Is it just me or what? Bird nest taste differently nowadays.

Which is, like a chicken farm.

Incubated swiftlets eggs and swiftlets in PVC nest, you keep 100% of whatever you breed. Compare to traditional swiftlet farm which the farmers claimed only 20% birds will return to their old nest. And when anything is raised in a closed farm, and soon these birds will be fed with great deal of carotene A so they can produce red bird nest like what they did to the chicken to produce orange eggs, and so the bird nest will look nicer and fetch higher price for the extra decorative value. Then, its not sarcasm, some steroids/methods will be discovered to produce mutant swiftlets that produce 10x more nest.

In no time we can find bird nest in everybody's breakfast or gardenia bread.

Hi

Anyone know the outcome of swiftlet industry meeting at kedah state carry out yesterday?
what i heard is only argi land approve,commercial unit not allow.
please update us....

This post has been edited by tangsn: Oct 28 2009, 03:49 PM

Yes, the workshop was at Paya Indah. They now have 20 nests in their experimental BH. Participants were allowed to tour it (which prob. explains why it's not so hot with the birds).

I think there is almost zero publicity. My aunt is married to a Malay, and it was she who told my mother about it. It's word of mouth mostly. They did say that the name of the new org. will be controversial due to the "bumiputera" in it; the speaker said the reason for it was because the Chinese already are very strong in this industry and have their own orgs. and lobbyists. This was to help bumiputeras enter the industry. But the name has yet to be approved by the ministry.

Each participant got a cert.

There were also given a book "Edible-Nest Swiftlets Management in Asia" which is a compilation of 15 research papers in very bad English from around Asia. They also got a big poster which showed the nests of various types of swiftlets; black, brown, grass and white nests. And many broschures.

Thanks kotmj. I just met the friend who attended, he mentioned a hilux & vios? >.<
I also have in hand the mentioned compilation (which also had a list of 724 participants), also booklets "Informasi Perusahaan Sarang Burung Layang2 Gua Di Semenanjung Malaysia" & "Garis Panduan Perusahaan Sarang Burung Layang2" both by Perhilitan. I haven't gone thru them yet, sleepy. If i have the time i'll try converting them to pdf so others can go thru as well (unless i feel guilty for violating copyright acts). Also have an MMS picture of the mentioned sample BH in Paya Wetlands, but since i am an outdated person... can't transfer the image to my lappy (erm... how do i check if my lappy has bluetooth?).

I am not sure how to approach the bumiputra association issue. If it is a national level entity, they must have at least representation from 7 bumiputra state level associations... or is it just representatives per se? If it is association based, then they will be in trouble. The only registered bumi association is the Terengganu one. Kedah will follow soon and so will Negri Sembilan (i heard la, from sources). But it shouldn't be a problem if it needs just individual reps. Or maybe they have to get the right person to guide them, not people with ulterior personal motives.

Lets say there will be a bumiputra national level association... it would help boost bumi participation. But as a bumi myself... as i said earlier... it might just be a political tool in the end, and might cause more disparity towards the industry. Secondly, since it was formed under Perhilitans supervision (i assume this for now)... it might make matters worse since Perhilitan with its 1972 Act is the main hurdle we face. I may sound biased but that possibility is there. I would prefer the VSD be the authority. The good part is, it will increase political leverage with more bumi participation.

tangsn, not sure about the Kedah state, is it under the Jabatan Perancang Bandar & Desa proposal? Someone did make a link downloadable a few months back (JPN.3/2009(3.1.4)). Will share info if i get wind of it.

The way Perhilitan is aproaching this business is really sickening. Do we have Persatuan Walet Cina this and that? Why does Perhilitan divide this business into racial lines?

Perhilitan is supposed to be a national thing encompassing all Malaysians.

The birds do not care if the Bird House is built my Indians, Vietnamese or Eskimos for that matter. If it is good, it will come.

Perhilitan, you should be ashamed of your actions and mentality. Not too late to change.

