CALLING ALL MEDICAL STUDENTS! V3, medical student chat+info center
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 Jun 3 2012, 06:54 PM, updated 5y ago
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#1
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::  
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Continuation of v2 : https://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=1147877 and v1 : https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/416477
Will update this post with necessary stuff after June 11th. |
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Jun 3 2012, 09:18 PM
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#2
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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How was your first six months in Monash? Happy with it despite all the brickbats thrown at it? Poor comparison with Clayton?
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Jun 5 2012, 05:29 AM
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#3
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Closer to 3 months than 6
 Very happy with the program  . As I mentioned before, since we have a smaller batch compared to our seniors (100 us, 130 Year 2, 300+ Clayton), I found that PBL sessions are more effective. But then it could be just my group There are bad apples of course, but I guess the quality of medical students overall hv been diluted by the number of seats available @ other medical schools as well. In comparison to Clayton, as I mentioned, we're able to access their lecture recordings but not vice versa. There are a lot of good lecturers in Clayton that I enjoy listening too (e.g Eizenberg, Kerr, Nandurkar, Bullock) in addition to good lecturers in Sunway. I especially enjoy the fact that tutorials were conducted by specialists in that field (e.g histology/pathology tutorials by pathologist, immune system by immunologist, HIV by HIV specialist etc.) instead of some random teachers. The course has some downsides - probably no internship opportunity in Australia despite being accredited by AMC, astronomical tuition fees compared to other schools and for some people - no cadavers. But then I try not to get too excited with being in Monash. If my government loan is not approved, I'm going to have to go to UTAR instead |
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Jun 5 2012, 07:19 AM
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#4
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 5 2012, 05:29 AM) Closer to 3 months than 6 I wish you all the best in your loan application. JPA loan/Mara and gomen recent additional funding.Very happy with the program . As I mentioned before, since we have a smaller batch compared to our seniors (100 us, 130 Year 2, 300+ Clayton), I found that PBL sessions are more effective. But then it could be just my group There are bad apples of course, but I guess the quality of medical students overall hv been diluted by the number of seats available @ other medical schools as well. In comparison to Clayton, as I mentioned, we're able to access their lecture recordings but not vice versa. There are a lot of good lecturers in Clayton that I enjoy listening too (e.g Eizenberg, Kerr, Nandurkar, Bullock) in addition to good lecturers in Sunway. I especially enjoy the fact that tutorials were conducted by specialists in that field (e.g histology/pathology tutorials by pathologist, immune system by immunologist, HIV by HIV specialist etc.) instead of some random teachers. The course has some downsides - probably no internship opportunity in Australia despite being accredited by AMC, astronomical tuition fees compared to other schools and for some people - no cadavers. But then I try not to get too excited with being in Monash. If my government loan is not approved, I'm going to have to go to UTAR instead  |
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Jun 5 2012, 08:49 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras 
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wow, can download the lectures?
hmm. would be good if we can share something  and pathology tutorial by pathologists, isnt that expected? unless u mean e.g. if the pathology tutorial is on renal pathology, then only a pathologist with special interest in renal pathology ("subspecialist" in renal pathology) teaches the tutorial, then that would be wow coz for my schl , any pathologist can be the tutor for any pathology tutorial  This post has been edited by arsenwagon: Jun 5 2012, 08:53 PM |
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Jun 5 2012, 09:18 PM
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#6
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 5 2012, 05:29 AM) Closer to 3 months than 6 Not much of a downside as with how things are at this point, most internationals will not have internship spots upon graduation. Of course Monash Sunway grads will be much lower in the "chain".Very happy with the program . As I mentioned before, since we have a smaller batch compared to our seniors (100 us, 130 Year 2, 300+ Clayton), I found that PBL sessions are more effective. But then it could be just my group There are bad apples of course, but I guess the quality of medical students overall hv been diluted by the number of seats available @ other medical schools as well. In comparison to Clayton, as I mentioned, we're able to access their lecture recordings but not vice versa. There are a lot of good lecturers in Clayton that I enjoy listening too (e.g Eizenberg, Kerr, Nandurkar, Bullock) in addition to good lecturers in Sunway. I especially enjoy the fact that tutorials were conducted by specialists in that field (e.g histology/pathology tutorials by pathologist, immune system by immunologist, HIV by HIV specialist etc.) instead of some random teachers. The course has some downsides - probably no internship opportunity in Australia despite being accredited by AMC,[  astronomical tuition fees compared to other schools and for some people - no cadavers. But then I try not to get too excited with being in Monash. If my government loan is not approved, I'm going to have to go to UTAR instead |
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Jun 5 2012, 09:33 PM
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#7
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Jun 5 2012, 08:49 PM) wow, can download the lectures? I'd be happy to share but they tag all the videos with session information. So I'd be in trouble hmm. would be good if we can share something and pathology tutorial by pathologists, isnt that expected? unless u mean e.g. if the pathology tutorial is on renal pathology, then only a pathologist with special interest in renal pathology ("subspecialist" in renal pathology) teaches the tutorial, then that would be wow coz for my schl , any pathologist can be the tutor for any pathology tutorial Regarding the pathologist thingy, you'd be surprised on how it's being done @ other schools QUOTE(podrunner @ Jun 5 2012, 09:18 PM) Not much of a downside as with how things are at this point, most internationals will not have internship spots upon graduation. Of course Monash Sunway grads will be much lower in the "chain". of course. cant complaint much there. but the number of students expecting to work in Australia is pretty high  |
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Jun 5 2012, 09:44 PM
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#8
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 5 2012, 09:33 PM) of course. cant complaint much there. but the number of students expecting to work in Australia is pretty high |
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Jun 5 2012, 10:10 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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wow so theres a no-sharing clause ah. too bad then
 hmm, really? imagine pharmacology lecturers tutoring for pathology, wouldnt that be disastrous. haha but we do have weird cases like a cardiologist giving lecture on infectious diseases (although both are internal med subspecialists) which i cant understand why, it's not like theres no ID specialist to give a lecture  This post has been edited by arsenwagon: Jun 5 2012, 10:12 PM |
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Jun 5 2012, 10:17 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Just hope that educational establishments and the governing councils should look at better governance, transparency and social responsibility. When all these goes with awareness, a lot of presumptions is unnecessary.
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Jun 6 2012, 08:58 AM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jun 5 2012, 07:19 AM) I wish you all the best in your loan application. JPA loan/Mara and gomen recent additional funding. Thanks QUOTE(podrunner @ Jun 5 2012, 09:44 PM) They ought not place too much hope in this, and keep up with current news pertaining to this issue, and not hoping "blindly". I guess if that's the main reason why they came to Monash, why not keep on hoping QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Jun 5 2012, 10:10 PM) but we do have weird cases like a cardiologist giving lecture on infectious diseases (although both are internal med subspecialists) Yea that case.. So far none of that happening in Sunway, cause I think students arent afraid to ask questions, and lecturers who dont know anything will be exposed which i cant understand why, it's not like theres no ID specialist to give a lecture But that will contribute to high tuition fee since specialists dont come cheap |
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Jun 6 2012, 02:14 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006 
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at undergraduate level, it is preferable for non-subspecialist to teach and lecture, as the information/knowledge required is basic, which every doctor (not even necessarily specialists) should know.....
the reason is, the subspecialists tend to have too much in depth knowledge, and tend to confuse medical students..... therefore, it is perfectly acceptable at undergraduate level, for a cardiologist to lecture on id.....and vice versa..... |
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Jun 6 2012, 03:10 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Is it not the norm at least to have specialists, though not subspecialist, lecturing at med schools?
Most topics are guided by a syllabus and experienced lecturers will know what is required in the earlier years than the later years. I would reckon that somebody with more than 10 years of lecturing experience can do it without referring to his notes. Well, I suppose that med schools know best and the strive for excellence is always there. |
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Jun 6 2012, 04:30 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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there are 2 levels in the medical programme.....the pre-clinical, and the clinical.....unfortunately, in some programmes, this has blurred due to integration of the two components programme...
at basic sciences/pre-clinical level, it is NOT necessary for clinicians to teach students....but preferable.... in the clinical years, clinicians will take over, but again, it is not necessary for 'super-specialists' to be teaching.....more important is the ability to take a good history and perform a good physical examination.....something any good doctor should be able to do.... the level of knowledge required at graduation is broad, but shallow....housemanship will consolidate the knowledge.....this wide spectrum of knowledge should stay with the doctor for life..... only when the doctor enters a post graduate training programme, will a deeper level of knowledge be required, based on the area of specialisation.... with years of practice in a speciality, it is inevitable that the specialist will forget much of the knowledge in other fields....and a situation may exist, where a super-specialist will be a world expert in his area, but have problem diagnosing common pro9blems.... |
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Jun 6 2012, 06:35 PM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 6 2012, 08:58 AM) Thanks Ignorance is bliss I guess if that's the main reason why they came to Monash, why not keep on hoping Yea that case.. So far none of that happening in Sunway, cause I think students arent afraid to ask questions, and lecturers who dont know anything will be exposed But that will contribute to high tuition fee since specialists dont come cheap |
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Jun 8 2012, 11:04 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Jun 5 2012, 08:49 PM) wow, can download the lectures? we have pathologists teaching us most of the paths and path tuts too. occasionally clinicians come in to teach the path stuff, but that's more during the clin years like end of 2nd and starting of 3rd years. So far i havent really seen super-specialists teaching us yet though hmm. would be good if we can share something and pathology tutorial by pathologists, isnt that expected? unless u mean e.g. if the pathology tutorial is on renal pathology, then only a pathologist with special interest in renal pathology ("subspecialist" in renal pathology) teaches the tutorial, then that would be wow coz for my schl , any pathologist can be the tutor for any pathology tutorial  somehow i feel that we have lots of endocrinologists here =/ haha. but they also take roles in gen med teams so they know their stuffs, and they are all very awesome clinicians exams soon though all the best for those taking exams soon too. |
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Jun 8 2012, 11:20 AM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Exam on Monday
Lucky only 1 paper - 3hours |
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Jun 9 2012, 10:44 AM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Ah! The awesome truth!
"You're not special" http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/high-s...-145709954.html |
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Jun 9 2012, 11:09 AM
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Junior Member
483 posts Joined: May 2009
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In my opinion, medical students should be taught mainly by specialist, occasionally subspecialist. This is due to what we should know is broad, any subspeciality training will narrow their scope, hence missing some part of other discipline.
About pre-clinical years, i think it will be better if clinician or lecturers with clinical experience to teach, as sometimes microbiologist/ immunologist emphasizes on different path as to a clinician. E.g: we were taught details about E.coli, but didnt know which site of infection will get it, not until we were scolded by a clinician in the hospital. |
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Jun 9 2012, 11:31 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Gorila_ @ Jun 9 2012, 11:09 AM) In my opinion, medical students should be taught mainly by specialist, occasionally subspecialist. This is due to what we should know is broad, any subspeciality training will narrow their scope, hence missing some part of other discipline. i am unsure what is meant here....shouldn't general topics than be taught by generalist rather than specialists?.....Added on June 9, 2012, 11:36 am QUOTE(Gorila_ @ Jun 9 2012, 11:09 AM) About pre-clinical years, i think it will be better if clinician or lecturers with clinical experience to teach, as sometimes microbiologist/ immunologist emphasizes on different path as to a clinician. E.g: we were taught details about E.coli, but didnt know which site of infection will get it, not until we were scolded by a clinician in the hospital. it is of course always better that all teaching be done by clinicians....but few med schools have this luxury....non-clinicians do have a different focus in the basic sciences, but the syllabus should have the relevant info available....in the case of this example, in addition to the microbiology information about e-coli, the usual sites of infection should be also listed..... This post has been edited by limeuu: Jun 9 2012, 11:36 AM |
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Jun 9 2012, 03:44 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Past news:
QUOTE Govt urged to cancel Lincoln College’s licence B Nantha Kumar | May 21, 2012 A PKR leader accuses the Health Minister of deliberately ignoring the controversy surrounding the private institution. PETALING JAYA: A PKR leader today sought the withdrawal of a licence given to Lincoln University College (LUC) to run an offshore medical programme in the Ukraine. Malacca PKR vice chairman G Rajendran, referring to a report that LUC was one of four private colleges that were fined last year for breaching a moratorium on nursing courses, said it was “strange” that the government had ignored this bad record when approving the licence last Nov 29. However, it is not clear whether the breach was discovered before or after Nov 29. The disclosure of the offence came last March 26 from Deputy Higher Education Minister Hou Kok Chung, who was replying to a question in Parliament. The moratorium, to address the problem of oversupply of nurses, has been in place since July 2010. » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « LUC and MMC could not be contacted for comment. Source: http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...80%99s-licence/ Older but related news: http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...leading-public/ http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...ion-through-pm/ http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...right-with-mmc/ ~ This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jun 9 2012, 03:56 PM |
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Jun 9 2012, 03:56 PM
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31 posts Joined: May 2005 From: Lab Somewhere
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...and here is what Liow Tiong Lai proposed:
QUOTE Tuesday April 17, 2012 http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...6137&sec=nationVarsity lecturers to help out at 22 hospitals By ROSHIDI ABU SAMAH roshidi@thestar.com.my TAPAH: The Health Ministry has identified 22 public and private universities which will provide specialist medical services in 22 district hospitals nationwide. Minister Datuk Seri Liow Tiong Lai said the universities were among 33 public and private universities in the country that offer medical courses. He described it as a smart partnership as the hospitals would provide all the necessary facilities while the universities would send their lecturers who are also medical experts with various specialisations. He said the collaboration would result in more patients receiving specialist treatment with a shorter waiting period. “It is a win-win solution for the ministry, universities and the public,” he said after witnessing the signing of the smart partnership between the ministry and nine universities at the Tapah Hospital yesterday. The ministry was represented by its secretary-general Datuk Kamarul Zaman Md Isa while the nine universities were represented by their vice-chancellors or top officials. The nine universities that inked the partnership agreement were: - Universiti Tunku Abdul Rahman that would provide specialist medical service at the Tapah Hospital, - Management and Science University (Kuala Kubu Baru Hospital), Perdana University (Bentong Hospital) - Universiti Malaysia Sarawak (Serian Hospital), - UCSI University (Dungun Hospital), - Lincoln University College (Lahad Datu Hospital), - Allianze University College of Medical Sciences (Kepala Batas Hospital), - Melaka Manipal Medical College (Jasin Hospital) - Mahsa University College (Tanjung Karang Hospital). Liow said the signing ceremony with the remaining 13 universities would be held later. “The partnership will help ease congestion at main hospitals and increase the bed occupancy rate at district hospitals,” he said, adding that priority areas include internal medicine, general surgery, paediatrics, obstetrics and gynaecology, orthopedic and anaesthesiology. This post has been edited by mRNA-83: Jun 9 2012, 03:59 PM |
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Jun 10 2012, 01:33 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Latest Episode:
http://youtu.be/xtmTwNeaqYc Past 5 episodes: http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...post&p=51840777 |
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Jun 15 2012, 01:06 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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And the russian recruitment continues...
From: recom.org "Dear Potential Medical Student , Pls see the basic information as below . We offer the most affordable MMC ( Malaysian Medical Council ) Recognised medical Courses . We offer hope to the millions who believe that Affordable Quality Education is available to them. We are Russian Resources and we have been sending students to study Medical Studies in Moscow , Volgograd & Nizhny for the past 14 Years . We have sent more than 2500 students to date. We also send Government Sponsored Students like JPA , MARA & other GOV or State Sponsorships ( Yayasan ) . Pls see the info as below & we would like to hilight the following: 1.0 Full Tuition & Hostel ( Total 6 Years with STPM or Equivalent entry ) only - Nizhny RM 109,000 +/- , Volgograd RM 119,000 + / - . * All pricings subject to the US Dollar . 2.0 Fully recognised by MMC ( Malaysian Medical Council ) . 3.0 We fully promote Nizhny & Volgograd as they have a very caring culture for students & the environment is condusive for studying . 4.0 We have approx 350+ Malaysian Students each in both Nizhny & Volgograd . Half are from JPA & MARA . 5.0 We will recommend Pre Medical for Students in Malaysia via Special Russian Course , but we fully recommend the students to do their foundation in Russia as their 1st intital year in Russia will fully benefit them. This is the best pathway for students with SPM Qualifications . 6.0 The Founder of Russian Resources is also the Honorary Consul of the Russian Federation . 7.0 Qualified students can also apply for JPA Loan on the 2nd year . JPA selects the students based on the good 1st year results . The Loan will cover all manners of Tuition Fees. ( If interested , pls request more information ) So we can contact you to help you fullfill your dreams to become a doctor and not be a victim of scams of untruthful agents. Pls email or contact me if you have any questions or clarification needed. We also have OIL & Gas Engineering and Aircraft Engineering . 5 Year Course Tuition only below RM 55,000.00 Eswin Woo Marketing Dept Russian Resources Sdn Bhd Mobile: + 6 012 4925727 Head Office : Russian Resources Sdn. Bhd. 28 floor -A1 , Gurney Tower . 18 Persiaran Gurney 10250 George Town PENANG " This post has been edited by podrunner: Jun 15 2012, 01:09 PM |
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Jun 15 2012, 01:40 PM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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If it's not for the fact that I have a family in tow, I'd contemplate going to Russia too....
Added on June 15, 2012, 1:44 pmBtw - http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...2854&sec=nation So.. lets take a bet - how many medical schools from China will be included in the schedule? This post has been edited by Syd G: Jun 15 2012, 01:44 PM |
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Jun 15 2012, 02:47 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jun 15 2012, 01:06 PM) And the russian recruitment continues... What happened to their Russian State Medical University and Moscow Medical Academy?From: recom.org "Dear Potential Medical Student , Pls see the basic information as below . We offer the most affordable MMC ( Malaysian Medical Council ) Recognised medical Courses . We offer hope to the millions who believe that Affordable Quality Education is available to them. We are Russian Resources and we have been sending students to study Medical Studies in Moscow , Volgograd & Nizhny for the past 14 Years . We have sent more than 2500 students to date. We also send Government Sponsored Students like JPA , MARA & other GOV or State Sponsorships ( Yayasan ) . Pls see the info as below & we would like to hilight the following: 1.0 Full Tuition & Hostel ( Total 6 Years with STPM or Equivalent entry ) only - Nizhny RM 109,000 +/- , Volgograd RM 119,000 + / - . * All pricings subject to the US Dollar . 2.0 Fully recognised by MMC ( Malaysian Medical Council ) . 3.0 We fully promote Nizhny & Volgograd as they have a very caring culture for students & the environment is condusive for studying . 4.0 We have approx 350+ Malaysian Students each in both Nizhny & Volgograd . Half are from JPA & MARA . 5.0 We will recommend Pre Medical for Students in Malaysia via Special Russian Course , but we fully recommend the students to do their foundation in Russia as their 1st intital year in Russia will fully benefit them. This is the best pathway for students with SPM Qualifications . 6.0 The Founder of Russian Resources is also the Honorary Consul of the Russian Federation . 7.0 Qualified students can also apply for JPA Loan on the 2nd year . JPA selects the students based on the good 1st year results . The Loan will cover all manners of Tuition Fees. ( If interested , pls request more information ) So we can contact you to help you fullfill your dreams to become a doctor and not be a victim of scams of untruthful agents. Pls email or contact me if you have any questions or clarification needed. We also have OIL & Gas Engineering and Aircraft Engineering . 5 Year Course Tuition only below RM 55,000.00 Eswin Woo Marketing Dept Russian Resources Sdn Bhd Mobile: + 6 012 4925727 Head Office : Russian Resources Sdn. Bhd. 28 floor -A1 , Gurney Tower . 18 Persiaran Gurney 10250 George Town PENANG " Also no longer keen to put students into Kurst University? Added on June 15, 2012, 2:50 pm QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 15 2012, 01:40 PM) If it's not for the fact that I have a family in tow, I'd contemplate going to Russia too.... What happened?Added on June 15, 2012, 1:44 pmBtw - http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...2854&sec=nation So.. lets take a bet - how many medical schools from China will be included in the schedule? Why the contrast with your Monash now and Russia? These are two extremes! Getting stressed up waiting for your funding approval? This post has been edited by cckkpr: Jun 15 2012, 02:50 PM |
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Jun 15 2012, 03:56 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 15 2012, 01:40 PM) If it's not for the fact that I have a family in tow, I'd contemplate going to Russia too.... Good gracious! Why??? |
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Jun 15 2012, 03:58 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jun 15 2012, 02:47 PM) What happened? Yeap. I was already given an "eviction notice".Why the contrast with your Monash now and Russia? These are two extremes! Getting stressed up waiting for your funding approval? *goes to suck thumb at a corner* |
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Jun 15 2012, 04:26 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Jun 15 2012, 04:35 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 15 2012, 03:58 PM) Yeap. I was already given an "eviction notice". Never give up. Keep trying and all you need is just THAT one!*goes to suck thumb at a corner* |
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Jun 15 2012, 04:58 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jun 15 2012, 04:26 PM) make comeback?.....it never left..... |
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Jun 15 2012, 05:37 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Jun 22 2012, 08:32 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Some news about international internships:
http://m.theage.com.au/national/education/...0619-20m83.html Encouraging steps, and of course the chances of working in aboriginal areas are reasonably high, as highlighted in the following article. http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2012/s3516456.htm |
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Jun 22 2012, 08:36 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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UCSI JPA scholars in trouble.. dum dee dum
http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v6/newsgeneral.php?id=675035 |
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Jun 22 2012, 08:39 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 22 2012, 08:36 PM) UCSI JPA scholars in trouble.. dum dee dum Is it even remotely POSSIBLE that their results sucked? http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v6/newsgeneral.php?id=675035 |
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Jun 22 2012, 09:59 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jun 22 2012, 08:39 PM) Is it even remotely POSSIBLE that their results sucked? When you need qualified students, you cannot get to even filled up the allotted quota. So they follow and came up with the foundation program. Out of the blue, JPA sent some students due to the high costs in Monash and Imu.To resolve this matter, the quota needs to be increased. Others would also asked for more and we will make the current situation worse. Added on June 22, 2012, 10:05 pm QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 22 2012, 08:36 PM) UCSI JPA scholars in trouble.. dum dee dum Was the number of medical students in Monash this year who came from mufy much less compared to the previous year and if true, what was the reason?http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v6/newsgeneral.php?id=675035 This post has been edited by cckkpr: Jun 22 2012, 10:05 PM |
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Jun 22 2012, 11:50 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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i suspect it's just that there are more foundation students than places available, and there are also good non scholar foundation students....and they just pick the best.....and only that 13 of the 55 make it into the top xx number to progress to medicine.....
like i said many times, scholars, both jpa and mara have a tendency to not do well....they traditionally are over represented in the infamous imu eos2 failures..... perhaps something to do with motivation.....or the lack of.... |
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Jun 23 2012, 08:24 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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This would be a blessing in disguise for JPA. The same thing happened to those "conditionally" offered places in Imu and Monash who did not do well in their pre-u.
Perhaps Quest and Lincoln can be the white knights. |
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Jun 23 2012, 08:41 AM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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Are they talking about 13 out of 55 PSD premedic students given places in UCSI MBBS programme or UCSI only able to admit 13 to their premedic course ?
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Jun 23 2012, 09:33 AM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(confirm @ Jun 23 2012, 08:41 AM) Are they talking about 13 out of 55 PSD premedic students given places in UCSI MBBS programme or UCSI only able to admit 13 to their premedic course ? If only 13 meets the minimum requirements,then something is very wrong with SPM assessment. |
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Jun 23 2012, 09:56 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jun 23 2012, 09:33 AM) If only 13 meets the minimum requirements,then something is very wrong with SPM assessment. I thought this has already been established. |
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Jun 23 2012, 02:05 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jun 23 2012, 09:33 AM) If only 13 meets the minimum requirements,then something is very wrong with SPM assessment. they did not fail to meet the requirement with spm....but their performance at the foundation.....it is quite common for top spm students to falter at their pre-u level....and vice versa.... like i said, it is often a matter of motivation...many spm students peak at spm and burn out after that.....they think that getting a scholarship is the ultimate aim, and life is easy after that.... big mistake.... |
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Jun 23 2012, 03:41 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jun 23 2012, 02:05 PM) they did not fail to meet the requirement with spm....but their performance at the foundation..... The non-academic criteria selection by JPA must be blamed.it is quite common for top spm students to falter at their pre-u level....and vice versa.... like i said, it is often a matter of motivation...many spm students peak at spm and burn out after that.....they think that getting a scholarship is the ultimate aim, and life is easy after that.... big mistake.... Furthermore, if it's foundation that the students were put through and not edexel, it's more shameful. Actually, I don't subscribe to the thinking that students who did not do well in SPM will do well in the pre-u. Those who succeed are more of exceptions; language based courses, creative arts or IT etc. Of course, some "smarties" who bloom later due to laziness or lack of focus. |
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Jun 23 2012, 07:03 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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let me qualify.....it is quite common for top spm students to stumble after....
it is possible for average spm students to shine in pre-u, but you are right, it's not common.....more of exceptions... |
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Jun 24 2012, 10:05 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Jan 2010
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hey guys, for registration for fy1 in uk, as far as my understanding it is based on the points right? so i tried researching it and found out that any additional skills(i.e extra degree or research) you have would contribute to 7 points under education achievement. may i know is what i have stated here true?
could someone pls enlighten me as to how significant this 7 points can be? I am currently having a break of 6 months. I could actually either do an attachemnt or go on a research. Either way will be beneficial for me but the thing is i prefer doing attachment than research but if that 7 point is that significant i would rather go on to do research than attachment. what do you guys think? |
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Jun 24 2012, 11:24 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(manking91 @ Jun 24 2012, 10:05 PM) hey guys, for registration for fy1 in uk, as far as my understanding it is based on the points right? so i tried researching it and found out that any additional skills(i.e extra degree or research) you have would contribute to 7 points under education achievement. may i know is what i have stated here true? that is correct...could someone pls enlighten me as to how significant this 7 points can be? I am currently having a break of 6 months. I could actually either do an attachemnt or go on a research. Either way will be beneficial for me but the thing is i prefer doing attachment than research but if that 7 point is that significant i would rather go on to do research than attachment. what do you guys think? however, for a 'research' to be given any value, it has to be published in an indexed publication...so some simple research done within 6 months is unlikely to be published......and thus of no value.... the 7 points is NOT vital, unless one is aiming to apply for an academic f1 post, or applying to a london deanery.... i would advise to take this 6 months to do something you like OUTSIDE medicine.....it will be the last long break in your life, till you retire.... sounds like heading for notts?..... |
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Jun 25 2012, 01:58 AM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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oh so the electives actually mean nothing?
damn should have just applied for 1 week project.... leave more time for vacation. |
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Jun 25 2012, 07:39 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jun 24 2012, 11:24 PM) that is correct... Looks like a pms situation?however, for a 'research' to be given any value, it has to be published in an indexed publication...so some simple research done within 6 months is unlikely to be published......and thus of no value.... the 7 points is NOT vital, unless one is aiming to apply for an academic f1 post, or applying to a london deanery.... i would advise to take this 6 months to do something you like OUTSIDE medicine.....it will be the last long break in your life, till you retire.... sounds like heading for notts?..... Enforced vacation arising from matching. |
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Jun 25 2012, 08:20 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Jun 25 2012, 01:58 AM) oh so the electives actually mean nothing? electives is always part of the course syllabus, and does not contribute to the 7 points....damn should have just applied for 1 week project.... leave more time for vacation. |
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Jun 25 2012, 08:22 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jun 25 2012, 08:20 PM) electives is always part of the course syllabus, and does not contribute to the 7 points.... oh, then i must have been mistaken alreadyand i met pakistani who went to mount sinai for electives because he said that would look good on his CV. also i saw ppl in US forums kept saying electives are importnat, get a good elective etc maybe situation not same in msia This post has been edited by arsenwagon: Jun 25 2012, 08:25 PM |
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Jun 25 2012, 09:42 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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it is obviously different for each country...
for msia, electives count for a fat zero in value.... |
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Jun 27 2012, 01:31 AM
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Junior Member
483 posts Joined: May 2009
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I just finished my electives, learnt a lot, so get a good elective.
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Jun 27 2012, 02:04 AM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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gorilla where did u go for electives?mind to share? hehe tq
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Jun 28 2012, 05:34 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Browsing around youtube - I encountered an idiot trying to remove a post-auricular dermoid...
Made in Malaysia for sure~ http://youtu.be/LDo7Kw1Dhp4 This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jun 28 2012, 05:34 AM |
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Jun 28 2012, 09:40 AM
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Junior Member
71 posts Joined: Jun 2012
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Hi,
Curious.. does the 5 year MBBS or MD program include doing surgery in the OT? Or is that a specialist matter. Thanks. |
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Jun 28 2012, 09:46 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(jimncf @ Jun 28 2012, 09:40 AM) Hi, BS in MBBS is Bachelor of Surgery...Curious.. does the 5 year MBBS or MD program include doing surgery in the OT? Or is that a specialist matter. Thanks. |
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Jun 28 2012, 10:32 AM
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Junior Member
71 posts Joined: Jun 2012
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jun 28 2012, 09:46 AM) BS in MBBS is Bachelor of Surgery... Hi and greetings,Yeah.. I understand the BS part... but, how extensive the surgery will be? Would it be minor surgery like a 1/2 hour job taking a cyst out or those like open up the body into the heart, lungs or brain etc? thanks for the clarification. |
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Jun 28 2012, 10:39 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(jimncf @ Jun 28 2012, 10:32 AM) Hi and greetings, think you'll start off by just observing, or helping sometimes. but that's during the start of clinical years for me. Not sure how it is for other universities.Yeah.. I understand the BS part... but, how extensive the surgery will be? Would it be minor surgery like a 1/2 hour job taking a cyst out or those like open up the body into the heart, lungs or brain etc? thanks for the clarification. |
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Jun 28 2012, 01:47 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(jimncf @ Jun 28 2012, 09:40 AM) Hi, you will NOT be expected, nor allowed to perform any operations as a medical student ......you will have the opportunity to observe, and in the later years, scrub up and assist at operations.....Curious.. does the 5 year MBBS or MD program include doing surgery in the OT? Or is that a specialist matter. Thanks. |
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Jul 1 2012, 07:04 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Just came across this, from Perdana's PDF brochure online:
"Students graduating from PU-RCSI are conferred with the primary medical degrees of the National University of Ireland (NUI), Bachelor of Medicine, Bachelor of Surgery and Bachelor in the Art of Obstetrics (MB,BCH,BAO). In addition, they are awarded the historical licentiates of the Royal College of Physicians of Ireland (LRCP & SI. The MB BCh BAO degrees are recognized by the Irish Medical Council, the Malaysian Medical Council and other regulatory bodies throughout the world. The degrees allow the holder to pursue postgraduate training worldwide." Based on this representation, this would be the premier medical school in the country. Thoughts? This post has been edited by podrunner: Jul 1 2012, 07:06 PM |
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Jul 1 2012, 10:33 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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they all say the same things, so i don't bother to read their hype....
the degree is no different from pmc's, which has been around for 15 years, so it's nothing special... in addition, it is a well known fact that irish med schools are degree mills for would be doctors from around the world who failed to enter their own med schools, americans particularly.... |
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Jul 2 2012, 02:54 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Jul 2 2012, 09:40 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jul 2 2012, 02:54 AM) I wonder who else clicks on these links. |
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Jul 2 2012, 10:03 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 2 2012, 09:40 AM) I wonder who else clicks on these links. Me me CyberSetan always post interesting stuff |
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Jul 2 2012, 10:47 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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it is silly to have 'rural' mbbs....there cannot be 2 categories of 'doctors'....
india's problem, like most other countries, is maldistribution....with rural areas under served.... they can do rural bonding, like the aussie rural bonded csp places.....but the training programme should be the same.... another solution is training paramedical personnel to run rural clinics, like what msia is doing..... |
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Jul 2 2012, 11:09 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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I doubt a rural mbbs grad will introduce himself as a rural GP. Plus, it will be a nightmare to "regulate" if the rural GP decides to move to the inner city!
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Jul 2 2012, 11:18 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Personally I dont mind serving in rural areas. I think the Internet + cheap domestic airfares + higher priority to do specialization & extra allowances made it even better.
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Jul 2 2012, 11:49 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jul 2 2012, 11:18 AM) Personally I dont mind serving in rural areas. I think the Internet + cheap domestic airfares + higher priority to do specialization & extra allowances made it even better. rural does NOT mean some place you need to fly to.... |
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Jul 2 2012, 11:56 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 2 2012, 11:49 AM) rural does NOT mean some place you need to fly to.... Is Kuala Selangor / Sabak Bernam considered rural? |
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Jul 2 2012, 12:09 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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Is there a ideal number of patient a GP should see in a day ?
