Discussion doesn't have to be vitrolic, calm down friends.

Though, my personal two cents is that Stashaway's annualized return infographic can be very misleading to some extent?

Their numbers are very optimistic and not very representative of real use cases, and their methodology is not fully clear, there's plenty of way to fuzz the numbers to make it look a lot better than it is.

For example, in the returns infographic, it does not take into factors such as
1. Stashaway Fees
2. Reoptimization
3. Deposit/Withdrawal timings
4. USD/MYR forex returns

Most of their returns are still from the initial inception bullruns and lucky successful reoptimizations, on the flip side, anyone who's been here from late 2020 onwards would still be looking at a sea of red for god knows when to come, so I wouldn't be surprised if tension runs high.

Ultimately, fund performance within a 2-3 year window are far from a useful judge of a portfolio performance - seeing that the average investor here probably has a horizon of 20-30 years.

My take is always judge Stashaway for everything surrounding it except their performance - is their fees good? Is their investing philosophy sound and aligned to your interest? Would the alternative to Stashaway (to you) is just not investing at all?

When I evaluated it for 2 years, I've found Stashaway incompatible with me - I love how easy it is to set up a reoccuring deposit and forget about it - the truly "Stashaway" nature of investing. It's great that to some people that would have just let their currency rot in their back for 0.25% interest, Stashaway is incredibly straight forward and encourages "set it up and forget".

But, I dislike their reoptimization and stock-pickiness nature, their crazy KWEB sector tilting saga (which was not indicated to me that this is going to be a thing before I started their portfolio), their slow deposit to investing period, the MYR->USD conversion process, their almost misleading fee structure, their app changes and fuzzing of words and numbers during bearish times, the messy MYR/USD return values, and fortunately for myself, I have access to alternative ways to invest in a fashion that's more aligned to what I have in mind.


But above all else, I do not judge them for their returns in a 2 year period out of my next 30 - that's just plain silly, in my opinion.

Discussion doesn't have to be vitrolic, calm down friends.

Though, my personal two cents is that Stashaway's annualized return infographic can be very misleading to some extent?

Their numbers are very optimistic and not very representative of real use cases, and their methodology is not fully clear, there's plenty of way to fuzz the numbers to make it look a lot better than it is.

For example, in the returns infographic, it does not take into factors such as
1. Stashaway Fees
2. Reoptimization
3. Deposit/Withdrawal timings
4. USD/MYR forex returns

Most of their returns are still from the initial inception bullruns and lucky successful reoptimizations, on the flip side, anyone who's been here from late 2020 onwards would still be looking at a sea of red for god knows when to come, so I wouldn't be surprised if tension runs high.

Ultimately, fund performance within a 2-3 year window are far from a useful judge of a portfolio performance - seeing that the average investor here probably has a horizon of 20-30 years.

My take is always judge Stashaway for everything surrounding it except their performance - is their fees good? Is their investing philosophy sound and aligned to your interest? Would the alternative to Stashaway (to you) is just not investing at all?

When I evaluated it for 2 years, I've found Stashaway incompatible with me - I love how easy it is to set up a reoccuring deposit and forget about it - the truly "Stashaway" nature of investing. It's great that to some people that would have just let their currency rot in their back for 0.25% interest, Stashaway is incredibly straight forward and encourages "set it up and forget".

But, I dislike their reoptimization and stock-pickiness nature, their crazy KWEB sector tilting saga (which was not indicated to me that this is going to be a thing before I started their portfolio), their slow deposit to investing period, the MYR->USD conversion process, their almost misleading fee structure, their app changes and fuzzing of words and numbers during bearish times, the messy MYR/USD return values, and fortunately for myself, I have access to alternative ways to invest in a fashion that's more aligned to what I have in mind.


But above all else, I do not judge them for their returns in a 2 year period out of my next 30 - that's just plain silly, in my opinion.

Discussion doesn't have to be vitrolic, calm down friends.

Though, my personal two cents is that Stashaway's annualized return infographic can be very misleading to some extent?

Their numbers are very optimistic and not very representative of real use cases, and their methodology is not fully clear, there's plenty of way to fuzz the numbers to make it look a lot better than it is.

For example, in the returns infographic, it does not take into factors such as
1. Stashaway Fees
2. Reoptimization
3. Deposit/Withdrawal timings
4. USD/MYR forex returns

Most of their returns are still from the initial inception bullruns and lucky successful reoptimizations, on the flip side, anyone who's been here from late 2020 onwards would still be looking at a sea of red for god knows when to come, so I wouldn't be surprised if tension runs high.

Ultimately, fund performance within a 2-3 year window are far from a useful judge of a portfolio performance - seeing that the average investor here probably has a horizon of 20-30 years.

My take is always judge Stashaway for everything surrounding it except their performance - is their fees good? Is their investing philosophy sound and aligned to your interest? Would the alternative to Stashaway (to you) is just not investing at all?

