Read it here
https://ecom-media-prd.sea.amway.net/sys-ma...F_TIP_EN_US.pdf
Full list of technical information on method use for testing, test results, test parameters & so on.
It's claims also certified by NSF, if they were just talk siok, NSF would have removed the certification just like Diamond.
The filter can't filter bacteria and virus, the UV do the jobs by deactivating the pathogens.
Do some research at least...

Headache buying following options:
1.） local brand Joven JP200 seen RM130-RM170
2.) Panasonic TK-CS10 seen RM149.50 - RM180 - RM209 also got
3.) Doulton (made in England) supercarb/ultracarb ( cant remember which one already) with CTC casing RM288
4.) 3M - RM399
5.) Normal china made single/double filter : RM79.90-99.90 also got can change to ceramic filter and carbon.

Which one should I buy for 1-2 person usage. Outdoor already got one stainless steel filter but never been changed for >10years already.

This post has been edited by uncle08: Feb 7 2018, 11:07 PM

ok

Good sharing. eSpring lists out all 140 contaminants just to prove to consumers that the filter really can filter all those 140 contaminants. As other said no ppl will really list out all the contaminants they can filter or no ppl will care how much contaminants the filter can filter out. Just because most of the filter claims they certificate by which third party but sometimes it is not really. If they also list out the contaminants but failed to do so mayb they will bare the risk so they wont do this. Anyone can sue eSpring or NSF can just remove the certification if their claims are not true, it prove they deserved it.

Filter cannot filter out bacteria and virus no matter which type of filter, so the UV light take and important part of it. Knows that not everyone care about it, all is based on personal requirements and needed. Different ppl have different needed and willing to spend just like someone willing to spend for a BMW but someone just satisfied of their Myvi, its same thing.



The water filter not only stop at current stage, the research keep on going, they deserved it.

sry eSpring to expensive for my budget. I dont like MyVi but i rather choose other model. instead of paying AmWay agent the commision same like Diamond and others Coway or Cocoo
product.

This post has been edited by uncle08: Feb 8 2018, 11:42 AM

Its just an example, even you dont like Myvi or choose other model also cannot compare to BMW, Mercedes or those right? Both are different thing, both technology are not the same, how much the scientists put the effort and how much the filter deserved it. As mention that everyone have their right to choose the right thing they wants and they need, different people different views and needs, it does not means the filter is same with others. Someone willing to spend for their requirements while someone just need basic, there is no right or wrong, all about the needed, cheers...

I'd just like to point out that in this industry, there is no magic. Industry is pretty stagnant, so there's only evolution here and no revolution.

A comparison of Myvi and BMW doesn't apply to water filters because then everyone would choose Rolls Royce - reverse osmosis, it filters out pretty much everything.

Don't look at the brand, brand in this business means nothing. You need to know what your filter does and what it's made of and where it is made. And while NSF is good, always remember that NSF is certification system, not quality control system. NSF doesn't tell you how long will filter actually perform at these levels or if your batch is not leaching plastics and chemicals in your water.

Oh, so you buy at shop you don't pay profit to the seller la LOL
BTW, if you buy with correct person and correct way, you don't pay single sen commission to agent. Amway don't work that way, instead you get your own commission & rebate.
I have seen a lot of business, mobile phones, electronics, vendors, etc... Some profit margin is way beyond your IMAGINATIONS

All the while not talking about the brand, its talking about the technology it used and what the filter really can filter out. eSpring list out those 140 contaminants proven by NSF means they dare to say that their filter really can do that compare to others, else they need to bare the risk. Compare Myvi and BMW not just look on the brand but you cannot denied that both technology used is different, and also the performance of the products. Can anyone just say that driving Myvi is same as BMW even though both also just car? Even not compare car, anything just like mattress or whatever, do anyone just think that the feeling of sleep on a Tempur mattress which cost around 20k is same as sleep on normal king koil or other brand mattress?
The same theory there. The technology used and the performance of the products.

How come reverse osmosis can related to Rolls Royce? Anyway, Reverse Osmosis which filter out everything most of the time suitable for those who have health problem or kidney problem as it just water which even does not contain mineral.

