One question for 3M AP902 + prefilter users, how much impact does it have on the water pressure? I'm asking because my area has relatively low water pressure. I suppose, it would be more impact than a sand filter.
Really... My fish somehow manage to survive in RO for say more than 4 years now... hmmm.... sure or not..... as I remember all Sea Aquarium need RO filtration so your statement very fishy!!! really... I have 2 Aquarium 1 on shrimp (Japanese Shrimp) very delicate fresh water shrimp and it survive using RO and another one mainly for my Normal 4 ft tank also on RO water...
RO offer the purest water minus the negativity of boiling water cause boiling water reduce oxygen inside water... also RO is not the same as distilled water cause distilled water is DEAD water... wile RO water is pure water without mineral but high oxygen... Don't say Fish cant survive in RO water cause in Aquarist RO is the best water for fish...
opps I was referring to Fresh water fish eg Gold fish and the filtration.Because Fresh water fish need a balance nutrient in the water hence too clean water they will get sick.
opps I was referring to Fresh water fish eg Gold fish and the filtration.Because Fresh water fish need a balance nutrient in the water hence too clean water they will get sick.
You are refering to the old skool RO filtration... the newer filtration that I have already solve the fundamental nutrient thing... the new R.O has post filter which is mineral stone and nutrient cartridge and this is where clean (un polluted) nutrient is added back to R.O. pure water... thats why my fresh water fish tank (the 4ft ones) can survive under it... also fish need clean water (un polluted water) as it is their life under clean stream... no one want to stay in heavy polluted industrial zone Air... even human prefer clean un-polluted air... same with fish they are less stress...
back to RO... I will recommend to get the one with Post filter cartridge which put back all the mineral and nutrient that been filted away by R-O system... it works and it clean...
Yes 2 to 2.5bar pressure is just nice but after going through membrane filter it will drop approximately 1 bar. As mentioned, i do my own research and share it online. Have a look at this
This show that the membrane is being clog >50% looking at the water so Dark. Hence filtered water out from kitchen tap In the end become <1 bar. The piping in the video very straight forward what I mean it only meant flushing. membrane have to perform Flushing twice a day and Backwashing 2 week once. If Water cut then when water start supplying nextday perform Backwashing and flushing. Generally POU can't withstand more than >2.5 bar those joint will start to leak and the fact is The more Slower water passes thru The POU Catridges the More reducing Chlorine % can be achieved Hence 1~1.5 bar is just good enough. If don't believe try to connect the main Pipe to POU 6 catridged and use filtered water to cook rice. Another One reduce the pressure to <1.5 bar and connect to POU 6 catridges and use filtered water cook rice. In the end compare the freshness cooked rice once cool put in the fridge and cover it. You will find the one that connect with Main piping to POU 6 catridges <1.5 bar is for more superior in keeping the freshness of the Cooked rice after several day. I use Membrane system for 2.8 yrs and POU a basic 6 filter catridges and I do analysis cooked rice can withstand the freshness up to >1 week.
Let me try answer the question you raised o. The ro (I choose to answer later because I want to see how the water expert answer )
My humble 2 cents.
RO water is good for aquarium, salt or fresh. Only when changing partial water because is stable, and mineral will not be gone because there still 2/3 or old water and the bio balls.
I use Amway filter water for my shrimps, planted, and guppy tanks.heat and Lighting is also challenge.
QUOTE(calvin_ng @ Oct 31 2013, 09:23 AM)
You are refering to the old skool RO filtration... the newer filtration that I have already solve the fundamental nutrient thing... the new R.O has post filter which is mineral stone and nutrient cartridge and this is where clean (un polluted) nutrient is added back to R.O. pure water... thats why my fresh water fish tank (the 4ft ones) can survive under it... also fish need clean water (un polluted water) as it is their life under clean stream... no one want to stay in heavy polluted industrial zone Air... even human prefer clean un-polluted air... same with fish they are less stress...
back to RO... I will recommend to get the one with Post filter cartridge which put back all the mineral and nutrient that been filted away by R-O system... it works and it clean...
ok this is all getting too confusing when technical spec comes in.
sifus out there, mind to give idea what should i use ?
