Few months ago there was a crash between a Honda Accord and a Tesla Model S. Apparently some Merc driver cut off the Tesla, forcing him to swerve into the opposite lane. Unfortunately there was another car coming that way, and it came to a head on collision. Both passengers in the Honda died, the Tesla driver suffered minor injuries.

1990 Honda Accord:


2012 Tesla Model S:




Clearly the Honda driver was the most innocent one in the whole crash, but since he drove the worst car he was the one to die. Would passive, careful driving have helped him? Nah. There's probably nothing he could have done. Life is unfair.

So when you buy your next car, don't just consider resale value. Stuff like this happens all the time, and there are huge differences between cars, even new ones. Consider if a bit of convenience and a few RM are worth your life (and consider the huge medical bills that come up when you are heavily injured as opposed to minor injuries). A Preve CFE or a Kia Rio will do a decent job at protecting you and your family, and they won't break the bank. There are other cars that aren't as safe as these cars that cost twice as much.

The way I see it there are 2 classes: Contis and Koreans on one side and local and Japanese on the other (Preve CFE sits in between, new Mazdas are mostly conti, Prius C and Prius too, Fiesta S is Japanese (all other Fiesta versions aren't)).

Btw.: The Tesla clearly shows the importance of a crumple zone. The whole front end is a crumple zone, there is no engine that can be pushed into the interior of the car. So they could design it in a way that all the crash energy can be absorbed in that area. Apparently it worked.

This post has been edited by kadajawi: Jul 24 2013, 04:10 PM

good share!

This is not a fair comparison as cars from the early 90s didn't have to face strict regulations in safetly. Most cars from that era are nothing more than eggshells on wheels. They didn't build bad cars then, it is just that the regulations that they have to follow were bad.

This post has been edited by sleepwalker: Jul 24 2013, 04:44 PM

I think TS not trying to compare car.. just to share something on car safety which most people ignore/not consider on it when buying car...

Of course not. That's why I wrote from when the car was. It could have been a Merc, a Volvo, the outcome would more or less have been the same. 2 dead, driver of new car walks away. But some people think old cars are very tough, perhaps even better than new ones. Clearly that isn't the case. Also, some people think as long as I drive defensive and not fast I'll be fine, even if my car isn't so safe. Clearly that too isn't the case.

I think it is about putting more importance on safety instead of RV when choosing cars. Not which car is better or worse.

You're right, but this wasn't a comparison anyway, just creating awareness.

Remember those threads alot of forumers banggalah because they know some big bosses/millionaires who drive old junkers? when the aspect of safety and value of life is mentioned, statements like "different ppl different thinking, deswai you are not rich like them blah blah blah...." is thrown at the face of well-meaning forumers.

Then there is those who claim drive slow no need ABS/ESC etc. etc. etc.

tesla chassis i think came from Lotus X-box styled chassis..hence very strong frontal impact resistant :hmmm:

the title should be: why driving a NEW car make sen?

No, since there is for example a significant difference between a brand new Camry 2.0 and a brand new Kia K5, VW Passat, Ford Mondeo, ... or between a Vios and a Kia Rio/Peugeot 208/Ford Fiesta LX for example.

@pomen_GTR: Not that I know of. The Model S is an all new car. The Roadster was Lotus based.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtxd27jlZ_g

2009 Chevy Malibu vs 1959 Chevy Bel Air, a SOLID, METAL car. Malaysians would test by knocking the cars skin and listed to the sound. And we'd say the Bel Air is SOLID and QUALITY!

yea it reminds me of the thread where ppl attacked me for saying its stupid for a millionaire to drive a wira..the point i was making is exactly TS point...dont need to drive FLASHY car...but it makes sense to get a SAFE car

Yup. There are a few old vs new tests, and it is always the new car that is winning.

(I do that knock knock test too though It just makes me feel better.)

Can someone point me to a website to see the rankings of latest and common models of different cars? Like Honda, Toyota, Kia...different segments..which ones are affordable but safe?

Hyundai Starex


Toyota Alphard


Perodua Viva


Perodua Myvi


Mercedes Benz SLS AMG


Nissan Skyline GTR

what tokok u ?

