Disclaimer: This is a generalization and possibly a stereotype ... but these are all based on truths at some point.

This is an article about "Nice Guys" vs "Jerks", the terms used by people who like to talk about women walking all over "nice guys" and preferring to date "jerks". I don't know how much clearer you want this to be. Using "nice guys" is NOT misleading. There are the insecure "nice guys" and the "genuine nice guys"

I also NEVER claimed this to be my own - http://www.heartless-b****es.com/rants/nic.../niceguys.shtml

Why "Nice Guys" are often such LOSERS

You hear it all the time: "He was such a NICE Guy, and she's such a Heartless b**** for dumping him."

I get letters from self-professed Nice Guys, complaining that women must WANT to be treated like shit, because THEY, the "Nice Guy" have failed repeatedly in relationships. This is akin to the false logic that "Whales are mammals. Whales live in the sea. Therefore, all mammals live in the sea."

If you have one bad relationship after another, the only common denominator is YOU. Think about it.

What's wrong with Nice Guys? The biggest problem is that most Nice Guys ™ are hideously insecure. They are so anxious to be liked and loved that they do things for other people to gain acceptance and attention, rather than for the simply pleasure of giving. You never know if a Nice Guy really likes you for who you are, or if he has glommed onto you out of desperation because you actually paid some kind of attention to him.

Nice Guys exude insecurity -- a big red target for the predators of the world. There are women out there who are "users" -- just looking for a sucker to take advantage of. Users home-in on "Nice Guys", stroke their egos, take them for a ride, add a notch to their belts, and move on. It's no wonder so many Nice Guys complain about women being horrible, when so often the kind of woman that gets attracted to them is the lowest form of life...

Self-confident, caring, decent-hearted women find "Nice Guys" to be too clingy, self-abasing, and insecure.

Nice Guys go overboard. They bring roses to a "lets get together for coffee" date. They try to buy her affections with presents and fancy things. They think they know about romance, but their timing is all wrong, and they either come-on too strong, too hard and too fast, OR, they are so shy and unassertive, that they hang around pretending to be "friends", in the hope that somehow, someway, they will get the courage up to ask her out for a "date".

They are so desperate to please that they put aside their own needs, and place the object of their desire on a pedestal. Instead of appreciating her, they worship her. We are only human, and pedestals are narrow, confining places to be -- not to mention the fact that we tend to fall off of them.

They cling to her, and want to be "one" with her for fear that if she is out of sight, she may disappear or become attracted to someone else. A Nice Guy often has trouble with emotional intimacy, because he believes that if she learns about the REAL person inside, she will no longer love him.

Nice Guys are always asking HER to make the decisions. They think it's being equitable, but it puts an unfair burden of responsibility on her, and gives him the opportunity to blame her if the decision was an unwise one.

Nice Guys rarely speak up when something bothers them, and rarely state clearly what it is they want, need and expect. They fear that any kind of conflict might spell the end of the relationship. Instead of compromising and negotiating, they repeatedly "give in". When she doesn't appreciate their sacrifice, they will complain that, "Everything I did, I did for her.", as if this somehow elevates them to the status of martyrs. A woman doesn't want a martyr. She wants an equal, caring, adult partner.

Nice Guys think that they will never meet anyone as special as she is. They use their adoration as a foundation for claiming that "no one will ever love her as much as I do." Instead of being a profound statement of their devotion, this is a subtle, but nasty insult. It is akin to saying to her: "You are a difficult person, and only *I* can ever truly love you, so be thankful I'm here."

The nice guy -needs- to believe that he is the best person for the object of his desires, because otherwise his insecurities will overrun him with jealousies and fear. The truth of the matter is that there are many people out there who can be a good match for her. We rarely stop loving people we truly care about. Even if we no longer continue the relationship, the feelings will continue... But love isn't mutually exclusive. We can (and do) love many people in our lives, and romantic love is really no different. Though he may love her immensely, there will likely be other people who have loved her just as much in her past, and will love her just as much in the future. The irony of it all is: "Who would want to go out with someone who was inherently unlovable anyways?"

More than loving the woman in his life, a Nice Guy NEEDS her. "She is my Life, my only source of happiness..." YECH! What kind of a burden is that to place on her? That SHE has to be responsible for YOUR happiness? Get a grip!