When I evaluated it for 2 years, I've found Stashaway incompatible with me - I love how easy it is to set up a reoccuring deposit and forget about it - the truly "Stashaway" nature of investing. It's great that to some people that would have just let their currency rot in their back for 0.25% interest, Stashaway is incredibly straight forward and encourages "set it up and forget".

But, I dislike their reoptimization and stock-pickiness nature, their crazy KWEB sector tilting saga (which was not indicated to me that this is going to be a thing before I started their portfolio), their slow deposit to investing period, the MYR->USD conversion process, their almost misleading fee structure, their app changes and fuzzing of words and numbers during bearish times, the messy MYR/USD return values, and fortunately for myself, I have access to alternative ways to invest in a fashion that's more aligned to what I have in mind.


But above all else, I do not judge them for their returns in a 2 year period out of my next 30 - that's just plain silly, in my opinion.

On average, real inflation eats FD rates for breakfast. Currently interest rates are relatively high while The Fed continues to raise interest rates, negatively affecting equity markets overall. 2023 still looks rather choppy and will certainly affect StashAway's performance across the board.

so whats the point of putting my current 10k  in savings in stash away

The optimistic answer is "So I don't miss the ride when it goes up - time in the market beats timing the market".

The pessimistic answer is "I have too much money, let's pay a portion of it to a fund manager regularly while I eat losses for the upcoming decade"

The thing is time in the market is something that people keep repeating without understanding anything about it. It means buy and hold. Which is not what SA is doing at all. They tikam buy random shit based on the overpaid fund managers they hired and then sell everything, only to repeat the process every year or so. Now what they're doing is called timing the market. Which is the exact opposite of what you want to be doing when investing long term. The reason why they're doing so is as you said in the second part, they're overpaid fund managers and they want to be seen doing something so they can justify their ripoff fees. In doing so, they lock in their bad bets and losses so you can never recover in the long term even if the market averages 10% returns per year over the coming decades. Do they really care? Not at all since their almost 1% fee keeps chugging along regardless of how poorly they perform.

Also time in the market almost always refers to investing passively and consistently in ETFs/mutual funds that track the S&P500 or the market as a whole. It doesn't mean randomly buying shit and expecting it to return money consistently, though those bets could pay off if you're Warren Buffett.

1stly there is no overpaid fund managers in SA 🤦‍♀️

The decision of asset allocation of SA it is based upon an investment committee in SA and headed by CIO

The only thing that is SA incurred is the platform management iinm it is run on AWS, the brokerage Saxo, local banks account with trustee which Pacific Trustee in Malaysia and other expenses like staff and rents

Which is why SA is able to take 50bps out of the minimum fees as their profit but yet still having losses even though running a billion dollar fund 🤦‍♀️ likely not now after the drawdown from KWEB

To me stashaway oversold on their capabilities and did not deliver.
They were also wrong in their bets.
Example of their marketing and how it differs to reality.
Also they tend to inflate the returns

I don't know how they manage to make the gains positive in the app despite it losing money.

so whats the point of putting my current 10k  in savings in stash away

In hopes of beating inflation over the long term.

Depreciation of Currency is SA Fault??
you invest with MYR,..you calculates your returns in MYR.

did SA portfolio loses your money if you follow what was in that image??

While I don't judge SA using short time period's performance, I disagree with using MYR to judge SA's performance.
SA converts your fund to USD before investing (except for Simple), so it only make sense to judge SA's performance using USD.

Otherwise, the performance is masked by currency fluctuations.

You can use MYR to see how much you will have at the end of the day, but to judge the performance, it should be in USD.

While I don't judge SA using short time period's performance, I disagree with using MYR to judge SA's performance.
SA converts your fund to USD before investing (except for Simple), so it only make sense to judge SA's performance using USD.

Otherwise, the performance is masked by currency fluctuations.

You can use MYR to see how much you will have at the end of the day, but to judge the performance, it should be in USD.

i have money in EPF,...
EPF has overseas investment
EPF gives out 5.35% ROI
i judge EPF returns in % it gives me

i have money in UT that invested in overseas markets with MYR
these UT returns is in %
i judge the UT returns in % it gives me

i have money in SA with MYR
SA invest in overseas
SA gives me returns in %
i judge SA returns in % it gives me.

Well, let's agree to disagree.
For me, if SA converts it to USD, and USD is the currency of the investments, to judge the investments' performance, we have to use the currency that those uses.

Your example of EPF & UT is not exactly equivalent.
EPF can invest in many different currencies. To judge the performance of those individual investment, you use the currency that those investments are using.
However, we don't get such visibility. We only see the MYR value. Thus we HAVE to judge EPF using the MYR value.

Same goes to UT.

I duno man….
My SA, syfe, ibkr, fsm all into sea water.

Want to blame SA… but generally market bad… but if dun scold SA, cannot also coz their perf is not what they preech…

Only thing doing good is my epf and ansb… but those number can be fake…. Or beutify…. Or just reserved drying up…. So yea…

I think the crisis is imminent. We just wait and see.

Cash is king for now