Well true, but just one rotten apple in the basket doesn't mean the whole basket of apples is bad. Just that ppl always remember the bad and forget the good. I know there are good people at some of these branches, they ain't all bad.

(Myself included) Forumers/bloggers/digerati the the people that complains the loudest in this 'echo chamber'. If you serious about complaining, take it to the next level, don't contribute to the endless rant thread.
Call the right channels @ Apple Malaysia for your complaint. Thats how i got my iMac G4's LCD panel replaced after a technician at an "Apple Premium Reseller" tried to 'Araldite' glue back the broken plastic bezel (did a sloppy job at glue-ing it back, which he shoudn't have done it in the first place)

This post has been edited by lonewalker: May 2 2010, 02:58 AM

i have said the same thing before, look guys some of you might justify saying that this thread can act as deterrent for people from visiting Machines, its a little bit of a stretch here me thinks, no point feeding this thread because not all sales person are bad, and bad experiences are situational,(i know it shouldnt be, but shit happens). Ultimately everyone who reads this thread should take it with a grain of salt, theres no such thing as nice salesperson, the reason why they are condescending is to get you to buy stuff,we should all know that, its all business at the end of the day. If they are not nice to you, they are just to lazy to earn their commission thats all, and by you walking off you have denied them that. Just go through the right channels, trust me these days they have alot of avenues for you to complain especially, info@machines.com.my that is read by their directors personally.

Which place is that?

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Added on May 2, 2010, 11:19 amThe point of contention here is, are we paying for service we are not getting? Macs are not like PCs, a Mac shop is a Mac shop, they all serve the same one company. Macs are premium products that are targeted at people who care about image and class and good service. People expect a clean, well-designed, tidy store and knowledgeable staff when they walk into a Mac store, they same way they don't when they walk into a small PC shop. It's what you pay for.

It's annoying when you pay for premium service and you don't get it. It makes you wonder how they got hired to do that in the first place.

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Added on May 2, 2010, 11:21 am

And you got it cheaper am I right?

This post has been edited by wodenus: May 2 2010, 11:26 AM

That's true but a bad first impression is even worse. Imagine a person trying to migrate from PC to Mac, then got ill treatment from those sales person, surely this will deter them from purchasing a Mac. Like 1 forumer experience in this thread where he brought his business to other mac shop (which valued ten of thousands of RM) where the sales person at machines act snobbishly. He even convince his friends not to go to machines. Word of mouth is very powerful. In sales, customers satisfaction and experience is everything.

I agree that one rotten apple doesn't mean all are bad. Right now, people here are dissatisfied with the sales/technical person rather than machines itself. Sure, machines have a high staff turn around and mostly are part timers but they are the company representatives. Maybe they should be given a basic PR/customer handling + product info before being put at the forefront.

Just my 2 cents laaaa

The thread starter DID sent an email to info@machines.com.my remember? And he didn't get any replies at all. If the director is reading it, he's just a snob too like like the tech. dept. guy for not replying or acknowledging anything. What other avenues are there? The MCMC? The Ministry of Domestic Trade and Consumers Affair? You cant trust Apple Store or Apple SG to listen to everything, remember, their working for the same head honcho, Machines is bringing in the dough too. Just 1 single email wont make them drop Machines from the company roster or give them a serious reprimand. There's always a possibility that it would fall into deaf ears. But if somebody mentions it in a public platform like in here, where everyone can see and make their own judgment, and where everyone can tell their own woes with the company, it will reach out to a lot more people, that's bad publicity. PR 101, never let bad press go public

Things always move faster when you make the case go public, just look at our local politics after the internet went wide, news travels way faster now. So in that case i support the thread starter for voicing out his complaints here and getting everyone to voice out theirs too, it's our rights to express our voice anyhow


True. I dont mind so much if a part-time sales person acted snobbishly, they're not full timers anyway so you might not meet them again in the future when you return. I dont even mind kicking them in the groin for being such a bstd. But the person who pisses of the thread starter is the technical person. How many part-time technical person that are specialized in Apple products are there in the country? It's a small niche market here, most probably he's a full timer. That's no excuse to be rude

I went to 1utama yesterday and visited machines. I went and ask a sales personal about macbook air. He seems nice and all explaining everything to me. I even asked him about the support/tech support and they say its okay to bring it back to machines for checkup and all. Seems nice but i wonder if that is just a way to attract me to buy that macbook air.