- pressure bar 2.x - no tangki (townhouse) - pre-existing piping >10 yrs - piping inside the house, all changed as the original piping cannot be changed - space to put outdoor unit very limited, cannot be those big big type, most likely to be hanged at the wall - don't mind doing backwash - no fish, no prawn, only human usage for cooking and shower and water the garden
Let me try answer the question you raised o. The ro (I choose to answer later because I want to see how the water expert answer )
My humble 2 cents.
RO water is good for aquarium, salt or fresh. Only when changing partial water because is stable, and mineral will not be gone because there still 2/3 or old water and the bio balls.
I use Amway filter water for my shrimps, planted, and guppy tanks.heat and Lighting is also challenge.
Yes I agree with your statement "RO water is good for aquarium, salt or fresh. Only when changing partial water because is stable, and mineral will not be gone because there still 2/3 or old water and the bio balls " and also "I will recommend to get the one with Post filter cartridge which put back all the mineral and nutrient that been filted away by R-O system"
As for Amway filter for your shrimp is okie as Amway system equip with UV to kill parasite/Virus in filtered water and won't attacking your shrimp. Anyway Amway did not stated How many Micron it can filter but to my guessing is about 1 micron. Well a system can cost few cent to few Hundreds thousand ringgit. Every system have Pros and cons. When talk about a water filter maintenance is a must. No Point to get a very good system in the end not proper maintenance carried out. That is why I always believe if majority sediment, rust. Virus can be removed at POE hence POU only need to take care GAC/Carbon block to reduce chlorine +Mineral/Alkaline. The ceramic filter (POU) 1 micron will indicate how effective your POE is.
One question for 3M AP902 + prefilter users, how much impact does it have on the water pressure? I'm asking because my area has relatively low water pressure. I suppose, it would be more impact than a sand filter.
Pls complaint to Syabas if your housing Less than 2 bar because your water pressure cannot/Slow fill the tanngki in your Double storey hse unless your developer know the pressure hence your hse should equip with 400gal tangki. If water too murky/Dirty No stand alone system can solve this problem. You will need to buy chemical to input to the raw murky/dirty water. The clean water then can goes to sand filter and joint up 3M or membrane or directly to POU. I have been doing alot underground water Project for multi national company as water is essential for site especially Construction.Quary,and so on. Domestic syabas water are treated and Underground are not treated at all Hence if Domestic water cut Pls shut off the main tap at meter area
Pls complaint to Syabas if your housing Less than 2 bar because your water pressure cannot/Slow fill the tanngki in your Double storey hse unless your developer know the pressure hence your hse should equip with 400gal tangki. If water too murky/Dirty No stand alone system can solve this problem. You will need to buy chemical to input to the raw murky/dirty water. The clean water then can goes to sand filter and joint up 3M or membrane or directly to POU. I have been doing alot underground water Project for multi national company as water is essential for site especially Construction.Quary,and so on. Domestic syabas water are treated and Underground are not treated at all Hence if Domestic water cut Pls shut off the main tap at meter area
It's only 25psi, about 1.7 bars. Complained before, they said it's old housing area, so if the pressure is too high, old pipes will start to leak
It's only 25psi, about 1.7 bars. Complained before, they said it's old housing area, so if the pressure is too high, old pipes will start to leak
Since it is only 1.7bar hence I propose you use sand filter and follow by PP Filter. By the way most probably your hse Piping is GI hence Due to corrosion the water volume and pressure is being reduce <3bar---> 1.7bar. You need to relay new Piping in order to enjoy filtered water. I can calculate the composition media volume and specification to fit your house Syabas incoming 1.7 bar as we always implement for Underground water projects also.
