ya i studying law in mmu. I thinking whether i should transfer to other college and start all over again my LLB. I already search online some big firms and that why i said majority of them from BVC and CLP but not from local universities that already obtained CLP exemption. If there is no different between BVC and local graduate, why so many ppl go for BVC?

The bvc/bptc offers better training for would be lawyers obviously...and some law firms regard those who have done the BVC as better prepared for pupillage. Firms like Azmi & Assoc (according to their website) pay those who have completed the BVC higher than others. Some firms like to have a mix of pupils who have done everything, in order for them to share their experiences.

But everything boils down to your ability and passion of course.

erm...is it very hard to get bptc offers in UK?what are the criteria they are looking at?

Because they can afford it ad it looks nicer on your name card plus of course different kinda training. I'm not saying that there's no diff on the training side, I meant those who have already graduated when they started chambering, there's not much diff because end of the day it all depends on the individual. AND other local uni except UM offered LLB not too long ago. I don't know how they trained them locally but BVC press more on advocacy skills and practical stuffs. You've started your course in MMU, if you think it's worth it to waste your time and money to transfer. Why not? People do tend to hire foreign grad because of their exposure, but if u think ull become a partner sooner because you are a BVC holder, think again. Honestly, I don't know bout others but most big/medium firms that I've encountered, chambies get paid the same whether they are bvc, clp or local grad. You get more only if you have a postgrad.

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Added on December 5, 2010, 1:21 amIt depends on where you are planning to go. Say if you graduated from Cardiff's LLB, easier to get placing in Cardiff. You have to be very wise when choosing your first choice. On a safe side, ICSL (City Law School) offers plenty, so if you apply to them as first choice, high chances that you'll get it.

This post has been edited by Folio: Dec 5 2010, 01:25 AM

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Added on December 5, 2010, 1:21 am

It depends on where you are planning to go. Say if you graduated from Cardiff's LLB, easier to get placing in Cardiff. You have to be very wise when choosing your first choice. On a safe side, ICSL (City Law School) offers plenty, so if you apply to them as first choice, high chances that you'll get it.

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erm..so do the institutions matter when you are applying for BPTC?i saw the admisson criteria on cardiff's website and i is clearly written on it that i have to be a registered member of one of the four inns,what does that mean?i am really confusing now~ can anyone just clarify for me the whole process of being called to bar in UK?what is the diff between LPC and BPTC?which qualification is recognised in malaysia and singapore?thanks a lot for any reply!

This post has been edited by minshuen: Dec 5 2010, 01:43 PM

I actually not really agree what u said because I found out that first batch of UKM law students graduated in 1990. (UKM) LLB programme in UiTM started on 1978. (UiTM) IIUM law programme started on 1983.(IIUM) Is it 20 years consider a short period? If compare to UK university, definitely 20 years consider a short period. Besides that, I think that 15 years experience in legal practice already eligible to become a partner of law firm. However, this is not what I saw in the reality. In Malaysia, majority partners come from BVC and CLP but not local uni. Thus, what I concern is whether my future will become like that if I continue study in MMU?

This post has been edited by twgang: Dec 5 2010, 05:45 PM

hi..

guys I was wondering if anybody knows the procedure to qualify as a Solicitor in Australia?

As i've mentioned earlier.. I'm studying in the UK currently...
Finishing my LLb course next June

I am adding Australia to my list of options..

I'm planning to be a solicitor in melbourne or it's surrounding areas..
not too far out more towards City..

anybody knows how the process is like?
and what do i need to do to qualify..
is it tough to get a job there as a malaysian?

anybody with experience?


thank you in advance

______________

oh I'm just gonna state here.. getting a Training Contract here in the Uk is very very tough =s
I can't believe I'm saying this.. but so far I've applied to 2 law firms..
i failed one on the NRT tests... =s
the other one no reply..