Yesterday 1utama traffic jam till the kerinchi junction there > <" crazy @___@

Im sorry, how are macs not the same as PCs? if im buying a 5K Mac and a 5K PC, it should be okay for me to just let it go if the PC fellers screw me with their half boiled attempts at Customer Service? Seriously how does one buy Premium Service? isnt all customer service complimentary of the product bought, irregardless of the product make and model or the price?

Your reasoning is a bit flawed here,"Macs are premium products that are targeted at people who care about image and class and good service", note that most of us here i'd say are average consumers with little or no disposable income whom are converted of years of using Peecees, There are 2 types of users when it comes to Apple Products, firstly theres the Mac user who buys a mac based on the Rigid MACOSX, relatively trouble free,ease of use orientated and then theres the Apple user, who buys a Mac cause he or she considers a Mac, high class, status elevator, uplifting image and all that the stretches to showing off and make others drool over them and continuously booting into Windows on a mac because the Mac osx is too difficult to learn.

this comment here also feels out of place too "People expect a clean, well-designed, tidy store and knowledgeable staff when they walk into a Mac store, they same way they don't when they walk into a small PC shop. It's what you pay for. " For godsakes its a freaking computer, dont tell me if its a shady area like Lowyat, you wouldnt want to buy a mac from the resellers there? and what about the influx of people opting too buy from online stores, does this factor come into play no. You havto understand the fact that macs these days are considered average computers, heck some HPs,Dells, and Vaios are more expensive then mac nowdays, i dont want to start on Alienware, that is what i call premium.

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Added on May 2, 2010, 2:01 pmDude, i said so many times already, salesman are always salesman, they dont act nice for no reason, of course to tempt you to buylah, Its the same everywhere what, try to walk around the perfume department in Jusco, alot of pretty girls or aunties will be nice to you, and ask you to try these and that hoping for you to buy lah.

This post has been edited by nimrod323: May 2 2010, 02:28 PM

True, its abit flawed there. I bought Mac because of Mac OSX. No other reason. If I have the money since I'm a kid I would get the old Macintosh.
It's not about image class or whatever reason because it happens to be I owned Sun Ultrasparc servers as well for very long time

I would buy another Mac still since troubleshooting across the world for PC problem can be too costly so its not about image, class or whatever upscale trend that I'd like to follow to. It's peace of mind for second purchase

I dont think omega-lynx mentioned anything about any email address, the first one to point at that email was me, try to scan what he first wrote theres no mention of which email he replied to. What other Avenues are there? well you are a consumer, try every other avenues there is i say, why hold back, ranting in a forum like this with a very segmented audience and whom are not forming a larger demographic of mac users in Malaysia doesnt help it either, it may serve as a place to vent out or give bad PR to a store but the reach is limited by its medium, thats why PR goes through every other medium be it mainstream or new media to reach its publics, trust me im doing a PR major.

Look the first thing about Apple resellers in Malaysia, They come and go, no company has maintained an effective monopoly or grip on the malaysian market, alot of hem go missing overnight, a prime example MacAsia and that tiny Mac Store in PowerCentre at iKea and others. No reseller is perfect, i have also pointed out Switch and Technocrats and Maccity a few times before,every company has bad employees be it part time or full time, what i am simply suggesting here is try all the avenues first and the relate your experiences here, just by not exercising your rights and complain here also no point, people could only sympathize with you and add fuel into the fire rather than finding the cause and avoiding the predicament all togather.