Went to a popular GP recently and the number at midday was 60 over hence he would be seeing at least 100 patients as he opens until 8pm. Charges including medicine range from 30 to 100.Take a mid-range of RM45.00 @100 patients and one day rest a week, he should be grossing RM1.35m a year.Net before tax should be RM 1m after expenses. ROI is 1 year if you are a good GP. Specialists earn even more ? |
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Jul 2 2012, 12:34 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(confirm @ Jul 2 2012, 12:09 PM) Is there a ideal number of patient a GP should see in a day ? you are committing the common fallacy of extrapolating the exception to the general....Went to a popular GP recently and the number at midday was 60 over hence he would be seeing at least 100 patients as he opens until 8pm. Charges including medicine range from 30 to 100.Take a mid-range of RM45.00 @100 patients and one day rest a week, he should be grossing RM1.35m a year.Net before tax should be RM 1m after expenses. ROI is 1 year if you are a good GP. Specialists earn even more ? my laksa man also sell 300 bowls a day.....guess what happens if i try to open another laksa stall nearby....? Added on July 2, 2012, 12:35 pm QUOTE(Syd G @ Jul 2 2012, 11:56 AM) Is Kuala Selangor / Sabak Bernam considered rural? will people complain if they are posted there?.....This post has been edited by limeuu: Jul 2 2012, 12:35 PM |
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Jul 2 2012, 01:14 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 2 2012, 11:49 AM) rural does NOT mean some place you need to fly to.... It means taking a 4 wheel, follow by a boat ride and a motor boat and no tv access. |
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Jul 2 2012, 02:45 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 2 2012, 12:34 PM) you are committing the common fallacy of extrapolating the exception to the general.... After sitting there waiting for 3 hours.....the best thing to do is to guess what is the income of this good GP.my laksa man also sell 300 bowls a day.....guess what happens if i try to open another laksa stall nearby....? Added on July 2, 2012, 12:35 pm will people complain if they are posted there?..... Certainly agree just like any other professions and business some will always do very well. But wife was saying how good if kids could become doctors and would be happy if they did half of the volume...ROI 2years. This post has been edited by confirm: Jul 2 2012, 02:56 PM |
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Jul 2 2012, 03:00 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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I've come to terms with the fact that ROI in monetary sense has become irrelevant. It may be my I, but definitely not my R.
This post has been edited by podrunner: Jul 2 2012, 03:01 PM |
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Jul 2 2012, 03:08 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 2 2012, 03:00 PM) I've come to terms with the fact that ROI in monetary sense has become irrelevant. It may be my I, but definitely not my R. Maybe RR! |
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Jul 2 2012, 03:21 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 2 2012, 03:08 PM) Maybe RR! RR = Rental Return? It better not be anything to do with my (increased) Respiratory Rate! |
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Jul 2 2012, 05:31 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 2 2012, 03:21 PM) RR = Rental Return? It better not be anything to do with my (increased) Respiratory Rate! Positive thinking leh. |
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Jul 2 2012, 06:09 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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I wonder how many malaysians went to oz for med earlier this year, and to UK this september. Just met someone whose relative is holding a UCL conditional.
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Jul 2 2012, 09:21 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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there are always more students to uk than oz, simply due to the number of places available...
i also know someone with a ucl conditional....wonder if its the same person.... |
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Jul 2 2012, 09:27 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 2 2012, 09:21 PM) there are always more students to uk than oz, simply due to the number of places available... The probability is very high. i also know someone with a ucl conditional....wonder if its the same person.... Re places, I guess it's due to the number of medical schools in the UK, and save for one or two, they all still offer undergraduate med degrees. |
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Jul 4 2012, 03:21 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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victoria medical students may all get their housemanship after all...including international students, with the new priority policy....
QUOTE In Victoria, 118 graduates are expected to miss out unless they are accepted in other states and territories. But competition has intensified after the Victorian government brought in a controversial system that gives international students who have studied in Victoria priority over Australian students who have studied outside the state. Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/educatio...l#ixzz1zdUujKVN |
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Jul 4 2012, 03:33 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 4 2012, 03:21 PM) victoria medical students may all get their housemanship after all...including international students, with the new priority policy.... At the end of the day, money talks. Don't frighten or kill the golden goose. The global economy does not look good and China may not take so much of the natural resources.Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/educatio...l#ixzz1zdUujKVN |
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Jul 4 2012, 03:49 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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other states may following this as well .THis could be why UTAS has just increased their MBBS fee for 2013 entry to AUD49,763 for year 1 increasing to AUD57105 in year 5.[totallingAUD266855]
This is a massive jump from AUD201000 for 2012 entry. |
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Jul 4 2012, 04:44 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Encouraging news. They just need to sort out the total shortfall. Like I've said previously, Victoria's internship placement is merit-based and I believe this will continue to be practiced, ie. after placing all the home VIC students, then internationals then face-off with each other for "prime" internship placements.
The rest may end up in less ideal training spots, eg private hospitals and remote locations catering for aboriginal services. It's training nevertheless, and the next bottleneck will be getting into specialisation programs. See article here: http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2012/s3516456.htm Numbers for next year: http://www.amsa.org.au/internship-crisis For VIC, there's still a shortage of 169 places, assuming all grads are staying put in VIC. Added on July 4, 2012, 4:47 pm QUOTE(confirm @ Jul 4 2012, 03:49 PM) other states may following this as well .THis could be why UTAS has just increased their MBBS fee for 2013 entry to AUD49,763 for year 1 increasing to AUD57105 in year 5.[totallingAUD266855] So they've done away with the "fixed" fee system then! Monash says "not more than 6%", and you just know that will need to be factored into the worksheet. This is a massive jump from AUD201000 for 2012 entry. This post has been edited by podrunner: Jul 4 2012, 05:04 PM |
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Jul 4 2012, 06:45 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 4 2012, 08:21 PM) victoria medical students may all get their housemanship after all...including international students, with the new priority policy.... The Victorian Hospitals have always unofficially prioritised international students in Victoria over interstate graduates, with a few exceptions, ie really outstanding med students from interstate. And now, they finally formalised it.Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/educatio...l#ixzz1zdUujKVN |
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Jul 4 2012, 09:22 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(confirm @ Jul 4 2012, 03:49 PM) other states may following this as well .THis could be why UTAS has just increased their MBBS fee for 2013 entry to AUD49,763 for year 1 increasing to AUD57105 in year 5.[totallingAUD266855] lucky i'm still with the fixed system. 50k per year? ouch.This is a massive jump from AUD201000 for 2012 entry. |
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Jul 11 2012, 12:14 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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OK... gov replied
I get to stay in Monash |
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Jul 11 2012, 01:48 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jul 11 2012, 12:14 PM) OK... gov replied Congrats, must be a load off!I get to stay in Monash |
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Jul 11 2012, 02:00 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 11 2012, 01:48 PM) Congrats, must be a load off! Yes. A lot of hard work ahead |
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Jul 11 2012, 03:24 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jul 11 2012, 12:14 PM) OK... gov replied Great!I get to stay in Monash |
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Jul 11 2012, 08:25 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Jul 11 2012, 12:14 PM) OK... gov replied congrats! I get to stay in Monash  |
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Jul 12 2012, 07:57 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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etc news~
1 lakh = 100,000 http://youtu.be/acjDBzQTPH4 http://youtu.be/b9cYD9RbDkQ http://youtu.be/RY-oI3ZzsRk This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jul 12 2012, 08:16 AM |
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Jul 15 2012, 05:01 PM
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Junior Member
31 posts Joined: May 2005 From: Lab Somewhere
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News from abroad - a bad news actually - from one of the northern states in India:
QUOTE Govt to ease norms for non-MBBS docs, Allopathy treatment will no longer be the preserve of MBBS doctors Source: http://in.news.yahoo.com/govt-ease-norms-n...-183000725.htmlMumbai, July 14 -- Allopathy treatment will no longer be the preserve of MBBS doctors. Practitioners trained in ayurveda, homeopathy and unani will soon be allowed to prescribe allopathic treatment, after undergoing a one-year course in allopathy pharmacology, the government announced on Friday. An ordinance to this effect will be issued next month. Medical education minister Dr Vijaykumar Gavit told the state assembly that non-MBBS practitioners who intend to prescribe allopathic treatment will have to clear an examination in allopathy pharmacology. This, the minister said, is to ensure that the government's decision stands up to scrutiny in court. The said course will start in August or September this year. » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « QUOTE Ayurveda, Unani doctors to strike work today As many as 2,000 ayurveda and unani doctors along with students from ayurvedic colleges in the city will participate in a nationwide strike on Tuesday to protest against the government move disallowing them from prescribing allopathic drugs. Dr Subash Gawari, vice-president of the National Integrated Medical Association, Pune district branch, said that a rally will be taken out from Tilak Ayurved College to the district collectorate. Only a few weeks ago, doctors from the Indian Medical Association had protested against the implementation of the Clinical Establishment Act, 2010 and National Commission for Human Resources for Health Bill, 2011 as proposed by the Union Health Ministry. “We are also opposed to the Bachelor in Rural Medicine (BRMS) course proposed by the health ministry. Our main demand, however, is to oppose the government's move that disallows us to prescribe allopathic drugs. In most of the talukas, there are no MBBS doctors and it is only ayurvedic practitioners who come to the aid of patients,” said Gawari. “The Maharashtra government had issued circulars in 1991 and 1996 allowing us to prescribe allopathic drugs,” said Gawari. The doctors have also opposed the Clinical Establishment Act that calls for a central body to supervise smaller state councils. This will dilute the power of state authorities and reduce accessibility of proper healthcare for patients, he said. The doctors will also protest against the violence meted out to doctors in Uttar Pradesh recently. Clinics to remain closed in Pimpri today ... contd. Source: http://www.indianexpress.com/news/ayurveda...k-today/972348/ QUOTE Medical body distances itself from ayurveda, unani doctors’ stir The Indian Medical Association (IMA) has distanced itself from the strike called by ayurveda, unani and homeopathy doctors. As many as 1,500-2,000 doctors from Pune and Pimpri took out a protest march demanding that they be allowed to prescribe allopathy medicines. » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « Source: http://www.indianexpress.com/news/medical-...rs-stir/972802/  Other related news: http://www.aalatimes.com/2012/07/13/ayush-...tra-government/ This post has been edited by mRNA-83: Jul 15 2012, 05:01 PM |
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Jul 16 2012, 09:07 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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india has a failed and failing healthcare system....and they are doing the wrong things to address the problem....
never mix up evidence based modern medicine system with largely non evidenced based alternative systems.... like i said earlier, they should have trained paramedics to provide basic healthcare like msia, rather than mixing everything up....a recipe for disaster.... |
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Jul 16 2012, 03:22 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 16 2012, 09:07 AM) india has a failed and failing healthcare system....and they are doing the wrong things to address the problem.... I quote from one of the comments:never mix up evidence based modern medicine system with largely non evidenced based alternative systems.... like i said earlier, they should have trained paramedics to provide basic healthcare like msia, rather than mixing everything up....a recipe for disaster.... QUOTE When the patient comes to Allopathy doctor he studies the patient first with the anatomy and finds the cause(Pathology), Distribution of the disease (Epidemiology), knows the type of microorganisms causing (microbiology) ,understands the disease nature (medicine) and understands the indications and contraindication for the drugs (Pharmocology). He applies all these after seeing a patient then come to decisionwhether to treat him conservatively Medicines)or need Operation (Surgery). So it is the knowledge off all the subjects studied in 5 yrs in allopathy will be applied to treat the patient. How can you cutshort all these and treat the patient by learning only Pharmacology? and in One year!!! Great !! Importantly the most abused drugs by these quacks are steroids and antibiotics.Does these ministers are concerned about the consequence of the public health with this? To prescribe one antibiotic in UK , you have a system and protocol. The higher antibiotics given to the patients is one of the main reason for having many drugs resistance organisms in India. Whereas the same drugs are choosen carefully by the allopathy doctor but infrequently compelled to presribed to compete with the local quacks. Does Health minister knows all these? Why cant they encourage the practice of other medicines in rural instead of blaming allopathy doctors ..The reason of giving a rural reason is a shitt.. He takes Money from association of the all the alternative medicine, amend the law and allow those people to practice allopathy.They know that they can make easy bucks.. These things can happen only in India. Comment by Dr.Jagadeesh 2012-07-14 07:44:52 Source: http://www.aalatimes.com/2012/07/13/ayush-...tra-government/ I just hope this stupidity will never happen in Malaysia - we have a lot of quacks already in our country - if they can prescribe allopathic medicines, it will be disasterous~ The level of corruption in that particular state medical council (Maharashtra) is unanimaginable, same goes for the other states - but to legalize allopathic treatment by AYUSH practitioner is certainly the first ever to be done~! (AYUSH - Ayurveda, Unani, Siddha, Homeopathy) On traditional and complementary medicine (TCM) practitioners in Malaysia, I hope with the tabled TCM Act their practice will be strictly regulated with evidence-based treatment as their core practice. This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jul 16 2012, 03:24 PM |
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Jul 16 2012, 03:26 PM
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Junior Member
55 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Studied and even had industrial placement in govt hosp but never got placed in healthcare dept after I graduated.... how do you guys/gals get da job meh?
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Jul 16 2012, 03:31 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(Rin @ Jul 16 2012, 03:26 PM) Studied and even had industrial placement in govt hosp but never got placed in healthcare dept after I graduated.... how do you guys/gals get da job meh? Firstly... tell us this...Are you an MBBS/MD/MBChB BAO graduate? if so from where? if not... then answers is simple... This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jul 16 2012, 03:40 PM |
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Jul 16 2012, 03:34 PM
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Junior Member
55 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Nope, I'm just a BA graduate... dang it Malaysia, y u make courses when can't place ppl into jobs
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Jul 16 2012, 03:50 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Rin @ Jul 16 2012, 03:34 PM) Nope, I'm just a BA graduate... dang it Malaysia, y u make courses when can't place ppl into jobs I don't see the relevance of your complaint. |
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Jul 16 2012, 04:38 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Rin @ Jul 16 2012, 03:34 PM) Nope, I'm just a BA graduate... dang it Malaysia, y u make courses when can't place ppl into jobs Why are you commenting in this thread, specifically? |
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Jul 17 2012, 12:26 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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... I've been considering an offer by Govt. TCM department to join them later when I finish my HO...
http://tcm.moh.gov.my/v4/bmelayu/ What do you guys think? - should I go bust some quacks? anyway... here is an 'entertainment': http://youtu.be/MBZTeyfWvNo This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Jul 17 2012, 12:48 AM |
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Jul 17 2012, 01:59 PM
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205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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a Malaysian relative just done a whipple procedure [bile duct/pancreas cancer] in Singapore General Hospital which is costing 2 to 3 times the price even compared to private medical centres here.
The reason going there is the lack of confidence in local facilities and doctors.Selayang GH,Subang medical,Sunway were recommended but were not pursued. Have to say the SGH/National Cancer Centre is really good.They have many good doctors and the facilities are world class. Is Singapore overrated ? Can Malaysia medical teams perform the same procedures equally well ? The family simply think Singapore is better despite it is a big hit financially. |
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Jul 17 2012, 02:43 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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Actually, SGH and NUH charges are not that high, compared to private hospitals in Spore.....
Wipples is a pretty old and standard operation, and is performed frequently in many msian hospitals, especially those with hbp units.... However, people will always look to a more 'advanced' country for 'better' care....indonesians come to msia, msians go to spore, and sporeans go to oz/us.... |
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Jul 17 2012, 05:06 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 17 2012, 02:43 PM) Actually, SGH and NUH charges are not that high, compared to private hospitals in Spore..... Ironically... many patients from the 'advanced' countries are here in India for treatment... just this morning a came across a couple from US seeking heart treatment in our VIVUS Heart centre...Wipples is a pretty old and standard operation, and is performed frequently in many msian hospitals, especially those with hbp units.... However, people will always look to a more 'advanced' country for 'better' care....indonesians come to msia, msians go to spore, and sporeans go to oz/us.... http://www.vivushealth.net/our-hospitals.html (I am posted in the 1st hospital in the list above) |
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Jul 17 2012, 05:20 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jul 17 2012, 05:06 PM) Ironically... many patients from the 'advanced' countries are here in India for treatment... just this morning a came across a couple from US seeking heart treatment in our VIVUS Heart centre... the reverse flow exist because of cost.....americans flies to jci accredited hospitals in india, thailand for treatment because it's cheaper (50 million americans have no or little insurance cover)......http://www.vivushealth.net/our-hospitals.html (I am posted in the 1st hospital in the list above) and sporeans go to johor for cheaper treatment, being allowed to draw from their cpf for some accredited hospitals..... |
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Jul 25 2012, 09:12 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2012/...mania-news.html
felt sad reading this yesterday hope things will change in the next year or so. sigh... Starting to worry about my future as an intern. hopefully i'll (and most of the international students who're intending to stay) be able to stay here. |
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Jul 25 2012, 11:42 AM
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jul 25 2012, 09:12 AM) http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2012/...mania-news.html On the one hand, there are giving students the opportunity to stay on upon graduation and on the other hand, they put some banana skins along the way.felt sad reading this yesterday hope things will change in the next year or so. sigh... Starting to worry about my future as an intern. hopefully i'll (and most of the international students who're intending to stay) be able to stay here.Yeah, back to the same old thing that they don't guarantee your internship. And they keep increasing the fees. What a load of shit! |
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Jul 25 2012, 12:10 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jul 25 2012, 09:12 AM) http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2012/...mania-news.html http://www.amsa.org.au/internship-crisisfelt sad reading this yesterday hope things will change in the next year or so. sigh... Starting to worry about my future as an intern. hopefully i'll (and most of the international students who're intending to stay) be able to stay here.the shortfall is shrinking, as new internship places are being created....down from the iriginal 495 to current 373..... tasmania has guaranteed all csp students intern places... tasmania has a population of 1/2 million, and needs only about 50-60 new doctors a year, so current numbers are significantly more than is required....traditionally, since the med school was established in the 60's many victoria students who can't get a place in the then only 2 med schools go to utas, and then return to vic for jobs....as can be seen from the vic numbers, vic now has surplus and likely not take interstate graduates....remember, vic place priority in selection on vic graduates, irrespective of residency status in oz..... the good news is that all states are now actively looking at solving this problem......and may eventually be able to place all internationals who want internship....the 'bad' news is, this will often mean regional/rural jobs.... Added on July 25, 2012, 12:12 pm QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 11:42 AM) On the one hand, there are giving students the opportunity to stay on upon graduation and on the other hand, they put some banana skins along the way. the new policy of graduate visas is a different thing from internship....Yeah, back to the same old thing that they don't guarantee your internship. And they keep increasing the fees. What a load of shit! the graduate visa is just to allow students to stay on for a time, and does NOT guarantee a job... internship is a guaranteed job..... the tuition fees charged is for education, and not to 'buy' a job after graduating....therefore like all courses, no university can guarantee a job for their students.....in spite of increasing fees, and the strong aud, there appears to be no shortage of applicants for these places..... This post has been edited by limeuu: Jul 25 2012, 12:32 PM |
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Jul 25 2012, 12:25 PM
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205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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How difficult is it to secure internship in NZ or Singapore ?
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Jul 25 2012, 01:53 PM
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3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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I think I read some news a while ago about NZ and SG wanting to take onboard those who aren't offered an internship place in Aus. but my memory on that is a bit hazy sorry.
Yeah i heard about states finding solutions for the situation, hopefully by then full paying international students like us will be guaranteed a place. I think Victoria changed their policies? I think international graduates are now equal to the local grads in terms of priority. I've read that in the newspaper i think. |
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Jul 25 2012, 02:15 PM
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 25 2012, 12:10 PM) http://www.amsa.org.au/internship-crisis Not guaranteed, fine but by implication, deemed to be more jobs available than graduates.the shortfall is shrinking, as new internship places are being created....down from the iriginal 495 to current 373..... tasmania has guaranteed all csp students intern places... tasmania has a population of 1/2 million, and needs only about 50-60 new doctors a year, so current numbers are significantly more than is required....traditionally, since the med school was established in the 60's many victoria students who can't get a place in the then only 2 med schools go to utas, and then return to vic for jobs....as can be seen from the vic numbers, vic now has surplus and likely not take interstate graduates....remember, vic place priority in selection on vic graduates, irrespective of residency status in oz..... the good news is that all states are now actively looking at solving this problem......and may eventually be able to place all internationals who want internship....the 'bad' news is, this will often mean regional/rural jobs.... Added on July 25, 2012, 12:12 pm the new policy of graduate visas is a different thing from internship.... the graduate visa is just to allow students to stay on for a time, and does NOT guarantee a job... internship is a guaranteed job..... the tuition fees charged is for education, and not to 'buy' a job after graduating....therefore like all courses, no university can guarantee a job for their students.....in spite of increasing fees, and the strong aud, there appears to be no shortage of applicants for these places..... internship guaranteed? then why onelove89 is worrying? Oh yeah, the increase in fees and the strong aud is already felt. A friend told me some are coming back to study locally especially those who enroll at the beginning of this year. |
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Jul 25 2012, 02:47 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 02:15 PM) Not guaranteed, fine but by implication, deemed to be more jobs available than graduates. sorry, did not make myself clear.....i do not mean internship is guaranteed....but that medical internship is a 'guaranteed' paying job, ie, it's employment with salary (in contrast to internship/attachment in other professions, which is non salaried)..... therefore, it is not guaranteed, just like any other jobs...internship guaranteed? then why onelove89 is worrying? Oh yeah, the increase in fees and the strong aud is already felt. A friend told me some are coming back to study locally especially those who enroll at the beginning of this year. |
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Jul 25 2012, 02:48 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 02:15 PM) Not guaranteed, fine but by implication, deemed to be more jobs available than graduates. I think you have misinterpreted. If a medical graduate has an internship spot, it means a job is of course guaranteed. It's the internship spot that is NOT guaranteed. internship guaranteed? then why onelove89 is worrying? Oh yeah, the increase in fees and the strong aud is already felt. A friend told me some are coming back to study locally especially those who enroll at the beginning of this year. As far as medical graduates are concerned, I do not recall reading about "more jobs available than graduates", definitely not in the last few years. |
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Jul 25 2012, 03:00 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jul 25 2012, 01:53 PM) I think I read some news a while ago about NZ and SG wanting to take onboard those who aren't offered an internship place in Aus. but my memory on that is a bit hazy sorry. i have already stated above that victoria now place international students in vic 2nd priority over interstate students (both local and international)....just behind local students in vic, which will still get 1st priority.....Yeah i heard about states finding solutions for the situation, hopefully by then full paying international students like us will be guaranteed a place. I think Victoria changed their policies? I think international graduates are now equal to the local grads in terms of priority. I've read that in the newspaper i think. and of interest to monash sunway mbbs students, they are placed in the same group as those interstate students.....ie have the same chances as international students studying onshore in the other states....however, looking at the numbers, it is unlikely many, or any will get jobs in 2013....as the shortage is >100 places....unless many csp students go interstate, and international students go to other countries... |
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Jul 25 2012, 05:09 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Just to update on the guy, who is a good student but did not get any interviews from his applications to UK, has apparently secured a conditional offer from Queens in Belfast through an agent.
The agent informed that all other UK universities medic places are now filled. |
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Jul 25 2012, 05:37 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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So there's some loophole to get into QBU then..
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Jul 25 2012, 07:00 PM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 25 2012, 03:00 PM) i have already stated above that victoria now place international students in vic 2nd priority over interstate students (both local and international)....just behind local students in vic, which will still get 1st priority..... I wouldn't be surprised if the postgraduate medical council of Victoria reverts to its previous priority list i.e. interstate domestic before local international - either this or the other states also follow suit - not that it makes much of a difference as there is simply not enough room to accommodate all the graduates into existing hospitals. (Private hospitals and clinics have been proposed as alternative training places)and of interest to monash sunway mbbs students, they are placed in the same group as those interstate students.....ie have the same chances as international students studying onshore in the other states....however, looking at the numbers, it is unlikely many, or any will get jobs in 2013....as the shortage is >100 places....unless many csp students go interstate, and international students go to other countries... The current estimated shortfall for 2013 spots is 373 (by AMSA), and this does NOT include Monash Sunway students...I think their chances are effectively nil... |
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Jul 25 2012, 07:25 PM
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Jul 26 2012, 12:00 AM) I wouldn't be surprised if the postgraduate medical council of Victoria reverts to its previous priority list i.e. interstate domestic before local international - either this or the other states also follow suit - not that it makes much of a difference as there is simply not enough room to accommodate all the graduates into existing hospitals. (Private hospitals and clinics have been proposed as alternative training places) It is basically a slap in the face for the Monash Sunway student, if PMCV had not changed their priority they would have had a higher chance of getting a job in Victoria. Now that PMCV has formalised the group 1 2 and 3, Monash Malaysia is placed in group 3, I could so imagine how devastated they are in terms of seeking internship in Australia. Even South Australia is ranking them below interstate internationals, ie priority 5, on par with the UQ New Orleans student.The current estimated shortfall for 2013 spots is 373 (by AMSA), and this does NOT include Monash Sunway students...I think their chances are effectively nil... In contrast, most Monash Sunway students last year got a job. Sigh. This post has been edited by tqeh: Jul 25 2012, 07:28 PM |
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Jul 25 2012, 07:29 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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I dont think Sunway Monash students expected internships in oz when they started. Its just when the first batch graduated, some were offered which was a pleasant surprise. In the earlier batches, more than 30% are JPA scholars and will be automatically excluded.
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Jul 25 2012, 08:46 PM
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 07:29 PM) I dont think Sunway Monash students expected internships in oz when they started. Its just when the first batch graduated, some were offered which was a pleasant surprise. In the earlier batches, more than 30% are JPA scholars and will be automatically excluded. This would make the Monash Sunway MBBS degree a much harder sell among private students - JPA to the rescue? |
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Jul 25 2012, 10:04 PM
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Numed students also don't get internship in UK.
Don't know whether it would affect them in future intakes. There is also talk that Jeffrey may go independent and another pms could be in the making. Nothing is static and value added is always ongoing. |
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Jul 25 2012, 10:18 PM
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 10:04 PM) Numed students also don't get internship in UK. Monash should have gone the JHU/Perdana route, get the Malaysian government to fund the initiative and reap the rewards - the Monash MBBS prestige is bound to be tarnished when word gets out that the degree is actually two-tiered...Don't know whether it would affect them in future intakes. There is also talk that Jeffrey may go independent and another pms could be in the making. Nothing is static and value added is always ongoing. |
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Jul 25 2012, 10:46 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jul 25 2012, 10:04 PM) Numed students also don't get internship in UK. i think the jury is out here.....Don't know whether it would affect them in future intakes. gmc will accredit the degree, so it will be allowed for provisional registration with gmc for the purpose of f1 and f2.... how the final year students will fit into the new system of f1 application and placement is unknown....there will be a test final year students in uk have to sit for nowadays....the score together with their final results will be used in ranking of applicants to the deaneries.... they do take in img into f1....and at the moment, it appears the available f1 places surpasses the number of graduating doctors from uk.....at least for 2012.... the other unknown is how ukba will look at this, whether they will issue tier 4 visas for non uk graduates for f1.....currently f1/f2 doctors gets extension of their existing tier4 student visas when offered f1...... Added on July 25, 2012, 10:48 pm QUOTE(Huskies @ Jul 25 2012, 10:18 PM) Monash should have gone the JHU/Perdana route, get the Malaysian government to fund the initiative and reap the rewards - the Monash MBBS prestige is bound to be tarnished when word gets out that the degree is actually two-tiered... i think most monash msia students already know that....especially those who have applied direct entry into oz med schools.....the cut off between the clayton and sunway campus is like a world apart.....This post has been edited by limeuu: Jul 25 2012, 10:48 PM |
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Jul 26 2012, 12:07 AM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 25 2012, 10:46 PM) i think the jury is out here..... When I spoke to the Dean of Numed, he said it was not possible for f1 but things could change.gmc will accredit the degree, so it will be allowed for provisional registration with gmc for the purpose of f1 and f2.... how the final year students will fit into the new system of f1 application and placement is unknown....there will be a test final year students in uk have to sit for nowadays....the score together with their final results will be used in ranking of applicants to the deaneries.... they do take in img into f1....and at the moment, it appears the available f1 places surpasses the number of graduating doctors from uk.....at least for 2012.... the other unknown is how ukba will look at this, whether they will issue tier 4 visas for non uk graduates for f1.....currently f1/f2 doctors gets extension of their existing tier4 student visas when offered f1...... Added on July 25, 2012, 10:48 pm i think most monash msia students already know that....especially those who have applied direct entry into oz med schools.....the cut off between the clayton and sunway campus is like a world apart..... Monash sunway intake this year somehow was lower this year and the numbers lesser but the previous year was practically all straight As and abt 30% more than this year's intake. Yeah, the difference in requirements can also be seen in other courses as well. |
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Jul 26 2012, 12:14 AM
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 25 2012, 10:46 PM) i think the jury is out here..... Monash is definitely losing its turf in Malaysia - Being the first foreign university campus gave Monash a head start in the private higher education scene; I am certain that Southampton and Reading are both seeking to emulate the success of Monash Sunway - this inadvertently makes them (including Nottingham and to some extent Newcastle) competitors in a very niche market - these universities cannot sell on price (dominated by the lower end degree mills) and they cannot offer the same experience that one would get in their respective main campuses. More foreign universities in the market can only mean a smaller slice of the cake for existing players (JPA/PTPTN allocation).gmc will accredit the degree, so it will be allowed for provisional registration with gmc for the purpose of f1 and f2.... how the final year students will fit into the new system of f1 application and placement is unknown....there will be a test final year students in uk have to sit for nowadays....the score together with their final results will be used in ranking of applicants to the deaneries.... they do take in img into f1....and at the moment, it appears the available f1 places surpasses the number of graduating doctors from uk.....at least for 2012.... the other unknown is how ukba will look at this, whether they will issue tier 4 visas for non uk graduates for f1.....currently f1/f2 doctors gets extension of their existing tier4 student visas when offered f1...... Added on July 25, 2012, 10:48 pm i think most monash msia students already know that....especially those who have applied direct entry into oz med schools.....the cut off between the clayton and sunway campus is like a world apart..... |
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Jul 26 2012, 10:26 AM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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With the listing of IHH, if one is to pursue medicine locally, I believe IMU will be most ideal.
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Jul 26 2012, 11:05 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 26 2012, 10:26 AM) With the listing of IHH, if one is to pursue medicine locally, I believe IMU will be most ideal. why? |
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Jul 26 2012, 11:25 AM
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 26 2012, 11:05 AM) why? Funding and assumed (rightly or wrongly) possibilities of having wider "training" (clinical years?) access to its stable of hospitals. |
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Jul 26 2012, 11:34 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 26 2012, 11:25 AM) Funding and assumed (rightly or wrongly) possibilities of having wider "training" (clinical years?) access to its stable of hospitals. the listing of ihh, which owns imu, will have a negligible financial impact on the operations of imu....it is not possible for clinical training to take place in private hospitals in the present msian context..... recent news about the private sector undertaking postgraduate training is just hot air... |
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Jul 26 2012, 11:42 AM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jul 26 2012, 11:25 AM) Funding and assumed (rightly or wrongly) possibilities of having wider "training" (clinical years?) access to its stable of hospitals. Khazanah, govt owned. A stroke of the pen will have an impact on the medical profession! |
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Jul 26 2012, 11:42 AM
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 26 2012, 11:34 AM) the listing of ihh, which owns imu, will have a negligible financial impact on the operations of imu.... IMU is being considered as a profit center, I suppose. it is not possible for clinical training to take place in private hospitals in the present msian context..... recent news about the private sector undertaking postgraduate training is just hot air... Back to the IPTAs then, if one can get in. |
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Jul 26 2012, 11:49 AM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jul 26 2012, 11:34 AM) the listing of ihh, which owns imu, will have a negligible financial impact on the operations of imu.... I reckon medical litigation will be the next big thing in Malaysia - malpractice lawyers rejoice it is not possible for clinical training to take place in private hospitals in the present msian context..... recent news about the private sector undertaking postgraduate training is just hot air... But in all seriousness, Malaysian patients go pretty easy on their doctors (that or they have no idea how/couldn't be bothered to file medical complaints). |
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Jul 26 2012, 12:02 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Jul 26 2012, 11:49 AM) But in all seriousness, Malaysian patients go pretty easy on their doctors (that or they have no idea how/couldn't be bothered to file medical complaints). only if they are not paying....try get a bad outcome in private practice on a paying patient, and see what happens... medical indemnity insurance premiums have doubled in the last 6 years.... |
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Aug 2 2012, 04:46 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Basically the story below is about - >A trauma surgeon by 26 y.o, graduated from three instituitions:
- Peking Uni - Kings College London - Royal College of Surgeon Actively involved in overseas aid missions... Have even written a book about it~  QUOTE Saturday July 28, 2012 Source: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...5915&sec=nationDoubts over ‘army doc’ MAJOR Chinese dailies have published doubts from the public over the medical qualifications of a 26-year-old man who claimed to be a military doctor, serving in war-torn countries. Sin Chew Daily reported that Winson Seow has said in past media interviews that he graduated from Peking University Health Science Centre, King's College London and The Royal College of Surgeons of England. » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « Links: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...2409&sec=nation http://drwinsonseow.wordpress.com/about/ http://www.facebook.com/ToServeWithLove.my then again.... ? This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Aug 2 2012, 06:05 AM |
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Aug 2 2012, 08:59 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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this guy is obviously a fake...i don't know what he and the father were thinking, to think they can get away with it in this age....
it is standard practice in many countries to perform qualification verification at source, ie they don't really bother with the cert itself, but will write to the university directly..... it is still not a common practice in msia, but i know some private hospitals that is doing this.....and it is one of the requirements under jci accreditation..... going forward, it will likely be an important component in the assessment of application for jobs.... in msia, it is already a requirement for all registered medical practitioner to quote their mmc no. in all documents.....anyone can verify the identity of any doctor here: http://mmc.gov.my/v1/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=50 |
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Aug 2 2012, 09:59 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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We are really in deep shit with all these fakes lurking around and worse still giving press conferences and media interviews.