For Asean cars, most relevant to our market
http://www.aseancap.org

For cars sold in Europe
http://www.euroncap.com

For cars sold in Australasia
http://www.ancap.com.au

Your point?

If you have to die, you have to, because GOD want you to.

You can check EuroNCAP, IIHS, NHTSA, ANCAP, CNCAP, ASEAN NCAP, ... but those are hard to compare at times (CNCAP is very different from the others, ASEAN NCAP hasn't tested many cars yet and don't do side impacts yet, but the advantage is they test Malaysian spec cars). Also spec levels are different.

Generally speaking I'd want ESP/VSC/VSA (different models different names) to help me avoid accidents, and I'd want 4 or better 6 airbags to protect me from side impacts, because those are quite dangerous.

Also, generally speaking the bigger the car, the safer. So D segment > C segment > B segment > A segment, when the rating is the same. But only when the specs are the same. Having side airbags makes a big difference when there is a side impact.

Statistics show way more people die in Malaysia than in Western Europe on the roads. So you are basically saying God hates Malaysians?

All things being equal, a safe car will protect you better. Your CHANCES of survival are simply much higher. It doesn't mean you are invincible. It doesn't mean you can drive like nothing can kill you. Drive sensible, and drive a safe car, and you should be alright.

Wow! Thanks guys. I looked at the aseancap site and surprised to find Honda City a very safe car. Also, Honda Jazz (or Fit overseas).

I see. Pls go an sleep on the middle lane of the PLUS highway for one night and see if you survive tomorrow morning.

If you die, don't feel bad because GOD wanted you to.

there is always two sides to this... on a good side... everyone is safer because the cars are safer...

on the bad side...human beings are known to compensate for risks... so, when a subject is given knowledge that they are driving something safer.. they might think they have more buffer and start inducing in more risk than they would have in driving a car less safe...

and if this does happen... yes, the statistics might show less fatality in total but it might also possibly show an increase on accidents due to more risk taken (being it driving faster or multitasking while driving... etc)

so, good and bad... always do not take things for granted is the best advice... as the old people says.. buying you a superman cape does not make you a superman..

Risk Compensation theory

As more technology is developed to keep the roads safe, the weakest link has become the driver.

This post has been edited by dares: Jul 24 2013, 07:52 PM

My minimum criteria when choosing and buying a car:

During 1980s Without ABS - OUT
During 1990s Without ABS + Front Airbags - OUT
During 2000s Without ABS + Front & Side Airbags - OUT
During 2010s Without ABS + Front, Side & Curtain Airbags and Stability Control - OUT
Since 2013 Without ALL THE ABOVE + Speed Sensing Auto Door Lock - OUT (Due to rampant robberies & snatch thieves nowadays)

God hates poor people. You can see more people in poor and poverty countries dies like flies.

Oops...i just opened a whole can of non-related worms...

Well, the problem with the City is the lack of side airbags. Since ASEAN NCAP didn't test side impacts (yet) that deficit doesn't show up. A Fiesta is still a much safer choice (except for the Fiesta S, all other models are fine), so is a Peugeot 208 or a Kia Rio. Likewise with the Jazz. The CBU hybrid Jazz is fine, the CKD one isn't, and the regular Jazz isn't either. The results you find from overseas are probably for cars with 6 airbags, and the CBU hybrid is the only one that offered it.

One of the two US organizations that do crash tests has tested a Prius with and without side/curtain airbags. Otherwise it was the same car. But the difference was huge. From more or less deadly to perfectly safe.

true i support this thread. Driving a safer car will at least provide more safety during crash.

but guys please dont compare cars during fatal impact, coz that will be not fair then

What under RM100k car has speed auto-lock? Also which under RM100k car has side curtain airbag? and both?

I don't think there are any...

You can see from his nick that BMW is his car of choice, so none below rm100k when new.

that is your assumption only, no body even mention that.

other countries have tsunami and tornado, you dont have。

so what tokok u?

GOD hates America?

if you're driving 10ton lorry, means what ?

you are plain stupid.

you cant even differentiate suicide and God's Will.

