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 Aircon Discussion V3, Home Appliance

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SUSkimsim
post Jun 21 2015, 10:10 PM

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QUOTE(KuzumiTaiga @ Jun 21 2015, 04:36 PM)
Need help, can someone please recommend me a 2HP air conditioning unit? For living room. 30x18ft space. Daikin seems cheaper but will it eat up A WHOLE LOT MORE electricity compared to my old non inverter Panasonic 1Hp (used for small room)? Would appreciate shop recommendation too, location cheras kajang
*
Believe me Daikin 2hp inverter works well for u
KuzumiTaiga
post Jun 21 2015, 10:30 PM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 21 2015, 10:10 PM)
Believe me Daikin 2hp inverter works well for u
*
is it true that inverter air conds are not as cold as standard air cond? I think inverter is like RM800 more expensive than non-inverter right.

540square feet living room

This post has been edited by KuzumiTaiga: Jun 21 2015, 10:52 PM
SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 07:51 AM

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QUOTE(KuzumiTaiga @ Jun 21 2015, 10:30 PM)
is it true that inverter air conds are not as cold as standard air cond? I think inverter is like RM800 more expensive than non-inverter right.

540square feet living room
*
Ya quite big of the area.

You might consider for 2hp at least, inverter can allow you turn on more often.. Rather than non inverter for 3 hours only.

cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 08:01 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 07:51 AM)
Ya quite big of the area.

You might consider for 2hp at least, inverter can allow you turn on more often.. Rather than non inverter for 3 hours  only.
*
Non-inverter can turn on 3 hours only? laugh.gif


cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 08:05 AM

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QUOTE(greyshadow @ Jun 21 2015, 12:32 PM)
I got this pana non-inverter 1hp aircon in my room, 8 years already

last year got repair once for the compressor, replaced the capacitor or transformer thingy, as the technician claim the compressor wasn't working
refilled the gas as well.

then last night again the same thing, not cold at all, at it's the the hottest night of the year! doh.gif

I'm guessing must be the compressor again doh.gif
now thinking should I fork out few hundred just to repair & service it
or should I just throw this 8 years old unit away and go grab a new inverter type? hmm.gif

do the aircon men accept the used units as trade in? hmm.gif
*
Sometimes, it is not worthwhile to fix old problematic appliances.

Labour cost may be expensive, as well as you don't have warranty that after the fix, it will not be problematic.
Fixing a compressor or replacing compressor may cost a couple of hundred buck already, unless it is just replacing inexpensive part like capacitor etc, which just a simple fix, then different story.


SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 08:24 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 08:01 AM)
Non-inverter can turn on 3 hours only?  laugh.gif
*
That is the common sense on ppls who ever installed non inverter for turn on 3 hours only for when is hot weather or for show only laugh.gif

For more ppls who ever used Aircon very often deffinelty go for inverter lah... Ha ha
SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 08:27 AM

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When think for save a unit price than end out cant afford to pay much higher bill wow

2hp n above the current input watt really much higher at least 1600-1800w

This post has been edited by kimsim: Jun 22 2015, 08:28 AM
greyshadow
post Jun 22 2015, 08:38 AM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Jun 21 2015, 03:09 PM)
Usually for non inverter, the capacitor will be the first to fail especially if you set the temperature too near to ambient temperature.
And when you refill your gas, did you do the major service on the indoor unit or not? If you never do, then sure it will give you the same problem.
The temperature sensor are attached to the cooling coil in the indoor unit, so if it is very dirty, the cooling coil will be cool down very fast and shut the outdoor unit fast. To confirm on this, just check if the outdoor unit workong or not.
*
aiks... yeah, I set my aircons in both my room and my kids room to around 24C - 26C only
so far my kids room aircon already changed the capacitor twice already within a year blink.gif
this would be my second time changing capacitor for my room in a year, which I hope it is.
yeah, last time when they changed the capacitor, they refill the gas and service the indoor unit as well.

So if we were to set the temp to close to ambient temp then the capacitor will be blown easily?
but if we set too low, electricity bill gonna be high, set too high; higher chance for a blown capacitor?

I wonder if changing to the inverter type would solve this? or is it the same with all aircons? hmm.gif


SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 08:46 AM

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QUOTE(greyshadow @ Jun 22 2015, 08:38 AM)
aiks... yeah, I set my aircons in both my room and my kids room to around 24C - 26C only
so far my kids room aircon already changed the capacitor twice already within a year  blink.gif
this would be my second time changing capacitor for my room in a year, which I hope it is.
yeah, last time when they changed the capacitor, they refill the gas and service the indoor unit as well.

So if we were to set the temp to close to ambient temp then the capacitor will be blown easily?
but if we set too low, electricity bill gonna be high, set too high; higher chance for a blown capacitor?

I wonder if changing to the inverter type would solve this? or is it the same with all aircons? hmm.gif
*
Because you keep the compressor on & off too often then easily to damage the capacitor

Otherwise change to inverter even set to 27C still working as well
cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 08:47 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 08:24 AM)
That is the common sense on ppls who ever installed non inverter for turn on 3 hours only for when is hot weather or for show only laugh.gif

For more ppls who ever used Aircon very often deffinelty go for inverter lah... Ha ha
*
Ten of thousand of offices, shops are using non-inverter air-cond for more than 8~10 hours out there.
So they turn on 3 hours?
or they are stupid to install non-inverter?
No
Why?