Nobody is restricting you venting out your views here, that is your right, its also the thread starters right to do so, what im implying and several others have said, know your rights, try all tangible avenues first and then come here and post your experience, and also most importantly post a follow up of your case so that people would know whats the outcome, rather then allowing others to think that the case has not be solved and the company continues to demonize its clients. There are good sides too the company which we can see in this thread but mostly its the negativity thats prevalent, its all valid but theres still an influx of people still buying alot of their computers for machines, then there must be some positive aspects that draws them there too, and also those reseller i have gripes with Switch and Technocrats(They are one of the two Mac Stores In KK, seriously no other choice).

I also support your points on salesperson, again i'd say its their loss if they treat a customer badly,no commissions for you and loss of sales. Technical wise, they shouldnt have treated the way TS was treated, as i have said in a few posts past no service centre should reject service from a customer, they should take it in and have to follow procedure just like any other company like Dell of HP contacting the Service representatives or in this case Apple Care to determine if the service can be carried forward or not.

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Added on May 2, 2010, 2:31 pmYep, exactly no going back to all those troubles. i wish i could also be apart of the powerpc days, gotta admit the peecees that i have bought in the past costs more than a mac, not o mention the maintaining costs associated with windows.


This post has been edited by nimrod323: May 2 2010, 02:31 PM

@nimrod323,

A tip of complaining, get the person's name. Without names, your complaints has no reasonable weight. Sales folks or even customer service have name tags (@ machines they should be wearing it all the time). Or even ask for their name. When you know their name its makes a person to be more responsible because subconsciously they know they can be identified and with that name you can always hold them responsible. Besides its easier for management to take action against one person to made an example of than lecturing the entire staff. This doesn't just apply for this case for just any case: TM.nut, government offices & etc.

@XenoStig,

Don't get me started on local politics. I turn on the 8pm news and its all about drama and bad jokes. There is a fine line between b****ing and moaning and the freedom of speech.

@wodenus,

To sum this up, we hold all apple retailers (machines for that matter) to a higher standard than the rest of the retail computer business. We are all here posting in a 189 post complaint thread .. (umm correction 190 including mine) just proves that point. Has there been a 100+ post complain thread on any other pc retailers, say: All-IT Hypermarket? Boy i do have a complaint about their CS frm way back 2007.

@XenoStig,

You are making an assumption there.

It's funny sometimes i pop in the forums to read stories about complaints. Its funny cause i know what all the complaints are about and i 'was' there (Was:Q1-2009).
The whole argument is flawed, the person behind the desk answering the phone isn't (always; for this case is NOT) tech support.
On a personal note: i take that argument as an insult as a tech support person, because i know for a fact that person is not tech support and of all things he's giving us techies a bad name.

EDIT: Typos and spellcheck
EDIT: appologies misquoted frozzbyte

______________________________

EDIT: something to add

BTW , there is no such thing as part time tech support, you have to take an apple certification to be an apple qualified technician. (as i recall) The certification will set you back at least half a grand (RM) for the test and every time a new OS release you'll have to take it again

This post has been edited by lonewalker: May 2 2010, 08:07 PM

Agreed, name tags are there for a reason too. oh and the local politics part, well there are many places where contract deals and actual evidences are posted but no action are taken, thats where it ends, in reality alternative media cant do much unless of course you participate in rallies and stuff then we are talking. a bit OT here,but its okay

I was under the impression that he did when he wrote "What kind of 2 bit service center is this shakehead.gif !? I asked him in a very soft way and he treated me like crap! I've sent them an email requesting the company's stand on this matter and they had not replied me even after around 2 months.". He sent to info@machines.com.my, contact@machines.com.my and service@machines.com.my. He did sent out a few emails to Apple Singapore, Hong Kong, America and Australia. Even to Apple UK where ha has some friends there. How do i know this? Aizat aka Omega-Lynx is a close friend of mine and trust me, ranting in this forum is not the only thing he's doing. He's only doing it to reach out to more technophiles. As he wrote, one of our friend are not sub-ing Machines to supply her company's computer lineup after what she has heard, that would have brought Machines a 100K, at least. And trust me, quite a number of our gang are not coming back to machines. And since he's quite "influential" (Zat dont kill me tau ) he managed to convinced some bigshots in the PM's department to not sub-contracting Machines to source Apple products (No, government offices doesn't use Macs. But they are thinking about acquiring Macs for a few critical sub-department)

He also went to the Malay Mail (he knows the editor-in-chief btw), but nobody from Machines wants to get back to them when they called (The Malay Mail is a big name when it comes to complaining consumers, so i don't blame Machines for being such a coward). I know him too you dont want to pick a fight with him. You tiao him, he'll come after you through Official and "Unofficial" ways by pulling some strings. Other than all the above, what other avenues are there? Since PR is your line, tell me what else can he do, i would gladly advice him likewise.

