.

PS: within klang valley lah of course. kindly PM me instead of posting here.
mutt
post Dec 20 2011, 10:18 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Dec 20 2011, 10:06 AM)
can anybody recommend me the best place to get exora bold premium?
best place as in offering the best, biggest discount and super duper highest trade in for an old junk.
thanks.

PS: within klang valley lah of course. kindly PM me instead of posting here.
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I would suggest you to sell you car by yourself. If trade in sure get the minimum value. And since Bold is just launched, I don't think there will be any discounts. I'd suggest you to wait for end of next year for great year end discounts laugh.gif
kadajawi
post Dec 20 2011, 02:12 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 20 2011, 03:59 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «
Awesome mat79, thanks for the info! Somehow I thought the taxes for local cars are much lower.

Quite confusing, but if I understand correctly VW _could_ sell a CKD VW Touran 1.2 BlueMotion (lower FC... 5.9L/100 km), base spec with 105 hp, manual gearbox, 6 airbags, ESC, aircon and not much else for 103,5k?! You can buy one for 17000 Euro, without tax 14285 Euro. Add 75% as it would be a CKD under 1.5L, 25000 Euro, which atm is RM 103,5k. These blood sucking vampires!

The Exora would be 11021 Euro without taxes then, add 19% it's 13115 Euro. That would be extremely competitive. Give it 6 airbags and ESC and I think people might buy it in Europe.

Going completely off topic I just had a look at the Yaris (Vios hatchback)... a 1.3L one with 101 hp, manual gearbox, 4 airbags (dealer mentions only 4, but it should have 7...?), aircon and... that's it really would cost RM 72600 (if it's a CBU). So it's not much more expensive in Malaysia, it's just that Proton really knows how to make cheap cars (or rather they know how to cut cost... no wonder a Saga might have slightly poor build quality).

The MyVi hardly has competition in Malaysia, apart from P1 which people are kind of afraid of. In Japan there is much, much much more competition I'd imagine. Same thing in Germany, I think I've seen it less than 5 times there (strangely enough I know one person who bought it, and she really liked it. Her previous car was the Citroen that turned into the Tiara though... she might have liked any car).

The taxing got me thinking... Ford can sell the Fiesta for 81k here, in Germany one that is similarly spec'ed (without the DSG) is, I believe, around 20k Euro, so more or less the same price for a smaller (hatchback) worse spec'ed car, and here they have to pay 85% tax instead of 19%. hmm.gif

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 20 2011, 02:13 PM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 20 2011, 02:37 PM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Dec 20 2011, 10:06 AM)
can anybody recommend me the best place to get exora bold premium?
best place as in offering the best, biggest discount and super duper highest trade in for an old junk.
thanks.

PS: within klang valley lah of course. kindly PM me instead of posting here.
*
new model dont think got discounts. Even free gifts is quite limited.

I have lobang for ready stock BTW.
rcracer
post Dec 20 2011, 03:38 PM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ Dec 19 2011, 06:39 PM)
watercooled i think.
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intercooler not for cooling of the turbo but cooling the AIR after compressed by the turbo before going into the engine. The prototype had a huge one
slowmo2020
post Dec 20 2011, 03:41 PM

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was wondering ... what kinda ron fuel they use on those exora test unit ??? 95 or 97 ???

This post has been edited by slowmo2020: Dec 20 2011, 04:44 PM
mat79
post Dec 20 2011, 04:34 PM

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they are many things that need to be considered n especially tax around the world. Its like in uk, thay have vat, plus here,plus there, n they got the actual price, n buying cars outside especially in us, u can even bargain the selling price coz its up to the dealer to reduce their own profit to be competitive, i've not been there, but my sis staying there for 4 years working owning mazda 6.there,but sold it before coming back to malaysia.
Have u been working or living in germany before? Just asking coz i'm not really regular forumer here, just regular reader n maybe just miss out some info about u.
Its like singapore, their tax is not that high, but coe alone for exora mline auto cost u 44k sgd. U can check through their customs website also but easily obtain based car price coz they put all of it visibily on the net.
Like euro,even tax n insurance(normally they call it running cost)is based on co2. Many of them can owned beemer but not many that owned it can run it coz the running cost too high..
By the way,they used ron 95.
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post Dec 20 2011, 04:42 PM

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QUOTE(slowmo2020 @ Dec 20 2011, 03:41 PM)
was wondering ...  what kinda ron fuel they use on those test unit ???          95 or 97 ???
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RON95 compatible.
kadajawi
post Dec 20 2011, 10:04 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 20 2011, 04:34 PM)
they are many things that need to be considered n especially tax around the world. Its like in uk, thay have vat, plus here,plus there, n they got the actual price, n buying cars outside especially in us, u can even bargain the selling price coz its up to the dealer to reduce their own profit to be competitive, i've not been there, but my sis staying there for 4 years working owning mazda 6.there,but sold it before coming back to malaysia.
Have u been working or living in germany before? Just asking coz i'm not really regular forumer here, just regular reader n maybe just miss out some info about u.
Its like singapore, their tax is not that high, but coe alone for exora mline auto cost u 44k sgd. U can check through their customs website also but easily obtain based car price coz they put all of it visibily on the net.
Like euro,even tax n insurance(normally they call it running cost)is based on co2. Many of them can owned beemer but not many that owned it can run it coz the running cost too high..
By the way,they used ron 95.
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I'm German, half ang mo, but grew up over there. Trying to learn how things are here, very fascinating and interesting smile.gif

Yup, petrol is extremely expensive over there, that's why contis tend to have a rather low FC. Insurance in Germany is at least in parts determined by what car you drive (i.e. expensive to repair, often involved in accidents (car popular with beginners, wanna be F1 drivers etc.)), location (areas with many accidents means expensive), age, how long they have owned a car, when the last accident was, gender, occupation, if you own a garage, who is going to drive it, ... very confusing and complicated, and it can be really really expensive. Tax depended on the cc and the classification (Euro1, 2, 3, ...), which would be checked every few years to ensure the car doesn't stink too much (if it does, road tax will rise). The UK already switched to a CO2 based system, not sure but I think Germany intends to follow. Merc, BMW etc. are also generally more expensive when it comes to servicing, repairing, spare parts. --> Big, expensive cars don't get very good resale value, i.e. anyone can afford to buy a big Benz, driving it though... not so much.
Vervain
post Dec 20 2011, 11:06 PM

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QUOTE(rcracer @ Dec 20 2011, 03:38 PM)
intercooler not for cooling of the turbo but cooling the AIR after compressed by the turbo before going into the engine. The prototype had a huge one
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There's water-cooled type intercooler.
farique
post Dec 20 2011, 11:16 PM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ Dec 20 2011, 11:06 PM)
There's water-cooled type intercooler.
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refer to first page.

Its air-to-air intercooler.


Also, water-cooled intercooler is not efficient for a mass produce car. Its not a race car or a sprint car.
xiphone4
post Dec 21 2011, 12:02 AM

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I thought Germany car road tax based on horse power and not engine cc?
I don't know 10 years ago I worked in Germany and I was told by local engineer.

This post has been edited by xiphone4: Dec 21 2011, 12:02 AM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 21 2011, 12:23 AM

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QUOTE(xiphone4 @ Dec 21 2011, 12:02 AM)
I thought Germany car road tax based on horse power and not engine cc?
I don't know 10 years ago I worked in Germany and I was told by local engineer.
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10 years ago diesel road tax is more expensive than the equivalent displacement petrol road tax.

10 years is a long time. A lot of things changed during the period.
Vervain
post Dec 21 2011, 12:34 AM

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QUOTE(farique @ Dec 20 2011, 11:16 PM)
refer to first page.

Its air-to-air intercooler.
Also, water-cooled intercooler is not efficient for a mass produce car. Its not a race car or a sprint car.
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Sorry, my bad sad.gif
mat79
post Dec 21 2011, 03:20 AM

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kadajawi, despite all the crazy taxes impose in car, i still feel bless as msian, we still get cheap education n cheap health care n cheap housing n even food(the living cost), not the cheapest in the world, but cheap than many others(rm 1 for a treatment, i dunno bout german whether can get the same price for medication)
Nightstalker1993
post Dec 21 2011, 05:14 AM

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QUOTE(farique @ Dec 20 2011, 11:16 PM)
refer to first page.

Its air-to-air intercooler.
Also, water-cooled intercooler is not efficient for a mass produce car. Its not a race car or a sprint car.
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isn't that the CVT cooler?
Aquariusdenz
post Dec 21 2011, 11:50 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 21 2011, 03:20 AM)
kadajawi, despite all the crazy taxes impose in car, i still feel bless as msian, we still get cheap education n cheap health care n cheap housing n even food(the living cost), not the cheapest in the world, but cheap than many others(rm 1 for a treatment, i dunno bout german whether can get the same price for medication)
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Rm1 kah? My place RM2 already
turbocharged
post Dec 21 2011, 11:54 AM

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this car is value for money !!

This post has been edited by turbocharged: Dec 21 2011, 11:54 AM
SUSkimsim
post Dec 21 2011, 12:21 PM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Dec 21 2011, 11:54 AM)
this car is value for money !!
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If you wanna this car no matter how, you got 10 more reason to giving yourself to buy this car.

Car is good and value for money.

(if I am stay in kampung and don't mind the M/T, just I pleased on this car can carry 7-8 ppl at same time.
Go shopping or any long distance journey smile.gif
allenultra
post Dec 21 2011, 12:27 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 19 2011, 11:57 PM)
i think that one is the CVT cooler
this exora did come with 2 radiator
not rare...my dad's waja also got 2 big fans there
and proton has been using semi syn oil all along
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There shall be only one radiator.

Proton cars usually come with 2 designs of fan cooling system.
1 cooling fan system for A/C condenser + radiator, or cooling fan systems for A/C condenser and radiator respectively.
mat_tepets
post Dec 21 2011, 12:41 PM

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http://www.star-motoring.com/Previews/2011...Exora!.aspx
mutt
post Dec 21 2011, 01:26 PM

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Let's see how the FC will be.. if can get around Waja CPS FC then I don't mind to put this car on my next year to buy list though I only have 1 little baby girl biggrin.gif
MR_alien
post Dec 21 2011, 02:22 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 21 2011, 01:26 PM)
Let's see how the FC will be.. if can get around Waja CPS FC then I don't mind to put this car on my next year to buy list though I only have 1 little baby girl biggrin.gif
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the FC should be good cuz of the CVT GB they put in there
CPS still use conventional 4AT
sbz2000
post Dec 21 2011, 02:49 PM

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i wonder how many ppl wait for somebody to crash it..... and looking for that engine for transplant biggrin.gif
kadajawi
post Dec 21 2011, 03:38 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 21 2011, 03:20 AM)
kadajawi, despite all the crazy taxes impose in car, i still feel bless as msian, we still get cheap education n cheap health care n cheap housing n even food(the living cost), not the cheapest in the world, but cheap than many others(rm 1 for a treatment, i dunno bout german whether can get the same price for medication)
*
You can be. Healthcare is pretty expensive (you are forced to be insured, but of course you have to pay, depending on how much you earn). If you need to go to the doctor you have to pay around 20 rm if you haven't done so before in the same quarter. Medicine is 20 or 40 rm each. Houses are quite affordable and the government helps a lot to make everyone have their own house. In Germany you are out on your own (though they make sure you can survive if unemployed).

I used to pay about 2000 rm in road tax alone for my 1.9 diesel (it was quite a stinker, one of the earliest catalytic converters). The modern 1.4 petrol was tax exempt.

Btw. there is more competition between shops, so especially consumer electronics are more affordable, especially on the upper end. frequently eating in restaurants will bankrupt you though... biggrin.gif

Education is free too, but somehow there is a strong correlation between the parents purse and their children success at school, if they go to university etc. (government supports the children of poor families with free loans of which they only have to pay back half the money). university is very cheap compared to us, UK, aus, ...

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 21 2011, 03:47 PM
turbocharged
post Dec 21 2011, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 21 2011, 03:38 PM)
You can be. Healthcare is pretty expensive (you are forced to be insured, but of course you have to pay, depending on how much you earn). If you need to go to the doctor you have to pay around 20 rm if you haven't done so before in the same quarter. Medicine is 20 or 40 rm each. Houses are quite affordable and the government helps a lot to make everyone have their own house. In Germany you are out on your own (though they make sure you can survive if unemployed).

I used to pay about 2000 rm in road tax alone for my 1.9 diesel (it was quite a stinker, one of the earliest catalytic converters). The modern 1.4 petrol was tax exempt.

Btw. there is more competition between shops, so especially consumer electronics are more affordable, especially on the upper end. frequently eating in restaurants will bankrupt you though... biggrin.gif
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yea, living in msia is such a blessing. msia is one of the best countries to stay.

ask those indon, bangla, negro, and ppl from myanmar. biggrin.gif
Aaron135LC
post Dec 21 2011, 04:51 PM

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sorry.. sign0006.gif a bit..

Germans went out for food.. they pay their own meal right..? despite going out as a family.. father pay own meal, mother pay own meal, son pay own meal or etc...

this comes from a german my sis knew.. her fren married this german.. and she find it weird cause german are normal to this..


but back to the topic about tax.. i still don really understand this..

can sum it up in a much more simpler way..? thanks ! icon_rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by Aaron135LC: Dec 21 2011, 04:51 PM
turbocharged
post Dec 21 2011, 05:00 PM

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QUOTE(Aaron135LC @ Dec 21 2011, 04:51 PM)
sorry.. sign0006.gif a bit..

Germans went out for food.. they pay their own meal right..? despite going out as a family.. father pay own meal, mother pay own meal, son pay own meal or etc...

this comes from a german my sis knew.. her fren married this german.. and she find it weird cause german are normal to this..
but back to the topic about tax.. i still don really understand this..

can sum it up in a much more simpler way..? thanks !  icon_rolleyes.gif
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OOT,

malaysian very steady, eat, father pay. buy vios, father pay(downpayment), buy 600k house, father pay downpayment.

get baby, father (grandfather dy) pay milk powder biggrin.gif

german/westerner is better in this case biggrin.gif

ok, just in general.

our culture more on spoonfeeding. from education to family.

OOT,

ok, back to car.
Nightstalker1993
post Dec 21 2011, 05:31 PM

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QUOTE(mat_tepets @ Dec 21 2011, 12:41 PM)
QUOTE
The new turbo-charged engine is still loosely based on the CPS engine but only shares 30% of its components with the CPS. So it’s not entirely a new engine. Gone is the painful howl that was associated with the CPS engine on a hillclimb, instead you now get progressive power to tug the car up the hill.


interesting... So it isn't just a simple bolt-on turbo eh? hmm.gif
MR_alien
post Dec 21 2011, 07:09 PM

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QUOTE(Nightstalker1993 @ Dec 21 2011, 05:31 PM)
interesting... So it isn't just a simple bolt-on turbo eh? hmm.gif
*
it should be
bolted in front of campro engine
this is campro not CPS
SUSkimsim
post Dec 21 2011, 07:24 PM

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QUOTE(Nightstalker1993 @ Dec 21 2011, 05:31 PM)
interesting... So it isn't just a simple bolt-on turbo eh? hmm.gif
*
The teachology is something like Intel Chip and Do the Over-clock system smile.gif

DinKnight
post Dec 21 2011, 11:10 PM

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Hi all, I test drove the Exora Bold 1.6 Premium CVT with my wife. Twice.

First was at Mutiara Damansara showroom. The route was mostly on the Penchala link. Number of people on board was 04: Me, wife, my brother and SA. Roads were wet coz it rained earlier. I tested the old Exora CPS when it first launched at this same showroom, it drove like a cow coz the engine was useless in climbing slopes.

But the Exora Bold with turbo was a good drive. Although I wished for more power and torque from the engine, the drive was adequate as I just need an MPV for town/city and highway driving. The car would be more from my wife, as we are expecting our first child mid of next year, so we are planning now on when to get the MPV. My wife was satisfies with the drive, despite having four adults on board, the power delivery was quite good.

The next day, we went to see an Alza. Wife liked the premium quality, but space was a BIG dissapointment (pun intended).

Second test drive on the same day was at the Taman SEA branch. This time I drove it on some normal flat roads, I found that I enjoyed the drive and tested the different gearbox modes (SAT, L gear, etc) and even the autocruise. With the features such as the reverse camera and overhead DVD entertainment system as standard on the Bold Premium for RM80k, I found that this MPV would be best suited for our needs in the near future. The only dissapointment for my wife was the absence of a proper Black colour choice, though I personally don't mind settling for the Elegant Brown (looks like Gold) colour. For me, I still have the stigma of past Proton ownership bugging me, I hope this new Exora wouldn't be too much of a problem, otherwise it would definitely be our last proton.

We would be placing a booking sometime early next year just after we purchase a new house in JB. Hopefully, by then, Proton manages to fix any niggling reliability issues of the engine, turbo and CVT box, and maybe reintroduce a proper Black colour.


kadajawi
post Dec 21 2011, 11:26 PM

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QUOTE(Aaron135LC @ Dec 21 2011, 04:51 PM)
sorry.. sign0006.gif a bit..

Germans went out for food.. they pay their own meal right..? despite going out as a family.. father pay own meal, mother pay own meal, son pay own meal or etc...

this comes from a german my sis knew.. her fren married this german.. and she find it weird cause german are normal to this..
but back to the topic about tax.. i still don really understand this..

can sum it up in a much more simpler way..? thanks !  icon_rolleyes.gif
*
Maybe we should start a thread in Kopitiam?

Personally I haven't seen everyone (in a family) pay for themselves. If they are just a couple, then yes, I'd say that's quite normal (or one would pay one day, the other one the other day). Within a family... I guess it is hard to generalize, within Germany there are already huge differences in character/behaviour (East Germans, especially from Saxony are popular for complaining/bemoaning how bad things are, Cologne is the gayest town of Germany, ... lots of stereotypes).

I like the idea of the family being there for each other. Sometimes in Germany it would happen that children sue their parents for money so they can for example study ohmy.gif (there's a law for that...)

About the taxes:
From what I understood so far it was 85% for _all_ cars, including local ones, then add 10% for CKD or 30% for CBU, unless it's a MPV with a <1,5L engine, then the 10% is waived. Or something like that. mat79's description is quite good.

Unfortunately then I found this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysian_mot...e_import_duties
I hoped it was less confusing. Another explanation (that seems to contradict the Wikipedia/MAA page?):
http://www.autoworld.com.my/aw/resources/duty.htm
So... diesel passenger cars always 120% tax (no wonder "many" big diesel on the road), and then it gets confusing, also no CKD is mentioned, no local car. Autoworld says the government can say "no, the car is worth more than that" and raise the price, so taxes will be higher...

It seems like in Langkawi cars are (completely?) tax free. A Exora Bold Premium is RM 79,548.00 / Solid in peninsular Malaysia, but RM 74,998.00 / Solid in Langkawi. So I wonder how it can be 75 or 85%...
Let's say the regular non metallic Vios G spec is RM 86,530.00, in Langkawi it is RM 64,280.66. VW, Ford etc. I couldn't quickly find a price for Langkawi sad.gif

http://english.pravda.ru/news/world/22-03-...675-malaysia-0/
This is simpler, however not precise, and I'm not sure how valid or current the info is. http://www.bmwclubmalaysia.com/forums/arch...hp/t-27579.html is quite enlightening, especially the last few posts. When you ask for a sales quotation you get exactly listed how much tax you have to pay?
chulaisn
post Dec 22 2011, 12:06 AM

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test drove this morning. first impression upon starting engine..dissapointment,,the engine sound and felt like a bag of nails..its rough and unrefine..exact feel i had when i took delivery of my gen2 5 yrs back. However, only at idle, it felt so. Thereafter on the move ,all was well, steering and suspension are good,the cvt gearbox smooth . Like the review by star motoring- pls dont expect kick in the butt turbo performance. infact i didnt feel the turbo at all but instead a very smooth progression..mybe the cvt blunted the pickup to a certain point.infact i would prefer such state of tune between gb and engine as reliability on the long run will be better. back to the drive, upon sudden acceleration ffrom low speed, a typical trait of the cvt emerge - the engine will spin to high rpm with a moment that feel like half clutching a manual car/or a worn out clutch, before the gear 'reengages' again - this probably is something a cvt driver will have to learn/live with.
turbocharged
post Dec 22 2011, 12:26 AM

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QUOTE(chulaisn @ Dec 22 2011, 12:06 AM)
test drove this morning. first impression upon starting engine..dissapointment,,the engine sound and felt like a bag of nails..its rough and unrefine..exact feel i had when i took delivery of my gen2 5 yrs back. However, only at idle, it felt so. Thereafter on the move ,all was well, steering and suspension are good,the cvt gearbox smooth . Like the review by star motoring- pls dont expect kick in the butt turbo performance. infact i didnt feel the turbo at all but instead a very smooth progression..mybe the cvt blunted the pickup to a certain point.infact i would prefer such state of tune between gb and engine as reliability on the long run will be better. back to the drive, upon sudden acceleration ffrom low speed, a typical trait of the cvt emerge - the engine will spin to high rpm with a moment that feel like half clutching a manual car/or a worn out clutch, before the gear 'reengages' again - this probably is something a cvt driver will have to learn/live with.
*
i think can engage manual shift(if there is any) to actually try the acceleration
V12Kompressor
post Dec 22 2011, 01:17 AM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Dec 22 2011, 12:26 AM)
i think can engage manual shift(if there is any) to actually try the acceleration
*
there isn't any

and the best way to get the best 0-100 timing is to slot it into D and step it to 4,000 rpm all the way.
wordtalks
post Dec 22 2011, 01:20 AM

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saw it on the today, UGLY
mat79
post Dec 22 2011, 01:26 AM

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kadajawi, u need also to refer to calculations given by customs malaysia, u can fork out the info n download the pdf.

Excise duty even for import cbu@ckd is at the same rate, the problem is the term that they use.
For import, the term is import excise duty n for local is local excise duty. In langkawi, it is free import tax n sales tax (can u see the term import tax). So, generally, local cars still has excise duty implemented n only sales duty is taken back.

About the price of japs @ foreign cars in langkawi, u need also be informed that it has cif(cost of insurance n freight) included while being local, there is no cif. The base price also not including dealer profit. Normaly dealer profit is calculate after calculating the tax.
To simplify things, If cbu, the calculation is price + all taxes(import duty+import excise duty+ sales tax)+ dealer profit = selling price.

For local is price+all taxes (local excise duty + sales tax) + dealer profit = selling price.

Selling price + additional accessories price + registration + insurance = on the road price in malaysia excluding langkawi n labuan.

Please take note that import excise duty=local excise duty, only the term used is different, but it give different effect in law n regulations.

The 300% tax that been around n still being a hot topic among malaysian already been revised in 2005 n implemented in 2006.

Being a free lance before,selling local cars, managed to get info on dealer profit, basically, dealer profit for proton cars is around 10% +-.(not salesman profit, but dealer profit n also not proton's profit per car)

i give u some highlight to count the tax.

Car value including cif x import duty rate = import duty.

