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> Vivian Balakrishnan remarks that Malaysia-, -Singapore water deal is "morally wrong"

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wanted111who
post Mar 3 2019, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(Faidzal @ Mar 3 2019, 10:59 PM)
hello my friend?

you got comprehension problem?

johor doesn't pay any money to Singapore for the treated water la.

the amount they buy from us is bigger than the amount we are buying from them.

it's net loss to Singapore.
*
The amount they buy from us is high but the amount we charge them is lesser, way lesser.
Faidzal
post Mar 3 2019, 11:26 PM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 3 2019, 11:25 PM)
The amount they buy from us is high but the amount we charge them is lesser, way lesser.
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I bet you suck at math.
syahmie8
post Mar 3 2019, 11:30 PM

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QUOTE(Faidzal @ Mar 3 2019, 10:33 PM)
we already did, but why build too much water treatment plants when we will eventually inherit those built by Singapore by year 2061?

as it is we already got a very nice water treatment plant that Singapore built for us back in 2011 when the 1st water agreement signed in 1961 lapsed in 2011.
*
Then buy the water treatment and stop selling water to Singapore la.. Why need to wait until 2061??? Lepas tu menyalak tak dpt jual air mahal.. Kena beli air mahal.. Wat the heck.. Oh well.. Something secret agreement that benefits some people la ni where the rakyat need to suffer.. 😄
TSzacky chan
post Mar 3 2019, 11:33 PM

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QUOTE(coyouth @ Mar 3 2019, 11:09 PM)
i knew a Singaporean was gonna post this to see Malaysian's reaction to it.
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i'm Malaysian...from perak...still in Malaysia... biggrin.gif

its good to see how other do thing compare to us here....nothing wrong with seeing that... tongue.gif
wanted111who
post Mar 3 2019, 11:54 PM

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QUOTE(Faidzal @ Mar 3 2019, 11:26 PM)
I bet you suck at math.
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Your math is good? Then help answer 3 simple math questions below.

How much is the total cost for 250 million gallon selling rate at 3 cent / thousand gallon

How much is the total cost for 16 million gallon of water with selling rate of 50 cent / thousand gallon?

Which one is higher per above?

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


This post has been edited by wanted111who: Mar 4 2019, 12:14 AM
wanted111who
post Mar 3 2019, 11:58 PM

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QUOTE(aniaaw325 @ Mar 3 2019, 11:33 PM)
Thats because Malaysia din lift a single finger😡

SG build, pay n maintain all the water infrastructure n will be handing over to Johor in working condition upon expiry of agt.  1st one handed in 2011 liao.  Go google.
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I know and we will be paying the maintainance fees of the treatment plant after the handover. You catch the deal? See short terms we getting free treatment plant, try see long term. We maintaining it+ selling water at lower rate

Also there are side deal with petronas in exchange of SG helping us building the treatment plant.

In a nutshell there are no free lunch given by Singapore, we are at lost again and again.

I post the link earlier. Try look for it.

This post has been edited by wanted111who: Mar 4 2019, 12:00 AM
weissPC
post Mar 4 2019, 12:09 AM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 3 2019, 11:54 PM)
Your math is good? Then help answer 3 simple math questions below.

How much is the total cost for 250 million gallon selling rate at 3 cent / thousand gallon

How much is the total cost for 16 million gallon of water with selling rate of 50 cent / thousand gallon?

Which one is higher per above?
*
Bro, you read or not?

The cost of treating the water is a few times higher than the 50 cents Singapore is charging Malaysia, it's not selling price, it's cost of subsidy and if people build infra for you what's wrong of you paying maintenance because you already untung by not paying for the infra.

I really suspect your maths and comprehension. Malaysian to a Malaysian.
weissPC
post Mar 4 2019, 12:16 AM

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If we want to argue, we need to do it properly, not use emotions, that's how we lose to the Singaporeans who use logic (but their downfall will be their pride, as is seen this thread).

This post has been edited by weissPC: Mar 4 2019, 12:17 AM
wanted111who
post Mar 4 2019, 12:17 AM

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QUOTE(weissPC @ Mar 4 2019, 12:09 AM)
Bro, you read or not?

