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English Clubs Liverpool FC- The Kop Talk 2012, Bye Dirk Kuyt!

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nando
post May 20 2012, 08:46 PM

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Admit tingly, I haven't been following Frank De Boer's managerial career at all..but been reading some good stuffs about him. Good to see him as one of the potential candidates.

This post has been edited by nando: May 20 2012, 08:46 PM
prophetjul
post May 20 2012, 08:55 PM

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QUOTE(ALeUNe @ May 20 2012, 02:57 PM)
Good managers would normally deliver good results in one season (12 months).
Good results in terms of game results, depth of squad, good football, good signings and developments.
Meaning Shanks was not a good manager or not 'normal' rolleyes.gif




hfi
post May 20 2012, 09:16 PM

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QUOTE(nando @ May 20 2012, 08:46 PM)
Admit tingly, I haven't been following Frank De Boer's managerial career at all..but been reading some good stuffs about him. Good to see him as one of the potential candidates.
*
Isn't he part of the Ajax revival project led by Cruyff ? Maybe that was someone else, but if it's him i doubt he would come. Tho we've seen far stranger turn of events.
Cloud0890
post May 20 2012, 09:38 PM

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Successful managers often have a close bond with his players. Mourinho at Chelsea and Inter, Fergie, Pep and now possibly Di Matteo. The trust between player and manager seem to somehow bring out the best from the players. That I think should be FSG's priority, Rafa has had a good relationship with most of the players that is still the core of our current team before he was sacked, this should be taken into consideration. While AVB has achieved a lot at Porto, he failed to bond with the players at Chelsea.
Petre
post May 20 2012, 09:41 PM

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QUOTE(Cloud0890 @ May 20 2012, 09:38 PM)
Successful managers often have a close bond with his players. Mourinho at Chelsea and Inter, Fergie, Pep and now possibly Di Matteo. The trust between player and manager seem to somehow bring out the best from the players. That I think should be FSG's priority, Rafa has had a good relationship with most of the players that is still the core of our current team before he was sacked, this should be taken into consideration. While AVB has achieved a lot at Porto, he failed to bond with the players at Chelsea.
*
??? are you sure?
Cloud0890
post May 20 2012, 09:44 PM

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yes many players still speak highly of Benitez...his sacking indirectly led to Masch and Torres leaving the club

they have publicly stated that even in troubled times they have utmost confidence in Rafa and stayed at the club out of loyalty for him even when we are doing very badly. When H&G sacked Rafa, both players lost confidence in the management and eventually left the club.

This post has been edited by Cloud0890: May 20 2012, 09:47 PM
hyperyouth_firepower
post May 20 2012, 09:46 PM

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QUOTE(Petre @ May 20 2012, 10:41 PM)
??? are you sure?
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our new director of communications think so. at the very least Rafa benitez has shown him.
TSsolstice818
post May 20 2012, 09:47 PM

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QUOTE(madfag @ May 20 2012, 05:59 PM)
yeah we do expect alot from Torres, but regardless, look at the Chelsea fans, we cheer him on every time he warms up, even after 1.5 years without making much of an impact. yet almost half you decides to continue to belittle him because he decided to leave.
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I have to say I m not one of those who booed him over. I still like him as a player and appreciated what he did to the club but I strongly disagree with your stand, especially the bold part. It's understandable why some of us here continue to belittle him or to certain extent hate him for what he did. You should have look from our prospective, not your own....

The case of Torres and Owen is pretty similar only that the latter left for free transfer and he made it worse when he snubbed us for Newcastle just because for more $.

Torres left us when we needed him most. I m not surprised if some of us here still hates him for that reason. I for one do not hate him for that....Players come, players go... I have seen Mascherano left, Alonso left....Torres leaving is expected. What i hope is, instead of bashing my mates, why not try to look from their prospective. It's easy to put words into other people mouth claiming them this and that. Experience what they experienced and you might just do the same. Tell me you wont feel the same if Lampard/Terry leave Chelsea for ManU or Arsenal...
ALeUNe
post May 20 2012, 09:47 PM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ May 20 2012, 08:55 PM)
Meaning Shanks was not a good manager or not 'normal'   rolleyes.gif
*
Please, Shankly was like 50-60 years ago.
Time changed. And I don't see you can implement the same in modern football.

