Bro, ideally yes. But in real life, some of us bring our hurts & 'old man' into our Christian life, CG, ministry.

Leader responsibility, yes, a lot. Care for the sheep, pray for them, counsel them, even when they look for leader middle of the night. If some CG members feel left out, leader is supposed to do something to make them feel welcome.
It's just some are not equipped enough to CG leader or were thrust into position(nobody liao they do lor). Or not the right personality to be CG leader, ie not a people person.

CG not social club statement usually refers to CG being gossiping center, which what I find it to be. Hence am guarded in what I share. Talk about general issues, the church, include court case on Allah issue, that one boleh. Personal matter better not, wait Tom, d***, Harry & their friends will know abt it.
Only very close friends share all.

edited.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Oct 15 2014, 06:31 PM

The thing is General Fahmy,
if you seriously think that leaders can be trusted, you are really wrong.
Espacially in this day and age where integrity does not mean anything anymore.

Going to another church will not change a thing. The fact is that in CG, most of the people are going to be cold to you anyway.
Problem with church nowadays is that it is being managed in a more corperate sense whereby numbers seem to be important rather then actually showing love to your brothers and sisters.
The purpose of CG is most likely just to show that the leaders are capable and use it to climb the ladder in the church.

Yes, the church is not supposed to be this way but then we are living at fallen times whereby appearance is more important then everything else.
Actually people in the church can be worse then the people outside because
1)They think they are special
2)They are too "busy"
3)Since you are not going to "benefit" them, then there is no reason for them to waste their time with you except maybe just say a hello just to show that they are "christians"

You see General Fahmy.
Do you ever see people questioning church leaders on their doctrine? No. Why? Because questioning church leaders will lead most likely to that person becoming an outcast. You see, after all the impression is once you question doctrine, you do not trust the church anymore or you are seen as a trouble maker. So opportunities will not be given to you anymore. That should not be the way because we should speak against all inconsistencies in the church but unfortunately, this is how the world and the church works today.

Putting your trust in man will always lead into dissapointment espcially in today's period where integrity means zero.

Also remember the pharaisees even though they had the law, were the worst kind of people out there.

I think since your name is about to get slandered, you should go to another church. But then don expect the situation to change.

Anyway. Christian Friends do not need to come from the church nowadays. Even on facebook pages, you can find christians who are sincere and loves God deeply.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Oct 15 2014, 06:45 PM

Nope.
The fact is that they never had the heart of a shepherd. You do not need to be trained in order to be that.

yeah, yeah, the bald guy right? u mentioned b4.

i'm so sori to hear tat u r unhappy @ ur church .

i belong to a big church. thr r advantages to attending a church wif a big congregation. sometimes its good tat not everybody knws everybody. I feel a sense of relief tat ppl dun poke their noses into my private life. Thr is a sense of real peace especially during times whn i just wan to go to church for some 'God + me' time. The al-Kitab does admonish believers to fellowship though .

I dun attend cg as i have to work nights more than half the time. What i do sign up for, r Bible study classes tat r conducted after main service is over & also join in other programmes organized by the church.

99% of my frens r non-believers. sometimes we dun have to like everybody or for everybody to like u in order to attend church.

This post has been edited by 14-9-2015: Oct 15 2014, 06:55 PM

the introvert must exercise their people skill anyway... step by step... as their part of sacrificing their flesh / working for salvation, according to GOD's grace given them... kennot excuse lahh...

Hence I mentioned abt CG leader not having the right personality(people oriented). That is one of the criteria for selection.
There are people when we think of them - ohhh, bro/sis so & so, cannot, not suit to be CG leader, be administrative leader can lah.

This post has been edited by eaglehelang: Oct 15 2014, 07:36 PM

why your church got raided? any specific reason? if you are staying in klang you maybe want to consider churches in klang area

Talk of course can, but got burnt liao with the gossipers. Serving & talk about ministry(ie like work), pray, that one no problem. As long as "do not give gathering together"

Depends on individual lah, some like going for fellowship, I find more draining, harder task than my work
I will really share only with few selected close friends. Others, nope.

i have no idea about it as my church is not big not small either more like a medium sized church

if u really have trouble getting along wif ppl in ur church & it affects ur spiritual growth, then by all means jump ship.

Bible study at my church seldom conducted by elders orpastors. they mostly invite outsiders frm overseas seminary or bible college or other churches mia, etc. tats y i sukak.

some of these have got Dr. titles. not bad la! they got rich knowledge .

are you going to Calvary Chapel ? i heard Marilyn Hickey doing the bible study there...