Another mistake Nice Guys make is to go after "hard luck" cases. They deliberately pick women with neuroses, problems, and personality disorders, because Nice Guys are "helpers". A Nice Guy thinks that by "helping" this woman, it will make him a better, more lovable person. He thinks it will give him a sense of accomplishment, and that she will appreciate and love him more, for all his efforts and sacrifice. He is usually disappointed by the results.

This ultimately boils down to the fact that Nice Guys don't like themselves. Is it any wonder women don't like them? In order to truly love someone else, you must first love yourself. Too often Nice Guys mistake obsession for "love".

Get this Guys: INSECURITY ISN'T SEXY. IT'S A TURNOFF.

You don't have to be an ego-inflated, arrogant jerk. You just have to LIKE yourself. You have to know what you want out of life, and go after it. Only then will you be attractive to the kind of woman with whom a long-term relationship is possible.
~~~

And the whole LOT of you, with a few exceptions, disgust me with your insecurities.
Grow up.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 16 2010, 11:11 PM

Good article. Though I think you should rename it as 'insecure guys'. Don't make 'nice guys' sound so bad lah... Real 'nice guys' aren't insecure about who they are, they're confident that they can make a girl happy, AND achieve success in the relationship.

The example above sounds more like a typical loser, doesn't rhyme with me as a 'nice guy'.

This post has been edited by ace.princess: Oct 16 2010, 04:40 AM

Quite a long post huh? I actually finish reading it.
Anyway is Spunkberry so happen to be bs3 ' Strawberry'?

Btw normally guys called themselves nice guy probably not a nice guy.
A nice guy would NEVER call himself a nice guy. Most of the time ppl around call them so if he really is.

In my opinion a nice guy would always know what he wanted in his life like above mention. And knows how to play with the pull and let go string concept. haha

This "nice guy" syndrome has also been expounded in more detail in the book No More Mr Nice Guy by Robert Glover.

That's no nice guy, that's a somewhat pathetic guy....though Im half of it...haha. But true, its just pathetic when you NEED a girl. It makes as if like without them, you'd die of a horrid suffocation which strangles your esophagus and turns your face blue. =|

thumbs up spunkberry!

this is an interesting articles I must say.

hence the "nice guy" quotation marks. this is a generalized view of what the nice guys really are ... the doormats I call around here, the ones that cater to every whim and fancy of their girlfriends.

Yes I am bs3 strawberry.

This part I dont agree.The "hard luck" cases are the ones who needs 'nice guys'.
If not, you want to pair them with who?

But I dont think anyone has that mentality that by helping someone, the person will love him more.Anyone who thinks that way is an idiota.


I have to say something cos you struck a nerve.
During highschool, I fell for a girl with a phobia for rain.

Shes cute,sweet, smart, and polite, but when its rain, shed cry( it was something traumatic in her childhood )
Due to this, she wont go to school if its rain,
and she will be 'missing' if it ever rain when shes in school
(the teachers knew, I went through a lot to know about it)

Dating her was hard with her overprotective family and all
I was so serious about our relationship, that Id refer to her father as my father in law to my friends
I went as far as reading books to help her

But in the end, I couldnt help her, and decided to let her go
cos I cant stand watching her cry everytime its raining.
I mean, I could be by her side and lend her a shoulder everytime,
we could live somewhere where it doesnt rain(yup, I thought about things so far ahead..lol)
but when her pains become your pain, its really hard


Now, my question is,
is a nice guy for her or not?

Is she better off with a person not caring about her enough that can stand watching her cry everytime?

Or a person like me who CANT stand her condition and wishes to help her in any way possible?
(ppl like me, later sure cant tahan watch her suffer, then leave her broken-hearted )

But we all know, the BEST person for her is THAT "nice guy", who can both stand her conditions even though it pains him,
and tries his best to cure her.


TL,DR:
Hard luck cases are where the nice guys are needed.You wont survive if you're not "nice" enough.

she doesn't need a nice guy. she needs to get over that fear. Her issues aren't anybody's to handle except herself. if her phobia drives every guy away, then that's her problem not his.

.....so the point is, u need to balance being a douche and a nice guy?

cant believe that i actually feel better after reading this article...wow!

It sounded more like asking the guys to just get over their own insecurities. There is nothing wrong in being nice to the girl that you like. Whether she will interpreted it as a good will from you or not is another story.

Heck, the title "nice guys" sound a bit misleading.

This post has been edited by spitfire111: Oct 16 2010, 12:13 PM

+1000000000

quote from family guy:

"women like it when we treat them like crap dont they?"

hahah, somehow, i think that applies here. not really like crap, but u know what i mean.. hopefully

typical close minded person.
doctor also cant help.
if its so easy, shed already over it.

just try put yourself in her shoes la.early childhood already went something so traumatic.
you think she didnt try to be brave?
ppl like her la the ones who try to show that they are brave, cos some things are just out of their control.
she tries hard, every day of her life, and it really shows

just imagine
you have a really effing good photographic memory,
everytime rain, your worst nightmare flashes vividly before you, and tears will flow.
being reminded of the worst part of your life is one thing, and then theres ppl around staring at you and wonder "wtf?".

just so you know, youre the kind of person that makes ppl like her have a hard time.
shes good looking, smart, this one weakness she have, and ppl like you shoot her.

If she's ugly and not smart, I cant imagine.

I guess some ppl are unsympathetic and only can relate to someone else's problem if it were his/hers

This article only proves that my theory is becoming a more logical path... lol!

Men should learn to behave that relationships and sex are secondary needs rather than behaving as though "no gf = failure"...

Men should focus in a career and get proper education to enhance himself... Let's face it, even you get a b**** and she divorces you and runs away with your money, you'd still have a career and education to rely on to build yourself up...

I posted this because I believe there needs to be a balance...

This post has been edited by Flaming_lion: Oct 16 2010, 02:16 PM

I had an epiphany after reading this. Thanks for sharing.

Y the source of the article was not credited?

http://www.heartless-b****es.com/rants/nic.../niceguys.shtml

'Nice guy" is nothing but a self-proclaim delusion.

it's simple guys....
u get laid, u wont whine, end of story.

"Mr. Nice Guys" in relationship always meks the mistake of...."i respect her decision" or "it's against her/my religion" & "v will safe for marriage".

u gotta try to laid ur gf.....be a "Mr. Naughty"
den the day u got dump (if dat shall happen), u'll hav less regret, & u wont whine.

hahahaha

You deserve a "Thank you" from me.It is really helpful.

thanks for this, i feel good lol, half of me is this kind of person , dang

http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1542094

It was posted before

Yes, but smacking self proclaimed nice guys around never gets old.

if doctors can't even help, what makes you think having the perfect boyfriend is going to help her?
if someone is suicidal, you can try to talk them out of it ... but if they end up going through with it, you bear no responsibility because in the end, it really depends on what the person did to try to help themselves. If she's SOOOOOO afraid of the rain up till now, doesn't sound like she's made any progress at all.

It's not the boyfriend's duty to help her out of it, it is her own problem.
Very mature of you to be thinking that she needs a hero. She is supposed to be her own hero about her fears.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 16 2010, 10:40 PM

Great article, awesome writings and fiery words as usual berry-channnnn~ ♥♥♥♥♥
This thread should be stickied imo to stop all the whining by 'pathetic/fake nice guys'.

This post has been edited by Priapuseros: Oct 17 2010, 12:57 AM

I don't think we can ever stop the whining in CC

Please stickie this.

Good article.

So girls prefere Bad guys?? Hm.. if nice guy is pathetic and insecure , then bad guys are better? even they are not loyal?? They go out messing around is it better? Or You like them to beat you up??

Im being gental and nice to my GF soft and kind , watever she yells or get angry no matter im right or wrong i still will "Tam" her. But ofcoz small small things it wont matter la, If for serious case If she is wrong i still "Tam" her but will reason things with her with a serious face after she cools down.

Nice and kind to her, but to other people i wont be as good as i treat my GF..

@tech3910 so true!

Hahaha, guys, when you do get a gf, have erm.. uknow with her. Seriously. Even if all goes haywire after that, at least you could've said you tasted the best of her, and for a brief moment she was truly yours. If you never made it that far, how'd you be able to show and convince your own heartbroken, miserable soul that she was yours? (this is when you 2 break up)

instead of saying nice guys are attention seekers without self-esteem, why don't you say girls are picky? why is the guy always be the one to know everything, when to give, what to give and how much to give? that article showed how ungrateful a girl can be instead.

Don't say like that la. I bet you girl won't dare to go for guy who gamble, alcoholic, loan shark etc etc.

If you complain nice guy early then don't complain bad guys after in relationship. Seriously stop b****ing what you have choosen.

Blame yourself for not appreciate what you suppose to instead.

yeh, i do see the points too. Some girls jst want more from you without compromise with you..& expecting you to give all...n at the end of the day..