(Car value including cif + import duty)x excise duty rate = excise duty.

(car value including cif+import duty+excise duty) x sales tax rate = sales tax.

For locals

car value x excise duty rate = excise duty

(car value+excise duty) x sales tax rate = sales tax

for base car prices in malaysia, cannot get the info, but let use base car prices in singapore using singapore dollar, which is the nearest comparison we can do.

For vios g auto(dunno whether same spec in malaysia), base cost price is 13270 sgd.

For exora m-line auto(same as malaysia,i think), base cost price is 14121 sgd.

Please take note that this base price is on may 2011, please refer to onemotoring.com.sg to get the latest one. And dealer profit will be vary.

Hopefully this will help u to figure out the calculation.


Added on December 22, 2011, 1:34 amto get best 0-100 timing is not to engage D, but engage L mode.

L mode is actually sport drive@ sometimes referring to low gearing, L in cvt is not the same as L in at. In mitsu cvt, some use L,some use S letter, n in previous mini cooper n bmw, they used SD to replace L.

In L mode, the engine will rev up 20% higher that D mode, so u will achieve high torque earlier than than D mode, example in D, u rev at 1700 rpm, then slot L, with the same throttle applied, the rev will climb to 2040 rpm which is where 205nm of torque already available. If in the mode,@ 1700rpm, the torque is around 150-160nm if i not mistaken.

This post has been edited by mat79: Dec 22 2011, 01:34 AM
dadurtyz
post Dec 22 2011, 01:35 AM

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QUOTE(DinKnight @ Dec 21 2011, 11:10 PM)
Hi all, I test drove the Exora Bold 1.6 Premium CVT with my wife. Twice.

First was at Mutiara Damansara showroom. The route was mostly on the Penchala link. Number of people on board was 04: Me, wife, my brother and SA. Roads were wet coz it rained earlier. I tested the old Exora CPS when it first launched at this same showroom, it drove like a cow coz the engine was useless in climbing slopes.

But the Exora Bold with turbo was a good drive. Although I wished for more power and torque from the engine, the drive was adequate as I just need an MPV for town/city and highway driving. The car would be more from my wife, as we are expecting our first child mid of next year, so we are planning now on when to get the MPV. My wife was satisfies with the drive, despite having four adults on board, the power delivery was quite good.

The next day, we went to see an Alza. Wife liked the premium quality, but space was a BIG dissapointment (pun intended).

Second test drive on the same day was at the Taman SEA branch. This time I drove it on some normal flat roads, I found that I enjoyed the drive and tested the different gearbox modes (SAT, L gear, etc) and even the autocruise. With the features such as the reverse camera and overhead DVD entertainment system as standard on the Bold Premium for RM80k, I found that this MPV would be best suited for our needs in the near future. The only dissapointment for my wife was the absence of a proper Black colour choice, though I personally don't mind settling for the Elegant Brown (looks like Gold) colour. For me, I still have the stigma of past Proton ownership bugging me, I hope this new Exora wouldn't be too much of a problem, otherwise it would definitely be our last proton.

We would be placing a booking sometime early next year just after we purchase a new house in JB. Hopefully, by then, Proton manages to fix any niggling reliability issues of the engine, turbo and CVT box, and maybe reintroduce a proper Black colour.
*
u really love black color that bad? then u should know how to take care of it. Turbo in proton still new, i suggest you give about sometime, maybe the car got warranty but what happen after warranty finish? maybe u will use this car for the next 5years before sell it and buy a new car,


Added on December 22, 2011, 1:36 am
QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 22 2011, 01:26 AM)

L mode is actually sport drive@ sometimes referring to low gearing, L in cvt is not the same as L in at. In mitsu cvt, some use L,some use S letter, n in previous mini cooper n bmw, they used SD to replace L.

In L mode, the engine will rev up 20% higher that D mode, so u will achieve high torque earlier than than  D mode, example in D, u rev at 1700 rpm, then slot L, with the same throttle applied, the rev will climb to 2040 rpm which is where 205nm of torque already available. If in the mode,@ 1700rpm, the torque is around 150-160nm if i not mistaken.
*
good info biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by dadurtyz: Dec 22 2011, 01:36 AM
mat79
post Dec 22 2011, 01:36 AM

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that is one advantage of cvt where no other gearbox has that, its like overboost mode.
V12Kompressor
post Dec 22 2011, 01:42 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 22 2011, 01:36 AM)
that is one advantage of cvt where no other gearbox has that, its like overboost mode.
*
wad?
mat79
post Dec 22 2011, 01:42 AM

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one more thing,it supposed to have different start sound different than campro@cps coz campro@cps used old cable plug design, while cfe use coil on plug, same as others iafm based unit.
The start sound shud be the same as any coil on plug based engine, except for idling sound. N the ac compressor is sound louder that any japs offering from outside, but inside, the ac compressor is not that loud. But if u come across with pug 308 @ 308thp, u can hear louder ac compressor sound.


Added on December 22, 2011, 1:48 ami mentioned its like overboost, not really overboost, it is based on gbox, not engine. Others that has overboost function like mini cooper s, but it is on the engine, overboost the turbine, so that u get higher torque than standard engine offering but temporarily.
But the objective is nearly the same, to reach higher torque as earlier than normal drive mode, only that, in cvt, it doesnt increase the figure output, but u get to max torque earlier than normal drive.
Hope u understand that, but remember, engaging L will incurr higher fc than normal D mode, of course, u need to trade off extra power with fc :-). The best thing, it is not temporarily like mini overboost function.


Added on December 22, 2011, 1:59 amand one more thing, cfe also couple with cvvt not vvt as in the engine slidesshow in the some blogs in the net n new cat con, n it is euro 4/5 ready, same as iafm+ in saga flx that actually has the same upgrade as in cfe, except minus cvvt n borg wagner turbine n added iafm@sometimes known as vim@vis(only the acronym is different, but the tech is the same, method of applying it differently according to manufacturers)
the iafm+ engine is not merely the same as iafm engine in persona elegance, the different is not noticable, but u can look up at the cat con, if y manage to open the heat cover, it has different design n also the exhaust sytem diameter is the same as in cps, not like old iafm.

Hope this will help.

This post has been edited by mat79: Dec 22 2011, 01:59 AM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 22 2011, 02:42 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 22 2011, 01:26 AM)
to get best 0-100 timing is not to engage D, but engage L mode.

L mode is actually sport drive@ sometimes referring to low gearing, L in cvt is not the same as L in at. In mitsu cvt, some use L,some use S letter, n in previous mini cooper n bmw, they used SD to replace L.

In L mode, the engine will rev up 20% higher that D mode, so u will achieve high torque earlier than than  D mode, example in D, u rev at 1700 rpm, then slot L, with the same throttle applied, the rev will climb to 2040 rpm which is where 205nm of torque already available. If in the mode,@ 1700rpm, the torque is around 150-160nm if i not mistaken.
*
In the previous gen Honda City there's D, S and L. How you explain that? S = rev 20% higher and L rev 50% higher?

The marvel of CVT is that each and every rpm it has its own respective maximum speed in both L and D mode. When you slot it into "L" mode, automatically the TCU will set the shortest ratio to propel the car forward. Even the most torque available between 2,000-4,000 rpm will be useless because the speed has been capped by the short gear ratio. By the time you floor the throttle, which should bring the rpm to 5,750 rpm, the whole car will no longer go any further faster due to the diminished horsepower. Torque is important for acceleration, but top speed is determined by horsepower. And even if it has the sufficient hp to propel the car to 100kph in L mode @ 5,750 rpm, it will still be slow due to the diminished torque at 5,750 rpm.

QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 22 2011, 01:42 AM)

Added on December 22, 2011, 1:48 ami mentioned its like overboost, not really overboost, it is based on gbox, not engine. Others that has overboost function like mini cooper s, but it is on the engine, overboost the turbine, so that u get higher torque than standard engine offering but temporarily.
But the objective is nearly the same, to reach higher torque as earlier than normal drive mode, only that, in cvt, it doesnt increase the figure output, but u get to max torque earlier than normal drive.
Hope u understand that, but remember, engaging L will incurr higher fc than normal D mode, of course, u need to trade off extra power with fc :-). The best thing, it is not temporarily like mini overboost function.


The advantage of CVT has is that it could adjust its ratio according to the rpm of the engine so that the power produced will be put into a full good use efficiently. Ultimately, it was the driver who get to choose which rpm he wish to travel on, and to get to the max torque early, firstly the driver need to know the "sweet pot" of the engine and in the case of Exora Bold, it is between 2,000-4,000rpm since this is the rpm zone which produce the most torque (205Nm). Then there's the right throttle level to apply in order to reach the optimum rpm in the shortest time as possible. Get these two things right and you get your desired max torque early.

This is not overboost or what ever boost it is. The CVT doesn't alter the torque produced by the engine. It just part of the process in getting use to CVT and how one should operate CVT efficiently.


mat79
post Dec 22 2011, 04:26 AM

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yup,it doesnt alter the torque curve, but it does increase the rpm due to not Shorter, but lower ratio. U can achieve its faster, i mean the time to achieve is faster by the same throttle input. I refer to prtn@punch cvt, n the old one was used in mini n bmw when it was still under zf. The characteristic is like that, u can check official documentations from zf@mini cooper.
Cvt vt2 in flx n vt3 in exora bold cfe is the upgrade cvt from cvt vt1f which sharing the same system n characteristic but plus enhancement on pwr n torque output n also reliability.

About old honda city cvt, u can search from honda since it is honda made the cvt, not punch@zf, n we are talking bout cvt in bold.

I said that u can achieve better timing in 0-100kmh, not the top speed. At which hp n torque by rpm u can achieve 100kmh? Is it 5750 rpm?
Actually no need pedal to metal, just floor at 4k rpm, enough coz this is cvt, not manual or at that u need to pedal to metal reaching the peak hp before shifting to the next gear.

By the way, the peak hp for cfe is @5k rpm, n if u rev beyond it, u r overrevving it. I think @5k rpm already give u around 185kmh+-, no need to speed more than that on the road i believe

If u find it hard to find the document for vt1f@vt2@vt3 , u can go to other blog in the internet where they already provide the document n discuss it.

I just call it LIKE over boost coz it give u the boost than D mode@more pickup. Like i said, try out urself. Applied the same throttle input in D mode, switch to L. if u have flx, try this out, maintain the rev at 3.5k rpm, switch to L, it will jump nearly 4k rpm which the peak torque already available, but with the same throttle input.

It actually stated in cvt vt1f documentation about what i explained. And the figure 20% is from the document. Happy browsing other blog n reading the document.

Anyway, sharing some info on punch@prtn cvt coz i believe not many bother to search for it, not for argument.

If u read what i said earlier, i just call it overboost (not the real term, but just used to word to describe it) coz it boosted the power(not changing the torque or powerband), it is not really overboost, or maybe just call it sport drive, are u agree with that term?if not, then shud blame bmw n mini coz calling it sport drive.

N never mention it altering any torque curve or adding any torque to the original output. I just mention, when u floor 1700rpm in D mode, when u shift to L, it will increase the rev to 2k rpm, this is for explaination purpose only on 20% increase of rev.

They r those on flx already try out going up to genting.

If cannot find it, just go to www.funtastickodesign.wordpress.com, look for older post coz alreadyin discussion few weeks back, i think.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:32 amn if i not mistaken, according to 30++ page explanation on vt1f, on the blog only a simple one, i have a complete one, if in L mode already reached it peak, it will enter the overdrive mode automatically(so, u still can gain same top speed in D mode).

There are many things in zf@punch based cvt that are really interesting to know such it only operate in full cvt mode if throttle input not more than 85%, if more, it will turn to slow sat mode, meaning that, if u pedal to metal, it is not in full cvt mode anymore,it is called slow sat mode.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:37 amah, forget to mention, lancer only has L@S.
City cvt, not really interest me to read bout it cause they actually already discard it in new city(not really new), even jazz in malaysia.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:40 amialways forgot to mentioned,i already shift to L when driving exora bold cfe@ 120kmh, n already driving it from 0-160kmh in L mode, but the traffic got away n it was raining during that.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:50 amand one more thing, in sat mode when in D, u also can select L while in sat, and its still 6 simulated gears, but each gear will be also 20% higher rev than sat in D mode.

R u confius with L in cvt with the one in AT??? coz actually, even in L mode, 100kmh is just around 2.5 -2.7k rpm only,but in D mode, it is lower than that.

This post has been edited by mat79: Dec 22 2011, 04:50 AM
mutt
post Dec 22 2011, 07:27 AM

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mat79, you sound like you're a Proton Engineer biggrin.gif
SUSkimsim
post Dec 22 2011, 07:38 AM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 22 2011, 07:27 AM)
mat79, you  sound like you're a Proton Engineer biggrin.gif
*
Yaloh... If warranty over then how huh? CVT got problem or turbo kit got problem, how much we need to reserved the future money to keep for standby replacement the parts? Ke ke.

Recent in FLX everyday can see the CVT problem on replacement, if warranty over.. I don't think this car can drive for longer period.

Because proton since like every year release new technology on engine & Gbox.

BTW we still dunno when the car is stable on this time.
If buy early then like customer, try and error for feelback, like a white mouse smile.gif
Vervain
post Dec 22 2011, 08:38 AM

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What is overboost? can it be installed?
V12Kompressor
post Dec 22 2011, 08:51 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 22 2011, 04:26 AM)
yup,it doesnt alter the torque curve, but it does increase the rpm due to not Shorter, but lower ratio. U can achieve its faster, i mean the time to achieve is faster by the same throttle input. I refer to prtn@punch cvt, n the old one was used in mini n bmw when it was still under zf. The characteristic is like that, u can check official documentations from zf@mini cooper.
Cvt vt2 in flx n vt3 in exora bold cfe is the upgrade cvt from cvt vt1f which sharing the same system n characteristic but plus enhancement on pwr n torque output n also reliability.

About old honda city cvt, u can search from honda since it is honda made the cvt, not punch@zf, n we are talking bout cvt in bold.

I said that u can achieve better timing in 0-100kmh, not the top speed. At which hp n torque by rpm u can achieve 100kmh? Is it 5750 rpm?
Actually no need pedal to metal, just  floor at 4k rpm, enough coz this is cvt, not manual or at that u need to pedal to metal reaching the peak hp before shifting to the next gear.

By the way, the peak hp for cfe is @5k rpm, n if u rev beyond it, u r overrevving it. I think @5k rpm already give u around 185kmh+-, no need to speed more than that on the road i believe

If u find it hard to find the document for vt1f@vt2@vt3 , u can go to other blog in the internet where they already provide the document n discuss it.

I just call it LIKE over boost coz it give u the boost than D mode@more pickup. Like i said, try out urself. Applied the same throttle input in D mode, switch to L.  if u have flx, try this out, maintain the rev at 3.5k rpm, switch to L, it will jump nearly 4k rpm which the peak torque already available, but with the same throttle input.

It actually stated in cvt vt1f documentation about what i explained. And the figure 20% is from the document. Happy browsing other blog n reading the document.

Anyway, sharing some info on punch@prtn cvt coz i believe not many bother to search for it, not for argument.

If u read what i said earlier, i just call it overboost (not the real term, but just used to word to describe it) coz it boosted the power(not changing the torque or powerband), it is not really overboost, or maybe just call it sport drive, are u agree with that term?if not, then shud blame bmw n mini coz calling it sport drive.

N never mention it altering any torque curve or adding any torque to the original output. I just mention, when u floor 1700rpm in D mode, when u shift to L, it will increase the rev to 2k rpm, this is for explaination purpose only on 20% increase of rev.

They r those on flx already try out going up to genting.

If cannot find it, just go to www.funtastickodesign.wordpress.com, look for older post coz alreadyin discussion few weeks back, i think.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:32 amn if i not mistaken, according to 30++ page explanation on vt1f, on the blog only a simple one, i have a complete one, if in L mode already reached it peak, it will enter the overdrive mode automatically(so, u still can gain same top speed in D mode).

There are many things in zf@punch based cvt that are really interesting to know such it only operate in full cvt mode if throttle input not more than 85%, if more, it will turn to slow sat mode, meaning that, if u pedal to metal, it is not in full cvt mode anymore,it is called slow sat mode.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:37 amah, forget to mention, lancer only has L@S.
City cvt, not really interest me to read bout it cause they actually already discard it in new city(not really new), even jazz in malaysia.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:40 amialways forgot to mentioned,i already shift to L when driving exora bold cfe@ 120kmh, n already driving it from 0-160kmh in L mode, but the traffic got away n it was raining during that.


Added on December 22, 2011, 4:50 amand one more thing, in sat mode when in D, u also can select L while in sat, and its still 6 simulated gears, but each gear will be also 20% higher rev than sat in D mode.

R u confius with L in cvt with the one in AT??? coz actually, even in L mode, 100kmh is just around 2.5 -2.7k rpm only,but in D mode, it is lower than that.
*
hmm.gif intriguing. very informative.

looks like a second test drive for me this weekend.

if what you said was true (20% higher rev), this further makes the VT2 & VT3 more efficient than what it already has now.

QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 22 2011, 07:38 AM)
Recent in FLX everyday can see the CVT problem on replacement, if warranty over.. I don't think this car can drive for longer period.

Because proton since like every year release new technology on engine & Gbox.

BTW we still dunno when the car is stable on this time.
If buy early then like customer, try and error for feelback, like a white mouse smile.gif
*
Get your facts right. If every single day there's CVT problem reported in the Saga FLX, then we should be seeing FLX breaking down in the middle of the road everyday. COSE will also be full of FLX's waiting to replace the faulty part. But thats not the case now.

Proton engineers themselves has tested 100,000km on this driveterain (Saga, Exora and also upcoming Espire) for months before releasing it to the public. And during that 100,000km run, it wasn't your average balik kampung road hogging cruising. They actually put tremendous pressure and stress on the driveterain.

If you don't have the guts to face the problem associated with owning a car with CVT, then just admit it. You can stick back to your old, boring, ancient, stoneage 4speed transmission in the Maivee or Grand Livina. rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Dec 22 2011, 08:52 AM
wezeer
post Dec 22 2011, 09:01 AM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ Dec 22 2011, 08:38 AM)
What is overboost? can it be installed?
*
i believe it's hard for you to overboost unless u'll done something else; boost controller etc..etc..
improper upgrade sure damage the turbine...
for this type of car, remained stock is the best..if u wanna feel the g-force..should you buy others...
or less wira converted to turbo...
hehehe

my 2 cents
mat79
post Dec 22 2011, 12:57 PM

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read carefully vervain, its LIKE overboost FUNCTION (just an impression, not really a button or overboost) :-).

Em, bout cvt problem, maybe u can look up from fl/flx thread.if i not mistaken, Its not really a problem that can break your cvt, n its already been recall back by prtn. The change the clucth pump with the updated one coz there are owners complaining that when they drive really slow, it tend to jerk a little bit. Thats all. Not every owner experience it, but prtn has recall all to change it, n its not a problem anymore i think.

Bout reliability, i think punch already present the paperwork on their cvt in a world conference(cant remember what is the name of conf)n they already tested it for 250k km for reliability.

But people never asked question on prius n corolla altis cvt? Sylphy perhaps or lancer? Even honda use cvt outside, only in msia they dont. Oh, toyota wish valvematic 2.0 use cvt too. Just weird, when other makes use cvt, never question it. Just read out about punch powertrain history first, get knowing who r they. This cvt is outsourced, not made by prtn. The same as manual flx that used getrag trans, people still question it.
I think beemer if rebadge as prtn also people will question it :-). anyway, i think guinea pig is suitable than white mouse, just kiddin' :-)
salimbest83
post Dec 22 2011, 03:55 PM

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cant wait for them to make this one

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post Dec 22 2011, 04:50 PM

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How's the 3rd row seat leg room of the Innova vs Exora?

SUSkimsim
post Dec 22 2011, 05:00 PM

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QUOTE(salimbest83 @ Dec 22 2011, 03:55 PM)
cant wait for them to make this one

user posted image
*
Wah looks good.

Quite interested of the 1.6cc hatchback.
turbocharged
post Dec 22 2011, 05:01 PM

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saga hatchback?

oh, you mean savvy? biggrin.gif
sbz2000
post Dec 22 2011, 05:05 PM

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that's it proton...that's more like it rather old boring waja era.....biggrin.gif proton become exciting again if they make this...
SUSkimsim
post Dec 22 2011, 05:13 PM

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Budget proton saga hatchback, no longer for polo GTi ke ke.
salimbest83
post Dec 22 2011, 05:16 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 22 2011, 05:00 PM)
Wah looks good.

Quite interested of the 1.6cc hatchback.
*
sure.. more like it if they can make its looks tasty like this
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


This post has been edited by salimbest83: Dec 22 2011, 05:17 PM
SUSkimsim
post Dec 22 2011, 05:19 PM

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Ha ha... Satu Malaysia apa apa Pun boreh.
V12Kompressor
post Dec 22 2011, 05:28 PM

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QUOTE(salimbest83 @ Dec 22 2011, 03:55 PM)
cant wait for them to make this one

user posted image
*
awww... not this shit again.

From the Espire to this. =.=
TSericmaxman
post Dec 22 2011, 05:36 PM

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Notice the aircon controls?

user posted image

I was expecting more.

Compare to the Persona

user posted image
forter
post Dec 22 2011, 08:41 PM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 22 2011, 05:36 PM)
Notice the aircon controls?

user posted image

I was expecting more.

Compare to the Persona

user posted image
*
I quite satisfied with this new exora improvement with the interior..but as you concern..im also cant understand why they did not change that 80s style dial knob...really spoiled the looks and feel....yes,you are right..atleast persona dial knob design look more premium...why dont they just use it for exora...its will enhance the dashboard design...

Maby proton think its just small thing that people dont bother...but some people including me really particullar about that...but overall package proton have done the good job...this mpv is one of my list to consider...
TSericmaxman
post Dec 22 2011, 08:47 PM

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QUOTE(forter @ Dec 22 2011, 08:41 PM)
I quite satisfied with this new exora improvement with the interior..but as you concern..im also cant understand why they did not change that 80s style dial knob...really spoiled the looks and feel....yes,you are right..atleast persona dial knob design look more premium...why dont they just use it for exora...its will enhance the dashboard design...

Maby proton think its just small thing that people dont bother...but some people including me really particullar about that...but overall package proton have done the good job...this mpv is one of my list to consider...
*
The other thing is, notice how the Persona has additional vents.

Even the Savvy has it!

user posted image

This post has been edited by ericmaxman: Dec 22 2011, 08:50 PM
ahsam1212
post Dec 22 2011, 10:27 PM

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Does it come with an intercooler?
-cmi-
post Dec 23 2011, 01:39 AM

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Proton exterior not really bad. Some of it had pretty good design.
But Proton really need to hire or change their interior designer alongside with their marketing manager.
They should know design give big impact to customer. They should know what kind of design that can give gooding impression to customer. Proton really need to learn from Korea. If Korean can make it, Proton also can. In order to improve more fast, they really need to take some drastic changes (and unpopular action for some Proton staff).
SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 06:32 AM

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I argee your saying, proton cars interiors should have very big to improved.