Noticed that

Aside from that. Seriously no car got all those features <RM100k? Preve no auto-lock? Airbags I can see Kia having loads of that. Fiesta too? I know Accord got auto-lock, but that is RM150k.

is the speed auto lock is when the car hit certain speed, it will auto look all the doors?

You are right, not possible to get a car that has all the safety features I required for below 100K. The closest will be the Kia Cerato which has 6 airbags (Front 2 Side 2 Curtain2), Anti-skid Braking System, Stability Control and Speed Sensing Auto Door Lock, but at RM118,888.

That's my excuse that until now I still have not bought a car for my dear precious wife loh.

PS Didn't anyone notice all the BMW models are more than 10 years old !

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 24 2013, 10:54 PM

Yep, usually between 20kph to 30kph, all the doors will lock automatically. During an accident, the doors will also unlock automatically for rescue operation.

i know forte has that auto door lock but not sure about the auto unlock when accident

im afraid that means you cant buy any conti car in 2013 then....all Contis do not have auto-lock as a safety feature....BMW, Ford, Merc etc.

Usually if the car has auto lock feature, it will also has auto unlock feature for safety reason. I am 99% sure Cerato has auto unlock function (information from Naza Kia website). I am not too sure about Forte though.

Got. Ford Fiesta sedan, under 85kk, 7 airbags, ESP, ABS, EBD, TCS...apa u mau pun ada, 5 star NCAP as well

I was informed by a Peugeot SA that the 508 has auto lock feature. I will have to pay special attention when test driving the car then. Unless the Peugeot is not consider as conti car, since it is CKD in Malaysia ?

Rio has 6 airbags. Less than 80k.

I have checked with the Ford SA already, not auto lock for all Ford models, even the Focus and Mondeo !

You earn enuff to buy a safe car, you can choose to
a) buy and drive a safe car
b) drive a kancil and let God decide

You are alive today, you can choose to
a) NOT sleep on the PLUS highway
b) sleep on the PLUS highway and let God decide

See my point?

Besides, if you wanna talk religion: If you think God is all-powerful and can control whether you die or not, what makes you think you can control whether you wanna suicide or not against His will?

This post has been edited by dares: Jul 24 2013, 11:06 PM

Sorry, my POV is that there is NO WAY we can ENSURE That the car we are driving is totally SAFE. Simply because all these are assumptions. The crash test only comes out with a procedures, common encounter and put them into test. Once passed, then these cars get certified.

Do you think when (touch wood) someone is meant to get into casualty, because of the brand "Volvo" "Mercs" "BMW", then it makes the differences? Or even it is "VIOS", then the God will say,"It is a God's car, let's spare these INNOCENT lives!"??

No, even the most safety car, tend to fail. It does mean it is fail proof. Statistics have proven that the bigger the vehicle, the higher the chance of survival. If this is the case, why don't we all change our cars to trucks due to the safety issues. I think these truck can easily pass these Euro NCAP easily.

It all depends on how vehicles collide, how is the casualty happens and the impact of the casualty. These design can prevent but NOT avoid it some vehicles would get involved into the casualties.



Read more here: http://www.trucktrend.com/features/consume...l#ixzz2ZyZ86V8j

This post has been edited by gold member: Jul 24 2013, 11:08 PM

The whole point for safer cars is about the INCREASING THE POSSIBILITY of surviving an accident, not a GUARANTEE.

If someone gets killed in a Viva after ramming a tree, perhaps that person would've survived in a Vios? But would a Vios survive a collision with a 10 tonne truck? probably not, but it is even less likely for a Viva.

This post has been edited by dares: Jul 24 2013, 11:15 PM

Hey Bro, haven't you notice all the models are above 10 years old ?

Like I said, it's a euro safety feature, even a 300k bmw does not have it, but if something like lack of auto lock is so important that you would ignore the other safety features?

I know, but when new they're all expensive cars, right?

Exactly what I am trying to say. It all depends on the driver and sometimes probabilities. All these are out of our controls. There are so many parameters on the road. It doesn't mean if we are careful, and driving a very safety branded car, then it is an "immunity" to all casualties! (in other word, it doesn't means once one has shone the brand of incredible "VIOS" = ultimately spare!).

