Music lovers will spent as much as they can to get the best instrument.

Take note that there is a lot of guitar and bass tuners are selling in the market, there is very less electronic violin tuners. The conductor (concertmaster in your view) will lead us all musician to tune but we must also learn how to tune it at first too. In orchestra, no electronic tuners are allowed for you all information. If you see some, you know what I mean.

It is not the bridge, it is the finger board. So yes, you should stick that on it. Most beginners do that unless you want to learn the hard way.

yeah, for beginner you can use electronic tuner first. then if you've fimilar with tuning the violin you can start to learn how to tune with tuning fork, or best learn how to tune with piano or follow your teacher's tuning (say like in string quartet there's no piano).

orchestra tuning goes like this:
oboe as the tuning reference -> concertmaster (first chair of first violin) follow oboe -> brass follow CM -> lower strings follow CM -> upper strings follow CM

of course different orchestra might have different tuning method but that's generally how it works.

no objections, but...

italians are overpriced and overrated, means it's a waste of money to buy italians nowadays (especially brand new instruments).

italians are certainly not bad, but to get the same quality without italian names one can save a HELL lot of money (usually, less than half of the price). generally "real" italians are going at least RM40k~RM50k at the very least. RM10k'ish italians are mostly done by apprantises (and some not even under supervision of the master), and for that price, mostly it's made from white instruments (pre-made pre-assembled violins with no varnish, ready for fine carving/varnishing) came from china.

not to mention, because everyone is looking for italians, fake italian labels and idiot sellers/scammers are everywhere in the world. unless you've seen the real deal, and have the skill to determine if it's a good instrument.

i wouldn't recommend italians at this range, they're more or less money investments where the italians will only increase of its value and almost never drop. unless you have the few hundred thousands or even millions to buy old master instruments - they're the best in the world.

PS: oh and by the way, give any MPO players to play your cheapo instruments, they'll make it sounds like expensive instruments...

I actually got mine for AUD20k (RM60k) when I visit Italy last two years ago. I met the luthier and bring back a few of them for sell.

But I have never heard of fake Italian hand made before, this sounds really really crap.

I do not know much about middle-range instruments, what about you recommend us?

wow RM60k...some more can bring back a few of them...man you're rich lol!

nevermind with the fake italians, buying directly from reputable dealers or luthier is the best but expecting to pay for similar price you paid. anything lower than RM30k just have to be careful especially those RM10k'ish ones. I've seen some RM20k italians those are made by apprantises and final touch up by master luthier - as told by the luthier to the dealer and to me.

of course if talking about middle range instruments below RM20k there're a lot of choices where one can't determine which country make the best instrument. players have to seek for the right instruments pretty hard as the quality vary quite a lot.

i just share some of my experiences. i've met some MPO violinist, one of them have RM15k'ish unknown violin and sounds really good. one of my friend also has an old french violin a few decades old, around RM22k sounds great. i've heard some lower range german violins (below RM10k) which usually doesn't sound good. i also met one very very good violinist, he bought a RM4k german violin from Chamber music and it turned out it should have cost RM10k and above - and he produce a very good sound out of it.

by the way the initial question was asking for a step up from Euro String violas. for violas, i've heard a china viola cost around RM4k'ish sounds very good - probably because of the player though.

i'd say play as much instruments as you can before giving out the money to the cashier - be it from shops or from other players. then you'll know which price range you'll appreciate.

but still, i'd recommend anything else than italian if one can pay RM60k for an instrument. don't get me wrong, italians are generally very good and they also serve as a very good investment as well, but if one going to save money, there're a lot of great makers around the world worth a look. i'm surprised that many award winning violin makers are american. they won competition participated by makers around the world, some even won competition held in italy.

This post has been edited by little ice: May 26 2008, 02:03 PM

I was there with my teacher, also my teacher actually brings them back here to sell. Not me, I am just helping out. So, no I am not rich at all.

I should pay to visit to Chambers music. Where is it by the way?

ah ok...

it's at the 3rd floor in Sungai Wang. they're selling some instruments there including italians, last time I check they also carry some italians going for RM40k~RM60k, along with some other used violins for sale - some of them are actually consignments.

Ahh..great. Hopefully there is cellos.

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Other than that, I am seeking for a middle-range electric violin. Playing the same genre all the time are sick sometimes. One of my favourite band, Yellowcard features a violinist playing along with a rock band.



I have been playing their music since 5 years ago on acoustic. Should get my hands on an electric violin.

Anyone thinking of playing rock music with violin?

i think they also carry some cellos but i really doubt they carry good ones though (very rarely local dealers carry high range cellos).

anyway you can pay a visit just to look at what they're selling.

that's a Zeta violin, and here's the model:
http://www.zetamusic.com/products/display.asp?id=52

and check out ian cooper, australian violinist also play all kinds of music (he IS very good).

http://www.iancooper.com

just to inspire you, this is actually done on electric violin but not guitar.
http://www.iancooper.com/sounds/IanCooperNo.mp3

is there any tips of playing slur? i cant play slur. i always lost tempo or the sound change every time i do slur. perhaps i suddenly bcome stiff/nervous when want to do slur?