Just like King Kenny, he had the record win % during his first term as Liverpool manager.
He was 35 years old at the time. And it's like 27 years ago.

King Kenny's 2nd return, he's already 60 years old.
I doubt you can assume he'd produce the same result.

P/S
Besides, the old football clubs were paying cheap wages. They could allow the managers to have few years of "honeymoon" or rebuilding.
It doesn't apply to modern football. Modern football clubs are paying high weekly wages. They can't allow few years of "honeymoon". They can't survive without producing results.


Added on May 20, 2012, 10:00 pm
QUOTE(solstice818 @ May 20 2012, 09:47 PM)
The case of Torres and Owen is pretty similar only that the latter left for free transfer and he made it worse when he snubbed us for Newcastle just because for more $.
*
Torres gave us a record high money.
Owen gave us a disgraced peanut. Owen is homegrown, and it's double disgrace.

This post has been edited by ALeUNe: May 20 2012, 10:00 PM
Cloud0890
post May 20 2012, 10:19 PM

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QUOTE
Fernando Torres said he expected to be selected in the starting XI for Chelsea's Champions League final against Bayern Munich, and revealed that he urged his team-mates to ditch their defensive tactics in Saturday's famous victory.

Torres had to watch from the bench for 84 minutes as Chelsea were dominated by Bayern at the Allianz Arena. Thomas Muller's late opener proved the cue for the Spaniard's introduction, and Torres said it was a shock not to be picked by Roberto Di Matteo.

"I was expecting to start,'' he said. "It was a big surprise for me, a big disappointment. But, in the final, the main thing is to win - it doesn't matter who plays.''

Torres' introduction alongside Didier Drogba helped drag Chelsea back into the match, with the former winning a corner from which the latter netted the Blues' equaliser. The game was eventually won on penalties.

After 120 minutes of football, Bayern had registered a staggering 43 shots compared to Chelsea's nine as the English side relied on backs-to-the-wall rearguard action. Torres felt the Blues were giving up too much ground, something he tried to change when he was finally introduced into the action.

"We needed to attack,'' Torres said. "We were playing like we had the handbrake on, looking like we couldn't attack, but I think we could, and in extra-time we showed we could play counter-attack as well.''

Torres and Di Matteo appeared to exchange words as the Chelsea boss attempted to select his penalty takers, with the costly striker not appearing among the Blues' five takers. Torres, though, still revelled in the joy of victory and dedicated the win to the club's fans.

"We had good luck at the right time but I think we're the right team to win this Champions League,'' Torres said. "It's for these guys [the fans]. They have been supporting us all season, a very difficult season when no-one believed in us, a lot of ups and downs. At the end, they are the ones who deserve it.''


Hmm? Di Matteo had no confidence in Torres to take a penalty?
Adryan
post May 20 2012, 10:21 PM

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QUOTE(solstice818 @ May 20 2012, 09:47 PM)
I have to say I m not one of those who booed him over. I still like him as a player and appreciated what he did to the club but I strongly disagree with your stand, especially the bold part. It's understandable why some of us here continue to belittle him or to certain extent hate him for what he did. You should have look from our prospective, not your own....

The case of Torres and Owen is pretty similar only that the latter left for free transfer and he made it worse when he snubbed us for Newcastle just because for more $.

Torres left us when we needed him most. I m not surprised if some of us here still hates him for that reason. I for one do not hate him for that....Players come, players go... I have seen Mascherano left, Alonso left....Torres leaving is expected. What i hope is, instead of bashing my mates, why not try to look from their prospective. It's easy to put words into other people mouth claiming them this and that. Experience what they experienced and you might just do the same. Tell me you wont feel the same if Lampard/Terry leave Chelsea for ManU or Arsenal...
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It's not that ... we are not bitter over him leaving at all. I'm not. Players come and go and we all accept that.