Noted that this is not only in the med field but many of these fakes are holding high positions with the power to influence decisions made. Boleh land is really on a downward slide.....what more can we do? |
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Aug 2 2012, 12:27 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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To have lasted this long and even published a book... That is something... He even had an interview with TV3...
I guess he must have known and prepared for this all this while... Pity to all the Malaysians that have been scammed and given false motivation by this fellow... Very easy to claim 'doctor' these days... This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Aug 2 2012, 01:32 PM |
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Aug 3 2012, 11:56 PM
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Junior Member
12 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: Sydney, Australia
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Hi guys, just wondering if anyone here have any experience or advice on obtaining attachments/placements in Malaysia during the end of year break during Dec-Jan (coming from an Aus Med school)? Not talking about electives here as I'm not in my final years yet. I've tried emailing some lecturers from UM Medical Centre but I've yet to get any response thus far!
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Aug 4 2012, 12:15 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(jolenemeteor @ Aug 3 2012, 11:56 PM) Hi guys, just wondering if anyone here have any experience or advice on obtaining attachments/placements in Malaysia during the end of year break during Dec-Jan (coming from an Aus Med school)? Not talking about electives here as I'm not in my final years yet. I've tried emailing some lecturers from UM Medical Centre but I've yet to get any response thus far! if it is not an official elective, don't bother writing/emailing officially.....the best way is to know people, and do unofficial attachments.....but quite pointless, as one doesn't learn much from hospital attachments after the 1st year....better enjoy the holidays.....there will be no more long holidays once into the clinical years.... |
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Aug 4 2012, 12:22 AM
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Junior Member
12 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: Sydney, Australia
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 4 2012, 12:15 AM) if it is not an official elective, don't bother writing/emailing officially.....the best way is to know people, and do unofficial attachments..... Wow you're fast! I'm actually in a grad entry MBBS so we've started a small amount of weekly training in the hospital since the beginning of year 1. I've also recently completed a 2 weeks General Paeds attachment over my last break, but I totally get what you mean about enjoying the long holidays! Just trying to perhaps look out for an attachment of a week or two to see how the healthcare setting in Malaysia is like in comparison to Aus. but quite pointless, as one doesn't learn much from hospital attachments after the 1st year....better enjoy the holidays.....there will be no more long holidays once into the clinical years.... Looks like I'll resort to the unofficial way then.... |
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Aug 4 2012, 01:13 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(jolenemeteor @ Aug 4 2012, 12:22 AM) Wow you're fast! I'm actually in a grad entry MBBS so we've started a small amount of weekly training in the hospital since the beginning of year 1. I've also recently completed a 2 weeks General Paeds attachment over my last break, but I totally get what you mean about enjoying the long holidays! Just trying to perhaps look out for an attachment of a week or two to see how the healthcare setting in Malaysia is like in comparison to Aus. I have arrange twice for my relatives and frankly, you need to 'know' some ppl to have a meaningful attachment.Looks like I'll resort to the unofficial way then.... |
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Aug 13 2012, 01:06 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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A levels results out this week. Hope all UK med applicants with conditional offers meet the requirements! Apparently UCAS received about 90,000 med applicantions for 2012/2013. This figure was then "trimmed" down to about 20,000 competing for about 7,500 places in the 31 medical schools.
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Aug 13 2012, 01:59 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 13 2012, 01:06 PM) A levels results out this week. Hope all UK med applicants with conditional offers meet the requirements! Apparently UCAS received about 90,000 med applicantions for 2012/2013. This figure was then "trimmed" down to about 20,000 competing for about 7,500 places in the 31 medical schools. Apparently out today. |
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Aug 13 2012, 05:38 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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A levels results will be out on the 16th.....
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Aug 14 2012, 08:09 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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I don't dare imagine the numbers here. Even NHS' 6% rise in death rates is horribly scary! Black Wednesday indeed!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthne...ing-season.html This post has been edited by podrunner: Aug 14 2012, 08:10 AM |
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Aug 14 2012, 08:21 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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in the past, it was 1 august, and that could be a weekend, so you can imagine the chaos sometimes....they have changed to the 1sy Wednesday of august, which is midweek, and should have maximum staff strength available.....
it's actually more than 4 days in most unis.....eg, nottingham actually devoted 2 scheduled 'shadowing' periods before the new housemans start, 4 and 2 weeks respectively, so that new doctors can merge into service as seamlessly as possible.... |
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Aug 15 2012, 02:35 AM
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Junior Member
56 posts Joined: Mar 2011 From: The Earth
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Hi, sifu...which book do you guys use for anatomy and physiology? Which ones do you guys recommend? Erm, maybe I need more details than normal for the requirements.
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Aug 15 2012, 03:03 AM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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anatomy - chaurahsia
physiology - guyton |
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Aug 15 2012, 03:19 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(SticH @ Aug 15 2012, 03:03 AM) anatomy - chaurahsia Conclusion: SticH must have had Indian lecturers physiology - guyton This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Aug 15 2012, 03:20 AM |
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Aug 15 2012, 03:25 AM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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Haha yeah currently in aimst, but anyway those 2 books are really awesome especially chaurahsia, I like their clinical application and mnemonics
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Aug 15 2012, 08:25 AM
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Junior Member
56 posts Joined: Mar 2011 From: The Earth
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Haha, sure stitch. Any other recommendations??
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Aug 15 2012, 09:51 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Netter is pretty good for atlas.
Added on August 15, 2012, 10:20 amBtw : Winson Seow says sorry http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...0397&sec=nation » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « This post has been edited by Syd G: Aug 15 2012, 10:20 AM |
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Aug 15 2012, 10:32 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Aug 15 2012, 09:51 AM) Netter is pretty good for atlas. It was very foolish to mislead and misrepresent in the first placeAdded on August 15, 2012, 10:20 amBtw : Winson Seow says sorry http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...0397&sec=nation » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « |
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Aug 15 2012, 11:21 AM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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Netter is good for viewing only, if you seriously want to learn anatomy, read books. You can try grey's anatomy as well but I think it's too hard for medical students?
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Aug 15 2012, 11:58 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Aug 15 2012, 09:51 AM) Winson Seow says sorry http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...0397&sec=nation » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « he can mis-represent himself with his qualification in traditional medicine (if that is indeed itself true), but to claim qualification from kings, and royal college of surgeons of london (doesn't exist) is outright fraud.... |
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Aug 15 2012, 12:38 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(SticH @ Aug 15 2012, 11:21 AM) Netter is good for viewing only, if you seriously want to learn anatomy, read books. You can try grey's anatomy as well but I think it's too hard for medical students? i thought that's what atlases are for......This post has been edited by Syd G: Aug 15 2012, 12:38 PM |
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Aug 15 2012, 01:33 PM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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Yeah but I used to make the mistake of reading atlas lol, dont want anyone to follow my footstep
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Aug 15 2012, 01:39 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 15 2012, 10:32 AM) It was very foolish to mislead and misrepresent in the first place He is a fake and he cheated. Stupid! |
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Aug 15 2012, 08:16 PM
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Junior Member
108 posts Joined: Jun 2005
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i think reading Clinical Anatomy: Applied Anatomy for Students and Junior Doctor is good... but for certain high yield topics u'll need at least moores anatomy
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Aug 16 2012, 05:46 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Aug 15 2012, 09:51 AM) Netter is pretty good for atlas. Reminds me of something my lecturer said. GA was first done in launceston in the world, and I heard from a traditional med doctor that GA was done even earlier in china with some herbs remedy. just interesting to hear from two different fields Added on August 15, 2012, 10:20 amBtw : Winson Seow says sorry http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...0397&sec=nation » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « QUOTE(SticH @ Aug 15 2012, 11:21 AM) Netter is good for viewing only, if you seriously want to learn anatomy, read books. You can try grey's anatomy as well but I think it's too hard for medical students? Netter's atlas is really good, especially when it comes to Head and neck. i never really used texts, but i do have moore to refer to. I'm using Gilroy atlas too. but i think netter's is much more comprehensive. don't like grey's. too messy. personal opinion, not to offend hardcore grey's fans |
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Aug 16 2012, 12:48 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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wow, you study anatomy just by looking at atlases? that's genius!
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Aug 16 2012, 01:00 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Aug 16 2012, 12:48 PM) wow, you study anatomy just by looking at atlases? that's genius! i use lecturer notes instead of the texts in books. + atlas. i guess that worked for me. |
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Aug 17 2012, 01:00 AM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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Any idea where to get littman stethoscope?
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Aug 17 2012, 01:34 AM
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Junior Member
108 posts Joined: Jun 2005
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@SticH check your PM!!
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Aug 17 2012, 02:48 AM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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skyklg nice site you have there, more ebooks pls
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Aug 17 2012, 03:03 AM
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Junior Member
29 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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dear all, my gf just started working in hospital as houseman, she had to start from 7 am until 10 pm, and she very tired after back home and such. we rarely had time together now, rant finish
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Aug 17 2012, 06:41 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(optimus_shine @ Aug 17 2012, 03:03 AM) dear all, my gf just started working in hospital as houseman, she had to start from 7 am until 10 pm, and she very tired after back home and such. we rarely had time together now, rant finish When you marry her after housemanship and have children, her schedule wont be so crazy. Be thankful.--- I'm looking for Cardio III steth as per recommended by CyberSetan. Any lobang to get it here in Malaysia before I go buy from Amazon? |
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Aug 17 2012, 11:52 PM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Aug 17 2012, 06:41 AM) When you marry her after housemanship and have children, her schedule wont be so crazy. Be thankful. Doing bulk?--- I'm looking for Cardio III steth as per recommended by CyberSetan. Any lobang to get it here in Malaysia before I go buy from Amazon? |
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Aug 18 2012, 04:31 PM
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Senior Member
5,170 posts Joined: Jul 2006 From: /k//k/, /k/undasang
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also, I want to ask, is there a high chance for my GF to migrate and accepted to work overseas as MO, and I can follow her as partner?
is doctor still a shortage in overseas? say, US, UK ,AUS |
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Aug 18 2012, 05:17 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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How recognised are the basic medical degrees from UM, UKM and USM? I know SMC recognises UM's and UKM's. It was mentioned in another forum that USM is also recognised (by SMC). Is this a recent addition? I am not able to verify this information.
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Aug 18 2012, 09:12 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 18 2012, 05:17 PM) How recognised are the basic medical degrees from UM, UKM and USM? I know SMC recognises UM's and UKM's. It was mentioned in another forum that USM is also recognised (by SMC). Is this a recent addition? I am not able to verify this information. usm is not recognised.....msian medical degrees are not recognised in other countries.... however, graduates from the university of malaya in msia (ie graduates from 1969 to 1989) are recognised by the gmc in uk, and can register as a practitioner without condition.... |
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Aug 19 2012, 03:50 AM
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Junior Member
29 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 18 2012, 09:12 PM) usm is not recognised..... how about PMC? is it recognize say UK/US/AUS?msian medical degrees are not recognised in other countries.... however, graduates from the university of malaya in msia (ie graduates from 1969 to 1989) are recognised by the gmc in uk, and can register as a practitioner without condition.... |
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Aug 19 2012, 04:02 AM
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Senior Member
1,170 posts Joined: Apr 2011 From: Deus Vult
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Aug 17 2012, 06:41 AM) When you marry her after housemanship and have children, her schedule wont be so crazy. Be thankful. wah...cardio 3, thats quite high end...and the price --- I'm looking for Cardio III steth as per recommended by CyberSetan. Any lobang to get it here in Malaysia before I go buy from Amazon? ... wont classic be suffice for med student? |
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Aug 19 2012, 08:59 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(optimus_shine @ Aug 19 2012, 03:50 AM) how about PMC? is it recognize say UK/US/AUS? pmc irish degrees are only recognised in ireland and msia.....opportunity to perform housemanship in ireland is now restricted as there are not enough places.....so generally, one is confined to work in msia.....Added on August 19, 2012, 10:04 am QUOTE(kurangak @ Aug 19 2012, 04:02 AM) wah...cardio 3, thats quite high end...and the price there is no need to buy expensive stets.....the usual classic is fine..... ... wont classic be suffice for med student?This post has been edited by limeuu: Aug 19 2012, 01:59 PM |
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Aug 21 2012, 12:54 AM
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Junior Member
56 posts Joined: Mar 2011 From: The Earth
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Hello guys, may I know which websitescan we get practice questions in basic medical sciences?
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Aug 21 2012, 10:50 AM
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Junior Member
173 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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Hi all...is there a way to find out when housemanship posting will start? I was informed that they will only be informed 1 week before it starts and this makes it difficult to plan for a holiday so I'm trying to see if there is another way we can find out the exact date...I'm asking on behalf of my gf...
Thanks |
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Aug 21 2012, 05:00 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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if you are referring to msian housemanship, there is no fixed date of start...people are posted as and when there are available vacancies....and since there is no more shortage, the usual civil service induction programme as applicable for all other civil servants will also apply before start of work......
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Aug 22 2012, 09:37 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Aug 22 2012, 01:15 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Aug 22 2012, 09:37 AM) Sounds promising, particularly the "eligible for provisional registration as a doctor..........UK General Medical Council"In the spirit of "anyone can be a doctor", there's also this: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/08/01/go.../#ixzz22GskatOI |
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Aug 22 2012, 02:31 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 22 2012, 01:15 PM) Sounds promising, particularly the "eligible for provisional registration as a doctor..........UK General Medical Council" These students would most probably be placed in the least favored universities.In the spirit of "anyone can be a doctor", there's also this: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/08/01/go.../#ixzz22GskatOI Don't know whether to cry or not to cry. If cry, also no tears. Hope no rent-seekers come into play. |
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Aug 22 2012, 02:57 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 22 2012, 01:15 PM) Sounds promising, particularly the "eligible for provisional registration as a doctor..........UK General Medical Council" these students should at least be above average.....at least as far as their pre-u results is concerned...(4.0 in matrik however doesn't say too much, as about 10% of matrik students get that, ie it's just atar90 and above.....)In the spirit of "anyone can be a doctor", there's also this: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/08/01/go.../#ixzz22GskatOI and it's a lifeline to the new med schools, which are facing dropping enrolment due to stricter selection criteria imposed by mmc.... as for numed, i don't quite understand the dean's logic on how this establishment will reduce the brain drain.....if students are allowed provisional registration with the gmc, it means they can also apply for fy.....and i foresee the majority will (except perhaps the scholars).... This post has been edited by limeuu: Aug 22 2012, 03:03 PM |
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Aug 23 2012, 06:22 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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See Requirement 4 re MCAT - am I understanding it correctly, that one will be accepted and then sits for the MCAT? It is just a formality?
http://perdanauniversity.edu.my/pugsom/adm...sions-criteria/ Wonder what the numbers are like for the first batch. |
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Aug 23 2012, 10:26 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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why are they so vague about their requirements?....even for ielts and toefl and muet, they refused to clearly state their requirements.....
what does 'successful passage' of these tests mean?.....muet band 1, ielts band 1 acceptable?..... they are certainly leaving the door open for 'individual adjustments' by not making a stand on what they want.... |
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Aug 23 2012, 10:55 PM
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Senior Member
1,170 posts Joined: Apr 2011 From: Deus Vult
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 23 2012, 10:26 PM) why are they so vague about their requirements?....even for ielts and toefl and muet, they refused to clearly state their requirements..... i dont think u can go anywhere with muet band 1 in malaysia, at least in govt uni...what does 'successful passage' of these tests mean?.....muet band 1, ielts band 1 acceptable?..... they are certainly leaving the door open for 'individual adjustments' by not making a stand on what they want.... |
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Aug 23 2012, 10:59 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(kurangak @ Aug 23 2012, 10:55 PM) i dont think u can go anywhere with muet band 1 in malaysia, at least in govt uni... you obviously do not know that many 'govt uni', or ipta, does NOT need muet for admission....and only need muet band 1 to graduate their students.....but that's beside the point....band 1 is also 'successful passage' through muet....because there is NO pass or fail band in these exams.... This post has been edited by limeuu: Aug 23 2012, 11:01 PM |
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Aug 23 2012, 11:39 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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I thought medic students require a higher muet band to graduate. If a medic graduate can't get band 4, he should not be there in the first place.
This post has been edited by cckkpr: Aug 23 2012, 11:40 PM |
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Aug 24 2012, 03:44 AM
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Senior Member
1,170 posts Joined: Apr 2011 From: Deus Vult
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 23 2012, 10:59 PM) you obviously do not know that many 'govt uni', or ipta, does NOT need muet for admission....and only need muet band 1 to graduate their students..... orly? last time i check, eng. course, law course, meds, n all high value cost needs at least band 3/4 in order to qualify to take the course...but that's beside the point....band 1 is also 'successful passage' through muet....because there is NO pass or fail band in these exams.... din know that band one is more than enough to get admission... hmm... |
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Aug 27 2012, 09:21 AM
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Senior Member
709 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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QUOTE(kurangak @ Aug 24 2012, 03:44 AM) orly? last time i check, eng. course, law course, meds, n all high value cost needs at least band 3/4 in order to qualify to take the course... At least you have Band (whatever band) to get admission into govt uni.... din know that band one is more than enough to get admission... hmm... |
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Aug 27 2012, 09:42 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Not too late to apply for Numed's September 2012 intake! One of the options available for those who did not meet their conditional offers for the 2012 UCAS cycle.
 Maxis being coerced as well, it seems. |
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Aug 27 2012, 10:06 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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wow....they are desperate.....enrolment must be dismal.....
and the big selling point?....'opportunity for periods of study in the uk'..... |
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Aug 27 2012, 10:30 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 27 2012, 10:06 AM) wow....they are desperate.....enrolment must be dismal..... So it's just an "opportunity", ie a chance or possibility, not really a certainty. This is already a caveat.and the big selling point?....'opportunity for periods of study in the uk'..... |
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Aug 27 2012, 11:03 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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afaik, there is no provision in the programme for any attachment in the uk, unlike monash's where there is a mandated 3-4 months attachment in melbourne to ensure students are familiar with the aussie healthcare system....
but i suppose it is possible to do some kind of short term exchange to newcastle upon tyne..... but it must be quite a shock for unewcastle to experience lack of suitable students....when they have abundant excellent students to choose at will in the uk.... |
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Aug 27 2012, 11:44 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Looks like this year, fewer students going to UK to do med.
Could be failure to secure places or JPA won't sponsor any for this year. Many are heading to India. (From relative contacts) |
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Aug 27 2012, 03:20 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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know of a person on scholarship going to QMU doing dent.
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Aug 27 2012, 05:16 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Why are some consultant surgeons being addressed as "Mr" instead of "Dr"? Female consultant surgeons are therefore Ms/Mrs/Madam?
This post has been edited by podrunner: Aug 27 2012, 05:17 PM |
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Aug 27 2012, 06:20 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 27 2012, 05:16 PM) Why are some consultant surgeons being addressed as "Mr" instead of "Dr"? Female consultant surgeons are therefore Ms/Mrs/Madam? because historical barber-surgeons were not considered doctors, and called mr. by the physicians... the barber surgeon colleges dates back centuries, the first being the rcs edinburgh, given the royal charter by king james in 1505 (not kidding).... for the first 3+ centuries they were not considered doctors by the physicians of the day, and the term mr. used, in a condescending way..... when formal medical education was established to include surgery, in the 19th century, the usage of mr. persist for barber surgeon fellows..... it is still used in the british isles and ireland, and some commonwealth countries..... it's use is traditionally restricted to fellows of the 4 historical barber-surgeon colleges, ie edinburgh, england, glasgow and ireland...but the australiasian college has also adopted the practice... there is reverse snobbery now, as surgeons proudly use that title as a badge of honour that they are 'higher' than mere doctors! however, ironically, in msia, masters graduates in surgery from local unis (um/ukm/usm) have used that title, although it is inappropriate, as they are not fellows of the barber-surgeons.....you know, tumpang glamour a bit... |
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Aug 27 2012, 08:02 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 27 2012, 06:20 PM) because historical barber-surgeons were not considered doctors, and called mr. by the physicians... LOL @ tumpang glamour!! the barber surgeon colleges dates back centuries, the first being the rcs edinburgh, given the royal charter by king james in 1505 (not kidding).... for the first 3+ centuries they were not considered doctors by the physicians of the day, and the term mr. used, in a condescending way..... when formal medical education was established to include surgery, in the 19th century, the usage of mr. persist for barber surgeon fellows..... it is still used in the british isles and ireland, and some commonwealth countries..... it's use is traditionally restricted to fellows of the 4 historical barber-surgeon colleges, ie edinburgh, england, glasgow and ireland...but the australiasian college has also adopted the practice... there is reverse snobbery now, as surgeons proudly use that title as a badge of honour that they are 'higher' than mere doctors! however, ironically, in msia, masters graduates in surgery from local unis (um/ukm/usm) have used that title, although it is inappropriate, as they are not fellows of the barber-surgeons.....you know, tumpang glamour a bit... So this term dates back centuries. Good to know, thanks! |
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Aug 27 2012, 08:56 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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in public hospitals like HKL surgeons and consultants are still being called Mr...
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Aug 27 2012, 10:05 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(zstan @ Aug 27 2012, 08:56 PM) in public hospitals like HKL surgeons and consultants are still being called Mr... only if they are fellows of the ancient barber-surgeon colleges....the others should NOT be using that title.....i usually pointedly call them dr. xxx instead of mr. xxx..... |
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Aug 27 2012, 10:11 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 27 2012, 10:05 PM) only if they are fellows of the ancient barber-surgeon colleges....the others should NOT be using that title..... Am I addressing T's surgeon correctly, then? i usually pointedly call them dr. xxx instead of mr. xxx..... |
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Aug 27 2012, 10:19 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 27 2012, 10:11 PM) Am I addressing T's surgeon correctly, then? in malaysia, only the govt doctors seems to be fixated with this.....most surgeons in private practice just use the simple dr, to avoid confusion with the public....it is also not an issue in north america, where everybody is a dr. xxx, md.........but in your particular case, he would be indeed a fellow of one of the scottish ancient barber-surgeon colleges.....in fact, a double fellow..... as a guide, look for the alphabets frcs(college name) or fracs..... the masters will not have these.... |
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Aug 30 2012, 07:38 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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http://www.intohigher.com/uk/en-gb/campaig.../into-sgul.aspx
http://www.sgul.ac.uk/international/into Quite interesting that SGUL has an international MBBS program, UCAS code A900 (instead of the usual A100), 6 years course, last 2 years "clinical practice in the United States or other international clinical sites". I wonder if these graduates will be eligible for FYP, alongside the grads from the A100 program....seems iffy when clinical training is done outside the UK. Prospective students should ask the right questions. Just read the brochure online : "Graduates will be provisionally registered with the General Medical Council (GMC). Applicants should note, that as MBBS International graduates, you will potentially not be able to complete the first year of foundation training in the UK leading to full registration, as under prevailing UK immigration rules you may not be able to get a work permit." This post has been edited by podrunner: Aug 30 2012, 08:09 AM |
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Aug 30 2012, 09:50 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Good to know another pathway but for a high cost education its better to exercise caution.
As a Malaysian, I would prefer one that is at least recognised by our own gomen. |
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Aug 30 2012, 10:33 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Aug 30 2012, 09:50 AM) Good to know another pathway but for a high cost education its better to exercise caution. Yeah, for traditional courses, we prefer traditional and recognised universities. Or I'm just plain old- fashioned.As a Malaysian, I would prefer one that is at least recognised by our own gomen. |
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Aug 30 2012, 12:56 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Aug 30 2012, 07:38 AM) http://www.intohigher.com/uk/en-gb/campaig.../into-sgul.aspx they will be img's, but since it is gmc recognised, probably need not sit for the plab....http://www.sgul.ac.uk/international/into Quite interesting that SGUL has an international MBBS program, UCAS code A900 (instead of the usual A100), 6 years course, last 2 years "clinical practice in the United States or other international clinical sites". I wonder if these graduates will be eligible for FYP, alongside the grads from the A100 program....seems iffy when clinical training is done outside the UK. Prospective students should ask the right questions. Just read the brochure online : "Graduates will be provisionally registered with the General Medical Council (GMC). Applicants should note, that as MBBS International graduates, you will potentially not be able to complete the first year of foundation training in the UK leading to full registration, as under prevailing UK immigration rules you may not be able to get a work permit." for non eu residents, they will have to fight with the sub-continent imgs for places... the question is, what happens if a british graduate with this degree.....what happens..... |
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Aug 30 2012, 01:37 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Aug 30 2012, 12:56 PM) they will be img's, but since it is gmc recognised, probably need not sit for the plab.... If I am not mistaken, this is only for international students.for non eu residents, they will have to fight with the sub-continent imgs for places... the question is, what happens if a british graduate with this degree.....what happens..... |
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Sep 2 2012, 12:23 AM
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Junior Member
9 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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Hey people, is Physics important for studying medicine? I just dropped Physics in A Level but I'm worried that I will need it later when I study medicine. Should I take it instead of Biology or I have to study both? Also, what should I do when I have a gap between going to university? I want to go to Monash Sunway but I will be finishing my A Levels in July next year. Should I go read medical books/work in clinics (how exactly do people get work experience in hosptials?)/ or should I improve my English/rest aka sleep everyday? Please someone help me I'm very clueless.
