For any general unit trust questions such as the ever popular distribution and cheaper to buy after dividends please read or discuss at the FSM MY thread
https://forum.lowyat.net/topic/3730638

For account opening FAQs - https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/acl/r...terAccount1.tpl

For Singapore bank account opening - https://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...aving+singapore

I'm hoping we can discuss unit trusts available on FSM SG, or other products on FSM such as retail bonds

"Great to hear that, I also received PM as well from forummer asking about FSM SG.
My favorite Asia ex japan fund goes to First State Dividen Advantage which give me quite decent of return IRR @ 13.08% for more than 2 and half years. But still lose abit to my Ponzi 2.0 performance la.. tongue.gif
https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=FSDVAD

Or you might start a thread focus about FSM SG and do not mix with long go version here, later make ppl lagi pening kepala."

I'm really bad at this... so please forgive me as the lousiest thread starter ever

I started with Dividend Advantage too... since it looked like Ponzi 2.0. But I guess I started at the wrong time, in March when India and China was at its highest... so until now I'm only breaking even...

FSM SG's bond funds are not as predictable as the msia's also, the short term SGD bond funds can lose money

And with the limited funds I have, I didn't construct a proper portfolio seeing how high the mature markets are already... but that also means it's not diversified

So boss.... what is your core portfolio? I tried looking at sui jau's, it makes me more



This post has been edited by dasecret: Oct 28 2015, 10:21 AM

oh.. so i reporting in first =D

And again, back to my question last night, which i think it was unanswered yet...

"Hmm... sound interesting. Any idea that we as Malaysian, can invest via FSM sg too?
Need to open an account there? Is it troublesome?
Which bank do you feel that it is user-friendly for online banking? *in Sg i mean...


Kindly enlighten, thanks "

This post has been edited by eleven dragon: Oct 28 2015, 01:42 AM

Sure, FSM has no restrictions in foreigners investing other than US citizens due to US laws. So be it SG or MY non-citizens can invest. For Malaysians, just need to post a form and go thru normal phone verification

Bank wise are you referring to opening a SG bank account? That can be a lot more tricky and there's another thread about it. But you do have the option of TT direct to FSM SG instead of maintaining a SG bank account. But I'm not sure what happens when u want to sell from FSM

hi
can we scan and email FSM SG form ?
how do you normally deposit money for your FSM SG account ?TT via which bank ?

I remember it has to be posted. But I could be wrong

I have a SG bank account but I'm pretty sure any malaysian bank can TT to Singapore

must be posted.

they will furnish you the TT instruction upon request. usually what i did was to TT for cash fund first then slowly pick my SG UT.

If u TT every purchase, TT charges will eat into your profits

Better TT lump sum into cash fund and park it there

Absolutely...
Do note that the cash fund return is 0.5% per annum... still a lot more superior than most SGD FDs offered in Msia at 0.2% per annum
And SGD short term bond fund return is 1.7% per annum

The game is very different in FSM SG and I'm still paying my tuition fees

Sifu, how to tag YCK1987? ... told you I'm hopeless
FSM MY thread so hot and no activity here

yck1987

Any advice if we in malaysia with local bank accounts wanna open FSM Singapore and buy UT in FSM Singapore?

I mean without going to Singapore to open bank accounts, just buy sell from malaysia only.

Is the cost very high to open and operate, buy sell FSM Singapore UTs, using malaysian banks?

Thanks.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/home/...strictions.svdo

Buy is TT fees and incurring the msia bank's exchange rate which is not so favorable compared to money changer rate

Sell is again TT fees and they only remit in USD or SGD, so if you don't have a foreign currency account in Malaysia, then you might again lose out due to unfavorable forex rate charged by your msia bank

But realistically, I would not put in FSM SG if I don't intend to keep for 3 years or longer, gotta make the TT and bank forex rate worthwhile

So say we open foreign currency account with CIMB Malaysia,
we bank in RM to be converted to SingDollars in that account, that should take care of TT fees right??

If Singdollars keep going up, why not,later can get back more RM

Short term bond fund where will lose money? I suggest you can look into UNITED SGD FUND CL A ACC which I think is less riskier & less volatile short term bond fund in the market. This fund always remind me characteristic of Ambond slow and steady type. If you are fancy about the return of RHB ASIAN TOTAL RETURN FUND might as well direct put ur money into their mother fund UNITED ASIAN BOND FUND CLASS SGD as I believe the high return of Asian total return is solely because of MYR depreciation in the past.

On the side note, there were really huge variety of bond fund to pick from FSM SG. https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/bond/home/index.svdo

Foreign currency account takes care of the forex losses; TT fees is like our IBG fees, but more because it's sending money to another country. I think for HSBC accounts it's like RM25 per transaction, I could be wrong though

Good thing with foreign currency account is, when you sell in FSM SG and remit the money back to the foreign currency account, you can choose not to change to RM where you may incur another round of forex losses

You should check the bank buy and sell rates, the spread is exorbitant
Even with the favorable forex movement, most of the time you can barely cover the spread
And for SGD to go up from RM2.6 to RM3.0 in less than 3 months is not a normal event, I do not expect that to happen even once a year... so don't bank on SGD sure go up

In short summary, is not worth if you do not have account over here as tt fees will eat up all your profit.
I was almost in auto pilot mode as I practice DCA to buy in more units on every 8th of the month with 0% SC upfront.

Will look at the United SGD fund, I was referring to the short term bond as part of the parking facility fund. Some days that short term bond NAV may go lower than the before, but most of the time it's temporary la. Not so use to it because ringgit denominated bond funds usually don't lose money

I have RHB Asian Total return fund, so I didnt get the United asian bond fund

What other funds you DCA monthly?