NoPe.

tomorrow 8pm rev bill crowder from RBC would be preaching at St. Barnabas Church, Klang right opposite of police station and beside indian temple only

Anyway to continue with the discussion with prophetjul:

22 And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.

23 But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.

24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.

27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.

28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

The passage above shows that the main focus has always been Israel.
We are just like "dogs which eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table".

You see. It was because Israel rejected the messiah and that is why we are now able to eat the crumbs. In Romans, it was pretty clear that we are grafted in
17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree

The thing is. Are we able to accept the facts that we are in fact dogs that are just eating the leftover?

Most of us cannot conceive that we are in fact dogs. We want to claim the fact that we are Israel's equal. Now I see the reason as to why Ammilleannism is so popular. Because Amileannism tells us that we are equal or even superior to the Jews. Unfortunately most traditional churches practices this. To me, this theology is a very grave error that undermine the Jews.

If you read Galatians 6 again, note the previous sentence before vs 16. Paul points to all believers.
That in Christ, there is circumcision(Jews), uncircumcism (gentiles).......them refers to these groups......and Paul calls them the Israel of God.
This is the kingdom of God.

Yes. Israel (the jews) will come back and recognise Him that they have pierced Zech 12 and join the gentiles who came into Kingdom first.
These collectively is called the Israel of God, not Israel the nation.

Not sure what you are trying to say here.
But spiritually we are all equal. Gal 6 says so.

However, Israel is special because God used this tiny insignificant nation to birth forth His Messianic purposes in His redemption plan of creation.
From Abraham right up to Armageddon

Jesus come down to earth to save the sinners that is including non jews..........

i read a book by author sandra teplinski she said God has assured the Jews of their place in heaven thru His covenant with Abraham and Jesus came down to renew the covenant and also God has plan for all mankind too

before Jesus was taken up to heaven, he lay down the great commission to His disciples.........

If you read the verses carefully.

Nope.
When the Canaan Woman says that she was a dog, Jesus did not exactly correct her to say that she wrong. Jesus did not tell her that she was same as the Jews. Jesus only praised her for her beliefs.

The fact is that Jesus concur with her that indeed from a race perspective, yes she was inferior compared to the Jews. She acknowledge that she was inferior to the Jews. She acknowledged that she was only eating the scraps left by the Israel. She acknowledged that she was not the main focus.

Similarly the passage in Romans also showed really clearly that we are eating the leftovers from the Jews. It's because the natural branches were cut off that we were given the opportunity to be grafted in. This language should have given you the idea that no, the focus is not on us. It's on Israel.

Spiritually we are equal. But then from a national basis, the Jews as a whole have been the focus. That's not really hard to imagine.

Israel is not really a tiny insignificant nation if you think seriously about it.

The whole old testament talks about God dealings with Israel. Even Paul defends Israel saying that God never abaddoned His promises with Israel.

God spent so much effort with Israel. How can you say that it's insignificant, I really cannot understand how you can even conclude that Israel is insignificant in view of the scriptures I provided.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Oct 16 2014, 12:51 AM

Vs 15 was referring to all believers.
But as I shown you. Vs 16 is not.

Paul would not have use them if he was referring to all believers.
He would have referred to us.

How can you read vs 15 and vs 16 and then make the assumption that vs 16 was referring to all believers?

Verse 12-13 was obviously referring to the opinion of the circumcised(The Jews). They feel that the gentiles should be circumcised.

Verse 14(KJV) says that Paul who is circumcised feels that those who are both Jews and Gentiles believers are brothers in Christ and there is no need for circumcision.

Verse 15 forms his theological basis

Verse 16 Paul praises those who are of verse 15.(Peace) He was asking for mercy for Israel in general because there are circumcised people within Israel who feels the need to force the gentiles into circumcision.

The promises and covenants to Israel are not only spiritual. They are also physical.
Ezekiel 20 talks about the gathering of all of the Israelites back into the land. Obviously as mentioned earlier, the Kingdom that Jesus set up will not just be based in Jerusalem. It will have a very Jewish flavour. It's not "international" as what you are trying to imply.

In fact reading Zechariah 12 as you told me to do so should already have given you a clue the amount of attention and protection that God shower towards Israel.

This post has been edited by sylar111: Oct 16 2014, 01:46 AM