Thanks hafizmamak85 for the reply, here are some additional coverage details of the plans (top: SMX, bottom: ILHP).

Both policies have never made any claims before.

SMX had an upgrade in 2022 for Covid case.

ILHP has been maintaining RM2400 annual premium since 2007, and increase to RM2780 in 2023.

1. ILHP is a much older plan, it stands to reason that the insurance pool is very substandard already. Hence the quantum of repricing will be higher, all else being equal.

SMX is much newer, launched in around 2016.The insurance pool is likely not as bad.

2. We also don't know the history of premium adjustments. Was ILHP repriced before, but you DID NOT accept the revised premiums? Likewise, was SMX repriced previously, and you did accept the premium increment?

3. ILHP being attached to an older base plan, may have had different sustainability requirements back then. With SPE2, the requirements got stricter. They are even more strict now. Hence, you may have bought the older base plan under very aggressive assumptions (in terms of investment returns, future medical inflation etc) compared to the newer SPE2/SPE3 plans.

4. It's highly likely you already received annual sustainability notices to increase the ILHP base plan premiums, which you've conveniently ignored. The ILHP base plan is on sustainable to age 66 as opposed to the SPE2 plan which is sustainable until age 73.

EDIT: For both plans, switch to the new SHP. Pronto!

This post has been edited by contestchris: Mar 27 2025, 10:06 PM

This is what I've gathered from your screenshot

Policy 1: 50k death benefit, 50k critical illness & early payout critical illness benefits, hospitalisation GL/reimbursement (SMX & extension of coverage until age 99), hospitalisation benefits, waiver of premium (disability & critical illness)

RM 337.5 per month (current premium)
RM 357.5 per month (post SHP upgrade)

Increment: RM 20 per month

Policy 2: 100k death benefit, waiver of premium for death & TPD, 50k critical illness benefits, hospitalisation GL/reimbursement (ILHP), 50k accidental benefits

RM 232 per month (current premium)
RM 535 per month (post SHP upgrade)

Increment: RM 303 per month

It is really baffling to me that Policy 2 is being asked to pay an extra RM 180 per month or almost RM 2.2k per annum compared to Policy 1 for essentially an extra RM 50k in death & accidental benefits.

What am I missing? It's ridiculous to pay an additional RM 2.2k per annum for an extra 50k in death & accidental benefits.

Something is off. Please check with Great Eastern. It seems to me that Great Protect Link may have had really high cost of insurance charges for the base coverage, which they may have masked by assuming high interest rates in the pricing of premiums. And perhaps, now that they may be using lower rates of return in the revised premium pricing, premiums have to be revised higher.

Really baffling, as Policy 2, which came into force in 2007, should or could have built up a higher cash value compared to Policy 1, which only came into force in 2015, although Policy 2 had a lower annual premium amount at inception - you would know this, so please check.

This is a bizarre case. And ILHP and SMX have similar levels of claims experience. Somehow, the ILHP plan, once upgraded, has to pay RM 535 per month while the SMX plan, only RM 357.5 per month, but the ILHP plan is only expected to be sustainable up to age 66, while the SMX plan up to age 73.





Please check if there are other additional charges, post upgrade, being levied for both policies (esp. allocation charges)

That is why these issues are coming to the surface now.

Also, I would like to add that any notification sent by ITOs to inform on the policy's sustainability is just a notice and not contractually binding. They cannot revise the contractual level premium set at inception of policy. Feel free to ignore it. It is only your responsibility to pay the premium amount set at inception of the policy. It is not your responsibility to abide by any notice requiring an increment in premium payments for sustainability purposes.

Oh yeah, this is really important. Policy 1's term for the current medical card is up to age 99 (2072) thanks to the attached SMX 99 rider, unlike Policy 2's current medical card which is only up to 2046 . Which means that when upgrading to SHP, the expectation for Policy 1 is for it be to be sustainable until age 99 while for Policy 2, it is a bit trickier.

This post has been edited by hafizmamak85: Mar 28 2025, 05:25 AM

What's even more baffling is that ITOs and DITOs can actually sell a profitable insurance policy for a 35 yr old male with

- 200k in death benefits,
- up to 200k for short term disability,
- 200k for long term disability, and
- a high powered medical card with an average pool medical cost of RM 3100 (12.1 claimants per 100 policyholders with an average payout of RM 25.4k) - unlike Great Eastern's sub RM 1000 average pool medical cost hospitalisation products



all for RM 4200 or RM 350 per month







This post has been edited by hafizmamak85: Mar 28 2025, 02:26 AM

Perhaps one of the consideration point for the big pricing increase is the vastly different in features of SMX and ILHP.