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Sep 2 2012, 12:27 AM
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Junior Member
93 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 12:23 AM) Hey people, is Physics important for studying medicine? I just dropped Physics in A Level but I'm worried that I will need it later when I study medicine. Should I take it instead of Biology or I have to study both? Also, what should I do when I have a gap between going to university? I want to go to Monash Sunway but I will be finishing my A Levels in July next year. Should I go read medical books/work in clinics (how exactly do people get work experience in hosptials?)/ or should I improve my English/rest aka sleep everyday? Please someone help me I'm very clueless. where are you doing your A levels? if you've done physics up to AS, that should suffice. get the basic idea of pressure, water potential gradients, etc |
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Sep 2 2012, 12:31 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 12:23 AM) Hey people, is Physics important for studying medicine? I just dropped Physics in A Level but I'm worried that I will need it later when I study medicine. Should I take it instead of Biology or I have to study both? Also, what should I do when I have a gap between going to university? I want to go to Monash Sunway but I will be finishing my A Levels in July next year. Should I go read medical books/work in clinics (how exactly do people get work experience in hosptials?)/ or should I improve my English/rest aka sleep everyday? Please someone help me I'm very clueless. TO a certain extent, it is. Physics is one of the basic fundamentals to human physiology. Though I would doubt any sane medical school would test it to a great deal. You can drop it in lieu of Bio (assuming the other two subjects should be Chem and Maths). I have plenty of friends who did so and managed to get into medicine. However, Physics will give you a better edge if you score, it looks a lot nicer of 4 flats than 3As. During the 7 months you have, what to do is entirely up to you. You could do all of those you suggested as above. You could get a job or something. It's entirely up to you. Work experience in hospitals is not as "work" per se. If you do not have a background of basic medical knowledge, I highly doubt that it'll help much, it'll open your eyes towards the life of a doctor, certainly. |
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Sep 2 2012, 12:43 AM
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Junior Member
9 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Sep 2 2012, 12:31 AM) TO a certain extent, it is. Physics is one of the basic fundamentals to human physiology. Though I would doubt any sane medical school would test it to a great deal. You can drop it in lieu of Bio (assuming the other two subjects should be Chem and Maths). I have plenty of friends who did so and managed to get into medicine. However, Physics will give you a better edge if you score, it looks a lot nicer of 4 flats than 3As. During the 7 months you have, what to do is entirely up to you. You could do all of those you suggested as above. You could get a job or something. It's entirely up to you. Work experience in hospitals is not as "work" per se. If you do not have a background of basic medical knowledge, I highly doubt that it'll help much, it'll open your eyes towards the life of a doctor, certainly. I'm doing A Levels in Taylor's Sri Hartamas. I am just really scared that it's important because that's what my lecturer keep telling me. They said that in medical school people actually wants students that have studied physics because it's really important. He said that apparently Biology is not important because you can just read up anytime. (I really like studying Biology that's why I choose to study medicine- is this a legit reason??) I'm struggling to grasp those Physics concepts though dropping Biology will definitely give me time to catch up. And yes, the other two subjects are Chemistry and Maths. I don't have any problem with these two subjects yet (hopefully never haha). My real question is how can I get this "work experience"? Do clinics hire A-levels people to "test the water"?? Won't I be very annoying and disturbing to the normal operation of the place? The main reason that I want to have a "hospital experience" is because it'll look good on my application, can I just email the hospital and enquire? Do people do that?Added on September 2, 2012, 12:46 amPs: How do people prepare for the ISAT? Apparently Monash Sunway requires it can somebody tell me more about it? This post has been edited by wringgle: Sep 2 2012, 12:46 AM |
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Sep 2 2012, 01:05 AM
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Junior Member
93 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 12:43 AM) I'm doing A Levels in Taylor's Sri Hartamas. I am just really scared that it's important because that's what my lecturer keep telling me. They said that in medical school people actually wants students that have studied physics because it's really important. He said that apparently Biology is not important because you can just read up anytime. (I really like studying Biology that's why I choose to study medicine- is this a legit reason??) I'm struggling to grasp those Physics concepts though dropping Biology will definitely give me time to catch up. And yes, the other two subjects are Chemistry and Maths. I don't have any problem with these two subjects yet (hopefully never haha). My real question is how can I get this "work experience"? Do clinics hire A-levels people to "test the water"?? Won't I be very annoying and disturbing to the normal operation of the place? The main reason that I want to have a "hospital experience" is because it'll look good on my application, can I just email the hospital and enquire? Do people do that? well, i'm guessing you like the physiology and biochem parts of biology. as you may have already noticed in A2 you'll learn the bigger aspects of biology like natural selection, biodiversity, crop plants, etc which has near NOTHING to do with medicine. but its good that you like biology, which probably means you like reading and you are looking for a career which involves life long learning. what your teacher says isnt actually true, i know plenty of medical students who took bio chem maths and for their fourth subject they take either psychology, economics (me included), english literature and to a certain extent history or accounting. but there is no doubt a sound foundation in physics would help in the long term later on in your pre-clinical years. Added on September 2, 2012, 12:46 amPs: How do people prepare for the ISAT? Apparently Monash Sunway requires it can somebody tell me more about it? its quite difficult to get work experience here in malaysia for medical students, it'll take a looooong time for you to get a placement if you use the proper way of sending a formal letter to a government hospital. private hospitals are too tedious when it comes to protocols. i did mine in a government hospital in a rural part of town, they've been known to be more cooperative. it also helps if you already know a doctor, that way you could just ask him/her to settle a placement so you wont have to wait so long. its better to do your work experience at a hospital than at a clinic, you'll get to see a wider variety of cases (depends on which ward you are attached to) and you will get to experience the ever tiring life of a doctor.  |
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Sep 2 2012, 01:55 AM
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Junior Member
9 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(nitr0bacter @ Sep 2 2012, 01:05 AM) well, i'm guessing you like the physiology and biochem parts of biology. as you may have already noticed in A2 you'll learn the bigger aspects of biology like natural selection, biodiversity, crop plants, etc which has near NOTHING to do with medicine. but its good that you like biology, which probably means you like reading and you are looking for a career which involves life long learning. what your teacher says isnt actually true, i know plenty of medical students who took bio chem maths and for their fourth subject they take either psychology, economics (me included), english literature and to a certain extent history or accounting. but there is no doubt a sound foundation in physics would help in the long term later on in your pre-clinical years. Thank you for your fast reply. Unfortunately no one in my family is a doctor so that means I have no connections at all. I don't mind the wait but are you sure they'll allow an A Level student to walk around the hospital if I try applying for it? Also, mind telling me what rural part of town was it? Another question, If I study medicine and graduate from Monash Malaysia is there any chance of me working in the United States? Like can I take the USMLE? I want to do postgraduate training or subspecialty and I know that since the Malaysian healthcare system is chaotic there is basically no chance for me to have this kind of opportunity here. My dream is to do go into OBGYN. I know that it might seem like it's too early to think of this but I just want to be clear on what to expect. Hope someone can enlighten me on this too. its quite difficult to get work experience here in malaysia for medical students, it'll take a looooong time for you to get a placement if you use the proper way of sending a formal letter to a government hospital. private hospitals are too tedious when it comes to protocols. i did mine in a government hospital in a rural part of town, they've been known to be more cooperative. it also helps if you already know a doctor, that way you could just ask him/her to settle a placement so you wont have to wait so long. its better to do your work experience at a hospital than at a clinic, you'll get to see a wider variety of cases (depends on which ward you are attached to) and you will get to experience the ever tiring life of a doctor. |
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Sep 2 2012, 02:09 AM
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Junior Member
93 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 01:55 AM) Thank you for your fast reply. Unfortunately no one in my family is a doctor so that means I have no connections at all. I don't mind the wait but are you sure they'll allow an A Level student to walk around the hospital if I try applying for it? Also, mind telling me what rural part of town was it? Another question, If I study medicine and graduate from Monash Malaysia is there any chance of me working in the United States? Like can I take the USMLE? I want to do postgraduate training or subspecialty and I know that since the Malaysian healthcare system is chaotic there is basically no chance for me to have this kind of opportunity here. My dream is to do go into OBGYN. I know that it might seem like it's too early to think of this but I just want to be clear on what to expect. Hope someone can enlighten me on this too. i did my attachment in terengganu which is a far way from sri hartamas i'm not sure about that because monash malaysia isnt exactly monash australia. if you want to work in the states i suggest you try applying for IMU's partner medical school twinning programmes. you can complete your clinical years in the US/UK/Australia and you would have a better chance of working overseas. hospitals do allow A level students to come and do their work experiences, it's just a matter of which hospital would have the time to entertain you. you have to remember that hospitals are a busy place. |
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Sep 2 2012, 08:19 AM
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Junior Member
472 posts Joined: Sep 2005 From: JOhor Bahru
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 01:55 AM) Thank you for your fast reply. Unfortunately no one in my family is a doctor so that means I have no connections at all. I don't mind the wait but are you sure they'll allow an A Level student to walk around the hospital if I try applying for it? Also, mind telling me what rural part of town was it? Another question, If I study medicine and graduate from Monash Malaysia is there any chance of me working in the United States? Like can I take the USMLE? I want to do postgraduate training or subspecialty and I know that since the Malaysian healthcare system is chaotic there is basically no chance for me to have this kind of opportunity here. My dream is to do go into OBGYN. I know that it might seem like it's too early to think of this but I just want to be clear on what to expect. Hope someone can enlighten me on this too. O&G u can take MRCOG which is recognized by Malaysia.. In MY, only MRCP, MRCPCH, MRCOG are recognized..So u can go any uni in MY and then take MRCOG.. passed n woola, u're O&G specialist.. hehe But mind u, O&G has very high medicolegal prob.. |
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Sep 2 2012, 10:17 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(wringgle @ Sep 2 2012, 12:43 AM) I'm doing A Levels in Taylor's Sri Hartamas. I am just really scared that it's important because that's what my lecturer keep telling me. They said that in medical school people actually wants students that have studied physics because it's really important. He said that apparently Biology is not important because you can just read up anytime. (I really like studying Biology that's why I choose to study medicine- is this a legit reason??) I'm struggling to grasp those Physics concepts though dropping Biology will definitely give me time to catch up. And yes, the other two subjects are Chemistry and Maths. I don't have any problem with these two subjects yet (hopefully never haha). My real question is how can I get this "work experience"? Do clinics hire A-levels people to "test the water"?? Won't I be very annoying and disturbing to the normal operation of the place? The main reason that I want to have a "hospital experience" is because it'll look good on my application, can I just email the hospital and enquire? Do people do that? Let's put it this way. Most of the things in A-levels will help you in your future. It doesn't matter it's Bio, Physics, Chem or Maths. It is your basic solid foundation to scientific knowledge. It won't be directly linked to your medical studies directly, but my experience has been that it does help by somehow helping me to understand. For example, biology in A-levels helped me get through those mitosis, gene expression selection and etc. Now, I learn what goes wrong with them (mutatations) and how it has an effect on the body. Physics helped me learn cardiovascular physiology. Most importantly, check the pre-requisits for entry to the uni. If they ask for physics, and you don't have it, then they won't be sorry.Added on September 2, 2012, 12:46 amPs: How do people prepare for the ISAT? Apparently Monash Sunway requires it can somebody tell me more about it? "Test the water"? Honestly, I don't see how an A-levels person can "test" by "working" in hospital. All you get to is an insight to what doctors do. Not how they do it (thought process) or their stressors. Some doctors would welcome you for a week or so, letting you wittness consultations, surgeries and so on but yeah, sometimes you do feel in the way of normal operational procedures. Medicine is more than liking biology. If that is your sole cause of wanting to enter medicine, please think thouroughly. It is not cheap, it is not short. It requires much more than your liking of biology. Essentially, on the surface, it is biology, but deep down, it is so much more. As an example, you need to be socially adapt enough to deal with distressed patients (especially in exam settings, since we're students). You'd need to be able to balance your time well between play and studies. THink about this. What can studying medicine do to satisfy you instead of you studying some orther Bachelor of Science (Biology) courses, or maybe vet? Or other courses. |
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Sep 2 2012, 10:31 AM
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Junior Member
472 posts Joined: Sep 2005 From: JOhor Bahru
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Sep 2 2012, 10:17 AM) Let's put it this way. Most of the things in A-levels will help you in your future. It doesn't matter it's Bio, Physics, Chem or Maths. It is your basic solid foundation to scientific knowledge. It won't be directly linked to your medical studies directly, but my experience has been that it does help by somehow helping me to understand. For example, biology in A-levels helped me get through those mitosis, gene expression selection and etc. Now, I learn what goes wrong with them (mutatations) and how it has an effect on the body. Physics helped me learn cardiovascular physiology. Most importantly, check the pre-requisits for entry to the uni. If they ask for physics, and you don't have it, then they won't be sorry. Doing biology will help u understand those mitosis stuff but when u're working, who cares about mitosis all those stuff?!"Test the water"? Honestly, I don't see how an A-levels person can "test" by "working" in hospital. All you get to is an insight to what doctors do. Not how they do it (thought process) or their stressors. Some doctors would welcome you for a week or so, letting you wittness consultations, surgeries and so on but yeah, sometimes you do feel in the way of normal operational procedures. Medicine is more than liking biology. If that is your sole cause of wanting to enter medicine, please think thouroughly. It is not cheap, it is not short. It requires much more than your liking of biology. Essentially, on the surface, it is biology, but deep down, it is so much more. As an example, you need to be socially adapt enough to deal with distressed patients (especially in exam settings, since we're students). You'd need to be able to balance your time well between play and studies. THink about this. What can studying medicine do to satisfy you instead of you studying some orther Bachelor of Science (Biology) courses, or maybe vet? Or other courses. In your clinical years, ur examiner wont ask u about mitosis as well.. In your HO training, it's totally diff story.. so A-Level or STPM subjects are useless when u go into clinical years and beyond.. unless u wanna do research when u graduate la.. |
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Sep 2 2012, 11:44 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(jingyong @ Sep 2 2012, 10:31 AM) Doing biology will help u understand those mitosis stuff but when u're working, who cares about mitosis all those stuff?! What is the HO population like in SGH? Was there a few times last couple of months, and I got the impression that there are LOTS, and even lots more med students milling about. Some med students were observed to be really keen on learning, but noticed a few who were more keen on their smartphones WHEN things were being explained to them! I felt more uncomfortable than them.In your clinical years, ur examiner wont ask u about mitosis as well.. In your HO training, it's totally diff story.. so A-Level or STPM subjects are useless when u go into clinical years and beyond.. unless u wanna do research when u graduate la.. |
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Sep 2 2012, 02:03 PM
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Junior Member
472 posts Joined: Sep 2005 From: JOhor Bahru
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Sep 2 2012, 11:44 AM) What is the HO population like in SGH? Was there a few times last couple of months, and I got the impression that there are LOTS, and even lots more med students milling about. Some med students were observed to be really keen on learning, but noticed a few who were more keen on their smartphones WHEN things were being explained to them! I felt more uncomfortable than them. When I was in SGH, quite a number of HO.. can say like 10 in a ward or so.. I have not seen any of my friends did that during my med school time.. maybe now things have changed.. lolor maybe they r searching internet for info.. |
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Sep 2 2012, 03:46 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(jingyong @ Sep 2 2012, 10:31 AM) Doing biology will help u understand those mitosis stuff but when u're working, who cares about mitosis all those stuff?! Not when working, I agree.In your clinical years, ur examiner wont ask u about mitosis as well.. In your HO training, it's totally diff story.. so A-Level or STPM subjects are useless when u go into clinical years and beyond.. unless u wanna do research when u graduate la.. But if you do not understand mitosis, how things can potentially go wrong, you wouldn't be able to understand how genetic mutations affect the cell. It may not be the fact that its used directly in your working years, but fundamental knowledge is there for a reason. That is why most unis will have basic medical sciences as their first year curriculum. Furthermore, if you've forgotten, medical students do need those knowledge to pass their exams. P/S: For ISAT, the example questions are way easier than the actual exam, do not use them as gauge. The exam will be 3 hours long and therefore be mentally prepared. I lost my concentration 2hours in and it affected my score. As far as I know, there are no test papers around to practise. This post has been edited by D_s_X: Sep 2 2012, 03:50 PM |
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Sep 2 2012, 10:02 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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(Hope limeuu can shed some light onto this)
I was surfing through the internet and browse through some specialists' CV in some private medical centres in Malaysia. To my surprise there were a lot of doctors, graduated from UM, worked most (except fellowship) of their career in Malaysia, are able to obtain FRCS (for whatever surgery it is) eventually, and most of them obtain their FRCS at about 6th year out! How is that possible? Ie graduated in 1987, FRCSOpth 1993. Fully registered with GMC and MMC. |
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Sep 2 2012, 11:38 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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like i said before, those graduated up to 1989 are recognised by the gmc, and can get full registration....
many actually went and worked a while in uk...it was as simple as flying there as a tourist, apply for jobs, and then once getting an offer, converting the tourist visa into a 4 year work visa..... many however did not, but the old style frcs can be sat for, with recognised work in some hospitals in msia....once signed up, they can just register with the colleges and fly to uk to sit for the exams.... it is still possible to sit for the exam, but the name has been changed to mrcs, which is not recognsied by msia....the frcs now is the speciality 'part 3' exam previously, which can only be sat for with recognised training rotation in the uk....no training in msia is recognised for this....hence surgical training are now exclusively masters for local msian graduates..... |
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Sep 6 2012, 03:41 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Sep 3 2012, 04:38 AM) like i said before, those graduated up to 1989 are recognised by the gmc, and can get full registration.... I see. Thank you for that information. Does that mean all the senior consultants' previous FRCS are actually the current "MRCS" ? Gosh it is all pretty confusing now.many actually went and worked a while in uk...it was as simple as flying there as a tourist, apply for jobs, and then once getting an offer, converting the tourist visa into a 4 year work visa..... many however did not, but the old style frcs can be sat for, with recognised work in some hospitals in msia....once signed up, they can just register with the colleges and fly to uk to sit for the exams.... it is still possible to sit for the exam, but the name has been changed to mrcs, which is not recognsied by msia....the frcs now is the speciality 'part 3' exam previously, which can only be sat for with recognised training rotation in the uk....no training in msia is recognised for this....hence surgical training are now exclusively masters for local msian graduates..... |
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Sep 6 2012, 04:34 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Sep 6 2012, 03:41 PM) I see. Thank you for that information. Does that mean all the senior consultants' previous FRCS are actually the current "MRCS" ? Gosh it is all pretty confusing now. no...the old frcs was the only fellowship given previously, and the standards required is like the current frcs...however, because of subspecialisation, a 'part 3' frcs was started, in subspeciality....ie for certification after a period of further subspeciality training....because it was confusing, they decided to just give one frcs, and general surgery added as one of the subspeciality...the old original frcs was then downgraded into a lower qualification and name changed to afrcs, and now mrcs..... the extend of knowledge and experience expected for the mrcs is less than the original frcs.....the original frcs is equivalent to the current frcs(gen surgery)....... in the past, neurosurgeons are also frcs....now they get frcs(surgical neurology)..... hope that makes sense... |
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Sep 15 2012, 05:10 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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This year Glasgow University has 5 Malaysians, of which 3 are from Sunway, 1 from Kyuem and the other not sure. None from Sunway last year. Sg has 10+ and looks like sg are everywhere and they seem to dominate the international intakes.
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Sep 15 2012, 05:48 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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malaysians disadvantaged in temrs of finances and educational opportunities.
a lot of students would settle for JPA scholarship to <insert third world country> or matriks rather than try to go for A levels and risk not getting anything. |
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Sep 16 2012, 11:19 PM
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Junior Member
80 posts Joined: Mar 2009
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Hello! I'm currently an A-Levels student and I'm looking forward to studying Medicine in the UK or Singapore. =P
Is there anyone here who is studying in NUS Medicine from A-levels? Because it seems that my actual results will only be out after the application deadline. The website says that SAT is needed for ppl like me but this pathway in inapplicable for Medicine. So I guess that the only way for me to apply for NUS is to wait for another year? I'm currently narrowing down my university options as I will need to send in my UCAS soon. Anyone here would like to suggest their UK university and share their experiences? |
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Sep 17 2012, 12:00 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(ltvl0929 @ Sep 16 2012, 11:19 PM) Hello! I'm currently an A-Levels student and I'm looking forward to studying Medicine in the UK or Singapore. =P Any of the Russell group is recommended.Is there anyone here who is studying in NUS Medicine from A-levels? Because it seems that my actual results will only be out after the application deadline. The website says that SAT is needed for ppl like me but this pathway in inapplicable for Medicine. So I guess that the only way for me to apply for NUS is to wait for another year? I'm currently narrowing down my university options as I will need to send in my UCAS soon. Anyone here would like to suggest their UK university and share their experiences? |
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Sep 17 2012, 07:03 AM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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MBBS from Exeter ,a new Russell has yet to be recognised by SMC ?
MBBS from Aberdeen,Leicester,Dundee, St Andrew not as good as those from the lesser Russell ? Any comments ? |
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Sep 17 2012, 07:28 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(ltvl0929 @ Sep 16 2012, 11:19 PM) Hello! I'm currently an A-Levels student and I'm looking forward to studying Medicine in the UK or Singapore. =P I assume you would have already sat for the UKCAT, and your PS is more or less written up. If you have not already visited TSR, it will be good to do so;Is there anyone here who is studying in NUS Medicine from A-levels? Because it seems that my actual results will only be out after the application deadline. The website says that SAT is needed for ppl like me but this pathway in inapplicable for Medicine. So I guess that the only way for me to apply for NUS is to wait for another year? I'm currently narrowing down my university options as I will need to send in my UCAS soon. Anyone here would like to suggest their UK university and share their experiences? http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=195 Lots of information here, and there are univeristy-specific discussions as well. Which universities are you considering at the moment? Good Luck! |
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Sep 17 2012, 10:38 PM
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Junior Member
80 posts Joined: Mar 2009
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Sep 17 2012, 07:28 AM) I assume you would have already sat for the UKCAT, and your PS is more or less written up. If you have not already visited TSR, it will be good to do so; Yup, I've been there. Would like to get the opinions of Malaysian students too because most ppl from TSR are UK locals if not mistaken. Yea, I've written my PS but still some tuning to do. Sadly, I didn't do so well for my UKCAT. I'm actually considering places like Belfast, Manchester, Southampton. But I haven't really narrowed down my choices yet. Thanks http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=195 Lots of information here, and there are univeristy-specific discussions as well. Which universities are you considering at the moment? Good Luck!  |
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Sep 18 2012, 12:24 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(ltvl0929 @ Sep 17 2012, 10:38 PM) Yup, I've been there. Would like to get the opinions of Malaysian students too because most ppl from TSR are UK locals if not mistaken. Yea, I've written my PS but still some tuning to do. Sadly, I didn't do so well for my UKCAT. I'm actually considering places like Belfast, Manchester, Southampton. But I haven't really narrowed down my choices yet. Thanks Belfast do offer places at the education fairs and some agents can get direct entry but not a preferred one. |
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Sep 20 2012, 10:08 PM
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Junior Member
80 posts Joined: Mar 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Sep 18 2012, 12:24 AM) Belfast do offer places at the education fairs and some agents can get direct entry but not a preferred one. What do you mean by direct entry but not a preferred one?I have narrowed down my final 7. - Aberdeen - Dundee - Cardiff - Leicester - Queen's Belfast - Southampton - Nottingham Anyone would like to share their experience / understand which might help me to finalise my final 4? Haha. =) |
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Sep 20 2012, 11:28 PM
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Junior Member
93 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(confirm @ Sep 17 2012, 07:03 AM) MBBS from Exeter ,a new Russell has yet to be recognised by SMC ? exeter got MBBS ah?MBBS from Aberdeen,Leicester,Dundee, St Andrew not as good as those from the lesser Russell ? Any comments ? |
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Sep 21 2012, 12:46 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(nitr0bacter @ Sep 20 2012, 11:28 PM) exeter got MBBS ah? it's the peninsula medical school......under the 2 unis of exeter and plymouth.....recent new med schools have all been affiliated med schools with established ones (eg, keele with manchester, durham with newcastle), or joint ones between adjacent unis, eg hull/york, brighton/sussex..... |
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Sep 21 2012, 03:25 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Huge Malaysian presence in Uni of Liverpool this year.
3 "FAMA" scholars, 2 JPA national scholars (from the top 30 spm 2009 batch) - both with 4A* 4 Mara scholars 4 girls, 5 boys. |
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Sep 21 2012, 04:16 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Sep 21 2012, 03:25 PM) Huge Malaysian presence in Uni of Liverpool this year. so what's the mara scholars' results?.....3 "FAMA" scholars, 2 JPA national scholars (from the top 30 spm 2009 batch) - both with 4A* 4 Mara scholars 4 girls, 5 boys. |
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Sep 21 2012, 04:30 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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4 of the 9 are from KYUEM as reported in their advertisement in Sunday Star.
Liverpool is popular in KYUEM. |
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Sep 21 2012, 05:10 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Sep 21 2012, 04:16 PM) so what's the mara scholars' results?..... The information you require is currently not available.This post has been edited by podrunner: Sep 21 2012, 05:37 PM |
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Sep 21 2012, 05:22 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Sep 21 2012, 03:25 PM) Huge Malaysian presence in Uni of Liverpool this year. Any from sg?3 "FAMA" scholars, 2 JPA national scholars (from the top 30 spm 2009 batch) - both with 4A* 4 Mara scholars 4 girls, 5 boys. Glasgow has >15. This post has been edited by cckkpr: Sep 22 2012, 11:55 PM |
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Sep 21 2012, 05:29 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(confirm @ Sep 21 2012, 04:30 PM) 4 of the 9 are from KYUEM as reported in their advertisement in Sunday Star. The 2 JPA scholars are from KYUEM. Not sure if the other 2 are from Mara. I can't find the advertisement.Liverpool is popular in KYUEM. |
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Sep 21 2012, 05:39 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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The Sunday Star two to three weeks ago,if not it must be the Saturday edition in those two weeks. Recall the lowest score is 3 As .
The advertisement listed all the top scorers[more than 100s] and where they are going and which courses.... |
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Sep 21 2012, 05:42 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(confirm @ Sep 21 2012, 05:39 PM) The Sunday Star two to three weeks ago,if not it must be the Saturday edition in those two weeks. Recall the lowest score is 3 As . 3As pretty standard requirement, if they like you in the interviews.The advertisement listed all the top scorers[more than 100s] and where they are going and which courses.... Saw the ad... the other two from KYUEM are Mara scholars. Many from the following list are doing Medicine, 13 from KYUEM alone. http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...2132&sec=nation This post has been edited by podrunner: Sep 21 2012, 06:14 PM |
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Sep 21 2012, 07:11 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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Anyone knows where is Gladys Tan,the top scorer in 2009 SPM from Kuching.....remember she wanted to do biology....
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Sep 21 2012, 07:17 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(confirm @ Sep 21 2012, 07:11 PM) Anyone knows where is Gladys Tan,the top scorer in 2009 SPM from Kuching.....remember she wanted to do biology.... I understand she wanted to go to the States to do Psychology. |
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Sep 21 2012, 08:05 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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All these top scorers studying medicine in UK were on 2 years A level in KYUEM. Since they are scholars as well, 3 to 4A* are perhaps really easy for them.
Know of a guy,not a scholar [maybe he declined] managed to score A*A*A*A*a [with all components in each of the 5 subjects at high distinction] in 11 months after SPM .He is scoring D average in UTAS med 1st year.Father is a med specialist in Pearl of the Orient. Will be interesting to know how well Aust Year 12 scorer do in UK med ... |
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Sep 21 2012, 10:08 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Like Limeuu previously said, the slate is wiped clean upon starting medical school. While pre-U results gets one into the course, what one does in medical school is one whole other ball game. For a start, the environment is totally different in university, and nobody is going to make sure one studies, and keep at it.
An academician friend opined that in his experience, the students who fare better in university are the ones who more or less studied independently while in secondary school, and in pre-u with no tuition at all. He added that there are A level students who attend tuition as well (due to habit), and is thus unfazed by all the A*s. With 4A*a, said student could have gotten a place to read medicine in the UK, unless PSs and/or interviews were not quite up to par. As for performance in UTAS thus far, let's hope he overcomes his predicament, soon. |
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Sep 21 2012, 10:52 PM
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205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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Sorry, D stands for distinction.He is in fact doing well.
Agree with you all the As do not mean one will do well. Understand father wanted him to finish fast ...otherwise he would like to go Cambridge ! Shouldn't he ? This post has been edited by confirm: Sep 21 2012, 10:57 PM |
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Sep 21 2012, 11:22 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(confirm @ Sep 21 2012, 10:52 PM) Sorry, D stands for distinction.He is in fact doing well. Ok that's more like it!Agree with you all the As do not mean one will do well. Understand father wanted him to finish fast ...otherwise he would like to go Cambridge ! Shouldn't he ? I am sure father has his reasons. However to give Cambridge a miss...oh dear. UNLESS, the father knows that LOTS of Oxbridge medical students end up in research and academia. Added on September 23, 2012, 12:22 pm QUOTE(cckkpr @ Sep 21 2012, 05:22 PM) Any from sg? Missed this post earlier. None from sg for med but apparently lots of Singaporeans reading law.Glasgow has >15. This post has been edited by podrunner: Sep 23 2012, 12:22 PM |
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Oct 1 2012, 04:20 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Anyone in India kind enough to help me buy Clinical & Surgical Anatomy by Vishram Singh?
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Oct 1 2012, 08:50 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Oct 1 2012, 04:20 PM) Anyone in India kind enough to help me buy Clinical & Surgical Anatomy by Vishram Singh? Maybe PM Cybersetan?I was told this is highly recommended - http://www.visiblebody.com/atlas_overview This post has been edited by podrunner: Oct 1 2012, 08:55 PM |
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Oct 2 2012, 03:32 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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Documentary time:
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Oct 2 2012, 06:13 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 1 2012, 08:50 PM) Maybe PM Cybersetan? Visible body is good as an atlas I was told this is highly recommended - http://www.visiblebody.com/atlas_overview . But it lacks things like ligaments and clinical-oriented info.QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Oct 2 2012, 03:32 AM) Documentary time: What are the odds that you posted just right after that and didnt event see my post.. aihhh  |
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Oct 2 2012, 11:53 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Oct 2 2012, 06:13 AM) Visible body is good as an atlas I saw that post. I'm not familiar with Vishram Singh's book. Here in India we use the somewhat 'standard' book for the entire country for anatomy subject - by Chaurasia. (3 volumes) . But it lacks things like ligaments and clinical-oriented info.What are the odds that you posted just right after that and didnt event see my post.. aihhh http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uf4elGpkdhM This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Oct 2 2012, 11:58 AM |
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Oct 3 2012, 09:34 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Wonder which country will send their scholars to do medicine in Malaysia. The article is quite hilarious, really.
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...5706&sec=nation |
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Oct 3 2012, 09:56 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 3 2012, 09:34 PM) Wonder which country will send their scholars to do medicine in Malaysia. The article is quite hilarious, really. AFAIK, Mauritius.http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...5706&sec=nation |
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Oct 3 2012, 11:41 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Oct 3 2012, 09:56 PM) AFAIK, Mauritius. Which med school are they in?So Mauritius recognizes Malaysian mbbs. One is more than nought. |
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Oct 6 2012, 08:10 PM
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Junior Member
205 posts Joined: Oct 2011
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Oct 6 2012, 10:09 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(confirm @ Oct 6 2012, 08:10 PM) Many ppl very vulnerable to fear and that's what certain religious preaching thrive on. Once it gets to the subconscious mind, it's more or less a done deal. Sad, real sad. |
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Oct 12 2012, 02:39 PM
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Junior Member
172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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Looks like WA is the first state to guarantee internships for all its students this year, let's see if other states follow suit...
"The State Government has ended speculation over the looming shortage of places for Australian medical graduates by guaranteeing internships for all WA-trained doctors next year and some interstate graduates." http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/15...90-new-doctors/ |
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Oct 12 2012, 03:07 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 12 2012, 02:39 PM) Looks like WA is the first state to guarantee internships for all its students this year, let's see if other states follow suit... "The State Government has ended speculation over the looming shortage of places for Australian medical graduates by guaranteeing internships for all WA-trained doctors next year and some interstate graduates." http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/15...90-new-doctors/ good news indeed! |
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Oct 12 2012, 03:59 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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the shortfall now is about 182 places, for 2013, of which the federal govt had allocated $10mil to accommodate 100.....the respective states are supposed to cough up the balance to absorb the remaining 82, but due to politics, have been dragging their feet....looks like the wa gov is the first to move...
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Oct 12 2012, 11:16 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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When rational ppl starts moving, things get done. Get politics out of the way. Bolehland need lots of such ppl.
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Oct 16 2012, 12:47 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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For medical student wannabes and current medical students, 5 tips worth reading:
https://www.facebook.com/ArundiMahendranMBB...ster=ts&fref=ts "Due to popular demand, I'm reposting the below. Good luck with all those applications! Will follow up soon with some tips on how to get into surgery school. Tips for the aspiring physician! Many of you have asked me advice regarding a career in Medicine. Here are my top 5 tips: 1. Get some work experience. Volunteer at your local hospital or shadow a doctor for a few days/weeks. See if you enjoy working in a clinical environment. Important to know early. You may be able to get involved in some research projects. All great for your medical school application and resume. 2. Study, study, study, study. I can't say it enough! Medical school is a tough place academically. You have to learn a lot of facts in a short space of time. There are frequent examinations. The only way you're going to survive and be successful at medical school is if you study. If you don't like to study, this is not the career for you. So think long and hard before you commit to a career in Medicine. 3. Find a Medical School that suits your personality and interests. This will motivate you to study and you will look forward to going there. All really important in helping you to study and get the grades to go. Whatever anyone says, all medical schools are good schools! Period. They all teach you to become a doctor and getting into any medical school means you're bright and gifted. Don't get distracted by finding the "best" medical school. 4. This tip is a carry-on from the above point. Medical school does not make you a good doctor. What you do with yourself AFTER medical school is what counts. How you conduct your professional life, how hard you work, how committed you are to your patients and your dedication to your practice - these are the things that will determine whether you are an excellent physician or just someone who went to medical school. 5. Finally, don't give up the interests that make you, You. If you enjoy rock climbing, find time in the semester to do it, if you're a fan of plays or music, keep acting and jamming with your buddies. All these seemingly trivial interests are actually what make life spontaneous and fun. It keeps you going through the years of hard study. And importantly, it helps you to relate to other human beings, namely your patients. Here's a secret, I did not enjoy medical school. I found it boring and repetitive. When I graduated, I was relieved to find that I loved the practice of medicine! I enjoyed taking care of patients, the diagnostic process and was thrilled when I got to go to the OR and do stuff. I knew then and now that I had made the right choice. Its life after medical school that counts, don't forget that. Good luck and godspeed!" Dr Arundi graduated from UCL. Her take on "all medical schools are good schools", sadly do not apply in Malaysia. This post has been edited by podrunner: Oct 16 2012, 12:53 PM |
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Oct 16 2012, 06:28 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 3 2012, 11:41 PM) Which med school are they in? IMU. But I really do not know the details of the said scholarship.So Mauritius recognizes Malaysian mbbs. One is more than nought. Anyway, yay WA! Tassie still lagging behind with positions though.. |
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Oct 17 2012, 12:31 AM
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Junior Member
38 posts Joined: Jul 2011
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hello guys~
im a 4th yr medical student,currently studying in a local university..in my earlier years as a med student,i didnt really give a damn about specialization..but med school are increasing in number and now more & more house officers are being produced..so it will & must be tough in the future years.. so may i ask,can someone please at least outline for me on how can i further my studies later after i graduate? im totally clueless about this..and if possible,i would like to further my studies overseas..if there's any chance la~ |
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Oct 17 2012, 12:38 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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when a 4th year medical student asks such questions, it is terrifying....what sort of students are taken in nowadays.....and what kind of med schools that give no clue to postgraduate pathways to their students in advanced stages of the course.....
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Oct 17 2012, 01:44 AM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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Truth to be told I learnt a lot from this thread. Lol. Well of course there is info on PG when we go to student conferences, but they're not reflective of the reality .
E.g Big shot from moh asking everyone to specialise but we all know the bottleneck is the number of places Which med school u from andie if u don't mind ? |
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Oct 17 2012, 01:48 AM
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Senior Member
1,170 posts Joined: Apr 2011 From: Deus Vult
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 17 2012, 12:38 AM) when a 4th year medical student asks such questions, it is terrifying....what sort of students are taken in nowadays.....and what kind of med schools that give no clue to postgraduate pathways to their students in advanced stages of the course..... Well, must be terrible students them ( me included) To be honest, to my opinion, work ur houseman years 1 st, then only think on which branch u want to specialize, coz u can dream to become a neurosurgeon, but do u really got what it takes to be one? Like a malay saying, 'ukur baju dibadan sendiri'... Unless u got ur 1st hand exp, ull never know whether those specialized branch is suitable for u or not... |
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Oct 17 2012, 08:33 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(kurangak @ Oct 17 2012, 01:48 AM) Well, must be terrible students them ( me included) there is a BIG difference between knowing WHAT field one may want to specialise in (which agreed, is mostly decided after one has started work).....and knowing HOW it is done, even if one may not do it......To be honest, to my opinion, work ur houseman years 1 st, then only think on which branch u want to specialize, coz u can dream to become a neurosurgeon, but do u really got what it takes to be one? Like a malay saying, 'ukur baju dibadan sendiri'... Unless u got ur 1st hand exp, ull never know whether those specialized branch is suitable for u or not... Added on October 17, 2012, 9:13 am QUOTE(andie le-ta @ Oct 17 2012, 12:31 AM) hello guys~ msian medical degrees are NOT recognised anywhere else in the world....with the exception of um's and ukm's, which are recognised by singapore.....im a 4th yr medical student,currently studying in a local university i would like to further my studies overseas..if there's any chance la~ This post has been edited by limeuu: Oct 17 2012, 09:16 AM |
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Oct 17 2012, 11:09 AM
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Senior Member
3,037 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: 6-feet under
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 17 2012, 08:33 AM) there is a BIG difference between knowing WHAT field one may want to specialise in (which agreed, is mostly decided after one has started work).....and knowing HOW it is done, even if one may not do it...... not even passing conversion tests? no medical degree is recognised across the worldAdded on October 17, 2012, 9:13 am msian medical degrees are NOT recognised anywhere else in the world....with the exception of um's and ukm's, which are recognised by singapore..... |
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Oct 17 2012, 11:20 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(C-Note @ Oct 17 2012, 11:09 AM) not even passing conversion tests? no medical degree is recognised across the world of course there are qualifying exams doctors can take to get registration in most countries....shouldn't a medical student know all these facts?....BEFORE embarking on a particular medical school.....? |
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Oct 17 2012, 03:43 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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A neurosurgeon and founder of health supplements MLM company.
http://www.frontier2u.my/company-profile http://www.mychildmalaysia.com/topic/12/Br...siness+++Babies |
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Oct 17 2012, 04:14 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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Recently there's a neurosurgeon talking about the after life....