Sorry I am not gonna talk about filter technology in terms of "BMW vs Myvi" with MLM people. I studied it, worked in the industry and know it inside. Any argument I provide comes back with "technology bro, 140 elements bro".

I am not a fan of RO systems for home use, but not because it doesn't contain minerals, it's not an efficient process, that's it. Someone seriously believes we get minerals from water? You need to drink a bathtub of water to get enough minerals. Someone really believes that RO water can leach minerals from your body? Please explain how.

There is not a single proven case where a person suffered because of RO water vs. mineral water, yet there are 100s of cases where people drinking RO and distilled water lived happily to their 90s.

And if you bring WHO argument, well WHO based it on old Soviet publications from 80s and if you refer to those Soviet publications they actually speak about technical distilled water. WHO also says fluoride is good.

Again, I'm not advocating for RO systems, most people would not need to go to this extreme. But there is nothing wrong with RO systems.

In fact, RO water is a battleground between RO system manufacturers and bottled water manufacturers who started losing sales especially in Western countries, where plastic bottles are viewed as evil. People started refilling their reusable water at drinking fountains (RO), so now it's bad.

Choice is yours, just like in case of fluoride. RO water is neither good or bad. But RO water is much better than the water available to 99% of world population. Ever heard of people dying because of contaminated water? Of course! Ever heard of people dying because they were drinking RO?

No one said that RO water can leach minerals from your body, no one say that a person will suffered because of RO water but not mineral water. Is there anyone say that people dying because they were drinking RO? Just need to know that RO not all, just can search many articles or news related RO water advantages and disadvantages from google right.

https://www.waterbenefitshealth.com/reverse...osis-water.html
https://draxe.com/reverse-osmosis-water/

Nowadays, everyone can search anything from internet about any proven and any truth, people can just based on their research and needed to make a suitable choice, no right or no wrong, but there is no need to paint a bad picture to other brand of products which it does not show any most ethical, go to the same, people can choose 3M, people can choose Aquaphor, people can choose those panasonic which within the budget, all the while is based on the needed and requirements, at last still stick back to their choice, there are still alot using eSpring, there aso alot using Aquaphor and aso even water filter like panasonic which buy from mall or even RO water filter, cheers....

Hi members

I'd been suing Amway Espring for 3 years. I found that the filter price is way too costly. Especially you are ask to change every 3-4 months. Not to mention doesn't come with hot & cool function.

There are many water solution out there that offers monthly installment eg coway, cockoo or nesh or others that range from RM125-300/m and you need to sign contract for 5 years.

I hope there is a product that can provide clean water with both hot cold & room temp water dispenser and low maintenance.

hope to hear the suggestion from the group.

TQVM

I am looking for one that

Do you absolutely want hot and cold in one? This kind of machine requires a lot of maintenance to keep it clean.

If yes, then the easiest and cheapest way is to buy quality filter system and bottleless water dispenser and connect one to another. Just make sure you clean your dispenser regularly.

Yes, hot for milo n milk for my kids, and cold occasionally will be handy. i already have an outdoor filter system installed and it has auto flushing every night.

thinking to get those similar like coway or cockoo type with few filter and connect directly into the system. however those coway and cockoo will require to sign contract again, which im kind of agaist it.

You will be overpaying like 10x for Coway/Cockoo. Best way is really quality separate filter and simple dispenser. Whole set will cost you like what, 2000RM or so...

These type of filter you pay more per Liter. You feel is cheaper because it operate by pay per use.

Who change eSpring cartridge every 3 to 4 months?
Your family drank 5000L quarterly?
Assuming 20 people live under the roof, each person consume 2L (yes 2L) per day, 20*2*30 = 1200L per month
It's 4800L for 4 months...
Or you use it to fill your bathtub

Hot & cold water dispenser never comes with cheap price, don't forget the electricity consumption. Hot water is around 300-450w cold water is around 350w.
Hot water? Boil it, don't be lazy, there're so many instant hot water dispenser out there doesn't require reboiling.
For cold water, utilize the fridge la.