Because there won't be much saving by using inverter air-cond in those environmenet, as people go in and out frequently that resulted loss of cool air frequently, and the air-cond won't able to achieve desired temp like 23c, whereby the advantage of inverter air-cond won't be significant.

Despite pages and pages explaining how inverter works, and how the saving come from, it seems still can get a grasp of the understanding on the inverter mechanism.

Inverter /= automatic save current.
It depended on how it works, and being used.

Undersize air-cond, room that can't properly heat insulated, or loss of heat, aka cool air can't properly contained within the room, you won't see the saving from inverter.
As when inverter is full blast or running 100% time, the electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.

Look at the label of electricity consumption of inverter compressor, the wattage needed by inverter is as same as non-inverter.
SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 08:51 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 08:47 AM)
Ten of thousand of offices, shops are using non-inverter air-cond for more than 8~10 hours out there.
So they turn on 3 hours?
or they are stupid to install non-inverter?
No
Why?

Because there won't be much saving by using inverter air-cond in those environmenet, as people go in and out frequently that resulted loss of cool air frequently, and the air-cond won't able to achieve desired temp like 23c, whereby the advantage of inverter air-cond won't be significant.

Despite pages and pages explaining how inverter works, and how the saving come from, it seems still can get a grasp  of the understanding on the inverter mechanism.

Inverter /= automatic save current.
It depended on how it works, and being used.

Undersize air-cond, room that can't properly heat insulated, or loss of heat, aka cool air can't properly contained within the room, you won't see the saving from inverter.
As when inverter is full blast or running 100% time, the electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.

Look at the label of electricity consumption of inverter compressor, the wattage needed by inverter is as same as non-inverter.
*
Office is never care about what Aircon are you usage since the air can keep that area as cold as possible.

Coz in office is earn money one.

Unlike home user may suffer on electric bill for monthly, nowadays everything has been increased, then still wanna worried about electric bill anymore..

laugh.gif

Different situation from ppls of views

You still never realized from non inverter change to inverter for monthly bills do you can save how much.

This post has been edited by kimsim: Jun 22 2015, 08:57 AM
SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 09:31 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 08:47 AM)
Ten of thousand of offices, shops are using non-inverter air-cond for more than 8~10 hours out there.
So they turn on 3 hours?
or they are stupid to install non-inverter?
No
Why?

Because there won't be much saving by using inverter air-cond in those environmenet, as people go in and out frequently that resulted loss of cool air frequently, and the air-cond won't able to achieve desired temp like 23c, whereby the advantage of inverter air-cond won't be significant.

Despite pages and pages explaining how inverter works, and how the saving come from, it seems still can get a grasp  of the understanding on the inverter mechanism.

Inverter /= automatic save current.
It depended on how it works, and being used.

Undersize air-cond, room that can't properly heat insulated, or loss of heat, aka cool air can't properly contained within the room, you won't see the saving from inverter.
As when inverter is full blast or running 100% time, the electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.

Look at the label of electricity consumption of inverter compressor, the wattage needed by inverter is as same as non-inverter.
*
Undersize air-cond, room that can't properly heat insulated, or loss of heat, aka cool air can't properly contained within the room, you won't see the saving from inverter.

As when inverter is full blast or running 100% time, the electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.

A: as for inverter should draw much more power consumption than non inverter, cause from inverter is offer to variable speed & capacity of cooling.

Normal 1hp inverter can able to achieve from 8500-12000 max Btu, is depend your fan & temperature preset.

Look at the label of electricity consumption of inverter compressor, the wattage needed by inverter is as same as non-inverter.

A: inverter have part loan after the temperature reaching may runs lower or slower speed of outdoor unit, even at night time the noise also keep as low than day time.



cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 09:33 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 08:51 AM)
Office is never care about what Aircon are you usage since the air can keep that area as cold as possible.

Coz in office is earn money one.

Unlike home user may suffer on electric bill for monthly, nowadays everything has been increased, then still wanna worried about electric bill anymore..

laugh.gif

Different situation from ppls of views

You still never realized from non inverter change to inverter for monthly bills do you can save how much.
*
Offices space consume even more electricity, with most corporate environment are cost saving minded nowadays, every opportunity that they can save cost, they will do

That's why I said, still can't get a grasp how inverter works.

Inverter does save you electricity when being used in desired condition, but it is not "automatically" give you the saving.

Look at the label on the compressor or spec of inverter compressor, does it stated inverter compressor consume 30% or 50% less than non-inverter?
The answer is no.


SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 09:40 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 09:33 AM)
Offices space consume even more electricity, with most corporate environment are cost saving minded nowadays, every opportunity that they can save cost, they will do

That's why I said, still can't get a grasp how inverter works.

Inverter does save you electricity when being used in desired condition, but it is not "automatically" give you the saving.

