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This post has been edited by limeuu: Jun 28 2013, 10:27 PM

So a top student from Imperial who does poorly in SJT can be ranked lower than a mediocre student from say, Manchester.

I thought such kind of policies only occur in third world or underdeveloped countries. Anyway, UK has until now managed to place all graduates for internships.

I think it's good for Limeuu to caution us on our expectations but he could be overreacting on the impact in the foreseeable future.

We have already moved one leg forward and would just have to deal with it.

as of 2013, all applicants will be placed.....but in future years, this may not be so, depending on the number of graduating doctors.....

but even for this year, the delay in placement for 300 people means uncertainty, delay in making plans, and loosing out in terms of choices of deaneries for fy.....if you get low sjt grades, you will go to the bottom of the list, and you will end up getting matched to choices of deaneries from the bottom of your list.....

going forward, they may have to separate internationals from local/eu applicants if there are not enough jobs to go around.....like in oz....

Strangely, opinions from the medical fraternity in the UK seem to differ. Have been in the UK since beginning of June, and met some of them, who opine that they are still looking for the best. They are having problems with EU grads who are not fluent in English.
Medical schools are also being fussy about communication skills, and have failed them in that module.

This post has been edited by podrunner: Jun 29 2013, 03:49 PM

the sjt is not a test of english....but of course, one's english needs to be good to appreciate the contextual situations in the questions...

there is always an issue with the english proficiency of eu doctors working in uk.....but that issue is NOT going to be solved by the sjt...the simplest way is a plain straight forward english requirement, like the ielts 7 required by oz.....

having aptitude tests to select the best is now pretty standard for medical school selection, but one has to question the aim of having such a test at point of graduation....irrespective of the result, people still graduate... (in fact, paradoxically those who failed the finals all got placements, and the ones who did not get a placement in the first round passed the final exams clean!)

when everybody eventually gets placement like this year, what is the purpose of the test?....because the only effect is that lower ranked graduates get sent to unpopular deaneries.....ie, they are saying, those more remote unpopular locations will get 'less well train and less than the best' doctors....

if the intention is to deal with eu doctors, it is causing some unexpected effects on british home graduates....

This post has been edited by limeuu: Jun 29 2013, 05:49 PM

Why do eu doctors choose to work in UK? Is it becoz of the current economic situation? Could also be a number of eu countries producing an excess of doctors over their own needs.
I also note that the present protests in Brazil are linked to the poor healthcare system due to the lack of doctors. As an interim solution, the President is considering importing 50k doctors from Spain and Portugal but this is met with objection from the local medical association.
Closer to home, doctors from Myanmar, Pakistan and Bangladesh are up for hire and does this indicate that they are producing more than what is needed. If it is true, why are we worried about our perceived excess in the near future. Seems that opportunities to work as doctors are aplenty if we are brave enough to into the borderless world. Should we worry since we have not reach 'export' status?
We may not have the recognition but the point is did we seek for it?

there is no shortage of doctors in brazil.....they have one doctor to 550 people, better than msia at the moment...the problem, like everywhere, is maldistribution....which is a reflection on the system, rather than the numbers of doctors...

doctors from spain and portugal will not go to brazil to work in rural areas.....that is like asking doctors in uk to come work in rural hospitals in borneo....

the likely outcome is doctors from cuba will go to brazil....and there are doubts about the training of cuban doctors...and remember, the language of brazil is portugese.....

Not sure if anyone here is aware of this but i was told by my friend who is a trainee lecturer at an IPTA that we now have 42 medical schools in Msia. Wow, Malaysia boleh. Good luck to those doctor wannabes.

Hi forumers I just wanted to ask a few questions. I've received an offer from numed in johor. Now according to their website they claim that their degree is recognized by the gmc. And I'll be able to go to UK for some Intercalated Study and obtain a BSc Honours degree or a Masters degree.

But my question now is will I be able to do my specialization studies in the uk with numed's degree? I am fully aware that the MBBS degree awarded in Malaysia are not recognized elsewhere but in Malaysia. Is there really no other pathway to do my specialization in other country unless i go for the imu twinning program? Assuming that i will not be studying overseas that is. Thanks for taking the time to read my question and hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on this.

First, you need to be able to get a FY1 job in the UK, to get into GMC'c register, so you can practice in the UK. Find out more about the foundation programme, on how one can qualify to apply for FY1 post. Specialisation is many years, and many hurdles from FY, AND you need to be working in the UK.

this issue has been discussed at pagalavan's blog, and is covered in several statements from the gmc.....

graduates from numed although recognised by gme, is not eligible for fy in uk under current guidelines....and they are not eligible also to sit for the plab, which can make them eligible for fy.....

so all students and potential students in numed should make decisions based on the assumption that they CANNOT work in uk.....

it is commonly misunderstood by many....'specialisation' in medicine means postgraduate on the job training, which means full time work......therefore, no work, no training.....intercalated degrees, masters, and doctorates are NOT specialisation qualifications.....

I am also confused about this. Let's say a person graduates from IMU local program. He/She can only work in hospitals in Malaysia for the rest of his/her life?
Then what about those people who do the IMU-PMS and they do not get to stay back in the UK. Can they re-enter UK later to work as a doctor there?
To be honest, I tried finding pagalavan's blog and I can't find anything comparing a local medicine graduate and a UK medicine graduate. Could you please give me the link?
Thanks.

This post has been edited by Mr Kong: Jul 7 2013, 11:12 PM

hi,
anyone of you know if there is any private institute provide training for student or working adults to teach them how to use varies kind of tools and equipment or machine in hospital?

My comments above is specifically in reference to the status of numed students......international students in uk is a different matter.....

Thanks for the clarification. Yeah sorry maybe i didn't state my question that clearly. I am clear that intercalated study and the masters provide by numed are not specialisation qualifications. I was just wondering that will I be able to go to uk for my further studies in specialisation qualifications in uk if i complete their intercalated study and masters degree provided in numed. Thanks.

Based on the information I have gathered now. Yes you can only work in hospitals in Malaysia for your whole life if you graduate in Malaysia in any MBBS local program. As our medical degree in Malaysia are not recognised in other country (with exception of UM and UKM medical degrees. Those are recognised in Singapore if im not wrong on this.)

For those who did the IMU-PMS programme that do not get to stay back in the UK. They wont we able to apply for their housemanship there as you have to be in UK for 5 years to work there. (Someone please clarify as I am not too sure about this.) In other words if you want to work in the UK you'll have to study for 5 years there. But however since you graduated from their PMS hence you are eligible to complete your specialisation studies there in the UK.

Not sure about your third question sorry.

Studying medicine in Bolehland is seriously a pain in the a**.

There's no such thing as "specialisation studies".

Specialisation qualifications oops sry.

the two has NO bearing on ability to undertake work in uk leading to specialist certification.

That is incorrect....all pms students are elligible to undertake the 2 year fy work...

that is not necessarily correct....it will depend on getting into a ST or CT job...

i think it is important to note that, once you are out from the system (ie, did not go through the fy), it is almost impossible to get back into the system from outside.....remember, you are a foreigner there....

there is no problem studying medicine in msia (standards, quality of students and costs aside)....if you only want to work in msia....

the problem is, many people wants to leave msia....

Maybe you can expand on what you think "specialisation qualifications" entail? I think a lot of aspiring medical students are unaware and/or confused. You need to be working in the UK.

Please read the following CAREFULLY:

http://www.mmc.nhs.uk/specialty_training/s...s_applican.aspx

http://www.mmc.nhs.uk/specialty_training_2...cture_2012.aspx