The cost of treating the water is a few times higher than the 50 cents Singapore is charging Malaysia, it's not selling price, it's cost of subsidy and if people build infra for you what's wrong of you paying maintenance because you already untung by not paying for the infra.

I really suspect your maths and comprehension. Malaysian to a Malaysian.
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Don't care about the cost of treating the water. Bro you admit it yourself, sg is going to transfer the plant ownership to us in the future.
We are to pay for its maintainance fees, so you think SG maintainance fees and costs is going to remain as it is forever?
Our selling price is, if we don't do anything about it now.

Do you even have any ability to analyze the future? When all plant is given to Malaysia? Who's paying to maintaining it?

No wonder it's so easy for SG to milk Malaysia, the sight is so short. Long term advantage or disadvantage also dunno?

This post has been edited by wanted111who: Mar 4 2019, 12:22 AM
weissPC
post Mar 4 2019, 12:24 AM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 4 2019, 12:17 AM)
Don't care about the cost of treating the water. Bro you admit it yourself, sg is going to transfer the plant ownership to us in the future.
We are to pay for its maintainance fees, so you think SG maintainance fees and costs is going to remain as it is forever?

Do you even have any ability to analyze the future? When all plant is given to Malaysia? Who's paying to maintaining it?

No wonder it's so easy for SG to milk Malaysia, the sight is so short. Long term advantage or disadvantage also dunno?
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You tell that to the court of arbitration that you ignore the cost of treating water, can ah?

Like a Singaporean said, make a win-win agreement, we're complimentary economies, we need each other to win, and you're thinking about maintenance cost when the bigger picture is China, and potentially all the sea trade bypassing us thru Myanmar direct to China.

This post has been edited by weissPC: Mar 4 2019, 12:26 AM
Artus
post Mar 4 2019, 12:26 AM

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QUOTE(mleemlee232 @ Mar 3 2019, 05:50 PM)
You seemed like a smart cookie.

Why cant we lower our tax rate to be sama sama as SG?

We are definitely in better position to lower as we hv oil,  palm oil,  durian, rubber n all kind of resources.

Wait,  we hv Labuan.  What happen?

We really must not behave macam master race. 

Always blame other race for working hard n succeed.
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Singapore's corporate tax rate is 17% whereas ours is 24%.

Corporate income taxes is a very important source of revenue for both governments. In the case of Singapore corporate taxes is 20% of their total revenue so they cannot simply be lowered.

What I was talking about was the kind of special tax rate that is given to foreign companies that want Singapore's help in running away from paying on profits made in other countries. That's why I gave the Australian example where a big company there avoided paying the Australian corporate tax rate of 30% by doing a transfer pricing via their Singapore-based "marketing arm".

This kind of special tax rate can be closed to zero. Singapore is not bothered to tax the profit because the profit was not really generated by the Singapore company anyway. This kind of activity is damaging to neighbouring countries.


weissPC
post Mar 4 2019, 12:36 AM

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QUOTE(aniaaw325 @ Mar 4 2019, 12:34 AM)
Who started Labuan?

Labuan is a tax haven😡

badawi or Bijan?

Where is their moral compass?
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If I remember, it's PM4...
wanted111who
post Mar 4 2019, 12:41 AM

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QUOTE(aniaaw325 @ Mar 4 2019, 12:22 AM)
Agreed.

Really hope no sinkies reading this.

They will die of laughing 😁
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indeed I agree, SG will definitely laugh at us.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Summary
Sg -My 24 November 1990 agreement- agreements would expire in 2061

Singapore to build a dam across Sungei Linggiu to facilitate the extraction of water from the Johor River

Singapore would compensate Johor RM$320 million for the land needed to build the dam and its surrounding facilities. This was in addition to a premium of RM18,000 per ha (per 10,000 sq m) and an annual rent of RM30 for every 1,000 sq ft (per 92.9 sq m) of the land.

Singapore would also bear the cost of constructing and maintaining the dam, which would be transferred to Johor at a later date

Together with the water agreement signed, there was also another agreement signed with Malaysian oil company Petronas that secured the supply of 150 million cu ft (about 4.2 million cu m) of natural gas from Terengganu to Singapore.

