Dear Siewan and friends,
A few pointers to share if you agree,
1. Once your BH show some form of improvement, avoid entering the BH for no serious problem and if you need to enter, best enter afternoon and leave before 4 pm.
2. A minimum of 2 weeks allowance be given before you enter for the next inspection and carefully examine the progress of the BH esp on the markings and tell tale signs.
3. Never do any major repair or adjustment when you are having result so as not to scare away any birds that you may have....a bird at hand is better than 2 in the bush.
4. Personally, I never encourage night bird sounds in all my BHs as it doesn't serve the function unless your BH really require the night sound.
It is so disturbing esp. to your neighborhood during the deep night. Why create trouble to all BHs in the region; you are not the only BH in the area, once the authority take action, all BHs will suffer all due your insistence of using midnight noise.
Here, we have a trouble with one BH owner who insist on using night sound and the neighbor has been complaining to the authority many time and this complainant has a mental problem and if he has complaint to the wrong person and if he had complained to his Doctor and with the doctor's recommendation to the authority esp. the Police Dept, his amp. and tweeters will be taken down in the middle of the night.

5. I always suggested that all BHs owners be considerate of your neighbourhood for they have right, too. Some BHs owners never understand that Peace is the best way for BHs to survive at town.......

Note: If your surrounding is like as in the plantation, you may want to use night internal sound to mask the outside predators or animals calls but not in the town where the birds are so used to human or vehicle sound and nosilence after midnight and even a cricket sound sound so loud ...you are asking for trouble.


Again, above are my own findings and may not the same as your learned and wised consultants.

This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 13 2009, 09:44 PM

hi guys. recently Rosmah came to Rembau... the reception? Was like she was the PM herself... banners all the way from the toll to the Rembau town. I think the one holding real power is Rosmah, not the PM.

anyways, point 5 of West Wing's recent post... arrived in KT around 6pm... as usual, the BH in KT town were blasting away their bird calls. Just stand anywhere at the bus terminal and you'd definitely hear it. 24hrs maybe?

All the best guys. MY standalone is still up and coming. Can't wait for completion so i can tamper with the audio and mist. Anticipation...

I was all for BHs@ TOWN and have a few @ towns but now, I must think of going out of town cos, my fellow BHs owners will kill us all, not this time but maybe sometime in the future. But the fact that I hate snakes and spiders, how then? Already did my best to share all my experiences for free and still bla bla at night and so I quit for not wanting to be told that I am like BN, getting the post but not doing anything about complaints and bad image from the public on BHs.

So, as I love my birds and this is the only way out, begging all BHs@town to cooperate; at least lower the volume and maybe end at 12 midnight and let the poor souls (your neighbours) to having a good night sleep, plus always smile when approaches and at least with that, we are united and have valid reasons to stay in town. If your consultant tell you that only with night sounds you will be successful, you can quote me as I never like to use night sound and I am successful. All consultants I know encourage and even force owners using night sound but till today, I don't see why? Either I am old and outdated or I am just antiCON.

So do what you like cos' I better sell all my BHs and be a retired millionaire instead of the swiftlet birds...all black, I shall be looking and caring for different type of birds, larger and more colourful plus prettier, too........joking lah hahahahahha

[quote=kuching_farmer,Apr 13 2009, 07:32 PM]
[quote=siewann,Apr 13 2009, 11:23 AM]
So far so good, the solar work just fine. it has been running 3 months without any problem.
they only tell me, the system can supply 3 to 4 hundred tweeter + 2 humifiyer + few light each floor + auto gate + cctv only. if i want more than more money they will need.
I do phone him he said u buy 25k is it?
DC ampli u blast it 24 hours for external sound or u got a timer for that ?

[/q

Hi Kuching_farmer,
he is right, i pay 25k for that system. It come with 8 timer controler. my external sound will close at 8 pm. u can program the timers at any time u want.

Greed and short sightedness have been the hallmark of most of our businessmen and politicians. Can't blame some for being short-sighted as this is usually as a result of the insecurity and uncertainties created by the authorities.