Walau! What happen to the IMalaysian concept or is it just for show. All ends when the curtain goes down!!!!!!!

Let's start a IWalet Association for at least the Swiftlets aren't racial............

Jumput kami juga kerana kami hendak berkongsi kongsi pendapatan dan berlajar bersama dengan semua raayat Malaysia tanpa kira Agama, keturunan atau kulit supaya semua raayat Malaysia Boleh!!!!

bullshit bullshit bullshit

This country is sick. The disease has afflicted most if not ALL branches of government.

The non-malays have to spend a lot of their own time and money, taking all sorts of risks without help but hindrance from the government. When they succeed, the government or the people in government get dissatisfied.

Doesn't Perhilitan or other branches of government realise that we need each other to make Malaysia successful?

1Malaysia will remain just an empty election slogan unless we think less along racial lines.

My apologies to malays friends and bird farmers if I offend you. You just have to go tell your own people that what they have done is wrong, wrong in the past, wrong at present and will still be wrong in the future.

no worries coolandy... whats true is true. Despite all the so called 1Malaysia concept preached by the higher ups... it is still the agencies & its government servants that execute and deliver. If the ideals or policy is good, doesn't necessarily translate into efficient non-bias delivery system.

I don't really mind about the bumi association... what bothers me if its influenced by other agencies or parties. An independent association would be good. If half the committee members had the same passion & drive as the forumers here... that would be good. If some of the committee members had hidden sole agendas (like using the association to gain contract work for BH's or doing consultancy work individually but using the association name)... that would be not good.

I see the function of an association... besides handling a part of marketing issues... as a platform to problem solve 'problematic' BH's. I mean... i am sure many of those interested in joining would be BH owners with unsuccessful BH's (at least thats the trend i can predict). Members with the proper experience could form some sort of task force... find solutions for members. Fee's? Hmm... minyak & food enough. hahaha! Also associations can guide interested people/parties looking to invest, organize talks, seminars, discussions, public awareness... do surveys and research... not to forget lobbying about issues threatening the industry.

If there was such a charitable association, swiftlet consultancy c/o's will definitely bungkus. >.<

Before anyone die from a broken heart or have a heart attack stewing in your anger over what some 'gomen' agencies are cooking up for the EBN industry. My apologies if this is a little off topic.
I dont blame the gomen servants (as Dunsun as pointed out), if the boss doesnt right it, no one will. Wise saying 'We get only the leaders we deserve.. or something similar to that effect'. Reading the writeup below will give you some inkling on some of the why's but doesnt offer the how's.
There are some enlightened folks around ... like the author below.
As for me I cry for what Malaysia could have been & what it may be.
I wish some previous 'leaders' 500 years of good health so they may also cry along for the missed opportunities.
=========================================


Cry my beloved Malay soul

AB Sulaiman |


When Alan Paton wrote 'Cry The Beloved Country' he was lamenting over the inhumanity of man over man, of how the whites can devise, construct and implement race- and colour-based social and economic injustices over the blacks in apartheid-era South Africa.

The whole world had condemned this practice; we were among the loudest screaming against it.

South Africa has moved on since then, and today it is one shining
example of an emancipated, open and progressive country enjoying a respectable place in the community of nations. It has thrown apartheid into the bins of its history.

Here in Malaysia, yes we condemn apartheid, and quite rightly so. But in the same breath we were and are still its major proponent our version of apartheid.

We do not call it apartheid; of course not. We call it instead
'Ketuanan Melayu' under the guise of 'championing Malay rights,' and implementing it under the New Economic Policy. It's smart, right? In none of them does the word 'apartheid' appear!

Yes, we are smart. We do not blatantly call it apartheid, we merely perfected the process of social separation. First of all we ensure the great majority of civil servants, the police, and the military are manned by Malays (the target benefactors). We give them good salaries, good perks and assured employment. We then devise rules and regulations, and even laws, to ensure the NEP's easy implementation.

