QUOTE(yeeck @ Aug 3 2018, 11:59 AM)
Servetus states his view clearly in the preamble to Restoration of Christianity (1553): "There is nothing greater, reader, than to recognize that God has been manifested as substance, and that His divine nature has been truly communicated. We shall clearly apprehend the manifestation of God through the Word and his communication through the Spirit, both of them substantially in Christ alone."[44]
This theology, though original in some respects, has often been compared to Adoptionism, Arianism, and Sabellianism, all of which Trinitarians rejected in favour of the belief that God exists eternally in three distinct persons. Nevertheless, Servetus rejected these theologies in his books: Adoptionism, because it denied Jesus's divinity;[45] Arianism, because it multiplied the hypostases and established a rank;[46] and Sabellianism, because it seemingly confused the Father with the Son, though Servetus himself does appear to have denied or diminished the distinctions between the Persons of the Godhead, rejecting the Trinitarian understanding of One God in Three Persons.[47]
The incomprehensible God is known through Christ, by faith, rather than by philosophical speculations. He manifests God to us, being the expression of His very being, and through him alone, God can be known. The scriptures reveal Him to those who have faith; and thus we come to know the Holy Spirit as the Divine impulse within us.[48]
Under severe pressure from Catholics and Protestants alike, Servetus clarified this explanation in his second book, Dialogues (1532), to show the Logos coterminous with Christ. He was nevertheless accused of heresy because of his insistence on denying the dogma of the Trinity and the distinctions between the three divine Persons in one God.
Servetus also had very unorthodox views on the end times. He believed that he was the Michael referenced in both Daniel and Revelation who would fight the Antichrist. Furthermore, he believed that all this would take place in his lifetime. This possibly explains his decision to visit Calvin in Geneva. Servetus could have thought that he was somehow bringing about the beginnings of the end times by facing those who argued and fought against him.Did you know that John Calvin had Michael Servetus burned at the stake for defying his beloved trinity doctrine? Is that the love of God, to burn men alive who don’t agree with you? Do not fruits tell?
You Catholics slander & lie, just like your Calvinistic brothers do, about Michael Servetus who was a true servant of God. Have you actually read the books you quoted?
The highlighted in red, is a trumped up charge used to slander & to bring down an innocent man!
The Lord Jesus Christ laid out a simple guideline for identifying the true and false among us. He said:
“You can tell what they are by what they do. No one picks grapes or figs from thorn bushes. A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot produce good fruit. Every tree that produces bad fruit will be chopped down and burned. You can tell who the false prophets are by their deeds” Matthew 7:16-20.
Aside from any discussion of doctrines, by this criterion alone John Calvin was a false prophet of the first order. How do we know?
Because he condoned and excused, when not initiating it himself, the persecution and murder of those who opposed his doctrines and position. These are
not the good fruits of a man of God.
One such as Calvin who kills others because they differ with his beliefs is a murderer.
That is precisely what Saul of Tarsus was before he was turned by God:
“Then Saul, still breathing murderous threats against the disciples of the Lord, went to the high priest and requested from him letters of authority to the synagogues of Damascus, that if he should find any who were of the Way, both men or women, he might bring them, having been bound, to Jerusalem” - Acts 9:1-2.
And Jesus said to him: “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” - Acts 9:4
After the Lord turned him, did Saul then persecute and slay real heretics, unlike the true brethren of Christ and children of God whom he had previously persecuted in his ignorance and religious zeal? Never! He was now found to be the persecuted one, by those that were his former comrades in unbelief; they stoned him, whipped him, beat him with rods, and then killed him. Why did they do this? Because of the gospel Paul preached. They could not bear to hear the Truth. They said: “Get rid of this man! He doesn’t deserve to live” - Acts 22:22 .
John Calvin said the same thing of Michael Servetus, a man that dared to disagree with his cherished doctrinal formulations. Seven years before Calvin actually saw to it that Servetus was put to death, he said: “If he [Servetus] comes [to Geneva], I shall never let him go out alive if my authority has weight.”
Calvin made good on his threat. Why? Because
he had no answers to Michael Servetus’ correction of his false doctrines, and he could not bear to be proven wrong and to lose face.
The temporal power he had taken to himself was predicated on being right. He was a very proud man; God resists the proud.
Did Paul call on men to repay the evildoers? No, he identified them and their evil for the sake of those who would listen, recognizing and proceeding according to the Lord’s injunction:
“Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves. Therefore, be wise as serpents and harmless as doves” - Matthew 10:16
Paul left it to God to judge those opposed to the gospel, and was willing to pay the price for his stance with his own blood, which he did. The saints shed their blood for, and not the blood of, sinners.
How Shall True Believers React to Unbelievers?What else are we to learn from Paul and his conversion from a violent persecutor of Christ’s brethren to a man who took much abuse for the privilege of being identified with Jesus Christ?
Paul himself gives us the answer that he received of the Lord:
“However, because of this I was shown mercy, so that in me first Jesus Christ might show forth all longsuffering, as a pattern for those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life” - 1 Timothy 1:16 .