Anyone with this idea of making townhouse birds homeless, and thinking that these desperate birds will be forced to stay at their eco parks/ standalone farms. should think again. A quick calculation would reveal the folly of closing down town BH. Majority of successful BH are town BH which produces 3 seasons of new birds each year. These are young birds that will be looking for a place to stay, some will choose eco parks. A successful town BH with 4000 birds can produce about 12,000 new birds each year. ie. assuming 2 eggs per season per pair. If they close down just this one BH there is 12,000 birds less per year looking for a place to stay. So in their desperate move to try to get their dirty hands on the 4000 old birds, they lose 12,000 potential tenants per year from the closure of just one town BH, not to mention the multiplying effect of these 12000 new birds in the subsequent years. All BH owners should see their BH as a factory churning out new birds into the system.

Let talk the scenario about Eco park, the owners usually will employ workers to harvest like at Indo ( If they can get the birds during the initial stage and I doubt so), harvesting workers going in half naked in to the BH and harvest but the owner's representative will wait at the entrance door. The workers will collect all nests ( with or without chicks and eggs) and will clean up the BH before the representative will go up to do inspection the cleanliness of the BH. The workers will clean up with the representative looking on to ensure that no nest is hidden under the pant or even in the underwear....expensive stuff, you know.

No representative will go up to any uncleaned BH and dirty their feet. If the workers do selective harvesting and just take the empty nests, do you know the extra time spend in checking the nests is more than harvesting the nests and what if you missed a nest or two, they are not going to do double work or extra work. All the owners' concern are maximum output and minimum expenses; normal factory expectation.

Town BH scenario.

Town BH,, we are mostly individual or family's concerned and we take care of out BH ourselves and we aren't stupid not to allow the birds to increase as the number will double if conditions allow and so will the nests. We have all the time as we normally stay downstairs or nearby and so security is much better. The more time we enter the BH, the more we feel closer to the birds and slowly but surely, the birds become part of our extended family......the provider of financial and wealth....just like our children giving us monthly maintenance but anyone of you having children giving you money monthly?

Unconsciously, we become their protector and the BH become a swiftlets' sanctuary.

With these scenario, do you think there will be any increment of nests.

---

Added on April 14, 2009, 5:37 pmA friend of Swiftlets PM me on the planks for BH with some questions and the following are my answers to share among all @ forum but please remember they are all my suggestions and pls feel free to comment.


1. The meranti plank mustn't has any smell even diesel that some sawmill use for cleaning saw......pls. reject all those.
2. I normal like to use 8ins. by 1 ins thick. The thicker the better but the cost will be much higher. As for width, min. 6 inches but all depend on your floor height and surround.
3. Nesting box, as I will like to recommend one long plank provided that the plank stay solid and fast. The boxes are to hold the long plank in good solid position and not to move as the birds hit hard on the plank on landing. Corner are where the birds like best and the corners should be at the side of the walls where the birds will feel safe.

[

This post has been edited by West Wing: Apr 14 2009, 06:32 PM

Swiftlet farming brings in RM2 bln a year: DG
By Anthony Joseph


Dept eyeing China market to increase export value

MIRI: Export value from swiftlet farming in the country has reached around RM2 billion a year, said director-general of Veterinary Services Department Datuk Dr Abdul Aziz Jamaluddin yesterday.

This is because of the big demand for edible bird nest in the Asian market, especially in China, and the increasing swiftlet farming activities in the country.

“We are trying to penetrate the China market. We can fetch a good value for it in China as the country imposed around 30 per cent tax for the product acquired from Hong Kong. As such, the government is trying to establish an understanding with China to enable those in the industry to export their product directly to the country,” Dr Abdul Aziz said after launching the state-level Veterinary Month here.

He said there have been tremendous yearly increases in number of swiftlet farmers or operators in the country since the past five years.

“In Peninsular Malaysia, the number increased from 900 in 1998 to 50,000 last year. From an income of around RM18,000 in 1998 it ballooned to RM1 billion in 2008,” said Dr Abdul Aziz who was representing Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Agro-based Industry Datuk Rohani Abdul Karim.

