I duno but for my first visit to MBS, was treated rather good like old kaki. Maybe because there is old kaki there and I jes join in chatting with them and ended up having quite interesting knowledge and fun. Maybe I am jes lucky. Haha

" apa customer mahu lagi....!!! " LOL ...

who doesn't like to be given attention??? for a fact...

sometimes, you need to know if the shop is jus "saying things that you like to hear" or are they really treating you as a respectable customer... i don't bother about this member, kawan, premium customer, sort of BS... they still want my money at the end of the day and that's a fact...

if i am wat they said i am...would they trust me to bring home their most expensive bike in the shop for a trial ride for 2 days? i doubt so...

for me... the relationship between myself as a customer and the shop is purely simple... business...i don't need them to sweet talk me...

if i have done my homework before i go to them... then there is less likely a chance they can influence my decision at the shop.. and they would have to do more work in trying to convince me to buy a certain something rather than just telling me a certain something is "sweet", "sedap", "fast", "light", "chun"... it means nothing, i hate those words.... tell me something a bit more concrete....

i don't mind a healthy discussion and debate with concrete facts... but having to tell me unquantifiable words to describe a certain something really does not work for me...

i mean, if you put yourself in their shoes... one can't help because the shop can't satisfy everyone... they do have to gauge their customers to see if they are legit buyers or they are just there to do a price check...

having to waste a bulk of their time talking to someone who don't spend a cent at their shop while they piss off another prospect customer isn't a sound plan to them and let's not deny that they open a business at the end of the day to make money not to keep you and i happy...

so, in order to be fair... i personally would not want to ask too much of anything if i am not interested in the first place to buy anything from them.. if i am really there to do a price check... i just ask the price and maybe a 2nd try at getting a better price... if it doesn't suit me, walk away.. no point chatting them up on the product if i am not interested... at the end of the day, if i do this repeatedly... i might get noticed and the next time i visit the shop, i might get cold shoulders from them even when i am really interested to get something from them...

well, everyone has their preferences... can't say it's wrong if you like salesperson to sweet talk you... but, it's a two way thing at the end of the day...if you don't like it in the first place... the would not have been kept you on the hook...

This post has been edited by butthead: Oct 9 2013, 01:31 PM

Hey i'm owning the China Hummer.. Envy of your Montague for sure.. Will definitely upgrade to this sometime in the future! The frame he is selling is super cheap i must say!

I am on Link D8, I am thinking to change bullhorn/dropbar because of my length of my hand, I feel the need of the extra extension. Not based on assumption, but after try on Verge X30h. For record, I am 6'5"
As I can't afford to change everything at once, so one thing at a time. Then again, I can't change bar but not brake level and shifter. You get what I mean?

So, my wish-list are SRAM Red, Dura-Ace or Ultegra.

at the time being, u can try to extend the bar out with extensions....

u have read that tern verge p9 will hit our shores soon...

price of beskal getting higher...

rrp in japan for VP9 is 99.8K Yen..

will be lucky if it is under RM 3k...

VP18 is still available in Japan for 2014, price up of course..
if over they stop VP18 and bring VP20 instead... will be lucky if its under RM 4K....


prototype model... initially planned to be a P10... but decided to be a P9...

Ya, I have got Litepro Stem. Also I considered bar end.

I did consider buying a china Hummer too. But eventually saw the ori montague frame at such a great price. No regret at all. Beautiful frame.

i'm not sure if this can be modded into a tern...

but u will lose the special tern hinge...

No way no way haha... I love the Tern Physis post. So, the Litepro stem or Aber Hallo stem is the only way.

This can be installed in the Tern Links. I have used this handlepost on the Dema (cap ayam as robyn calls it ) and suprisingly, it's more robust and stable compared to the Tern's flexy Physis. Drawback is it's heavier! But the height is adjustable and also it has double clamp and release for the handlebar. It uses the same star nut also. Special Tern hinge actually needs more refining! But the 3 Tern P9 that I know has done that. we know what's the problem already. Still, if they can use Dahon's style of mounting the fork to the handlepost, it's still the BEST!

PS/ The top picture is the one I am referring to. The bottom one is for 1 inch quill type steerer tubes!

This post has been edited by etigge: Oct 9 2013, 03:55 PM

Actually there are many. The former Vitesse is now the Dahon Formula. Dahon Vectors are now Tern Verge series. Why, that's for the father and son to know and for us to find out. I see many similarities in Terns though. Buy the Tern Link D8 for RM1500 ( PM me if you cannot get that price) and slap in a pair of better rims, change to 9 speed drivetrain, change the seat post, seat and handlebars, you get the Tern Link P9. Cheaper too and also you get to choose the other components. In fact you can even get the RD adapter and convert to 10 speed. The much fanfared Pirate Ninja is a souped up P9 of the same frame. More or less lah! Terns has made a lot of model variations by just swapping components rather than coming out with different models.

My advise, check and research more thoroughly!

^ sounds like what I am doing

Would any sifu here care to spend some precious time educate For those new to fb like me in breaking down the bike basic frame. It is obvious that different models shares similar frame. Take the example of Tern, it has P & D series - P9, P71, P24h, D8, D7i C7 (copy straight from the website). They all seems to use the same type of frame (Link, 6061-AL, patented OCL Joint and Double Truss technology) but differ in fork. From here on, can the experts willing to perform some hair splitting works to established the base frame (regardless of the models due to components), and the one level higher and so on? I am keep bulking on this frame thing because in Mtb, we only look and buy the best possible frame and then choose the components accordingly. So, still can't shake this off me. Thanks

The other choice is change to x10/x20 handlepost and use vro stem.