We then brainwash our Malay brethren with the notion 'untuk agama bangsa dan negara' that there is a higher ideal beyond performing a duty with professionalism and dedication, and that is doing things in the name of religion and race.

We devise rules and regulations, and even laws, to ensure the NEP's easy implementation.

Then we design and implement social and economic policies like channeling lucrative government contracts, separate education
streams, housing rebates, banking and financial support, in favour of, you guessed it, the Malays.

It does not stop there. We devise measures to prevent the people from raising too much objections to all these by introducing or continuing legislation and religiously implementing them.

The Sedition Act for example stops people from talking too much about language and religion. The Official Secrets Act prevents people from gaining access to government files.

Students and lecturers are not allowed to discuss and make public any subject that would appear to be critical to government (yes, government, not political) policies and philosophies.

All publications must, first of all, get operating licences.
Newspapers must not only get a licence before publishing but it must be renewed every year.

Sacrifices conveniently forgotten

The king of all of the suppressive and oppressive laws is the
Internal Security Act, when a citizen can be put under detention
without the benefit of any charge!

All said and done, we sacrifice the rule of law in favour of rule by
private individuals. To show that we are really smart, we pooh pooh the loyalty and patriotism of the non-Malay segment of the
population.

We call them pendatang or immigrants bearing the stigma that they are social discard from their original country, similar to rogues, rascals, refugees, mercenaries and scoundrels. We just ignore their proven talent and ability in wealth creation and economic productivity, as well as to their demonstrated loyalty and patriotism.

Many of such pendatangs have made the ultimate sacrifices as military personnel defending its security, during the Emergency, the Confrontation period with Indonesia and as policemen while policing the social environment.

They have contributed and are continuing to, in sport and the arts.
Their record as loyal and patriotic Malaysians is quite impeccable.
But we do not really care.

The perplexing thing is that despite these attributes and positive
records of the non-Malays, we are still going about championing and implement apartheid principles. In this new year, perhaps we can do with a little reflection: why are we doing all this?

We do this apparently to recover our lost soul. We perceive that we have been victims of colonization when the Portuguese, Dutch and British colonizers all but butchered the Malay entity, psychology and culture. In the process we perceive that we have lost our Malay identity.

With independence, we thought we could recapture the lost glory of Malay suzerainty by becoming masters of all facets of a nation, especially its commerce, and economy. We found out that the Chinese community had beaten us to it.

We felt the Chinese had capitalised on our weakness and captured the economic initiatives (and wealth) as well as the social characteristics of the country. We lost 'face'.

Now we want to regain the mertabat or dignity and pride of the Malay race!

Yes, we feel that we have to recover our soul and it is here that we are reminded of Paton's book title, but in this case suitably
paraphrased to ? Cry my beloved Malay soul.

Our Malay soul needs to cry for doing the right thing for the wrong reason or the wrong thing for the right reason; even for the wrong thing for the wrong reason, but not for the right thing for the right reason.

To start with colonization is really not an excuse for our
psychological malaise and ineptitude.

Colonization has been a feature of human history and felt all over
the world. There are very few countries that have not been colonized in the world.

It is thus a neutral concept in human social and economic
development. It is certainly not an impediment to social or economic progress as we are wont to portray it. We should dump this notion that we hold dear into the bin of history.

Rethinking our way of thinking

Just look at the records. The Koreans were once colonised by
theJapanese, but today Korea is an industrial power house. Singapore was once colonized by the British and was indeed a part of us, and today we see this tiny country being a solid financial, trading and industrial entity.

Most pointedly of all, the US was once a British colony and today it is the mightiest nation in the world.. Our second grouse - that the Chinese have cornered the economic sector of the country also needs re-looking into, on two counts.

First, the Chinese did not become successful based on any conscious and concerted economic programme to economically marginalise us.

We did this self-inflicted wound ourselves. As proof, we have to note that most of the Chinese came to our shores with only their feet, hands, guts and brains and perhaps a bundle of clothes, nothing more.