Thanks, I'll prolly just replace the bridge for now, but its quite expensive to ask other to carve the bridge >< anyway i'll try to uh go for the audition then T.T try... I'm not a pro though, and no grade basically xD just started 1.5 years ago =D found that I like viola, its very unique n i love the sound. =)

Ah~ well, dunno much of china violin, but I heard that the sound quality aint tat good? don know much of italy violins but i know they are super expensive XD German ones aint bad though. hmm... I'm looking for a rm1k ++ step up, I prefer mild sound rather than a sharp and loud type. =/ hmm~ no idea =D

Haha, go to the store and buy one. Since you have been playing for so long, why not go for an exam as well?

I think my shop have a few RM1k-RM2k violas, come by if you want..

i use my piano n ear for other times.

Wat i meant was we are on9, so got pc, and can give him a free software ma.

i like using the digital tuner and play infront of it, so i can see whether how "IN-TUNE" i play.

So more laptop detectt sound faster than an electronic device, so faster response

Ahh..I was there yesterday, they only have like 10 cellos. Not really a big string instrument shop.

Yes, I know that is a Zeta but Zeta is a high-end brand. At least RM10k for one. Acoustic violin is fine but for not electric, I have to manage my spending already, moreover I need an amplifier for it.

Ian Cooper, haha. Suprisingly, I met him before. Electric violins can really do a lot of sounds that is near to guitar and Ian Cooper does it. I remember to went to his concert two times, he loves Jazz but not for me but still entertains me.

Slurs, just keep the bow moving and put the other finger over it. Well, it is easy if you play slurs one by one and slowly and then pick it up fast. Playing scales with slurs will help you.

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Added on May 27, 2008, 11:07 pmJust a little question. The electronic device tuner you mean is the guitar ones? Or the violin ones with E A D G on it?

And...have you try using tuning fork before?

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Added on May 27, 2008, 11:09 pmlittle ice, are you a music teacher?

I have just came back from a Guild Australia examination board meeting. If you are a music teacher, I have something for you.

This post has been edited by Cello: May 27 2008, 11:09 PM

yeah it's a small shop, at least they carry a bit of nice violins there. have you tried them? last time i tried an italian by marcello villa, smallish violin yet produce nice and big volume. but the price is also RM60k...er no thanks, absolutely beyond my reach...i still have a lot of gears to invest...

budget wise you can always try yamaha electric violin. i don't like them though, they're around RM4k i think. you can also try the piezo pickup route, around RM1000 for the pickup (fishman is very good and no modification needed on your violin) + fishman preamp for piezo pickups. although not quite the sound of solid body electric violin but at least you have a clean sound to start with. you can directly jack up to the PA system directly since there's already a preamp, so you save a lot of money unless there's no PA system.

fyi, electric violins also use piezo pickup. it's just the design that's different (like Zeta Jazz series pickup there's 2 pickup for each strings, total of 8 pickups).

as for amps, there'll be endless purchase man. AER is really good for acoustic piezo pickup sound (not sure if solid body electric violin works). for others, well you're better off with multi-fx pedal or software ampsims.

he's brilliant. seldom i heard electric violinist can do such a guitar lead sound on violin. when i first heard the soundclip i thought it was electric guitar for a looooong time and i never believe it's a violin, until i got myself a good soundcard and speaker (for music production purpose), definitely it's a violin.

i used to teach a bit but no longer teaching now. i do play violin as my 2nd instrument (not profesionally though), my primary job is music production thing.

thanks anyway!

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Added on May 28, 2008, 1:57 amlooking at computer screen and let computer to tell you if you're out of tune isn't a very good idea and same goes to tuners, imho. it'll distract your brain cause you're trying to hear and see at the same time. actually it's best to shoot a video of your performance, THEN you'll learn from there (heifetz is one of the first person who make use of audio and video recording, as told by my teacher). what seems to be in tune of when you heard under your ears sounds very different when you hear the playback of the video.

actually, i prefer violinist play slightly out of tune on some notes, it actually give the music some "colour" and personal character of the violinist him/her self. of course, not out of tune all the way la...

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Added on May 28, 2008, 2:14 amBTW Cello, mind telling which italian maker made your (i assumed) violin? i've play one made by marcello villa (he's pretty famous), priced at RM60k at chamber music but it was quite some time ago. it's actually quite nice and feel quite different from other violins, smallish, yet big dynamics (very rare you can actually PRESS the strings, which will give you all back, press more, sound bigger).

however i don't quite trust the sound under ear. playing a violin in a big hall WITH other instruments (accompaniment such as piano/small ensemble) and it still stand out, then it really has a very good projection. ease of control/dynamic range/tone is also important though, but it's hard to find one that actually project.

This post has been edited by little ice: May 28 2008, 02:14 AM

some useful info sites on strings and brands...
http://www.stringsmagazine.com/issues/Stri...overstory.shtml
http://www.violinist.com/wiki/violin-strings/

and thanks cello for fixing my string

i use it to tune for both my guitar and violin. it detects any sound, u just set the frequency etc etc.

tuning fork? i think few years ago i use it.

usually piano, piano easier

anyone has any useful tips on playing staccato? Esp jumping from strings to strings >< I seriously need to work on my techniques. I'm quite ok in reading notes.

i have no prob do string skipping. but i have prob do slur. lol. i wonder why

I've got a whole section on staccato in passacaglia that I can barely play well. To do staccato which part of the bow should i use? End of bow or starting of bow? or mid of bow? ><

onelove - not sure if you're talking about staccato or spiccato. staccato is played with a short stroke of the bow, fast and short, without lifting off your bow. if playing spiccato, you should use lower bow, much easier to control.