Another thing, what kind of outdoor filter you use? Need flushing every night? That's insane...

This post has been edited by oyching88: Feb 10 2018, 12:23 AM

OMG, not Amway followers again, please stop!

From Espring manual (I'm not making it up, you can search yourself, page 3, #2

The eSpring Water Purifier is designed for use only with cold, bacteriologically
suitable (potable) water

This Class B system conforms to NSF/ANSI 55 and contains an ultraviolet lamp
that requires replacement at intervals in accordance with the manufacturer’s
instructions. The device is designed for the supplemental bactericidal treatment
of disinfected public drinking water or other drinking water that has
been tested and deemed acceptable for human consumption by the state and
local health agency having jurisdiction. The system is only designed to reduce
normally occurring non-pathogenic or nuisance microorganisms. Class B
systems are not intended for treatment of contaminated water.

Just read it one more time. Supplemental treatment of already clean water. Can only reduce non-pathogenic or nuisance microorganism.


Let's continue, it's fun. #7

Except for lead and a few other compounds, the eSpring Water Purifier
is NOT designed to remove soluble inorganic substances such as iron,
calcium, magnesium, nitrates, arsenic or fluorides.

hmmm... Sure you call calcium and magnesium "useful minerals". What about iron, nitrates and arsenic? Guess they were not the part of "removes 140 elements". You know that most quality 3 stage filters with sub-micron will remove iron, nitrates and arsenic, right? Geez, most iron can be removed by simple 20RM sediment filter...

Let's go even further. Page 15:

Rated Service Life: The Cartridge is designed to serve the average family’s
cooking and drinking water needs for one year or 1320 U.S. gallons (5000 L),
whichever comes first.
NOTE: Actual Cartridge life will vary with the amount of use and quality of the
water supply.

Now connect the dots. If you use pure water, as suggested above, it will last 5000L. If water is relatively bad and contains a lot of impurities (like what we have in Malaysia), then this number drops like a rock. From my experience, 5 micron sediment filters needs to be replaced (or washed, if pleated polyester) every 3-4 months, otherwise no flow. That means that our Malaysian water can kill a filter within 3-6 months. So if we assume that filter can last 1 year, it simply means that Espring doesn't filter most impurities.

I got all this from Espring manual, didn't make any of it up, everyone can check it if you don't trust. I think this should conclude our discussion on MLM products and bring us back to real world of filters. Admins can pin this information to the top, would be helpful.



P.S. and while we're at it, let's go through the propaganda booklet that was presented by Amway people few pages ago. Again, you can verify it all.


Claim 11: Effectively removes particulates down to 0.2 microns including asbestos, sediment, dirt, and scale

OK but...

Claim 15: Effectively removes waterborne parasites larger than 3 to 4 microns

Didn't they just mention that everything down to 0.2 microns is removed? Why mention particles of 3-4 microns and larger? Now I see how you got "140 contaminants", why not 1400, you can list everything that's larger than 0.2 microns one by one.


Claim 17: Does not remove beneficial minerals such as calcium, magnesium, and fluoride

Forgot to mention iron, arsenic and nitrates from #7 above. Selective marketing?


Claim 18: Ultraviolet light destroys more than 99.99% of waterborne disease-causing bacteria and viruses in drinking water

In their own manual they clearly say non-pathogenic or nuisance, now suddenly it's disease-causing. Not good to lie, I'm guessing that's why there is no information for that claim.


Claim 20: The cartridge will treat drinking and cooking water for 5,000 litres (1,320 gallons) or one year, whichever comes first

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) estimates that
the average person consumes 1.63 litres of liquids per day,
based on nine different surveys taken from literature (4). This would
equal 3,570 litres (943 gallons) per year.

No comments. I think the whole booklet was assembled from Wikipedia quotes and Amway people didn't even bother to check the math. 1.63*365=3570?

Claim 23: Uses exclusive patented technology

Ok. But all 3 are related to carbon block and most are dated back to 1986. Only one is from year 2000. So the system is basically a carbon block with 30 years old technology. What "advanced technology of BMW" are we talking about??? (yes, there are some electronics patents but these are not relevant to filtration).

