^ this match up is all i've been playing last week.
Key fr toss is to make as little stalkers as possible. More lotz, sentries to support colo. Immortals at front line to soak marauder n thor damage. Work really well when combined with guardian shield.

but those shield surely slows down the raid..

If thors works well again collosus than use them all by all means ^^.

got 1 question, how to deal with zerg's mass muta ball? quite annoying when they just use it to dance between your base and expansion....and sometimes the ball is just so huge that they will brute force the turrets..

i know early harassment is an option, but i am still very new to this game, and still struggling to master the basic build...

jz go attack and kill him...
force his muta to go back and def his base (even nada did the same after a while)...
while u mass up to a death ball jz get thors + marines with stim (and some medics)...

if he doesnt magic box his muta, ur thor would be supreme...
if he does, ur marines will pew pew all the mutas...

thanks for the advice

probably my sense of the timing of my attack is still off (partly also because scare he will attack my base lol)

any tips to improve on this?

I dnt really gt ur point

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Added on November 13, 2010, 1:32 pmthor with weapons upgrades cn 2 shot mutalisk. N if they are grouped together. It cn take out the whole bunch. Reinforce ur army with sm bio n hellions as anti lings. Bring along some scv love fr ur mech. Your gd to go

This post has been edited by tjinn: Nov 13 2010, 01:32 PM

One thing to point out. Vikings are never good against a group of Mutas. Vikings are too slow and can never chase down the high mobility Mutas. You can only put them static at your mineral line to help defend, in which a Turret will do a much better job at cheaper cost.

I kinda LOL when "Shokz Starcraft 2 Guide - #1 Selling Starcraft 2 Guide", recommends players to use Vikings against Mutas.

This post has been edited by westley0214: Nov 13 2010, 01:46 PM

They are hwever quicker to pump out to reinforce turrets n rines though if u are cought out of position. So its smthing to note.

so the best way is to move out attacking his base, forcing him to retreat to protect it right? i will try it later...however vikings are still needed i think, if he goes broodlord (or just finish him off before he got the chance)

U dnt see broodlords very often.
I only build vikings against zerg fr 2 reasons.
Snipe his overlords. N harass his mineral lines.

Also take note of the timing. The earliest reasonable time for the first batch of Mutas to come out should be about 8 to 9 mins mark (assuming he tech straight up to Lair after Pool). You should be having E-Bay ready before the 8 min marks no matter how (if he did not go for Mutas, your E-Bay is still useful for the infantry weapon upgrade, armor upgrade, requirement for Planetary Fortress etc.), so that Turrets can be build instantaneously after the first wave of Mutas harassment. First wave should be consist around 5 - 6 Mutas. Your Rines will be enough to deal with them.

If he decides to go for more and more Mutas, then you will have to get some Thors.

And yes, aggression is the best way. Base for base, I'm sure you can finish all his buildings off before his Mutas do finish your buildings off.

This post has been edited by westley0214: Nov 13 2010, 02:12 PM

thanks for the really helpful tips
and i always hesitate too much when i should attack...scared this and that (is my army big enough? what if he counter attack me? etc etc)....and often it will be too late when i finally decides to go out

Most of my wins from playing terran are from TVP and TVZ match ups! I totally suck at TVT especially when it comes to games which is more than 30minutes my winning rate is equally 0% -.-

i guess westley and tjinn cover it up pretty well...
turrets are good but thors are better as they have high range + splash...
and the best thing is u can move out with them...

vikings are really really really horrible vs mutas due to their low firing rate thus very bad effective dps...
thors + marines are the way to go...
usually i prefer to go marine heavy and once the muta reach a certain mass u would need some thors...
others go for thor first to help def the base (1 thor per base is enuff usually) then mass up marine tank thor for the deathball

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Added on November 13, 2010, 3:41 pmTvT is really hard to play...
such a high lvl chess game...
though i still like going banshee harass -> tank marine -> tank marine vikign (and some marauders when his tank count is high)...
still i am nt used to managing all my tanks at the same time + viking + raven PDD + stim = die from trying to multitask lol

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Nov 13 2010, 03:41 PM

I played a TvZ just now, the Zerg player made all the way to Mutalisk+Zergling+Baneling, I did scout earlier and do some economical damage, but it seems that its not enough, the Zerg will just expand way more faster than I did. All I did is just Bio ball+Thor and was getting Siege Tank as well but in the end was gg-ed as he go his Ultra out. Any suggestion to break this combo?

after ur eco advantage i believe he went muta and pin u down to ur base rite?
the general respond to this is to stay on ur 2 bases and just do a big timing push before his ultras get high or he get to a 300food army (200/200 with larvae stockpiled)...
timing push with some thors + siegetanks and bio support (marine heavy) as ur big ball of death...
get the tanks damage upgrade to 1 shot banes (+1 for +0 armor banes) and upgrade accordingly...
a 120-150 food would be a good timing depending on map and wut ur opponent does...
his food would be much higher at around 180-200 but ur tech heavy army will chew through it with some losses...

it would require some experience for this of course but since u did some economical damage i think the window for ur timing push is slightly bigger...

btw guys thor >> collo

250 MM 1 shot would kill a colo almost instantly..

They need to do something about thors

yup...
but thors are mostly used on immortals nowdays as the cannons go through the hardened shields and 1 shot...
the advantage of colossus are the 9 range and the splash if the thors are lined up though...
chargelots are a must in PvT imho >.<

btw from ur experience of thor vs VR what to u think?
i been having mixed results on this >.<

I get what you mean, he's doing FE so I just keep on doing the best to harass and catch up. Perhaps I need to practise more, I keep on pushing out when its like 100+ foods on my side and get pawned by his army, its like 3 times like that, and after that I figured out it would be better if I just wait for my army to grow. And ya, I got +2 damage upgrade for Thor, so I think I'll get some tanks next time.