John Calvin does not fit this pattern – quite the opposite. He did not suffer those that disagreed with him even to live. He played the part of persecutor. He set an evil example, against the admonition of the apostle John:
“We are not to resemble Cain, who was a child of the Evil One and killed his own brother. And why did he kill him? Because his own actions were wicked and his brother’s actions righteous” - 1 John 3:12 WNT.
Can anyone truly defend Calvin? Amazingly enough, many try to do so in the Name of Christ. thomasthai among others.
They do not realize they have put their hand in the hand of a murderer, and now their hands are also stained with the blood of the saints, whom Calvin persecuted and yet persecutes by his spirit that lives in those who follow him.
For they were not heretics that Calvin persecuted, but the very brethren of Christ. As Jesus said to His brothers:
“Certainly, the time is coming when people who murder you will think that they are serving God” - John 16:2.
The Scriptures are not ambiguous about Calvin’s works and their origin:
“Everyone hating his brother
is a murderer. And you know that no murderer has everlasting life abiding in him” - 1 John 3:15 .
Calvin was such a man.
QUOTE(thomasthai @ Aug 6 2018, 06:16 AM)
Let me make life easier for all.
The
doctrine of Trinity cannot be fully understood by men!
No matter how you try to understand it by human logic, you cannot reconcile that fact that the bible teaches 3 distinct person of God, but God is one.
The 2000 years of church history has already proven that. The bible makes no attempt to explain how is this possible.
The reformers came up with a formula, that is God is One in essence, but Three in Persons.
There is NO OTHER WAY to understand this. Just take it as the bible teaches and dont try any creative ways to explain it.
i'm calling BS on that one!
What horrid confusion, vainglory, and strife have been produced by philosophers posing as Christians, putting God under a microscope in their intellectual laboratories and dissecting Him into three beings;
even messing with the Scriptures to support their damnable heresies! What arrogance! What presumption!
These are doctrines of devils designed to confound and derail seekers of truth. They are there to test the pilgrims traveling to the celestial city of God. Paul told the Corinthians:
“For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved [of God] may be made manifest among you” (1 Corinthians 11:19 KJV).
The Scriptures also say:
“Hear, O Israel, the
LORD our God is ONE LORD” (Deuteronomy 6:4 KJV).
“There is ONE LORD, one faith, one baptism” (Ephesians 4:5).
“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory” (1 Timothy 3:16 KJV).
“Jesus said to him, Have I been with you such a long time and yet you have not known Me, Philip?
He who has seen Me has seen the Father. And how do you say, Show us the Father?” (John 14:9 MKJV)
“Take heed therefore to yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost has made you overseers, to feed the Church of God, which He has purchased with His own blood” (Acts 20:28).
Who purchased the Church of God – Jesus, the Holy Ghost, or God?
Some apologist for the trinity doctrine came up with the fancy explanation that we pray to the Father, through the Son, by the Holy Spirit. But who did Stephen pray to when he was stoned?
“And they stoned Stephen, who was calling on God and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit” (Acts 7:59 MKJV).
Perhaps the trauma of the experience hindered him from understanding the difficult, yes, impossible, concept of the trinity and remembering how he ought to relate to it? (Who can conceive such a thing?)
The arguments of Trinitarians are the products of brain-soiling and quite easily countered with truth from Scripture.
Jesus said, “My sheep hear My voice.” I hear the voice of God. Do I hear introductions like, “This is the Father,” or, “This time it’s the Son,” or, “Yesterday you heard from the Son, but today I, the Holy Spirit, am speaking”? Or do I sometimes hear a chorus of three voices? No, I hear one voice, as did all the prophets of God. He is One, not three.
Jesus is God, and all the figurative language Jesus and others used concerning the Person of God is understood by those to whom it is given. Isaiah says there is only one Savior and none besides Him:
Isaiah 45:21-23 MKJV
(21) Declare and bring near; yea, let them take counsel together. Who has declared this of old? Who has told it from then? Is it not I, the LORD? And there is no other God besides Me; a just God and a Savior; there is none besides Me.
(22) Turn to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other.
(23) I have sworn by Myself, the word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, that to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
Philippians 2:9-11 MKJV
(9) Therefore God has highly exalted Him, and has given Him a Name which is above every name,
(10) that at the Name of Jesus every knee should bow, of heavenly ones, and of earthly ones, and of ones under the earth;
(11) and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Isaiah calls the Son “Wonderful, Counselor, the Mighty God, the Everlasting Father, the Prince of Peace.” God presented Himself to the world in a body formed for the purpose, and we are to worship Him as He is. Anything else is folly.
I am one person. I am a father, a son, and a husband. That may make three positions or roles, but it doesn’t make me three people. So it is with God, the Lord Jesus Christ. The Name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is Lord (Father) Jesus (Son) Christ (Holy Spirit, meaning “Anointed One”).
Man was created in God’s image. Is man three persons? If God is three, but man is one, the image God created is false. But God isn’t three, and His image is perfectly accurate. Yes, I’m spirit, soul, and body, but I’m one person, not three.
