Dear All, Shalommmm

I am looking for church which either like

1. Joel osteen teaching
2. Jospeh prince teaching.
3 Or other church which focus more on prosperity teaching.

I am in malaysia selangor / KL area, english speaking.

Mohon bantuan jeee... tqvm n God Bless. :-)

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 8 2014, 05:32 PM

ok thanks, i will find other way to get info

fyi: I think you have wrong impression about my post. My post is limited to finding a church, not discussing Joel Osteen / Joseph Prince teachings.

btw: why you wrote like this : i wonder where you get the idea that this both ministry talk about prosperity all the time? ... this is your conclusion rite ? not mine hehehe :-)

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 11 2014, 11:18 AM

I am not blind, and I am going to church but not "regular church goers". I have personal relationship with Jesus Christ.

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 11 2014, 11:20 AM

ProphetJul,

You are right, your writings also correct, but I think my God, Jesus Christ, is NOT AGREEING with you in a lot of context.

Now malaysia need strong christian churches and people, and the basic factor is money and human resources. with money, you can fly a lot of intercessor teams from indonesia / overseas to pray, and lay hands, prayer circle on many orang asli houses, military brach, policy offices especially bukit aman, and many places, and also to curb / bind strongmans above military, military secret agents / unit khas, UMNO, pakatan rakyat, lawyers, lawmakers, and many faces that simply not 100% align with Christ perfect plans; last and not least, speak blessings to many leaders in malaysia from top level office / sultanese to local kings such as datuks / datins. Not to add that Christ is about to come for second time soon, so things does not act as catalyst for spreading the gospel / binding strong mans in malaysia are lesser priorities.

If you want to have demonstrate, i can ask pray or ask my team to pray that you or your team cannot login / reply to my thread and posting anything that does not constitute JESUS CHRIST perfect will. wanna start the demonstration ? let me know

in the mean time, BACK OFF AND STOP WRITING anything that hinder malaysia for Jesus.

I havent start pray / asking God anyway...

The best to read is bible. but the easiest to watch is youtube. let's start with "reading" topic first.

Unlike al-quran, bible is translated to many languages and still considered bible, not "2nd class bible". Bible originally written in greek / aramaic (sorry forgot details but sure not written in english originally). Original writings and translation works both carry same truth, same authority.

I use english bible. Unfortunately, there are a lot of english bible. I use NIV because it's simple english. It's a matter of my preference, no string attached.

Here is the website:

https://www.biblegateway.com/

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Also, as part of your interest in becoming christian, you need to know that Christians are not 1 size fit all in term of teachings and understandings. Yes Jesus is God and Savior, but teaching and understandings are different topics.

There are groups of Christians. There are many factions / streams bearing Christian label. You can compare to moslem it has sunni / syiah. In Christian we called it denomination / movements etc... in short, not 1 size fit all.

I also part of a denomination / group / movements and I have Jesus as Savior. Every Christians should claim Jesus as Savior, but it does not means that all Christians agree with every other Christian, naturally because humans are different, also denomination clearly defines the border.

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Because of that differences, therefore following advises as per what i think good for you to start, but get ready that not everybody is agree with me.

Back to your interest to become christians, to fulfill your interest, reading bible is good but not easy. youtube is easier imho. then i suggest you find 2 keywords in google and youtube:
1. Joel Osteen.
2. joseph prince.

then you need to go to church, and find some community to build your faith. But here is a catch:
if you are malaysia muslim bumiputera, unfortunately, i think you should know that JAIS / JAIM prohibits muslim bumiputera to go to church. therefore imho your church gonna be overseas because you just cannot go to church in malaysia. That's what i know. cmiiw.

Josepth prince church is in singapore, so you can fly every weekend to singapore. you can fly airasia to indonesia medan if you live in penang / selangor.

if you are chinese / india race, then in malaysia I know only 2 churches:
1. http://dumc.my/
2. http://www.chc.org.my/

Other churches I have no ideas, perhaps members here can help you out.