Cause we buy on budget m'sia car & should have pay for worth, even the electronic digital Aircon control can be put on bold premium..

But you will notice the saga BLM dashboard is about the same to Lotus kosong interior design.

So still far to improved and the after sales warranty services they should do the prefect to cover all the defect on new cars.
On some time you will facing this word, no cover on warranty or proton car is like that one,
Even the roof or rear screen leaking on rain water, they will said this is very normal on proton sad.gif

So if the proton wanna keep improved should have change the proton on every services center rules or manager.
One more thing budget car spare parts still very expansive than improted car.

No matter how once your cars is after sales services to be done the nicely jobs for feedback on customer.

This post has been edited by kimsim: Dec 23 2011, 07:02 AM
forter
post Dec 23 2011, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 23 2011, 06:32 AM)
I argee your saying, proton cars interiors should have very big to improved.

Cause we buy on budget m'sia car & should have pay for worth, even the electronic digital Aircon control can be put on bold premium..

But you will notice the saga BLM dashboard is about the same to Lotus kosong interior design.

So still far to improved and the after sales warranty services they should do the prefect to cover all the defect on new cars.
On some time you will facing this word, no cover on warranty or proton car is like that one,
Even the roof or rear screen leaking on rain water, they will said this is very normal on proton sad.gif

So if the proton wanna keep improved should have change the proton on every services center rules or manager.
One more thing budget car spare parts still very expansive than improted car.

No matter how once your cars is after sales services to be done the nicely jobs for feedback on customer.
*
Not only proton maa..grand livina also should improve its old fashion interior...u buy almost rm100k..but still u get lousy aircond dial knob...no HU button at steering...no auto cruise...and so on....

And dont try to say that grand livina spare parts are cheaper then proton...

This post has been edited by forter: Dec 23 2011, 11:31 AM
SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 12:03 PM

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QUOTE(forter @ Dec 23 2011, 11:30 AM)
Not only proton maa..grand livina also should improve its old fashion interior...u buy almost rm100k..but still u get lousy aircond dial knob...no HU button at steering...no auto cruise...and so on....

And dont try to say that grand livina spare parts are cheaper then proton...
*
Cause I paid for japanases budget car.

Made in m'sia should be more cheaper for budget.
If not why we need to paid that much higher tax.

This post has been edited by kimsim: Dec 23 2011, 12:16 PM
forter
post Dec 23 2011, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 23 2011, 12:03 PM)
Cause I paid for japanases budget car.

Made in m'sia should be more cheaper for budget.
If not why we need to paid that much higher tax.
*
Off course exora bold with full of features already more cheaper than 'budget'grannd livina...

So you are ok paid almost rm100k..just for JAPANESE BUDGET CAR...doesnt matter its kosong car as long as its japanese!..bravo man...i cant say more bcoz u already happy to paid for japanese budget car!..good for you...
SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 01:43 PM

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QUOTE(forter @ Dec 23 2011, 01:18 PM)
Off course exora bold with full of features already more cheaper than 'budget'grannd livina...

So you are ok paid almost rm100k..just for JAPANESE BUDGET CAR...doesnt matter its kosong car as long as its japanese!..bravo man...i cant say more bcoz u already happy to paid for japanese budget car!..good for you...
*
Actually I don't mind what you comments on grand livina interiors kosong and selling price 100k..

When you own this and drove for comfort ride at all times.

I'll paid for worth on 100k in budget Japanese car.

This post has been edited by kimsim: Dec 23 2011, 02:48 PM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 23 2011, 02:58 PM

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lol, typical lame reason for making self feeling good driving an overpriced and under spec Japanese car.

laugh.gif
SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 03:02 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 23 2011, 02:58 PM)
lol, typical lame reason for making self feeling good driving an overpriced and under spec Japanese car.

laugh.gif
*
No matter what you said...

At lease this is not proton and made in m'sia car brows.gif

After 10 years the body paint still look good, if m'sia cars, think 3 yrs ago only the paint 30% peel off, wear & tear.

forter
post Dec 23 2011, 03:04 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 23 2011, 01:43 PM)
Sure... At lease I paid for imported car and assemble in m'sia, that mean the parts still made from oversea with paid for tax and quality control.

Proton is local made without duty tax import tax,
The car still expansive than oversea made brows.gif

This both's cars if you like Exora more comfort and power to accelerator and like proton interiors design.
Just go a head,
when the car is no ppl to comments and how to improved this?

Grand livina is very simple design, like kosong interior what you said,
got extra money just install and what I want.

I don't think so Exora go drive up to 180-190km/h in highway, on my livina at 180km/h still feel very stable.

If you want more nicely interiors just go for Toyota wish smile.gif

When you drive the grand livina 1.8 and definetely you won't chose for local made cars again.

Cause proton is not made for exported car we buy this,
If the proton can offer for exported car & quality why we not go for proton.
*
Did you know where are this actually grand livina come from?..
Did you know what is percentage part for g/livina are imported and local source?..
Seem like u just to be proud with your JAPANESE logo...

Since when proton are more expensive than oversea made like u say?..put aside about tax..now we are talking about what price u pay and what u will get...that is what we talk about value for money...you think grand livina not overprice ke...u can compare livina with rondo with full features(both of them overseas made but assemble here like u said)...did you cannot feel that livina soo overpriced...cannot feel that you got cheated by tan chong?...

Haha..im not say livina is not good...but to say not to drive local made car anymore once drive grand livina is to much..haha..u just stand by for others proton owner to shoot you..

You also donno that proton already export thier exora to others country...and once again did u know which and how many country that selling grand livina?..japan?..haha..
SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 03:13 PM

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QUOTE(forter @ Dec 23 2011, 03:04 PM)
Did you know where are this actually grand livina come from?..
Did you know what is percentage part for g/livina are imported and local source?..
Seem like u just to be proud with your JAPANESE logo...

Since when proton are more expensive than oversea made like u say?..put aside about tax..now we are talking about what price u pay and what u will get...that is what we talk about value for money...you think grand livina not overprice ke...u can compare livina with rondo with full features(both of them overseas made but assemble here like u said)...did you cannot feel that livina soo overpriced...cannot feel that you got cheated by tan chong?...

Haha..im not say livina is not good...but to say not to drive local made car anymore once drive grand livina is to much..haha..u just stand by for others proton owner to shoot you..

You also donno that proton already export thier exora to others country...and once again did u know which and how many country that selling grand livina?..japan?..haha..
*
Ha ha you think the Exora is local made and support this, just go a head, even you can afford imported car,
Then your life still stuck in Malaysia.

After fews year you don't completed the Exora is still perfect to suits your style for driving in 80k?

Do you think at 80k for buying local made is izit not overprice?

If less than 60k for mpv local made that's everyone still affordable.

If you think the Kia Rando is the best just go and buy.


Added on December 23, 2011, 3:19 pmI'll only said if proton nobody to gave comments and won't improved as much.

Maybe you miss understanding smile.gif

This post has been edited by kimsim: Dec 23 2011, 03:19 PM
kadajawi
post Dec 23 2011, 06:50 PM

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So if Proton makes a Ferrari competitor and charges 120k you say overpriced?

The Exora seems to be really good, even though the interior looks a bit cheap. Maybe it is better than the Livina? (which, btw., seems to be meant for ASEAN/China, Wikipedia only lists those countries + Brasil or something like that. If a car is only offered in those countries there might be a reason for that, especially if the brand is established in other markets too).
V12Kompressor
post Dec 23 2011, 06:59 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 23 2011, 03:13 PM)
Ha ha you think the Exora is local made and support this, just go a head, even you can afford imported car,
Then your life still stuck in Malaysia.

After fews year you don't completed the Exora is still perfect to suits your style for driving in 80k?

Do you think at 80k for buying local made is izit not overprice?

If less than 60k for mpv local made that's everyone still affordable.

If you think the Kia Rando is the best just go and buy.


Added on December 23, 2011, 3:19 pmI'll only said if proton nobody to gave comments and won't improved as much.

Maybe you miss understanding smile.gif
*
lol


SUSkimsim
post Dec 23 2011, 07:25 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 23 2011, 06:50 PM)
So if Proton makes a Ferrari competitor and charges 120k you say overpriced?

The Exora seems to be really good, even though the interior looks a bit cheap. Maybe it is better than the Livina? (which, btw., seems to be meant for ASEAN/China, Wikipedia only lists those countries + Brasil or something like that. If a car is only offered in those countries there might be a reason for that, especially if the brand is established in other markets too).
*
Ok lah... Since you all is a proton supporter.

I am no comments for 80k exora bold with new cvt & soft turbo boots.

Congrates for 1st batch white mouse.

Just go for this with latest feedback.. smile.gif

kadajawi
post Dec 23 2011, 07:31 PM

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Naw, I'm a conti driver, always been, always will be (unless it's a GT-R or LF-A... ha).

I'm just saying that the Exora seems to be worth the money in Malaysia. More than, let's say, the Avanza. tongue.gif Unless it goes wrong all the time. But you can't just say, it's a Proton, so it has to be less than 80k.
mutt
post Dec 23 2011, 09:17 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Dec 23 2011, 07:25 PM)
Ok lah... Since you all is a proton supporter.

I am no comments for 80k exora bold with new cvt & soft turbo boots.

Congrates for 1st batch white mouse.

Just go for this with latest feedback.. smile.gif
*
I got ya.. well at least you're not really blind bashing Proton tongue.gif . Constructive comments are good but need to be relevant and factual biggrin.gif no offence ya dude. you're always welcome to criticize but I'd suggest you to email DSZ instead. That would be more practical. hehe... laugh.gif
TSericmaxman
post Dec 23 2011, 09:27 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 23 2011, 09:17 PM)
I got ya.. well at least you're not really blind bashing Proton tongue.gif . Constructive comments are good but need to be relevant and factual biggrin.gif no offence ya dude. you're always welcome to criticize but I'd suggest you to email DSZ instead. That would be more practical. hehe... laugh.gif
*
bro, waja cps change to exora bold? brows.gif
mutt
post Dec 23 2011, 09:35 PM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 23 2011, 09:27 PM)
bro, waja cps change to exora bold? brows.gif
*
I'm not going to trade in my Waja CPS for Exora Bold. Later can't play2 with other cars already laugh.gif

Perhaps by end of 2012 nod.gif
Vervain
post Dec 23 2011, 10:28 PM

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Actually it good value for money. How I wish my car also have 200nm of torque.
mutt
post Dec 23 2011, 10:33 PM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ Dec 23 2011, 10:28 PM)
Actually it good value for money. How I wish my car also have 200nm of torque.
*
I need 300nm at least flex.gif
Vervain
post Dec 23 2011, 10:47 PM

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Bang mau Tarik treller ka? I think it's achievable from diesel, kinda hard for petrol unless the block is upped to 2.0 turbo
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post Dec 23 2011, 11:47 PM

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Fisker Karma, 1300 Nm. biggrin.gif

With 1.8 or 2.0 and turbo it's possible. The Merc C class has a 1.8L with 204 hp and 310 Nm. BMW 528i has a 2L with 350 Nm and 245 hp.
xiphone4
post Dec 24 2011, 10:13 AM

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Thinking of upgrading my manual exora to bold, but some one offer me estima 2002/2007 3000cc second hand owner at rm88,000, hard to make decision.
They offer trade in my M line 2009 december for RM 46,000

This post has been edited by xiphone4: Dec 24 2011, 10:16 AM
AMDAthlon
post Dec 24 2011, 10:15 AM

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QUOTE(xiphone4 @ Dec 24 2011, 10:13 AM)
Thinking of upgrading my manual exora to bold, but some one offer me estimata 2002/2007 3000cc  second hand owner at rm88,000, hard to make decision.
*
Wow..not bad that Estima price..

But..Brand new or 2nd Hand? hmm.gif
ocphangaz
post Dec 24 2011, 12:30 PM

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this car is fast... almost able to follow my autech tuned A31...
s@ni
post Dec 24 2011, 12:41 PM

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QUOTE(xiphone4 @ Dec 24 2011, 10:13 AM)
Thinking of upgrading my manual exora to bold, but some one offer me estima 2002/2007 3000cc  second hand owner at rm88,000, hard to make decision.
They offer trade in my M line 2009 december for  RM 46,000
*
U r going for older car.. Backward?
MR_alien
post Dec 24 2011, 01:36 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 23 2011, 10:33 PM)
I need 300nm at least  flex.gif
*
what u need is lighter body
since this is MPV
since u said end of 2012 thn go to the model releasing next year
persona alike body + CFE + maybe CVT = win waja CPS anytime
mutt
post Dec 24 2011, 03:13 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 24 2011, 01:36 PM)
what u need is lighter body
since this is MPV
since u said end of 2012 thn go to the model releasing next year
persona alike body + CFE + maybe CVT = win waja CPS anytime
*
Since it's an MPV, no point lightweight + high torque. Later will end up at longkang or terbalik upside down biggrin.gif


MR_alien
post Dec 24 2011, 03:19 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 24 2011, 03:13 PM)
Since it's an MPV, no point lightweight + high torque. Later will end up at longkang or terbalik upside down biggrin.gif
*
this is just to solve the "underpower" problem
next with pairing it with the sedan...it will go very fast...haha
engine already surpass CPS's performance
neo1point3
post Dec 24 2011, 03:23 PM

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QUOTE(xiphone4 @ Dec 24 2011, 10:13 AM)
Thinking of upgrading my manual exora to bold, but some one offer me estima 2002/2007 3000cc  second hand owner at rm88,000, hard to make decision.
They offer trade in my M line 2009 december for  RM 46,000
*
Bro, if you can afford estima maintenance then go for it! thumbup.gif
mutt
post Dec 24 2011, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(neo1point3 @ Dec 24 2011, 03:23 PM)
Bro, if you can afford estima maintenance then go for it!  thumbup.gif
*
But it's a 10 years car already. 3000cc some more shakehead.gif
V12Kompressor
post Dec 24 2011, 04:22 PM

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That Estima is quite old already...

more wear and tear to be expected

and also the rubbers all also starting to worn out already since it has harden given the long age.
mutt
post Dec 24 2011, 04:55 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 24 2011, 04:22 PM)
That Estima is quite old already...

more wear and tear to be expected

and also the rubbers all also starting to worn out already since it has harden given the long age.
*
sometimes need to close 1 eye on the car we're going to buy and drive. Even if it's not T or H badge doesn't mean the car not reliable. well the tiger badge has proven they're now as reliable as T and H lately (because both brand become worse lately tongue.gif ) just hope that the CFE wont dig your pocket deeply biggrin.gif of course the maintenance will be higher (slightly perhaps?) than normal campro or CPS nod.gif

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 24 2011, 04:55 PM
kadajawi
post Dec 24 2011, 05:04 PM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Dec 24 2011, 03:13 PM)
Since it's an MPV, no point lightweight + high torque. Later will end up at longkang or terbalik upside down biggrin.gif
*
mpvs can handle well too. I trust lotus to be able to do that too. Most extreme examples are the 9ff powered VW T5 by RH I think (Porsche engine tuned to 800 hp) bus as well as several other VW busses (T1 to T5, all probably heavily modified... There's one that can compete with a Porsche GT3 on the race track...) and the Renault Espace F1... Ok not fair, that is a F1 car with a Espace lookalike body.
Longy
post Dec 24 2011, 06:10 PM

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I test drive EBP yesterday. Overall I would give 7-8/10. Agree with most of the good comments said before.
2 things which i noticed was, the pick up is slow after you wait at the traffic light and move, You really have to press the throttle bit harder. 2nd thing is the interior, the door handles looks bit cheap, they are bit sharp on the hand.

Overall it is good buy for 80K. Hope the Proton will take the feed backs seriously.

V12Kompressor
post Dec 24 2011, 07:59 PM

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for the pick up, it has two reason which caused the "slowness"

one is the slightly delay pedal response and secondly, it was due to the weight. If you have got used to driving a normal sedan car, you'll feel MPV and SUVs are a bit slow off the line due to the weight difference.
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post Dec 24 2011, 08:07 PM

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QUOTE(Longy @ Dec 24 2011, 06:10 PM)
I test drive EBP yesterday. Overall I would give 7-8/10. Agree with most of the good comments said before.
2 things which i noticed was, the pick up is slow after you wait at the traffic light and move, You really have to press the throttle bit harder. 2nd thing is the interior, the door handles looks bit cheap, they are bit sharp on the hand.

Overall it is good buy for 80K. Hope the Proton will take the feed backs seriously.
*
I think the initial slow pick up is due to turbo lag but once you are in the right gear and rpm, then you feel the intoxicating rush of POWERRRR


V12Kompressor
post Dec 24 2011, 08:17 PM

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QUOTE(Enclave Recruit @ Dec 24 2011, 08:07 PM)
I think the initial slow pick up is due to turbo lag but once you are in the right gear and rpm, then you feel the intoxicating rush of POWERRRR
*
wad???
mutt
post Dec 24 2011, 08:23 PM

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QUOTE(Enclave Recruit @ Dec 24 2011, 08:07 PM)
I think the initial slow pick up is due to turbo lag but once you are in the right gear and rpm, then you feel the intoxicating rush of POWERRRR
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pokgaizai
post Dec 24 2011, 10:33 PM

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Test drove this exora bold, also heard the whinning sound too.. SA said wont be whinning sound during highway, just only pickup time. Just worried long journey also having the sound... haven't manage to test drive long way...

Pickup very very strong, just alittle bit lag, as not familiar with cvt maybe, dono when is the kick in...

Also i have a question, anyone fixed a boot cover for their exora before? As don't want the items in boot so obvious to be seen... that SA said just lower down the rear most seat to cover the boot rclxub.gif

icon_question.gif
MR_alien
post Dec 24 2011, 10:49 PM

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QUOTE(pokgaizai @ Dec 24 2011, 10:33 PM)
Test drove this exora bold, also heard the whinning sound too.. SA said wont be whinning sound during highway, just only pickup time. Just worried long journey also having the sound... haven't manage to test drive long way...

Pickup very very strong, just alittle bit lag, as not familiar with cvt maybe, dono when is the kick in...

Also i have a question, anyone fixed a boot cover for their exora before? As don't want the items in boot so obvious to be seen... that SA said just lower down the rear most seat to cover the boot  rclxub.gif

icon_question.gif
*
that whinning sound if not wrong is the turbo kickin in
Pogostik
post Dec 24 2011, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(pokgaizai @ Dec 24 2011, 10:33 PM)
Test drove this exora bold, also heard the whinning sound too.. SA said wont be whinning sound during highway, just only pickup time. Just worried long journey also having the sound... haven't manage to test drive long way...

Pickup very very strong, just alittle bit lag, as not familiar with cvt maybe, dono when is the kick in...

Also i have a question, anyone fixed a boot cover for their exora before? As don't want the items in boot so obvious to be seen... that SA said just lower down the rear most seat to cover the boot  rclxub.gif

icon_question.gif
*
I think it's turbo spooling.
mat79
post Dec 25 2011, 02:55 AM

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from what i know, the slight delay is due to punch cvt function known as creep n crawler to compensate rubberband effect to make it easier when u park ur car or do slow manouver. Previously has knocking complaint for this function but punch rectifies it by minimizing the clutch drag at standstill...if u try to park inspira cvt,oppose to cfe cvt, punch is easier to control coz in lancer,the car hesistate slight on pedal input,but when it start moving,it suddenly lurk or jump to the front. Not a big problem actually when u learn how to cntrl it.
One more thing, in cvt, we need to give input to the ngine first, then cvt will choose appropriate gear. Plus with dbw tech,u know a little lag will appear.
If u notice, in normal drive, if u look at rpm, normally u just floor the pedal up to 2krpm, after reaching the designation rpm, then the mpv start moving. The slight delay is not really will cause u trouble coz it is nearly unnoticable, nd when u look at the tacho, u already past legal limit intown@60kmh...i think actually what happen in ur drive is whether u pedal to metal during that time to test the pickup@half pedal input. It just my guess,coz by pedal to metal, u thought that the mpv will jump off from straight line like manual high performance turbo car. Still remember when fifth gear member driving evo 10 couple with sst(twin cluctch), when stoping the car n then pedal to metal, the car hesitate,there is a slight delay cousing the late timing compare to its rival, imprezza. Fun to watch thou compare to overatted top gear.
jigon
post Dec 25 2011, 06:51 AM

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i just read the p***tan first impression HERE

It says the engine use VVT technology (same as daihatsu/toyota VVTi) and there is no mention about CPS...is this true?

Really like to have somebody compare the FC with the first batch exora...before making my decision..

Cheers
b16a
post Dec 25 2011, 02:18 PM

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just test drove cfe-ed campro exora bold..out of curiosity to feel what is soft turbo and driving mpv felt..

not bad..i might say,i just dont like the delay of the cvt and to me the unresponsive brakes..other than that..its quite ok..

a apple to orange comparison with my car..(240hp, 195nm tq,1350kg,manual tranny lsd gb NA)..compared to exora(138hp,205nm tq,1400-ish kg,cvt FI)

but the torque and curb weight is quite similar..

gua tak pandai guna flat toerque lagii blush.gif .i like high revvings machine

other than that..its a good and solid build mpv..and good handling as well..and the nvh is awesome..

yang i tak suka.

1.kalau jalan jauh ,takda tempat letak tangan kiri.
2.tempat duduk keras.
3.cvt punya delay dan sudden surge turbo tu buat jadi tak smooth untuk city driving(congested).
4.takda feel..(fun factor).
5.badge proton


dares
post Dec 25 2011, 03:38 PM

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Just came back from test drive. I cant complain about the delay because honestly i can hardly feel it, in fact at the traffic light i almost hit the car in front because the sudden surge of power.

No arguments about the turbo, fuu power sial...
BakBaby
post Dec 25 2011, 04:13 PM

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QUOTE(b16a @ Dec 25 2011, 02:18 PM)
just test drove cfe-ed campro exora bold..out of curiosity to feel what is soft turbo and driving mpv felt..

not bad..i might say,i just dont like the delay of the cvt and to me the unresponsive brakes..other than that..its quite ok..

a apple to orange comparison with my car..(240hp, 195nm tq,1350kg,manual tranny lsd gb NA)..compared to exora(138hp,205nm tq,1400-ish kg,cvt FI)

but the torque and curb weight is quite similar..

gua tak pandai guna flat toerque lagii blush.gif .i like high revvings machine

other than that..its a good and solid build mpv..and good handling as well..and the nvh is awesome..

yang i tak suka.

1.kalau jalan jauh ,takda tempat letak tangan kiri.
2.tempat duduk keras.
3.cvt punya delay dan sudden surge turbo tu buat jadi tak smooth untuk city driving(congested).
4.takda feel..(fun factor).
5.badge proton
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ada arm rest kan bold ni?
MR_alien
post Dec 25 2011, 09:37 PM

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QUOTE(BakBaby @ Dec 25 2011, 04:13 PM)
ada arm rest kan bold ni?
*
not sure exora got armrest or not
but the new proton now i think doesn't come with armrest but dn't worry...aftermarket company sure will quickly made a few for sell


Added on December 25, 2011, 9:39 pm
QUOTE(dares @ Dec 25 2011, 03:38 PM)
Just came back from test drive. I cant complain about the delay because honestly i can hardly feel it, in fact at the traffic light i almost hit the car in front because the sudden surge of power.