The introduction or marketing of the product will be carried out in stages in the Asian market. It has the same potential with other products such as ‘tongkat ali’ and ‘kacip fatimah’ which are picking up among Asian consumers.

“We are also trying to go into Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Europe. We can see there are big potentials in the industry in Sarawak,” he added.

Meanwhile, the cabinet has approved the Veterinary Services Department as the agency to develop swiftlet farming in the country.

Also present were permanent secretary to the Ministry of Modernisation of Agriculture, Datu Jaul Samion and the director of Agriculture Department, Paul Vincent Ritom.

Dear Readers just for your information. Things looks pretty positive lately.

Good!!!....Good News....

Hopefully, Vet dept. is on farmers side...

Bureaucratic red tapes in the administration.

From farming to harvesting to cooking to eating also facing ass. Next time go toilet pang sai also kena harass.

http://www.sun2surf.com/article.cfm?id=32343

This post has been edited by Bobby C: Apr 16 2009, 01:29 PM

How about coming out with a policy that only 100% Bumi companies are allowed to process EBN. And only bumi has the sole right to do farming.

Other races go and tanam keledek and Jagung. So it will balance the race involvement in swiftlet farming. Anything can happen in Bumiland

I think that should be the way. Malaysia Bumiland!

Rokok & Arak not haram. But bird nest is HARAM!

Robbing and destroying BHs in Mukah is not haram but apply license is considered Haram because you will never get.

Ben, please recommend the best mental hospital for the bunch of crooks from hutan. Thks.

This post has been edited by Bobby C: Apr 16 2009, 05:03 PM

What kind of stupid act... forfeiting bird's nest at the immigration checkpoints is a really stupid idea and which country has done it except Malaysia and this Malaysia pasti boleh....come on , the tourists are coming to enjoy and spend and buy and what do you expect them to read the full laws book of Malaysia before coming......we sell openly and they buy openly and so what's wrong? I once did went to China to buy alot of goods from China and the chinese custom officer asked me why I bought so much goods and I shouted at her "why? it is wrong if I want to help China to sell her products?" and with that the lady officer keep quite. Tourists are coming to buy and do they have to ask every shops whether they have pay taxes or is is illegal to buy or can I buy or all nonsenses!!!!!!

Hundreds of kilos of bird's nest worth hundreds of thousands of ringgit have been confiscated at the country's exit points; oh my God!!! The tourists are going back home to tell all their friends not to visit Malaysia as Malaysian main silat mata....sekarang ada, sekarang hilang......


Why spend so much money to promote tourism when we Malaysia here are killing all tourism here. BH swiftlets should never be in the fully protected specises as we have increase the population many many folds........and the nests they are buying are from our building and not from the caves. It is nests created by man for Human consumption.

Why create so much problem to our guests and all they want are to have happy times in Malaysia and we, Malaysia before this are known for warm welcome and famous Malaysian smile> shame on us all, Malaysian!!!!!!

And again, above are always my own opinions and if offended, pls. accept my sincere appologies.................

West Wing don't waste your effortlah! If only some of them could think 10% like you Malaysia already become 1st world country.

Selecting criteria of doing their job for the Gov must show the ability to tarnish and put Mlaysia into a state of no hope.

If anyone of them trying to turn Malaysia into a economy giant will be put into cold storage.

Mr. West Wing I hope you are not born yesterday.

Some administration just never grows up at all!!! How can we have a better future !!!

ai ya......U think they don't meh??

they more clever than us!!!...

They want money only mah!!! kepala makan kua kua, tak mungkin kakitangan tak mau makan, kan??....

Why they do that...to confisticate bird's nests and stop everyone from exporting/bring out bird's nests??

THEY WANT YOU TO APPLY LICENSE!!!

WITH THE LICENSE, THEY WILL HAVE A RECORD :

1) APPLICANT NAME AND DETAILS

2) QTY OF BIRD'S NESTS

FROM THERE, THEY WILL HAVE A GOOD GRASP OF WHO IS EXPORTING BN!!!

