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37 If I am not doing the works of My Father, then do not believe Me. 38But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe Me, believe the works themselves, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I am in the Father.”

Every step of way only confirm Triune God. The Trinity is all over the place.


Jesus is Son of God. ie...God, if it was merely in reference to human sonship, the teachers would not be triggered to stone him. Jesus constantly refers Himself with 2 titles.

Son of God and Son of Man. As what I've told you, He is Man and God at the same time.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Mar 21 2020, 11:11 PM

John 17

1When Jesus had spoken these things, He lifted up His eyes to heaven and said, “Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son may glorify You. 2For You granted Him authority over all humanity,a so that He may give eternal life to all those You have given Him. 3Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent. 4I have glorified You on earth by accomplishing the work You gave Me to do. 5And now, Father, glorify Me in Your presence with the glory I had with You before the world existed.

If Jesus was a mere human prophet, he cannot give eternal life. Only God can.

The Union between Jesus and Father God is already there. That is the 1st order. Jesus prayed that his followers will also be in union as they "already" are. That is the 2nd order of sequence.

That is why in Christianity, the relationship for the believers and God is very close.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Mar 21 2020, 11:20 PM

Praise be to our Lord Jesus Christ for raising the dead back to life as recorded in the Holy Scriptures.

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The Son, Jesus Christ on earth, had measureless or limitless Spirit and Spiritual power in Him = God/the Word became flesh. Not the same for Christians on earth, ie they have measured or limited Spirit and Spiritual power in them. ......

JOHN.3: = 34 For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure. 35 The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand. 36 He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

EPH.4: = 4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Spiritual Gifts

7 But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift. 8 Therefore He says:

“When He ascended on high,
He led captivity captive,
And gave gifts to men.”

9 (Now this, “He ascended”—what does it mean but that He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth? 10 He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things.)

11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head—Christ— 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Mar 22 2020, 12:06 AM

god may have died. But GOD did not die on the cross. Jesus the man died on the cross and shed His blood as a sacrfice for the atonement of sins of mankind.
Then He rose on the Sabbath 3 days later to DEMONSTRATE that He had the authority over life and death.
Believe in His work.

Try to read my last two posts slowly.

I can put it in another way:

The God who died for us is not the God before incarnation. Prior to incarnation, God certainly did not have blood, and He could not have died for us. It was after the incarnation, in which God was mingled with humanity, that He died for us. Through incarnation, our God, the Creator, the eternal One, Jehovah, became mingled with man. As a result, He was no longer only God, He became a God-man. As the God-man, He surely had blood and was able to die for us

When the God-man died on the cross, He died not only as man but also as God. The One who died on the cross was the One who had been conceived of God and born with God. Because He was a God-man, the very element of God was in Him. The divine element was mingled with His humanity.

In the conception of the Lord Jesus, the God-man, the divine essence out of the Holy Spirit (Matt. 1:18-20; Luke 1:35) was generated in Mary's womb. Such a conception of the Holy Spirit in the human virgin, accomplished with both the divine and human essences, constituted a mingling of the divine nature with the human nature and produced the God-man, One who is both the complete God and a perfect man, possessing the divine nature and the human nature distinctively, without a third nature being produced. This is the most wonderful and excellent person of Jesus.

The conception and birth of the Lord Jesus was God’s incarnation (John 1:14), constituted of the divine essence added to the human essence, hence, producing the God-man of two natures - divinity and humanity. Through this, God joined Himself to humanity that He might be manifested in the flesh (1 Tim. 3:16) and might be the Savior (Luke 2:11) who died and shed His blood for us.

Now that is the awesome good news ~~~

It's NEVER an issue for any of the Christians in here.

As Ive said it's an establish doctrine which cannot be shaken.

It's only an issue to you because you're a moslem. No other reason.

one can argue all one wants and still be considered misguided.

aral is sincere in trying to point it out to us

however, whether he is right or wrong remains to be seen

I think aral has to honestly look at both christianity and islam and decide for himself which faith's followers are bringing peace to the world today.

every faith has it's fanatics but for one in particular, it seems to be the norm rather than the exception.

actions do speak louder than words, right?

I've actually ponder what you said in the last few line....the same as you. But that is not for discussion in this thread.

This is a Christian fellowship thread where Christians hang out.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Mar 22 2020, 08:49 PM

no offense meant

None taken.

Just that this Aral fella doesn't understand ALL Christians in here are united and have accepted the doctrine of Trinity.

Even the Catholics accepts this. (Yeeck can confirm this)

Trinity is one of the Primary Doctrine, other than Jesus Christ being the son of God that unites the entire Christian World.

It is only cultic and heretic that rejects Trinity.

it is not that he doesn't understand.
he has been taught christians are misguided.

and because he has faith in his scripture, he believes.

it is the same with us right?

so what makes the difference?

isn't it our living relationship with Christ?

we not only believe but we experience it for ourselves.

peace the world cannot give
joy unspeakable
love beyond mere feelings
and so much more only christians understand.

Yup

Psalm 34:8 (NIV) - Taste and see that the LORD is good; blessed is the man who takes refuge in Him!

Chriatinity is living experiental and not just a concept.

God is faithful, so much so..we know Christ Jesus is the True and Living God.


We cannot deny, we cannot reject after tasting this LIVING GOD!

There are more to this. Muslims believe that the Quran is revealed directly from God, not written by human hands (think of it like Moses receiving the Law directly from God on Mt Sinai). For them the Bible is corrupted over the centuries. yet, Christians are considered People of the Book, but.............folks like Dr ZN likes to (mis)quote from the Bible.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Mar 23 2020, 11:11 AM

it is their perogrative.

i suggest we do not mention it by name lest we be accused of anything.

already know this.

Nothing new.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Mar 23 2020, 11:25 AM

have any of you read their scripture?

i have done about a third of it.

No thank you.

it is to understand their frame of mind.

only then we can give them answers that will challenge them to thinknfor themselves

This post has been edited by popcorneater: Mar 23 2020, 12:02 PM

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How did God/Jesus reached out to the Gentiles who mostly knew nuts about His Word and Law in the Old Testament.? = He used a Pharisee Jewish zealot and Roman citizen who had both feet or experience and knowledge in Judaism/Christianity and Roman Gentilism, ie apostle Paul.
....... Similarly we have a number of Christian converts who were ex-Muslims = have both feet in Islam and Christianity; and a number of Christian converts who were ex-Buddhists, ex-Taoists, ex-Hindus, ex-atheists/communists, ex-Jews, ex-etc.

People like you and me are likely not equipped by the Spirit of God to reach out to Muslims. Instead, we should heed the warning of 1PET.5:8, eg avoid breaking the local laws(MATT..22:21) by not proselytizing to Muslims in Malaysia like aral3005 = may end up like Pastor Raymond Koh. If Malaysian Muslims are interested to convert, there are ways, though quite difficult, eg Lina Joy who emigrated or escaped from Malaysia.
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This post has been edited by lurkingaround: Mar 23 2020, 01:08 PM