Btw, just realised, the person in your link claims to have mbbs from Glasgow, which is weird consideRing Glasgow offers mb chb not mbbs, unless perhaps due to mbbs being more widely known as a medical degree.. This post has been edited by arsenwagon: Oct 17 2012, 04:15 PM |
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Oct 17 2012, 05:09 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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this is going to be another fake...like that winson guy....entering glasgow medical school at 15?....
even the space tourist is involved.... http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...619&sec=central |
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Oct 17 2012, 05:25 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Don't tarnish the reputation of University of Glasgow!
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Oct 17 2012, 05:56 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 17 2012, 05:09 PM) this is going to be another fake...like that winson guy....entering glasgow medical school at 15?.... "...performing surgeries at Tan Tock Seng Hospital in Singapore...."even the space tourist is involved.... http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...619&sec=central |
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Oct 17 2012, 05:59 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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Also if u search glen eagles website, you would be able to see their clinicians cv.
Last I checked there was no dr Jong there... |
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Oct 17 2012, 06:01 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Oct 17 2012, 05:59 PM) Also if u search glen eagles website, you would be able to see their clinicians cv. You're right, and a google search with her name and Tan Tock Seng Hospital will only give links to the articles posted here.Last I checked there was no dr Jong there... This post has been edited by podrunner: Oct 17 2012, 07:43 PM |
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Oct 18 2012, 10:10 AM
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Junior Member
172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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Talks on surgery, medicine and pharmacy from Oct 19-21
Read more: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/10/18/ta.../#ixzz29c13NjLB "As a recognised degree in Malaysia and Australia, students can become doctors in Malaysia or Australia which leaves them with more options and opportunities. Students need not worry about career prospects as there are always jobs for doctors."  Are things really that bad for Monash Sunway? |
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Oct 18 2012, 11:42 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 10:10 AM) Talks on surgery, medicine and pharmacy from Oct 19-21 Giving talks an indication of being bad?Read more: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/10/18/ta.../#ixzz29c13NjLB "As a recognised degree in Malaysia and Australia, students can become doctors in Malaysia or Australia which leaves them with more options and opportunities. Students need not worry about career prospects as there are always jobs for doctors." Are things really that bad for Monash Sunway? |
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Oct 18 2012, 11:44 AM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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Well Limeuu said med schools don't need to advertise.
Even local public unis which people deem to be substandard do not need to advertise ...and it will be full of people trying to get in! Even resorting to political connections This post has been edited by arsenwagon: Oct 18 2012, 11:45 AM |
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Oct 18 2012, 11:58 AM
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Junior Member
172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Oct 18 2012, 11:42 AM) Giving talks an indication of being bad? "Bad" as in not meeting enrolment numbers...Well, giving talks is one thing, making statements like the one I highlighted is just downright unscrupulous... |
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Oct 18 2012, 12:06 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 10:10 AM) Talks on surgery, medicine and pharmacy from Oct 19-21 yes it is.....they have been unable to fill all the places, and have resorted to dumbing down their selection, like all the other ipts med schools.....they have ignored the isat results.....and atar scores taken in are very much lower than the 99.0 used in clayton.....Read more: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/10/18/ta.../#ixzz29c13NjLB "As a recognised degree in Malaysia and Australia, students can become doctors in Malaysia or Australia which leaves them with more options and opportunities. Students need not worry about career prospects as there are always jobs for doctors." Are things really that bad for Monash Sunway?the reason is partly the cost.....and partly the realisation by many parents that it is not the same degree as the clayton one.....and there is smaller and smaller chance of doing internship in oz going forward.... in this respect, imu-pms is definitely the better choice, especially the uk matches.....that is why the imu-pms undergraduate stream is the most popular and heavily over subscribed, and now probably the most difficult ipts med school to get into..... imu still advertises their pms programme, but it's usually part of a uni-wide advert, more targeting at potential students for their other programmes.....they have enough applicants for the pms programme..... Added on October 18, 2012, 12:07 pm QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 11:58 AM) "Bad" as in not meeting enrolment numbers... it is misleading, but they are desperate.....Well, giving talks is one thing, making statements like the one I highlighted is just downright unscrupulous... This post has been edited by limeuu: Oct 18 2012, 12:07 PM |
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Oct 18 2012, 12:14 PM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 18 2012, 12:06 PM) yes it is.....they have been unable to fill all the places, and have resorted to dumbing down their selection, like all the other ipts med schools.....they have ignored the isat results.....and atar scores taken in are very much lower than the 99.0 used in clayton..... Quote from the article - "The MBBS programme takes in 130-140 students once a year" - anyone has any idea what the cohort size is for 2012?the reason is partly the cost.....and partly the realisation by many parents that it is not the same degree as the clayton one.....and there is smaller and smaller chance of doing internship in oz going forward.... in this respect, imu-pms is definitely the better choice, especially the uk matches.....that is why the imu-pms undergraduate stream is the most popular and heavily over subscribed, and now probably the most difficult ipts med school to get into..... imu still advertises their pms programme, but it's usually part of a uni-wide advert, more targeting at potential students for their other programmes.....they have enough applicants for the pms programme..... Added on October 18, 2012, 12:07 pm it is misleading, but they are desperate..... |
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Oct 18 2012, 12:16 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 11:58 AM) "Bad" as in not meeting enrolment numbers... Someone should ask the right questions during the talk! It will be interesting to see how the questions will be addressed, or sidestepped. It looks as thought it is GES that made the statements you highlighted.Well, giving talks is one thing, making statements like the one I highlighted is just downright unscrupulous... This post has been edited by podrunner: Oct 18 2012, 12:23 PM |
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Oct 18 2012, 12:59 PM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 18 2012, 12:16 PM) Someone should ask the right questions during the talk! It will be interesting to see how the questions will be addressed, or sidestepped. It looks as thought it is GES that made the statements you highlighted. Well, I'm assuming the advertisement is paid for by Monash and as such, is endorsed by the institution itself. Regardless, I'd love to hear the speaker's (or the Sunway Medical School) response to the Australian internship shortage - any news about Sunway graduates getting an internship for 2013?This post has been edited by Huskies: Oct 18 2012, 12:59 PM |
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Oct 18 2012, 01:51 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Oct 18 2012, 11:44 AM) Well Limeuu said med schools don't need to advertise. Would the demand for places in public unis be the same if the fees are not subsidized? A no brainer!Even local public unis which people deem to be substandard do not need to advertise ...and it will be full of people trying to get in! Even resorting to political connections Added on October 18, 2012, 1:54 pm QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 12:14 PM) Quote from the article - "The MBBS programme takes in 130-140 students once a year" - anyone has any idea what the cohort size is for 2012? It was around 120. More than what you expect them to get!This post has been edited by cckkpr: Oct 18 2012, 01:54 PM |
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Oct 18 2012, 03:16 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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in countries with socialised education system, the selection of medical students is not based on cost or ability to pay......
in capitalised education system like the us, where most unis are privately run, and charges fees, there is also little selection based on ability to pay....although there is affirmative action policies to help minorities and indigent students..... the system now existing in msia is one where there exist several parallel systems, each with a different set of characteristics..... the ipta is heavily subsidised, and takes in both the best students, as well as nep compliant students..... ipts generally is money based...... foreign med schools like russia/ukraine/indonesia are for cheaper courses and for students who are weaker.... non of the systems are based purely on merit..... |
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Oct 18 2012, 04:18 PM
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4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 18 2012, 03:16 PM) in countries with socialised education system, the selection of medical students is not based on cost or ability to pay...... This is no longer true. Most of the best students are already in the colleges pursuing the different pre-university courses after the SPM and what is remaining in the STPM or matriks are the filtered ones, many of whom are not by choice.in capitalised education system like the us, where most unis are privately run, and charges fees, there is also little selection based on ability to pay....although there is affirmative action policies to help minorities and indigent students..... the system now existing in msia is one where there exist several parallel systems, each with a different set of characteristics..... the ipta is heavily subsidised, and takes in both the best students, as well as nep compliant students..... ipts generally is money based...... foreign med schools like russia/ukraine/indonesia are for cheaper courses and for students who are weaker.... non of the systems are based purely on merit..... We have to accept the fact that the glory of the iptas are long gone. |
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Oct 18 2012, 11:30 PM
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Senior Member
3,037 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: 6-feet under
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Oct 18 2012, 10:10 AM) Talks on surgery, medicine and pharmacy from Oct 19-21 why would australia want anymore doctors...? they have enough of their own. my friend's brother cant get housemanship. 5th year medical student in uni of melbourne. Read more: http://www.theborneopost.com/2012/10/18/ta.../#ixzz29c13NjLB "As a recognised degree in Malaysia and Australia, students can become doctors in Malaysia or Australia which leaves them with more options and opportunities. Students need not worry about career prospects as there are always jobs for doctors." Are things really that bad for Monash Sunway?some doctors are even sweeping the floors in ireland because they pay better than gov' hospitals |
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Oct 18 2012, 11:45 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(C-Note @ Oct 18 2012, 11:30 PM) why would australia want anymore doctors...? they have enough of their own. my friend's brother cant get housemanship. 5th year medical student in uni of melbourne. you will not be looking for housemanship jobs when you are in 5th year of melbourne's undergraduate medical course...... |
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Oct 19 2012, 01:33 AM
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Senior Member
3,037 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: 6-feet under
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 18 2012, 11:45 PM) you will not be looking for housemanship jobs when you are in 5th year of melbourne's undergraduate medical course...... Hospitals are full..his course is only 5 yrs before aus implemented the new graduate entry system like the USA |
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Oct 19 2012, 07:19 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(C-Note @ Oct 19 2012, 01:33 AM) Hospitals are full..his course is only 5 yrs before aus implemented the new graduate entry system like the USA the last intake of the undergraduate system was 2008, ie that cohort is now in the 5th year, and still have i more year to go next year 2013.....there was no intake in 2009 and 2010..... the first graduate entry cohort was in 2011, and will graduate end 2014......because it is 4 year.....not 5...... |
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Oct 19 2012, 07:47 AM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Oct 19 2012, 07:19 AM) the last intake of the undergraduate system was 2008, ie that cohort is now in the 5th year, and still have i more year to go next year 2013..... Internship placements for next year should be out by now. Maybe the 5th year has not been placed yet.there was no intake in 2009 and 2010..... the first graduate entry cohort was in 2011, and will graduate end 2014......because it is 4 year.....not 5...... |
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Oct 19 2012, 07:52 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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those who entered in 2008 in the last undergraduate cohort will enter final year next year, and start housemanship applications in mid 2013.......to start in 2014....
the numbers for 2014 will not be known till all applications are in, and there will likely be expansion of intern jobs as well.....so the mismatch will be unknown until then..... |
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Oct 19 2012, 07:56 AM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Oops, forgot UMelb's undergrad course was 6 years!!
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Oct 20 2012, 10:49 AM
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3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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they still need doctors. just that the training spots for intern are very limited (which is silly really if you're trying to get more doctors). AFAIK, they are still TRYING to do something about it, but it's all talks at the moment. just hope they will take actions.
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Oct 20 2012, 11:23 AM
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Oct 20 2012, 10:49 AM) they still need doctors. just that the training spots for intern are very limited (which is silly really if you're trying to get more doctors). AFAIK, they are still TRYING to do something about it, but it's all talks at the moment. just hope they will take actions. Doctor demo highlights hazy future - "A WINDSCREEN cleaning at the stoplights usually costs a gold coin. Tomorrow, in Sydneys Taylor Square, 100 or more doctors-in-waiting will be doing it for free.International medical students have planned the “scrubs in the street protest” to highlight a mismatch between university and clinical training places, which threatens to leave 180 graduating students without internships next year." http://www.theaustralian.com.au/higher-edu...x-1226499569555 In other news, Malaysia seems to be doing just fine...with 47 medical schools?! No oversupply of doctors "The government has given an assurance that the country would not face a situation where there would be an oversupply of doctors in future. Minister in the Prime Minister's Department Tan Sri Nor Mohamed Yakcop said proper manpower planning by the government would ensure that such a scenario would not happen." http://www.thesundaily.my/news/509332 This post has been edited by Huskies: Oct 20 2012, 11:29 AM |
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Oct 25 2012, 06:33 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Oct 26 2012, 08:54 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 25 2012, 06:33 PM) if he had least spend one day off to day a full medical check up once a year when he started working he could be still very well alive. kesian. |
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Oct 26 2012, 09:01 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Oct 25 2012, 06:33 PM) read his testimony and his note few days ago. really inspiring. Money isn't all mighty and all powerful. |
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Oct 31 2012, 04:50 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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I guess that's one of the biggest elephant in the room when we were studying medicine. Hard to convince the students to "not think about money" when you're practicing when they're going to graduate with huge student loan around their neck or be "indebted" to some parents whom I reckon will expect to be supported financially after investing so much in their education.
Doesnt help also that the teacher docs also come to school in their Audis, BMWs (+ personal driver) I'm done with Year 1 exam, only OSCEs left. Can you believe how fast time went by? |
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Nov 1 2012, 08:55 PM
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172 posts Joined: Jan 2011
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The intern crisis has hit the Australian parliament: Senator Nash backs #interncrisis campaign in Senate speech
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=playe...d&v=47_dGR4efpc One can only wonder when this issue will be raised in the Malaysian parliament, if ever... |
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Nov 1 2012, 09:37 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Huskies @ Nov 1 2012, 08:55 PM) The intern crisis has hit the Australian parliament: Senator Nash backs #interncrisis campaign in Senate speech Was on the interncrisis website...very impressive! Hope this will be resolved soon, so all international students will get to be trained in Australia. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=playe...d&v=47_dGR4efpc One can only wonder when this issue will be raised in the Malaysian parliament, if ever... err...this is a "non-issue" in the malaysian parliament. |
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Nov 1 2012, 10:12 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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i wonder why the respective states refused to come up with the extra 8 million for the last 80 grads.....divided amongst the states, it's only less than 2 million each....
now, this problem is not going away even if the 8 million comes through this time....the numbers goes up some more for 2014.....i believe it only peaks and plateau off about 2006.....when all the new med schools starts graduating.... |
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Nov 8 2012, 01:06 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Things looking up for medical grads in oz
http://www.honisoit.com/2012/11/plibersek-...ernship-crisis/ |
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Nov 8 2012, 02:35 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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i wonder if mr. noor is a jpa/mara scholar and should really return to msia and fulfil the bond?.....
This post has been edited by limeuu: Nov 8 2012, 02:36 PM |
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Nov 8 2012, 03:02 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Nov 8 2012, 02:35 PM) i wonder if mr. noor is a jpa/mara scholar and should really return to msia and fulfil the bond?..... I have to admit I wondered the same! He did say he is 300k in debt on the interncrisis website. |
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Nov 8 2012, 03:51 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Nov 8 2012, 03:02 PM) I have to admit I wondered the same! He did say he is 300k in debt on the interncrisis website. mara loan is also a debt....waived if the scholar gets a 1st class.... |
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Nov 8 2012, 07:05 PM
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168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Nov 2 2012, 03:12 AM) i wonder why the respective states refused to come up with the extra 8 million for the last 80 grads.....divided amongst the states, it's only less than 2 million each.... I guess the problem is not that simple, as this is just the beginning of the problem. If they let all of the international interns come through, it will get rolled over and carried on for HMO2 positions and on and on and on. Bear in mind once a person completed his internship he will be eligible for permanent residency hence rendering the situation even messier. now, this problem is not going away even if the 8 million comes through this time....the numbers goes up some more for 2014.....i believe it only peaks and plateau off about 2006.....when all the new med schools starts graduating.... Contrary to popular beliefs, there ARE actually jobless interns out there whom are unable to secure a HMO2 position. Most jobs are full in Adelaide, Perth, Vic, Sydney and Queensland. Even Rockhampton and Mackay are full. I always thought that internship is the bottleneck, there are always more HMO2 positions that interns, but no, the fact is there are still jobless people out there. But this time around, it is not limited to international students - some interns that are born and bred in Aussie, live in Aussie school in Aussie, are still left jobless without a place. This is just the beginning of the problem, sadly. |
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Nov 8 2012, 08:20 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Comments on the article are interesting.
http://theconversation.edu.au/why-internat...hospitals-10261 |
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Nov 8 2012, 08:46 PM
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1,569 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Oct 31 2012, 04:50 AM) I guess that's one of the biggest elephant in the room when we were studying medicine. Hard to convince the students to "not think about money" when you're practicing when they're going to graduate with huge student loan around their neck or be "indebted" to some parents whom I reckon will expect to be supported financially after investing so much in their education. Hiw about the payback? 3 yrs can ma?Doesnt help also that the teacher docs also come to school in their Audis, BMWs (+ personal driver) I'm done with Year 1 exam, only OSCEs left. Can you believe how fast time went by? |
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Nov 9 2012, 04:29 AM
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451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Nov 8 2012, 01:06 PM) Things looking up for medical grads in oz Tassie graduates 2012 all of them should have jobs! (as all international students got places as well, though smaller areas including local Tassie). Apparently what I have heard is that there are some reserve fundings available if needed, but yeah.http://www.honisoit.com/2012/11/plibersek-...ernship-crisis/ |
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Nov 9 2012, 10:31 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(Materazzi @ Nov 8 2012, 08:46 PM) Hiw about the payback? 3 yrs can ma? You'd be working for gov for the first four years. If you're paying RM3k/month... you can do the math |
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Nov 9 2012, 07:57 PM
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Nov 9 2012, 10:31 AM) You'd be working for gov for the first four years. If you're paying RM3k/month... you can do the math Oh man..lower than accounting grads? No increment? |
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Nov 9 2012, 08:15 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Materazzi @ Nov 9 2012, 07:57 PM) Oh man..lower than accounting grads? No increment? How much did you think newly graduated doctors earn? |
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Nov 10 2012, 10:44 AM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(Materazzi @ Nov 8 2012, 08:46 PM) Hiw about the payback? 3 yrs can ma? for public uni yes why not. |
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Nov 10 2012, 06:01 PM
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Senior Member
3,037 posts Joined: Dec 2007 From: 6-feet under
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QUOTE(Materazzi @ Nov 9 2012, 07:57 PM) Oh man..lower than accounting grads? No increment? Surplus..and the gov is not going to let docs open private clinics tht easily anymore ..reason why they r giving so many scholarships to jpa medical students is to tie them to civil work for as long as possible. |
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Nov 10 2012, 11:41 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(C-Note @ Nov 10 2012, 06:01 PM) Surplus..and the gov is not going to let docs open private clinics tht easily anymore ..reason why they r giving so many scholarships to jpa medical students is to tie them to civil work for as long as possible. you've got it wrong....the gov don't really bother about doctors leaving for the private sector anymore, not that they have really ever been, except for the 2 (previously 3) years compulsory service.....the surplus, like you said, will make it different this time.....there is going to be fewer jobs in private, becoming a gp will be very tough (too many), and many doctors will prefer to stay on in the gov service....and being on a scholarship is going to be a plus, not a negative point....and they will get preference for gov jobs...the compulsory service will likely be scraped within the next few years, housemanship is already on contract basis...so the day will come then private students will do 2 years housemanship on contract, then will not get selected to continue in the gov service.....they will have to find work elsewhere...or be jobless.... |
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Nov 12 2012, 01:27 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Now that the issue is blown up proper in Australia, other related views are being expressed now by those in the medical profession. Basically I think they are saying the issue ought to be nipped in the bud.
"Perhaps it’s time to revisit the concept of the 2-year internship — the same model as the UK Foundation Programme. When the prerequisites for general medical registration (medicine, surgery and emergency medicine) are spread across 2 years, the burden of supervising those terms is halved, while trainees can continue to accumulate experience. It may be easier to convince the community that a compulsory, paid internship is a right for every graduate if their second year of hospital service is also compulsory. The reality of contemporary medical training means that the practical changes would be minimal. "We know that full fee-paying overseas students are an important source of revenue for universities, but recruitment must be transparently linked to an ongoing pathway into the medical workforce. This must include the areas of workforce need — not just rural and remote areas but also outer metropolitan areas." - Sue Ieraci MJA Internship Dilemma |
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Dec 3 2012, 02:56 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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an update for potential students intending to head to uk...
1. the peninsula medical school is now split into two separate entities, as the plymouth and the exeter med schools from next year..... 2. the liverpool school at lancaster has been given a licence to start their own separate programme, and from next year, graduates will get the lancaster mbchb instead of the liverpool one... 3. this is not really new, keele graduated their first batch of mbchb this year....previous years get the manchester mbchb.... not sure how recognition will be for 1. the peninsula degree is recognised by mmc. lancaster is not yet recognised, keele is already recognised.... |
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Dec 5 2012, 07:41 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jun 22 2012, 11:50 PM) i suspect it's just that there are more foundation students than places available, and there are also good non scholar foundation students....and they just pick the best.....and only that 13 of the 55 make it into the top xx number to progress to medicine..... Apparently the scholar in Clayton didn't do well. So how do Mara deal with scholars who, for example, fail first year (after sitting for supplementary papers)?like i said many times, scholars, both jpa and mara have a tendency to not do well....they traditionally are over represented in the infamous imu eos2 failures..... perhaps something to do with motivation.....or the lack of.... |
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Dec 5 2012, 09:18 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Dec 5 2012, 07:41 PM) Apparently the scholar in Clayton didn't do well. So how do Mara deal with scholars who, for example, fail first year (after sitting for supplementary papers)? they are given more money to repeat the year....i am not kidding..... |
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Dec 5 2012, 09:25 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 5 2012, 09:18 PM) they are given more money to repeat the year.... yeah they do. My friend has to pay for the extra 1 sem of med research to fill in that 1/2 year gap before he retakes the failed semester. i am not kidding..... JPA and MARA get quite good allowance too. just wondering, the 10 year bond with govn upon finishing your JPA scholarship, is that still on? and if it is, is that a good thing in your opinion? |
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Dec 5 2012, 09:33 PM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 5 2012, 09:18 PM) they are given more money to repeat the year.... That's ridiculously generous...it's a lifetime crutch then.i am not kidding..... |
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Dec 5 2012, 09:51 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 5 2012, 09:25 PM) JPA and MARA get quite good allowance too. just wondering, the 10 year bond with govn upon finishing your JPA scholarship, is that still on? and if it is, is that a good thing in your opinion? QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 5 2012, 09:25 PM) yeah they do. My friend has to pay for the extra 1 sem of med research to fill in that 1/2 year gap before he retakes the failed semester. that will not happen from next year, in utas, as the format is changed to be consistent with other med schools, and utas' own clinical years....ie, the semester format is removed, and it's a whole year's programme now with one final result at the end.....This post has been edited by limeuu: Dec 5 2012, 09:57 PM |
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Dec 5 2012, 10:15 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 5 2012, 09:51 PM) it's still 10 years....and in the future when there is a glut of doctors, that will indeed be an asset.....at least you are 'guaranteed' a job.... oh, so if you failed year 2 sem 2 you'll have to retake year 2? thought they'll be more lenient for pre-clins that will not happen from next year, in utas, as the format is changed to be consistent with other med schools, and utas' own clinical years....ie, the semester format is removed, and it's a whole year's programme now with one final result at the end..... |
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Dec 5 2012, 10:45 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 5 2012, 10:15 PM) oh, so if you failed year 2 sem 2 you'll have to retake year 2? thought they'll be more lenient for pre-clins yes....but not fail sem 2, there isn't a division anymore, you just fail year 2, and repeat the whole year...might as well, since it's quite pointless parking students in a secondary course for a sem, so they can repeat the failed semester....this format works for other courses, where the same unit is offered in both semesters, but not single intake courses....btw, the semester system also works in imu due to the double intake.... |
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Dec 6 2012, 03:09 PM
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451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 5 2012, 10:45 PM) yes....but not fail sem 2, there isn't a division anymore, you just fail year 2, and repeat the whole year...might as well, since it's quite pointless parking students in a secondary course for a sem, so they can repeat the failed semester....this format works for other courses, where the same unit is offered in both semesters, but not single intake courses.... Seems like the structure we have in third year...btw, the semester system also works in imu due to the double intake.... |
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Dec 6 2012, 09:11 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 6 2012, 03:09 PM) Seems like the structure we have in third year... yes, it is to bring the first 2 years in line with the clinical years, like i said above...... |
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Dec 11 2012, 11:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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Wow, version 3 already? There seems to be a lot of info on Australia, guess many interested to practice there eh? Oh no, here comes the brain drain
Anyway, I do realize the lack of post grad discussion in this thread. Seems to me not many are keen for further studies  |
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Dec 12 2012, 12:26 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 11 2012, 11:55 PM) Wow, version 3 already? There seems to be a lot of info on Australia, guess many interested to practice there eh? Oh no, here comes the brain drain the discussion is about potential and current students in oz, and does not mean necessarily means working there, and there is increasing probability that many will not get internship jobs there in future.... Anyway, I do realize the lack of post grad discussion in this thread. Seems to me not many are keen for further studies also, this thread is about medical students, hence the focus in about getting into, and focusing on medical studies.....postgraduate issues will be inappropriate for students at this point...... |
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Dec 12 2012, 12:36 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 12 2012, 12:26 AM) the discussion is about potential and current students in oz, and does not mean necessarily means working there, and there is increasing probability that many will not get internship jobs there in future.... To my knowledge, most people who attend med schools in developed countries do have the intention of working there upon graduation (scholars not included). So anyhow, privately funded medical students studying in developed countries do largely contribute to the brain drain phenomenon.also, this thread is about medical students, hence the focus in about getting into, and focusing on medical studies.....postgraduate issues will be inappropriate for students at this point...... Anyway, no harm discussing about postgrad studies here even though the thread is meant for medical students. Perhaps a senior doc like yourself can start the ball rolling. It would definitely be nice for a senior clinician such as yourself to shed some light on this matter. |
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Dec 12 2012, 01:02 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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intentions, and the actual ability to are different matters.....and increasingly, both uk and oz are closing doors to international students staying on and working after graduating.....
the same will be happening to working in spore as well, in the near future..... which is why is amusing to read students of local med schools not recognised elsewhere talk about going to work and do postgraduate training in these developed countries.... as for postgraduate issues, pagalavan's blog would probably be a better place to ask and discuss..... |
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Dec 12 2012, 01:15 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 12 2012, 01:02 AM) intentions, and the actual ability to are different matters.....and increasingly, both uk and oz are closing doors to international students staying on and working after graduating..... To my knowledge, uk's door has long been closed for non eu citizens. Imgs can only do foundation years there, and will be required to leave upon completion. As for oz, they are still taking in mos who has completed amc test (some of my classmates just went). Just that the internship post is limited.the same will be happening to working in spore as well, in the near future..... which is why is amusing to read students of local med schools not recognised elsewhere talk about going to work and do postgraduate training in these developed countries.... as for postgraduate issues, pagalavan's blog would probably be a better place to ask and discuss..... Btw are u from Kuching? Do you know anything about cardiology department in Sarawak GH? I heard training under Dr Sim is very good. |
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Dec 12 2012, 01:21 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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img refers to doctors who graduated outside these countries.....international students who studied and graduated there are not considered img.....
it is possible to get jobs beyond fy in uk....the visa requirements will be met, as long as there is a job offer, and that is possible in some circumstances....particularly for top students with good references..... dr. sim is no longer with the moh officially.... |
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Dec 12 2012, 01:27 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 12 2012, 01:21 AM) img refers to doctors who graduated outside these countries.....international students who studied and graduated there are not considered img..... Oh my bad. What I meant was non eu citizens who have completed their studies in uk.it is possible to get jobs beyond fy in uk....the visa requirements will be met, as long as there is a job offer, and that is possible in some circumstances....particularly for top students with good references..... dr. sim is no longer with the moh officially.... So without dr sim, does the cardiology in SGH still offer good training? |
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Dec 12 2012, 01:32 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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yes..........
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Dec 12 2012, 09:55 AM
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2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 12 2012, 01:32 AM) yes.......... Any chance of expanding on the "........"? |
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Dec 12 2012, 06:08 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 12 2012, 06:21 AM) img refers to doctors who graduated outside these countries.....international students who studied and graduated there are not considered img..... Limeuu, I did not study nor work in the UK. But I have heard postgraduate in the UK is difficult but most of my friends got it anyway. Why?it is possible to get jobs beyond fy in uk....the visa requirements will be met, as long as there is a job offer, and that is possible in some circumstances....particularly for top students with good references..... dr. sim is no longer with the moh officially.... And I have seen a couple of times you mentioned about top students with good references getting PG job. But, how many people can actually be top student in the university? And some top students did not end up performing extremely well in work anyway. |
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Dec 12 2012, 06:32 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Re PG opportunities in the UK, I think currently there are still places, but as it has been commented on, many times now in this thread and other related threads, medical graduates are on the increase, domestic and international students, both. Unless PG places are adjusted accordingly, some international students will miss out, in the near future.
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Dec 12 2012, 09:02 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 12 2012, 06:08 PM) Limeuu, I did not study nor work in the UK. But I have heard postgraduate in the UK is difficult but most of my friends got it anyway. Why? It is not difficult if you choose the less popular disciplines......And I have seen a couple of times you mentioned about top students with good references getting PG job. But, how many people can actually be top student in the university? And some top students did not end up performing extremely well in work anyway. The uni results help you get good fy rotations......then the consultants' references are all important..... Like i said, it is possible.....just only if you really want or not.....eg a colleague's daughter rejected a paediatrics rotation for ophthalmology in spore.....she cannot get oph in uk, and there is pressure to complete exams quick and continue to get jobs to qualify for the tier 2 visa..... |
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Dec 12 2012, 10:50 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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is it normal to know almost nothing about opthalmo at this stage? I mean basic things like corneal ulcers, cataracts, glaucoma, conjunctivitis i'm ok with it. I was asked about floaters and had no idea what are those or what they are associated with.
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Dec 13 2012, 05:03 PM
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Senior Member
4,864 posts Joined: Nov 2008
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My niece just successfuly completed her pre-clinical studies (5 semesters) at IMU and will proceed to do the clinical part in the UK for 3 yrs to complete her medical degree, as part of the twinning medical program. Unfortunately she will have to wait until August 2013 to commence her study in UK as per the university intake calendar.
Anybody got any idea what will be good for her to do during this '8-month waiting time'? Govt hospitals do not take in medical students as medical assistants. Are there any opportunities for her to work in private hospitals/clinics? I'd appreciate any suggestions. Mr limeuu, any idea? This post has been edited by Stamp: Dec 13 2012, 05:04 PM |
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Dec 13 2012, 05:44 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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take a 'gap' year off....well, 9 months off.....go do things she likes/want to do, preferably nothing to do with medicine....believe me, after this, there will be NO time for anything else....
relative got a travel and work visa to oz, and worked in sales....earn some money, and visited several cities... |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:48 AM
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Senior Member
4,864 posts Joined: Nov 2008
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 13 2012, 05:44 PM) take a 'gap' year off....well, 9 months off.....go do things she likes/want to do, preferably nothing to do with medicine....believe me, after this, there will be NO time for anything else.... she plans 'to lepak' for a couple of months but she wants to work in a medical-related field until the time comes for her to continue her medical study.relative got a travel and work visa to oz, and worked in sales....earn some money, and visited several cities... most likely she'll find work at a private clinic. |
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Dec 17 2012, 11:35 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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Dear medical students/doctors, pls point out the mistake in this discharge note from a peripheral hospital.
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Dec 17 2012, 02:00 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Can I admit that I cant comprehend the handwriting much?