This post has been edited by hestati: Feb 10 2018, 06:59 PM

https://www.amway.com/en/ResourceCenterDocu...minantsList.pdf
Here are the over 140 contaminants that eSpring can filter out, if any false, anyone can sue it and the company need to bare the risk.

Iron:
Iron is necessary for your health. The most well-known role that iron plays in human nutrition is in the formation of the protein hemoglobin, which transports oxygen to all cells of the body. Iron is also used in cellular metabolism and is found in many of the body’s enzymes. Low iron stores in the body can lead to iron deficiency, anemia and fatigue and can make you more susceptible to infections. The Environmental Protection Agency of US considers iron in well water as a secondary contaminant , which means it does not have a direct impact on health . Based on WHO (World Health Organization), for humans, the average lethal dose of iron is quite high -- between 200 and 250 milligrams per kilogram of body weight. High levels of iron can be harm, however, iron toxicity is rare, and iron intake from drinking water is typically much too low to raise health concerns -- about 0.6 milligrams per day if you’re consuming a typical 2 liters of water per day , compared to an average iron intake of 10 to 14 milligrams per day from food.
http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health...micals/iron.pdf

Nitrate:
According to National Drinking Water Quality Standard of Malaysia (NDWQS), the maximum contaminant level (MCL) for nitrate is 10 mg/L .
https://environment.com.my/wp-content/uploa...g-Water-MOH.pdf
From National Water Quality Standards for Malaysia, the nitrate (NO3) in our water is around range 5 mg/L to 7 mg/L which is below the standard maximum contaminants level (MCL) for nitrate.
http://www.wepa-db.net/policies/law/malaysia/eq_surface.htm
The best way to remove nitrate from drinking water are Ion exchange units, reverse osmosis, or distillation.

Arsenic:
If in an inorganic form, arsenic can be removed or reduced by conventional water treatment processes. There are five ways to remove inorganic contaminants; reverse osmosis, activated alumina, ion exchange, activated carbon, and distillation. Filtration through activated carbon will reduce the amount of arsenic in drinking water from 40 - 70% or up to 80%, http://nopr.niscair.res.in/bitstream/12345...9%20413-416.pdf.
The Maximum Contaminant Level (MCL) of arsenic to water concentration is 0.01 mg/L equal to 0.01 parts per million (ppm) according to WHO (World Health Organization). From the research, The concentration of the arsenic As (III) in the filtrated water by activated carbon was as low as 0.0001 mg/L or parts per million (ppm) which was much lower than the Maximum Contaminant Level ( MCL).
Anion exchange can reduce arsenic by 90 - 100%. Reverse Osmosis has a 90% removal rate, and Distillation will remove 98%. If the arsenic is present in organic form, it can be removed by oxidation of the organic material and subsequent coagulation. In fact eSpring which use activated carbon filter is capable of reducing 40%-70%. eSpring only list the contaminants that it can really reduces effectively which not claimed wrongly.

So for who want to remove nitrate or arsenic or those inorganic contaminants can just choose reverse osmosis filter which filter everything and just a very clean and pure water.

The cartridge is designed to serve the average family’s cooking and drinking water needs for one year or 1320 U.S. gallons (5000 L), whichever comes first. While actual cartridge life will vary with the amount of use (of course as per mention 5000 L) and quality of the water supply. All the while water filtration experiment is using standard quality of water but not pure water, as my house have 7 siblings and total 8 people in house, our cartridge just changed last year August and now the filter still got 3 lights based on the indicators which total is 4 lights, it times to change while it left 1 lights and turn red. Those who lives in a water quality is really bad area, no matter using what type of filter that require filter maintenance sure will need to change more frequent compare to others to ensure the filter function well and also the water quality. This is the fact.

This post has been edited by Ch33r: Feb 11 2018, 01:09 AM

Gee...! Looks like Amway eSpring agents have been lying in this forum all these while.
Debunking the false representation of eSpring agents with eSpring's very own manual.