The things I couldn't take was .. how he backstabbed the club shortly after joining Chelsea and the lack of effort in his last 6 months. Alonso and Mascherano thought about leaving but they still put 110% in their last season.

That's why fans appreciate them still because they played for the club at the end of the day.

Torres didn't chase, he didn't run, lack of commitment, lack of attitude and it was so obvious he didn't want to play for Liverpool anymore but yet we came up with excuses that he just came back from injury, lack of match fitness, etc.

In his last 6 months, yes, Torres scored goals but it wasn't the same Torres the season before. That could be due to Hodgson's play as well but the least he could was to give FSG and Kenny chance. Funnily enough, he only played well against Chelsea and in the January transfer window.

I don't know if Chelsea was definitely his choice but all I assume is he just wanted to leave and only Chelsea wanted his signature at that time but it looks as though his choice wasn't Chelsea. He hardly looks happy there.

QUOTE(Cloud0890 @ May 20 2012, 10:19 PM)
Hmm? Di Matteo had no confidence in Torres to take a penalty?
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Says it all when he didn't even start both finals. And yeah, also says it all that he wasn't given a spot kick.

At least when Suarez wasn't given in the final.. it was because he missed all his kicks this season!!

This post has been edited by Adryan: May 20 2012, 10:22 PM
ALeUNe
post May 20 2012, 10:42 PM

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QUOTE(Adryan @ May 20 2012, 10:21 PM)
The things I couldn't take was .. how he backstabbed the club shortly after joining Chelsea and the lack of effort in his last 6 months. Alonso and Mascherano thought about leaving but they still put 110% in their last season.
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Both Torres and Gerrard lost their form before Rafa left.
They have not recovered until today.

Torres was running like headless chicken for 6 months under Uncle Roy.
led_zep_freak
post May 20 2012, 10:56 PM

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QUOTE(Cloud0890 @ May 20 2012, 10:19 PM)
Hmm? Di Matteo had no confidence in Torres to take a penalty?
*
As I recall, he wasn't a good penalty taker even at Liverpool. biggrin.gif
rushmode
post May 20 2012, 11:05 PM

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torres penalty record not really good so its understandable di matteo not taking chances giving torres a spot. give the lad a break already.
never_walk_alone
post May 20 2012, 11:16 PM

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Torres was gone.. am looking forward to the new manager wit d new style we play...

especially as we r really need a creative midfield tongue.gif
koolspyda
post May 20 2012, 11:16 PM

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QUOTE(ALeUNe @ May 20 2012, 11:42 PM)
Both Torres and Gerrard lost their form before Rafa left.
They have not recovered until today.

Torres was running like headless chicken for 6 months under Uncle Roy.
*
because we never had a plan under roy. you see all he did was "aggur, carrager, when the balll commes into defunce, kick it high up the paurk for torre to chase, he will score gurls from there" tongue.gif


oh my god, he's englund manager now doh.gif ok jokes aside. hmm, uncle roy biggrin.gif



i don't know how fans still buy into media spun cold relationship between gerrard, carra & bentitez.

If reading into some excerpts of gerrard autobiography, there are lots of things we don't get to see, the lighter moments of him & rafa. no rift, no misunderstanding etc.

Maybe to some forumer excuse, who will comment gerrard is just being diplomatic of rafa. it's his autobiography, juicy tit bits sells. sadly there is no sensationalise bits unlike how media spins the cold row between these 2. rclxub.gif rclxub.gif


and you have fans/forumers repeatedly calling on rafa poor man management. hmm.gif

This post has been edited by koolspyda: May 20 2012, 11:18 PM
rushmode
post May 20 2012, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(koolspyda @ May 20 2012, 11:16 PM)
because we never had a plan under roy. you see all he did was "aggur, carrager, when the balll commes into defunce, kick it high up the paurk for torre to chase, he will score gurls from there"  tongue.gif
oh my god, he's englund manager now doh.gif
i don't know how fans still buy into media spun cold relationship between gerrard, carra & bentitez.

