Somebody start a new topic "No Swiftlet Houses in Georgetown - Right or Wrong " for discussion.

note that the topic is similar to the blog spot so that a google search will turn this forum up.

Are there many in this group who are game for an intelligent discussion on the above topic, if there are, others from the various swiftlet associations, PHT and Badan Warisan, and YB's will be informed and invited to participate.

Be aware that many of the invitees will be professionals in their respective fields therefore will probably know in absolute detail what they discus.

We, swiftlet house owners cannot afford to be humiliated in this instance as this can influence the result of how the 1GP will be implemented by the local councils[.

Are we up to it ?

most important thing to me is that all of us including the govt must look further than the problems which in actual fact can be dissolve once our nation economy and also creating workforce for the nation. one should not think of just monopolizing the industry as it will hurt the growth and creativity in implementing new bird house and sophitiscated shops and business that will increase also tourist to the country.

i did realize that one can actually stood there for more than an hours or more doing nothing just watching the bird flying above the sky. it's like a fish pond theraphy to your leg but this one is like a soul theraphy minus your neck ache after that...


and the industry had nothing to do with race and hopefully the malays will not be so jealous of the chinese as it has nothing to do with race. blame it on the underworld businessman or the loan shark bosses and don't forget that many of chinese and malay datuks , corrupt authorities that used to renovate their house into palaces and mansion in remote areas .

THE MAIN OBSTACLE THREATENING THE SURVIVAL OF THE BIRD NEST HOUSES IN HERITAGE ZONE

Regarding the rather imminent problems faced by the BHs in Heritage zoning of Penang. In our Opinion, the BHs and the Heritage building could actually co-exist with absolute no problem at all. The swiftlet is also a living heritage of Penang. The Penang Heritage Trust (PHT) only has the jurisdiction, duty and interest to ensure that all heritage buildings should have the external look or façade intact. In another word, the PHT only wants those heritage buildings with their external look as old as possible but not run down. They do not have the jurisdiction or legal right to dictate the owners of what they should or could do inside the building. So, as long as the owners could agree or ensure to cooperate to re-renovate or maintain the outlook of their heritage buildings as heritage as possible, we do not see any valid reason why the PHT want to continue to object? Just like if a owner leaves the building idle or operates an illegal 4-D operation or a prostitute den inside the building, the PHT has absolutely no jurisdiction or authority to say yes or no. We do not think that the officials inside PHT are unreasonable people as all of them are known highly respectable and professional volunteers. Question here is, have both the parties ever sat down peacefully with real sincerity for a friendly dialogue or interaction wanting to resolve the situation for a win-win to co-exist for the good of Penang? So far, it is to our knowledge that no such important formal meeting has ever been held yet. Why not? We would suggest that the representatives from the BH owners should initiate to request PHT for such a dialogue. In this case, the recognized representatives should be committee or recognized respectable persons from the existing Associations.


There are presently two Associations in Penang, the Penang Bird’s Nest Merchants Association (MERCHANTS) and the ASNI. It seems the MERCHANTS is almost dormant, ineffective and inactive, so it is left with only ASNI to spearhead. If the committee of the association is really committed and living up to the expectation and have the welfare and interest of the members and owners in their hearts sincerely, they should start doing something positive pro-actively to interact with the PHT by now to clear the misunderstanding rather than waiting like sitting duck for the official announcement of the launching of the 1GP which may not materialize in the near future as we have been promised far too many times. Please bear in mind, BHs under Heritage Law is very unique and different a lot from the others. Also remember that such dialogue is to seek win-win and not to win all nor for war.


WE HAVE ALL THE RIGHTS TO PROTECT OUR RIGHTS BUT MUST ENSURE THAT OUR RIGHTS DO NOT INFRINGE ON OTHERS’ RIGHTS, AND THEN ONLY OUR RIGHTS ARE RIGHT.


The BH owners do not have the right to cause misery and nuisance to the neighbourhood. Once, they infringe that, the BH owners already lose the right to operate the BH. The PHT has the right to ensure that all heritage buildings must be maintained and look like a heritage building externally. But the PHT does not have the right to dictate the owners what they should do inside their own buildings.


If the related association/associations is too weak, too slow or ineffective to spearhead, may we suggest the SMI Association of Penang to get involved and take active role. The SMI Association does have the obligation and duty to be involved as they do have many members owning BHs inside Heritage core zone of Penang. And the bird nest industry also falls under its jurisdiction. Understand that, before the formation of ASNI, the SMI was the sole main organization and representative on behalf of the BH owners participated actively in the earlier official dialogues and meetings with the State Govt. Why is SMI not continuing its duty now? We think that the SMI with its vast experience and resources and much bigger member base and better organized with a lot more talents should take the leading role as from now again.