They become successful for their hard work, both physically and
mentally and for the sacrifices they were prepared to make and had undertaken. They were successful for having the mental fortitude to seek opportunities, grab those that come along and worked extra hard to realize the potentials of these opportunities.

Secondly, we have been given a chance to be equal with them, both under numerous 'special privileges' enshrined in the Constitution, as well as under its NEP implementation programe.

The special privileges have always been in the constitution while the latter began in 1970. In short, we have been given the chance - the opportunity - many times over, to better our Malay polity.

Whereas the Chinese had to struggle just to find and identify the
opportunities, in our case they were handed to us on a silver platter!

Thus far we have failed to capitalize adequately on them. It rather shameful we missing out on these chances specially created for us in the first place.

Either way the root cause of our weaknesses and the strength of the Chinese lies in two words - positive thinking. Our thinking is mired with so many dos and don'ts, so many musts and musn'ts, so many cans and cannots, may and may nots, plenty enough to created and internalize doubts and fears in our minds.

So much so that we have doubt over what we can and what we can't do, what is allowed and what is not. We spend a lifetime looking for these highly complex cans and cannots, musts and must nots, that we have hardly any mental energy left to develop and self-confidence to get on and face the realities of life.

Let's refer to this case as the 'can't don't and won't syndrome'. The Chinese by the way are not encumbered by such syndromes.

What appears to have happened is that this syndrome has affected our mental ability to conceptualise. We see things on the straight and narrow. We accept wisdoms handed down to us by our elders as the gospel truth.

Blinded by sentiment

We do not see that things can be seen and interpreted in many
alternative ways. We feel we have the monopoly on truth; we therefore think that we are right all the time and other people are wrong all the time. Witness the way we see religion for example.

We think that we as Muslims are right and other people who profess other religions are wrong, all the time.

We need to cry for thinking that we can and have doctored the way the people think and do things. We have been intimidating the people with what they can read or write or think and do.

We seem to be saying "you can think anything, do anything, write
anything so long as it does not criticise or condemn the government".

Soul-searching and resuscitating is not or should not be about
pointing accusing fingers at some bogeys. That would be a most
negative thing to do. It would be better for us to be open-minded and be able to identify our own strengths and weaknesses.

We improve upon our strengths and dump our weaknesses. Mainly we must be able to develop the awareness that we have both the strengths and weaknesses in the first place.

To illustrate, the NEP has proved many time over as a failed strategy for our socio-economic advancement.. Let us be aware of this in the first place and move on seeking other ways with better chance of success.

How about secularizing the Malay mind? It might make for a good start for we can see many of the don'ts, can'ts, musn'ts dissipating into the wind.

In the meantime, here we are in the early days of a new year. We should begin by realising that whatever 'smart' moves we had undertaken all this while have not really been that smart after all.

The joke is on us. Everybody says so ? the liberated Malays, the
non-Malays, our neighbors and the rest of the international
community. Only those of us basking in our closed mind and benefiting from the profits of the status quo say it's alright.

Happy New Year all the same and here's hoping this year we can get a good perspective as to what propagating a good mertabat really means.
It's long overdue.

In the meantime, cry my beloved Malay soul.


Jean-Luc Godard - "To be or not to be. That's not really a
question."

then we should support DAP,PKR.PAS
new goverment might bring us good news.

tangsn... new government? yes, possibly good news. But its also a double edged blade. The current government HEARS our voices, but alas doesn't LISTEN. Well, some do, at least the MPSp has agreed to do research before pointing fingers to the swiftlet industry;

http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...733&sec=central


Here are some of yesterdays newsclippings about the Perhilitan workshop. Also a suggestion of a One-Stop-Center for permits/licenses. I have no idea how this will be done, especially when different PBT's will definitely want to handle the issue on their own;

http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...699&sec=central

http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...184&sec=central


The Bandar Melawati BH's will be facing some gusty wind due to issues brought up by residents/other shoplot owners;

http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...392&sec=central


Dear Cergau, for Malays like us who are aware and realize that the real culprits destroying not only our kinsmen but also our nation... are our own brothers... it is our duty to enlighten others. For people like us who have access to information & relevant sources... it is our duty to inform the uninformed. That 50 plus years of the same rule has given rise to a new form of feudalism. The young are confused and solely seek the pleasures of life, the old mere puppets. It is more or less the same for the Indian community.