well, left you & you said..why I did so much & nothing come back.. ah leechers..

+1...there are too many girls out there who behaves like this...especially those nice looking ones..

yes yes blame the girls for your shortcomings. It goes both ways - girls not happy with what they chose for themselves, and guys blaming them for their own shortcomings.

Turns out that girls don't actually make these guys have such shortcomings ... the GUYS ALREADY HAVE THEM. So yeah, enough whining already.
Grow a pair.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 18 2010, 10:58 AM

ouch.

For wat find a nasty Husband who fool around , when back start slapping you girls??

*You see.. TS, we boys be good and gental to you all and you all say us not man la this la that la easy to bully la.. too soft la etc... zz

*When We get Nasty and manly.. complain la my husband scold me... so mean to me ... dont love me.. he's like got his own world dun choi me everything he make decision on his own didt ask for my opinion la...etc etc...

What you all want? walau.... GRR!!

This post has been edited by crisboy: Oct 18 2010, 11:06 AM

Well can't blame the guys for being like that when there are girls here in this forum who advises the guy to bring the gf out for romantic dinner for calling him a "sohai".

And if you take a look at some of the relationship advice from girls or perhaps doormat guys for that matter. They encourage guys to continously tolerate and be patient with bad attitude from girls and even reward them for their behaviour.

not my problem. nobody likes to listen to my advice lolol.

I would like to add that the article was written by a woman classified as a heartless b****, not those whiny girls Drian has just mentioned. I am a woman classified as a heartless b****, and yes I wear that badge proudly. I think it's quite clear I don't put up with you whiny little boys anyway

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 18 2010, 11:13 AM

doesnt mean not good looking dont too
cant generalise..

How about those manipulative one? one not satisfy enuf..many also want.

duh, no one is perfect. but look at reality. Shortcoming + shortcomings = long comings

& based on math,
if you differentiated it

shortcomings/shortcomings = whinny at both side.

so no one is perfect, just some use it to self righteous & selfishness.

Rule NO.1 : girls dont know what they want.

---

Added on October 18, 2010, 11:15 amYou dont whinny? I wonder if your bf do read this how will he felt about.

This post has been edited by KVReninem: Oct 18 2010, 11:15 AM

Guess you are right then...my friend

Nice guy not whining but its hahaha if you get pawned damn nice for being c2pid b****. Plus jerk prefer safe himself 1st when any trouble comes.

Difference?
Nice guy = treat you well, you are most important, gentleman, not a trouble maker, will not have bad attitude to gamble, prostitude, drink, smoke, drug, another or more women outside, robbery, borrow $, hard work

Jerk= bully, he's most important, rough, trouble make, attitude of as above list, lazy, always play, mature emo only not attitude mature

Being a nice guy doesn't mean so easily get bullied. Jerk show his emo power only while nice guy truely physical power. Accept the fact you're blind and think short term instead think what happen to your future.

This post has been edited by dragynraken: Oct 18 2010, 11:44 AM

No I don't whinny, only horses do. he already knows. I'm not one of those girls you guys seem to like to make an example of.

And what has to do with horse? Why suddenly choose date with horse?

OBVIOUSLY you don't get it!

so you are trying to imply that you are in special league?

This post has been edited by KVReninem: Oct 18 2010, 12:15 PM

nope. I don't think I'm special. I just think I'm not like all those girls I see you guys whine about. there are a few girls like myself here on the forums too, so no I'm not special.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 18 2010, 12:18 PM

Not special meh date with horse?

PS: she not like those bxxxx la

This post has been edited by dragynraken: Oct 18 2010, 12:22 PM

lolol OBVIOUSLY you STILL don't get it.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 18 2010, 12:23 PM

she`s saying she`s a better kind of sophisticated type of ........

arrrrkkkkk pui!!

Think and see nice guys better or Jerk better? THINK la girls.. Use your brain...

You want PAIN or you want to be like Queen?? XD

Nice guys = Treat you like queen give everything you want and love you the most.. When danger comes he protect you even he is small and useless ATLEAST HE PROTECTED YOU!!!

Jerk = Treat you like slave .. maybe will hit you beat you, even worst sell you off!! Ask you for money, no money beat you up. IF GOT DANGER COMES "Wohooo I RUN FIRST!!!" you die your problem..

This post has been edited by crisboy: Oct 18 2010, 12:46 PM

conclusion, end up with nice jerk are better off.

LoL... true also..

come to think of it im almost same as nice jerk too..LOL half half..

Girls, apply now for good and bad attitude boy. Not just 100% bad or 100% good.

