QUOTE(Jedi @ Jan 20 2021, 01:00 PM)
Intel GG already, now is time for Intel to catch up... now with new CEO. if want catch also minimum few years...
AMD Ryzen, AM4 Platform
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Jan 20 2021, 03:38 PM
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Senior Member
1,194 posts Joined: Apr 2007 |
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Jan 20 2021, 04:02 PM
Show posts by this member only | IPv6 | Post
#6982
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Junior Member
514 posts Joined: Mar 2018 |
QUOTE(popopi @ Jan 20 2021, 03:38 PM) Intel GG already, now is time for Intel to catch up... oh boi you gonna triggered some peoplenow with new CEO. if want catch also minimum few years... sonyfanzz liked this post
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Jan 20 2021, 04:40 PM
Show posts by this member only | IPv6 | Post
#6983
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Senior Member
2,239 posts Joined: Apr 2005 |
On the contrary based on issues complained on this section abt amd do u think intel gg? Haha
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Jan 20 2021, 05:04 PM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(Jedi @ Jan 20 2021, 04:40 PM) realistically, intel still long way from gg. their revenue is 71billion while amd is only 6b. They may be doing “better” than intel in DIY enthusiast systems. But they are still a far cry from being a reliable corporate solution and servers. Intel’s low power devices seems to work better than amd as well.This post has been edited by Bonchi: Jan 20 2021, 05:05 PM |
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Jan 20 2021, 05:08 PM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(popopi @ Jan 20 2021, 03:38 PM) Intel GG already, now is time for Intel to catch up... intel just lansi wanna stick to their own fabs jer.. imagine if they throw to tsmc to do... sure gg. Infact the upcoming future power horse might be apple’s workstation CPU.now with new CEO. if want catch also minimum few years... |
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Jan 20 2021, 05:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,231 posts Joined: Aug 2008 |
QUOTE(nrw @ Jan 20 2021, 08:48 AM) » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « Edited*: added AMD's public use graphs. Edit2*: actually the boost clock override (up to +200MHz by AMD, up to +500MHz based on OEM) makes it much harder to have a stable system (with override of +200 or more) in combination with a PBO2 curve. I bet everyone having a 5600x and having played with +200 & PBO2 or above can relate. It just doesn't work all that well. If you want both, you have to settle for +50 or something much lower than +200MHz. |
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Jan 20 2021, 08:04 PM
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Elite
6,799 posts Joined: Jan 2003 |
QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 20 2021, 05:08 PM) intel just lansi wanna stick to their own fabs jer.. imagine if they throw to tsmc to do... sure gg. Infact the upcoming future power horse might be apple’s workstation CPU. its not fab issue. tsmc cant help. they cannot get the clock speed high enough to beat cmtlake/rkt i mean look it took zen 3 chiplet 7nm ..(imc higher fab) 15x the cache, not working cstate, weird pbo, not at all at thermal spec, unknown voltage ranges, ram 3200 to beat a 14nm tech. |
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Jan 20 2021, 08:28 PM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(cstkl1 @ Jan 20 2021, 08:04 PM) its not fab issue. tsmc cant help. zen 3 cannot clock so high is their design problem i suppose.. tsmc is just technically a "wafer printer". So far we've not seen tsmc make products that clocks very high but we can see from the same fab, they've made very different chips for very different clients with very different characteristics.they cannot get the clock speed high enough to beat cmtlake/rkt i mean look it took zen 3 chiplet 7nm ..(imc higher fab) 15x the cache, not working cstate, weird pbo, not at all at thermal spec, unknown voltage ranges, ram 3200 to beat a 14nm tech. |
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Jan 20 2021, 08:58 PM
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Elite
6,799 posts Joined: Jan 2003 |
QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 20 2021, 08:28 PM) zen 3 cannot clock so high is their design problem i suppose.. tsmc is just technically a "wafer printer". So far we've not seen tsmc make products that clocks very high but we can see from the same fab, they've made very different chips for very different clients with very different characteristics. Afaik fab only just small part. Its always down to design first.Rklk is seriously diff than cmlk. Alderlake even more. Hint two mc on it. Fivr on secondary rail. Pseudo support with ddr4 kindda nerfs the cpu. |