I guess this is a late reply, but anyway, many brother and sister has shared in regard to this question.

I just want to highlight the word "enlighten", because you asked for enlightenment.

The enlightenment is not coming by reading bible nor listen to the preacher nor reading online. The enlightenment comes by asking Jesus Christ himself, because bible clearly written in
Matthew 7:7
“Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.

This sounds simple, but truly: Have you ask Jesus Christ to give you enlightenment ? I didn't mean implying, but formal word-by-word in English. Many people thinks, and meditate, listen to sermonts, googling and they assumes they already ask Jesus. I believe Jesus does know your heart. The issue is, have you clearly realized that you have asked questions ? or have you clearly realized that you never asked questions ?

Allow me enlighten why you have to ask this questions, because you are unique. No ones has the same background like you. Even your closest friends or parents does not know everything deep inside you. You think you know everything about your own body and your own mind, will, soul, spirit ? sorry to disappoint you, you don't.

Then who knows you better than yourself ? The ones who knows you inside and out 100% ? only The creator. Who is the creator ? Jesus Christ.

Therefore it's imperative that you asked Jesus Christ to enlighten you, because he is your creator. Do you know that before you were born from your mother womb, you are in God's thought ? Therefore God's know you 100% inside and out.

Now Asking Jesus start with a humble heart. If you do not know what's standard Jesus has for a humble heart, again Matthew 7:7. He will enlighten you.
To ask and to receive answers are two different things. How to listen to God's voice, again Matthew 7:7. He will enlighten you.

From this point forward, i think it's better to see your response what happen after you apply Matthew 7:7.

God Bless

hmm... just asking:

is this reformed catholic whose your friend attends same as this website:
http://www.reformedcatholicchurch.org/about_us.htm

or actually ur american fren refer to below ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Charismatic_Renewal

i think imho, only Jesus can answer that questions. It's true that bible give a hint or baseline. But back to every individual background and education, some individual may think himself as sheep but other people think he's only goat.

2 options, sheep and Goat, and 2 validations, from Christ or not from Christ (aka devil) gives 4 combinations or outcomes. Let's see the breakdown below:

A. If you think yourself as Goat, how do you know it's not devil try not to condemn you ? telling that you are not good Christian and not "holy" enough ? It's written in Rev 12:10 (NIV)

B. If you think yourself as Goat, how can you sure that Lord Jesus put that in your heart, in order to rebuke you and correct your path ? out of HIS love HE can do this, speak and correct HIS children because it's written that HE chasten the one HE loves. (Hebrew 12:6)

C. If you think yourself as Sheep, how do you know it's not a deception from devil ? I mean devil can give you impression that you are on certain standard, but actually our Lord Jesus Christ know you are not yet HIS standard. (John 10:10)

D. If you think yourself as Sheep, how can you be sure that Lord Jesus is agreeing the definition, idea, concept, of you defining or considering yourself, as sheep ?

Only God Jesus Christ can established something deep within your spirit about how much your progress is. and give you status: either Sheep or goat. or, in this information age where word like fuzzy are common... it's quite possible that Holy Spirit gives you impression 50% sheep and 50% goat. or perhaps 40- 60, 60-40, etc...

Hope you can get the conviction from Christ himself, not from your own understanding.

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 18 2014, 07:19 PM

there are "die" that entitled sijil kematian malaysia
and there are "die" that does not entitled sijil kematian malaysia.

what pehkay means is the second one.

I agree, we should not create layers upon layers of hidden meaning.

Unfortunately, i am not the author of the bible. I believe Holy Spirit is the author of the bible. Therefore when you say: "We take the meaning as 10 yrs old would have taken to believe when first time reading the Bible" ... without you realize, you try to demonstrates you are smarter then Holy Spirit. But i am sure you are trying to be "as safe as" possible and "as righteous as" possible.... a good intention and pure heart is good, but cannot out weight God's love to you.