No arguments about the turbo, fuu power sial...
*
i dn't know but previous saga FLX also have delay
they changed 3 things thn fixed already
1.CVT pump
2.fuel hose
3.extra CVT cooling hose
so u can ask if they fixed this few things

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Dec 25 2011, 09:39 PM
pokgaizai
post Dec 25 2011, 09:46 PM

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Both driver and passenger side also have arm rest..

user posted image tongue.gif
imperialrealcs
post Dec 25 2011, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(b16a @ Dec 25 2011, 02:18 PM)
just test drove cfe-ed campro exora bold..out of curiosity to feel what is soft turbo and driving mpv felt..

not bad..i might say,i just dont like the delay of the cvt and to me the unresponsive brakes..other than that..its quite ok..

a apple to orange comparison with my car..(240hp, 195nm tq,1350kg,manual tranny lsd gb NA)..compared to exora(138hp,205nm tq,1400-ish kg,cvt FI)

but the torque and curb weight is quite similar..

gua tak pandai guna flat toerque lagii blush.gif .i like high revvings machine

other than that..its a good and solid build mpv..and good handling as well..and the nvh is awesome..

yang i tak suka.

1.kalau jalan jauh ,takda tempat letak tangan kiri.
2.tempat duduk keras.
3.cvt punya delay dan sudden surge turbo tu buat jadi tak smooth untuk city driving(congested).
4.takda feel..(fun factor).
5.badge proton
*
but ur 240hp car cannot fit 7 person nicely, much smaller, much older than this exora.
and btw, what fun factor u want in an mpv? u plan to race it with full occupant? did u read news few days ago where 6 ppls in an mpv crashed and 4 teenagers juz after spm dead? lol fun factor.
dares
post Dec 25 2011, 11:57 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 25 2011, 09:37 PM)
not sure exora got armrest or not
but the new proton now i think doesn't come with armrest but dn't worry...aftermarket company sure will quickly made a few for sell
Test driven the Bold Premium today, got armrest.

QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 25 2011, 09:37 PM)
i dn't know but previous saga FLX also have delay
they changed 3 things thn fixed already
1.CVT pump
2.fuel hose
3.extra CVT cooling hose
so u can ask if they fixed this few things
I've test driven the FLX SE 1.6, the delay is still there. I read in The Star motoring today a review for Exora Bold and FLX SE, the author say use L gear to eliminate the delay, dunno true anot.

MR_alien
post Dec 26 2011, 12:02 AM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 25 2011, 11:57 PM)
Test driven the Bold Premium today, got armrest.
I've test driven the FLX SE 1.6, the delay is still there. I read in The Star motoring today a review for Exora Bold and FLX SE, the author say use L gear to eliminate the delay, dunno true anot.
*
should ask SA got install replace/install these few parts in stated be4
because those part that i stated are recall parts for saga for the delay
some member changed it and the delay is kinda almost gone already
L gear not so sure.. but L gear is used for hill climbing....CVT's L gear is totally different than 4AT's L gear
V12Kompressor
post Dec 26 2011, 12:11 AM

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The L gear is just to engage short gear ratio, means more brisk acceleration, hence, the delay isn't noticeable.
imperialrealcs
post Dec 26 2011, 12:47 AM

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L gear is like S mode in honda city. the rev gets higher with the same throttle feedback
dares
post Dec 26 2011, 02:07 AM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 26 2011, 12:11 AM)
The L gear is just to engage short gear ratio, means more brisk acceleration, hence, the delay isn't noticeable.
*
So should the driver switch to L when going from standstill then switch back to D?

EDIT: should stop derailing this thread, feel free to reply in the BLM/FL/FLX tered biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by dares: Dec 26 2011, 02:08 AM
multiplexer
post Dec 26 2011, 02:15 AM

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i have just had a test drive for exora bold.. normally test drive could only go for 5km only.. but yesterday i had almost 20km rclxms.gif i was the last person who test drive yesterday. so i personally ask the SA whether we could go for a longer ride. and he agreed cool2.gif

the space was very comfortable. even my 3 years old boy said "waaa.. so big.."

the handling is top class.. lotus tune was awesome...

accelerating wise, maybe its only me, but i expect more from 2000-4000rpm tork tuned.. its a bit lag but still okay.. acceptable lah..

the interior, only the head unit gives some setback.. its too simple.. paired with the stock ICE unit, its so so only. but considering the tag price of the exora, still acceptable..

the meter panel looks fine.. some people said it looks cheapo, but for me, its simple yet elegant.. again, maybe its only me..

i pay some attention to the interior finishing.. i must congratulate Dato Syed Zainal for such workmanship.. the finishing of proton becoming more appealing than the previous model.. i could really see how neat the assembly of the door panel, head unit, door rubber, and leather seat.. kudos.. notworthy.gif

and last part, is the engine.. i took some hit with the test drive unit with some hard pushing on my golden right foot, and the SA looks like sweat.gif ... the acceleration was superb.. i didnt turn on the radio so that i could feel the engine rev.. i could hear some hard revving when i push the pedal hard to move the exora, and i think its the CFE that have been activated when it reached 90kmj.. but the gear shifting still smooth.. thanks to the CVT..

overall, this is all i can say.. thumbup.gif thumbup.gif thumbup.gif

but im worried of the campro+CFE reliability.. so im gonna passed the first batch of the exora bold although im really impressed and tempted with the 2.6% interest from bsn..

and some info from the SA.. proton is coming up with 5 doors hatchback satria neo very soon, most probably end of january or end of feb 2012.. this is new for me as following paultan.org, i never seen the spyshot before..

and according to him also, all model from proton shall be increased rm1500 starting from 1jan 2012... same thing goes to perodua.. its due to the parts that p1 and p2 couldnt bear the increase point anymore..
imperialrealcs
post Dec 26 2011, 02:16 AM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 02:07 AM)
So should the driver switch to L when going from standstill then switch back to D?

EDIT: should stop derailing this thread, feel free to reply in the BLM/FL/FLX tered biggrin.gif
*
no. that would cause unnecessary fuel wastage. live with it coz face the fact, the car come with 2 most lagging tech for current vehicle; the drive-by-wire and cvt. anyway its juz the starting of the acceleration though. i believe after that everything is super fine and smooth
V12Kompressor
post Dec 26 2011, 02:21 AM

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QUOTE(multiplexer @ Dec 26 2011, 02:15 AM)
and last part, is the engine.. i took some hit with the test drive unit with some hard pushing on my golden right foot, and the SA looks like  sweat.gif ... the acceleration was superb.. i didnt turn on the radio so that i could feel the engine rev.. i could hear some hard revving when i push the pedal hard to move the exora, and i think its the CFE that have been activated when it reached 90kmj.. but the gear shifting still smooth.. thanks to the CVT..
*
ini your own statement or your SA kencing you one? lol
dares
post Dec 26 2011, 02:40 AM

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QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Dec 26 2011, 02:16 AM)
no. that would cause unnecessary fuel wastage. live with it coz face the fact, the car come with 2 most lagging tech for current vehicle; the drive-by-wire and cvt. anyway its juz the starting of the acceleration though. i believe after that everything is super fine and smooth
*
I wish I could ignore it, but it was really bugging me when I test drive it. Even the Inspira exhibited similiar characteristics during acceleration, though not as serious.


QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 26 2011, 02:21 AM)
ini your own statement or your SA kencing you one? lol
*
I could hear the whining sound around that speed also. The pickup was very impressive, the car kept pulling ahead of every car on the road like nobody's business. If we have such power on a saga chassis, I would dump the Inspira for that any time of the day.

Dare I say, between my test drive experience with the Inspira and the EBP, I was more taken with the EBP though I don't see myself buying a MPV.
multiplexer
post Dec 26 2011, 02:46 AM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 26 2011, 02:21 AM)
ini your own statement or your SA kencing you one? lol
*
the SA didnt say anything.. its purely based on my experience.. as being said earlier, I THINK ITS THE CFE.. it maybe true, it may not.. may i know why are u asking this?


Added on December 26, 2011, 2:50 amdoes anybody here could provide the maintenance cost for EBP? kept asking the SA, unfortunately he didnt hav one.. he didnt aware of whether the service item is the same with the previous exora without the CFE.. overall, he didnt know anything about the maintenance schedule+cost.. tongue.gif

This post has been edited by multiplexer: Dec 26 2011, 02:50 AM
pokgaizai
post Dec 26 2011, 08:42 AM

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QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Dec 25 2011, 11:22 PM)
but ur 240hp car cannot fit 7 person nicely, much smaller, much older than this exora.
and btw, what fun factor u want in an mpv? u plan to race it with full occupant? did u read news few days ago where 6 ppls in an mpv crashed and 4 teenagers juz after spm dead? lol fun factor.
*
Driving friends/family 7 person all together, thats fun to me d biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by pokgaizai: Dec 26 2011, 08:44 AM
MR_alien
post Dec 26 2011, 08:51 AM

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QUOTE(multiplexer @ Dec 26 2011, 02:46 AM)
the SA didnt say anything.. its purely based on my experience.. as being said earlier, I THINK ITS THE CFE.. it maybe true, it may not.. may i know why are u asking this?


Added on December 26, 2011, 2:50 amdoes anybody here could provide the maintenance cost for EBP? kept asking the SA, unfortunately he didnt hav one.. he didnt aware of whether the service item is the same with the previous exora without the CFE.. overall, he didnt know anything about the maintenance schedule+cost.. tongue.gif
*
the turbo is supposed to be kickin in @ 2000RPM-4000RPM
so its already kickin in when u pickin up....you'll kinda hear a whinning sound
CFE is just a name...its actually campro with turbo bolted on
and the increase next year....its not they cannot bear anything...its government policy....its a tax...every car brand also need to increase or absorb themselves

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post Dec 26 2011, 12:04 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Dec 24 2011, 07:59 PM)
for the pick up, it has two reason which caused the "slowness"

one is the slightly delay pedal response and secondly, it was due to the weight. If you have got used to driving a normal sedan car, you'll feel MPV and SUVs are a bit slow off the line due to the weight difference.
*
Thank You V12Kompressor. I am driving a sedan auto now, may be that is why I felt the slow pick up after standstill in EBP. One more test drive on highway and I am almost confirmed buying EBP. Have to look for the bank with best interest rate. smile.gif
V12Kompressor
post Dec 26 2011, 03:26 PM

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I would recommend you not to put much expectation on the highway performance. The top end speed is more or less similar to the old Exora. But then, reaching 110kph is effortless.


Added on December 26, 2011, 3:28 pm
QUOTE(multiplexer @ Dec 26 2011, 02:46 AM)
the SA didnt say anything.. its purely based on my experience.. as being said earlier, I THINK ITS THE CFE.. it maybe true, it may not.. may i know why are u asking this?
*
I dont think it start spooling that late. smile.gif

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Dec 26 2011, 03:28 PM
mat79
post Dec 26 2011, 06:31 PM

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em,based my own test drive, this baby easy to reach up to 160kmh, since full torque untill 4k rpm,u have enough torque to propel the mpv at that speed without taking consideration the coefficient drag n lift. Its only a little bit slower reaching speed after that,but not that slow. 185kmh easily to reach by anyone, and media test last week mentioned that personally it can go beyond 190kmh coz when one media driven flx se@190kmh, they still cannot overtake bold, and they are still far away infront of flx se@190kmh.
Actually,managed to chat with media delegation when they break for lunch at hyatt.
Chat with media delegations was fun coz they are really friendly, but meeting the pwrtrain engineers, h n t members are really precious moment.
Whether iafm+ or cfe, they really put hard works to it, countless man hours of trial and testing, a lot of constraints they met, but at last,they managed to do it. Some of them just comeback from spain, some from swiss n even some from lotus uk.

Some nice advice from them, never try to modified the engine coz it already been at optimum performance n reliability, need to remember, if u put more power to it, u will reduce the life span of cvt since it can only take max 220nm. 205nm is the safe spot to ensure its reliability and they already test it up to 250k km. Thats why it takes long time for them to launch the engine.

So,wish the best for them.
MR_alien
post Dec 26 2011, 07:09 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 26 2011, 06:31 PM)
em,based my own test drive, this baby easy to reach up to 160kmh, since full torque untill 4k rpm,u have enough torque to propel the mpv at that speed without taking consideration the coefficient drag n lift. Its only a little bit slower reaching speed after that,but not that slow. 185kmh easily to reach by anyone, and media test last week mentioned that personally it can go beyond 190kmh coz when one media driven flx se@190kmh, they still cannot overtake bold, and they are still far away infront of flx se@190kmh.
Actually,managed to chat with media delegation when they break for lunch at hyatt.
Chat with media delegations was fun coz they are really friendly, but meeting the pwrtrain engineers, h n t members are really precious moment.
Whether iafm+ or cfe, they really put hard works to it, countless man hours of trial and testing, a lot of constraints they met, but at last,they managed to do it. Some of them just comeback from spain, some from swiss n even some from lotus uk.

Some nice advice from them, never try to modified the engine coz it already been at optimum performance n reliability, need to remember, if u put more power to it, u will reduce the life span of cvt since it can only take max 220nm. 205nm is the safe spot to ensure its reliability and they already test it up to 250k km. Thats why it takes long time for them to launch the engine.

So,wish the best for them.
*
good if they have tested it until 250K KM
this is to ease the worry for those that want to buy this car/FLX SE but kinda curious abt the reliability of the turbo itself and the CVT
dares
post Dec 26 2011, 07:17 PM

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Good work from proton, ppl need to have a little faith in them. Nevertheless, its not the engineering i am worry about, it is the qc.

Btw, flx se can reach 190??

This post has been edited by dares: Dec 26 2011, 07:18 PM
V12Kompressor
post Dec 26 2011, 07:42 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 07:17 PM)
Good work from proton, ppl need to have a little faith in them. Nevertheless, its not the engineering i am worry about, it is the qc.

Btw, flx se can reach 190??
*
1.3 alone can reach 185, let alone the 1.6 SE

sleep.gif
mutt
post Dec 26 2011, 08:13 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 07:17 PM)
Good work from proton, ppl need to have a little faith in them. Nevertheless, its not the engineering i am worry about, it is the qc.

Btw, flx se can reach 190??
*
I've seen my friend speed up to 190kmh and I was the passenger. And the most scary part, he's tail gating a Waja at 190kmh! It's Saga BLM IAFM btw (non plus version)

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 26 2011, 08:14 PM
mat79
post Dec 26 2011, 08:20 PM

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yup, can reach, but the test car still new, under 1k km if i not mistaken mentioned by the media. The engine felt a little bit tight due to still new. They believed,after few k mileage, it will perform better. N iafm+ in flx se is better even compare to cps when they tested it at karak highway interm of power delivery across rev range,maybe due to its light weight, but far better than 1.6 fl previously.

And flx 1.3 can manage speed at 185 kmh. By the way, iafm+ n cfe comply with euro step 5. One of pwrtrain dpt, euro step is not all about co2 output, actually other 3 components, nox, carbon monoxide n hc. Then co2 output will reduce, but still depend on type of fuel u r using(ron and euro step fuel, mlaysia only euro 2 fuel).
Non official figure co2 for cfe when they test it in europe is below 150kg.
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post Dec 26 2011, 08:33 PM

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You seem to have some insight... are they planning to bring the Exora to Europe? It sounds a bit that way smile.gif
neo1point3
post Dec 26 2011, 08:46 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 07:17 PM)
Good work from proton, ppl need to have a little faith in them. Nevertheless, its not the engineering i am worry about, it is the qc.

Btw, flx se can reach 190??
*
Yeap, my 1.3 neo also can reach 170km/h with 4 adults. auto summore. Campro really good at high speed
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post Dec 26 2011, 09:26 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Dec 26 2011, 08:20 PM)
yup, can reach, but the test car still new, under 1k km if i not mistaken mentioned by the media. The engine felt a little bit tight due to still new. They believed,after few k mileage, it will perform better. N iafm+ in flx se is better even compare to cps when they tested it at karak highway interm of power delivery across rev range,maybe due to its light weight, but far better than 1.6 fl previously.

And flx 1.3 can manage speed at 185 kmh. By the way, iafm+ n cfe comply with euro step 5. One of pwrtrain dpt, euro step is not all about co2 output, actually other 3 components, nox, carbon monoxide n hc. Then co2 output will reduce, but still depend on type of fuel u r using(ron and euro step fuel, mlaysia only euro 2 fuel).
Non official figure co2 for cfe when they test it in europe is below 150kg.
*
actuali wat is difference of iafm plus wit iafm?iafm can upgrade to iafm plus??i believe why the media will said flx se even power compare to cps..bcoz due to weight saga flx se is light than waja cps or gen2 cps..around 150kg difference
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QUOTE(samwongjyhhorng @ Dec 26 2011, 09:26 PM)
actuali wat is difference of iafm plus wit iafm?iafm can upgrade to iafm plus??i believe why the media will said flx se even power compare to cps..bcoz due to weight saga flx se is light than waja cps or gen2 cps..around 150kg difference
*
actually thats kinda subjective
IAFM and IAFM+ if not wrong is no difference..IF NOT WRONG
IAFM+ advantage is..it resolved the previous "tak tak" sound made by some rod inside

dares
post Dec 26 2011, 11:16 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Dec 26 2011, 10:09 PM)
actually thats kinda subjective
IAFM and IAFM+ if not wrong is no difference..IF NOT WRONG
IAFM+ advantage is..it resolved the previous "tak tak" sound made by some rod inside
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IAFM+ was developed specifically for the CVT gearbox to allow the engine to reach the max hp at a lower rpm.

This post has been edited by dares: Dec 26 2011, 11:24 PM
xshiro
post Dec 26 2011, 11:28 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 11:16 PM)
IAFM+ was developed specifically for the CVT gearbox to allow the engine to reach the max hp at a lower rpm.
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yes this achieved with reprofiled camshaft..maybe this is what they call iafm+

anyway tested the exora, very smooth and good power, but got light whining sound..cvt sound?

This post has been edited by xshiro: Dec 26 2011, 11:34 PM
dares
post Dec 26 2011, 11:35 PM

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QUOTE(xshiro @ Dec 26 2011, 11:28 PM)
yes this achieved with reprofiled camshaft..can speculate that, iafm (manifold) has no difference..bit difference in head and programming (maybe)

anyway tested the exora, very smooth and good power, but got light whining sound..cvt sound?
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Thats what i got from wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campro#Campro_IAFM_engine

Read the part about IAFM+

Iafm is a separate component from the engine block, don't think it has anything to do with the camshaft.

The whining sound......turbo baybeh icon_idea.gif icon_idea.gif

This post has been edited by dares: Dec 26 2011, 11:37 PM
A2Z2U
post Dec 26 2011, 11:38 PM

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I noticed that the torque curve of CFE in the range 1000-2000rpm rises linearly and significantly higher compared to CPS. I suppose the turbo starts working above 2000rpm. What causes the gain of torque in this range?
xshiro
post Dec 26 2011, 11:44 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 26 2011, 11:35 PM)
Thats what i got from wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campro#Campro_IAFM_engine

Read the part about IAFM+

Iafm is a separate component from the engine block, don't think it has anything to do with the camshaft.

The whining sound......turbo baybeh icon_idea.gif&nbsp; icon_idea.gif
*
yes, i know...iafm is intake manifold thingy..the mechanism of switching to long runner / short runner

but in paultan, got mentioned reprofiled camshaft is a part of the stuff they called iafm+...

so how you shift the powerband? i believe it is the work the camshaft..plus with the help of iafm


Added on December 26, 2011, 11:53 pmturbo whining...not annoying but just hard to ignore...tongue.gif cool though

This post has been edited by xshiro: Dec 26 2011, 11:53 PM
dares
post Dec 26 2011, 11:54 PM

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QUOTE(xshiro @ Dec 26 2011, 11:44 PM)
yes, i know...iafm is intake manifold thingy..the mechanism of switching to long runner / short runner

but in paultan, got mentioned reprofiled camshaft is a part of the stuff they called iafm+...

so how you shift the powerband? i believe it is the work the camshaft..plus with the help of iafm
*
Now that you put it this way, it makes sense. Anyone can confirm this? If this is true, then it is the same freaking iafm from before...
Vervain
post Dec 27 2011, 12:11 AM

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VVt like CFE?
s@ni
post Dec 27 2011, 12:50 AM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ Dec 27 2011, 12:11 AM)
VVt like CFE?
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CFE =/= VVT
MR_alien
post Dec 27 2011, 01:28 AM

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QUOTE(xshiro @ Dec 26 2011, 11:28 PM)
yes this achieved with reprofiled camshaft..maybe this is what they call iafm+

anyway tested the exora, very smooth and good power, but got light whining sound..cvt sound?
*
whinning sound again
thats the turbo
imperialrealcs
post Dec 27 2011, 01:35 AM

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due to the presence of intake vvt, the powerband can shift according to engine load. im suppose this vvt we're talking about is something that retard/advance the ignition timing of the engine.
also i remember cam pulley also can shift the powerband
rcracer
post Dec 27 2011, 04:05 AM

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QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Dec 26 2011, 06:35 PM)
due to the presence of intake vvt, the powerband can shift according to engine load. im suppose this vvt we're talking about is something that retard/advance the ignition timing of the engine.
also i remember cam pulley also can shift the powerband
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VVT is simply variable valve timing, not ignition timing.

Like honda i-vtec,VVTi, DVVt, CVVt, it change the intake valves timing from overlap opening with exhaust valves or no overlap at all.

The bump on the timing belt cover houses the mechanism exactly like an adjustable cam pulley except it's automatically controlled

This post has been edited by rcracer: Dec 27 2011, 04:05 AM
mat79
post Dec 27 2011, 08:26 AM

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yup,exora bold if i not mistaken will be available in uk next year. Basically, evry improvement of cfe engine is at iafm+ except vvt, turbo n those related to turbo. Cooling also been improved n cat con also diff than old one,same as cfe. By the way, exhaust diameter n mufler for iafm+ the same as cps,only length is diff due to car design.
multiplexer
post Dec 27 2011, 09:31 AM

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reading these thread makes me wanna go to the dealear and book EBP instantly.. demnnn smile.gif
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post Dec 27 2011, 09:43 AM

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QUOTE(pokgaizai @ Dec 25 2011, 09:46 PM)
Both driver and passenger side also have arm rest..

user posted image  tongue.gif
*
i tak perasan.terlalu asyik dengan perfomance enginnya..hehe.
QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Dec 25 2011, 11:22 PM)
but ur 240hp car cannot fit 7 person nicely, much smaller, much older than this exora.
and btw, what fun factor u want in an mpv? u plan to race it with full occupant? did u read news few days ago where 6 ppls in an mpv crashed and 4 teenagers juz after spm dead? lol fun factor.
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hehe yup, i know lah,an apple to orange comparison..not in need og mpv yet,im family of three..but if i opt to 1, exora cfe it is..
imperialrealcs
post Dec 27 2011, 10:25 AM

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QUOTE(rcracer @ Dec 27 2011, 04:05 AM)
VVT is simply variable valve timing, not ignition timing.