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Jan 20 2021, 09:14 PM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(cstkl1 @ Jan 20 2021, 08:58 PM) Afaik fab only just small part. Its always down to design first. deswai cannot imagine what would happen if intel went with tsmc.. could be something hnghhh. But well, since their 10nm is coming together, that might be something nice to look forward to. Rklk is seriously diff than cmlk. Alderlake even more. Hint two mc on it. Fivr on secondary rail. Pseudo support with ddr4 kindda nerfs the cpu. or maybe by then, amd might finally sit down and properly solve their stability problems. This post has been edited by Bonchi: Jan 20 2021, 09:15 PM |
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Jan 20 2021, 09:31 PM
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Senior Member
5,780 posts Joined: Feb 2007 |
QUOTE(popopi @ Jan 20 2021, 03:38 PM) Intel GG already, now is time for Intel to catch up... Intel might be gg on DIY market,now with new CEO. if want catch also minimum few years... corporate customer still buying pc with intel CPU, my workplace workstation, lappy, tablet are 100% intel CPU + GPU. most of them dont really cares about internal tech. all the lab instrument my company produce are still using intel celeron WITH Windows 10... running program from usb drive takes sweets 10 minutes because dumbass windows defender will scan the drive every single time lol |
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Jan 20 2021, 11:35 PM
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Senior Member
1,784 posts Joined: Jan 2003 |
QUOTE(1024kbps @ Jan 20 2021, 09:31 PM) Intel might be gg on DIY market, Yeap, stability is the highest priority in enterprise world.corporate customer still buying pc with intel CPU, my workplace workstation, lappy, tablet are 100% intel CPU + GPU. most of them dont really cares about internal tech. all the lab instrument my company produce are still using intel celeron WITH Windows 10... running program from usb drive takes sweets 10 minutes because dumbass windows defender will scan the drive every single time lol I'm still trying to convince company to switch to EYPC/Threadripper for our virtualisation farm.... let's see if management buy the idea or not... |
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Jan 21 2021, 12:11 AM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(thankyou @ Jan 20 2021, 11:35 PM) Yeap, stability is the highest priority in enterprise world. virtualization is the only thing it can do for now actually. If used for database and storage servers that requires high IO and fast caches, xeon still outperforms the epyc.. and also the lack of confidence in security on amd's side. There is a huge compatibility issue as well, like my former company did a trial run on the epyc and one of the legacy SAP host kept crashing.I'm still trying to convince company to switch to EYPC/Threadripper for our virtualisation farm.... let's see if management buy the idea or not... So if you dont wanna end up possibly having endless OT to troubleshoot... better do a test run first like as for a sample This post has been edited by Bonchi: Jan 21 2021, 12:15 AM |
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Jan 21 2021, 12:24 AM
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Senior Member
984 posts Joined: Sep 2005 From: Bolehland |
QUOTE(1024kbps @ Jan 20 2021, 09:31 PM) Intel might be gg on DIY market, To be fair, there isn't much wrong with Ice+Tiger Lake with ultraportables from a performance standpoint, apart from the exorbitant prices Intel charges for those chips vs Coffee/Comet Lake.corporate customer still buying pc with intel CPU, my workplace workstation, lappy, tablet are 100% intel CPU + GPU. most of them dont really cares about internal tech. all the lab instrument my company produce are still using intel celeron WITH Windows 10... running program from usb drive takes sweets 10 minutes because dumbass windows defender will scan the drive every single time lol QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 21 2021, 12:11 AM) virtualization is the only thing it can do for now actually. If used for database and storage servers that requires high IO and fast caches, xeon still outperforms the epyc.. and also the lack of confidence in security on amd's side. There is a huge compatibility issue as well, like my former company did a trial run on the epyc and one of the legacy SAP host kept crashing. There's a lot of specially binned Xeons with almost all cores disabled but the fastest ones, so you end up with ultra fast 4-8 core HEDT chips and a crapload of cache. These chips have no equals in the AMD sphere for the niche tasks they're excellent at (some specialty databases, high frequency trading software, etc).So if you dont wanna end up possibly having endless OT to troubleshoot... better do a test run first like as for a sample But when it comes to mass number of VMs, AMD is king here in price/performance by a huge margin. |