WITH THAT RECORD, THEY CAN SQUEEZE YOUR BALLS TIGHT TIGHT....

INCOME MAN WILL KNOCK ON YOUR DOOR....SELAMAT PAGI ENCIK.....PAGI INI SUDAH PERGI KUTIP SARANG?? SUDAH BAYAR TAX KAH???

BELUM???.......


CAN WE CHANGE THEIR MINDSET??


U KNOW I KNOW.....NEVER!!!
...

Well, well, well we farmers are really a bunch of boxers trying to block punches left n rt, n under n above, macam macam pun ada . No peaceful road ahead , a bloody long n winding road. One good news fr Ben immediately drowned by news of bad practises by govt officers. Malaysia truly Asia what a waste of advertising fees ! So what happened to the confiscated b nests ?

Westwing, I share yr concern with regard to noise pollution by BH. I had dinner in a swiftlet area at abt 8pm n one BH was terribly loud with its ext n int sd. Beside it is a Kumon learning centre for kids. These are the "Rogue" BH owners who are giving the real owners a bad name. I can say this BH is not doing that well n if not wrong owned by an outstation fella n with this type of attitude just wonder when the other successful owners in that area will face problems with the authority. I once had a friend advising me to cut out all int sound but leave only a single twitter to play the int sd from 8pm to 7am so not to kacau neighbors. I'm ok with my sd, next door ok too.

---

Added on April 17, 2009, 11:40 amWell, well, well we farmers are really a bunch of boxers trying to block punches left n rt, n under n above, macam macam pun ada . No peaceful road ahead , a bloody long n winding road. One good news fr Ben immediately drowned by news of bad practises by govt officers. Malaysia truly Asia what a waste of advertising fees ! So what happened to the confiscated b nests ?

Westwing, I share yr concern with regard to noise pollution by BH. I had dinner in a swiftlet area at abt 8pm n one BH was terribly loud with its ext n int sd. Beside it is a Kumon learning centre for kids. These are the "Rogue" BH owners who are giving the real owners a bad name. I can say this BH is not doing that well n if not wrong owned by an outstation fella n with this type of attitude just wonder when the other successful owners in that area will face problems with the authority. I once had a friend advising me to cut out all int sound but leave only a single twitter to play the int sd from 8pm to 7am so not to kacau neighbors. I'm ok with my sd, next door ok too.

This post has been edited by ornimann: Apr 17 2009, 11:40 AM

i think the new gov administration should really look into the problems of the BN industry seriously, implement suitable rules and regulations and at the same time doing both qualitative and quantitative research BEFORE drawing such guidelines. having said this... the industry players should take the initiative to form an advisory panel of sorts (a proper panel representing associations and having the support of BH owners) to advise the relevant government agencies...educating, guiding and most importantly eradicating the social stigma about the industry.

we are all aware of the nuisance of rogue BH owners.. blasting audios and stuff... and this small group even being small, can tarnish the industry as whole. how can we change them? i assume this is one role that should be played by the associations.

what i fear most is when a specific ruling/undang2 kecil tempatan (be it from the PBT, Veterinar or Perhilitan) crops up to annihilate totally town BH's.... all because of some errant owners. this is possible, but i did mention on how we could avoid this many times.

I mentioned before on some experiences with gov agencies... the words 'saya tak minat amik tahu' or 'mengarut la buat rumah burung' is not uncommon. commercial banks on the other hand are more receptive. i went and met an AgroBank officer and after introductions, i asked him outright what did he know about the BN industry, the answer was as expected, not much. I took some 30 minutes summarizing the issues and technical info for him to get an idea, this includes short term and long term plans. The reason? i did not want to talk or discuss with someone totally ignorant of the industry. The best part is, no one in N9 has ever applied for such a loan for a BH project. I am sure some maybe uneasy with this, explaining bits and pieces... but my rational is... IF i get this loan, whatever the value... it will pave the way for future entrepreneurs interested. By presenting in a professionally businesslike manner, it will give the impression that this industry is ready for the next level... large scale BUT strategically planned BH's and indirectly educating financial institutions with the limited info i have (NOT those agro parks, i consider them evil).