An old bugger (actually he was my former prof & dean) once told me about his concept of 'ilmu';

"There's data, information, knowledge & wisdom. You collect data compile and translate it into information. You analyze the information and you get knowledge. How, when & where you use that knowledge... wisdom. Until you get there you will need guidance, that's my role. Starting from tomorrow, you will be dogs. When i say do, you do. When i say sit, you sit."

I hated the old man's guts since he was one hell of an arrogant b*st**d... but will be forever indebted for his teachings & guidance. Maybe this is the reason i always propose to associations to do surveys of their members. >.<

(sorry talking nonsense, suddenly got flash backs during student years)

'
Please read Animal Farm and you will understand that the opposition may be even worst than the present Government when in power. "MAY" is a question mark???????? and what's if not and even worst????

For at least the BN is one big family although the Umno is the head of the family and they now know their past mistakes but the opposition have 3 heads.............all have their own agendas then, just think what will really happen if in power....no sense of direction and this may lead us to what are happening to many of the African and Arab countries. Even as we talk, they, the opposition already have problem understanding each other............. the raayat have shown the BN Government what the raayat truly wanted and it is up to the PM and his team to correct the wrongs and do the corrections before it's too late.

Sorry that I again posted Politic matter in this forum for swiftlets but then, it's good if the relevant authorities read these and take the right approach toward solving all the wrongs and allow us, the hardworking minorities Malaysians make a clean and honest living. IshaAllah

---

Added on October 31, 2009, 2:39 pmHere are some of yesterdays newsclippings about the Perhilitan workshop. Also a suggestion of a One-Stop-Center for permits/licenses. I have no idea how this will be done, especially when different PBT's will definitely want to handle the issue on their own
qouted : dunsuntutmybuntut

One stop centre means that we need not go to all the PBT bodies but to one centre and let they solve it on their own. We provide all documentation to one centre only as these will save us time and problem with different PBT departments. Inspection if required, will be one time affair with all departments officers going to your BH to do inspection all at once and not each PBT at their own time. All departments will furnish the One Stop Centre with the requirement and you will only need to fill the forms provided by the one stop centre.

These inspection have been carried out in Pekan where all relevant departments like the bomba, health, haiwan, perhilitan and MDK all have their officers attended the inspection together but in Pekan, each will send you their approval to you and what one stop centre mean that all report shall go to the one stop centre which represent all departments.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Oct 31 2009, 02:39 PM

We don't have an alternative to BN in this country. It's not like in many other Western countries where there are essentially 2 strong parties, each a credible alternative and each with lots of experience running the country, either alone or in coalition with another party.

Here, we have BN. And we have the jokers.

I see nothing wrong talking about politics here, the bigger picture of the industry does involve gov policies, and its them politicians that make up the government. Either way, let it be BN or Opposition (opposition here seems to be the opposite in some states), as long as they facilitate the industry... then its ok with me.

If the one-stop center will be as what you mentioned, then it would be a good thing!!! I just hope it won't be another corrupt set up... since most of the agencies involved are kinda infamous for such practices.

Here's todays;

http://thestar.com.my/metro/story.asp?file...006&sec=central

Batang Berjuntai area. Still got people thinking that swiftlets shit on cars. And still highlighting errant BH owners. Same old same old, trust me, this new guideline will definitely cause town BH's to be eradicated at this rate. In the past 2 months there has been more than a dozen articles about the swiftlet industry in mainstream papers... only 2-3 in a positive light. I believe some parties are aiming something or have an agenda. It just isn't by coincidence. (ok-ok, maybe i'm over reacting thinking about some conspiracy theory). Anyway, how can they blame its the swiftlet industry that caused people to move out, when the most of the time swiftlet farms are made in washed out tak laku development areas to begin with? Come on la, everybody knows Bestari Jaya is just a joke, existing only because a Jawa had a dream. I passed by the old road that day and saw the Yu Hue Swiftlet. Also saw the Selangor Fruit Valley... which looked more like an African savanna.