Since it is only 1.7bar hence I propose you use sand filter and follow by PP Filter. By the way most probably your hse Piping is GI hence Due to corrosion the water volume and pressure is being reduce <3bar---> 1.7bar. You need to relay new Piping in order to enjoy filtered water. I can calculate the composition media volume and specification to fit your house Syabas incoming 1.7 bar as we always implement for Underground water projects also.
Er.. my pipings are brand new. It's 1.7 bar at entry point. I am using sand filter now, it just does not filter as clean as membrane.
Er.. my pipings are brand new. It's 1.7 bar at entry point. I am using sand filter now, it just does not filter as clean as membrane.
How long have you use the sand filter and under what brand ? Generally Sand filter need to change sand every 3 yrs to maintain the quality filtered water. Sand filter Can filter up to 5 Micron and Ultrafiltration can filter up to 0.01micron. Generally Ultrafiltration filtered water able Protect your Washing Machine, Water heater, WC and Many More. As for Sand filter yes not as clean as Ultrafiltration but better than no filter at all. You can see POU ceramic catridges get slightly dirty after 1~2 month compare ultrafiltration POU ceramic catridges nominal dirty after >3yrs .
This post has been edited by Solar freak: Oct 31 2013, 07:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
From: Builders Hardware Enterprise 0362572412
QUOTE(Solar freak @ Oct 31 2013, 09:45 AM)
This show that the membrane is being clog >50% looking at the water so Dark.
FYI, that water is tap water mix with a little INK, so it is impossible for it to clog the filter 50%. This demo shows how good the UF filtration but at the expense of reducing water pressure. How often we get water as dirty as this?
Now from your explanation, seems like UF is more troublesome, nd flushing twice a day, nd backwash and after sometimes nd to change the membrane.
This post has been edited by zheilwane: Nov 1 2013, 01:05 AM
How long have you use the sand filter and under what brand ? Generally Sand filter need to change sand every 3 yrs to maintain the quality filtered water. Sand filter Can filter up to 5 Micron and Ultrafiltration can filter up to 0.01micron. Generally Ultrafiltration filtered water able Protect your Washing Machine, Water heater, WC and Many More. As for Sand filter yes not as clean as Ultrafiltration but better than no filter at all. You can see POU ceramic catridges get slightly dirty after 1~2 month compare ultrafiltration POU ceramic catridges nominal dirty after >3yrs .
My sand filter is GE, about 3+ years now. Since my POE water pressure is so low, I guess I cannot use membrane. Does 3M POE filter drop as much pressure as typical membrane?
FYI, that water is tap water mix with a little INK, so it is impossible for it to clog the filter 50%. This demo shows how good the UF filtration but at the expense of reducing water pressure. How often we get water as dirty as this?
Now from your explanation, seems like UF is more troublesome, nd flushing twice a day, nd backwash and after sometimes nd to change the membrane.
When talk about water filter we always stress on Maintenance. The reason why UF need to flush twice a day and backwash once every 2 week is to not let the UF clogged. Flushing twice a day (1 minute/once) and backwash Once every 2 week (I minute/Once) would not cost you <rm1/mth. 3M,Diamond and PP filter are on the same platform means the media used cannot backwash. In order to clean the media need to take out and use High pressure/Chemical to wash and pose a health issue when chemical been used in some cases. Since these brand/ system Can filter up to 5 micron and compare to UF 0.01 Micron hence Water pressure/Volume definitely lower at POU <1.5bar. As mentioned before the lower Pressure <1.5bar at POU hence the POU filter effectiveness in reducing chlorine. As for sand filter system can perform Backwash and Flushing and same spec can filter up to 5 micron. Pls be reminded all new house nowadays tap used are on half turn system are very prone to Leak if water not clean <1 micron. The repair Of Taps/Fixture, water Pump/ Washing machine/Water heater etc will more expensive affair and also the yearly POE Filter Maintenance is higher compare to UF.