Like honda i-vtec,VVTi, DVVt, CVVt, it change the intake valves timing from overlap opening with exhaust valves or no overlap at all.

The bump on  the timing belt cover houses the mechanism exactly like an adjustable cam pulley except it's automatically controlled
*
i don't know about other vvt system but pretty sure vvti does alter the ignition timing as well
watonk
post Dec 27 2011, 10:37 AM

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I've tested the Exora Bold last Saturday. Good power delivery & overall a nice package. Finally Exora have a matching powertrain.
roomate
post Dec 27 2011, 11:25 AM

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QUOTE(xshiro @ Dec 26 2011, 11:44 PM)
yes, i know...iafm is intake manifold thingy..the mechanism of switching to long runner / short runner

but in paultan, got mentioned reprofiled camshaft is a part of the stuff they called iafm+...

so how you shift the powerband? i believe it is the work the camshaft..plus with the help of iafm
Actually IAFM+ incorporate several parts from CFE ie long life timing belt, new AC Compressor, new piston n con-rod.
Accessory belt tensioner is also new, solving the annoying belt slipping noise

camshaft was changed to shift the torque earlier.

but seems that Edar doesn't promote these new features of IAFM+
A2Z2U
post Dec 27 2011, 12:43 PM

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QUOTE(pokgaizai @ Dec 25 2011, 09:46 PM)
Both driver and passenger side also have arm rest..

user posted image  tongue.gif
*
Seat looks small. Is it comfortable for big guy?
ZenGTMM
post Dec 27 2011, 12:48 PM

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QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Dec 27 2011, 12:43 PM)
Seat looks small. Is it comfortable for big guy?
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Yeah its quite big.. My waistline is 35" and i still feel the seats were still slightly bigger than it is able to hold me properly when cornering hard.
mat79
post Dec 27 2011, 12:59 PM

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as being explain by roomate, some add, ecu also new for iafm+, 32bit torque based easyu ecu conti ag, same as cfe n persona elegance, but 100% new calibration,diff than in elegance. Iafm @2krpm, achieve 85-90% of torque before reach the peak @ 4k rpm.
multiplexer
post Dec 27 2011, 02:26 PM

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QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Dec 27 2011, 12:43 PM)
Seat looks small. Is it comfortable for big guy?
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the angle of the picture makes it look small.. try visit any showroom and see it your self..
rcracer
post Dec 27 2011, 05:20 PM

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QUOTE(imperialrealcs @ Dec 27 2011, 03:25 AM)
i don't know about other vvt system but pretty sure vvti does alter the ignition timing as well
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Ignition timing is always altered doesn't matter if there is variable valve timing or not, even if in ancient automobile with coil and distributor is also altered.

Because as the engine speeds up the spark needs to also come earlier right otherwise how to match the speed with spark?

So the spark is always advanced or retarded according to the engine speed. Unless you have some special twin plugged engines or sequential spark which are rare.
rapidbumi
post Dec 28 2011, 10:38 AM

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test drive exora bold at mutiara damansara... impress with it.. ways better than cps exora.. don't know my loan app can approve or not ... if not have to wait another year... sweat.gif
forter
post Dec 28 2011, 10:48 AM

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QUOTE(rapidbumi @ Dec 28 2011, 10:38 AM)
test drive exora bold at mutiara damansara... impress with it.. ways better than cps exora.. don't know my loan app can approve or not ... if not have to wait another year... sweat.gif
*
Its better for you to get 2012 manufacture car...
DinKnight
post Dec 28 2011, 09:50 PM

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QUOTE(multiplexer @ Dec 27 2011, 02:26 PM)
the angle of the picture makes it look small.. try visit any showroom and see it your self..
*
Eh come on lah. I test drove the Exora Bold. I do indeed find the front seats are smaller than average. Even the Vios punya seat feels slightly bigger than it.
neo1point3
post Dec 28 2011, 11:08 PM

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QUOTE(DinKnight @ Dec 28 2011, 09:50 PM)
Eh come on lah. I test drove the Exora Bold. I do indeed find the front seats are smaller than average. Even the Vios punya seat feels slightly bigger than it.
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Vios space small, exora space bigger...that's why feel smaller wink.gif
diablos
post Dec 29 2011, 06:49 PM

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Ordered EBP..... hope can get before CNY
dares
post Dec 29 2011, 06:55 PM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Dec 29 2011, 06:49 PM)
Ordered EBP..... hope can get before CNY
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Congrats...your SA promised how soon?
diablos
post Dec 29 2011, 06:57 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 29 2011, 06:55 PM)
Congrats...your SA promised how soon?
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They say make it before CNY... Mostly the 2nd week

Swordsmen
post Dec 29 2011, 07:10 PM

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currently nice review.
diablos
post Dec 29 2011, 07:23 PM

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Yup, I test drive it....It's much better than previous Exora.
vinorgouki
post Dec 29 2011, 07:27 PM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Dec 29 2011, 06:57 PM)
They say make it before CNY... Mostly the 2nd week
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Me too. I hope can get mine before CNY too. smile.gif
What's ur interest rate bro?
diablos
post Dec 29 2011, 07:32 PM

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QUOTE(vinorgouki @ Dec 29 2011, 07:27 PM)
Me too. I hope can get mine before CNY too. smile.gif
What's ur interest rate bro?
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2.85%
dares
post Dec 29 2011, 07:43 PM

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This CNY balik kampung gonna see many Exora Bolds and Inspiras chasing each other down the highway biggrin.gif
V12Kompressor
post Dec 29 2011, 08:04 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Dec 29 2011, 07:43 PM)
This CNY balik kampung gonna see many Exora Bolds and Inspiras chasing each other down the highway  biggrin.gif
*
I duduk diam diam on slow lane blush.gif blush.gif
ultramaman
post Dec 29 2011, 08:35 PM

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same here. sa said sometime in january... :|
mat_tepets
post Dec 29 2011, 08:51 PM

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loan dah lulus.. maybank 2.83% 9 tahun
V12Kompressor
post Dec 29 2011, 09:16 PM

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QUOTE(mat_tepets @ Dec 29 2011, 08:51 PM)
loan dah lulus.. maybank 2.83% 9 tahun
*
grats.

Just curious though;

all of you guys who booked the EBP, wads your color preference?
mat_tepets
post Dec 29 2011, 09:24 PM

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elegen brown smile.gif
vinorgouki
post Dec 29 2011, 09:27 PM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Dec 29 2011, 07:32 PM)
2.85%
*
So nice. N some guy got 2.83% too.
Mine is 2.88% for 7 yrs. :-(

I booked solid white.

This post has been edited by vinorgouki: Dec 29 2011, 09:29 PM
dares
post Dec 29 2011, 09:29 PM

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Next year the interest rate will probably go up, so will car prices. Cherish your purchases.
ultramaman
post Dec 29 2011, 09:45 PM

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im asking for the brown one. reason being. at least the seats and the door cards wont look so out out place...
ijam
post Dec 30 2011, 06:35 AM

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Anybody choose cocoa grey color? my SA said this color only available in 2 months' time. Is it true?
rapidbumi
post Dec 30 2011, 12:26 PM

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loan approved...for EBP...but by RHB dont like RHB that much... still waiting from Public though..
diablos
post Dec 30 2011, 05:08 PM

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I took Silver....I still dont understand why my friends keep telling me not to buy exora... they all seems like anti proton, or is it proton really got that much of issue? I got both foreign and national car. Frankly speaking I like o drive waja cps.
peet
post Dec 30 2011, 08:01 PM

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When I have time, will go showroom take a look. What put me off the last time was when I close the rear boot, it goes BOOM! No padding etc unlike Jap cars. Wonder if they worked on this for the turbo version.
TripleJ104
post Dec 30 2011, 08:10 PM

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QUOTE(peet @ Dec 30 2011, 08:01 PM)
When I have time, will go showroom take a look. What put me off the last time was when I close the rear boot, it goes BOOM! No padding etc unlike Jap cars. Wonder if they worked on this for the turbo version.
*
Go try closed any toyota camry boot & see got different or not..
TSericmaxman
post Dec 31 2011, 10:31 AM

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QUOTE(TripleJ104 @ Dec 30 2011, 08:10 PM)
Go try closed any toyota camry boot & see got different or not..
*
Cheapness rolleyes.gif

Dont forget the epic toyota 4AT thats still in the 2.0 Camry laugh.gif
mutt
post Dec 31 2011, 12:45 PM

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QUOTE(peet @ Dec 30 2011, 08:01 PM)
When I have time, will go showroom take a look. What put me off the last time was when I close the rear boot, it goes BOOM! No padding etc unlike Jap cars. Wonder if they worked on this for the turbo version.
*
Then same with my dad's chevy nabira.. not BOOM but KEBABOOM. Yes I am serious cool2.gif

oh.. chevy not Japs tongue.gif

This post has been edited by mutt: Dec 31 2011, 12:45 PM
AMDAthlon
post Dec 31 2011, 12:48 PM

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QUOTE(ericmaxman @ Dec 31 2011, 10:31 AM)
Cheapness rolleyes.gif

Dont forget the epic toyota 4AT thats still in the 2.0 Camry laugh.gif
*
When the heck MY Toyota going to bring teh new Camry with 6AT? sweat.gif
MR_alien
post Dec 31 2011, 12:56 PM

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QUOTE(AMDAthlon @ Dec 31 2011, 12:48 PM)
When the heck MY Toyota going to bring teh new Camry with 6AT?  sweat.gif
*
i dn't think they will improve la
as long as it still sells and NOBODY complain abt it
they won't even improve it to 6AT or even CVT cuz use old tech...low cost, higher profit margin
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post Dec 31 2011, 01:55 PM

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How do you expect a MPV boot to close? My Kangoo also bangs loud when you just let the thing drop, and IIRC a Touran isn't much different either. Just find the right technique to close the thing... for me it's lowering it until maybe 10 cm left, then pull up slightly, immediately letting go/pushing down a bit to close. Then the sound is ok, not too loud, and it's properly locked.

Unless they install a hydraulic system or electric motors to close the boot I doubt there is a lot they can do.

Hey, I have heard some people say 4AT is an advantage... proven tech, won't go wrong, easy to maintain. laugh.gif

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Dec 31 2011, 01:56 PM
dares
post Dec 31 2011, 02:15 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 31 2011, 01:55 PM)
How do you expect a MPV boot to close? My Kangoo also bangs loud when you just let the thing drop, and IIRC a Touran isn't much different either. Just find the right technique to close the thing... for me it's lowering it until maybe 10 cm left, then pull up slightly, immediately letting go/pushing down a bit to close. Then the sound is ok, not too loud, and it's properly locked.

Unless they install a hydraulic system or electric motors to close the boot I doubt there is a lot they can do.

Hey, I have heard some people say 4AT is an advantage... proven tech, won't go wrong, easy to maintain. laugh.gif
*
Just now help my friend close his vios dugong boot...boom with metal clanking sound tongue.gif tongue.gif

Funnier is that i help him close coz he was inside the house and accidentally press the boot open button but lazy wanna come out and close it, and i ngam ngam arrive outside laugh.gif
peet
post Dec 31 2011, 04:24 PM

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My 21-yr old Estima closes with a nice "thud", although not as refined as the latest Estima's. Okay some of u say, it's not in the same class. But a 20+ yr old Estima is <RM30K on the market now. So in theory, can a 2012 Exora not copy some of the features of a 20-yr old Estima?

FWIW my Saga FLX also has problems with boot closing. It's slightly out of alignment but I can live with it cos it's a small boot.

QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 31 2011, 01:55 PM)
How do you expect a MPV boot to close? My Kangoo also bangs loud when you just let the thing drop, and IIRC a Touran isn't much different either. Just find the right technique to close the thing... for me it's lowering it until maybe 10 cm left, then pull up slightly, immediately letting go/pushing down a bit to close. Then the sound is ok, not too loud, and it's properly locked.

Unless they install a hydraulic system or electric motors to close the boot I doubt there is a lot they can do.

Hey, I have heard some people say 4AT is an advantage... proven tech, won't go wrong, easy to maintain. laugh.gif
*
imin
post Jan 1 2012, 12:20 AM

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how come some got lower interest rate than others? I tot the interest rate is fixed... no?
dares
post Jan 1 2012, 12:37 AM

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QUOTE(imin @ Jan 1 2012, 12:20 AM)
how come some got lower interest rate than others? I tot the interest rate is fixed... no?
*
Varies from bank to bank, loan tenure, loan amount and vehicle type.
MR_alien
post Jan 1 2012, 12:37 AM

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QUOTE(imin @ Jan 1 2012, 12:20 AM)
how come some got lower interest rate than others? I tot the interest rate is fixed... no?
*
becuz of different bank
the difference is very small only...it depends how many years u take too
diablos
post Jan 1 2012, 01:16 AM

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I checked di, all the interest is same from the bank. he difference is the number of year you loan and the amount.
Eg: 60k 7yrs = 2.85%
60k 5yrs = 2.88%
60k 9 yrs = 2.83%
mat79
post Jan 1 2012, 01:21 PM

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peet, my father 33 years old ford escort gt 1.3 twin choke webber carburator boot closed with nice thud than a vios or even camry. So, does it counts? :-). Even my fathers neighbour own 1963 merc has better thud sound when closing the boot than my father's ford, n even better than japs premium cars.
If u say germans marque, european counter parts, i have to say yes, but if with japs, aiyoo, it is the same. Even closing door sound the same. The thing that we closed, the sound not only depend on how much rubber or how much sound insulation u put inside it, it also depend on vacuum level of the car, the wind resistant n etc. Diff cars has diff design. Sometimes even some top marques has cheap scale sound when closing the door@boot, thats why they started to use auto hidrolick door or boot, just push the button,it closed on its own. Thats why freed swing door feel premium n never ever hears and old van closing sound due to that. But if u have to close it manually,it is the same maa...so, there is price to pay.
Something to ponder,If compare estima 20 years, why not compare it with avanza, innova n wish currently? They suppose done better coz estima already 20 years. Is it really hard for toyota to make it sound better @ no sound at all after 20 years? Hua...hua....
TripleJ104
post Jan 1 2012, 05:21 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Dec 31 2011, 01:55 PM)
How do you expect a MPV boot to close? My Kangoo also bangs loud when you just let the thing drop, and IIRC a Touran isn't much different either. Just find the right technique to close the thing... for me it's lowering it until maybe 10 cm left, then pull up slightly, immediately letting go/pushing down a bit to close. Then the sound is ok, not too loud, and it's properly locked.

Unless they install a hydraulic system or electric motors to close the boot I doubt there is a lot they can do.

Hey, I have heard some people say 4AT is an advantage... proven tech, won't go wrong, easy to maintain. laugh.gif
*
Yup this is usually what i do when i closing boot. nod.gif
forgot_86
post Jan 2 2012, 01:09 AM

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Just did the test drive this evening, as have been said by others, it really is amazinngg rclxms.gif Felt really good and much better than my brother's avanza, which is very light and too simple for the same price.

The guy suggest me to change the tyre to 17" for better even better handling and road grip. It will look physically better as well. Gonna trade in my savvy 06 for exora prime. biggrin.gif
MR_alien
post Jan 2 2012, 01:44 AM

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QUOTE(forgot_86 @ Jan 2 2012, 01:09 AM)
Just did the test drive this evening, as have been said by others, it really is amazinngg rclxms.gif  Felt really good and much better than my brother's avanza, which is very light and too simple for the same price.

The guy suggest me to change the tyre to 17" for better even better handling and road grip. It will look physically better as well. Gonna trade in my savvy 06 for exora prime.  biggrin.gif
*
wrong la...bigger rim will sacrifice handling actually..stick with original size is the best
for better road grip...change to better tyres thn can already
but yeah...17" will look very cool
kadajawi
post Jan 2 2012, 02:11 AM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Jan 2 2012, 01:44 AM)
wrong la...bigger rim will sacrifice handling actually..stick with original size is the best
for better road grip...change to better tyres thn can already
but yeah...17" will look very cool
*
Really? Cornering should be improved I thought, unless the rims are so big that the suspension can not keep up with uneven roads anymore. However FC, performance and comfort will suffer. I'd stay with stock... I mean it's not a sports car. biggrin.gif
MR_alien
post Jan 2 2012, 02:21 AM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Jan 2 2012, 02:11 AM)
Really? Cornering should be improved I thought, unless the rims are so big that the suspension can not keep up with uneven roads anymore. However FC, performance and comfort will suffer. I'd stay with stock... I mean it's not a sports car. biggrin.gif
*
it will ruin handling actually
u want better cornering...get sport spring/abs...harder is much better for cornering but comfort suffer
bigger rim also affect FC and comfort as well
they made it with a certain size of rim for a reason..so better dn't change it
bigger rim just looks cool only actually
plus...its a MPV...why u need to corner so hard..hahaha
imin
post Jan 2 2012, 03:48 AM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Jan 1 2012, 01:16 AM)
I checked di, all the interest is same from the bank. he difference is the number of year you loan and the amount.
Eg: 60k 7yrs = 2.85%
      60k 5yrs = 2.88%
      60k 9 yrs = 2.83%
*
ouh thanks for the info... but all this while I thought if we take loans with shorter tenure, the interest rate will be lower.. it seems I was wrong then


QUOTE(forgot_86 @ Jan 2 2012, 01:09 AM)
Just did the test drive this evening, as have been said by others, it really is amazinngg rclxms.gif  Felt really good and much better than my brother's avanza, which is very light and too simple for the same price.

The guy suggest me to change the tyre to 17" for better even better handling and road grip. It will look physically better as well. Gonna trade in my savvy 06 for exora prime.  biggrin.gif
*
i thought avanza only RM60k++ one? exora bold cost at least about 70k right?
mat79
post Jan 2 2012, 04:01 AM

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QUOTE(imin @ Jan 2 2012, 03:48 AM)
ouh thanks for the info... but all this while I thought if we take loans with shorter tenure, the interest rate will be lower.. it seems I was wrong then
i thought avanza only RM60k++ one? exora bold  cost at least about 70k right?
*

avanza 1.5 kot rm70k++
MentalSlug
post Jan 2 2012, 08:38 AM

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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


To prove my ride is cooler than yours laugh.gif jk jk..

How about change 205/45or50/17? Does it affect FC coz the width ady is same with oem spec.
forgot_86
post Jan 2 2012, 12:11 PM

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QUOTE(imin @ Jan 2 2012, 03:48 AM)
ouh thanks for the info... but all this while I thought if we take loans with shorter tenure, the interest rate will be lower.. it seems I was wrong then
i thought avanza only RM60k++ one? exora bold  cost at least about 70k right?
*
My brother bought the avanza early this year around 75k, 1.5. Use drum brake at the back. And he always has problems to overtake, so when i ride with him we only go for middle or left lane blush.gif Right lane later kena highlight tongue.gif


QUOTE(MentalSlug @ Jan 2 2012, 08:38 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


To prove my ride is cooler than yours laugh.gif jk jk..

How about change 205/45or50/17? Does it affect FC coz the width ady is same with oem spec.
*
The guy suggest me to change to 215/45/r17. He said that is just the right size.

Hmm, somehow when the guy explain about the whole tyre things, and how wide tyres have more grip and can brake better seems to make sense sweat.gif But now im not sure anymore. And kept pointing out also how most BMW and Merz have big and wide tyres for that reason.

Maybe the stock tyre is the best to go. Need to do more research
dares
post Jan 2 2012, 12:16 PM

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QUOTE(forgot_86 @ Jan 2 2012, 12:11 PM)
My brother bought the avanza early this year around 75k, 1.5. Use drum brake at the back. And he always has problems to overtake, so when i ride with him we only go for middle or left lane  blush.gif  Right lane later kena highlight  tongue.gif
The guy suggest me to change to 215/45/r17. He said that is just the right size.

Hmm, somehow when the guy explain about the whole tyre things, and how wide tyres have more grip and can brake better seems to make sense  sweat.gif  But now im not sure anymore. And kept pointing out also how most BMW and Merz have big and wide tyres for that reason.

Maybe the stock tyre is the best to go. Need to do more research
*
Wider tyre does improve grip and stability, at the expense of weight and fc. They are also friggin expensive.
MR_alien
post Jan 2 2012, 01:15 PM

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QUOTE(forgot_86 @ Jan 2 2012, 12:11 PM)
My brother bought the avanza early this year around 75k, 1.5. Use drum brake at the back. And he always has problems to overtake, so when i ride with him we only go for middle or left lane  blush.gif  Right lane later kena highlight  tongue.gif
The guy suggest me to change to 215/45/r17. He said that is just the right size.

Hmm, somehow when the guy explain about the whole tyre things, and how wide tyres have more grip and can brake better seems to make sense  sweat.gif  But now im not sure anymore. And kept pointing out also how most BMW and Merz have big and wide tyres for that reason.

Maybe the stock tyre is the best to go. Need to do more research
*
yes...WIDER tyres(not bigger) does provide more grip..yes..like BMW...their tyres very wide
for the safe side...just go for the better tyres enough already
get something like continental CC5..or better
kadajawi
post Jan 2 2012, 03:20 PM

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QUOTE(MentalSlug @ Jan 2 2012, 08:38 AM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


To prove my ride is cooler than yours laugh.gif jk jk..

How about change 205/45or50/17? Does it affect FC coz the width ady is same with oem spec.
*
As long as the rims are bigger FC and performance will be worse as far as I know. That's what a friend reported... though he also changed to wider ones.
Wider tyres hurt grip when it is wet though, don't they? Also the performance will be reduced. You won't feel it so bad when you have a 300 hp BMW, but an Exora Bold isn't that overpowered. smile.gif

I'd stay with the stock size (or go for smaller ones) and change to better tyres instead.