that's why I'm thinking about other options..
CLP -> last option

looks like ppl are not Sh*tting when they say its tough to get TCs in UK

This post has been edited by KiyoshiJoz: Dec 9 2010, 01:42 AM

You are just stereotyping. For the fact that you are still studying, you wouldnt actually know what it's like in practical reality world. You have to at least think outside the box. Not everyone can survive the practice (do a research on that). the number of graduates from local uni are relatively small as compared to those abroad. Yes, it started 20 yrs ago or whatever but how many graduated annually during those days? Im in this so-called big firm and I've seen good lawyer from local uni and I'm pretty sure if they do stay in practice, they will be promoted soon enough. I don't see any diff between myself and any local graduates in the firm. It all depends on your working attitude. You work for your future and your qualification wouldnt affect anything. It doesnt matter whether if you are a first class oxford grad, you wouldn't go anywhere if you suck. But if you have the money and time to waste, better transfer now before it's too late because with such mindset you might regret later.

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Added on December 12, 2010, 1:04 amYes, you need to be admitted to one of the four inns before you start you course. Not to worry about the inns, you will have a place eventually if you have gotten a place in bar school.

BVC - 1 year - recognised by msian admission board so can skip CLP.
LPC - 1 year + 2 years training contract - recognised only upon admission to the rolls in UK which is after 2 years of training contract. If you failed to obtain a TC after 1 year LPC course, you still need to sit for CLP in msia. Unless if you really want to practice in UK, no harm trying but make sure you get your TC before you start you LPC or there's a possible risk for wasting the whole LPC.



This post has been edited by Folio: Dec 12 2010, 01:04 AM

Yes, you need to be admitted to one of the four inns before you start you course. Not to worry about the inns, you will have a place eventually if you have gotten a place in bar school.

BVC - 1 year - recognised by msian admission board so can skip CLP.
LPC - 1 year + 2 years training contract - recognised only upon admission to the rolls in UK which is after 2 years of training contract. If you failed to obtain a TC after 1 year LPC course, you still need to sit for CLP in msia. Unless if you really want to practice in UK, no harm trying but make sure you get your TC before you start you LPC or there's a possible risk for wasting the whole LPC.

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thanks for the reply!erm..are you a lawyer?may i know what qualification u hold?

I absolutely agreed to what u said that future will depend on working attitude because there are too many lawyers in malaysia now. So, do u mind to tell me which legal firm u currently working in? Izzit majority partners of ur legal firm from local university? As u mentioned earlier, u had saw good lawyer from local uni, may i know which local university they from?

I recently do some research on which route I should go after I graduate from mmu but I cant even get any information because few lawyers that I know all graduated from overseas. Hence, can u provide me some info that which area of law i should go for after i graduate? Thank you.

This post has been edited by twgang: Dec 12 2010, 11:08 PM

"which route"?

on another note, i dun see how anyone can provide u with info on which area of law you "shud go for", especially at your stage...

I'm in one of the S. I don't know what you like so I've no idea which area you should go into. If you have no idea what you want in life, maybe you should start thinking rather than checking out who holds what qualification.

it's way too early to worry about that. you MIGHT have some idea when you start chambering. but in all likelihood, you would require a few years of working before you will be able to make a decision.

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Added on December 14, 2010, 5:07 pmthere are plenty of local grads in big firms. have you seriously looked online? which firms have you been tracking?

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Added on December 14, 2010, 5:21 pmdear, graduates from local uni usually dont get into private practice. they have a very bright future in government service. go check out the qualifications of the top ppl in the AG's chambers. their min presence in big firms is not because the big firm dont want to employ them but because they feel that gov service will take them further. trust me, if you can work hard and have the right attitude, you will get into the firm you are targeting.



This post has been edited by Eli: Dec 14 2010, 05:21 PM

Because some practising lawyer told me that better for me to choose now which area of law that I interested and focus on it during my study.

ya there are plenty of local grads in big firms but most of them onli a legal assistant. Majority partners from big or medium size firm were graduated from overseas. Local graduate onli consist of small portion. UM is onli the exception.

ya local graduate definitely have a very bright future in government but i think this onli for malay which I am a chinese. If I'm not mistaken, top ppl in AG chambers graduated from UM right?