If reading into some excerpts of gerrard autobiography, there are lots of things we don't get to see, the lighter moments of him & rafa. no rift, no misunderstanding etc.

Maybe to some forumer excuse, who will comment gerrard is just being diplomatic of rafa. it's his autobiography, juicy tit bits sells. sadly there is no sensationalise bits unlike how media spins the cold row between these 2.  rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif
and you have fans/forumers repeatedly calling on rafa poor man management.  hmm.gif
*
gerrard (and to some extent carra) did not actually help either by staying silent when rafa's attacked by everyone from all corner (media, owner, ex-players). if your captain and vice captain publicly backed you up, it would have take some burden of the manager. just saying..

its water under the bridge now though..
Rotuham
post May 20 2012, 11:38 PM

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Congrats to torres.He made the right decision to leave us.Just not the manner in which he left.

Anyway good news for those who don't think rafa is the right man(including me tongue.gif ).

http://www.sportsvibe.co.uk/news/football/...next-week-16583
maranello55
post May 20 2012, 11:41 PM

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CARRA SPEAKS OUT: REMEMBER WHERE WE WERE WHEN KENNY TOOK OVER

http://live4liverpool.com/2012/04/lfc-news...kenny-took-over

QUOTE
LIVERPOOL legend Jamie Carragher has spoken out about the club’s first full season under Kenny Dalglish.
In an interview printed in The Sunday Telegraph, the Anfield hero addressed a number of issues and urged critics of Dalglish to “remember where we were when Kenny took over”.
“The club were on their knees. We’d gone through a difficult period and found ourselves in a poor position in the league.”

“Kenny took over and it wasn’t just that he gave everyone a lift in terms of his presence around the club, but most importantly with performances and results.”

On the subject of the Reds poor league form this year, he admits the disappointment in the camp with the recent run of results, but recognises that the current side is a work in progress , and insists that Kenny Dalglish is the only man to lead the Merseyside club to future success.

“We all recognise we’ve come up short in the league compared to where we’d like to be – because we wanted to be closer to the top four…..(but)We were just starting the process again so you can’t just expect it happen immediately.”
Nearing his 700th appearance in a Reds shirt the centre-back is never one to shirk responsibility, and he feels that Liverpool’s senior players ought to take their share of the blame for this seasons shortcomings too, rather than letting the new signings take the blame.

“As a group of players, we need to improve and it’s not fair just talking about the new ones. It’s not easy learning what it means to play for Liverpool. There’s far more additional expectation and pressure here.”

Although he did admit that some new signings would be necessary in the summer, Carra thinks that this season’s new boys will be all the stronger for having a full campaign at the club under their belts.

“Maybe we need a couple of new players next season to push us on, and we hope the players we bought this season will then go on to another level after a year’s experience playing for the club.”

When asked about the Dalglish’s future as manager, Carragher answered unequivocally:
“He’s the one here who knows what it means to win a league title and what we’ve got to do going forward…There isn’t anyone else here with experience of winning a league title. It’s ridiculous anyone would dismiss his experience and achievements in the game when he’s started getting Liverpool winning trophies again already.”

nando
post May 21 2012, 12:02 AM

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i think Gerrard/Carragher were all caught in midst of the political wars during the last years of Rafa...
there were basically 3 camps.... Gillette vs Hicks and somewhere, Rafa was also fighting them (moneys to sign players).
So the whole Liverpool board and management were involved in this war....

Gerrard and Carragher later revealed that they just wanted to stay neutral and concentrate of football (which was very hard). They were afraid that any show of support to any party (even Rafa) will be used against them



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