The Kangoo also only has drum brakes at the back, but it still brakes ok. Performance... when kick down it's ok lah, unless you want to go over 110. It does go faster than 110, but it will take it's sweet time... laugh.gif
mat_tepets
post Jan 4 2012, 09:51 AM

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http://www.bhauto.my/exora-lebih-berkuasa-lancar/

review dari berita harian
vinorgouki
post Jan 5 2012, 04:30 PM

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hi guys who had loan approved.
my loan already approve almost 2 weeks.
do i nd go to sign agreement? or wait the stock come 1st?
MR_alien
post Jan 5 2012, 04:40 PM

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QUOTE(vinorgouki @ Jan 5 2012, 04:30 PM)
hi guys who had loan approved.
my loan already approve almost 2 weeks.
do i nd go to sign agreement? or wait the stock come 1st?
*
yes...u need to sign agreement
the stock is there already actually....if theres no car there...they can't apply for loan
they need the car's identity to apply the loan
dares
post Jan 5 2012, 04:47 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Jan 5 2012, 04:40 PM)
yes...u need to sign agreement
the stock is there already actually....if theres no car there...they can't apply for loan
they need the car's identity to apply the loan
*
I think you can apply for loan without the stock, but to prepare the documents for the signing the stock must be ready (Need car specs and chassis number). Maybe that's why vinorgouki waited 2 weeks after loan approved also not yet sign, because the car has not arrive yet.
MR_alien
post Jan 5 2012, 04:52 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Jan 5 2012, 04:47 PM)
I think you can apply for loan without the stock, but to prepare the documents for the signing the stock must be ready (Need car specs and chassis number). Maybe that's why vinorgouki waited 2 weeks after loan approved also not yet sign, because the car has not arrive yet.
*
hmm...maybe
cuz i remember that when u apply the loan...an officer from the bank will go see the car be4 they approve it
so thats why need to have the car there
dares
post Jan 5 2012, 05:15 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Jan 5 2012, 04:52 PM)
hmm...maybe
cuz i remember that when u apply the loan...an officer from the bank will go see the car be4 they approve it
so thats why need to have the car there
*
Nahh...when I signed for my car it haven't arrive at the dealership yet, but was in their stockyard in Seri Kembangan. Only after I signed the loan agreement did the dealer transport my car to their showroom in Sri Petaling. All the SA gave the loan officer was my documents and the car specs.

I remember my SA tell me that I can apply loan this month and buy car next month, but subject to interest and price changes la as long as you have not signed the documents.

Maybe it depends on the relationship between the bank and the dealership.

This post has been edited by dares: Jan 5 2012, 05:17 PM
diablos
post Jan 5 2012, 06:27 PM

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I heard the from radio proton got discount, any of you guys manage to get any discount for exora bold?
MR_alien
post Jan 5 2012, 06:41 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Jan 5 2012, 05:15 PM)
Nahh...when I signed for my car it haven't arrive at the dealership yet, but was in their stockyard in Seri Kembangan. Only after I signed the loan agreement did the dealer transport my car to their showroom in Sri Petaling. All the SA gave the loan officer was my documents and the car specs.

I remember my SA tell me that I can apply loan this month and buy car next month, but subject to interest and price changes la as long as you have not signed the documents.

Maybe it depends on the relationship between the bank and the dealership.
*
oh..u mean its in the stockyard..yes ..it is in the stockyard
when i say its here already mean the actual car is in their possession already
becuz the bank MUST see the car be4 they approve the loan...the bank is same like us ...buyers as well
if we...the buyer didn't see the car...will u send few hundred thousand to the car company?...no right?
the bank actually pay lum sum on the car and they kinda lend it to us..haha...we owe the bank...bank doesn't owe anyone anything
rapidbumi
post Jan 6 2012, 09:29 AM

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guys what is the best colour for exora bold? white/silver/cocoa grey/elegant brown?..
vinorgouki
post Jan 6 2012, 11:14 AM

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thanx for the info mr. alien n dares.

coz the SA ask me to sign the bank agreement. then he can prepare all the things n wait for the stock come.

so i nd to comfirm with u guys 1st before making any agreement.
hows any others who had approve the loan?
ultramaman
post Jan 6 2012, 11:38 AM

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any news on when we getting delivery for the car ?
i've paid booking fee, i've got a loan, but apparently cant proceed until the car is at the dealer , because the loan agreement needs the vehicle chassis number.
did your SA update you on delivery of the car? i asked proton on fb and they said its 2 months. sad.gif
dares
post Jan 6 2012, 12:30 PM

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QUOTE(vinorgouki @ Jan 6 2012, 11:14 AM)
thanx for the info mr. alien n dares.

coz the SA ask me to sign the bank agreement. then he can prepare all the things n wait for the stock come.

so i nd to comfirm with u guys 1st before making any agreement.
hows any others who had approve the loan?
*
Better wait until the dealership recieve your car, unless they already stock it somewhere else. You cant sign anything unless they have the chassis number, and they cant have the chassis number unless the car is already in their possession.

When you sign, make sure you check the specs of the car thorougly, including color and such, it is listed in te documents.

My sa will only bring the car to the dealership after i sign it, although they have stocked it at seri kembangan.

This post has been edited by dares: Jan 6 2012, 12:36 PM
MR_alien
post Jan 6 2012, 12:38 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Jan 6 2012, 12:30 PM)
Better wait until the dealership recieve your car, unless they already stock it somewhere else. You cant sign anything unless they have the chassis number, and they cant have the chassis number unless the car is already in their possession.

When you sign, make sure you check the specs of the car thorougly, including color and such, it is listed in te documents.

My sa will only bring the car to the dealership after i sign it, although they have stocked it at seri kembangan.
*
actually be4 the loan is approved...the officer from bank already go see the car in the stockyard
what the buyer need to do is match the chassis number from the loan application to the actual car...see if the same
and of course check for faultiness
ntc2000
post Jan 6 2012, 03:05 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Jan 6 2012, 12:38 PM)
actually be4 the loan is approved...the officer from bank already go see the car in the stockyard
what the buyer need to do is match the chassis number from the loan application to the actual car...see if the same
and of course check for faultiness
*
if after sign the loan agreement and found that car got serious faulty, and we dont want to accept that car, then how?

This post has been edited by ntc2000: Jan 6 2012, 03:06 PM
xshiro
post Jan 6 2012, 03:12 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 6 2012, 03:05 PM)
if after sign the loan agreement and found that car got serious faulty, and we dont want to accept that car, then how?
*
they'll replace for you
vinorgouki
post Jan 6 2012, 06:26 PM

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QUOTE(ultramaman @ Jan 6 2012, 11:38 AM)
any news on when we getting delivery for the car ?
i've paid booking fee, i've got a loan, but apparently cant proceed until the car is at the dealer , because the loan agreement  needs the vehicle chassis number.
did your SA update you on delivery of the car? i asked proton on fb and they said its 2 months. sad.gif
*
my SA didnt comfirm with me. he said estimate 1 month, any update he will contact me.
i even heard Proton Edar SA said, it available at mid of January. hope it will be true.
coz i need a car for CNY too.

This post has been edited by vinorgouki: Jan 6 2012, 10:45 PM
BakBaby
post Jan 6 2012, 10:37 PM

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QUOTE(forter @ Dec 22 2011, 08:41 PM)
I quite satisfied with this new exora improvement with the interior..but as you concern..im also cant understand why they did not change that 80s style dial knob...really spoiled the looks and feel....yes,you are right..atleast persona dial knob design look more premium...why dont they just use it for exora...its will enhance the dashboard design...

Maby proton think its just small thing that people dont bother...but some people including me really particullar about that...but overall package proton have done the good job...this mpv is one of my list to consider...
*
check out Polo TSI dial knob smile.gif

http://paultan.org/2010/10/18/volkswagen-p...ions/dsc_0701b/


kadajawi
post Jan 7 2012, 12:23 AM

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QUOTE(BakBaby @ Jan 6 2012, 10:37 PM)
Polo still supposed to be cheap car, only not for us.

But I'm surprised... that's a automatic climate control thing (well, more or less, at least you can set the temperature of the air that is coming out of the vents, the better ones try all they can to achieve the wanted temperature, and then there are even better units), so better than what the Exora has. However in the previous gen Polo this is how it looked like: http://i.auto-bild.de/ir_img/5/9/9/5/1/8/K...f122165ecd4.jpg The new unit definitely looks cheaper and is not as good I guess.
mat79
post Jan 7 2012, 01:36 AM

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common cut cost measure,even apply to vw. It is cheaper to outside countries than malaysia, if look at omv price@docket price,polo tsi is more expensive than exora,but not that expensive,just couple of k. Cheap german cars only cheap for germans n european people coz their purchasing power is higher than us.
But exora is an mpv, polo is small car b segment. Saga flx 80k anyone? Nope, it wont be sold even a single unit i think.
zookri
post Jan 7 2012, 11:21 AM

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On the day u collect ur new car...if u found ur car got faulty.. Just don’t sign the delivery order form... ask the SA or the dealer to clear the prob or replace the car... once u sign the form, the dealer n SA take no responsibility if u found any prob with ur car...

Bank officer only check at the stockyard only for dealer with "floor stock" facilities only... Not many Proton dealers have this facility... agreement customer need to sign so the dealers can order or make bookings with Proton and Proton will fwd to them the Engine n Chassis number..
kadajawi
post Jan 7 2012, 12:16 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 7 2012, 01:36 AM)
common cut cost measure,even apply to vw. It is cheaper to outside countries than malaysia, if look at omv price@docket price,polo tsi is more expensive than exora,but not that expensive,just couple of k. Cheap german cars only cheap for germans n european people coz their purchasing power is higher than us.
But exora is an mpv, polo is small car b segment. Saga flx 80k anyone? Nope, it wont be sold even a single unit i think.
*
Not only cause of purchasing power, tax too. also the Polo we get is already pretty high spec... but the highest spec Myvi also still feels like a Myvi, right? Also I doubt many are going for a high spec Polo... most will be buying a more entry level one in Europe.

One of the main features of the Golf 6 was that it was cheaper to produce than the Golf 5. Golf 7 should be cheaper yet. They claim that the product feels more premium on the inside though, is tougher etc.

I don't expect a 80k MPV to feel very premium... at least they are not cutting costs on the handling and noise insulation... who cares if a dial looks a bit cheap (of course it would be nice if the Exora is like a 5 series BMW...).
mat79
post Jan 7 2012, 01:59 PM

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dont get me wrong kadajawi, what i mean is that if we want prtn to have nearly same quality of cars, we need to be prepared to pay at the same premium price as well. Thats why if saga(base line model) want to have a quality like polo(likely base line model for vw),saga need to be priced atleast 80k, but the problem is,is there anyone want to buy saga at 80k? The same as exora, is there anyone want to buy exora @ 120k atleast? Even when exora prime price at rm88k which happened cheaper than innova(same tax as locals for innova),but with bundle of goodies n leathers and safety gadgets, but people still say it is expensive. People only accept exora prime at the same price of exora bold cfe @rm80k.

That is why it is really hard for prtn to make everyone happy coz price is really important part for people to buy prtn cars. They dont care even when prtn come with sedan that has 10 airbags with the same price of vios, they still buy vios coz for them,the emblem itself is value for money. Prtn with 10 airbags with the same price as vios will be label as overcharge n pricey n etc...


Added on January 7, 2012, 2:01 pmops,forgot to mentioned, agreed on hefty tax in malaysia compare to outside.

This post has been edited by mat79: Jan 7 2012, 02:01 PM
kadajawi
post Jan 7 2012, 02:40 PM

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I agree. Let them die in their Vios. There are better alternatives (even the European Vios hatchback (Yaris) is vastly superior).
ntc2000
post Jan 7 2012, 03:25 PM

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just want to check what is the best offer can get?

i booked mine as well... but not much $$ rebate or free gift.
vinorgouki
post Jan 7 2012, 03:41 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 7 2012, 03:25 PM)
just want to check what is the best offer can get?

i booked mine as well... but not much $$ rebate or free gift.
*
hi bro,
i get RM500 komisyen back from the SA. Full tank.
no others free gift.
How about urs? n ur SA got tell u when u can receive ur car?

This post has been edited by vinorgouki: Jan 7 2012, 03:58 PM
ntc2000
post Jan 7 2012, 04:05 PM

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QUOTE(vinorgouki @ Jan 7 2012, 03:41 PM)
hi bro,
i get RM500 komisyen back from the SA. Full tank.
no others free gift.
How about urs? n ur SA got tell u when u can receive ur car?
*
RM450 + number plate.

i try to request full tank, he dont want gip...

next 10 days... car haven reach yet... cry.gif
vinorgouki
post Jan 7 2012, 04:09 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 7 2012, 04:05 PM)
RM450 + number plate.

i try to request full tank, he dont want gip...

next 10 days... car haven reach yet...  cry.gif
*
wow, 10 days, so fast. mine estimate 1 month, lagi teruk.
did he comfirm 10 days will arrive stock? wheres ur place bro?

This post has been edited by vinorgouki: Jan 7 2012, 04:12 PM
ntc2000
post Jan 7 2012, 04:35 PM

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QUOTE(vinorgouki @ Jan 7 2012, 04:09 PM)
wow, 10 days, so fast. mine estimate 1 month, lagi teruk.
did he comfirm 10 days will arrive stock? wheres ur place bro?
*
i booked before launch... june 2011 alr booked... gila kah?

hahahaha
kochin
post Jan 9 2012, 04:48 PM

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full tank, security tint, rm1k rebate.
ok kah?
MR_alien
post Jan 9 2012, 04:59 PM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jan 9 2012, 04:48 PM)
full tank, security tint, rm1k rebate.
ok kah?
*
new car also got so many free things?
sure is bold?
ntc2000
post Jan 9 2012, 07:59 PM

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even got people offer me 1.5k cash rebate.... lol

as i know bold executive, yes 1.5k rebate
but for bold premium, i dont know
kochin
post Jan 9 2012, 10:04 PM

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QUOTE(MR_alien @ Jan 9 2012, 04:59 PM)
new car also got so many free things?
sure is bold?
*
bold premium.
oh i forgot to add, it's 2012 engine and not 2011. rclxms.gif
vinorgouki
post Jan 9 2012, 11:20 PM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jan 9 2012, 10:04 PM)
bold premium.
oh i forgot  to add, it's 2012 engine and not 2011. rclxms.gif
*
U really got a big discount. N how to request 2012 engine?
isit the next batch at mid Jan 2012?

rapidbumi
post Jan 10 2012, 09:23 AM

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QUOTE(kochin @ Jan 9 2012, 10:04 PM)
bold premium.
oh i forgot  to add, it's 2012 engine and not 2011. rclxms.gif
*
wah, u get RM1k rebate for bold premium? where did u book? my SA never mention this to me... i've booked at Mutiara D..
ntc2000
post Jan 10 2012, 11:00 AM

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My SA told me 2012 car gold color batch reach their showroom already.

I still have to wai for silver color.
diablos
post Jan 10 2012, 12:09 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 10 2012, 11:00 AM)
My SA told me 2012 car gold color batch reach their showroom already.

I still have to wai for silver color.
*
Me too.... I also waiting for silver.


Added on January 10, 2012, 12:10 pm
QUOTE(rapidbumi @ Jan 10 2012, 09:23 AM)
wah, u get RM1k rebate for bold premium? where did u book? my SA never mention this to me... i've booked at Mutiara D..
*
Is it he minus the NCB... then got 1k discount?

This post has been edited by diablos: Jan 10 2012, 12:10 PM
fx20
post Jan 10 2012, 12:58 PM

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I am planning to get a exora soon because of the space. I am torn between the Exe (Manual) and CVT. The difference is about 12k.

Looking at the budget I have (79k) I don't know any good justification to spend 12k to swtich to CVT.

Anyone mind to share his/her comment?


This post has been edited by fx20: Jan 10 2012, 12:59 PM
rapidbumi
post Jan 10 2012, 03:38 PM

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QUOTE(fx20 @ Jan 10 2012, 12:58 PM)
I am planning to get a exora soon because of the space. I am torn between the Exe (Manual) and CVT. The difference is about 12k.

Looking at the budget I have (79k) I don't know any good justification to spend 12k to swtich to CVT.

Anyone mind to share his/her comment?
*
it's not just CVT... but engine CFE vs CPS as well,..n others... but I suggest you go for a test drive first to decide whether you needed the enhancement or not.. you're the best judge for what you need..
dares
post Jan 10 2012, 05:08 PM

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QUOTE(fx20 @ Jan 10 2012, 12:58 PM)
I am planning to get a exora soon because of the space. I am torn between the Exe (Manual) and CVT. The difference is about 12k.

Looking at the budget I have (79k) I don't know any good justification to spend 12k to swtich to CVT.

Anyone mind to share his/her comment?
*
If you buy cps, kenot naik genting with full load. tongue.gif
ultramaman
post Jan 10 2012, 05:37 PM

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the manual and normal auto has a different engine, the much less powerful engine.
the cvt has the more powerful engine. and its the version that all the advertisments are harping about.
mutt
post Jan 10 2012, 05:45 PM

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QUOTE(fx20 @ Jan 10 2012, 12:58 PM)
I am planning to get a exora soon because of the space. I am torn between the Exe (Manual) and CVT. The difference is about 12k.

Looking at the budget I have (79k) I don't know any good justification to spend 12k to swtich to CVT.

Anyone mind to share his/her comment?
*
RM12 difference is so much worth it.. I couldn't keep my face from smiling when I test drive this MPV.. Else you'll climb Genting with a long face laugh.gif
MR_alien
post Jan 10 2012, 05:56 PM

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the CPS is ok actually...as long as its using CVT GB
saga also same...using same engine but GB 1 use 4AT and another use CVT...difference is quiet big
but of course if can get CFE + CVT...thats the best
neozombie
post Jan 10 2012, 05:59 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Jan 10 2012, 05:08 PM)
If you buy cps, kenot naik genting with full load. tongue.gif
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Underated statement...

have u been to genting using exora before.... ... ?? dont give false statement
dares
post Jan 10 2012, 06:04 PM

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QUOTE(neozombie @ Jan 10 2012, 05:59 PM)
Underated statement...

have u been to genting using exora before.... ... ?? dont give false statement
*
You see the tongue smiley at the end of the sentence?

It is well known that the exora cps 4at is underpowered especially climbing hill, let alone at a full load of 7 people. What are you so defensive about?
fx20
post Jan 10 2012, 06:10 PM

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I am well aware of the weakness of 4AT CPS. Normally you don't get much horsepower with AT especially during gear transition.

But does MT having similar problem?

Or can MT go up Genting ?


Added on January 10, 2012, 6:18 pm
QUOTE(mutt @ Jan 10 2012, 05:45 PM)
RM12 difference is so much worth it.. I couldn't keep my face from smiling when I test drive this MPV..  Else you'll climb Genting with a long face laugh.gif
*
12K make a lot of difference in your monthly installment.


Added on January 10, 2012, 6:19 pmDecision, decision and decision.

This post has been edited by fx20: Jan 10 2012, 06:19 PM
dares
post Jan 10 2012, 06:20 PM

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QUOTE(fx20 @ Jan 10 2012, 06:10 PM)
I am well aware of the weakness of 4AT CPS. Normally you don't get much horsepower with AT especially during gear transition.

But does MT having similar problem?

Or can MT go up Genting ?
*
Any car can go up genting, just a matter how slow you are willing to go, even risk engine overheat.

MT exora cps i am not familiar, maybe someone can shed some light on it. Butnif you have not test drive the cfe + cvt, please takeit for a spin. It will be money well spent esp if you carry many people most of the time.
fx20
post Jan 10 2012, 06:24 PM

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Tested BOLD Premium 2 weeks ago. I like it very much, but 12k more. Can only full loan 70k and no extra cash at hand, sad.gif
huaren1978
post Jan 10 2012, 06:31 PM

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Finally we managed to find time to test drive the Exora Bold last weekend. Can say I couldn't stop smiling (or was it grinning from ear to ear?) all the way from start to finish. The torque was simply superb. We were pleasantly surprised with the short driving experience that we had.
A2Z2U
post Jan 10 2012, 07:48 PM

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QUOTE(huaren1978 @ Jan 10 2012, 06:31 PM)
Finally we managed to find time to test drive the Exora Bold last weekend. Can say I couldn't stop smiling (or was it grinning from ear to ear?) all the way from start to finish. The torque was simply superb. We were pleasantly surprised with the short driving experience that we had.
*
Bro, I know the turbo kick in at 2000rpm. How about the pickup below 2000rpm? let's say from 1000-1999rpm, is it same as normal cps or better in term of pickup?
dares
post Jan 10 2012, 07:58 PM

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QUOTE(fx20 @ Jan 10 2012, 06:24 PM)
Tested BOLD Premium 2 weeks ago. I like it very much,  but 12k more. Can only full loan 70k and no extra cash at hand, sad.gif
*
Well since your budget is fixed, nothing can do about it blush.gif

QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Jan 10 2012, 07:48 PM)
Bro, I know the turbo kick in at 2000rpm. How about the pickup below 2000rpm? let's say from 1000-1999rpm, is it same as normal cps or better in term of pickup?
*
Like any other normal car.
chulaisn
post Jan 10 2012, 08:01 PM

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the exora MT gear shift is super heavy and stiff. try it out..see whether u can get use to it before deciding
mivecwira
post Jan 10 2012, 08:04 PM

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Exora Bold (~RM80k) is it equip with CFE+CVT g/box or only just for the Premium spec (~RM90K)??
A2Z2U
post Jan 10 2012, 08:14 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Jan 10 2012, 07:58 PM)
Like any other normal car.
*
So can I say it has worse pickup than cps at range 1000-1999rpm because of its slightly reduced cc (cps 1597cc and cfe 1561cc) and heavier kerb weight compared to cps hmm.gif
huaren1978
post Jan 10 2012, 10:14 PM

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QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Jan 10 2012, 07:48 PM)
Bro, I know the turbo kick in at 2000rpm. How about the pickup below 2000rpm? let's say from 1000-1999rpm, is it same as normal cps or better in term of pickup?
*
Say you're driving a normally-aspirated Exora CPS, would you consciously make an effort to keep the rpm below the 2000 mark while driving off when the lights turn to green?

I don't get your point actually. hmm.gif but to answer your question anyway, without the turbo spooling it would behave just like any other 1.6-litre nomarlly-aspirated engine.
A2Z2U
post Jan 10 2012, 10:31 PM

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QUOTE(huaren1978 @ Jan 10 2012, 10:14 PM)
Say you're driving a normally-aspirated Exora CPS, would you consciously make an effort to keep the rpm below the 2000 mark while driving off when the lights turn to green?

I don't get your point actually. hmm.gif but to answer your question anyway, without the turbo spooling it would behave just like any other 1.6-litre nomarlly-aspirated engine.
*
A commenter in paultan said he pressed hard on accelerometer and the car didn't really moved fast until it reached 2000rpm. So I guessed the pickup was weak below 2000rpm.
V12Kompressor
post Jan 10 2012, 10:44 PM

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QUOTE(mivecwira @ Jan 10 2012, 08:04 PM)
Exora Bold (~RM80k) is it equip with CFE+CVT g/box or only just for the Premium spec (~RM90K)??
*
Exora Bold alone already have CFE and CVT

The more expensive Exora prime shares the same driveterain, but with more luxurious interior (captain seats, individual DVD player, full leather upholstery)


Added on January 10, 2012, 10:46 pm
QUOTE(A2Z2U @ Jan 10 2012, 10:31 PM)
A commenter in paultan said he pressed hard on accelerometer and the car didn't really moved fast until it reached 2000rpm. So I guessed the pickup was weak below 2000rpm.
*
I can't comprehend why people love to full throttle when testing cars, especially cars equipped with CVT.

This post has been edited by V12Kompressor: Jan 10 2012, 10:46 PM
diablos
post Jan 10 2012, 11:41 PM

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Called my sales man...... can get my car within next week coz the car start coming....weeeee............ did you guys really get rebates...? I ask my sales man he say no rebates for new model..... sad.gif only free gift.....
k!nex
post Jan 11 2012, 12:26 AM

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QUOTE(huaren1978 @ Jan 10 2012, 10:14 PM)
Say you're driving a normally-aspirated Exora CPS, would you consciously make an effort to keep the rpm below the 2000 mark while driving off when the lights turn to green?