From the screenshot, im assuming the SMX has annual limit of 117k with unlimited lifetime limit. Whereelse the ILHP has 50k annual limit and 200k annual lifetime.

The SHP should be in the range of RM 3-5 mil annual limit and unlimited lifetime limit. As for the other benefits table would need further comparison.

Now to the question if its worth it or not, im not sure as im not involved in pricing or RI business. But as a consumer if i am looking for more comprehensive protection, i would compare with a quote from another policy, waiting period etc, is my coverage sufficient, affordability etc etc

This post has been edited by cms: Mar 28 2025, 10:06 AM

Thanks hafizmamak85, contestchris & CMS for the insights. I've emailed to GE CS to ask for

1. A detailed breakdown of the premium increment for my policy, showing how the new amount is calculated.
2. A line-by-line justification for each rider included in the policy and how it contributes to the premium adjustment.

But I've a bad feeling that they will blame the different because of ILHP & SMX work differently.

My colleague advised me to accept the offer, and then restructure/ downgrade the base plan (remove PA, remove CI) to lower annual premium, if allowed to do so. I have another AIA plan (AETNA LIVING COVER), and can buy standalone PA plan is just few hundreds per year.

I've also consulted Allianz & Prudential agents, they gave me some options. Both of them said accepting ILHP upgrade to SHP can be considered.

Allianz's alternative option is quite complicated. Was advised to restructure current ILHP, remove PA/ CI/ lower TPD/Life. Add on Allianz medical plan + 5000 TPD/ Life. The premium end up similar (SHP upgrade ≈ ILHP downgrade + Allianz medical). Two things that appeal to me are 1. Allianz no waiting period if I take the offer before 30 Apr, 2. sustainibility age = 80 (vs. SHP 66)

Prudential directly quote me RM585 monthly (or RM7000 per annum), but need body check up and 2 years waiting period.

This post has been edited by cactuscch2: Mar 28 2025, 11:54 AM

i wrote a post about the things to consider when you switch from your current policy from company A to company B. I'm not saying dont do it all, but do take into account the cost involved are complicated.

I'm not fully understanding what you are putting here. did you also approach Allianz to get a new policy? i suppose you dont have a current policy with allianz? you should shop around but do read my previous post about the switching.

Also want to clear up some misconception, assuming you are a normal person, non of the medical plans out there have 2 years waiting period. the 2-years is actually referring to the incontestability period, which somehow gets translate to "dont claim within 2 years".

I dont work for GE, and i have no vested interest in GE. I put it in a different analogy, if you are switching from a honda city to honda accord, the jump of car loan installment will be smaller. but if you are switching from axia to accord, i'm sure the jump in car loan instalment is bigger. in the end we are consumers, it's our choice to want that accord or not. i wont say they blame it on the axia being cheap, but the axia is cheaper, that is the reality right?

But what i like about the GE plan (SHP) is that it comes with a few deductible options. Fundamentally, insurance (including medical insurance) is a tool to transfer financial risk. honestly, if i were to masuk hospital now, assuming i'm working BUT i dont have employee insurance, i can still afford to fork out the medical bills myself. 10k 20k is a lot of money but i do have savings i can tap on and this 10k and 20k is not an amount that will put me in debt or wipe me out. but if the hospital bill is 100k 200k, then i will be in trouble. So coming back to the GE plan, they have deductible of 2.5k, 5k, 20k. so by going for deductible of say 5k or 20k, you will be paying lower charges and lower premium. whatever savings you can get, can be invested, and forms part of retirement fund, emergency fund, etc. I believe we as consumers benefit from these flexibility.

it circles back to why we buy insurance, it's to cover the risk we can't absorb. risk that can hurts us alot or even wipe us out. just like why i dont care about travel insurance that covers luggage damage. after all, luggage damage, yes, it's not great, i need to spend money buy new luggage, but it's just cost of travelling. i care about travel insurance that covers my medical part, cause we know, if hospitalised, in places like USA, that medical bill really can wipe me out financially.

added side note on the GE plan: from what i see on the brochure. the SHP Plus offers what i think are not important benefits, dont get it (IF you do decide to upgrade to SHP)

This post has been edited by adele123: Mar 28 2025, 12:37 PM

Recently all my insurances increase price.. Some give u option to maintain current price, some either force u to accept price increase or downgrade plan.. Any difference?

My guess, ...

If maintain current price, .... the coverage years will be shortened.
If pay the new price, every thing will remains until further notice.
If downgrade, the benefits of the initial plan will be less or shortened.