What I concern is because I currently studying in MMU, I feel that the future like limited if continue study in mmu, honestly speaking until now nobody can prove to me that local graduate can success unless study in UM.

This post has been edited by twgang: Dec 14 2010, 07:35 PM

I suggest that you go to malaysianbar.org.my, search for BC statistics. It will more or less answers your question. As I said earlier, during those time, foreign grads ratio higher than local. That's why. You are such an early stage, don't have to worry what you want to specialize in. Choose a subject that you really have interested in. Different ppl has diff views, that was how I did it the last time because I know in reality, I wouldnt be practising in that area so I'm equipped with additional knowledge. Don't listen to others lah, it's your future make the decision yourself. There are thousands of practising around and their views are all diff.

1) Because some practising lawyer told me that better for me to choose now which area of law that I interested and focus on it during my study- I still disagree with this statement, the subjects that you take in uni have no bearing on your future professional life. they only serve as general knowledge. for example if you take company law as a subject in uni, it will give you some general background as to company law. but it does not mean that failing to take company law means you can never be a corporate and commercial lawyer. 99% of what you really need is what you will learn while working. if u have the drive and the attitude, you can pick up areas that you failed to study during university. the area that i am in, i didnt even remotely touch in uni.

2)ya there are plenty of local grads in big firms but most of them onli a legal assistant. Majority partners from big or medium size firm were graduated from overseas. i disagree. in big firms, they have a mixture of overseas grads (UK, NZ, Aust, Singapore), london external grads, UM grads and grads from other local uni (example IIU etc) as partners. i'm telling you, NO ONE looks down on local universities. however, having said that, big firms have no problem with ANY uni grads in so long as they can speak and write good english. and your english seems fine.

3) What I concern is because I currently studying in MMU, I feel that the future like limited if continue study in mmu, honestly speaking until now nobody can prove to me that local graduate can success unless study in UM. it has already been proven. u are just not listening. but it's your life. if you wanna do something silly like change uni midway of your career it's up to u. just remember that u are delaying your own career path.

Below are the qualification of partners from 5 big firms in Malaysia:

Zaid Ibrahim & Co
5 from IIUM, 1 from UKM, 2 from UM, others all from overseas or CLP (total=38)

Lee Hishammuddin Allen & Gledhill
1 from IIUM, 2 from UM, others all from overseas or CLP (total=22)

Skrine
3 from UM, others all from overseas or CLP (total=38)

Shook Lin & Bok
all from overseas or CLP (total=26)

Shearn Delamore & Co
1 from IIUM, 2 from UM, others all from overseas or CLP (total=46)

*Pls take note that few partners from IIUM had continued their LLM at University of Cambridge or Harvard.
(Pls correct me if I have make any mistake)

Actually I had searched many legal firms beside of this 5 big firms but the answer is around the same. Hence, anymore legal firm that I required to look into??

Regarding the issue that which area of law I should concentrate, I concur that I will only find out when I come into chambering. Thank you for the advice provided.

You just don't get it don't you? Foreign grads during those times are relatively higher than local grads + the ratio of people leaving practise, that's why you see more foreign grad in their list. If you have time to actually count (yes, I'm sure u did count ONE BY ONE), please go to msian bar site to check the statistic on lawyers joining and leaving practise. I'm from one of the firms you mentioned above and I've plenty of colleagues from local uni, in which if they can survive for at least 7 years and above in practice, they will become a partner as well. On a side note, one of the criteria of being a good lawyer is logical thinking, no offence but from what I see, you really need to work on that.
PS. Since you are so free, can you count and list down the LAs as well?

Sry I not understand what statistic you want me to look into. Can u pls provide the link here?

I believe that he is referring to this

http://www.malaysianbar.org.my/general_not...stics_2009.html


Further, I wish to state that at the end of the day, in legal practice, it all comes down to you as an individual. Lest that you won't get a partnership, this is not the appropriate time for you to consider for a partnership in large firms. Not everyone wants to be a partner in a large firm and not everyone wants to remain in active practice.

While you're in MMU, just do your best and see where it takes you. Your worries will not make you a better lawyer.