Been wondering about Why? in the first place an Association is form?
For the purpose of what??

i would love to see what had they list out when forming an association?

My guess is... mempelihara ,pembangunan dan menglahirkan lebih anak burung di sekitar bandar

or menjaga hak hak asasi manusia dan pembentukan satu tempat hobby untuk semua penternak burung.

I can't find the blog "No Swiftlet Houses in Georgetown - Right or Wrong" as mentioned but do find the below blog and I passed comments and advices on it and doesn't know if he is going to publish it or not. Even if he didn't publish it but surely he must have read it and revert back to me as I even provide him with all my particulars like name and email if he want to know the truth about the industry and not trying to spread lies unless he, too has hidden agenda.

http://noswiftlethousesingeorgetown.blogsp...03/contact.html

ah an independent journalist from CJ is interested to do a video too on anti swiftlet i guess. his name is jimmy. so now we have another guy who loves journalism and some hobby in video cam gonna dictate the future of the swiftlet farmers.

If this joker gets the attention of some big shot in the ministry who want to get publicity then it will be the end of swiftlets farming.

It seems he is pushing very hard to get swiftlets farming out of Penang.

Does anybody know this guy?

Bad day...Bad day....

There is no such blog ! I'm suggesting a forum with a similar name so that a google search will produce results leading to the forum ! as well as http://noswiftlethousesingeorgetown.blogsp...03/contact.html
This will lead people searching for the blog site to also see the forum site listed. Then newcomers will have a chance to see and participate in the forum.

Of course the blogger of noswiftlethousesingeorgetown has an agenda. It is clear that the blogger does not want swiftlet houses in Georgetown. Why would the blogger want to publish the truth ? Which is why a counter measure must be initiated to refute those allegations.

As for PHT.. Penang Heritage Trust is an NGO not part of the State Government. They have NO jurisdiction over anything except for their own properties and members. PHT puts pressure on the state government to get things done. The State and country has a Warisan department that takes care of heritage matters.

There are members of ASNI who advocated the dialogue between ASNI and PHT but unfortunately the committee is uncommitted.

There is no such requirement that the fascade must be maintained only. In fact it is a council requirement when you submit plans for renovations in heritage zones that before it is passed, the fascade must be at least restored to councils' standards . PHT is pushing for restoration externally as well as internally to be as close as possible to the original. For some buildings in the core Heritage zones, MPPP will only pass plans for renovations only if they fulfill the requirements for restoration internally as well as externally.

SMI is also an NGO and advises members on such industries. They currently work together with ASNI. Official support will come when the time comes. For swiftlet houses in heritage zones, I suspect SMI will only comment when the legal position is clear.

Hi West Wing,

Im new to this industry and i have visited the website you have posted and have posted some of my comments. Well, my comments will be display getting approval....and it seem my comments unlikely will be display out as all the display blogs there are more "aggresive" and "bias".....

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Added on April 5, 2010, 9:32 pmAgreed!

This post has been edited by Ivan Ho: Apr 5 2010, 09:32 PM

That's why I prefer to get the issue in the open instead of leaving them to the wolfs..........feeding the raayat with lies and scaring the public that with the swifltets @ town, all raayat @ town going to die from H1N1, diseases and everything from monthly period to cancer are cause by the swifttes and no one have ever complaint about the pigeons and night spots that created problems to the raayat and it seem that all because we are gentlemen, nice and kind. If we wear tattoo and walk like Godfather, no one will say a word about us. Make Swiftlets Sanctuaries as part of our Heritage and we will charge tourists for visiting BHs and buying birdnests on the way out to take back home as health food at factory(BH) outlet price, right?

Public awarness and understanding of swiftlets are very importance and that as investors and providers of BHs esp.in town, we need to help to educate the general public on the right and correct information so that when serious standoff present, they either support us or at least stand on the side line.

So, readers and supporters of the industry, if you love the birds, and more, if you own a BH, it is your obligation to educate fellow Malaysian on the advantage of the industry and that the BHs aren't going to bring any harm to them. Otherwise, millions of swiftlets will die, many years of hard work destroyed, billions ringgit losed, economy gone and the list may go on and on if the government destroy all BHs @ town.

"We move but the swifltets never" and how, why and who is the liar and Pighead who preached that we can move the swiftlets to another location.