Joined: Jan 2008
From: Builders Hardware Enterprise 0362572412
i think u didnt get the point here. There are people out there who wants super clean water so get UF while there are some who just wants clean water, higher flow rate and lesser maintenance, hence 3M is the choice. As mentioned many times, each filters have their pros and cons, each customers have different needs. Just share the info online and let the customers decide what is best for them.
1) Flushing twice a day (1 minute/once) and backwash Once every 2 week (I minute/Once), Replacement of membrane every 3 years = TROUBLESOME and High Maintenance, wouldnt this b a BIG HEADACHE for busy people like us?
2) UF 0.01 Micron hence Water pressure/Volume definitely lower at POU <1.5bar = REDUCTION IN WATER PRESSURE
3) The reason why UF need to flush twice a day and backwash once every 2 week is to not let the UF clogged = EASILY Gets CLOGGED
FYI, we can add an angle valve to reduce the flow if you wan to talk about increasing the effectiveness of POU in reducing chlorine. Why do we need to get UF to purposely to lower down the pressure just to increase the effectiveness of POU, while a single and cheap angle valve can do the same job?
Hi all, just found out about this very informative thread. My neighborhood in kampung / village area get their water supply directly from pipes connected to the river up on the hills. i was wondering if there is any proper water filtration setup or product that is suitable for this. Any advice is very much appreciated. Thanks in advance guys.
If you plan to use commercially available water filtration system, make sure the incoming water pressure is high enough to pass through the filtration medium. Refer to product specifications/datasheet for the information.
Anyhow, I recommended you to further investigate the ceramic pot water filter. For rural area of underdeveloped countries, they use ceramic pot (sponsored by NGO/charity organization) as filtration medium to obtain drinking water. The ceramic pot impregnated with silver. This eliminated the need of UV light disinfection (popular method of disinfection for commercial unit).
QUOTE
What is A Ceramic Filter and How it Works
The ceramic water filter is made of porous clay and has a coating of colloidal silver solution. Ceramic water filters strain the dirt and bacteria out of the water as it passes through the pores of the ceramic filter pot and kill bacteria as it comes into contact with the colloidal silver.
In creating ceramic water filters, ground rice husks (or other organic material) are added to the clay mixture. The rice husks burn out in the high temperatures of the kiln, creating thin clay walls with cavities in between. These thinner clay walls increase the speed that the water moves through the filter, while still requiring water to pass between clay particles and therefore still removing dirt and pathogens.
Silver also kills bacteria. It is used on airplanes, by NASA in space, and in hospitals as a disinfectant. The silver solution in ceramic water filters is very important in killing bacteria. Laterite, also added to the clay has a high amount of iron oxide in it. The iron has a positive charge when in the filter and seems to hold onto viruses which have a negative charge (like a magnet that holds onto metal). This can help remove viruses from the water. Be aware ceramic filters do not eliminate chemical contaminants that could be in some source water.
The ceramic filter pot is set in a plastic receptacle tank with a plastic lid and a spigot (or tap). The ceramic filter pot is manually filled with 10 liters of source water. The water is purified as it seeps through the ceramic filter pot at a rate of approximately 2 liters per hour. The plastic receptacle combined with ceramic filter pot can store up to 35 L of water. [Read more]
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This post has been edited by Bubble Ring: Nov 2 2013, 08:35 PM
Yesterday had some time so Change both the Indoor and outdoor 3M filter. Both the filters already 23months old.
Make sure the incoming water supply are close.
The Outdoor are straightforward, just push the level and turn. Picture below show the size, and the small footprint for my outdoor filter. On the floor is the old filter, still looking good from the exterior.
The Indoor is tricky because water will flow out when you take it out, and don't want to wet the cabinet. A small rectangle bucket, and some cloth/fabric will do the trick. Best lift out the filter, let the it sleep, unlock and turn the filter.
The new filters come with NSF certification, and what it can filters/tested with.