There are many way a casualty can happen. It can happen that a vehicle losses control, some obstacles on road during high speed driving and can be even (the story inspira vs lancer) that a vehicle lost control and flying over from the opposite side of the road! There are just many possibilities. It doesn't mean that if we have a safe car, we drive recklessly = God saves the poor driver.

but driving a Viva might avoid that accident in the first place..maybe due to slower acceleration and top speed.
It is all about bad timing.

This post has been edited by wh0cares: Jul 24 2013, 11:25 PM

Viva can be fast. Enough to cause a fatal accident.

I really cannot comprehend how come some people would choose RV/cheap spare parts/low maintenance over 6 Airbags and stability control, when these safety features will greatly improve their chances of survival in an accident or minimize the injuries ?

not some, is many, at least typical malaysians

Fair point. You can only do your best to increase the chance of survival for yourself and your passengers, that's all.

No, I will not overlook the important safety features such as side & curtain airbags, ABS, ESP etc. But I will also NOT consider a car that does not has auto lock feature, with the rampant robberies, road bullies and snatch thieves in Malaysia nowadays !

Looks like I have to change my next nickname to kiahyundai, no more f10f30 loh !

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 24 2013, 11:48 PM

I can confirm that, one day I was driving happily at 120kp on the NS highway, but was overtaken by 2 kancil/viva (can't differentiate because they were passing too fast lah)

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 12:08 AM

im driving viva . thinking of upgrade with 70k budget make taken service charge into consideration.

so alza, almera, preve which one is safer ?

Many factors:

1. Money. They are not going to use their car for long, hence RV is important. Since they know they are going to sell their car in a few years, it is a CONFIRMED big 'savings'.

2. Cars tend to breaks down in Malaysia shitty road. Drive a skyline in Japan, absorbers good for many years. Take the skyline back to Malaysia, all 4 absorbers need to chance in less than 2 years (4k satu batang). Nobody keeps the absorber as stock in Malaysia, need wait 1 week for stock. This is about money + convenience.

3. Chances of fatal accident is very very low. Whereas chances for minor accident (scratch, bump other cars during parking, scratch door) is very common especially among young drivers. Hence buying a car with cheap spare parts almost guaranteed some 'savings' as all these minor accidents might required you to change some parts. Why pay more for something that has the probability of >1% (fatal accident) to happen when you can SAVE for something that will happen at the probability of say...50%? (minor accident)

4. Malaysians usually prepare for something they foresee. Since fatal accident is very rare and "die" is a almost a taboo word, they would sometimes place more importance on other factor. As long as the car have some safety features, then it is fine. Don't need to have 6 airbags. 2 airbags are enough.

*All those numbers are just my imaginary guess works to show my point. It's not a statistic but it makes my point clearer.

Then why buy life insurance or personal accident insurance. The probability of dying at a young age also very low what, or else the life insurance companies all kaput ! I look at those safety features as insurance, hope I will never use them, but will have peace of mind to have them ever ready to serve.

Life insurance = covered many things ma, not only accident fatal accident on the road.
Personal accident insurance = it is aim for coverage during accident. But is not only covered for fatal accident ma. Normal minor accidents also covered

Between this 3, of course Preve.

If you can drive a manual, then Fiesta 1.4l manual at RM69k.

This post has been edited by dares: Jul 25 2013, 12:47 AM

Well, the safety features are not there solely to prevent fatal accident. They are there to minimize injuries or to turn fatal to non-fatal. My point is, the reason people spend on insurance is to prepare for untoward things and minimize the loss/suffering. The safety features of a car provide the same safety net, even though a serious accident is very unlikely to happen to anyone.

let's get it straight... no one buys a car expecting to get into an accident...no one like accidents and that is a fact... you can only do as much as you can to prevent it whether it is driving cautiously or getting a safer car..

and what if, that person has no money to get a safer car.. it is not their choice to not drive a safer car.. their money is making the decision for them...

Haha, I get your point. You voice out that you cannot comprehend why people disregard safety when buying a car. I'm just telling you to main reasons, doesn't mean I have the same thinking.