Look at the label on the compressor or spec of inverter compressor, does it stated inverter compressor consume 30% or 50% less than non-inverter?
The answer is no.
*
Just remember what I said inverter have part load.
Non inverter is fixed speed there is never reduce the power consumption an even the temperature pre-set are reached..

The only works as on & off, but for non inverter would more accurate on & off very often is due to raining day and night time after 2am to next morning.

When is day time from the non inverter is never works as on & off unless is set to 28C ha ha

Compare to 1hp below
If consider part load as low as 450w per hour vs fixed speed as normal input watt as 800w they Is between the big gap.

This post has been edited by kimsim: Jun 22 2015, 09:42 AM
cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 09:48 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 09:31 AM)
Undersize air-cond, room that can't properly heat insulated, or loss of heat, aka cool air can't properly contained within the room, you won't see the saving from inverter.

As when inverter is full blast or running 100% time, the electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.

A: as for inverter should draw much more power consumption than non inverter, cause from inverter is offer to variable speed & capacity of cooling.

Normal 1hp inverter can able to achieve from 8500-12000 max Btu, is depend your fan & temperature preset.

Look at the label of electricity consumption of inverter compressor, the wattage needed by inverter is as same as non-inverter.

A: inverter have part loan after the temperature reaching may runs lower or slower speed of outdoor unit, even at night time the noise also keep as low than day time.
*
Inverter still need to run at 100% to cool down the room when the room is not cold enough or far from the desired temperature.

Tell me, when the room temperature is 28c, while the preset temperature tell the air-cond to achieve 18c,
what the compressor will do?

Run at partial load? your room will forever not cool enough, as at partial load, the coolness delivered also becoming partial.
The compressor need to run at 100% rpm to cool down the room in this situation.
Run at 100% rpm --> electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.




SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 09:52 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 09:48 AM)
Inverter still need to run at 100% to cool down the room when the room is not cold enough or far from the desired temperature.

Tell me, when the room temperature is 28c, while the preset temperature tell the air-cond to achieve 18c,
what the compressor will do?

Run at partial load? your room will forever not cool enough, as at partial load, the coolness delivered also becoming partial.
The compressor need to run at 100% rpm to cool down the room in this situation.
Run at 100% rpm --> electricity consumption is as same as non-inverter.
*
That is why an inverter is offer for R410a gas only
To help the faster & lower temperatures are maintenace on 24-25c only.

Just try install Daikin GA inverter you may feel different
cherroy
post Jun 22 2015, 09:52 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 09:40 AM)
Just remember what I said inverter have part load.
Non inverter is fixed speed there is never reduce the power consumption an even the temperature pre-set are reached..

The only works as on & off, but for non inverter would more accurate on & off very often is due to raining day and night time after 2am to next morning.

When is day time from the non inverter is never works as on & off unless is set to 28C ha ha

Compare to 1hp below
If consider part load as low as 450w per hour vs fixed speed as normal input watt as 800w they Is between the big gap.
*
Another wrong understanding.

Non-inverter shut down the compressor when the preset temperature is reached, this is where the power consumption being reduced, but this is poor compared to inverter mechanism of reduce the rpm of the compressor.

Inverter doesn't run partial load all the time, it depended on the situation.
When inverter sense big difference between the room temperature vs its pre-set desired temperature, it needs to run at 100%.
SUSkimsim
post Jun 22 2015, 09:57 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jun 22 2015, 09:52 AM)
Another wrong understanding.

Non-inverter shut down the compressor when the preset temperature is reached, this is where the power consumption being reduced, but this is poor compared to inverter mechanism of reduce the rpm of the compressor.

Inverter doesn't run partial load all the time, it depended on the situation.
When inverter sense big difference between the room temperature vs its pre-set desired temperature, it needs to run at 100%.
*
Ok ok.. Nowadays still available for non inverter model..
Wait one more day is totally phase out then you would realize the inverter more accurate and works lower power consumption at all
SUSleonhart88
post Jun 22 2015, 10:05 AM

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QUOTE(kimsim @ Jun 22 2015, 09:57 AM)
Ok ok.. Nowadays still available for non inverter model..
Wait one more day is totally phase out then you would realize the inverter more accurate and works lower power consumption at all
*
non inverter will exist forever la.
SUSsupersound
post Jun 22 2015, 10:08 AM

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QUOTE(greyshadow @ Jun 22 2015, 08:38 AM)
aiks... yeah, I set my aircons in both my room and my kids room to around 24C - 26C only
so far my kids room aircon already changed the capacitor twice already within a year  blink.gif
this would be my second time changing capacitor for my room in a year, which I hope it is.
yeah, last time when they changed the capacitor, they refill the gas and service the indoor unit as well.

So if we were to set the temp to close to ambient temp then the capacitor will be blown easily?
but if we set too low, electricity bill gonna be high, set too high; higher chance for a blown capacitor?

I wonder if changing to the inverter type would solve this? or is it the same with all aircons? hmm.gif
*
Capacitor is store store enough of charge to energize the outdoor unit.
By changing to inverter, indeed it will solve this issue.

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