The only reason i think Machines still get customers are because there are Machines outlet in most major shopping complex. When people see Machines are everywhere, they would jump to the simple conclusion that Machines are the indisputable leader hence they would go there instead of other "smaller" dealers. Even the dirtiest mamak stalls will get their fair share of customers


To Lonewalker, Freedom of Speech IS inclusive of bit*hing and moaning. You take take the former away, then there wont be the latter. it's your rights to moan all you want, but it's your rights to turn your ears away too. that's what we call Freedom of Speech and not i-only-want-to-listen-to-those-who-agrees-with-me-and-screw-those-who-doesn't-or-just-talking-rubbish. It's a weird thing for you to even compare those 2. So if you say that bit*hing and moaning shouldn't be allowed, then most if not all politicians from BN & PR shouldn't be allowed to open their mouths (which i would fully support btw )

@XenoStig, in reference to M'sian politics

b***-ing and moaning is a childish interpretation of freedom of speech. The right to freedom of speech stands for a much higher cause than to be used to b**** or moan about some petty things. Not to go too OT...

My bottom line is: not happy with service and wana complain, complain thru proper channels
Wana leave a testimony do a full one, don't drop one liners like (its called trolling in other words) and of course send it through proper channels.

Not doing things tru proper channels just generates noise. One might think, if i get this loud enough, i might just be heard. Nobody can't get any sense of anything when there is too much noise. Hence, your 'noise' has fallen on deaf ears(of your own making).

The forum is definitely not the right channel for complains.
Can we all get over this? Close the thread

This post has been edited by lonewalker: May 2 2010, 05:41 PM

About the tech exam, there are few level. At lease for the one that I had it cost over a grand (not half). And you need to attend new briefing or test whenever there are new hardware or software. Maybe we are referring different level.

@lonewalker
Aik ... when did I make the comments on post #190??

well, no matter if this thread is going to boycott machines or not... i'm just glad we have a 'warning' here in apple byte. i always thought im the only one who hates machines staff n really like epicentre...found out that i'm not alone .

n very true...when an average customer see machines branch everywhere, that person would simply assume machines is the best in the business. but when he/she get bad treatment from machines, he/she might assume that other apple resellers are worse

in miri, the only apple reseller (optiprimus) only the manager actually knows about macs. the rest of the staff are very clueless. but so far none of them are snobbish etc. if they dunno, they will find the manager 1st, if cannot they try to google or find out some other way, until they really try they'll say they dunno. somehow i appreciate that

Much higher cause? And what's that, may i ask? Please elaborate more, i want to hear some examples. If an immigrant wanted to come to America legally to make a living by opening a hotdog stall in New York, but was turned down by the Immigration Department because they "unofficially" have a policy against admitting petty trader, only those who are conducive to the "larger" economy are allowed admittance. Heck, even i would somewhat agree with them for not admitting small-fry like that. Is that what you meant by "for a much higher cause"? If that is so, what ever happened to the line "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.." emblazoned inside The Statue of Liberty? After all, aren't most American immigrants in the first place? If you know your history, there's no need for me to continue

As i said "freedom of speech" encompassed ALL speeches and expression, no matter how trivial. Your version of Freedom of Speech is a selective one, where you only want to hear what interests you and nothing else and you will try to muffle what you call "childish conversations". To deny ANY of it is to stifle one's right. Just like what you are doing or want to be done. Trolling or being childish might be unsightly, but hey, it's legal is it not?