Hmm....what i mean is, yes, even though safety features of a car provide a safety net to prepare for untoward things and to minimize the loss/suffering, some people just doesn't find it "profitable" to invest on something that is so expensive just to have a safety net for fatal accident and for something that is so unlikely to happen. However keep in mind that to most people, some safety features is enough to them, instead of a full fledged safety system.

Side/curtain airbags: Fiesta LX hatchback, around 70k? All the other Fiestas except for the S too. Kia Rio. Peugeot 208.
Side airbags: Preve CFE. Polo sedan.

I think he means auto locking doors once you start driving. That was a standard feature on most cars I believe... though these days it isn't anymore. It was removed due to cars not unlocking themselves after an accident, and that being a security risk. Which I think is ridiculous, because if the car doesn't lock itself I will do that myself... and then the car will still be locked after an accident.

My Kangoo auto locks above maybe 7 km/h...

But really, I might even prefer not having that feature. That means that hopefully you'll remember to lock the car once you get inside. Otherwise there is still a certain time frame from getting inside until you've reached the necessary speed where you are in danger. I try to remember locking the car once I get inside.

@darkdevilrey: Toyota salesman? Malaysia got no floods? Robberies? It's not the safest place in the world either. Europe hardly has those nature catastrophes (at least not so deadly ones). So Europeans are beloved by God? Quite a few Europeans are atheists these days...

@gold member: There is no such thing as absolute safety. But you can for example go through a poor, dangerous neighbourhood, wearing a flashy Rolex and a suit and an expensive looking suitcase, or you can avoid going through there, or, if need be at least be low profile about it. You just try to do what you can to be safe, and you're more likely to be safe. That alone is worth it, IMHO.

That study is ridiculous. Cars in general have become much safer. In Europe trucks aren't popular at all, yet the deaths have gone down significantly. It's not the increase in trucks that helped. I would't be surprised if those things actually make roads less safe.

I don't think they think about that. Or they believe in fate and God's will...

Amongst those the Preve CFE. But Proton _may_ upgrade the CFE sooner or later to 6 airbags. They've said something hinting in that direction.

@Balanced: The chances for fatal accidents in Malaysia are actually very high.

Scratched doors etc. are the same to repair no matter if Viva or Rolls Royce. (More or less lah... of course Rolls Royce the paint may be more expensive, and workshops will want to charge more cause you look rich )

Also, don't forget there are 50 shades of grey between being alive and dead after an accident. The Tesla owner WALKED AWAY. Had he driven lets say a Vios he might have been badly injured, but still alive. Maybe for the rest of his life he will sit in a wheel chair? Maybe he can't work as a doctor anymore? Getting the best safety you can afford also helps with those things. Surviving with no injuries instead of some.

Btw. I'd rather have a car that prevents me from being badly injured, than having an insurance that pays me in that case. I prefer being unharmed.

@butthead: I'm talking about picking the car that offers the best safety for the money you have, or at least a reasonable level. If your choice is between Viva and Saga SV, pick the Saga SV. It is much safer. If your choice is between Vios, City, Almera, 208, Rio or Fiesta pick between 208, Rio or Fiesta.

well said

That is my intention, not to spend more than what you can afford just to get a safer car. But to choose wisely within your budget on a safer car rather than a car with a better FC, RV or ease of maintenance.


This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 09:58 AM

The Kia Cerato 1.6L has all the same safety features as the 2.0L model. It also has the same safety features as the D segment Optima K5.

It comes loaded with 6 airbags(including curtain airbags), Anti Lock Braking System, Electronic Brakeforce Distribution, Brake Assist, Traction Control System, Stability Control System and Hill Assist Control.

And all this for 99K+ only.

and people will buy viosTRD

You are right on the spot. Now I have no more excuses to delay buying the Cerato 1.6l for my dear precious wife loh !

Well said kadajawi & E34E36E46.

Safety should be top priority when buying a car.

When someone ask me why buy a rio instead of vios for B-segment budget, i will tell them, it is an insurance if shit happens if me or wife is driving it. There is no guarantee if one would have survive but at least i know, the chances of survival will be higher than says a vios.