Some relevant points;

1. being a pioneer for a standalone unit (actually theres another 2 standalone, but more than 15km away), it will help build population for those that might want to get involved in the future.
2. the creation of a new rural industry, a standalone BH on agriculture land, hopefully a sample BH following the rules to the dot.
3. job opportunities for locals. God willing, it can give jobs to rural folk(processing, security).
4. usage of idle land
5. increase land value of surrounding plots

I had an audience with the Ketua kampung, very receptive. Will meet the YB soon once i get back from KT. Will need his endorsement and support. There were many shop BH's within the vicinity, but i haven't had the chance to meet the owners, also don't know what to expect (reaction) when i do meet them. hopefully it will be positive. some units were closed due to complaints by locals. THIS is an example of the problems... which needs to be addressed.

Please give feed back. I will need all the info and advice i can get to tread these next few months, particularly when building in a traditional setting, with lots of politicking.

Owh, by the way, i got a support letter from Jabatan Veterinar... came at 10am to submit the letter... was called at 11am to come pick up the support letter... ???????? wtf???? A friend of mine... took 3 weeks just to get a letter... it took me less than 2 hours. So something must be wrong somewhere. Kudos to Jabatan Veterinar and efforts by Dr. Redzuan (in whatever capacity he can contribute). Jabatan Veterinar should call up Dr. CK Lim or Unlce Ben or other esteemed sifu's to brief officers. I have the same hope with ChanK, the veterinary dept should be more involved. We can assist this by meeting and discussing with officers, at any chance we get.

Sorry for babbling, just wanted to share my experiences. I am mostly guided by a sifu from KT, but i believe knowledge and wisdom cannot be gained just from a few teachers, but from a bunch coupled with personal experience.

This post has been edited by dunsuntutmybuntut: Apr 17 2009, 04:05 PM

Talking about bank loan, based on conversation with one bank manager from PBB who is awared of this industry, the bank will only provide up to 70%(if remember correctly) of the land valuation price. Bank will not loan a single cent on the building cost. In another word building cost all by cash only.

Can understand why. Putting ownself under the bank's shoes, the only thing valuable to the bank is the land. The building made of concrete, rebar, wooden plank etc of zero value to the bank. The bank is not going to take the risk of fail farms in the middle of no where. All risk is bore by the farmers. Banks are smart. They are in all win-win position. If you success, they win. If you fail, they still win as land acquired only 70% of the cost. Farmers go eat bananas.

If the gomen is smart, they should go study how many % of the nest in the market contributed from the shop houses compare to farm land. Not surprise 80:20. If any change in ruling to strike out shophouses, you are taking about 0:20 ie hundreds of millions may be billion gone down the drain because one silly error on the paper. Dont play play.

Should learn from one relative, buy one particular bank share, multi million by now.

I fect not all BN are confiscated at exit point. Those conficated are those the owners refused to rundeng or no nore money to met the rundeng amount. Got it ???

Years ago I went on a working visit to Kores . Visitors are allowed to bring home with them maximun of 1 kilo of ginsen without any harassment. Malaysia should do likewise to curb the practice of officers collecting taxes for themself.

In Serikei the Swiftlets association's comittee goes around and moniter all BH and rouge BH owners are encourage to cooperate with others BH owners and protect everyones lifelihood . Is it to much to ask ??

Somewhere in Sarawak 3 BH tweeters were shot out with air gun by angry neighbour. Another BH in Miri a huge fire creckers the size if a car tyre was set of under a sucessful BH also by angry neighbour.

So BH owners its time to look at yourself and your conscience . Your shelfish action will cause harn and discomfirt to all around you. The psychological harm is same like those living around night golf coures as there is no night , hence many night golf course are being shut down all over the world and owners aer being sued for damages. Do you want to be the the one responsible for the same fate for all BH in shoplots ? Your choice !!

