what EO u guys recommend for Persona? Going to do my 70k km service soon

first of all, oils have fully SYNTHETIC, not SYNCHRONIZE

20l/100km = 5km/l, that's even worse than my fuel consumption for Sepang track day (about 5.5km/l)
are you sure you're measuring correctly, such as using fuelly.com , and are your tires having proper air pressure?
consider doing another threebond throttle body cleaning, and after done that, use a lighter viscosity engine oil. (i personally don't prefer change oil then do throttle body cleaning as the cleaning agents may linger around and compromise your engine oil)

Depends on what you can afford really. Budget wise?

This post has been edited by shinjite: Jun 1 2015, 05:13 PM

bro kindly pm me

sorry for the typo error on the Fully Syn..

based on your advice, i should do it now or wait until my next service?as i still have 7k due for next service?

your call really. if you really hate the current oil and have the budget to go for a new one (and oil filter), why not?

you can consider it as an expensive engine flush or so.

u mean the oil suction using the machine?
i prefer manual open screw and drain then....it drain more completely compare to suction.
seems like RM15 onwards everywhere ya....actually the job is just to open screw...drain ...and screw back....

And also the oil filter wrench.

The suction one more complete because they use after draining.
Last year I can still get rm10 (without suction) in Shah Alam.

oh really?
i tried before have one shop they use suction machine, suck from the oil dip stick hole.
have different technique?

and that cost us RM15 in less than 15 minute?
we are in high income nation now....lol

Here in my area cost rm10.

where ur location?

Oh.. I don't know too many shops that handle old cars like that. Maybe you can start your own post somewhere and wait for someone with experience to reply you.

- Well, I consider temperature and pressure has some form of significance since they are indirectly related to oil shearing. The stability of the oil has an effect on the cars performance no? But I guess on normal days you'd never reach that level of oil fatigue compared to track days.

- UOA is good but not everyone is going to fork out RM200+ everytime just to analyse their used oils. I for one am too lazy to collect and too broke to send.

- Well, TUV tests are as stringent if not more than API. Whilst API has more followings, TUV is respectable in their own right so to me if an oil is TUV certified I'm perfectly ok that it's not API certified. Either or will work for me.

- that's the thing with oil temps and pressure: that's no different than old common knowledge of viscosity = protection.
which evidently in today's even stricter tests/standards and direction towards lower viscosity oils, (0w16 anyone?) such knowledge is no longer applicable, or at least, the "be all end all" towards determining an outcome. (such as low viscosity = low protection)
to iterate again: i'm not saying oil temperature/pressure is something to be ignored; rather, similarly to viscosity, it is no longer the only factor in determining an engine oil's performance.

- if an oil have higher temperature and pressure, is however ABLE to cope with track day performance, does not shear and have very minimal wear under many MANY laps of track day performance.
is it still bad?

vs an oil that have much lower temps and pressure, however sheared/become watery or thick like sludge after maybe a track day.
would you still use this oil? but how do you know it doesn't shear/fail in engine protection solely based on oil temps and protection?

bear in mind the cost is usd 25, if we can have shared shipping, we can bring the more expensive shipping fees much lower.
of course, if the local labs step up and have better offerings, we can potentially lower the cost further. unfortunately i just gave up on my search so if there's anyone out there who can pick up where i left off that would be awesome shinjite

- here's the thing with TUV, i don't know many (if any) EO that certifies with them!
from the top of my head i only remembered liqui moly (being german and all lol) has that logo...
https://www.certipedia.com/search?utf8=%E2%...en&q=liqui+moly
https://www.tuev-sued.de/industry_and_consu...ts/certificates

maybe i am searching it wrong?

just *MAYBE* you're mistaken with the ACEA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Auto...ers_Association
THAT is their european body that deals with EO (among other things) and unfortunately for that, i am unable to find a public directory which allows queries like the TUV/API.

Bahau (negeri sembilan).

Listen, listen, listen.

Shell has a plant in Qatar called the Pearl Gas-to-Liquids facility. The only company in the world to begin large-scale production of base oils from natural gas.

Why Qatar?
They have more NG than crude; so there.

Whats a base oil?
All engine oil manufacturers start with a base oil from ExxonMobil. Why? Only Exxon has the scale to be able to supply base oil. So all the tiny manufacturers buy base oil and then add additives to make their proprietary blend; i.e. Prince, StopOil, etc.
Base oils are made from derivatives of crude oil. Derivatives are cracked and recombined molecularly which is where the word 'synthetic' comes from; as the reconstituted oil bears almost no molecular relation to crude oil.

So Shell Pearl??
Shell is creating synthetic base oil from natural gas derivatives; which is a cleaner fossil fuel with much less contaminants as its a gas. The resultant reconstituted base oil has much lower foreign particles than synthetics from a crude base.

So....
A much cleaner oil than one derived from crude oil.
Forget about UOA. Shell's PurePlus (brand name) engine oils are like distilled vs mineral water. Mineral water tastes great; but distilled water has zero, and I mean zero, suspended solids. Mineral water has around 60-80 ppm solids (0.06-8 g/L) but there is a difference in taste right?

And then....
You just can't beat it; scientifically. PurePlus just launched last week by SHell Malaysia. Pennzoil is owned by Shell so they might bring it in soon. But in the mean time; nothing is gonna beat that stuff.

*I do not work for Shell; I just like scientifically solid arguments

P.S Some facts that you might not have heard.
- Back in the day, Formula ONe's 12 teams, 11 supplied by ExxonMobil (even those with other oil companies as sponsor). Each team has a fuel engineer with a 10*12ft spectrometer which can tell the engineer who drove the car after each lap, based on oil analysis. The only company besides Mobil? Shell (you can guess the team).
- So what about F1? True cutting-edge auto tech cuts it teeth in F1. To put it simply, only Castrol, Shell, Exxon have the resources to be able to research their oils from the base oil upwards. Almost all other companies just buy off-the-shelf (Exxon) base oil to blend with additives.

lol'd

but anyways, i've been waiting for UOA's for ages from BITOG, iinm they already had them (didn't really follow up/dig around) as pennzoil/shell pureplus had been a hot topic for the past year ish (notice the first page and some of my discussions about pureplus/NG)

now base oil:
not all, and ExxonMobil, while being among the largest supplier, is not the sole supplier of crude oil/base stocks.
for example, motul's large usage of esters, require minimal to no crude oil

look up on what are esters and you'd be surprise hehe

try to dig up some of my previous postings as i was hyping it like hell back then.
didn't really have the chance to play with it as they don't offer in 0w20

Synthetics of X % PAO/Esters >> Synthetics of X % gas-to-liquid base oil >> Synthetics of X % of conventional base oils , no ?

Note: whereby X > 50