By the way, the rio comes with speed sensing autolock too and it will unlock if there is accident.

This post has been edited by gtfan: Jul 25 2013, 11:22 AM

I've noticed a lot of people arguing about the extremes. Not to disagree but just to add another point of view. There are 3 types of accidents in my opinion.

1. minor accidents where no matter what car you drive, you'll walk away
2. fatal accidents where no matter what car you drive, you'll die
3. everything in between

Most accidents will likely be #3. A safe car will ensure that the chances of you surviving is higher in this category.

More thoughts about safety:

- a safe car is a combination of features including seat belts. Wear your seatbelts. Princess Diana was traveling in one of the safest cars in the era. The only person to survive the crash was the bodyguard who was wearing a seat belt

- a safe car can be hampered when rescuers can't break the windscreen to save you in an accident because you put safety tint on it

- a safe car can become unsafe when loose items in the car fly around during impact. This is particularly true in SUV where there's no separation between the luggage and passenger sections

I guess all auto lock is also auto unlock coz when we off the engine it will auto unlock, when accident occur the engine will also turned off so the doors will unlock, no?

Kia Forte 2.0..

You can automatically open them for the 2 front doors be it whether it's lock or not,

Everyman/woman has his/her priority, be it safety/RV/FC or whatever reason, the point is to raise the awareness of basic safety features that should be put in every car by the car manufacturers or distributors. Let us all Malaysian car buyers put pressure on them to put in safety features as in US and Europe, and not with just 2 crappy airbags! Don't let those distributors get away with those substandard safety features. We don't need sunroof or leather seats (don't mind having them if they already put in the 6 airbags and ESP), especially with the Malaysian weather !

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 12:11 PM

Most cars equipped with auto lock can still be opened from inside by the driver and front passenger. The auto lock feature is to prevent intruder opening the door from outside the car. Of course, the best is to instill the habit to lock the car as soon as you get in the car. The auto lock feature is just an added security, in case you forget to lock the door.

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 12:22 PM

in my opinion, there is no point to have a high RV, high FC but low safety coz when u involved in an accident, those RV and FC can't buy life, can't buy the broken arm or foot, can't buy u the ability to work and earn money, etc

understand that.. explaining to no-name regarding the auto-lock feature I have in my car. you don't need to door to be unlock before you can walk out of the car.

it's good to know that

driving a safe car makes sense only if u drive it safely....

sry is VIOS is a safe car ?

Sorry, I was trying to explain to "no-name" also, but click the wrong reply quote.

It's relative.

It depends on which car you compare to. It's a safe car if you compare to Viva or Kancil. It's unacceptable if you compare to Fiesta, Rio or 208 in the same price range.

Sometimes is the other guy who is not driving safely and he crosses your path (just like the TS's story), that is when the extra safety features come into play to reduce your "bodily damage" .

That's is why you need both ACTIVE safety and PASSIVE safety features in your car. Sometimes things literally drop from the sky !

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 12:41 PM

the other guy needs to drive safely too....but yes I agree with u....sometimes it depends on luck and fate...if ur time is up...drive watever safe car...times up buddy

Personally, I think all manufacturers should make moose test compulsory.

Of course, when time is up, time is up. There is nothing you can do.

But with side and curtain airbags, it may translate into the difference between a cracked skull plus broken ribs or just serious concussion and sore arms.

This post has been edited by E34E36E46: Jul 25 2013, 01:17 PM

I see. Thanks

wat u said is true, no doubt about it....and TS story is also very true....can happen to anyone...

but what if Car A was Car B...would the outcome change? what if both are Car A and vice versa....

Conclusion, all cars are not made 100% death proof. Speed Kills!

Just bare in mind that Forte 2.0 is not a 5 star. The A pillar bent on frontal collision.

So, realisticly, poor people who buy cars <rm100k cannot afford safe cars even if they wanted too

poor poor people

For below 100k, there are a few with 6 air bags or more. Toyota Prius C, ford fiesta, Kia rio, Kia forte, Kia serato, Mazda 2
Anymore to add?

when it is time to go, one has to go. when's there life there's death. when a life is formed, he/she already facing the day of death to come one day.