Scientist have verified that thest house swiftlers call Fuciphagus Domesticus are in fact domesticated animals like goats and pigs. They should rightly be managed by The Veterinary Dept. Rather then protected specis under the wildlife Dept. I don't think the Millions and millions of FD will be in danger of extinsion in the very near future.

Question ! do you seriously think the wildlife dept. will just let this very lucrative trade slip through their fingers ?? Think Again ! I wonder if the PM will give his Primer's directive to this effect weather the state Govt. will obey these orders. Will See !

Uncle Ben is right. New definitions must be coupled with new set of rules. Old outdated set of rules should be flushed down the drain (again with proper guidance from wise bird men).

Yes Bobby C, the banks will only offer 60-70% of land value OR 80-90% of project cost, whichever is lower. To me whats more important is the issue of interest... you can check the rates but so far, the 4% by AgroBank is the best... this comes under the Gov scheme. BNM pumps money into AgroBank/SME/other financial outlets to be disbursed through these entities with terms and conditions deemed fit by them. Take example, the 3F or other fancy names. I hear they have tons of money underutilized. Why? They ARE commercial banks. The pra-syarat or terms won't help new guys, despite the fact that its new guys that need help the most. Money doesn't flow out, interest for them? At least thats what i think. Not too familiar with these banking stuff.

Anyway, i've always considered most government agencies as being prehistoric in attitude and performance. Only a few agencies have improved.

Here's an example... since we all acknowledge Malaysia as Boleh Land... lets say... the old MOA... plus MEDC... plus Pembangunan Luar bandar... Women & Family... Belia & Sukan apa lagi? Some have their own agencies to assist rural development... lets list 'em down;

1. JKM
2. JKK
3. Agri Dept
4. Vet Dept
5. FAMA
6. FELDA
7. FELCRA
8. Whatever other Fel or KETENGAH or that has an A in the end
9. MARA
10. TEKUN
11. KEMAS
12. INFRA (owh, thats another one with an A)
13. Peladang
14. 4B

and maybe a bunch more we don't even know exist. not all have existed for 50 years, but most more than 10 years some 20-30 years. has poverty rate significantly been reduced? has the agriculture sector REALLY helped rural people? or has the policies implemented only stuffed the coffers of gigantic corporations like FELDA and Sime Darby?
(do you have any idea how much FELDA is worth??????????????????????????????????????)

a clear example... tax payers (US) support the Welfare Department... they distribute it to the so called hard core poor. yes... they distribute it to the poor. taxes from rich bastards and big c/o's. now... from who do you think they receive the names of the hard core poor? besides those who apply for help la... from the JKKKKKKKKKKKKK. ok... who are the JKKK? owh, just politically influenced dinosaurs who think they still live in colonial rule and seriously believe they are fighting for Malay supremacy. owh... whose names do they submit to the welfare dept? aaa... only their nieces, aunts, uncles, cousins, relatives and don't forget their wifes step uncles grandchildren twice removed as well.

my point is... the policy or program is idealistic and good. but the delivery system to the end beneficiary or the people who should be helped stinks like shit. this applies to most policies that were thought and planned while ministers were passing out their bowel contents. no proper research was done, no pilots were made, and no viable data compiled (since most data and statistics were doctored or tailored for the ministers preference). the second main reason is because the deliverers (the people who deliver) are not properly trained or have the proper attitude. a good example are these young agriculture officers... these fresh idiots from universities. they come out with degrees in horticulture or soil sciences or even botany... but once on the job they couldn't care less going to site visits and actually getting their hands dirty. Jabatan Pertanian is having this problem with the new Agriculture Officers. How the hell can you advise a person on how to properly apply lime when the only lime they have seen is in books? same goes to the veterinarians... once when we were going to transfer 1000 ducks (we had to get the vets consent) the vet came and asked us' "Are these ducks healthy?", when smack in front of her there were 3,000 ducks. WTF.

just expressing my point of view. lets just hope the slogan One Malaysia, People First, Performance Now doesn't actually mean;

One Malaysia (My Malaysia), People First (My Own People/Cronies), Performance Now (Just forget the First 50 years).