So does your Calvinists Bible read like the following :
The Gospel According to Trinitarians
“But what does it say? ‘The Word is near you, even in your mouth and in your heart’; that is, the Word of Faith which we proclaim; Because if you confess the
Trinity, and believe in your heart that God is Triune, you shall be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses unto salvation. For the Scripture says, ‘Everyone believing in the Trinity shall not be put to shame.’ For there is no difference both of Jew and of Greek, for the same Lords over all are rich to all who call on Them. For everyone, ‘whoever shall call on the Trinity will be saved’” (Romans 10:8-13 MKJV).
“For God so loved the world that He gave His only-begotten Son, that whoever believes in the
Trinity should not perish but have everlasting life” (John 3:16 MKJV).
“He who believes on the
Trinity is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the
Trinity” (John 3:18 MKJV).
“He who believes on the
Trinity has everlasting life, and he who does not believe the
Trinity shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides upon him” (John 3:36 MKJV).
“Then Peter said to them, ‘Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the
Trinity to remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit’” (Acts 2:38 MKJV).
“Philip said, ‘If you believe with all your heart, it is lawful.’ And he answered and said, ‘I believe in the
Trinity.’ And he commanded the chariot to stand still. And they both went down into the water, both Philip and the eunuch. And he baptized him” (Acts 8:37-38 MKJV).
“All the Prophets give witness to the
Trinity, that through the name of the
Trinity whoever believes in the
Trinity shall receive remission of sins” (Acts 10:43 MKJV).
“And leading them outside, he said, ‘Sirs, what must I do to be saved?’ And they said, ‘Believe on the
Trinity and you shall be saved, and your household’” (Acts 16:30-31 MKJV)
“And Paul said, ‘John truly baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on the Trinity coming after him, that is, into the Trinity.’ And hearing, they were baptized in the name of the Trinity” (Acts 19:4-5 MKJV).
“And this is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is Triune, and in Him is no singleness without Three” (1 John 1:5 MKJV).
“And by this we know that we have known Him, if we believe in the
Trinity. He who says, ‘I have known Him,’ and does not believe the
Trinity, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever believes the T
rinity, truly in this one the love of God is perfected. By this we know that we are in Him. He who says he abides in Him ought to believe in the
Trinity” (1 John 2:3-6 MKJV).
“Who is a liar but he who denies the
Trinity? He who denies the
Trinity is anti-Christ. Everyone who denies the
Trinity has neither the Father nor the Son. The one confessing the
Trinity has the Father and the Son” (1 John 2:22-23 MKJV).
Haledoch“We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the Trinity. He who does not love the Trinity abides in death” (1 John 3:14 MKJV).
“And this is His commandment, that we should believe on the Trinity, and love one another, as He gave us commandment. And he who believes in the Trinity dwells in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by believing in the Trinity” (1 John 3:23-24 MKJV).
“Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but try the spirits to see if they believe in the Trinity, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses the Trinity is of God; and every spirit that does not confess the Trinity is not of God. And this is the anti-Christ you heard is coming, and even now is already in the world” (1 John 4:1-3 MKJV).
“By this we know that we dwell in Him, and He in us, because we believe in the Trinity. And we have seen and testify that the Trinity was sent to be the Savior of the world. Whoever shall confess the Trinity, God dwells in him and he in God” (1 John 4:13-15 MKJV).
“Everyone who believes in the Trinity has been born of God. And everyone who loves Him Who begets also loves him who has been born of Him. By this we know that we love the children of God, whenever we love the Trinity. For this is the love of God, that we believe in the Trinity, and this is not burdensome. For everything that has been born of God believes the Trinity. And this is the victory that overcomes the world, our faith. Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes in the Trinity?” (1 John 5:1-5 MKJV)
By the way, the italicized words in this next verse are inserted by the
translators,
not to be found in the most original manuscripts:
“For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness on the earth: the Spirit, and the water, and the blood; and the three are into the one” (1 John 5:7-8 MKJV).
“He who has the Trinity has life; he who does not have the Trinity does not have life. I have written these things to you who believe on the name of the Trinity, that you may know that you have everlasting life, and that you may believe on the name of the Trinity” (1 John 5:12-13 MKJV).
“For many deceivers have entered into the world, who do not confess the Trinity. This is the deceiver and the anti-Christ” (2 John 1:7 MKJV).
“Everyone transgressing and not believing in the Trinity does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of the Trinity, he has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring the doctrine of the Trinity, do not receive him into your house, nor speak a greeting to him” (2 John 1:9-10 MKJV).
whoa, dangerous mang!
"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ." - Jude 4-6 
Jul 12 2018, 05:47 PM, updated 7y ago
Quote
unless I misunderstood it lol
….ok……so no mention about repentant thief here. Only mocking. 
reviled = criticize in an abusive or angrily insulting manner.
Neither do 2 of the 3 Synoptic Gospels! 
I've never advocated 'works based' salvation. Only Obedience. Endurance. Perseverance. Narrow path.
The thief on the cross for one, was technically still under the Old Covenant, but Jesus being God forgave his sins based on his repentance and promised him Paradise. Just because you can't find the term Trinity in Scripture doesn't mean it is not implied there. Even the term Bible is not mentioned.
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