I don't get your point actually. hmm.gif but to answer your question anyway, without the turbo spooling it would behave just like any other 1.6-litre nomarlly-aspirated engine.
*
I beg to differ, by theory it should be worse than a normal 1.6 NA car. Reason, the engine compression ratio is lower compare to NA version.Turbo= 8.9:1 compare to NA= 10:1 .

Thats the weakness of turbo, low end sux before the turbo start spooling.
ultramaman
post Jan 11 2012, 12:30 AM

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how many seconds do u think your engine will remain below 2k ?
kadajawi
post Jan 11 2012, 01:30 AM

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When it has CVT shouldn't it just raise the RPM above 2k whenever you try to accelerate hard?

VW Touran 1.4 TSI, 1.9 TDI and Ford Galaxy 1.6 TDCI had the same issue. No power before the turbo kicks in. But then it's nice thumbup.gif
A2Z2U
post Jan 11 2012, 02:26 AM

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QUOTE(k!nex @ Jan 11 2012, 12:26 AM)
I beg to differ, by theory it should be worse than a normal 1.6 NA car. Reason, the engine compression ratio is lower compare to NA version.Turbo= 8.9:1 compare to NA= 10:1 .

Thats the weakness of turbo, low end sux before the turbo start spooling.
*
QUOTE(kadajawi @ Jan 11 2012, 01:30 AM)
When it has CVT shouldn't it just raise the RPM above 2k whenever you try to accelerate hard?

VW Touran 1.4 TSI, 1.9 TDI and Ford Galaxy 1.6 TDCI had the same issue. No power before the turbo kicks in. But then it's nice thumbup.gif
*
So, to compensate for the weaker low end pickup, manufacturers need to tune the engine so that turbo kicks in at lowest rpm possible. That way, the drivability is greatly increase. I see that VW, Peugeot and Ford can tune their turbo cars to kick in at <1600rpm thumbup.gif

This post has been edited by A2Z2U: Jan 11 2012, 02:36 AM
mat79
post Jan 11 2012, 08:09 AM

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erm,actually, cfe has more torque than cps from 1k-2k rpm, u can refer to torque graph. If u want to get optimum fuel efficiency, u shud drive below 2k rpm before the tubo unit kick in coz when it kicks, more fuel will be injected to perform complete combustion coz air ratio already diff(a lot of air coz forced induction), n fuel ratio need to balance it, so,it is known as air fuel ratio.

About feeling delay or not moving,it is due to cvt misconception by those who are not familiarize with cvt. If u get uncomfortable with cvt behavior,thats why sat button is created.

In cvt, rpm meter easily jump up n speedo is not following the rpm until it reach desire speed@designated rpm.

If u want to have feeling rpm n speedo move accordingly together, just set sat on.

To said cfe torque at rpm 1k-1999k rpm is low than cps unit,is totally wrong. 90% of torque for cps only available@3k rpm which is only 135nm@3k rpm,which cfe already reach nearly 160nm of torque as low as 1500 rpm, more than peak torque of cps 150nm at 4.5krpm.

So,hopefully this will clear the picture


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:15 amcompression ratio is not only about performance,it is also about efficiency n also lower comp ratio allow the engine to accept low octane fuel.

Normally high performance na engine has high comp ratio,and its cause them only to accept premium@high octane fuel only. Thats why type r n swift sport only can accept minimum premium fuel as ron 97 in malaysia.


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:17 amthats is also why cvvt existed in cfe,to cater low end torque from 1-2k rpm before tubo unit kick in.

This post has been edited by mat79: Jan 11 2012, 08:17 AM
hemanlo
post Jan 11 2012, 09:21 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 08:09 AM)
erm,actually, cfe has more torque than cps from 1k-2k rpm, u can refer to torque graph. If u want to get optimum fuel efficiency, u shud drive below 2k rpm before the tubo unit kick in coz when it kicks, more fuel will be injected to perform complete combustion coz air ratio already diff(a lot of air coz forced induction), n fuel ratio need to balance it, so,it is known as air fuel ratio.

About feeling delay or not moving,it is due to cvt misconception by those who are not familiarize with cvt. If u get uncomfortable with cvt behavior,thats why sat button is created.

In cvt, rpm meter easily jump up n speedo is not following the rpm until it reach desire speed@designated rpm.

If u want to have feeling rpm n speedo move accordingly together, just set sat on.

To said cfe torque at rpm 1k-1999k rpm is low than cps unit,is totally wrong. 90% of torque for cps only available@3k rpm which is only 135nm@3k rpm,which cfe already reach nearly 160nm of torque as low as 1500 rpm, more than peak torque of cps 150nm at 4.5krpm.

So,hopefully this will clear the picture


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:15 amcompression ratio is not only about performance,it is also about efficiency n also lower comp ratio allow the engine to accept low octane fuel.

Normally high performance na engine has high comp ratio,and its cause them only to accept premium@high octane fuel only. Thats why type r n swift sport only can accept minimum premium fuel as ron 97 in malaysia.


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:17 amthats is also why cvvt existed in cfe,to cater low end torque from 1-2k rpm before tubo unit kick in.
*
Very well explained...
dares
post Jan 11 2012, 10:31 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 08:09 AM)
erm,actually, cfe has more torque than cps from 1k-2k rpm, u can refer to torque graph. If u want to get optimum fuel efficiency, u shud drive below 2k rpm before the tubo unit kick in coz when it kicks, more fuel will be injected to perform complete combustion coz air ratio already diff(a lot of air coz forced induction), n fuel ratio need to balance it, so,it is known as air fuel ratio.

About feeling delay or not moving,it is due to cvt misconception by those who are not familiarize with cvt. If u get uncomfortable with cvt behavior,thats why sat button is created.

In cvt, rpm meter easily jump up n speedo is not following the rpm until it reach desire speed@designated rpm.

If u want to have feeling rpm n speedo move accordingly together, just set sat on.

To said cfe torque at rpm 1k-1999k rpm is low than cps unit,is totally wrong. 90% of torque for cps only available@3k rpm which is only 135nm@3k rpm,which cfe already reach nearly 160nm of torque as low as 1500 rpm, more than peak torque of cps 150nm at 4.5krpm.

So,hopefully this will clear the picture


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:15 amcompression ratio is not only about performance,it is also about efficiency n also lower comp ratio allow the engine to accept low octane fuel.

Normally high performance na engine has high comp ratio,and its cause them only to accept premium@high octane fuel only. Thats why type r n swift sport only can accept minimum premium fuel as ron 97 in malaysia.


Added on January 11, 2012, 8:17 amthats is also why cvvt existed in cfe,to cater low end torque from 1-2k rpm before tubo unit kick in.
*
I was beginning to wonder when is anyone gonna bring up the vvt in the context of the campro cfe.

This post has been edited by dares: Jan 11 2012, 10:32 AM
mat79
post Jan 11 2012, 10:38 AM

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one more thing,if u press the pedal more than 85% of throttle, full cvt mode will change to slow mode sat, which cause the rpm raise slowly to upper rev,not jump up like in cvt.

There are a lot of cvt tech that we need to learn on,not just wiki,it is full of tech, they way it works also diff than conv at.

Thats why nowadays, they opt to single clutch,dual clutch n cvt trans rather than conv torque converter at. But still some still using it since it is already well known n well verse.
nickfun
post Jan 11 2012, 11:56 AM

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MAT97, i don't agree on the premium price thing u mention, as the cost of a Vios is not 80k, it is the TAX that make it become 80k.
If prtn would have to produce the same quality car they can sell it at 50k for sure.
If proton can produce a 80k Saga im expecting it to be on par with inspira at least.
The loyalty prtn paid to Mitsubishi = 0 so definitely you dont need to pay 90k.

People buy Toyota becos they can afford and they have a peaceful mind about the service.
Prtn need to EARN that trust from people, past already teach them a lesson.
they have this tot of building cheap cars to satisfy all parties need but now its different cos
Naza/competitor bringing more and more value for money vehicles and their 'gov protection' is getting lesser smile.gif

However i see a good sign on Exora upgrade and i, myself is very interested to test drive it smile.gif

QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 7 2012, 01:59 PM)
dont get me wrong kadajawi, what i mean is that if we want prtn to have nearly same quality of cars, we need to be prepared to pay at the same premium price as well. Thats why if saga(base line model) want to have a quality like polo(likely base line model for vw),saga need to be priced atleast 80k, but the problem is,is there anyone want to buy saga at 80k? The same as exora, is there anyone want to buy exora @ 120k atleast? Even when exora prime price at rm88k which happened cheaper than innova(same tax as locals for innova),but with bundle of goodies n leathers and safety gadgets, but people still say it is expensive. People only accept exora prime at the same price of exora bold cfe @rm80k.

That is why it is really hard for prtn to make everyone happy coz price is really important part for people to buy prtn cars. They dont care even when prtn come with sedan that has 10 airbags with the same price of vios, they still buy vios coz for them,the emblem itself is value for money. Prtn with 10 airbags with the same price as vios will be label as overcharge n pricey n etc...


Added on January 7, 2012, 2:01 pmops,forgot to mentioned, agreed on hefty tax in malaysia compare to outside.
*
imin
post Jan 11 2012, 03:14 PM

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this article here http://www.arenakereta.com/13/12/2011/prot...d-h-line-prime/ mentioned that exora bold FL will come out soon.. hmm
mat79
post Jan 11 2012, 03:31 PM

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QUOTE(nickfun @ Jan 11 2012, 11:56 AM)
MAT97, i don't agree on the premium price thing u mention, as the cost of a Vios is not 80k, it is the TAX that make it become 80k.
If prtn would have to produce the same quality car they can sell it at 50k for sure.
If proton can produce a 80k Saga im expecting it to be on par with inspira at least.
The loyalty prtn paid to Mitsubishi = 0 so definitely you dont need to pay 90k.

People buy Toyota becos they can afford and they have a peaceful mind about the service.
Prtn need to EARN that trust from people, past already teach them a lesson.
they have this tot of building cheap cars to satisfy all parties need but now its different cos
Naza/competitor bringing more and more value for money vehicles and their 'gov protection' is getting lesser smile.gif

However i see a good sign on Exora upgrade and i, myself is very interested to test drive it smile.gif
*
of couse vios is price higher due to tax, but also due to traders profit. Let me inform u, vios is under asean cept program n it being tax the same as locals @ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. 10% ckd import tax is wave due to cept.Same as saga,@ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. Please refer to www.maa.org.my to get clear picture.

Locals rebate 50% on excise duty already lifted since 2009,it is under nap program. So,now they are equally in term of tax paid. Refer to www.customs.org.my , www.maa.org.my n midf website.

So, what had happened? It is higher traders profit charge by toyota to us. If u have opportunity to look at ap paperworks,u will be shock coz even some take traders profit at 70k percar,its not from europe,it is from asia country.

Saga is not relevant to compare to vios, coz even without tax, its still cheaper than vios. True competitor is persona elegance n gen2.

Just wait for p321a, it is direct competitor with vios n city, with same tax applied, n judge whether prtn can do better or not compare to vios@city.

Dont talk about old tax structure coz we are now in 2012. Happy motoring.


Added on January 11, 2012, 3:33 pmjust wait whether p321a premium is par with inspira @ rm80 below or better or lesser.

This post has been edited by mat79: Jan 11 2012, 03:33 PM
dares
post Jan 11 2012, 03:36 PM

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QUOTE(imin @ Jan 11 2012, 03:14 PM)
this article here http://www.arenakereta.com/13/12/2011/prot...d-h-line-prime/ mentioned that exora bold FL will come out soon.. hmm
*
Exora FL = Exora Bold / Exora Prime. No such thing as Exora Bold FL, at least not yet.


QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 03:31 PM)
of couse vios is price higher due to tax, but also due to traders profit. Let me inform u, vios is under asean cept program n it being tax the same as locals @ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. 10% ckd import tax is wave due to cept.Same as saga,@ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. Please refer to www.maa.org.my to get clear picture.

Locals rebate 50% on excise duty already lifted since 2009,it is under nap program. So,now they are equally in term of tax paid. Refer to www.customs.org.my , www.maa.org.my n midf website.

So, what had happened? It is higher traders profit charge by toyota to us. If u have opportunity to look at ap paperworks,u will be shock coz even some take traders profit at 70k percar,its not from europe,it is from asia country.

Saga is not relevant to compare to vios, coz even without tax, its still cheaper than vios. True competitor is persona elegance n gen2.

Just wait for p321a, it is direct competitor with vios n city, with same tax applied, n judge whether prtn can do better or not compare to vios@city.

Dont talk about old tax structure coz we are now in 2012. Happy motoring.


Added on January 11, 2012, 3:33 pmjust wait whether p321a premium is par with inspira @ rm80 below or better or lesser.
*
Good info.

This post has been edited by dares: Jan 11 2012, 03:37 PM
nickfun
post Jan 11 2012, 04:49 PM

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such a high price but yet there are so many buyers on N/H/T becos they believe/trust the brand more than prtn.

Prtn need to do something to regain the trust...when people hear prtn they says its a lousy car (for those who afford higher price car)

i'm comparing Vios and Saga becos they are under same segment while persona/inspira/Gen2 more towards the Civic/Altis.

City for 90k is definitel over priced piece of steel (no offence to city owner ya)

QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 03:31 PM)
of couse vios is price higher due to tax, but also due to traders profit. Let me inform u, vios is under asean cept program n it being tax the same as locals @ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. 10% ckd import tax is wave due to cept.Same as saga,@ 75% excise duty n 10% sales tax. Please refer to www.maa.org.my to get clear picture.

Locals rebate 50% on excise duty already lifted since 2009,it is under nap program. So,now they are equally in term of tax paid. Refer to www.customs.org.my , www.maa.org.my n midf website.

So, what had happened? It is higher traders profit charge by toyota to us. If u have opportunity to look at ap paperworks,u will be shock coz even some take traders profit at 70k percar,its not from europe,it is from asia country.

Saga is not relevant to compare to vios, coz even without tax, its still cheaper than vios. True competitor is persona elegance n gen2.

Just wait for p321a, it is direct competitor with vios n city, with same tax applied, n judge whether prtn can do better or not compare to vios@city.

Dont talk about old tax structure coz we are now in 2012. Happy motoring.


Added on January 11, 2012, 3:33 pmjust wait whether p321a premium is par with inspira @ rm80 below or better or lesser.
*
This post has been edited by nickfun: Jan 11 2012, 04:50 PM
0300078
post Jan 11 2012, 05:15 PM

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i think lots of Malaysian dun like Proton becoz of pass experience (a lot of them owned Proton before so that where the hate came from), i myself drive a Wira for 4 years before i know how it feels....

Proton did make some progress but that is becoz they piss too many of their pass customer off to come back and buy proton from them again.

Goodwill is abit on the down side i would said..... they are now surviving through selling cars that i cheap until no other direct competitor in that price range.
mat79
post Jan 11 2012, 05:20 PM

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sorry,typo,not midf, but miti.

Em, saga is sub b segment, while gen2 n persona is b segment, never be c segment car.

Altis n civic is c segment car as inspira. Vios n city is b segment car.

Quite unique the way u comparing segment of cars coz even international mags, dont do comparo b segment with c segment cars :-), quite unique i must say.

If u have the opportunity to know asian max 1600 challenge which satria neo won previously, that is the cars in b segment, such as city,vios,yaris, jazz, swift, pug 207,gen2,neo n etc.

To do comparison b with c segments is like comparing bmw 3 series with merc e class.

By the way,its ur own way of comparing, even its unique, after all, we are malaysian, living in unique country. Happy motoring.


Added on January 11, 2012, 5:30 pmsaga has competitors actually, but rarely other manufacturers sell it in malaysia. U can see a lot of saga competitors in india (not tata nano, but ford, suzuki, renault, dancia, toyota n etc) n in china.Dunno why, maybe coz of malaysia market,they dont like buying cheap cars from other automakers. Same fate happen to alto,cheaper than swift,but coz made in india, even by suzuki,less sold than swift by big margin,people still opt for viva. Same as i10,definitely better than myvi lb coz it is hyundai global car,better equip,better kappa engine, better tech,better safety, equally priced(personal opinion),but the sale is pretty weak to compare to myvi.

Thats why malaysia is a unique market like forte, global car, sold really well globaly, but when sell in malaysia market, cannot beat vios n city market,even civic@altis, although it is better equips than the competitors. If it is due to brand, hyundai, kia is top 5 manufacturers together with toyota in the world, so good brand indeed.

This post has been edited by mat79: Jan 11 2012, 05:30 PM
kadajawi
post Jan 11 2012, 06:47 PM

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Persona I personally would see as a C segment car, albeit a small one. It is difficult anyway, what is a Skoda Octavia? Underpinnings are from the Golf, so C segment. Price too. But in terms of size it is probably D seg.

I think if you don't have the budget for an expensive choice you'll go for the one that is easy and cheap to maintain. And that is usually P1, P2 or Toyota. You can't afford to deal with hard to find and expensive spareparts.


mat79
post Jan 11 2012, 09:35 PM

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its just up to ur opinion kadajawi :-), then,persona n gen2 shud be the cheapest c segment,not only in malaysia, but out there, but then, people still complaining about it price.(according to ur opinion lah, not mine)

but reading others, fiesta is never golf n jetta contender, mazda 2 also the same. I dunno whether out there auto journo compare glf n jetta with fiest@mazda 2, or they compare it to focus@mazda 3???

But it seems golf n jetta is compare with focus n mazda 3.

By the way,it seems good for prtn coz atleast somebody manage to see it as c segment, so since p321a is bigger n longer, so now it become accord n camry rival in d segment :-). It is a good sign actually. U get d segment car, at b segment price.

Hopefully the best for proton,make us proud.
kadajawi
post Jan 12 2012, 12:07 AM

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Well, the Fiesta hatch is most def B segment, even if it's a slightly big one. Will the addition of a boot make it C segment? No clue... probably not.

Fiesta is the same category with Clio, Polo and Corsa. Myvi too, IMHO. There is usually no sedan for these small cars in Germany (there used to be a Polo sedan, but that wasn't exactly successful). Other European countries may have a sedan version.

Btw. it's very uncommon to say A, B or C segment in Germany. I think A segment is considered Kleinstwagen, meaning smallest possible car. B segment is Kleinwagen, small car. Then there is the Golf-Klasse... Golf category, named after the benchmark VW Golf. Also called Kompaktklasse (compact). Mittelklasse would be D segment, something like a Passat, Mondeo, 3 series BMW or C class. Obere Mittelklasse is above that... 5 series, E class, A6, ... and finally Oberklasse (S class, 7 series, A8). Is there any segment that describes those cars here?

I'm not sure if the P321a will be big enough to be considered D segment. C segment probably, but on the upper end, while the Persona is on the lower end.

Btw., Wikipedia says the Gen-2 is C segment. It is longer than the Golf, which is clearly considered C segment.
mat79
post Jan 12 2012, 09:25 AM

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good info about germans make,and actually knowing about it too. Even in same segment, civic n altis is still not 3 series direct competitor nor c class merc.

But wiki, dont depend on it 100% coz it is editable,but still can get useful info. P321 is upper b sub c segment,like forte, 1.6 to compete with b as vios n city, 2.0 with civic n altis in malaysia.

Anyway,good info kadajawi. Really apreciate things that u share.
turbocharged
post Jan 12 2012, 09:31 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 03:31 PM)
Saga is not relevant to compare to vios, coz even without tax, its still cheaper than vios. True competitor is persona elegance n gen2.

Just wait for p321a, it is direct competitor with vios n city, with same tax applied, n judge whether prtn can do better or not compare to vios@city.

Dont talk about old tax structure coz we are now in 2012. Happy motoring.


Added on January 11, 2012, 3:33 pmjust wait whether p321a premium is par with inspira @ rm80 below or better or lesser.

*
oh, so the P321a is a competitor to inspira/civic/altis/slyphy?

2012 , we using new tax structure? but, how come price still same? rclxub.gif rclxub.gif rclxub.gif

if 2012, there is a significant change in the car price i understand. the price it self is not change. in fact, its getting higher and higher.

last time waja 60k. now persona 60k. persona is smaller. yes inflation inflation.


Added on January 12, 2012, 9:32 am
QUOTE(kadajawi @ Jan 12 2012, 12:07 AM)
Well, the Fiesta hatch is most def B segment, even if it's a slightly big one. Will the addition of a boot make it C segment? No clue... probably not.

Fiesta is the same category with Clio, Polo and Corsa. Myvi too, IMHO. There is usually no sedan for these small cars in Germany (there used to be a Polo sedan, but that wasn't exactly successful). Other European countries may have a sedan version.

Btw. it's very uncommon to say A, B or C segment in Germany. I think A segment is considered Kleinstwagen, meaning smallest possible car. B segment is Kleinwagen, small car. Then there is the Golf-Klasse... Golf category, named after the benchmark VW Golf. Also called Kompaktklasse (compact). Mittelklasse would be D segment, something like a Passat, Mondeo, 3 series BMW or C class. Obere Mittelklasse is above that... 5 series, E class, A6, ... and finally Oberklasse (S class, 7 series, A8). Is there any segment that describes those cars here?

I'm not sure if the P321a will be big enough to be considered D segment. C segment probably, but on the upper end, while the Persona is on the lower end.

Btw., Wikipedia says the Gen-2 is C segment. It is longer than the Golf, which is clearly considered C segment.
*
i assure you myvi interior is roomier than golf smile.gif

but no way myvi is a c segment car biggrin.gif


Added on January 12, 2012, 9:39 am
QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 05:20 PM)

If u have the opportunity to know asian max 1600 challenge which satria neo won previously, that is the cars in b segment, such as city,vios,yaris, jazz, swift, pug 207,gen2,neo n etc.


*
can you share details of this? i only see a news statement in paultan. nobody knows where and what this is.

maybe they race among satria neo and persona?