I heard Datuk Beh presented the Kedah guideline, is this true? Does anyone have a copy?

I can imagine many, many people who dislike living, or working, or operating businesses where swiftlets in the hundreds breed. But I cannot imagine them being in any way cohesive and organized enough to willfully sabotage the industry. This is what I said earlier about how there will be no town BHs anymore in a few years. The collective dissatisfaction of the general population is irresistably strong and one politicians have to react to. Many little voices will come to a booming chorus. The days of the town BH are numbered.

---

Added on October 31, 2009, 4:47 pmMany of you are still in a state of complete denial. It is interesting for me to see this. It reminds me of the Jews who stayed on in the ghettos while they were transported truck-by-truck to the concentration camps. Many will not believe what they heard of those camps. Like many of you, there is something in their brains that stops them from recognizing the blindingly obvious. And to take action.

This post has been edited by kotmj: Oct 31 2009, 04:50 PM

Haha, well i did think of a conspiracy theory. For all you know, the culprits might even be from within the industry itself... people who have interests in land or eco-parks, or those parties that look forward to opportunities to monopoly certain areas in the industry. who knows eh? that is the way the country works, can't use it... break it or disable it. that's how political parties rule.

Anyways, what dissatisfies me is the lack of proper information the general public has. Second is why are they still errant BH owners that disregard the rules... what the hell are the associations doing? Highlighting the bad ones over and over is just unfair, and definitely biased. Whether or not town BH's days are numbered is still to be seen. If a proper guideline catering for existing town BH's is enforced, there shouldn't be a problem as long as the delivery system is transparent and it really addresses the owners plus community issues. Lets just hope errant town BH owners will listen.
(oh by the way, i don't have a town BH. only a 30x80 3 story stand alone unit on agri land >.<)

I do wish some association or merchant association would do a paid documentary of the industry. You know, like those paid commercials. I haven't seen any Discovery or National Geographic documentary or articles about 'swiftlet sanctuary services' (using bro West Wing's term)... and so far the NGO's in Malaysia... namely the MNS, the FOE or SAM know nuts about the industry. They can't even provide the proper data... and on the other hand so can't the industry. We need, research, we need surveys and samplings. I plead to the associations with many members with town BH's... please do data collection and do a survey on your members. We must be prepared with information in hand, thats the least we can do.

The Jew metaphor, just isn't the same comparing those situations. But i thank bro kotmj, the Jews had no choice... whether they believed it or not the end result would still mean genocide. We, the swiftlet sanctuary providers on the other hand do have a choice, react, respond and as bro kotmj said... take action in any capacity we have.

This post has been edited by dunsuntutmybuntut: Oct 31 2009, 05:26 PM

I would love if the National Geographic do a documentary on us providing Swiftlets Sanctuaries as they may even paid us to ensure that the swiftlets population increases and that we must ensure the nests are only harvested after fledgling. Also that the swiftlets remain free and wild and no one should domesticate the wild free flying swiftlets.

Only thru this method that the world know about us and would help us to protect the species from harm and destruction......... that all town's BHs be gazetted as protected swiftlets sanctuaries............well, I can dream, can't I??????????

thats a dream i share as well bro West Wing. That is why i over and over state we must do research, we must prove the statements wrong... we can shove the research data to international organizations to attract conservation interests... well, among others la.

Mr West Wing,

You should contact the natitional geographic to done documentary on your BH.
they will happy to get the documentary done but you have to contribute one of your BH for them to study.


This post has been edited by tangsn: Nov 1 2009, 06:42 AM