ACS is acute cardiac symptom right? so Asp is aspirin? And there's a Perindopril down there? Side note : Passed year one  This post has been edited by Syd G: Dec 17 2012, 02:00 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 02:40 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 02:00 PM) Can I admit that I cant comprehend the handwriting much? congrats on passing! ACS = acute coronary syndrome. ACS is acute cardiac symptom right? so Asp is aspirin? And there's a Perindopril down there? Side note : Passed year one at first i thought DOA = dead on arrival. oops. I can't read the writings, i see aspirin, perindopril and maybe a rosuvastatin? oh gosh. |
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Dec 17 2012, 05:07 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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Yeah, one of the mistakes is the bad hand writing. Doctor's writing supposed to be neat and tidy
This patient was diagnosed with ACS and warded. Upon discharge, he was prescribed the following meds: T. Perindopril 4mg OD T. Aspirin 150mg OD T. Clopidogrel 75mg OD T. Lovastatin 20mg ON C. Gemfibrozil 300mg ON T. Cardiprin 1tab OD T. Isordil 10mg TDS S/L GTN 1tab PRN Now, please find the mistake in this list of drugs. |
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Dec 17 2012, 05:25 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Double dose aspirin? Cardiprin + Aspirin
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Dec 17 2012, 05:37 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 05:25 PM) Double dose aspirin? Cardiprin + Aspirin Good. Even someone who has just passed first year can pick up the error. The list of meds was prescribed by a junior MO who has just completed Housemanship. This MO is a graduate of an IPTA which is recognized by Singapore medical council. I really hope this is an "accidental" or "postcall" mistake. If not the rural folks are in big trouble. BTW, statin with fibrate is also not a good combination, as it can cause rhabdomyolysis. This combination is only used as second line therapy. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 05:40 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 06:24 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 05:37 PM) Good. Even someone who has just passed first year can pick up the error. yeah but if the TGL levels are really high fibrates should be started along with statins.The list of meds was prescribed by a junior MO who has just completed Housemanship. This MO is a graduate of an IPTA which is recognized by Singapore medical council. I really hope this is an "accidental" or "postcall" mistake. If not the rural folks are in big trouble. BTW, statin with fibrate is also not a good combination, as it can cause rhabdomyolysis. This combination is only used as second line therapy. |
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Dec 17 2012, 06:44 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 06:24 PM) yeah but if the TGL levels are really high fibrates should be started along with statins. Monotherapy is always recommended as the initial therapy. If TG is > 5.7mmol/L at presentation, fibrate is started instead of statin. Combination therapy is only recommended if optimal monotherapy has failed to bring the lipid level down to target lipid goals after 8-12 weeks.Pls refer below pic for more info (from KKM guideline) 
This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 06:45 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 07:02 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 10:37 PM) Good. Even someone who has just passed first year can pick up the error. It is likely that it is a unintentional mistake (for aspirin and ?cardiprin).The list of meds was prescribed by a junior MO who has just completed Housemanship. This MO is a graduate of an IPTA which is recognized by Singapore medical council. I really hope this is an "accidental" or "postcall" mistake. If not the rural folks are in big trouble. BTW, statin with fibrate is also not a good combination, as it can cause rhabdomyolysis. This combination is only used as second line therapy. Not sure why gemfibrozil, does it actually really work? Definitely I wont feel comfortable starting them together. ? consider beta blocker in future? Statin is a must regardless of lipid studies given its role in secondary prevention. Plavix - did not state the duration? Was PCI done/ BMS/ DES? =D Such mistake would not be made if there is a pharmacist around checking discharge scripts? |
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Dec 17 2012, 07:22 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 06:44 PM) Monotherapy is always recommended as the initial therapy. If TG is > 5.7mmol/L at presentation, fibrate is started instead of statin. Combination therapy is only recommended if optimal monotherapy has failed to bring the lipid level down to target lipid goals after 8-12 weeks. yes but this was a discharge script. the patient might have already been started on initial therapy during admission. no? furthermore it is unclear on how long has the patient been admitted and what other drugs has the patient been taking along with his other test results. IMO besides the duplication of aspirin, its hard to justify whether the script is accurate or not based on present data. Pls refer below pic for more info (from KKM guideline)
QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 07:02 PM) It is likely that it is a unintentional mistake (for aspirin and ?cardiprin). gemfibrozil is to lower TGL levels, beta blockers work on the heart. both drugs work differently and have different mechanisms and different outcomes. Not sure why gemfibrozil, does it actually really work? Definitely I wont feel comfortable starting them together. ? consider beta blocker in future? Statin is a must regardless of lipid studies given its role in secondary prevention. Plavix - did not state the duration? Was PCI done/ BMS/ DES? =D Such mistake would not be made if there is a pharmacist around checking discharge scripts? u only start statins if patient has a previous cardio/stroke event. if levels all ok then no issue la. but having said that if you get admitted probably got problem liao.This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 17 2012, 07:23 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 07:40 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 07:02 PM) It is likely that it is a unintentional mistake (for aspirin and ?cardiprin). was looking for beta blockers in the chart and trying to make up what is what. to be honest i've never heard of cardiprin, we just say low dose asp 100mg. Not sure why gemfibrozil, does it actually really work? Definitely I wont feel comfortable starting them together. ? consider beta blocker in future? Statin is a must regardless of lipid studies given its role in secondary prevention. Plavix - did not state the duration? Was PCI done/ BMS/ DES? =D Such mistake would not be made if there is a pharmacist around checking discharge scripts? but yeah, double prescription seems like an unintentional mistake? (overworked? still, not an excuse). QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 07:22 PM) yes but this was a discharge script. the patient might have already been started on initial therapy during admission. no? furthermore it is unclear on how long has the patient been admitted and what other drugs has the patient been taking along with his other test results. IMO besides the duplication of aspirin, its hard to justify whether the script is accurate or not based on present data. I'll still put in statins and asp just for prevention, for high risk patients. as far as i know, statins are relatively safe, well, apart from some causing rhabdo, but chances are rather low. and I wouldn't be so sure on prescribing fibrates with statin tgt.gemfibrozil is to lower TGL levels, beta blockers work on the heart. both drugs work differently and have different mechanisms and different outcomes. u only start statins if patient has a previous cardio/stroke event. if levels all ok then no issue la. but having said that if you get admitted probably got problem liao. |
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Dec 17 2012, 08:23 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 07:02 PM) It is likely that it is a unintentional mistake (for aspirin and ?cardiprin). As mentioned, I hope this is an unintentional mistake. If not then I am very worried about the quality of medical education.Not sure why gemfibrozil, does it actually really work? Definitely I wont feel comfortable starting them together. ? consider beta blocker in future? Statin is a must regardless of lipid studies given its role in secondary prevention. Plavix - did not state the duration? Was PCI done/ BMS/ DES? =D Such mistake would not be made if there is a pharmacist around checking discharge scripts? yes, agreed with the statin part. Statin should be started regardless of lipid profile post ACS/STEMI. Like you, I am also not comfortable with starting both fibrate and statin. if I am not mistaken, PCI is not routinely done for ACS. It is however, a gold standard for STEMI. Also, district hospital has no cardiologist, so PCI can't be done. Well, I am equally surprised that pharmacist didn't pick up the mistakes. QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 07:22 PM) yes but this was a discharge script. the patient might have already been started on initial therapy during admission. no? furthermore it is unclear on how long has the patient been admitted and what other drugs has the patient been taking along with his other test results. IMO besides the duplication of aspirin, its hard to justify whether the script is accurate or not based on present data. I guess you are confused a little. Let me clarify.gemfibrozil is to lower TGL levels, beta blockers work on the heart. both drugs work differently and have different mechanisms and different outcomes. u only start statins if patient has a previous cardio/stroke event. if levels all ok then no issue la. but having said that if you get admitted probably got problem liao.1. The guideline says optimal monotherapy before considering combination. Does 20mg of lovastatin or 300mg of gemfibrozil sound optimal to you? Are you aware of the max dosage for each drug? 2. Date of admission and discharge clearly written on the discharge note. Pls read it carefully. 3. All drugs taken by the patient are on the discharge note (usual practice for hospitals) 4. You dun only start statin post stroke or cardio event (where did you get this fact!?). Statin can be used in simple dyslipidemia as suggested by KKM guideline and guidelines all over the world. 5. tqeh is right on beta blocker for ACS. Beta blocker reduces the myocardial oxygen demand, thus it benefits patients with ACS/STEMI as well as CCF. I would suggest you do a read through of KKM's guidelines as well as books such as Sarawak Handbook of Medical Emergencies. Are you a doctor btw? If I am not mistaken, you are a pharmacist right? Added on December 17, 2012, 8:38 pm QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 17 2012, 07:40 PM) was looking for beta blockers in the chart and trying to make up what is what. to be honest i've never heard of cardiprin, we just say low dose asp 100mg. Cardiprin is combination of 100mg aspirin and 45mg glycine. It causes less gastrointestinal effect than conventional aspirin. but yeah, double prescription seems like an unintentional mistake? (overworked? still, not an excuse). I'll still put in statins and asp just for prevention, for high risk patients. as far as i know, statins are relatively safe, well, apart from some causing rhabdo, but chances are rather low. and I wouldn't be so sure on prescribing fibrates with statin tgt. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 08:38 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 08:53 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 05:37 PM) Good. Even someone who has just passed first year can pick up the error. Ah. Wanted to point out statin/fibrates combo but too unsure about that.The list of meds was prescribed by a junior MO who has just completed Housemanship. This MO is a graduate of an IPTA which is recognized by Singapore medical council. I really hope this is an "accidental" or "postcall" mistake. If not the rural folks are in big trouble. BTW, statin with fibrate is also not a good combination, as it can cause rhabdomyolysis. This combination is only used as second line therapy. Btw what's the reason for the MO to prescribe lovastatin instead of atorvastatin? Am more familiar with the latter since it's.....more famous price? dosage? compliance? |
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Dec 17 2012, 08:55 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 08:23 PM) As mentioned, I hope this is an unintentional mistake. If not then I am very worried about the quality of medical education. ah my bad then. didn't really check the DOA. so yeah, the fibrates shouldn't be prescribed together with statins. yeap the statin dose is quite low and not maxed out yet. my mistake on part 4. should be referring to high risk patients.yes, agreed with the statin part. Statin should be started regardless of lipid profile post ACS/STEMI. if I am not mistaken, PCI is not routinely done for ACS. It is however, a gold standard for STEMI. Also, district hospital has no cardiologist, so PCI can't be done. Well, I am equally surprised that pharmacist didn't pick up the mistakes. I guess you are confused a little. Let me clarify. 1. The guideline says optimal monotherapy before considering combination. Does 20mg of lovastatin or 300mg of gemfibrozil sounds optimal to you? Are you aware of the max dosage for each drug? 2. Date of admission and discharged clearly written on the discharge note. Pls read it carefully. 3. All drugs taken by the patient are on the prescription slip. 4. You dun only start statin post stroke or cardio event (where did you get this fact!?). Statin can be used in simple dyslipidemia as suggested by KKM guideline and guidelines all over the world. 5. tqeh is right on beta blocker for ACS. Beta blocker reduces the myocardial oxygen demand. |
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Dec 17 2012, 08:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 08:53 PM) Ah. Wanted to point out statin/fibrates combo but too unsure about that. Simply because lovastatin is the cheapest, and the only statin MO in KKM can prescribe (other statins need specialist prescription) Btw what's the reason for the MO to prescribe lovastatin instead of atorvastatin? Am more familiar with the latter since it's.....more famous price? dosage? compliance?This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 08:56 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 08:56 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 08:53 PM) Ah. Wanted to point out statin/fibrates combo but too unsure about that. yeah cheaper. statins mostly differ by their potency.Btw what's the reason for the MO to prescribe lovastatin instead of atorvastatin? Am more familiar with the latter since it's.....more famous price? dosage? compliance? |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:07 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 08:55 PM) ah my bad then. didn't really check the DOA. so yeah, the fibrates shouldn't be prescribed together with statins. yeap the statin dose is quite low and not maxed out yet. my mistake on part 4. should be referring to high risk patients. For your info, some consultants even routinely prescribed statin for all type 2 diabetic patients above the age of 40 regardless of baseline lipid profile. |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:13 PM
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3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 08:53 PM) Ah. Wanted to point out statin/fibrates combo but too unsure about that. atorva should be more potent, rosuva too, compared to simva and lovastatin. but rosuva or crestor is very expensive. GH gave my mom lovastatin too. Btw what's the reason for the MO to prescribe lovastatin instead of atorvastatin? Am more familiar with the latter since it's.....more famous price? dosage? compliance?Lifestyle and exercise isn't doing much help for my cholesterol been hovering above normal limits for a few years now.  |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:26 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 09:07 PM) For your info, some consultants even routinely prescribed statin for all type 2 diabetic patients above the age of 40 regardless of baseline lipid profile. yeah statins are usually prescribed if the patients has diabetes. hmm not so sure if that's the correct practice though if the consultant does not bother about the lipid profile. |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:26 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 17 2012, 09:13 PM) atorva should be more potent, rosuva too, compared to simva and lovastatin. but rosuva or crestor is very expensive. GH gave my mom lovastatin too. Maybe you should start taking statin then Lifestyle and exercise isn't doing much help for my cholesterol been hovering above normal limits for a few years now. j/k |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:28 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 17 2012, 09:13 PM) atorva should be more potent, rosuva too, compared to simva and lovastatin. but rosuva or crestor is very expensive. GH gave my mom lovastatin too. rosuvastatin has the highest incidence of liver and muscle side effects so it is generally avoided.Lifestyle and exercise isn't doing much help for my cholesterol been hovering above normal limits for a few years now. |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:36 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 18 2012, 12:22 AM) gemfibrozil is to lower TGL levels, beta blockers work on the heart. both drugs work differently and have different mechanisms and different outcomes. u only start statins if patient has a previous cardio/stroke event. if levels all ok then no issue la. but having said that if you get admitted probably got problem liao.I have not been studying in a while (like really super long) but correct me if I am wrong (I know there are a lot of senior doctors reading, please correct me if I am wrong!) I have no idea if gemfibrozil actually works in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event - I have not been taught about it, or read about it, or find out about it. Statins MUST be used in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event as Number Needed to Treat is low (?50, cant remember, depending on which studies you pick and which statin) Statins, can be used for primary prevention for high risk patient - oh well, nowadays ppl just treat numbers anyway lol even if they are perfectly healthy lol. NNT probably about 1000? pretty low yield. Perindopril has to be used post AMI as it reduces mortality (er, something to do with cardiac remodelling blabla) B-blocker, in patient post AMI without significantly impaired systolic function (Ie systolic heart failure), should be commenced on a B-blocker (low dose first, as tolerated) as it reduced recurrent AMIs and ?mortality. And yea, about the plavix part, I dont know man, I dont know whether the patient had a STEMI/NSTEMI. But the duration of plavix should be documented!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:42 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 09:36 PM) Yea, I think I know what are those drugs for after a few years of medical school. ACS refers to both unstable angina and NSTEMI, as both shares similar treatment plan. Plavix is usually continued for 6 weeks post ACS, and up to a year post PCI (dual antiplatelet therapy).I have not been studying in a while (like really super long) but correct me if I am wrong (I know there are a lot of senior doctors reading, please correct me if I am wrong!) I have no idea if gemfibrozil actually works in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event - I have not been taught about it, or read about it, or find out about it. Statins MUST be used in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event as Number Needed to Treat is low (?50, cant remember, depending on which studies you pick and which statin) Statins, can be used for primary prevention for high risk patient - oh well, nowadays ppl just treat numbers anyway lol even if they are perfectly healthy lol. NNT probably about 1000? pretty low yield. Perindopril has to be used post AMI as it reduces mortality (er, something to do with cardiac remodelling blabla) B-blocker, in patient post AMI without significantly impaired systolic function (Ie systolic heart failure), should be commenced on a B-blocker (low dose first, as tolerated) as it reduced recurrent AMIs and ?mortality. And yea, about the plavix part, I dont know man, I dont know whether the patient had a STEMI/NSTEMI. But the duration of plavix should be documented!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:42 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 18 2012, 02:28 AM) rosuvastatin has the highest incidence of liver and muscle side effects so it is generally avoided. Is that from lecture / real life practice? I see so many cardiologists start people (private prac) on rosuvastatin. Hospital people tend to get atorva. |
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Dec 17 2012, 09:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 09:42 PM) Is that from lecture / real life practice? I see so many cardiologists start people (private prac) on rosuvastatin. Hospital people tend to get atorva. Not really. Nowadays in hospitals we use more of lova and simva. Reason: cheaper This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 09:55 PM |
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Dec 17 2012, 10:02 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 09:36 PM) Yea, I think I know what are those drugs for after a few years of medical school. fibrates is more related to risk reduction in diabates compared to a cardiovascular event. its usage is more limited to reduce TGL levels and that's about it I have not been studying in a while (like really super long) but correct me if I am wrong (I know there are a lot of senior doctors reading, please correct me if I am wrong!) I have no idea if gemfibrozil actually works in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event - I have not been taught about it, or read about it, or find out about it. Statins MUST be used in secondary prevention of cardiovascular event as Number Needed to Treat is low (?50, cant remember, depending on which studies you pick and which statin) Statins, can be used for primary prevention for high risk patient - oh well, nowadays ppl just treat numbers anyway lol even if they are perfectly healthy lol. NNT probably about 1000? pretty low yield. Perindopril has to be used post AMI as it reduces mortality (er, something to do with cardiac remodelling blabla) B-blocker, in patient post AMI without significantly impaired systolic function (Ie systolic heart failure), should be commenced on a B-blocker (low dose first, as tolerated) as it reduced recurrent AMIs and ?mortality. And yea, about the plavix part, I dont know man, I dont know whether the patient had a STEMI/NSTEMI. But the duration of plavix should be documented!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! plavix is there to prevent clot formation. working together with aspirin. QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 17 2012, 09:42 PM) Is that from lecture / real life practice? I see so many cardiologists start people (private prac) on rosuvastatin. Hospital people tend to get atorva. from lectures i would guess because its the most expensive.....? anyway, its just more incidence compared to other statins doesn't mean its bad otherwise it would be pulled out of the market. |
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Dec 17 2012, 10:04 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 09:28 PM) rosuvastatin has the highest incidence of liver and muscle side effects so it is generally avoided. I'm not too sure where you got your source though, but from journals i read, rosuva has lower incident of rhabdo, and similar adverse event rates compared to other statins. an exception is cerivastatin, which is banned. they do get slight raise of transaminase though. QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 09:55 PM) Not really. Nowadays in hospitals we use more of lova and simva. Reason: cheaper agreed =P save cost. and hey, they all work well. my teacher called it the miracle drug because it has many other functions too, like stabilizing plaques and etc etc. So yes I will still give high risk patients statins. and I wont add in a fibrate.... unless the consultant tells me so and consult the pros if you don't know. |
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Dec 17 2012, 10:07 PM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Any comments on diuretics and beta-blockers? E.g why they're not given?
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Dec 17 2012, 10:15 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 17 2012, 10:04 PM) I'm not too sure where you got your source though, but from journals i read, rosuva has lower incident of rhabdo, and similar adverse event rates compared to other statins. an exception is cerivastatin, which is banned. they do get slight raise of transaminase though. its from my lectures made by practitioners. guess in practice its a different story.agreed =P save cost. and hey, they all work well. my teacher called it the miracle drug because it has many other functions too, like stabilizing plaques and etc etc. So yes I will still give high risk patients statins. and I wont add in a fibrate.... unless the consultant tells me so and consult the pros if you don't know.QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 10:07 PM) Any comments on diuretics and beta-blockers? E.g why they're not given? both drugs causes hyperglyceamia. which may lead to diabetes if not properly monitored. |
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Dec 17 2012, 10:38 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 17 2012, 10:07 PM) Any comments on diuretics and beta-blockers? E.g why they're not given? U mean in the case of ACS? That's because in ACS the cardiac function is relatively well preserved, unlike in CCF. Thus diuretic is not needed to get rid of the extra fluid.Beta blocker should be given to patients with ACS, STEMI and CCF, as it reduces the myocardial oxygen demand. However, it should be introduced slowly as patients may complain of worsening of symptoms upon initiation of therapy. Also, beta blocke is contraindicated in COAD or Asthma patients. Like what zstan said, combination of diuretic and b blocker can cause new onset diabetes melitus. Thus close monitoring is required. |
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Dec 17 2012, 10:45 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 10:02 PM) fibrates is more related to risk reduction in diabates compared to a cardiovascular event. its usage is more limited to reduce TGL levels and that's about it In diabetic patients, statin is still the first line therapy for risk reduction, unless TG>5.7 then fibrate will be used instead.plavix is there to prevent clot formation. working together with aspirin. from lectures i would guess because its the most expensive.....? anyway, its just more incidence compared to other statins doesn't mean its bad otherwise it would be pulled out of the market. Btw, the mechanisms for both aspirin and clopidogrel are important for MRCP part 1. One has to know them by heart if keen for MRCP. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 17 2012, 10:52 PM |
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Dec 18 2012, 03:27 AM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 17 2012, 10:15 PM) its from my lectures made by practitioners. guess in practice its a different story. both drugs causes hyperglyceamia. which may lead to diabetes if not properly monitored. QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 17 2012, 10:38 PM) U mean in the case of ACS? That's because in ACS the cardiac function is relatively well preserved, unlike in CCF. Thus diuretic is not needed to get rid of the extra fluid. Beta blocker should be given to patients with ACS, STEMI and CCF, as it reduces the myocardial oxygen demand. However, it should be introduced slowly as patients may complain of worsening of symptoms upon initiation of therapy. Also, beta blocke is contraindicated in COAD or Asthma patients. Like what zstan said, combination of diuretic and b blocker can cause new onset diabetes melitus. Thus close monitoring is required.  Exactly why we need more discussions in this thread. |
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Dec 18 2012, 09:10 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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TBH I haven't seen much use of fibrates (none that I can recall, for that matter) so far. Don't know if it has fallen out of favour in Australia (Hobart) or it's just that I've been not looking close enough.
P/S: B-blockers can mask the adrenegic symptoms of hypoglycaemia as well (!use in high risk patients). Hypermax, are b-blockers and absolute contraindication in COPD and Asthma? I ask this only because I have seen patients on them, where the doctors say, B-blockers work for them. |
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Dec 18 2012, 09:40 AM
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3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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I guess the benefits outweighs the risk? I think cardioselective BBs will be used to decrease unwanted s/e. but still, it will have more or less affect the airways/FEV1.
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Dec 18 2012, 09:47 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 18 2012, 09:10 AM) TBH I haven't seen much use of fibrates (none that I can recall, for that matter) so far. Don't know if it has fallen out of favour in Australia (Hobart) or it's just that I've been not looking close enough. B blocker is contraindicated in both coad and asthma as it causes bronchial constriction. I have not seen patients with coad or asthma being started on b blocker. Perhaps the patients u have seen are having cardiac asthma?P/S: B-blockers can mask the adrenegic symptoms of hypoglycaemia as well (!use in high risk patients). Hypermax, are b-blockers and absolute contraindication in COPD and Asthma? I ask this only because I have seen patients on them, where the doctors say, B-blockers work for them. |
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Dec 18 2012, 09:55 AM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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In theory, that only applies to non-selective BBs right? How atenolol?
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Dec 18 2012, 10:03 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 18 2012, 09:55 AM) In theory, that only applies to non-selective BBs right? How atenolol? The cardio selective bb loses its receptor selectivity at higher dosage.http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_blocker Read under the section adverse effects. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 18 2012, 10:11 AM |
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Dec 18 2012, 01:55 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 18 2012, 09:10 AM) TBH I haven't seen much use of fibrates (none that I can recall, for that matter) so far. Don't know if it has fallen out of favour in Australia (Hobart) or it's just that I've been not looking close enough. fibrates are not like statins which can give you other benefits, their only role is to lower TGL. fish oil with omega 3 and 6 seems to be a more popular choice now.P/S: B-blockers can mask the adrenegic symptoms of hypoglycaemia as well (!use in high risk patients). Hypermax, are b-blockers and absolute contraindication in COPD and Asthma? I ask this only because I have seen patients on them, where the doctors say, B-blockers work for them. beta blocker is also contraindicated in people with vascular diseases. but the benefits still outweighs the risk. QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 18 2012, 09:40 AM) I guess the benefits outweighs the risk? I think cardioselective BBs will be used to decrease unwanted s/e. but still, it will have more or less affect the airways/FEV1. QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 18 2012, 09:55 AM) In theory, that only applies to non-selective BBs right? How atenolol? at the end of the day, like onelove89 mentioned, is to see whether the benefits outweigh the risk or not. even in an asthmatic patient, if the patient needs a b-blocker to survive it has to be given and the asthma is being contained in some other ways (if the patient suffers an attack). and a drug being selective doesn't mean 100% of the drug particles are selective. as hypermax pointed out, as the dosage increases there will be more circulating drugs in the system and just 1% of the stray particles maybe enough to trigger and attack. having said that some asthmatic patients may also not react to the beta blocker. so the best way is to monitor the patient and prescribe accordingly and start with small doses.This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 18 2012, 02:00 PM |
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Dec 18 2012, 05:18 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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we should really have more of these discussions. |
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Dec 18 2012, 05:34 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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OK, again. Pls spot the mistake in this discharge note.
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Dec 18 2012, 06:30 PM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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Can only read Humulin, Furosemide, Felodipine....maybe Enalapril, Aspirin and ... not so sure about the last one.
Patient given diuretics despite being DM n on insulin treatment? |
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Dec 18 2012, 10:23 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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Last one is simvastatin. ccb given with ccf? Wanna kill the patient mer
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Dec 18 2012, 11:38 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 18 2012, 10:23 PM) Last one is simvastatin. ccb given with ccf? Wanna kill the patient mer Good one. The list of meds were prescribed by a senior MO graduated from a renown university in developed country. From the same hospital as the previous case. That's why I am against judging a doctor purely based on where he graduated from. Added on December 18, 2012, 11:40 pm QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 18 2012, 06:30 PM) Can only read Humulin, Furosemide, Felodipine....maybe Enalapril, Aspirin and ... not so sure about the last one. Furosemide is needed in this case as the patient has CCF. This is again a case of benefits outweigh the risks.Patient given diuretics despite being DM n on insulin treatment? This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 18 2012, 11:40 PM |
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Dec 19 2012, 12:01 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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Tripple whammy right there as well?