Come on guys, give spunky girl a break. I agree with the posting of heartless bit*h. It's basically good guys finish last.



On one hand, I thank all nice pu$*ys, you allow us baddies to get the girl, at least we helped out in "product testing" section, next time the girls can teach you nice guys how to do it yeah

(after we had tested more than 100 times before you..)


It's not about nice or being a jerk. It's the attitude difference. Nice guys don't love themselves, so girls tend to see it as weaker guys, self also no love, how to love me? Then you nice guys, si$$y and pu$$y whipped, how to love? Attitude like being "girly guys or pondan-like", no love for you

The best man is..

Not being the "girly-man" and yet not being the jerk. Mixture of both. Then it's a

Hey brother NICE guys = pondan?? who teach you that?? Pondans are more fierce then you think LOL...

And for the watever 100 times thing... thats hooker already..LOL but i do agree on too NICE is not good..

Heh im a nice guy also.. but to my GF only, to other people Normal and dont care much. Will fight if have to.

Nice guy and girly is totally diffrent story my fren..
Nice guy and Pondan is also totally diffrent story my fren..

Well.. at the end of the day you still get a clean girl for a wife right? Why dont you get a badass wife instead?? haha..
And when you are with a clean gf and you love her what do you do??????? aha.. same as us be a NICE GUY!!!

Good guys gets last.. but all the girls go for them if interms of stable and caring. Well we do have alot of choices..

Which girl wants you if your badass? why they wanner suffer your beating to them??

OR NOT??? back to your dirty badass girls?? You know yourself..

This post has been edited by crisboy: Oct 18 2010, 04:52 PM

there are genuinely nice guys/girls/people (everybody loves them including me) and there are guys who are nice until pondan/gay to a girl (and they come here to whine no gf or the girl don't love them)

agree too nice is no good, nice guy to gf/wife is okay, but being nice at the start when meeting girl, she just can't love you at all.

your badass and nice guy meaning is different with me, my badass is not your ABUSIVE guy. maybe you haven't see, i witness some guy friends who are not pondan or girly guys at most of the time, only in front of the girl that they then they turn "pondan/girly at that moment"


in the end of the race, the good guys work hard and bring stability to the girls to start family, a good conclusion to a story

This post has been edited by SwooshY: Oct 18 2010, 05:05 PM

Yea thats like a hungry wolf ...

ahahahha

different thread..?

Wat diffren thread? that type of good until like girl is wolf la... Just wanner farkie farkie... ahha

Oh.. Correct too, wolf in sheep's clothing

sorry spunky, I know you are better kind

I only want nice guys, jerks got no chance at all, and I can spot one from far far away... Thanks to my rather 'colourful' dating experience.

I only date nice guys because:

1. I'm a self-respecting woman, no way would I allow a jerk to mistreat or abuse me. I would never tolerate a guy who puts his friends above me, treats me only as sex toy, thinks it's okay to fool around, does not appreciate my views or opinions, or thinks that a woman's role is just to make sammich and spread.

2. I've seen enough of broken families. Most of the time, the woman married a jerk, probably for his money. (Thus why I'm so damn against woman marrying for money and I think women must be able to earn her own) These real 'losers' are more likely to bring problems to the family such as alcoholic, gambling addiction, loan sharks, mistresses, or worse, children from 'accidents'.

3. Jerks are the most emo guys around. They just cannot control their emotions and often burst at minor things. They sometimes need a woman to 'handle' his emotions. They can be even more b****y than an average female.

4. The drama and trouble which comes with dating jerks... just not worth it. I want to be in a loving relationship which we adore each other, not one whereby he causes so much problem I always have to call my girlfriends to complain over ice cream tubs at sleepovers.

5. As per article, SELF-PROCLAIMED 'nice guys' are losers. Doormats, we don't need another. Losers aren't man enough to protect us, we're not confident in them.

6. REAL nice guys don't whine, they're happy to know that they can make their partners happy, and they did not have to lose their own self-respect to please a woman. While making her happy, he knows how to hold his own worth at the same time. That's the kinda man I date.

Do you understand the meaning of the term "middle ground"?

This article is not saying that nice guys have to turn into jerks. This article is telling guys to find a middle ground. Be nice to girls, but have a limit to the amount of shit you'll take from her. Know when you're being taken advantage of. Have some pride in yourself.

What this article is saying is that most so-called "nice guys" are not really nice at all, they're stupid and lame. And if they decide in the end to turn into jerks, then they're just being even more stupid and lame.

---

Added on October 18, 2010, 7:19 pmWhy is that so difficult?