The TS already went to the proper channels (i've already mentioned it on my last post, which part did you not understand?), and then some. He went and started topic to see if others have the same experience as him. Tell me, if he or anybody else did not brought this topic up onto the public's (albeit just low yat forumers) attention and only went to "proper channels", how would we all know if others had bad experiences with Machines too? Are you saying that when the police shot that 14 year old kid, we should just let police handle their own investigation by THEIR OWN people? It's the proper SOP anyway, right?

"""Not doing things tru proper channels just generates noise. One might think, if i get this loud enough, i might just be heard. Nobody can't get any sense of anything when there is too much noise. Hence, your 'noise' has fallen on deaf ears(of your own making)""". ----- Are you trying to sound smart or something? What do you think we (low yat forumers) are, a committee members of a single company trying to pass a motion with unanimous support? If we ARE a committee member, that passage memang la boleh pakai beb, but we are not. We are all entitled to our own conclusions here, whether we agree with the others or not. That's why it's called a forum, not a Yes-Men Fiesta

"""The forum is definitely not the right channel for complains""". And who are you to police the forumer here? Are you some All-Wise Forum-Yoda or something? Or are you or any of your family members are working for Machines and you felt stung by this thread? Every forum in the world has their own "complaints thread", why should this be any different? After all, if everyone are only allowed to post "detailed, technical" messages", Low Yat Net will be a dead grave yard. They might as well put a sign "Certified Nerds and Geek only. Others need not enter"

I can deduce that you are pro-opposition, but weirdly you sound more like Mahathir-Era-BN but without the elegance. To "quote" a lawmaker, "You tak suka thread ni, you keluar dari thread ni". There's a lot more threads in this forum that can satisfy your "specific" wants & needs


P.S. i know all this are a bit off topic, but if it is kept quiet, it will only empowers those who wants to be in power

This post has been edited by XenoStig: May 3 2010, 08:33 AM

Actually very funny 1 la. There r 2 types of customers. There r ppl who like to be left alone to browse until we need help then we will call a staff n ask for help. U go to shops overseas all mostly lidat 1. I'm in this camp. I love the freedom to browse without some salesman breathing down my neck.

Then there is the type of customer who wants the saleperson to dote on them like they're spending a million bux even if they only intend to buy a rm50 small puny thing. They walk into a big huge store like Machine or Epi Center n no1 comes rushing to them to ask "how may I hep chu?" n that's it. They immediately decide the shop is a lansi shop who dont have customer service at all.

So, there's no perfect shop for every type of person. Just choose 1 that suits u. Dont like it then dont spend money there. There's no need to go on a crusade to tell everybody not to buy from them. Life is too short to waste time on trivial things lidat la. Go find another Mac shop that u like, spend ur money there n go home a happy person.

This post has been edited by ianho: May 3 2010, 08:36 AM

True boss, im in the former camp myself. But what they did to my buddy is just outright rude, nobody likes to get that kind of treatment mah, right? And true oso, life is too short, but i would rather spend 10min here than puffing my life away on cigarettes

Guys, I went Machines and Mac City in 1 Utama yesterday and based on my observations, Mac City has more customers compared to Machines. My gf and I went in both shops and guess how were we treated? People in Mac City approached us and treated us in a good manner. I asked for Incase MBP case, the staff who served me the didnt know what was it, but she asked the manager about the the case for me. too bad they do not have the case there, then I told her that I just wanna browse through everything myself, so she left us alone there. This is what I call good service. But in Machines, from what I've noticed, there are not many customers compared to Mac City which was full of customers yesterday. I would say, there were only 2customers there I think if I remember correctly. I went in, nobody served us, fine with that. Staff there are either busy playing with psp, busy surfing or listening to songs. So both of us went in there to inquire bout the case I was looking for, they gave me the look where I'm just asking and not buying. When I asked staff whether they are gonna stock Incase casing or not, the answer the staff gave was, "I don't know" then he continued playing his psp. He didnt even bother to ask his manager or colleague. Both of us got ignored after that. So you guys judge. Which shop do you think provides a better service? It's just based on my personal experience anyway. I will definitely not gonna step into Machines anymore.

This post has been edited by sumtuckieeeee: May 3 2010, 08:49 AM