How I wish if I can buy those quality frames only! Most foldies comes in full set up and components are choosen by the manufacturers' themselves. It's their strategy to minimize cost and sell at the best possible price they can. Unlike MTBs we can choose a frame and select components to our liking. Then MTBs also have ranges where they are cheaper and comes in complete packages, especially those that are shodded with almost year end components whereby newer versions are coming out soon. Maybe foldies will also come in frames alone in future.

As for folding bikes, the most important aspect is the toughness of the joints, especially the main tube bracket. The difference between the branded ones and the non branded ones is that branded ones, specifies the maximum weight that the frame can take. Also I did notice that branded frames comes with forks that is only 76mm width. The cheaper version mostly comes with the normal 100mm width front forks. There's a reason why, they made it only 76mm. Because the rims are smaller, you have to get the spokes almost vertical to maximize the strength and the research is that if the angle of the spokes are too slanted, it will be weak. That's why, most wheelsets on 100mm forks have 32 spokes rather than the lower spoke counts on the more expensive models. Also some models have more spokes in the rear compared to the front and off course those higher end wheelsets like Kinetix Pro have a stronger rim but they cost a bomb!

This is one of the points in folding bikes and there are other aspects like, handlepost, tire clearance, brakesets etc.etc. One advantage of folding bikes is they can use either roadies or mtb's components. Dahons and Terns are bulky frames but they are made strong. KHS are made more slimmer and looks more sportier. If you look carefully, alot of spinoffs from cheaper brands follows Dahon MUs design. I have used Dahon Eco C7 frame (called Vybe now) for more than a year and I have no problem with it and have upgraded till 27 speed with better components. It was and still is the lowest tier of their range and still it was fun to ride. Then I change to Dahon Speed P8 but I only retain the frame and fork while everything else from my Eco C7 is moved to the new frame. I find the ride better and not so bumpy, maybe due to the chromoly frame which absorbs bumps better compared to the aluminium frame of the Eco C7. This was also confirmed by my wife who also have changed from Eco C7 to Boardwalk. Although Boardwalks are shodded with inferior components, the frame is still OK and what I was looking for was frame as she too has her components moved to the new bike. Coincidently, the Boardwalk is also chromoly steel and the meausrements and angle of the geometry is similar to Speed's, except the maintube is smaller and circular in the case of Boardwalk.

As for Terns, I see only 2 geometries. The Link and the Verge. The Eclipse are expanded version of the Verge which was also the same design as the former Dahon Vectors. So, there's only 2 types of frame for Terns but sub divided into Link C series with a cheaper handlepost and different maintube fold latch and with 7 speed Shimanos. Can Neos use 7 speed? They never did though! Then you have D8 which has the same frame but with different handlepost and bigger latch for the maintube bracket. They made it without a RD hanger for Shimanos and SRAMs RD. They wanted to make the Neos the standard RD for the frame but adapters are available to mod it to use Shimanos and SRAMs. Up a tier is their P series but still uses the same frame geometry. They give a better wheelset, crank (lousy bash guard though), smoother seat post and made it 9 speed with Neos RD too. Oh yeah! a different paint job to differentiate!

Next is the Verge series which incidently was Dahon's Vector's design. They made the same frame into Verge , Tern Verge X30h, X10, P18, X20 and also S11i which all shares the same frame design. Only the components and gearings are different. The eclipse is the same design but made bigger to accommodate 24 inch diameter wheelsets. I won't be suprise in later years, a 26 inch ones will appear which in my opinion they should have bypass 24 and made 26 directly. Then we can have more tire choices and also wheelset choices. Tern do have 26 inch foldies though but they are heavy clunkers.

In conclusion, I think you can make the cheap Tern Link C7 rides like the Tern Link P9 with changes on componentry just like improvement on cheaper Dahons into better rides with higher end components. Eg. why would I spend
8 grand for a Tern Eclipse X20 when I can buy a Tern Eclipse P9 for 3 grand and use the 5 grand for Shimano Dura Ace or Ultegra and better rims? I can even consider Shimano XTRs or Xts.

Off course all this is my opinion and observation, I might be wrong but you all can look at it yourself.

This post has been edited by etigge: Oct 9 2013, 11:43 PM

A guy went on a round the Singapore island bicycle ride using the Tern Verge X20, a trip of 155 km in about 6 hours plus.... this gives an average speed of about 24.5 kph.

At the end of the ride, he pushes his Tern into the hotel lobby and elevator...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhCYDORO1LE

etigge, can i use a 8 speed shifter for my 7 speed boardwalk?

much prefer the trigger over the gripshift n at some point i plan to upgrade to better wheelset along with 8 speed cassette but it could take a while

at the mean time i just wanna change to trigger shifter n if 8 speed shifter does indeed work then next time i dont have to buy again

7 speed shifter only is hard to find d

You actually can use it if you insist but shifting is not accurate and inconsistent. I don't recommend it though. I too like trigger shifter as I find gripshift cumbersome. In your case, upgrading means getting the cassette hub first but if 8 speed is enough for you, you can actually find 8 speed freehubs so you don't have to change wheelsets. At the same time, if you are going to change wheelsets to accommodate cassettes, might as well upgrade to 9 speed! Afterall, it is easier to source and you still need to change the same components.