So stupid is Malaysian, got milked like a cow still feeling grateful because they are feeding us fodder.


QUOTE(weissPC @ Mar 4 2019, 12:24 AM)
You tell that to the court of arbitration that you ignore the cost of treating water, can ah?

Like a Singaporean said, make a win-win agreement, we're  complimentary economies, we need each other to win, and you're thinking about maintenance cost when the bigger picture is China, and potentially all the sea trade bypassing us thru Myanmar direct to China.
*
Above article sure is a win to sg. Because got stupid people who see 310 million sgd owai.. Its myr, can feed us forever.

Cancelling 1 hsr project already cost us double or triple of 310 million myr.

This post has been edited by wanted111who: Mar 4 2019, 12:45 AM
Artus
post Mar 4 2019, 12:55 AM

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QUOTE(aniaaw325 @ Mar 3 2019, 11:08 PM)
Aiyo,  jux say whether we want Malaysia to honour signed agreements or not lah.

If yes to honour agt, it was provided in 1987. None other than Dr M himself consciously chose not to. Both MY media n Dr M din publicly disclose this bit. Prob to mislead the MY public to paint this agt as unfair with no px adjustment mechanism.

If no to honour agt,  then MY shld announce to the whole world that any written agt can b unilaterally changed by MY alone if the govt feel it is unfair.  Also can.

But China is a gd example.  Its lease of HK to UK is lagi unfair as China was forced to sign.  However, it stick to 1997 agt with no drama.  Instead,  it did the right thing to up its own game n see where it is now.
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I have already said that the UK didn't need to return Hong Kong Island back to China. Hong Kong Island and Kowloon was ceded in perpetuity to Britain after the First and Second Opium Wars. What that meant was that both the Hong Kong Island and Kowloon belonged to the UK - they were not leased from China.

What was leased for 99 years from China was the New Territories and the lease was to expire in 1997. The UK wanted to extend the lease on the New Territories beyond 1997 but China refused. On top of the refusal to extend the lease, China demanded the return of Hong Kong Island and Kowloon together with the New Territories when the lease on the New Territories expires in 1997.

The PM of the UK at that time, Margaret Thatcher, refused to return Hong Kong island and Kowloon and China's Paramount Leader at that time, Deng Xiaoping threatened an invasion of Hong Kong if the UK refused. Thatcher chickened-out.



Just like how Britain used its stronger military power back in the 19th century to force China into giving them Hong Kong and Kowloon, a much stronger China in the 20th century can easily demand back Hong Kong without even firing a shot.

Now you may understand why Singapore spends so much on its military. It probably need to ensure that all the unfair agreements in its favour, to continue.


Artus
post Mar 4 2019, 01:45 AM

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QUOTE(wannastudy @ Mar 3 2019, 10:50 PM)
Sg is the best at treating water, number one in the world. There are research centres, sg been doing it since a long time, and we even do it in china for them. Cleanest water in the wold

I doubt msia can treat water as well as us.

Johor tap water will be yellow and with rocks as well.
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You mean like this?

PUB explains rusty brown water flowing from tap in Ang Mo Kio HDB flat

Rusty water is very common because sure got some sediments in the water supply. Found around the world. Singapore also no exception. The bigger the water distribution network, more occurrence of broken pipes.

As long as drinking straight from the tap doesn't make you ill is good enough.

If totally don't want sediments then maybe drink your desalinated water 100% but that might kill you:

Scientists reveal public health risks with desalination



This post has been edited by Artus: Mar 4 2019, 01:46 AM
Faidzal
post Mar 4 2019, 01:56 AM

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QUOTE(syahmie8 @ Mar 3 2019, 11:30 PM)
Then buy the water treatment and stop selling water to Singapore la.. Why need to wait until 2061??? Lepas tu menyalak tak dpt jual air mahal.. Kena beli air mahal.. Wat the heck.. Oh well.. Something secret agreement that benefits some people la ni where the rakyat need to suffer.. 😄
*
1. there is a binding agreement that ends in 2061

2. why buy water treatment plant when you can get it for free?