There will always be nasty people who will take advantage of you, girls and guys. You can't expect the world to mould itself to your liking. You can only learn how to judge character, avoid the bad people and choose the good people.

Again, this is not difficult. Most people learn this. If you can't, you might as well live alone on a mountaintop.




This post has been edited by n00b13: Oct 18 2010, 07:19 PM

+1, I like.
so do I look for such women, not girl.

lol you forget that she's a princess too, but she's a princess with a good head on her shoulders

Basically guys in relationships should just man up.

tell that to the majority of CC

Beats me spunky, but should we invite evangelistica to read this up? I think he needs to burn the note down(i dunno how it can be done online, but still, do or die) and swallow it up into his brain. =)

---

Added on October 19, 2010, 12:34 amVery rare to get....either their dead silent, or they are overshadowed by the losers as you described. Well, Im from a broken family myself, but its always up to individual to see their environment they grow up in and make the best out of it instead of putting hatred and becoming another moron. But....ure a princess.....they're scary...seriously.=P

This post has been edited by [F]atalit[Y]: Oct 19 2010, 12:34 AM

I just wonder if princess ever step out of comfy zone...

definitely beats him going around spreading his noob negativity

Funny thing is the nice guys who think they are nice and end up whining and b!tching aren't really nice guys. If you're a nice guy u react nice all the time, you don't suddenly turn into an idiot after being screwed once or twice over.

The title is wrong the assumption that they are nice guys is also self deceiving and wrong. They are just a bunch of naive guys that tried to be nice but failed and went all emo.

Well I'm just saying females also play a part in imposing such mindset on guys. Some of the girls here in this forum or perhaps the public also encourages guys to be doormats and the tell them that that's the way to get a girl or maintain a girl.

This post has been edited by Drian: Oct 19 2010, 09:31 AM

I've seen that happen, and I think those girls have no brains anyway. They tell them to be that, and then complain that their guys are like that. HELLO?

That's my GF quality +6

Then it's up to you to avoid them and choose better girls.

This is WIN. if all women thought like that we would have :-

- Less marital problems
- divorce rates below 10%
- Less problematic kids
- Less Crime

thing is, you guys always say you want girls like that, and when you actually do meet one, she's too "aggressive" for you because you want a submissive woman that doesn't give you shit.

Sorry, either aggressive and independent, or submissive and clingy. Pick one.

This post has been edited by spunkberry: Oct 19 2010, 09:33 PM

False dichotomy. I choose independent yet loving.

+1. Some people just wanna have the cake and eat it too.

both are capable of loving - I never said they weren't capable of loving Now pick one: indepedent and aggressive, or submissive and clingy.
why would you be in a relationship with someone who doesn't love you? stupid.

False dichotomy. I like independent but I don't like aggressive. A person doesn't have to be both.

All of these are just from subjective personality of a woman. It all depends on the degree of aggression, or independent, or clingy and so on. =)

Independent doesn't mean the person will be aggressive, it just means the person isn't clingy. Just because a person is clingy doesn't mean a person is submissive either, you can be clingy and authoritative.

and neither are any of those attributes binary, its just a gradient, and the extreme of either side ain't healthy.

lol girls like myself are unattractive to most Malaysian guys. Wonder why?

I've met a lot of clingy people, and they are submissive because clingy people can't stand to be alone and therefore, cater to their partner's every whim and fancy.

That's because you're outspoken, you can speak your mind which is not "attractive" for women to do in asian culture. Consider yourself more western in that aspect.

I know clingy people who are not submissive, just because there is some correlation, doesn't mean that one attribute is opposite of the other.

true, but I meet more of my clingy/submissive than clingy/aggressive.

excuse me for butting in,i wanan say that i for one respects and admires a woman who can speak her mind that way i wont have to deal with "oh honey,you didnt like what we did last holiday?shat you shoulda told me!" kind of situations. Not be ass kissing ms.spunk but thats why i asked for her advice in a 'situation' of mine

Ironically (though unsurprisingly), in a thread that is titled "quit whining already" is filled with women whining about guys whining about women.

I'm sure it's a statistical problem.

My girl always speaks her mind and I sometimes feel horrible as a result XD I guess that's why alot of people like submissive women. They think they are easier to please. (not true, btw)

LOL.

very true..........

face problem. yes we are shallow. too bad for you.