Perhaps you don't realize but now i hope your eyes is open. Let 10 yrs old think as 10 yrs old.... Let Sonido think as what Christ wants...

My advise, ask the holy spirit. He will gently guide you. He will gives you rhema. For detail about Logos and Rhema, i think this side should be good to start:
http://ati.iblp.org/ati/family/articles/concepts/rhema/

I appreciate your view not to believe in God. At least you share your core belief system.

Ok i see your point because i exactly like yours before, before moving to other church.

I also has a lot of confusion in the past because people interpret bible "suka-suka-dia"... meaning whatever the preacher / gurus claim he got from God / Jesus Christ, they just preach 1 way, and did not want to hear my response nor answering my questions. Forget about challenge him, because he the ones holding the mics. Sometimes i got change to discuss usually if the preacher is not busy. either by lunch / dinner or just simply casual talks... at the end either i have something new, or i feel closer to hell.

The problem is, their version of truth did not help my problem, or at least their truth also did not make me a better person. What i feel, i feel sooooooooooo close to hell instead of soooooooooo close to Jesus.

Then i decided to venture from Churh A, to B, to C to D to really find the church that really meet my need
1. Church must understand that i am a normal human being. take me as is, or leave me alone
2. Church must understand that i sin everyday, due to nature as business man sometimes i have to convince client and give clients comforts, instead of plain truth.
3. Church must be worshiping Jesus Christ, same as i worship Jesus Christ.
4. Church must be open and have attitude to give warmth welcome to newcomers, instead of just simply Praise God and forget new comers.

So today i went to a church that really 50% to 70% meet my expectations. At least the community did not condemn me, and understand me as is... as is meaning take me as what i am. And also, they take care my emotional needs, as a human being, i need pair of ears that i can trust. The definition of trust is:
1. did not call me sinner because i share you A,B,C,D...
2. can keep secret as i just need ur pair of ears.

sound selfish ? you need to trust me this. They are people that want to invest their lives in you. Listening to you, and build you... because they are just people like to do that... there are also church like that... 1st They put Jesus as no 1, and then No 2. they invest their lives in you. The doctrine is just as simple as that. So if you are selfish, these kind of church still will pamper you, because they are looking for selfish people. at least that's their doctrine.

You can try church:
http://www.chc.org.my/

When you attend chc church above, they always announce to all congregation: who is the first comer or second time comer. We would love to know you more and let's have a relationships. This is good. they are deliberately telling you that if you are a first timer or second timer, you are welcomed. All you need to to is raise your hand and minister / ushers / leaders nearby will give you pen and card that you can fill with your name and phone number.

This church as 500 people at 10AM service in the morning, so it's quite packed, but usually only 1% to 5% are new comers. sometimes leaders they approach you, sometimes if not, usually they will call you next days... but perhaps they forgot who knows... people are inperfect anyway

The people are nice, but again... people also have weaknesses... so don't get tempted to just say yes...yes... and open up 100%. Balance it.... trust Jesus, don't be naive... Test first....

When they call you, they ask for a meeting / chit-chat ... well consider as business opportunities. who knows it's benefit, why not give a try.... give them test case. (aka you lie / make up story lahhh.... ) e.g.
telling them i run a business but now business is difficult ya... where is my Jesus ?
telling them i am smart at school, but i need to work so don't have time to study, so i cheat with assignments and exams... what should i do ya ? life difficult lah... no work no money to pay tuition. no degree no career lahhh...

Then slowly you will have a better understanding of live.

now is 9:15 sunday. chc start at 10AM. hope u stay nearby. God Bless

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 20 2014, 09:17 AM

I think it's fine.

It's not Catholic church at all imho. It does not display Catholic culture nor misa / service.
It's not Presbyterian / Wesleyan / traditional churches i think.

It's something else... now this is difficult to explain, unless you attend yourself.