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Jan 21 2021, 12:27 AM
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Senior Member
1,649 posts Joined: Sep 2008 |
QUOTE(yimingwuzere @ Jan 21 2021, 12:24 AM) To be fair, there isn't much wrong with Ice+Tiger Lake with ultraportables from a performance standpoint, apart from the exorbitant prices Intel charges for those chips vs Coffee/Comet Lake. yeap precisely.. epyc is just a core slave... and really bang for buck for the number of cores it has. Kinda the best for less intense webhosting VMs.There's a lot of specially binned Xeons with almost all cores disabled but the fastest ones, so you end up with ultra fast 4-8 core HEDT chips and a crapload of cache. These chips have no equals in the AMD sphere for the niche tasks they're excellent at (some specialty databases, high frequency trading software, etc). But when it comes to mass number of VMs, AMD is king here in price/performance by a huge margin. yimingwuzere liked this post
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Jan 21 2021, 12:30 AM
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Senior Member
1,784 posts Joined: Jan 2003 |
QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 21 2021, 12:11 AM) virtualization is the only thing it can do for now actually. If used for database and storage servers that requires high IO and fast caches, xeon still outperforms the epyc.. and also the lack of confidence in security on amd's side. There is a huge compatibility issue as well, like my former company did a trial run on the epyc and one of the legacy SAP host kept crashing. Definitely no, production VM hosts will still be running on Xeon clusters. I'm trying to propose EYPC/Threadripper for staging VM hosts... At least we can test it out for 6-12months for the stability period.So if you dont wanna end up possibly having endless OT to troubleshoot... better do a test run first like as for a sample But again, it's very hard to convince the bosses to allocate budget for AMD cluster hosts without knowing "if it actually works"... In theory ya.. it will work and it should... in reality... if it ever crashes... there goes our KPI lol! |
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Jan 21 2021, 01:06 AM
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Senior Member
984 posts Joined: Sep 2005 From: Bolehland |
Since everyone was talking about PBO2 Curve Optimizer... What negative offsets are you guys using? Currently attempting to tune at a per-core level, and using Cinebench R23 10mins MT run + 6 hours Prime95... reckon this is sufficient for stability testing based on what everyone here has experienced so far?
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Jan 21 2021, 09:31 AM
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Senior Member
1,194 posts Joined: Apr 2007 |
QUOTE(Rhetoric @ Jan 20 2021, 04:02 PM) Lol, maybe yes... but this is the cold hard truth... I only started support AMD form the 5000 series onwards, else is always Intel for me.QUOTE(Bonchi @ Jan 20 2021, 05:08 PM) intel just lansi wanna stick to their own fabs jer.. imagine if they throw to tsmc to do... sure gg. Infact the upcoming future power horse might be apple’s workstation CPU. Intel already using TSMS for their up coming PCH. fabs is good business, cannot simply let go. older gen fabs is still making lots of money.QUOTE(1024kbps @ Jan 20 2021, 09:31 PM) Intel might be gg on DIY market, Ya, you are right here. AMD now mostly for DIY and prebuilt systems and maybe laptop.corporate customer still buying pc with intel CPU, my workplace workstation, lappy, tablet are 100% intel CPU + GPU. most of them dont really cares about internal tech. all the lab instrument my company produce are still using intel celeron WITH Windows 10... running program from usb drive takes sweets 10 minutes because dumbass windows defender will scan the drive every single time lol AMD will still take more years if want to tackle into vertical industry.... |
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Jan 21 2021, 12:35 PM
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Senior Member
5,093 posts Joined: Oct 2004 From: J@Y B33 |
QUOTE(1024kbps @ Jan 20 2021, 09:31 PM) Intel might be gg on DIY market, As long as it's Intel corporate customer still buying pc with intel CPU, my workplace workstation, lappy, tablet are 100% intel CPU + GPU. most of them dont really cares about internal tech. all the lab instrument my company produce are still using intel celeron WITH Windows 10... running program from usb drive takes sweets 10 minutes because dumbass windows defender will scan the drive every single time lol TBH those not so IT savvy just see the brand without realizing Celeron and i7/i9 performance gap is very huge. |
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Jan 21 2021, 02:07 PM
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All Stars
10,090 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Sarawak |
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