3. why stop selling when you also get benefits from selling (effectively getting free treated water)?

and yes, who benefits from this water deal?

bukit berlari?

whistling.gif whistling.gif whistling.gif

This post has been edited by Faidzal: Mar 4 2019, 02:24 AM
Faidzal
post Mar 4 2019, 02:25 AM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 3 2019, 11:54 PM)
Your math is good? Then help answer 3 simple math questions below.

How much is the total cost for 250 million gallon selling rate at 3 cent / thousand gallon

How much is the total cost for 16 million gallon of water with selling rate of 50 cent / thousand gallon?

Which one is higher per above?

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
did you factor in the cost for Singapore to treat 1000 gallon of raw water?

of course you didn't bcos you didn't read any of the other replies as well.

ok la I humour you

1. answer is 7500 = A

2. answer is 8000 = B

but unfortunately equation no. 2 is supposed to be 16x1000x7.20 = 115,200 = C

with 7.20 the cost to Singapore to treat the water for both sides.

instead of selling water at 115,200, Singapore sold it for 8000.

C- B = Singapore loses 107,200 each time they sell to Malaysia

told you you suck at math


Faidzal
post Mar 4 2019, 02:31 AM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 3 2019, 11:58 PM)
I know and we will be paying the maintainance fees of the treatment plant after the handover. You catch the deal? See short terms we getting free treatment plant, try see long term. We maintaining it+ selling water at lower rate

Also there are side deal with petronas in exchange of SG helping us building the treatment plant.

In a nutshell there are no free lunch given by Singapore, we are at lost again and again.

I post the link earlier. Try look for it.
*
1st of all who is we?

there's no 'we'. there's only the water concession holder which in this case is ranhill.

the ranhill corp. pay maintenance fee only for the plants that supply water to johor. as per agreement.

they get money to do maintenance from johor ppl who buy their water.

as for plants that supply both johor and Singapore, it's Singapore that's responsible. as per agreement

not only you suck at math, you lack understanding of law as well.


Faidzal
post Mar 4 2019, 02:37 AM

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QUOTE(wanted111who @ Mar 4 2019, 12:41 AM)
indeed I agree, SG will definitely laugh at us.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Summary
Sg -My 24 November 1990 agreement- agreements would expire in 2061

Singapore to build a dam across Sungei Linggiu to facilitate the extraction of water from the Johor River

Singapore would compensate Johor RM$320 million for the land needed to build the dam and its surrounding facilities. This was in addition to a premium of RM18,000 per ha (per 10,000 sq m) and an annual rent of RM30 for every 1,000 sq ft (per 92.9 sq m) of the land.

Singapore would also bear the cost of constructing and maintaining the dam, which would be transferred to Johor at a later date

Together with the water agreement signed, there was also another agreement signed with Malaysian oil company Petronas that secured the supply of 150 million cu ft (about 4.2 million cu m) of natural gas from Terengganu to Singapore.

So stupid is Malaysian, got milked like a cow still feeling grateful because they are feeding us fodder.
Above article sure is a win to sg. Because got stupid people who see 310 million sgd owai.. Its myr, can feed us forever.

Cancelling 1 hsr project already cost us double or triple of 310 million myr.
*
singaporeans only laugh at YOU and you alone bcos you really are stupid.

others already pointed out your mistakes.




darth5zaft
post Mar 4 2019, 02:39 AM

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QUOTE(wannastudy @ Mar 3 2019, 10:34 PM)
I don't think msia has the ability to run a world class water treatment plant.

U see when sg treats the water, it is crystal clear and u can drink it straight.

U go to places like kl, the bloody tap water is yellow with thick chlorine and has sediments and floating stuff inside.

So there u go.

But nowadays even a xiaomi water purfier has membrane technology and can filter waste water to become drinkable...for 1000 ringgit so it is not like we are in 1960s
*
Kek

Thinking water everywhere in marehsia the same lousy quality as the one run by selangor.


The reason why KV water suck is because they never built a dam, and then take the water straight from the river on the downstream. You can see how busuk the river water in kajang and bangi already and guess what the intake is further downstream near Putrajaya.


I suggest you go pahang, penang(the island, mainland one lousy) and perak and see how the pipe water there works. Even in the afternoon the pipe water is cold.

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