I will always encourage newbiz to build BH in good area and best in core area cos the Core will ensure maximun and fastest success of BHs and that's the truth. This is not from any swiftlets' text book but from years of understanding swiflets behavior and studying of failed BHs.

Building one in your agriculture land is because it's cheap and it create less attention to your BH but you have so much difficulties in managing your BH esp. securities and predators problems if you happened to be lucky to get sufficient birds to stay.

I have friends BHs @ agriculture land broken in even there is no nest inside .......... cos your sound system, equipments and your metal doors can fetch good money, too. ECO park is worst cos they normally need very large cheap land to make huge profit so your chance of getting birds is as good as 4D strike.........100 BHs and only best 5% success rate, 10% little and do you think you are so lucky to be the 5% group? Most of them even charge you for maintenance.........what's about insurance if not successful? In Genting Casino, at least if you buy insurance, you be paid double.

how much does 1kg bird nests worth in peninsular? In sarawak mostly around rm4.2k to rm4.5k for A standard bird nests. One of the villager got 7-8kg per month.

http://swiftletfarming.blogspot.com/2009/0...downstairs.html

building birdhouse in agricultural or remote area will face situation like the blog above . the destruction or killing of young birds .
does the authority know anything about bird ranching in the first place. kalau tak tau, belajar lah - pihak berkuasa tempatan. gaji dulu pun macam in, sekarang pun tak beza. tolong kami, kami tolong kerajaan juge. jangan jadi gangster lepas pakai uniform . pakai uniform bukan untuk tunjuk tunjuk.. dengar dulu dan bagi masa. jangan pandai pandai buat decision, beri peluang untuk semua orang , lebih senang jadi baik dari jahat.

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Added on April 6, 2010, 12:12 pmI thought of organizing a tour or going to places where the swiftlet to the South and end up in Mersing. We can also take a look in Melaka which reported thousands of birds migratory etc...
anybody like to arrange tour there and share expenses on the travelling ? got anybody interested in this 3 days trip.

This post has been edited by hackwire: Apr 6 2010, 12:12 PM

Recently I have visited Bali and they are quit successfull promoting swiftlet, and i observed a lot visitors will drop by and buy some during way out...

I agreed on your comment that managing a BH @ agriculture land do have disadvantages such as security problem....in fact, our nation is not "secure enough" as compare to other countries.

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Added on April 6, 2010, 2:23 pmHi, please do let us know the travel itinerary or planning. many thanks.

This post has been edited by Ivan Ho: Apr 6 2010, 02:23 PM

Hi, im interested to buy some. Any info? Many thanks.

ok ivan, let me schedule this itineary and at the same time will visit some good spot for local food . i also like to hook up with some johoreans who like to share knowledge of swiftlet.

first day : maybe we head to rompin and than to Mersing for the evening show . there's also a place for star gazing in mersing. at night we can look for night seafood or ikan bakar . ( invite johor swiftlet association )

second day : may be we can go to melaka and than invite melaka swiftlet association than can view the wild birds and a few swiftlet spot if any.

third day: we headed home in the morning.

( we need some johor and melaka folks to accomodate us )

Another news item about Edible-nest Industry

http://m.themalaysianinsider.com/articles....ing-to-spit-at-

Swiftlet nests: Nothing to spit at
By Sheridan Mahavera

SITIAWAN, April 7 — When swiflet nest tycoon Lim Theam Siew talks about the state of this million-dollar industry, it’s difficult not to feel frustrated.

According to studies commissioned by the Malaysian Bird’s Nest Merchant’s Association, Malaysia lies at the centre of the world’s swiflet golden triangle. In other words, if swiflet nests were like oil reserves, Malaysia would be Saudi Arabia.

Better still, there is an inexhaustible demand for the nests among China’s two billion people every year.

So why should Lim, the association’s president, be exasperated? Because in his efforts to help the government tap into this gold mine and regulate the industry, he only hears encouraging noises from the lowliest officials to a former prime minister. Unlike his birds, these chirps produce nothing.

As a result, the industry exists in a muddle of unchecked greed, messy expansions, public ignorance and bureaucratic two-facedness. Examples of this are numerous, says Lim.

Perhaps the most infuriating is the fact that no Malaysian agency issues food safety certificates for exported nests, claims Lim.

In other words, since merchants export almost all of their nests to China they have had to go to Singapore to get the certification.

“Malaysians produce the nests but we have to go to Singapore to get it certified to be exported. Can you believe this?”

Also, when harvesters convert abandoned shops in urban areas into swiflet motels, the public invariably complains about the noise, the fear of viruses and the hygiene. So the government comes out with so-called guidelines stating that motels can only be built in rural areas.