Also this article may be interest for you guys. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9264493 This post has been edited by D_s_X: Dec 19 2012, 12:10 AM |
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Dec 19 2012, 12:35 AM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 19 2012, 12:01 AM) Tripple whammy right there as well? firstly the article compares the drug against a placebo, which is pointless in this time and age. of course the drugs performs better than a placebo. Also this article may be interest for you guys. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9264493 'Of the 450 patients, 55% were identified as having coronary artery disease as the cause of their heart failure, and the remaining 45% were classified as having a nonischemic cause.' in this case actually only about 45% of the patients are more prone to heart failure worsening by the CCB IMO. in people with CAD your heart may be still be fine (valves and walls still normal). also there isn't any confidence interval for the decrease in blood pressure hence it may not be clinically significant although its statistically significant. mortality rates for both are the same as well. anyway the discussion and conclusion pretty much sums it up: "Despite these modestly favorable hemodynamic and hormonal effects, however, felodipine ER therapy was not associated with clear-cut short-term or long-term clinical benefit. This study, therefore, does not support the concept that a dihydropyridine calcium antagonist can strikingly augment the favorable clinical response to ACE inhibitors in heart failure. Nonetheless, the data suggest that felodipine ER can be used safely in patients with heart failure if used for another indication. " so maybe the MO is treating the patient for hypertension? sorry can't really read the abbreviations. but this means that Felodipine is not contraindicated with CCF and the script is accurate. This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 19 2012, 12:37 AM |
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Dec 19 2012, 06:56 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 19 2012, 12:35 AM) firstly the article compares the drug against a placebo, which is pointless in this time and age. of course the drugs performs better than a placebo. 1. This patient has both hypertension and CCF, thus felodipine should not be used as first line therapy. In the above case, dose of enalapril is still not optimized.'Of the 450 patients, 55% were identified as having coronary artery disease as the cause of their heart failure, and the remaining 45% were classified as having a nonischemic cause.' in this case actually only about 45% of the patients are more prone to heart failure worsening by the CCB IMO. in people with CAD your heart may be still be fine (valves and walls still normal). also there isn't any confidence interval for the decrease in blood pressure hence it may not be clinically significant although its statistically significant. mortality rates for both are the same as well. anyway the discussion and conclusion pretty much sums it up: "Despite these modestly favorable hemodynamic and hormonal effects, however, felodipine ER therapy was not associated with clear-cut short-term or long-term clinical benefit. This study, therefore, does not support the concept that a dihydropyridine calcium antagonist can strikingly augment the favorable clinical response to ACE inhibitors in heart failure. Nonetheless, the data suggest that felodipine ER can be used safely in patients with heart failure if used for another indication. " so maybe the MO is treating the patient for hypertension? sorry can't really read the abbreviations. but this means that Felodipine is not contraindicated with CCF and the script is accurate. 2. Beta blocker could be added for this case in place of felodipine. Beta blocker is known to be beneficial in patients with heart failure, and it treats hypertension as well. 3. Calcium channel blocker is best avoided in systolic heart failure, but can be used safely in diastolic heart failure. Both conditions can only be distinguished with echocardiography. However, both conditions often coexist in clinical practice. Echo was not done in the above case. 4. Another study done on felodipine in heart failure http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277290/ It is really good to see healthy discussions going on. Keep up the good work guys. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 19 2012, 06:58 AM |
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Dec 19 2012, 08:01 AM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 11:56 AM) 1. This patient has both hypertension and CCF, thus felodipine should not be used as first line therapy. In the above case, dose of enalapril is still not optimized. Agreed that CCB should be changed to B-blocker. Here we use metoprolol, and some heart function clinics (run by heart failure specialist, ie cardiologist who did fellowships in HF) uses atenolol, not sure why. 2. Beta blocker could be added for this case in place of felodipine. Beta blocker is known to be beneficial in patients with heart failure, and it treats hypertension as well. 3. Calcium channel blocker is best avoided in systolic heart failure, but can be used safely in diastolic heart failure. Both conditions can only be distinguished with echocardiography. However, both conditions often coexist in clinical practice. Echo was not done in the above case. 4. Another study done on felodipine in heart failure http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277290/ It is really good to see healthy discussions going on. Keep up the good work guys. It is quite interesting to know that in Malaysia we can diagnose "CCF" without a documented Echo. I know it's a clinical diagnosis but still, wouldn't you want to know whether you have missed any important information, ie Pulmonary HTN, LV RV size EF etc. |
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Dec 19 2012, 08:05 AM
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8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 19 2012, 08:01 AM) Agreed that CCB should be changed to B-blocker. Here we use metoprolol, and some heart function clinics (run by heart failure specialist, ie cardiologist who did fellowships in HF) uses atenolol, not sure why. How's CCF generally diagnosed in Malaysia anyway?It is quite interesting to know that in Malaysia we can diagnose "CCF" without a documented Echo. I know it's a clinical diagnosis but still, wouldn't you want to know whether you have missed any important information, ie Pulmonary HTN, LV RV size EF etc. CXR, HT, maybe ankle/sacral edema? Added on December 19, 2012, 8:10 am QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 18 2012, 10:23 PM) Last one is simvastatin. ccb given with ccf? Wanna kill the patient mer Nice. As hypermax mentioned, MOs can only prescribe lovostatin..so how did this happen? QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 18 2012, 11:38 PM) Good one. Ah.. Thanks. Learn something new everyday The list of meds were prescribed by a senior MO graduated from a renown university in developed country. From the same hospital as the previous case. That's why I am against judging a doctor purely based on where he graduated from. Added on December 18, 2012, 11:40 pm Furosemide is needed in this case as the patient has CCF. This is again a case of benefits outweigh the risks. At least the doc has a decent handwriting This post has been edited by Syd G: Dec 19 2012, 08:10 AM |
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Dec 19 2012, 09:04 AM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Syd G @ Dec 19 2012, 08:05 AM) How's CCF generally diagnosed in Malaysia anyway? The person who prescribed the meds in this case is a senior MO (UD48). In district hospital, senior MOs sometimes function as specialist in terms of drug prescription.CXR, HT, maybe ankle/sacral edema? Added on December 19, 2012, 8:10 am Nice. As hypermax mentioned, MOs can only prescribe lovostatin..so how did this happen? Ah.. Thanks. Learn something new everyday At least the doc has a decent handwriting |
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Dec 19 2012, 10:19 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 06:56 AM) 1. This patient has both hypertension and CCF, thus felodipine should not be used as first line therapy. In the above case, dose of enalapril is still not optimized. I see your point, but maybe it's just one of those things that just works for the patient.2. Beta blocker could be added for this case in place of felodipine. Beta blocker is known to be beneficial in patients with heart failure, and it treats hypertension as well. 3. Calcium channel blocker is best avoided in systolic heart failure, but can be used safely in diastolic heart failure. Both conditions can only be distinguished with echocardiography. However, both conditions often coexist in clinical practice. Echo was not done in the above case. 4. Another study done on felodipine in heart failure http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277290/ It is really good to see healthy discussions going on. Keep up the good work guys. I have no idea about diagnosis of CCF in Malaysia, but I do know theres Framingham's Citreria (not like I remember the citrerias) EDIT: just added the criteria for completeness after searching Major criteria: Cardiomegaly on chest radiography S3 gallop (a third heart sound) Acute pulmonary edema Paroxysmal nocturnal dyspnea Crackles on lung auscultation Central venous pressure of more than 16 cm H2O at the right atrium Jugular vein distension Positive abdominojugular test Weight loss of more than 4.5 kg in 5 days in response to treatment Minor criteria: Tachycardia of more than 120 beats per minute Nocturnal cough Dyspnea on ordinary exertion Pleural effusion Decrease in vital capacity by one third from maximum recorded Hepatomegaly Bilateral ankle edema 2 major criteria OR 1 major and 2 minor criteria. Also, does anyone know what else they look for in echos for CCF besides Ejection fraction (Systolic failure) and LV function (both systolic and diastolic failure)? Is it a diagnosis by a specialist only? This post has been edited by D_s_X: Dec 19 2012, 10:26 AM |
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Dec 19 2012, 02:29 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 06:56 AM) 1. This patient has both hypertension and CCF, thus felodipine should not be used as first line therapy. In the above case, dose of enalapril is still not optimized. beta blocker should not be used here because the patient has diabetes..though this can improvised...how was the patient's kidney's condition? considering patient has DM the kidney may not be fully functional as well. ivabradine could be used though (not sure whether district hospital has this drug). enalapril is already at the 10mg target to manage aldosterone levels as well as stabilising the bp. the diuretics is also helpful against the patient's hypertension along with resolving the oedema so there are 3 drugs for hypertension now. without echo its really hard to tell how bad has the heart failed and how bad will the CCB affect the heart(class 1/2/3/4 using NYHA classification?)2. Beta blocker could be added for this case in place of felodipine. Beta blocker is known to be beneficial in patients with heart failure, and it treats hypertension as well. 3. Calcium channel blocker is best avoided in systolic heart failure, but can be used safely in diastolic heart failure. Both conditions can only be distinguished with echocardiography. However, both conditions often coexist in clinical practice. Echo was not done in the above case. 4. Another study done on felodipine in heart failure http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277290/ It is really good to see healthy discussions going on. Keep up the good work guys. also that study was done in 1987, not very sure whether the same circumstances applies 25 years later. Added on December 19, 2012, 2:30 pm QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 19 2012, 10:19 AM) Also, does anyone know what else they look for in echos for CCF besides Ejection fraction (Systolic failure) and LV function (both systolic and diastolic failure)? you could also look for hypertrophy of the atrium or ventricles or whether are the walls dilated (dilated cardiomyopathy)This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 19 2012, 02:42 PM |
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Dec 19 2012, 04:21 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... « Wall thickness, and ventricular size/mass too I think. but mainly EF and LV function and determining whether it's sys or dias. I know there's the boston criteria too. http://www.aafp.org/afp/2000/0301/p1319.html think both criteria are pretty similar in terms of sensitivity and specificity. |
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Dec 19 2012, 06:49 PM
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451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 19 2012, 02:29 PM) beta blocker should not be used here because the patient has diabetes..though this can improvised...how was the patient's kidney's condition? considering patient has DM the kidney may not be fully functional as well. ivabradine could be used though (not sure whether district hospital has this drug). enalapril is already at the 10mg target to manage aldosterone levels as well as stabilising the bp. the diuretics is also helpful against the patient's hypertension along with resolving the oedema so there are 3 drugs for hypertension now. without echo its really hard to tell how bad has the heart failed and how bad will the CCB affect the heart(class 1/2/3/4 using NYHA classification?) The patient's functional capacity (CCF re NYHA classification) is much more important than the Echo itself IMO. Some people function very well with relatively low EF. also that study was done in 1987, not very sure whether the same circumstances applies 25 years later. Added on December 19, 2012, 2:30 pm you could also look for hypertrophy of the atrium or ventricles or whether are the walls dilated (dilated cardiomyopathy) QUOTE Wall thickness, and ventricular size/mass too I think. but mainly EF and LV function and determining whether it's sys or dias. I know there's the boston criteria too. http://www.aafp.org/afp/2000/0301/p1319.html think both criteria are pretty similar in terms of sensitivity and specificity. Does it really matter that much if it's systolic or diastolic failure in practice? Any practictioners out there care to enlighten me? http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/conten...pl_D/2.abstract Summary: Systolic failure: ACEI, Digitalis, Diuretics Diastolic Failure: ACEI, BB, CCB, Diuretics +- Digitalis (in AF). I don't think many people are put on Digitalis anyway unless they have AF due to risk of toxicity. |
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Dec 19 2012, 07:01 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 19 2012, 02:29 PM) beta blocker should not be used here because the patient has diabetes..though this can improvised...how was the patient's kidney's condition? considering patient has DM the kidney may not be fully functional as well. ivabradine could be used though (not sure whether district hospital has this drug). enalapril is already at the 10mg target to manage aldosterone levels as well as stabilising the bp. the diuretics is also helpful against the patient's hypertension along with resolving the oedema so there are 3 drugs for hypertension now. without echo its really hard to tell how bad has the heart failed and how bad will the CCB affect the heart(class 1/2/3/4 using NYHA classification?) 1. Beta blocker is not recommended in DM patients, but it is not absolutely contraindicated. Compare to CCB in heart failure, it is relatively safer.also that study was done in 1987, not very sure whether the same circumstances applies 25 years later. Added on December 19, 2012, 2:30 pm you could also look for hypertrophy of the atrium or ventricles or whether are the walls dilated (dilated cardiomyopathy) 2. Low dose Beta blocker is generally used in HF. So even DM patients with HF are well tolerated towards BB. 3. There are many studies with conflicting views on the usage of CCB in HF. But in general, CCB is best avoided in diastolic HF (a strong physiology knowledge will tell you why) 4. Enalapril can be used as high as 20mg BD in HF 5. Kidney functions are normal in this case. QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 19 2012, 06:49 PM) The patient's functional capacity (CCF re NYHA classification) is much more important than the Echo itself IMO. Some people function very well with relatively low EF. In practice, both systolic and diastolic HF often coexist (according to my consultant, more reference needed). Thus CCB shouldn't be used as first line.Does it really matter that much if it's systolic or diastolic failure in practice? Any practictioners out there care to enlighten me? http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/conten...pl_D/2.abstract Summary: Systolic failure: ACEI, Digitalis, Diuretics Diastolic Failure: ACEI, BB, CCB, Diuretics +- Digitalis (in AF). I don't think many people are put on Digitalis anyway unless they have AF due to risk of toxicity. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 19 2012, 07:08 PM |
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Dec 19 2012, 07:03 PM
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451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 07:01 PM) 1. Beta blocker is not recommended in DM patients, but it is not absolutely contraindicated. Compare to CCB in heart failure, it is relatively safer. I can say that as well after receiving and talking to a few lecturers they do coexcist.2. Low dose Beta blocker is generally used in HF. So even DM patients are well tolerated towards BB. 3. There are many studies with conflicting views on the usage of CCB in HF. But in general, CCB is best avoided in diastolic HF (a strong physiology knowledge will tell you why) 4. Enalapril can be used as high as 20mg BD in HF 5. Kidney functions are normal in this case. In practice, both systolic and diastolic HF often coexist (according to my consultant, more reference needed). Thus CCB shouldn't be used as first line. |
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Dec 19 2012, 07:11 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 12:01 AM) 1. Beta blocker is not recommended in DM patients, but it is not absolutely contraindicated. Compare to CCB in heart failure, it is relatively safer. Just had some bedside teaching about diastolic heart failure (and had a glance at all the heart function clinic letters for a patient admitted under med) - basically it's all about fluid balance and beta blocker, and there is nothing much else to treat. A quick read in uptodate showed that there is not much data about diastolic heart failure. ?ACEI ?diuretics ?probably beta blocker. Difficult! Thats why you need to go to heart function clinic lol2. Low dose Beta blocker is generally used in HF. So even DM patients are well tolerated towards BB. 3. There are many studies with conflicting views on the usage of CCB in HF. But in general, CCB is best avoided in diastolic HF (a strong physiology knowledge will tell you why) 4. Enalapril can be used as high as 20mg BD in HF 5. Kidney functions are normal in this case. In practice, both systolic and diastolic HF often coexist (according to my consultant, more reference needed). Thus CCB shouldn't be used as first line. |
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Dec 19 2012, 08:35 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 19 2012, 07:11 PM) Just had some bedside teaching about diastolic heart failure (and had a glance at all the heart function clinic letters for a patient admitted under med) - basically it's all about fluid balance and beta blocker, and there is nothing much else to treat. A quick read in uptodate showed that there is not much data about diastolic heart failure. ?ACEI ?diuretics ?probably beta blocker. Difficult! Thats why you need to go to heart function clinic lol The recipe for chronic heart failure management comprises of the following:1. Diuretic (to get rid of oedema) 2. ACE I (improve survival and quality of life) 3. Beta blocker (reduce myocardial oxygen demand) 4. Restriction of fluid intake In Malaysia, CHF is usually diagnosed clinically with radiological evidence. However, not every CHF patient can get echo due to limited resources in KKM. Also, echo is usually done by medical assistant, so the reliability remains questionable |
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Dec 19 2012, 09:26 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 08:35 PM) The recipe for chronic heart failure management comprises of the following: I have a very dumb question here, Angiotensin II has various functions, which of it is the most prominent? Is it constriction of vessels as I remember?1. Diuretic (to get rid of oedema) 2. ACE I (improve survival and quality of life) 3. Beta blocker (reduce myocardial oxygen demand) 4. Restriction of fluid intake In Malaysia, CHF is usually diagnosed clinically with radiological evidence. However, not every CHF patient can get echo due to limited resources in KKM. Also, echo is usually done by medical assistant, so the reliability remains questionable |
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Dec 19 2012, 10:17 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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Excuse the interruption, but thie article is quite "enlightening"...
"One of the many things that make Malaysia in general such an appealing retirement option is its high standard of health care. Hospitals are well-equipped and modern, and most medical personnel speak fluent English. In addition, health care costs are very low, and the quality of care tends to be excellent. Since Malaysia does not have any medical schools, all physicians practicing medicine here have received their education abroad, mainly in the European Union, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and the U.S. Health care is of such a high standard and so reasonably priced that Malaysia is one of the world’s top medical tourism destinations, with visits growing at a rate of 30 percent annually." Article here: http://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/On-Ret...largely-unknown |
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Dec 19 2012, 10:44 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 01:35 AM) The recipe for chronic heart failure management comprises of the following: Am just talking about diastolic HF, not HF in general.1. Diuretic (to get rid of oedema) 2. ACE I (improve survival and quality of life) 3. Beta blocker (reduce myocardial oxygen demand) 4. Restriction of fluid intake In Malaysia, CHF is usually diagnosed clinically with radiological evidence. However, not every CHF patient can get echo due to limited resources in KKM. Also, echo is usually done by medical assistant, so the reliability remains questionable |
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Dec 19 2012, 11:30 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 19 2012, 10:44 PM) Am just talking about diastolic HF, not HF in general. Ahh, sorry, I didn't read your post properly.Yeah, I must admit I dun really know how to treat diastolic HF. Haven't encountered a pure DHF before. Added on December 19, 2012, 11:31 pm QUOTE(podrunner @ Dec 19 2012, 10:17 PM) Excuse the interruption, but thie article is quite "enlightening"... Total rubbish article. Sounds like promotional gimmick by our gomen. "One of the many things that make Malaysia in general such an appealing retirement option is its high standard of health care. Hospitals are well-equipped and modern, and most medical personnel speak fluent English. In addition, health care costs are very low, and the quality of care tends to be excellent. Since Malaysia does not have any medical schools, all physicians practicing medicine here have received their education abroad, mainly in the European Union, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and the U.S. Health care is of such a high standard and so reasonably priced that Malaysia is one of the world’s top medical tourism destinations, with visits growing at a rate of 30 percent annually." Article here: http://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/On-Ret...largely-unknown This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 19 2012, 11:31 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 12:00 AM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 19 2012, 09:26 PM) I have a very dumb question here, Angiotensin II has various functions, which of it is the most prominent? Is it constriction of vessels as I remember? vasoconstriction.. hypertrophy of the heart... renin release which triggers aldosterone release... Na retention..increase fluid retention.. BP raised..Added on December 20, 2012, 12:02 am QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 19 2012, 07:01 PM) 1. Beta blocker is not recommended in DM patients, but it is not absolutely contraindicated. Compare to CCB in heart failure, it is relatively safer. yeah CCB will also cause peripheral oedema which is very hard to get rid off. so its best to avoid.2. Low dose Beta blocker is generally used in HF. So even DM patients with HF are well tolerated towards BB. 3. There are many studies with conflicting views on the usage of CCB in HF. But in general, CCB is best avoided in diastolic HF (a strong physiology knowledge will tell you why) 4. Enalapril can be used as high as 20mg BD in HF 5. Kidney functions are normal in this case. In practice, both systolic and diastolic HF often coexist (according to my consultant, more reference needed). Thus CCB shouldn't be used as first line. This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 20 2012, 12:02 AM |
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Dec 20 2012, 03:00 AM
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Junior Member
47 posts Joined: Dec 2012
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hello guys, im new here.
im spm grad and interested in doing medicine. i have questions regarding a level  should i enroll to college in jan or march. let say i enroll in january. then, what if i get good result for my spm(which in march) then apply for scholarships and got offers for overseas. what im afraid/unsure is if i reject those offers and continue my a level will i get to receive scholarship again to do pre med/degree? and what subjects should i take for a level. i have done my homework and thinking of taking chemistry and biology.but idk what to take for 1 more subject. if can i really dont want to take physics and take mathematics instead. but for medicine do i really have to take physics or there is other option? thanks in advance |
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Dec 20 2012, 08:07 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 03:00 AM) hello guys, im new here. If you get a straight A's result for your SPM, you can try and might get the JPA scholarship to do medicine. They will sponsor you to do the A-levels and send you wherever they like after that.im spm grad and interested in doing medicine. i have questions regarding a level should i enroll to college in jan or march. let say i enroll in january. then, what if i get good result for my spm(which in march) then apply for scholarships and got offers for overseas. what im afraid/unsure is if i reject those offers and continue my a level will i get to receive scholarship again to do pre med/degree? and what subjects should i take for a level. i have done my homework and thinking of taking chemistry and biology.but idk what to take for 1 more subject. if can i really dont want to take physics and take mathematics instead. but for medicine do i really have to take physics or there is other option? thanks in advance eg; We got JPA students in MSU-IMS Bangalore who did their A-Levels in MSU Shah Alam. If you don't mind being sent anywhere to do medicine by JPA and don't have the $$$ to do it privately... just apply and take the JPA route if it is offered to you~ Added on December 20, 2012, 8:15 amHere is a blog of one of my juniors (JPA scholar) and her experience: http://www.tzequan.blogspot.com/2012/03/i-...end-myself.html This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Dec 20 2012, 08:17 AM |
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Dec 20 2012, 08:29 AM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Dec 20 2012, 08:07 AM) If you get a straight A's result for your SPM, you can try and might get the JPA scholarship to do medicine. They will sponsor you to do the A-levels and send you wherever they like after that. Edited - read wrongly.eg; We got JPA students in MSU-IMS Bangalore who did their A-Levels in MSU Shah Alam. If you don't mind being sent anywhere to do medicine by JPA and don't have the $$$ to do it privately... just apply and take the JPA route if it is offered to you~ Added on December 20, 2012, 8:15 amHere is a blog of one of my junior (JPA scholar) and her experience: http://www.tzequan.blogspot.com/2012/03/i-...end-myself.html This post has been edited by podrunner: Dec 20 2012, 08:34 AM |
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Dec 20 2012, 10:00 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 03:00 AM) hello guys, im new here. How was your mock exam results?im spm grad and interested in doing medicine. i have questions regarding a level should i enroll to college in jan or march. let say i enroll in january. then, what if i get good result for my spm(which in march) then apply for scholarships and got offers for overseas. what im afraid/unsure is if i reject those offers and continue my a level will i get to receive scholarship again to do pre med/degree? and what subjects should i take for a level. i have done my homework and thinking of taking chemistry and biology.but idk what to take for 1 more subject. if can i really dont want to take physics and take mathematics instead. but for medicine do i really have to take physics or there is other option? thanks in advance I have friends whom enrolled for jan/march intake, and they dropped out half way because they've gotten the scholarship, of course they have to restart again. It depends really. Some just have a backup plan just in case they didn't get the scholarship. physics is a part of medicine but I don't think it's a prerequisite for doing med. (do pardon if i'm wrong) of course you can scroll through the many MANY posts in this thread before deciding that medicine is for you. QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Dec 20 2012, 08:07 AM) If you get a straight A's result for your SPM, you can try and might get the JPA scholarship to do medicine. They will sponsor you to do the A-levels and send you wherever they like after that. Or they might put you in one of the local private Us. eg; We got JPA students in MSU-IMS Bangalore who did their A-Levels in MSU Shah Alam. If you don't mind being sent anywhere to do medicine by JPA and don't have the $$$ to do it privately... just apply and take the JPA route if it is offered to you~ Added on December 20, 2012, 8:15 amHere is a blog of one of my juniors (JPA scholar) and her experience: http://www.tzequan.blogspot.com/2012/03/i-...end-myself.html Good testimony from your junior. Reminds me of how I prayed to God, and waiting for a long time for the answer. Still, I wish to come back to sarawak/sabah to serve my people one day, but I don't think it'll be that soon.India's med course is much expensive compared to the local private Us, is that correct? |
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Dec 20 2012, 10:02 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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MMC need Chemistry, Biology and Maths/Physics.. so you dont have to take Physics.. I didnt
Monash Australia doesnt even require Biology. |
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Dec 20 2012, 10:29 AM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 20 2012, 12:00 AM) vasoconstriction.. hypertrophy of the heart... renin release which triggers aldosterone release... Na retention..increase fluid retention.. BP raised.. I do think that you need to reread my question more carefully, I know about all those but which of it is dominant? (Hence hypermax's: (improve survival and quality of life)) |
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Dec 20 2012, 10:41 AM
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Junior Member
47 posts Joined: Dec 2012
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 20 2012, 10:00 AM) How was your mock exam results? well for my trial,I have friends whom enrolled for jan/march intake, and they dropped out half way because they've gotten the scholarship, of course they have to restart again. It depends really. Some just have a backup plan just in case they didn't get the scholarship. physics is a part of medicine but I don't think it's a prerequisite for doing med. (do pardon if i'm wrong) of course you can scroll through the many MANY posts in this thread before deciding that medicine is for you. Or they might put you in one of the local private Us. Good testimony from your junior. Reminds me of how I prayed to God, and waiting for a long time for the answer. Still, I wish to come back to sarawak/sabah to serve my people one day, but I don't think it'll be that soon.India's med course is much expensive compared to the local private Us, is that correct? science subjects i got 'C' for chemistry/physics and 'B' for biology. 'A' for mod maths and 'E' for add maths (40 marks). will i get accepted to a-levels with this?(for january intake) but im pretty confident i can scores in my real spm.  since i was child my dream was to be a scientist but change my mind to be a doctor instead. (since it looks like the profession dont do well in malaysia and i dont really have wide knowledge about being a scientist) but now i got really interested and sothisphicated to be a doctor. and it's my dream to be a doctor now. i cant see myself doing other jobs than being a doctor. i think my personality matches for doctor and can withstand the pressure of being a doctor |
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Dec 20 2012, 11:04 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 10:41 AM) well for my trial, You can get into an a-level program. Not sure about the scholarship though.science subjects i got 'C' for chemistry/physics and 'B' for biology. 'A' for mod maths and 'E' for add maths (40 marks). will i get accepted to a-levels with this?(for january intake) but im pretty confident i can scores in my real spm. since i was child my dream was to be a scientist but change my mind to be a doctor instead. (since it looks like the profession dont do well in malaysia and i dont really have wide knowledge about being a scientist) but now i got really interested and sothisphicated to be a doctor. and it's my dream to be a doctor now. i cant see myself doing other jobs than being a doctor. i think my personality matches for doctor and can withstand the pressure of being a doctor When you see your doctor, you only see less than 10% of what they do. Other things involve frustrating things like dealing with authorities, problem-solving, politics, medico-legal issues, bad bosses and trying no to kill someone. In addition to trying to keep up with the latest drugs, invention, research findings etc |
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Dec 20 2012, 11:07 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 20 2012, 10:00 AM) India's med course is much expensive compared to the local private Us, is that correct? Mostly yes... except a few IPTS... eg; Perdana Uni~ (can do MBBS almost three times over in India with their tuition fee) |
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Dec 20 2012, 12:45 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 20 2012, 10:29 AM) I do think that you need to reread my question more carefully, I know about all those but which of it is dominant? (Hence hypermax's: (improve survival and quality of life)) All of these happen concurrently when angiotensin 2 binds to the AT1 receptors. There's no dominant process and it is a positive feedback mechanis. However if you are talking about short term and long term eeffects of excess angiotensin 2 circulating ijbthe body then vasoconstriction and bp increase takes place first and hypertrophy comes later at a slower rate. Hence if you dont treat it your condition will get more and more worse. Which brings back to improving survival rate and qualityof life. Hope I answered your question.This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 20 2012, 12:53 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 01:56 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 20 2012, 10:29 AM) I do think that you need to reread my question more carefully, I know about all those but which of it is dominant? (Hence hypermax's: (improve survival and quality of life)) vasoconstriction and sodium reabsorption.was reading an article on AT2r, which is rather interesting http://hyper.ahajournals.org/content/35/1/155.full http://circres.ahajournals.org/content/83/12/1182.full However i think sartans and prils are pretty much the same in terms of efficacy. Still there are conflicting data saying one is better than the other. Any clinicians can clarify the selection of sartans over ACEI? (apart from when the patient cannot take ACEI). Added on December 20, 2012, 2:04 pm QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 10:41 AM) well for my trial, makes me think that you're now talking in jargon to be sophisticated. science subjects i got 'C' for chemistry/physics and 'B' for biology. 'A' for mod maths and 'E' for add maths (40 marks). will i get accepted to a-levels with this?(for january intake) but im pretty confident i can scores in my real spm. since i was child my dream was to be a scientist but change my mind to be a doctor instead. (since it looks like the profession dont do well in malaysia and i dont really have wide knowledge about being a scientist) but now i got really interested and sothisphicated to be a doctor. and it's my dream to be a doctor now. i cant see myself doing other jobs than being a doctor. i think my personality matches for doctor and can withstand the pressure of being a doctor It takes more than just 'dreams' to be a doctor. It takes more than 'personalities' to be a doctor. What IS the right personality to be a doctor actually? Also, you can withstand the pressure being a doctor, like syd G said, it's not as simple as you think, even I don't quite fully understand what i'm venturing into. I'm certain the pressure then is much greater than what I'm experiencing now. To think about you'll be responsible for ones life, is different from the actual thing when you are holding the person's life in your hands. I'm not discouraging you. just asking you to think twice Ain't everyones cup of tea when it comes to the lifestyle.This post has been edited by onelove89: Dec 20 2012, 02:04 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 02:58 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 10:41 AM) well for my trial, your results suggest you are NOT suitable to become a doctor....there are so many people with straight as even in the trial exam, they will be more qualified....most students do get better final results in spm compared to the school trials, but it is unlikely and unusual for students to do dramatically better, so that trial result will translate into mostly b's and a few low a's in the final result...if you get any c in the sciences and maths, you will NOT be allowed to enter medicine, as a mmc ruling....science subjects i got 'C' for chemistry/physics and 'B' for biology. 'A' for mod maths and 'E' for add maths (40 marks). will i get accepted to a-levels with this?(for january intake) but im pretty confident i can scores in my real spm. since i was child my dream was to be a scientist but change my mind to be a doctor instead. (since it looks like the profession dont do well in malaysia and i dont really have wide knowledge about being a scientist) but now i got really interested and sothisphicated to be a doctor. and it's my dream to be a doctor now. i cant see myself doing other jobs than being a doctor. i think my personality matches for doctor and can withstand the pressure of being a doctor but you are lucky this is malaysia, as it is one country where you can buy a doctor's degree... if you manage to get at least b's in sciences and math, you can do a pre-u, like a levels, and if you do get at least 3b, and have the money, you can enter one if the numerous ipts med schools..... however, scholarship is out of the question....your grades are not good enough.... i would however advise you to change you mindset, and prepare yourself for a career in something else...just because you want to be a doctor, does NOT mean you can, or should be allowed to....i do NOT think you are academically qualified.... This post has been edited by limeuu: Dec 20 2012, 03:01 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 03:24 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 20 2012, 02:58 PM) your results suggest you are NOT suitable to become a doctor....there are so many people with straight as even in the trial exam, they will be more qualified....most students do get better final results in spm compared to the school trials, but it is unlikely and unusual for students to do dramatically better, so that trial result will translate into mostly b's and a few low a's in the final result...if you get any c in the sciences and maths, you will NOT be allowed to enter medicine, as a mmc ruling.... Here comes the smack down, oppa limeuu style but you are lucky this is malaysia, as it is one country where you can buy a doctor's degree... if you manage to get at least b's in sciences and math, you can do a pre-u, like a levels, and if you do get at least 3b, and have the money, you can enter one if the numerous ipts med schools..... however, scholarship is out of the question....your grades are not good enough.... i would however advise you to change you mindset, and prepare yourself for a career in something else...just because you want to be a doctor, does NOT mean you can, or should be allowed to....i do NOT think you are academically qualified.... Give him some chance la. Maybe he can do well in pre U? U never know. |
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Dec 20 2012, 03:31 PM
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Junior Member
26 posts Joined: Jun 2012
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 03:24 PM) Here comes the smack down, oppa limeuu style How about do something nearer lor.......pharmacy or nursing also can lar......work in the hospital what.. LOLGive him some chance la. Maybe he can do well in pre U? U never know. |
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Dec 20 2012, 03:34 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(Damier @ Dec 20 2012, 03:31 PM) How about do something nearer lor.......pharmacy or nursing also can lar......work in the hospital what.. LOL In that case one can choose to work as cleaner in hospital. Dun even need a diploma lol |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:01 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 03:24 PM) Here comes the smack down, oppa limeuu style i have never seen b and c students at spm become a students in a proper pre-u...Give him some chance la. Maybe he can do well in pre U? U never know. have you?.... however, i have seen them become a students at some 'foundation' programme for russian med schools.... |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:03 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 20 2012, 01:56 PM) vasoconstriction and sodium reabsorption. Makes much more sense right now for it to be first line for BP in certain cases as well as CCF. was reading an article on AT2r, which is rather interesting http://hyper.ahajournals.org/content/35/1/155.full http://circres.ahajournals.org/content/83/12/1182.full However i think sartans and prils are pretty much the same in terms of efficacy. Still there are conflicting data saying one is better than the other. Any clinicians can clarify the selection of sartans over ACEI? (apart from when the patient cannot take ACEI). I remember our lecturers told us that sartans and prils are pretty similar, although there are different side effects due to presence/breakdown of bradykinin. However, I do remember somewhere that sartans work differently something along the lines of losartan binds loosely whereas cadesartan binds tighter? |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:28 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 20 2012, 04:01 PM) i have never seen b and c students at spm become a students in a proper pre-u... TBH only one. A friend of mine got only 2As and the rest B and C in SPM, but managed to get TER 96% for SAM. But to be fair he was sick during SPM. But nevertheless, nothing is impossible. And the fact that you haven't encountered one doesn't mean it doesn't exist have you?.... however, i have seen them become a students at some 'foundation' programme for russian med schools.... But of course he has to work extra hard from now. If his pre u result is still not satisfactory, then I will discourage him from joining the medical fraternity as well. Btw anyone sitting for mrcp part 1 in Jan? I have a list of must know facts. Let me know if u need it. This post has been edited by hypermax: Dec 20 2012, 04:33 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:35 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 20 2012, 01:56 PM) vasoconstriction and sodium reabsorption. the first choice is always ACEI due to the cost, sartans are still relatively new are much pricier and are only used when ACEI are not effective (in the private settings it may be another story though). but both should never be used together.was reading an article on AT2r, which is rather interesting http://hyper.ahajournals.org/content/35/1/155.full http://circres.ahajournals.org/content/83/12/1182.full However i think sartans and prils are pretty much the same in terms of efficacy. Still there are conflicting data saying one is better than the other. Any clinicians can clarify the selection of sartans over ACEI? (apart from when the patient cannot take ACEI). technically ARBs are more effective as it binds directly to the receptors hence angiotensin 2 have no where to bind and get degraded. In the case of enzyme inhibition there's bound to be some ACE escaping the effects of ACEI. but in real life scenarios it may differ. This post has been edited by zstan: Dec 20 2012, 04:43 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:42 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 20 2012, 04:35 PM) the first choice is always ACEI due to the cost, sartans are still relatively new are much pricier and are only used when ACEI are not effective (in the private settings it may be another story though). but both should never be used together. In clinical practice, first line is almost always ace-I. Arb is used when patient cant tolerate ace-i, usually due to dry cough (accumulation of bradykinnin in the lungs). Of course in some cases, double blockade is used (combination of both Arb and ace-i). |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:43 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 03:24 PM) Here comes the smack down, oppa limeuu style Give him some chance la. Maybe he can do well in pre U? U never know. QUOTE(Damier @ Dec 20 2012, 03:31 PM) How about do something nearer lor.......pharmacy or nursing also can lar......work in the hospital what.. LOL Pharmacy and nursing aren't 'backups' for med. Both are noble professions which requires same amount of dedication and they all have their own difficulties. Don't enter the courses just because it seems like a 'backup plan' in case you don't get into med. Get in for the right reasons. QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 20 2012, 04:03 PM) Makes much more sense right now for it to be first line for BP in certain cases as well as CCF. yes to everything I remember our lecturers told us that sartans and prils are pretty similar, although there are different side effects due to presence/breakdown of bradykinin. However, I do remember somewhere that sartans work differently something along the lines of losartan binds loosely whereas cadesartan binds tighter? but I don't know how relevant are those info to practical clinical scenarios. TBH i haven't seen any AT1r antag prescribed on the wards, yet. (or maybe I just missed them)Added on December 20, 2012, 4:49 pm QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 04:42 PM) In clinical practice, first line is almost always ace-I. Arb is used when patient cant tolerate ace-i, usually due to dry cough (accumulation of bradykinnin in the lungs). Of course in some cases, double blockade is used (combination of both Arb and ace-i). Was wondering if there are other criteria (other than the issue of dry cough/intolerance of ACEI) needed to prescribe arbs. I haven't came across dual ACEI-arb usage, so I found this along the way:http://www.ccjm.org/content/76/12/693.full This post has been edited by onelove89: Dec 20 2012, 04:49 PM |
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Dec 20 2012, 04:50 PM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 04:42 PM) In clinical practice, first line is almost always ace-I. Arb is used when patient cant tolerate ace-i, usually due to dry cough (accumulation of bradykinnin in the lungs). Of course in some cases, double blockade is used (combination of both Arb and ace-i). its really not recommended... there's always other choices of BP lowering drugs.. combination of these 2 will result in declining renal function. the electrolyte imbalance will also be more severe if combined. http://www.jfponline.com/pages.asp?aid=7183 |
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Dec 20 2012, 06:25 PM
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Junior Member
47 posts Joined: Dec 2012
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Dec 20 2012, 02:58 PM) your results suggest you are NOT suitable to become a doctor....there are so many people with straight as even in the trial exam, they will be more qualified....most students do get better final results in spm compared to the school trials, but it is unlikely and unusual for students to do dramatically better, so that trial result will translate into mostly b's and a few low a's in the final result...if you get any c in the sciences and maths, you will NOT be allowed to enter medicine, as a mmc ruling.... why so mean, you dont even know me.but you are lucky this is malaysia, as it is one country where you can buy a doctor's degree... if you manage to get at least b's in sciences and math, you can do a pre-u, like a levels, and if you do get at least 3b, and have the money, you can enter one if the numerous ipts med schools..... however, scholarship is out of the question....your grades are not good enough.... i would however advise you to change you mindset, and prepare yourself for a career in something else...just because you want to be a doctor, does NOT mean you can, or should be allowed to....i do NOT think you are academically qualified.... im not fully prepared during my trial. teachers dont finish sylllabus and so on (last minute study before exam). but im giving my 100 percent for my real spm. i know my capabilities. i cant say anything right. just wait for spm result in march and i will prove you are wrong. i even dont hangout anymore with my socalledhipster* friend because they do stupid things and they dont realize how tough life is if you want to succeed. |
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Dec 20 2012, 06:51 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 06:25 PM) why so mean, you dont even know me. Now that's what I call confidence! im not fully prepared during my trial. teachers dont finish sylllabus and so on (last minute study before exam). but im giving my 100 percent for my real spm. i know my capabilities. i cant say anything right. just wait for spm result in march and i will prove you are wrong. i even dont hangout anymore with my socalledhipster* friend because they do stupid things and they dont realize how tough life is if you want to succeed. All the best! |
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Dec 20 2012, 07:03 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 06:25 PM) why so mean, you dont even know me. Good for you that you're confident. But seriously, there is much more to being a doctor than you think. Can you answer me what a doctor does besides diagnosis and prescribing/delivering appropriate medicines/ procedures?im not fully prepared during my trial. teachers dont finish sylllabus and so on (last minute study before exam). but im giving my 100 percent for my real spm. i know my capabilities. i cant say anything right. just wait for spm result in march and i will prove you are wrong. i even dont hangout anymore with my socalledhipster* friend because they do stupid things and they dont realize how tough life is if you want to succeed. Not being your wet blanket but please do survey other careers as well, you're young and there is still much more to think about. Please note that committing this early to medicine is not necessarily good, I sometimes doubt myself in less time than I think that I'm going to have to be responsible for a person's health. It may seem very managable in paper but when you start to see things in the healthcare setting, by gosh, it is a whole new philosophical lession. Who knows, when you're exploring you might discover some hidden gems as well! (IMHO, all professions are noble as you earn an honest living) Also, my path post-SPM was A-levels then to University. I wasn't the brightest student in my high school but I did fairly well with Maths and Science subjects. Did fairly well in my A-levels and was lucky to be granted an acceptance letter to uni. I did 3 science and a maths for A-levels. Physics and/or biology (have not heard any that does not need chemistry) is/are not needed in all universities but to be safe, just take it if you can handle it to be safe. Do survey which universities you're planning to apply to before choosing the subjects. |
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Dec 20 2012, 07:58 PM
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Junior Member
47 posts Joined: Dec 2012
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 20 2012, 07:03 PM) Good for you that you're confident. But seriously, there is much more to being a doctor than you think. Can you answer me what a doctor does besides diagnosis and prescribing/delivering appropriate medicines/ procedures? is it abt good heart, communication skills, tolerance, patience?Not being your wet blanket but please do survey other careers as well, you're young and there is still much more to think about. Please note that committing this early to medicine is not necessarily good, I sometimes doubt myself in less time than I think that I'm going to have to be responsible for a person's health. It may seem very managable in paper but when you start to see things in the healthcare setting, by gosh, it is a whole new philosophical lession. Who knows, when you're exploring you might discover some hidden gems as well! (IMHO, all professions are noble as you earn an honest living) Also, my path post-SPM was A-levels then to University. I wasn't the brightest student in my high school but I did fairly well with Maths and Science subjects. Did fairly well in my A-levels and was lucky to be granted an acceptance letter to uni. I did 3 science and a maths for A-levels. Physics and/or biology (have not heard any that does not need chemistry) is/are not needed in all universities but to be safe, just take it if you can handle it to be safe. Do survey which universities you're planning to apply to before choosing the subjects. hmm, but dont worry i will reconsider abt doing medicine after done my a levels. if i get good result and feels i can cope with being a doctor i will continue with it. btw thanks for all the replies |
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Dec 20 2012, 08:12 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 06:25 PM) why so mean, you dont even know me. it's a good thing to have confidence. Don't get us wrong. We aren't just being mean and trying to put you off or discourage anyone trying to get into med. Some of us here are real doctors and some of us are medical students. We say so because we know what you will be venturing into, and how tough it is from there onwards. Limeuu isn't being mean, he's just being realistic, and he's speaking from his experience. im not fully prepared during my trial. teachers dont finish sylllabus and so on (last minute study before exam). but im giving my 100 percent for my real spm. i know my capabilities. i cant say anything right. just wait for spm result in march and i will prove you are wrong. i even dont hangout anymore with my socalledhipster* friend because they do stupid things and they dont realize how tough life is if you want to succeed. Back then, I too was very sure med was the only path for me. Why? because the only reasons I had was 'I wanted to help others' and 'I can do it because I'm (sort of) top in class'. Oh how I crashed and burned. =P Even in my foundation program in OZ, they keep stressing that we should find an alternative to med. There were SO SO many out there trying to do med, including those who are just in the middle of the bell curve. I'm glad I didn't get in the first time. Get your reasons right. It's more than just 'I want to help others' or 'I KNOW this is my future career.' That isn't enough to get you any where. Oh, and also, D_s_X's first question can give you an idea of how much you know about doctors/medicine. Do tell us what do you think about that. Also with your trial results, well, for the time being it's not really enough to get you a scholarship, unless your SPM results prove us wrong. cheers. |
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Dec 20 2012, 08:43 PM
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Senior Member
2,524 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Beneath the starry night
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 20 2012, 04:50 PM) its really not recommended... there's always other choices of BP lowering drugs.. combination of these 2 will result in declining renal function. the electrolyte imbalance will also be more severe if combined. It is not recommended, but some nephro consultants do use such combination in selected cases. I am not sure of the indication as my haven't done my nephro rotation as MO. Will try to find out more about this.http://www.jfponline.com/pages.asp?aid=7183 |
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Dec 20 2012, 08:55 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(hypermax @ Dec 20 2012, 08:43 PM) It is not recommended, but some nephro consultants do use such combination in selected cases. I am not sure of the indication as my haven't done my nephro rotation as MO. Will try to find out more about this. http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/26/8/2268.longthis one says that it's renoprotective. Others say that they don't do much (in terms of renoprotection) But it'll be great to see what the consultants say about the combination. |
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Dec 20 2012, 11:32 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(medwolf @ Dec 20 2012, 07:58 PM) is it abt good heart, communication skills, tolerance, patience? In a nutshell, it is part of it. Syd G has said it is also about medico-legal obligations, professional and personal life boundries and et cetra. Your life will be dominated by medicine. In my limited years of training, having a good heart, tolerance, patience can only bring you so far, there are many unpredictable circumstances where those won't be able to help you with your judgement but in fact, might cloud it. It is not the cleanest profession where everything is either right or wrong. There is much time to explore! I hope that you'll get good results in SPM and A-levels and so on, however, if you don't; plenty of other options as careers where your good heart can be put to good use as well, don't fret! Like I said, every profession is noble if you do it with the right heart. hmm, but dont worry i will reconsider abt doing medicine after done my a levels. if i get good result and feels i can cope with being a doctor i will continue with it. btw thanks for all the replies P/S: re:if i get good result and feels i can cope with being a doctor i will continue with it. You seem to be able to know your limits, one of the things I have been taught to be a good doctor =) |
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Dec 23 2012, 06:32 AM
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Senior Member
2,280 posts Joined: Jul 2008 From: マレーシア
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not sure if this is the right place
but i'm going to finish med school soon need to fill housemanship form and interview just around the corner any idea good place for housemanship? not GH....i hate big hospital cos many medical student (like myself) and more importantly fierce consultant any tips very much appreciated |
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Dec 23 2012, 10:55 AM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(raul88 @ Dec 23 2012, 06:32 AM) not sure if this is the right place well if you want to opt for 'smaller' hospitals you can always apply places like pahang, kelantan, terengganu, perak etc.but i'm going to finish med school soon need to fill housemanship form and interview just around the corner any idea good place for housemanship? not GH....i hate big hospital cos many medical student (like myself) and more importantly fierce consultant any tips very much appreciated |
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Dec 23 2012, 12:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,280 posts Joined: Jul 2008 From: マレーシア
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QUOTE(zstan @ Dec 23 2012, 10:55 AM) well if you want to opt for 'smaller' hospitals you can always apply places like pahang, kelantan, terengganu, perak etc. too far.if not in selangor, ns melaka or johor is ok |
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Dec 23 2012, 01:26 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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With the tsunami of housemans, popular posts will fill up quickly, and you will get asigned somewhere.....they do not entertain appeals anymore, if you don't want, they will send someone else, and you can wait.....