This post has been edited by cactuscch2: Mar 28 2025, 02:37 PM

I rather maintain price and top up later if it allows..why suffers now and downgrade lifestyle bcoz of paying more for insurance. Life is short.. Dont need to cover until 99yo

I don't read about 90% for what hafizmamak writes. I believe contestchris has given a theory for some explanation on the differences of the premium. Which I can't add more since i dunno anyway. But those seems like the sound theory

Insurance product is more complicated than to compare. Not an excuse for the insurance companies but ya, it is not something you can compare easily with another person and just ask why he/she is different.

Having said that you have sent an email to GE, they should give you a more complete answer than us mostly providing educated guess.

Thank you so much. My understanding of insurance is very limited. I've picked up more and more concepts from you and others who replied. These are good learning experience.

There isn't a vast difference in coverage or features between the SMX and ILHP policies, once the upgrade to SHP is taken into account.

The ILHP policy, post upgrade to SHP, is required to pay RM 535 per month or an additional RM 180 per month (RM 2.2k per annum) for essentially an extra 50k in death and accidental benefits, compared to SMX's post upgrade monthly premium of RM 337.5. This part needs to be appreciated.

Perhaps it is due to the ILHP base (excl. medical) coverage - death, critical illness, accident benefit, waiver of premium - having higher cost of insurance charges compared to the SMX policy.

Policy 1 (SMX): 50k death benefit, 50k critical illness & early payout critical illness benefits, hospitalisation GL/reimbursement (SMX & extension of coverage until age 99), hospitalisation benefits, waiver of premium (disability & critical illness)

RM 337.5 per month (current premium)
RM 357.5 per month (post SHP upgrade)

Increment: RM 20 per month

Policy 2 (ILHP): 100k death benefit, waiver of premium for death & TPD, 50k critical illness benefits, hospitalisation GL/reimbursement (ILHP), 50k accidental benefits

RM 232 per month (current premium)
RM 535 per month (post SHP upgrade)

It really is frustrating to see people wanting better coverage for hospitalisation but end up paying so much more just because they have an old policy and are forced to upgrade within a bad basic plan that has very high cost of insurance charges.

In such situations, I would implore policyholders to be open to surrendering their old policies and purchasing a new one altogether if they truly wished to have better hospitalisation coverage.

Let's face it, the usual suspects when it comes to hospitalisation policies is going to be either AIA, GE, PRU or one of the smaller kutus such as Allianz or HLA. These are the main contenders. And every one of them will have a different underwriting and claims philosophy.

Price is only one aspect that needs to be appreciated. The other aspect, and one that I would argue is more important, is the payout. How much is getting paid out - number of claimants per 100 policyholders and the average claims amount per claimant - is what needs to be asked.

Higher frequency of medical claims and average claims amount indicate a less restrictive claims department. No one wants to purchase an expensive hospitalisation policy only to be later told to pay first and claim later or have impositions on treatment types and other exclusions.

Great Eastern fairs poorly, I would give it a C grade, in this area for only having an average pool medical cost of less than RM 1000 (RM 730). No GE medical policy, with a large number of policies or high claims frequency profile, has got an average claims amount of more than RM 11k.



Prudential, on the other hand, has a got a claim frequency of 7.4 claimants per 100 policyholders and an average claims amount per claimant of RM 14.7k for its PRUHealth plan, which brings the average pool medical cost close to RM 1100. I would give this a B grade.

So, always ask your agent, prior to purchase or upgrade, about the hospitalisation plan's claim frequency and average claims amount per claimant.

Insurer to raise medical premiums ‘because of increase in claims’



This post has been edited by hafizmamak85: Apr 3 2025, 10:52 AM

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nst.com.my...024-amid-weaker

What would happens when they see their profits down due to higher payouts?




Attached thumbnail(s)

Any suggestion for our forumer ? Should he stay same or upgrade in your opinion ?

Hi both, spoiler function exist. Please use it. Like how I am using it. As demonstrated.



Please god damn stop having long useless post with multiple images and screenshots without spoiler. One type long, one go quote the long post. End up no one is reading/helping the people who needs help.

cherroy

Yes, I believes that would be more helpful to TS

Hello. Noob question here.

I have SMARTPROTECT ESSENTIAL INSURANCES 2 by Great Eastern since Sept 2014.

If i surrender this policy, do i get any cash?
Never claim before.

Will ask the insurer but need any knowledge from anyone about this.
Thanks in advance

Yes you will get the cash value of your investment holdings. You can easily check this amount by logging into eConnect.

May I know why you want to surrender the policy? SPE2 is one of the better ILPs around and is something that I personally have too.