“What the public and the government don’t understand is this bird is very choosy about where it wants to build its nest. It chooses only places where there are no predators such as rats, snakes and pests, which is why it is drawn to urban areas.

“The motels for these birds are continuously kept dust- and insect-free otherwise we won’t get quality nests. The droppings are collected everyday as they make good ammonia fertiliser,” Lim explains.

“If you move a hotel, you will lose up to 80 per cent of your birds.”

There is the perception that the swiflet business is like rearing other birds such as chickens, ducks and songbirds which are filthy and which fuels health concerns.

Essentially, the guidelines do not reflect a thorough understanding of swiflet behaviour as no ministry appears interested in studying the bird.

“Without a comprehensive reference on the bird’s behaviour, its genetics, the content of its waste, potential for disease, the nest’s actual nutritional value, how are we supposed to regulate the industry?,” Lim asks.

In his interview with The Malaysian Insider in his home office, Lim produces sheaves of paper detailing his quest to get the government to treat the industry like it does oil palm, rubber or padi.

There are reports of meetings he has had with every animal-related agency under the government from wildlife to veterinary services to agriculture.

There are also plans and studies he and his association has come up with based on best practises in Indonesia and Thailand, which have been sent to the government for further action. And yet the interest he’s received is piddling.

Despite being in the middle of the world swiflet population zone, Malaysia produces only a woeful five per cent of the total number of nests, globally. 95 per cent is produced by Indonesia.

At RM2,000 to RM4,000 per kg for unprocessed nests, the industry attracts a lot of interest and it is estimated that there are about 60,000 harvesters in Malaysia.

“The problem is, only 20 per cent of them are successful. It is still largely hit-and miss because again, we don’t fully understand the bird.

“What we need is a body to look after the industry, something like a Malaysian Oil Palm Board for bird’s nest otherwise it will go to waste.”

uncle liew, the reason our bird nest need to sent to singapore for certification is partly because our Malaysia govt does not have the radiation machine yet to kill the bacterias without harming the nutrients of the bird nest.

i had encountered the same scenario with exporting mangosteen or any fruits to american markets due to the FDA requirement. So far, only two SEA country able to do that which is Thailand and Singapore. Imagine Thailand have the multi million dollar equipment invested for exporting their mangoes, mangosteen, longan to USA market while malaysia is still doing it in a smuggling method .

Uncle liew was correct when the govt don't think that fruits and others like bird nest deserve such investment. Thailand and Singapore is enjoying those profits and malaysia exporter in order to get certification or export into USA have to use the facilities in singapore and cost is added up for that.

Malaysia Bird nest merchant should highlight more detail about this can or not? This opinion is spew out based on the agricultural farming of raw fruits that also face rejection in the US FDA requirement which almost been blacklisted for bringing food pests into their country.

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Added on April 7, 2010, 10:00 am
http://rayfreshfoods.com/?id=faq

http://uw-food-irradiation.engr.wisc.edu/Process.html

http://www.foodproductiondaily.com/Packagi...ood-irradiation

malaysia govt don't know there's ali baba website is it??
http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/irradiation_machine.html

http://www.ehow.com/how_5020475_become-dec...processing.html

Year 2000, now already 2010
All talks by malaysia govt.
http://www.nuclearmalaysia.gov.my/mns/News...%20Launched.htm

This post has been edited by hackwire: Apr 7 2010, 10:00 AM

hai hackwire. When is the trip? I plan to join. I am from Malacca. I am familiar with melaka BH... I can bring you to see swiftlet that stay inside a hotel.
Let me know the date then.

eric goh
012-6187114

ok great , i already told ivan next week probably on wednesday and come back on fri or sat morning.

that will be great... i pm you for more detail soon. hope more can join like a field trip for learning and discussion. hope the rest of you can join also. itineary trip is to get to Mersing and coming back to Melaka than head back home...i will check for hotel in mersing and melaka rate also.

"If you move a hotel, you will lose up to 80 per cent of your birds.”

…. I do prefer it to be refer to as swiftlets sanctuaries or just Bird House and not hotel………..as we didn’t provide any services to the swiftlets
And most importance of all, if we move, we are as good as closed shop and finished.

How do we get just one swiftlet to follow us to the agriculture land.......pls advice me.........as I am blurred and confused by the statement of losing 80% of my birds if I move......all the birds, I assured you, my friends...........

With exception of the one in my pant; last sentence is a just for laugh and no offend pls.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 7 2010, 08:45 PM