So advise is, choose a smaller hospital, especially further from klang valley.....otherwise they may just assign sabah or sarawak to you..... |
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Dec 23 2012, 07:25 PM
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Senior Member
1,396 posts Joined: Sep 2004
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fellow medics. am looking for some second hand OBA question books. please PM me if you can COD in the Klang Valley. Thank you very much.
*for clinical years This post has been edited by Cristiano-Ronaldo-7: Dec 23 2012, 07:28 PM |
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Dec 24 2012, 08:14 AM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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On Tun Dr. Lim Keng Yaik's demise...
QUOTE ...Dr Lim died at 5.13pm on Saturday, leaving behind his wife Toh Puan Wong Yoon Chuan and three children. He was 73. Si Pin said he and his family were in Hong Kong on a holiday when he got a call from his father to return home. “He was supposed to join us on the trip, but he pulled out when he started having problems with his leg. He had been ill for a year and was hospitalised on Friday with breathing difficulties,” he added. Si Pin said Dr Lim requested to be moved back home from the hospital as “he wanted to pass away in his own house”. When asked what was his father's last words to the family, Si Pin replied: “Live life and go on...now you don't have to stay three feet from me.”... Source: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...0024&sec=nation Since we have yet to know the actual cause of death and if we are to speculate... could it possibly be due to pulmonary infarct from an emboli coming from his leg? DVT? ... ? Then again he was ill for the past 1 year...? cancer perhaps? Anyway... RIP for the late Tun and condolences for his family. This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Dec 24 2012, 08:16 AM |
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Dec 24 2012, 08:27 AM
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VIP
8,023 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: :: Cheras ::
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He had cancer.
If I'm not mistaken it was a 'manly' cancer. Either prostate or testicular? |
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Dec 24 2012, 01:04 PM
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Senior Member
2,227 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: cheras
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Seems legit, cancer predisposes to dvt
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Dec 24 2012, 01:48 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(arsenwagon @ Dec 24 2012, 01:04 PM) Seems legit, cancer predisposes to dvt This is sort of a dumb question, any particular sort of malignancies that normally presents with VTE/DIC? Was thinking of haemato malignancies? or solids have equal chances? |
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Dec 24 2012, 02:23 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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Let the man RIP.
There is no need for any speculation on his medical condition in public space. |
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Dec 24 2012, 03:21 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Dec 24 2012, 02:23 PM) Let the man RIP. You're back! There is no need for any speculation on his medical condition in public space. |
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Dec 24 2012, 04:17 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 24 2012, 01:48 PM) This is sort of a dumb question, any particular sort of malignancies that normally presents with VTE/DIC? Was thinking of haemato malignancies? or solids have equal chances? An embolus can consist of a fragmented malignant mass from its primary or secondary sites. Hemato malignancies...? Yes... AML can lead to DVT. Other D/D? This post has been edited by CyberSetan: Dec 24 2012, 04:18 PM |
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Dec 25 2012, 12:49 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Dec 24 2012, 09:17 PM) An embolus can consist of a fragmented malignant mass from its primary or secondary sites. I think we need to be more professional than speculating other people's cause of death based on newspaper report.Hemato malignancies...? Yes... AML can lead to DVT. Other D/D? |
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Dec 25 2012, 01:20 PM
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Junior Member
451 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Dec 25 2012, 12:49 PM) I think we need to be more professional than speculating other people's cause of death based on newspaper report. Let's leave out other DDx and just discuss about Malignancies and Clots? |
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Dec 25 2012, 06:33 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(D_s_X @ Dec 25 2012, 01:20 PM) Let's leave out other DDx and just discuss about Malignancies and Clots? I was asking purely out of curiosity on the mechanisms/prevalence of hypercoagulability state in malignancies, so I agree. any one can shine some light on this issue? Also this article is pretty good: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1550339/ another dumb question: do we put all patients undergoing chemo/radio with DVT prophylaxis? |
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Dec 29 2012, 01:19 AM
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Junior Member
8 posts Joined: Jan 2012
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Hello! I'm a monash medical student. Nice to meet you all! =D
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Dec 29 2012, 07:33 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(ArkFin8 @ Dec 29 2012, 01:19 AM) Hello! I'm a monash medical student. Nice to meet you all! =D Clayton or Sunway? |
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Dec 29 2012, 10:45 AM
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All Stars
15,856 posts Joined: Nov 2007 From: Zion
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Dec 25 2012, 06:33 PM) I was asking purely out of curiosity on the mechanisms/prevalence of hypercoagulability state in malignancies, so I agree. Not really unless the patient is quite immobile or bed ridden. Compression stockings is mmuch a viable alternative for prevention if the patient is not highly at risk. DVT prophylaxis with drugs may give rise to unwanted bleeding.any one can shine some light on this issue? Also this article is pretty good: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1550339/ another dumb question: do we put all patients undergoing chemo/radio with DVT prophylaxis? |
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Jan 4 2013, 04:04 PM
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Junior Member
64 posts Joined: Sep 2010
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Hi guys,I am planning to medicine(doctor).I've just finished my SPM.What should I do next ? is A-levels the best option ? i am planning to study overseas after a year or two here....which countries is the best for medicine ?
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Jan 4 2013, 04:46 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Dalmin_07 @ Jan 4 2013, 04:04 PM) Hi guys,I am planning to medicine(doctor).I've just finished my SPM.What should I do next ? is A-levels the best option ? i am planning to study overseas after a year or two here....which countries is the best for medicine ? You need to work on that english if you want to do med/ study abroad. Alevels is the best choice imho. provides a broader pathways after and prepares you better for uni, in general. If you want twinning, there are a few to choose from, manipal, pmc and IMU are basically the main choices. I don't really count Monash sunway>clayton as 'twinning' though. How're your results? |
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Jan 4 2013, 05:29 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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I heard a collective groan....
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Jan 4 2013, 06:46 PM
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Senior Member
825 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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I am not interested in medicine at all but I am merely asking on behalf of my friends what names to run away from when it comes to dodgy medicine programs. Sorry for not doing my own research because it is just not me, I am expecting nothing but a short reply. So far, I only know of SEGi and the notorious President College. What else should be added to the list?
Apologies for interrupting the discussion. This post has been edited by Intermission: Jan 4 2013, 06:53 PM |
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Jan 4 2013, 06:58 PM
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Junior Member
64 posts Joined: Sep 2010
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jan 4 2013, 04:46 PM) You need to work on that english if you want to do med/ study abroad. haha my english is fine I guess Alevels is the best choice imho. provides a broader pathways after and prepares you better for uni, in general. If you want twinning, there are a few to choose from, manipal, pmc and IMU are basically the main choices. I don't really count Monash sunway>clayton as 'twinning' though. How're your results? but I realised the mistakes I did in my earlier post yes well everyone's telling me that too.but it's 1.5 years right ? is there a shorter alternative ? also,which college is the best for A-levels? I heard taylors and sunway is good.How about Methodist ? Why wouldn't u count that as twinning? well I haven't got my SPM results yet but my trials was just so-so.Nothing bad not good. |
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Jan 4 2013, 07:54 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Intermission @ Jan 4 2013, 06:46 PM) I am not interested in medicine at all but I am merely asking on behalf of my friends what names to run away from when it comes to dodgy medicine programs. Sorry for not doing my own research because it is just not me, I am expecting nothing but a short reply. So far, I only know of SEGi and the notorious President College. What else should be added to the list? Said friends must learn to do own research.Apologies for interrupting the discussion. One place to start - www.pagalavan.com |
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Jan 4 2013, 08:30 PM
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Senior Member
825 posts Joined: Aug 2012
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jan 4 2013, 07:54 PM) Said friends must learn to do own research. I have already send them the link a long time ago......One place to start - www.pagalavan.com But that doesn't answer my friend's question, sorry. Come on, since there is so many stubborn parents and incompetent students , the least we can do is tell them which school to avoid and which to go. At least that way the good schools can kick them out on your behalf and far less damage is done, save the damaged "face" which they deserve. Well intentioned advice will not deter them but the cold hard truth will. I am just asking for schools to avoid. You don't want to meet them after they graduate from dodgy schools do you? Grant me my list please, you're not helping everyone by not saying no and I am beginning to feel tired being the mediator of my stubborn friends and fussy online medical students. Don't ask me to do the research because this does not concern me and I am but a mere messenger. Stubborn as they might be, they are still my friends. Treat it as if you are alerting people of a public hazard if you will. Thanks for your attention. This post has been edited by Intermission: Jan 4 2013, 08:52 PM |
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Jan 4 2013, 10:02 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Intermission @ Jan 4 2013, 08:30 PM) I have already send them the link a long time ago...... In Malaysia, the medical schools TO GO to would be UM, UKM or USM for IPTAs, or IMU and Monash for IPTSs. But that doesn't answer my friend's question, sorry. Come on, since there is so many stubborn parents and incompetent students , the least we can do is tell them which school to avoid and which to go. At least that way the good schools can kick them out on your behalf and far less damage is done, save the damaged "face" which they deserve. Well intentioned advice will not deter them but the cold hard truth will. I am just asking for schools to avoid. You don't want to meet them after they graduate from dodgy schools do you? Grant me my list please, you're not helping everyone by not saying no and I am beginning to feel tired being the mediator of my stubborn friends and fussy online medical students. Don't ask me to do the research because this does not concern me and I am but a mere messenger. Stubborn as they might be, they are still my friends. Treat it as if you are alerting people of a public hazard if you will. Thanks for your attention. |
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Jan 4 2013, 11:26 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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the med schools to aim for are the ones you cannot qualify academically to get entry into......lol
true for probably 80% of med students in bolehland at the moment..... |
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Jan 5 2013, 12:01 AM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jan 4 2013, 11:26 PM) the med schools to aim for are the ones you cannot qualify academically to get entry into......lol 20% gets into top private such as IMU/Monash? true for probably 80% of med students in bolehland at the moment..... or are they the richer ones? I think it's a whole different story if one is aiming for local Us. |
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Jan 5 2013, 12:42 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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if stringent criteria as demanded for med schools in developed countries are applied, many in imu and monash will also NOT qualify.....
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Jan 5 2013, 04:24 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jan 5 2013, 12:42 AM) if stringent criteria as demanded for med schools in developed countries are applied, many in imu and monash will also NOT qualify..... They should set an entry exam like ISAT too.Any recommendation for OnG text? thinking of getting one. |
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Jan 5 2013, 05:58 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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the priority at the moment is to fill up all available places and make money for the ipts......and comply with the nep for ipta....NOT set standards to choose the best qualified students...
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Jan 5 2013, 06:22 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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With the entrance to oz and uk getting tougher, there should be enough straight As students for IMU and Monash, at least.
Anything less will be disastrous in the mid-term. |
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Jan 5 2013, 06:52 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jan 5 2013, 04:24 PM) They should set an entry exam like ISAT too. Williams obstetrics & Novacs gynecology. - Internationally recognized references.Any recommendation for OnG text? thinking of getting one.Our HOD recommend the above text books for POST GRADUATE students... For undergraduate, our HOD only wants us to read the following : - Dutta's Obstetrics and Gynecology - Shaws gynecology - Mudaliar and Mennons obstetrics. For our fast revision: - Multani obstetrics & Gynecology notes. Google these if you are curious about them.... (i personally dont like obstetrics and gynecology) |
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Jan 5 2013, 08:59 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jan 5 2013, 06:52 PM) Williams obstetrics & Novacs gynecology. - Internationally recognized references. Llewellyn-Jones fundamentals of Obstetrics & Gynaecology by Oats J and Abraham SOur HOD recommend the above text books for POST GRADUATE students... For undergraduate, our HOD only wants us to read the following : - Dutta's Obstetrics and Gynecology - Shaws gynecology - Mudaliar and Mennons obstetrics. For our fast revision: - Multani obstetrics & Gynecology notes. Google these if you are curious about them.... (i personally dont like obstetrics and gynecology) Essential Obstetrics and Gynaecology by Hacker, Moore and Gambone. These two are in my list recommended by our school. any one knows any of them? =/ Thanks Cybersetan. will google them up and go down Kamal to have a look. The theory part is rather interesting for me, I haven't done the actual clinical part though. So we'll see |
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Jan 5 2013, 11:58 PM
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Senior Member
1,569 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jan 5 2013, 06:52 PM) Williams obstetrics & Novacs gynecology. - Internationally recognized references. Why u dont like? OnG is quite easyOur HOD recommend the above text books for POST GRADUATE students... For undergraduate, our HOD only wants us to read the following : - Dutta's Obstetrics and Gynecology - Shaws gynecology - Mudaliar and Mennons obstetrics. For our fast revision: - Multani obstetrics & Gynecology notes. Google these if you are curious about them.... (i personally dont like obstetrics and gynecology) Added on January 6, 2013, 12:01 amAnyone know whether radiologist make much money? I heard radiologist hv flexible time and not so demanded hours This post has been edited by Materazzi: Jan 6 2013, 12:01 AM |
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Jan 6 2013, 12:04 AM
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Senior Member
964 posts Joined: Dec 2005 From: Ipoh!
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Hi guys, any recommendation on pharmacology books? Would prefer those that we can really refer during clinical years as the book tripathy used right now is kind of towards academic? thanks!
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Jan 6 2013, 12:18 AM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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it is worrying, when students decide, even before they even graduate (and some, even before managing to enter med school) what they want to do on the basis of money.....not interest and talent....
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Jan 6 2013, 02:58 AM
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Junior Member
308 posts Joined: May 2009
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can apply for medicine with ccc a levels...realistically
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Jan 6 2013, 06:56 AM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 02:58 AM) can apply for medicine with ccc a levels...realistically You need Bs to qualify. Take the alternative foundation way.You will get blasted here for thinking of taking med with the results you get. A less demanding forum may help you. |
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Jan 6 2013, 12:23 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 02:58 AM) can apply for medicine with ccc a levels...realistically is this a statement, or a question?  Of course you can get in with CCC. Depends where and what uni you're going into. Same goes to the quality of education given to you. Airasia says everyone can fly, Msia says Msia boleh, I say, in Msia, everyone can be a doctor! We are at the top of the game cos we can do anything. |
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Jan 6 2013, 04:17 PM
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Senior Member
1,569 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(onelove89 @ Jan 6 2013, 12:23 PM) is this a statement, or a question? Patients will not ask the univ u hv graduated with Of course you can get in with CCC. Depends where and what uni you're going into. Same goes to the quality of education given to you. Airasia says everyone can fly, Msia says Msia boleh, I say, in Msia, everyone can be a doctor! We are at the top of the game cos we can do anything. |
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Jan 6 2013, 04:27 PM
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Junior Member
308 posts Joined: May 2009
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jan 6 2013, 06:56 AM) You need Bs to qualify. Take the alternative foundation way. Why should get blasted for asking??...isnt tht the whole purpose of a forum to discuss and ask question...is there such thing as a less demanding forum??? all im asking is which med schools in malaysia that are not very particular about good a level results e.g (CCC) realistically speaking about acceptance of those results, as in anyone got get in?You will get blasted here for thinking of taking med with the results you get. A less demanding forum may help you. This post has been edited by Raymond7693: Jan 6 2013, 04:28 PM |
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Jan 6 2013, 04:47 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 04:27 PM) Why should get blasted for asking??...isnt tht the whole purpose of a forum to discuss and ask question...is there such thing as a less demanding forum??? all im asking is which med schools in malaysia that are not very particular about good a level results e.g (CCC) realistically speaking about acceptance of those results, as in anyone got get in? Without Bs, you get nowhere. You need more research. |
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Jan 6 2013, 04:50 PM
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Senior Member
2,527 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Im a Medical Officer in /K. I'm here to lepak.
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QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 04:27 PM) Why should get blasted for asking??...isnt tht the whole purpose of a forum to discuss and ask question...is there such thing as a less demanding forum??? all im asking is which med schools in malaysia that are not very particular about good a level results e.g (CCC) realistically speaking about acceptance of those results, as in anyone got get in? You got C's for A-levels? Is that equivalent to C of STPM eg; 2.00 GPA? If so, you will be told by actual doctors here not to do MBBS/MD. |
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Jan 6 2013, 05:06 PM
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Junior Member
407 posts Joined: Jun 2009
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Hi.
My friend wants to know let's say he gets a LOCAL medical degree from IMU. As far as i know, IMU's local medical degree is only recognised by Malaysia and Sri Lanka government. Can he do his specialist/master in UK? Because his IMU local degree only is only recognised here and not UK. |
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Jan 6 2013, 05:51 PM
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Junior Member
168 posts Joined: Jul 2010
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QUOTE(limeuu @ Jan 6 2013, 05:18 AM) it is worrying, when students decide, even before they even graduate (and some, even before managing to enter med school) what they want to do on the basis of money.....not interest and talent.... Limeuu,Having said that, lotsa my consultants in hospital are pretty "$-minded". The first detail they look at (especially surgeons) for patient is whether or not he/she has private health insurance. If they have, they will try to drag them across to private and speed up the procedure. Why cant people ask about which specialty makes more money? lol. And also, which specialty is more employable/ more business/ more jobs around. |
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Jan 6 2013, 05:55 PM
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Senior Member
2,214 posts Joined: Feb 2009
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 6 2013, 05:06 PM) Hi. Short answer, no.My friend wants to know let's say he gets a LOCAL medical degree from IMU. As far as i know, IMU's local medical degree is only recognised by Malaysia and Sri Lanka government. Can he do his specialist/master in UK? Because his IMU local degree only is only recognised here and not UK. |
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Jan 6 2013, 07:09 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(tqeh @ Jan 6 2013, 05:51 PM) Limeuu, I'm kinda interested to know how is the 'market' like in Malaysia.Having said that, lotsa my consultants in hospital are pretty "$-minded". The first detail they look at (especially surgeons) for patient is whether or not he/she has private health insurance. If they have, they will try to drag them across to private and speed up the procedure. Why cant people ask about which specialty makes more money? lol. And also, which specialty is more employable/ more business/ more jobs around. As for specialties, In Aus, surgeons earn A LOT. Then comes GP (not all), then the physicians. But this is just too general. |
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Jan 6 2013, 07:37 PM
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Junior Member
308 posts Joined: May 2009
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QUOTE(CyberSetan @ Jan 6 2013, 04:50 PM) You got C's for A-levels? Is that equivalent to C of STPM eg; 2.00 GPA? no my question is do student with those results get accepted??if so whr??....im duin computer science...i wana noe well for the sake of knowingIf so, you will be told by actual doctors here not to do MBBS/MD. |
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Jan 6 2013, 07:58 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 07:37 PM) no my question is do student with those results get accepted??if so whr??....im duin computer science...i wana noe well for the sake of knowing Some newly opened private uni and Russia mainly. |
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Jan 6 2013, 09:10 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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You don't get 3 Bs in STPM or A levels here, no way. Even the lowest tier uni. Alternative is foundation which is a joke!
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Jan 6 2013, 10:00 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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yes, as long as you pay the fees, some med schools will accept ccc or lower....
which is why 2 years ago, mmc had to draw up guidelines on what the minimum qualifications should be.....and they placed 5b at spm in sciences/math and bbb at stpm/3.0 at matrik as minimum..... that is why many ipts now cannot fill up places, as there is a lack of people with money AND minimum qualifications...they do 'accept' weaker applicants, and tell them to 'appeal' to mmc.... what happens when someone with ccc graduates with a medical degree and wants to get registration, nobody knows as yet.... the simplest solution for the ipts med schools is to conduct their own 'foundation' and give all their students '3.0'....... Added on January 6, 2013, 10:05 pm QUOTE(Raymond7693 @ Jan 6 2013, 07:37 PM) no my question is do student with those results get accepted??if so whr??....im duin computer science...i wana noe well for the sake of knowing sake of knowing?..... really?....http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=2657368&hl= This post has been edited by limeuu: Jan 6 2013, 10:05 PM |
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Jan 6 2013, 10:51 PM
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Senior Member
4,864 posts Joined: Nov 2008
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QUOTE(cckkpr @ Jan 6 2013, 09:10 PM) You don't get 3 Bs in STPM or A levels here, no way. Even the lowest tier uni. Alternative is foundation which is a joke! yeah, that's true.why would someone who got 3Cs in STPM / A Levels want to do medicine in the first place? the grades at A Levels give somewhat quite a good barometer whether one has the capability to study medicine. even straight As students found medical school to be super duper demanding. |
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Jan 6 2013, 11:01 PM
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Senior Member
3,107 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(Stamp @ Jan 6 2013, 10:51 PM) yeah, that's true. A lot of them are ignorant and not knowing what they are venturing into. Even if they got in, they might not like the course or they might drop out after semester 1. I've even seen straight As quitting after 1 semester. But good on them as they found their real passion in life why would someone who got 3Cs in STPM / A Levels want to do medicine in the first place? the grades at A Levels give somewhat quite a good barometer whether one has the capability to study medicine. even straight As students found medical school to be super duper demanding. |
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Jan 7 2013, 03:59 PM
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Junior Member
407 posts Joined: Jun 2009
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QUOTE(podrunner @ Jan 6 2013, 05:55 PM) Short answer, no. I took this from IMU's Medical brochure."Many Malaysian doctors who attend the local course also sit the membership examinations of the UK colleges and thus end up with postgraduate qualifications from the UK as well." I am not questioning your answer, I understand that reality may sometimes be different. But why do you say NO,he can't do his specialist/master in UK? This post has been edited by Mr Kong: Jan 7 2013, 04:00 PM |
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Jan 7 2013, 04:31 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 7 2013, 03:59 PM) I took this from IMU's Medical brochure. You cannot GO to UK to do postgraduate but you can sit in Bolehland some of those UK based qualifications. I am not too sure what is the difference. It could be some external qualifications similar to Law but cannot practice in UK."Many Malaysian doctors who attend the local course also sit the membership examinations of the UK colleges and thus end up with postgraduate qualifications from the UK as well." I am not questioning your answer, I understand that reality may sometimes be different. But why do you say NO,he can't do his specialist/master in UK? |
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Jan 7 2013, 04:37 PM
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Junior Member
407 posts Joined: Jun 2009
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OK. I have another enquiry.
What about Penang Medical College's programme? Their Medical Degree is recognised by Ireland. Is it possible to do post graduate in UK? This post has been edited by Mr Kong: Jan 7 2013, 04:37 PM |
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Jan 7 2013, 05:22 PM
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Senior Member
4,514 posts Joined: Apr 2010
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 7 2013, 04:37 PM) OK. I have another enquiry. I doubt the PMC degree is recognised in Ireland. It is something like Manipal with the pre-clinical in Ireland and the the clinicals in Penang. The quality of PMC is no longer the same compared with those of 5 years ago.What about Penang Medical College's programme? Their Medical Degree is recognised by Ireland. Is it possible to do post graduate in UK? Even Numed in Johor is not recognised in UK though UK may be coming out with a new category to classify these off-shore campus. It is not likely to allow even such graduates to practice in UK unless graduating from UK including IMU-PMS students. |
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Jan 7 2013, 05:33 PM
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Junior Member
407 posts Joined: Jun 2009
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Quote from PMC's website:
"The MB BCh BAO degrees are recognised by the IMC (Irish Medical Council), MMC (Malaysian Medical Council), Sri Lankan Medical Council as well as other regulatory bodies throughout the world. The degrees allow the holder to pursue postgraduate training worldwide." But the PMC option isn't better than a local IMU degree,no? |
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Jan 7 2013, 05:41 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 6 2013, 05:06 PM) Hi. My friend wants to know let's say he gets a LOCAL medical degree from IMU. As far as i know, IMU's local medical degree is only recognised by Malaysia and Sri Lanka government. Can he do his specialist/master in UK? Because his IMU local degree only is only recognised here and not UK. QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 7 2013, 03:59 PM) I took this from IMU's Medical brochure. these are different things......and don't confuse the two....."Many Malaysian doctors who attend the local course also sit the membership examinations of the UK colleges and thus end up with postgraduate qualifications from the UK as well." I am not questioning your answer, I understand that reality may sometimes be different. But why do you say NO,he can't do his specialist/master in UK? any doctor from a listed uni (and there are several 'lists') can register and sit for the exams, once they satisfy pre-requisites..... 'doing specialisation (there is NO such thing as 'masters' as specialist qualification in uk) in uk' means WORKING there, and that is not possible, as the imu degree is not recognised there, therefore not registrable...albeit one can sit for the plab test and if passed, can register with gmc.... |
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Jan 7 2013, 05:44 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 7 2013, 04:37 PM) OK. I have another enquiry. ireland is a completely different country from the uk...What about Penang Medical College's programme? Their Medical Degree is recognised by Ireland. Is it possible to do post graduate in UK? the pmc irish degree is NOT recognised by the gmc....therefore no, cannot work in uk.... |
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Jan 7 2013, 05:47 PM
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All Stars
12,290 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Mr Kong @ Jan 7 2013, 05:33 PM) Quote from PMC's website: note that gmc is NOT mentioned...."The MB BCh BAO degrees are recognised by the IMC (Irish Medical Council), MMC (Malaysian Medical Council), Sri Lankan Medical Council as well as other regulatory bodies throughout the world. The degrees allow the holder to pursue postgraduate training worldwide." But the PMC option isn't better than a local IMU degree,no? the pmc degree has one extra country that recognises it over imu-mbbs....ie ireland.... note that it is now almost impossible for pmc graduates to get a housemanship job in ireland due shortages of places..... |
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