At least you can see these videos and my analysis. Allow me to share some youtube videos about "churches" that i have encountered so far. These 5 churches are not in malaysia.

1. Synagoge. It's for jewish but i am not jewish. naturally they just put distance to you, regardless you have Jesus or not imho.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Z_gyc7yG_c

2. Mormon - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormons)
If you see the video below, you can see it looks traditional. But unfortunately, Mormon is not something i endorsed personally, due to doctrine and teaching issues. But this video is just to demonstrate how nice a traditional setting is (despite the teachings), hommy church and far away from concert style / modern setups.

City Harvest was not build (i mean architecturely build) with this setting. The service room is basicly a huge auditorium, with concert lamps and does not painted white. It does not use church pews so it's just does not look like this youtube at all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia0TcWrKf-E

3. Victory Church of Hattiesburg
Now this is the sample of another church, which i recommend. It's quite loud not quiet type church. so far the teaching is fine. building is basicly a basic traditional church style. painted white, with projector to help display powerpoint. teaching ok2x lah it think

City Harvest Church was using a theather like screen soooo wide i oso surprised and not comfortable in the beginning. at least they manage to put the light no so bright so it's still ok laaahhh....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7CmLjCRcvc

4. Desert Heights Church
This church is what i called contemporary. Look at the preacher wearing jeans. in the beginning i was not okay, cuz usually pastor wears black and white or at least a man suit. oh not to mention he preach using ipad not bible book... oh well i think something just change. this clip is promotional so it has no teaching available. but the clip is good. it's able to communicate to some internet users (like me hehehe...)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiFiwt3ObbM

5. live church UK
same like no 4. just another clip of contemporary church. I study personally how they represent their church or what i called brand marketing for church awareness.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDbZ2KGCc-U

As you see, things has changed. so does church.
some preserve original style so old people "old schooler" like me comfortable
some goes to contemporary style so newcomers will be comfortable. Not "old schooler" like me.

At the end, just go to the Church that is right.... right for you... because it's for you (and your family if ur married)...

Confused ? just go to city harvest church imho.

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 20 2014, 08:20 PM

Yeah... but this one is difficult lah... overseas pulak... they have no passport to bring them to malaysia .. (assume we agree to share 50/50 pay for airline & living cost).

This post has been edited by de1929: Jul 21 2014, 08:53 PM

This church in indonesia:
http://www.jkiinjilkerajaan.org/

has sent some intercessor to Syria but not to help those 2 kids, but to bind the strong man and principalities there. When the effects of bindings strong man can be realized on earth (aka revival) dunno... hopefully soon enough...

Quite interesting that those intercessor were so afraid cuz those locals able to identify them as christian, but syrian say "indonesia adalah kawan". Later i know that our races (btw: i am indonesian), my country indonesia and dark skin does not resemble a threat that compared to westerners such as white american / caucasians. So i think malaysian oso can go to syria i think...

c'mon malaysia... malaysia bolehhh...

I just feel Holy Spirit led me to write this. Perhaps because you wrote "each relationship is unique and personal"... Try to tell your self / your brain to think about what Jesus wants. In a deeper word, try to get Jesus heartbeat. No, i will not write about city harvest this time

no lahh.. you are a smart *ss one no worries. Just trust me (i mean including my earlier writings)... sorry for b*d words hahaha... see i oso not giving you good example but you know inside i am not trying to bully u rite ?

that's goooooddddd .... i am proud of you ... i wish i can say that's goooooddddd .... like how Jim Carrey in Bruce Almighty (2003) hahaha...

Allow me to kepo2x sikit

About arguing wit the unbelievers, you need to show them who is the strongest. The strong one rules. The strong one ruled offer the weaker one, on the positive sides, the strong one offer protection for the weaker ones. The weak will follow the strong ones. That's the nature of human.

Break something if necessary to prove something. This is a deep word, please don't take literally. Literally, bless them. spiritually, bind / break something. actually, Only Jesus Christ knows how to deal with certain things.