This post has been edited by turbocharged: Jan 12 2012, 09:39 AM
0300078
post Jan 12 2012, 09:49 AM

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anyway how they judged the segment of the car one? By the roominess of car?
Some car looks big outside when sit in feel so small.
turbocharged
post Jan 12 2012, 10:01 AM

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the best small car with big interior is myvi and jazz.

myvi interior is unbelievable. esp rear seat. pwns inspira and civic
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post Jan 12 2012, 11:30 AM

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In this case does anyone knows what the final pricing for Exora Bold are? Are they the same as the tentative price which was published end of last year?
sphiroth
post Jan 12 2012, 11:49 AM

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Mat79, it is a really good info on the tax system we have. I considered myself quite knowledgeable in car industry (<-syok sendiri :-P) but never knew the new tax system. May I suggest you opened a new thread about this tax structure since many of us is still in the dark about it. notworthy.gif
turbocharged
post Jan 12 2012, 11:51 AM

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QUOTE(sphiroth @ Jan 12 2012, 11:49 AM)
Mat79, it is a really good info on the tax system we have. I considered myself quite knowledgeable in car industry (<-syok sendiri :-P) but never knew the new tax system. May I suggest you opened a new thread about this tax structure since many of us is still in the dark about it. notworthy.gif
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it doesnt matter if the price still the same.

change name and this and that. sleep.gif
sranua
post Jan 12 2012, 12:28 PM

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Hi everybody,
Finally after reading so many positive comment on the Bold, I got a chance for test drive. The route is a combination of hilly, twisty and city road where pick up is essential to move the bigger body compared to sedan car.
Firts impression, nice colour, nice sporty kit, bigger tyre compared to CPS. Leather seat quite nice but not body hugging. Dashboard just like ordinary modern car. Just that in reverse gear, a small picture at the back of Exora should be helpful to reverse safely. Bonus point here as we sometime read some people bang the toddler or their son while reversing.
Pick up is the plus point here, in which the engine need not to be stressed, just hovering around 2000 rpm it will easily bypass Myvi while climbing a hill. So for a MPV with bigger body with small engine 1.6 its a boon to the driver.
NVH - it was really quiet in the Bold. No intrusion of noise from the car and motor from the outside. Very relaxing. Handling is the best character of Proton cars since Gen2, so Bold take a sweeping long corner with guts and confidence. The Lotus Ride and handling emulates in the MPV show how much Proton had improved. No need to install aftermarket absorber. The steering just nice, with audio button.
Thumbs up to the powertrain department and Ride & Handling Dept or whatever the name is...That Tngku Djan still Head of Dept I guess.
Overall, its big, spacious for family trip and good pick up at lower rpm. At 1.6 engine with just RM90.00 roadtax, could save around RM300.00 if take other model that run on 2.0 engine. With that money, can spend at Umbai for Ikan Bakar or expensive Timberland shirts ha..ha laugh.gif

This post has been edited by sranua: Jan 12 2012, 12:32 PM
kadajawi
post Jan 12 2012, 01:59 PM

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Thanks mat79, same thing goes to you. I second the wish for a post where the tax structure is explained, and make it sticky. Some people still think there is 300% tax and all.

Aren't Civic and Altis considered C segment? The Civic is "Golf-Klasse" in Germany, they have stopped selling the Corolla and replaced it with the Auris (if you ask me a stupid decision, but they thought the Corolla name was too uncle... they needed something fresh. And then the first car under the Auris name was just a boring Corolla, yet again, so the name also quickly got considered boring and undesirable. Why not release an exciting car under the Corolla brand? People quickly look through a simple name change).

It's really hard to categorize cars in segments. I'd say Audi, Merc and BMW are usually premium in whatever segment they are (except for the big ones, there you just expect that sort of quality).

@turbocharged: You haven't sat in a Kangoo then. First time I sat inside I thought the car has no roof laugh.gif Leg room is also not bad, for such a small car that seats 7.

One of the problems with taxes is that people are used to pay a lot. So when the taxes go down, the companies still charge as much as before, they simply make more profit. Also when only a certain segment is tax exempt, such as hybrids, they can't price it at a lower level than their other cars. Who would buy a normal VW when the Jetta hybrid costs less than even a Polo? The only companies who can do that are those who are not in Malaysia yet or are only selling cars in totally different segments. Renault comes to mind, however they are imported by TC, and TC also has Nissan, and Nissan sells regular cars too.

I'd love to see some magazine/website to compare the Exora Bold vs. all other MPVs, i.e. Avanza, Alza, and also S-Max and Cross Touran (I know they are 2x as expensive, but what if the Exora can actually (almost) reach them?
Deja Vu
post Jan 12 2012, 03:29 PM

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QUOTE(kadajawi @ Jan 12 2012, 01:59 PM)
I'd love to see some magazine/website to compare the Exora Bold vs. all other MPVs, i.e. Avanza, Alza, and also S-Max and Cross Touran (I know they are 2x as expensive, but what if the Exora can actually (almost) reach them?
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Test drove d Bold CVT couple of wks ago. Totally beats other sub-RM100K MPVs hands down.

Mayb s'one should hv a show down between d 1.8 Grand Livina, 2.0 Innova, Rush, Cherry 2.0 MPV, n mayb throw in d Wish , Honda Freed & Stream coz of price.

As for foreign vs local car prices, no doubt d taxes has painted some rather one-sided perception on branding vs quality/value for money. Furthermore, P1 definately screwed up ppl's respect last time resulting wats happening now.
neo1point3
post Jan 12 2012, 04:02 PM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Jan 12 2012, 10:01 AM)
the best small car with big interior is myvi and jazz.

myvi interior is unbelievable. esp rear seat. pwns inspira and civic
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yeap. Because the car is higher so there is more space for leg. Kenari also like that
mat79
post Jan 12 2012, 05:23 PM

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turbocharged,it is under asian speed fest n festival,it is in 2009. Prtn won the podium,both cars,both neos. The circuit in sepang,thai n indonesia. But dunno why they stop the competion afterwards,conspiracy maybe coz if u look at the competitors, mainly them are manufactured in thai n indo. Just plain thought.

The same price coz some manufacturers enjoying higher profit due to tax lifting. Why need to reduce price when people still thinking 300% tax n they can enjoy higher profit since people still buying it at the same sales figure from year to year. Some, reducing profit margin to cater market coz the brand itself is not strong in malaysia market.

Just refer to customs website n maa n miti for futher info. Malas nak tulis coz too long to explain coz too much too cover. Just read from the source shall we. I also has sonata ap paperwork,cannot publish,nanti my friend kena coz it pnc. Nanti depa tau kat mana paperwork tuh coz ada mcm2 data. Safely to say that their traders profit is a whooping rm 70k.

The new nap is to abide wto rules n regulations,not afta which already fully abide since 2010, for cars already since 2009. So,according to nap, cbu 30% n 10% ckd non asean cept will be abolish, so,asean japanese n koreans cars, peroduamthey will have to prepared to face the european wave starting this year, n i believe prtn already prepared with p321a,p322a n gsc :-)
turbocharged
post Jan 12 2012, 05:24 PM

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so ,same la, end of the day, consumer is still loser. T_T
V12Kompressor
post Jan 12 2012, 06:16 PM

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QUOTE(turbocharged @ Jan 12 2012, 05:24 PM)
so ,same la, end of the day, consumer is still loser. T_T
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in the business world, consumer always lose wad. laugh.gif

just like wan tan mee, the seller might profit Rm2 per plate out of the RM 4.50 he charged. The only "consolation prize" we get is, we walked out with a full stomach.
turbocharged
post Jan 12 2012, 07:34 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Jan 12 2012, 06:16 PM)
in the business world, consumer always lose wad. laugh.gif

just like wan tan mee, the seller might profit Rm2 per plate out of the RM 4.50 he charged. The only "consolation prize" we get is, we walked out with a full stomach.
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full stomach is a must.

full stomach, and will come back again with a smile= win

full stomach, and will come back again but not stop cursing = lose

sad.gif
danabu
post Jan 12 2012, 08:19 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 12 2012, 05:23 PM)
turbocharged,it is under asian speed fest n festival,it is in 2009. Prtn won the podium,both cars,both neos. The circuit in sepang,thai n indonesia. But dunno why they stop the competion afterwards,conspiracy maybe coz if u look at the competitors, mainly them are manufactured in thai n indo. Just plain thought.

The same price coz some manufacturers enjoying higher profit due to tax lifting. Why need to reduce price when people still thinking 300% tax n they can enjoy higher profit since people still buying it at the same sales figure from year to year. Some, reducing profit margin to cater market coz the brand itself is not strong in malaysia market.

Just refer to customs website n maa n miti for futher info. Malas nak tulis coz too long to explain coz too much too cover. Just read from the source shall we. I also has sonata ap paperwork,cannot publish,nanti my friend kena coz it pnc. Nanti depa tau kat mana paperwork tuh coz ada mcm2 data. Safely to say that their traders profit is a whooping rm 70k.

The new nap is to abide wto rules n regulations,not afta which already fully abide since 2010, for cars already since 2009. So,according to nap, cbu 30% n 10% ckd non asean cept will be abolish, so,asean japanese n koreans cars, peroduamthey will have to prepared to face the european wave starting this year, n i believe prtn already prepared with p321a,p322a n gsc :-)
*
What model is p322a??
kadajawi
post Jan 12 2012, 09:33 PM

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Ok, so... I have checked before that a RM 80k Fiesta is worth almost 20k Euro in Germany... due to all the kit it comes with (it's 18k, but that is for the 1.6 as a manual... no PowerShift/DSG in Germany), and usually that's a 1-2k option. In this trim the German one also has headlights and wipers that turn on and off automatically.

Let me check the Yaris. It's a bit harder to compare since the specs are very different, and it is the latest Yaris (Vitz), not yet launched in Malaysia. The only auto box the Yaris gets is a CVT one, so I opt for the manual 6 speed and try to compare it with the entry level Vios. Biggest engine you can get is a 1.33 (or 1.4 diesel). The 1.33 outputs 99 hp, so it is a bit weaker than the 1.5L unit, but gets a better gearbox. Also the Yaris in base spec gets: 7 airbags, electronic stability control, traction control, ABS (well, they don't even bother to mention it, but it would be very weird to have ESC and TC but no ABS and BA) and 3 point seatbelts everywhere. The cool spec (necessary to get the option to go for the "big" engine) adds aircon and 15"... steel rims biggrin.gif .

It costs 15100 Euro.

If you want the car with the CVT gearbox you will have to upgrade to "Life", which will also give you rearview camera (for such a small car...), rpm meter (uuuhm... really?), soft touch instead of hard plastic everywhere, buttons on the steering wheel, leather steering wheel and gearknob, 6 speakers and a 6.1" screen multimedia thing.

With the manual gearbox it costs 15850 Euro, 17070 Euro with the CVT gearbox. Actually that is a pretty decent deal. Base price is around 11000 btw., for entry level everything, it won't even have aircon then (but 7 airbags and ESC/TC).

One has to note that both are hatchbacks, the sedans aren't sold. If they were, it would probably cost another 1000 or so more.

More or less the price in Germany and Malaysia match (a bit cheaper in Germany, and of course they should earn more (but they also have to pay off their cars faster than Malaysians with their super long hire loans)). However the Toyota Yaris is a few k cheaper and much better equipped than the Vios, especially in terms of safety. Euro spec and Malay spec Fiesta are quite similar, although I'd say the Malaysian spec is better.

The exchange rate is 1:4 today.

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Jan 12 2012, 09:35 PM
mat79
post Jan 12 2012, 10:42 PM

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thats why its hard to compare with other countries coz sometimes, even they assembly it in diff country for diff market. Same as beemer, if u check around the world, the price is not the same, the spec also sometimes not the same. Just get the info on docket price@manufacturer price from customs,it help u to figure out. Why not visit www.funtastickodesign.wordpress.com, the data is available to download from there :-).

P322a, neo 4 doors :-), just joking,its actually hatchback version for p321a, with a little sporty look, n cfe engine will get the manual trans, 6 speed getrag. If everything run according to plan, will be introduce in 2013, just wait for the spyshots, i think will be available in march, if only someone manage to spot the car, he..he..

P321a is not the best car in the segment, but it is capable. soft plastic sir,if u mind....:-)
V12Kompressor
post Jan 12 2012, 10:47 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 12 2012, 10:42 PM)
P322a, neo 4 doors :-), just joking,its actually hatchback version for p321a, with a little sporty look, n cfe engine will get the manual trans, 6 speed getrag. If everything run according to plan, will be introduce in 2013, just wait for the spyshots, i think will be available in march, if only someone manage to spot the car, he..he..
*
owh, that explains the Astra Turbo that always tag along with the P3221 mules.
kadajawi
post Jan 12 2012, 10:49 PM

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QUOTE(V12Kompressor @ Jan 12 2012, 10:47 PM)
owh, that explains the Astra Turbo that always tag along with the P3221 mules.
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It does? Didn't notice...

@mat79: Cause I didn't know that site. tongue.gif Is it yours? Unfortunately I will have to ask google translate to read it... biggrin.gif
0300078
post Jan 13 2012, 07:38 AM

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the specs of car is based on the customer... so end of the day most of the Brands here still think that Malaysian are dumb arse that care less about their owned safety. And those company handling local market one also care less about their customer they just want money. The Prius C got 7 Airbag why? Becoz tat car was for the Japan market.... if it were made for this market i guess u will be happy if it has 2 airbag.
SUSkimsim
post Jan 13 2012, 07:57 AM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 12 2012, 10:42 PM)
thats why its hard to compare with other countries coz sometimes, even they assembly it in diff country for diff market. Same as beemer, if u check around the world, the price is not the same, the spec also sometimes not the same. Just get the info on docket price@manufacturer price from customs,it help u to figure out. Why not visit www.funtastickodesign.wordpress.com, the data is available to download from there :-).

P322a, neo 4 doors :-), just joking,its actually hatchback version for p321a, with a little sporty look, n cfe engine will get the manual trans, 6 speed getrag. If everything run according to plan, will be introduce in 2013, just wait for the spyshots, i think will be available in march, if only someone manage to spot the car, he..he..

P321a is not the best car in the segment, but it is capable.  soft plastic sir,if u mind....:-)
*
Hi, Mat

Are you works from proton company and thier send you to LYN market and do research?

Thanks, I just wondering to know about your background smile.gif

Cause you knew the proton news as much more.
mat79
post Jan 13 2012, 10:25 AM

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ha..ha..not working with them. But have to admit knowing some important people inside which been my friends n insiders.

Yup,there are problems n weakness here n there, but they are trying their best effort right now. U know la, masalah birokrasi, uncapable cronies n etc. Rnd team actually do their best from the start, but being hampered by others after that. Thats why many of them actually sad with what happened, n people in malaysia blamming the rnd people, while they are doing really good job, name it design team, engineering team,hnt team n etc. But u know,they are not the one who make decission, selection of vendors n etc. They done their job, after that its up to others to continue it.


Added on January 13, 2012, 10:26 amnot my blogs,but my friend's blog, n always sharing something there.

This post has been edited by mat79: Jan 13 2012, 10:26 AM
imin
post Jan 13 2012, 02:26 PM

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about all these taxes.. means if we bawak sendiri car from other country to malaysia, it'll be much cheaper, right? we won't need to pay same price of the vehicle sold here?
Longy
post Jan 13 2012, 04:15 PM

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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 11 2012, 10:38 AM)
one more thing,if u press the pedal more than 85% of throttle, full cvt mode will change to slow mode sat, which cause the rpm raise slowly to upper rev,not jump up like in cvt.

There are a lot of cvt tech that we need to learn on,not just wiki,it is full of tech, they way it works also diff than conv at.

Thats why nowadays, they opt to single clutch,dual clutch n cvt trans rather than conv torque converter at. But still some still using it since it is already well known n well verse.
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Mat 79, Thank for all explanations here. I have already booked EB after a couple of test drives, just waiting for the delivery. I really feel for the ground staffs of Proton, although the Top Management would have screwed up . I am happy to support Proton one more time and hope this time they will really stand up.

danabu
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QUOTE(mat79 @ Jan 13 2012, 10:25 AM)
ha..ha..not working with them. But have to admit knowing some important people inside which been my friends n insiders.

Yup,there are problems n weakness here n there, but they are trying their best effort right now. U know la, masalah birokrasi, uncapable cronies n etc. Rnd team actually do their best from the start, but being hampered by others after that. Thats why many of them actually sad with what happened, n people in malaysia blamming the rnd people, while they are doing really good job, name it design team, engineering team,hnt team n etc. But u know,they are not the one who make decission, selection of vendors n etc. They done their job, after that its up to others to continue it.


Added on January 13, 2012, 10:26 amnot my blogs,but my friend's blog, n always sharing something there.
*
I always belive in Malaysia if without influences from politics, most of the GLCs can perform much better then now.

We should be still the same league with S. Korea, HK & Singapore as in 1980s. But now we are in the same league with Indonesia, Thailand and Vietnam. Hopefully next time not Laos, Myanmar and Phlipine.
0300078
post Jan 13 2012, 05:24 PM

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i think Vietnam, Thailand and Indonesia are climbing over our head loh....

heard from a Indonesian..... why Malaysia here development so slow? They have been developing rapidly in this few years time.

Vietnam.... those vietnam worker i used to hired in my factory.... went back to vietnam told me that they can get better paid and work in Vietnam than in Malaysia.

diablos
post Jan 13 2012, 10:07 PM

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Today went to the shop... ask my dealer.... she say silver might get after CNY.... so sad ..... sad.gif

This post has been edited by diablos: Jan 13 2012, 10:07 PM
ntc2000
post Jan 13 2012, 11:00 PM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Jan 13 2012, 10:07 PM)
Today went to the shop... ask my dealer.... she say silver might get after CNY.... so sad ..... sad.gif
*
i change to get elegant brown alr..
diablos
post Jan 13 2012, 11:01 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 13 2012, 11:00 PM)
i change to get elegant brown alr..
*
I was offered too.... but my wife like silver... so I got no choice but to wait... sad.gif
mutt
post Jan 14 2012, 02:56 AM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(diablos @ Jan 13 2012, 11:01 PM)
I was offered too.... but my wife like silver... so I got no choice but to wait... sad.gif
*
I saw silver Exora Bold on the road already. Quite handsome brows.gif
V12Kompressor
post Jan 14 2012, 10:44 AM

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QUOTE(mutt @ Jan 14 2012, 02:56 AM)
I saw silver Exora Bold on the road already. Quite handsome  brows.gif
*
ada cucuk ah brows.gif
ntc2000
post Jan 14 2012, 11:44 AM

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QUOTE(diablos @ Jan 13 2012, 11:01 PM)
I was offered too.... but my wife like silver... so I got no choice but to wait... sad.gif
*
my wifey also like silver, but elegant brown still in my choice list... Last 2 weeks, SA told me 2011 silver got stock, but i plan to get 2012 car. if silver, need to wait till feb.

Next tuesday or wednesday going to take car, now waiting for WWG number plate to open... WWF number almost sold out, i wait for WWG.

how long u have to wait silver color?


Added on January 14, 2012, 11:45 am
QUOTE(mutt @ Jan 14 2012, 02:56 AM)
I saw silver Exora Bold on the road already. Quite handsome  brows.gif
*
probably 2011 showroom or testdrive unit.

This post has been edited by ntc2000: Jan 14 2012, 11:45 AM
mat_tepets
post Jan 14 2012, 02:54 PM

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user posted image

putih ada, elegent brown ada, silver ada

aku punya elegent brown biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by mat_tepets: Jan 14 2012, 02:55 PM
diablos
post Jan 14 2012, 08:09 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 14 2012, 11:44 AM)
my wifey also like silver, but elegant brown still in my choice list... Last 2 weeks, SA told me 2011 silver got stock, but i plan to get 2012 car. if silver, need to wait till feb.

Next tuesday or wednesday going to take car, now waiting for WWG number plate to open... WWF number almost sold out, i wait for WWG.

how long u have to wait silver color?


Added on January 14, 2012, 11:45 am
probably 2011 showroom or testdrive unit.
*
they told me after cny. ....... about 31 Jan
ntc2000
post Jan 16 2012, 08:40 PM

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got my car alr...

diablos
post Jan 16 2012, 09:54 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 16 2012, 08:40 PM)
got my car alr...
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Elegant Brown? Congratz!!!!!!
ultramaman
post Jan 17 2012, 04:28 AM

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wah, congrats


Added on January 17, 2012, 7:31 amhows the car?


This post has been edited by ultramaman: Jan 17 2012, 07:31 AM
imin
post Jan 17 2012, 04:52 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 16 2012, 08:40 PM)
got my car alr...
*
review please biggrin.gif
Swordsmen
post Jan 17 2012, 05:17 PM

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Attention to all potential buyers, be known that after the new platform ( tuah ) launching, the Exora engine will be updated to Mivec 1.8 & 2.0 and the cfe still on the list, so you had lot of choices after this

This post has been edited by Swordsmen: Jan 17 2012, 05:18 PM
ntc2000
post Jan 17 2012, 05:41 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 05:17 PM)
Attention to all potential buyers, be known that after the new platform ( tuah ) launching, the Exora engine will be updated to Mivec 1.8 & 2.0 and the cfe still on the list, so you had lot of choices after this
*
u mean tuah will have mivec 1.8, 2.0 and cfe?

i dont think they gonna have this kind of arrangement.


Added on January 17, 2012, 5:43 pm
QUOTE(diablos @ Jan 16 2012, 09:54 PM)
Elegant Brown? Congratz!!!!!!
*
yup... thanks bro.


Added on January 17, 2012, 5:45 pm
QUOTE(imin @ Jan 17 2012, 04:52 PM)
review please biggrin.gif
*
will do.. need some times to molest this car 1st.

This post has been edited by ntc2000: Jan 17 2012, 05:45 PM
ultramaman
post Jan 17 2012, 05:48 PM

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pictures...
MR_alien
post Jan 17 2012, 07:28 PM

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QUOTE(ntc2000 @ Jan 17 2012, 05:41 PM)
u mean tuah will have mivec 1.8, 2.0 and cfe?

i dont think they gonna have this kind of arrangement.
*
i think is small FL
i think proton is aiming reliable engine(timing chain) and power at the same time
Swordsmen
post Jan 17 2012, 08:17 PM

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read careful my posts, EXORA will be using the mivec not tuah.. tuah using current cfe
xshiro
post Jan 17 2012, 08:26 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 08:17 PM)
read careful my posts, EXORA will be using the mivec not tuah.. tuah using current cfe
*
macam macam..pening, too many choices, diesel ada? tongue.gif
diablos
post Jan 17 2012, 10:10 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 08:17 PM)
read careful my posts, EXORA will be using the mivec not tuah.. tuah using current cfe
*
any sos?
blackmarket
post Jan 17 2012, 10:13 PM

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where u get the info? any idea the upcoming new sedan aka tuah will cost how much?
V12Kompressor
post Jan 17 2012, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 05:17 PM)
Attention to all potential buyers, be known that after the new platform ( tuah ) launching, the Exora engine will be updated to Mivec 1.8 & 2.0 and the cfe still on the list, so you had lot of choices after this
*
hi bang,

bebola kristal jenama apa u pakai?
TSericmaxman
post Jan 17 2012, 10:22 PM

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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 05:17 PM)
Attention to all potential buyers, be known that after the new platform ( tuah ) launching, the Exora engine will be updated to Mivec 1.8 & 2.0 and the cfe still on the list, so you had lot of choices after this
*
hmm.gif

interesting news there..
mutt
post Jan 17 2012, 11:41 PM

please pronounce my nick as 'mood/mut' not 'mud/mat
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QUOTE(Swordsmen @ Jan 17 2012, 05:17 PM)
Attention to all potential buyers, be known that after the new platform ( tuah ) launching, the Exora engine will be updated to Mivec 1.8 & 2.0 and the cfe still on the list, so you had lot of choices after this
*
Last time I heard Exora will be using 1.8 CPS end up using 1.6 CPS and the 1.8 CPS just remain as rumors only.

Without source or atleast valid point why Proton will use Mivec engine your word can be taken as 100% BS..

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