FSM Sgp also offers funds that payout monthly dividends. Then we get our money faster to take advantage of opportunities in the mkt, or for our monthly usage for those who are retired.

It's just like a monthly salary dropping our account.

These are high-yield bond funds. They are available in the USD too. Good proxy for keeping your USDs, than letting your USDs sit in the bank earning zero interest.

Edited by adding the third para to provide more infos for investors.

This post has been edited by Hansel: Oct 31 2015, 01:02 PM

The high-yield bonds funds are yielding 7+% at current nav.

I have Allianz Us HY, Natixis IF Loomis Multisector Inc SGD H and United Asian HY Bond Dist Sgd.

Which fund is giving the yield of 7%?

I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund.

Recommended funds by FSM SG :

Asian Ex Japan : First State Dividend Advantage

YTD : 5.5%
Return : 1 yr (10.26%), 2 yr (12.66%), 3 yr (12.05%)

As for me, i will change the SGD notes in Msia and pass to a friend to bank in Sg bank. Most of them come back every 2-3 month once. Can save TT charges too.

Can try OCBC

The one that you are holding, the Alianz US HY. The price as of Oct 30, 2015 is USD 8.49 per unit and the annual DPU = USD 0.06 per month per unit x 12 = USD0.72 per year.

USD 0.72 / USD 8.49 = 8.48% yield.

HOWEVER : High Yield Bonds are also known as Junk Bonds - that's what many people say. Risk of defaults ?

Or you can change with your friend who's a malaysian and work in Singapore. They need spending money when they go back hometown right? Save even the spread on money changer

Yes you are right. But most of them dont wan. even good friend. Unless you have siblings there.

Yeah i know. But thar is just a small amt in portfolio.

No pain no gain.

What funds are you having nw?

why ar? Takut u makan their money? Change at mid rate means they dont need to lose money to money changer also ma

But the interesting part is I have been carrying a Euro HY Bond Fund for eight years, and right thru the European Crisis too, and till today, the HY Bond Fund is still paying-out 4.17% of yield.

The DPU does go up and down, so does the NAV, but the yield has always been above 4%.

I heard these HY Bond Funds will have their NAVs dropping badly when the US rate hike does happen, but if the FOMC is careful enough not to raise too much, and is data-dependant to decide on when to hike, then the impact to the US-centric HY Bond Funds should be minimal.

I am just waiting to top-up on these US-centric HY Bond Funds, with the view that the US mkt should be able to do well, with the close 'nurturing' of the US Gov't. Are you waiting to top-up too ? What that truely caught my eyes about these HY Bond Funds are their monthly payout feature, with which I can get my hands on my money faster for reinvestment.

Thanks! The fund looks really good

['QUOTE(prince_mk @ Nov 3 2015, 10:52 AM)
I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund. '
quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 04:04 PM]
Thanks! The fund looks really good

[/quote]

Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[quote=Hansel,Nov 3 2015, 05:03 PM]
['QUOTE(prince_mk @ Nov 3 2015, 10:52 AM)
I put in United Asian HY Bond Dist SGD. My favourite fund. '
quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 04:04 PM]
Thanks! The fund looks really good

[/quote]

Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[/quote]

I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

And which Allianz HY are you referring to?
If it is this
https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=ALZ198

Then the IRR does not look good at all, it's negative for 1 year and 2 year annualised

This post has been edited by dasecret: Nov 3 2015, 05:22 PM

[quote=dasecret,Nov 3 2015, 05:17 PM]
Hi prince and dasecret, this fund got me interested and I looked up in it. Based on the fund properties, looks like the fund was launched way back in May 13, 2013, and it only started paying monthly dividend on April 29. 2014.

https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=UOB046

Any idea why did it not start to pay dividend upon launching ?

Analysing the dividend payout each month from April 2015 till October 2015, the lowest payout was in July 14, amounting to SGD 0.00662159 per unit.

SGD 0.00662159 x 12 = SGD 0.079458, and SGD 0.079458 / SGD 1.175 (price for Oct 30, 2015) gives a yield of 6.76%, which is a fair yield,... yes !

The dividend does not seem to be consistent every month, unlike the Allianz HY USD Funds which give out quite a consistent dividend. What are the other factors that you guys look at which qualify this fund as being good ?

[/quote]

I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

[/quote]

Thank you, dasecret,... if you're of that view, then wouldn't a fund that does not pay out dividends at all, not to mention monthly dividends some more, provide you better IRR (hence, leading to ROI too) than this fund ? A fund that keeps all its earnings for would be able to increase its NAV better and faster, right ?

Do you look at its holdings, and the safety of the fund's holdings, since we are dealing with High Yield bonds being the holdings of the funds here ?

I observed that the IRR, or the nav movement started to trend down when the FOMC announced the tapering event last year, followed by the 'threat' of the rate hike this year. Previously, the nav movement was either increasing and remained stable.

I believed that the nav will recover after the FOMC has actually performed the rate hike. But if course, this is left to be seen,... I am waiting for the rate hike.

Why do they have 2 types of fund performance readings - the Offer to Bid and the Bid-to Bid Returns ?

[quote=Hansel,Nov 3 2015, 05:22 PM]
I look at fund returns in the form of IRR, and ROI to a lesser extent. Dividend yield is not a consideration for me since I prefer to reinvest and grow my investment

[/quote]

Thank you, dasecret,... if you're of that view, then wouldn't a fund that does not pay out dividends at all, not to mention monthly dividends some more, provide you better IRR (hence, leading to ROI too) than this fund ? A fund that keeps all its earnings for would be able to increase its NAV better and faster, right ?

Do you look at its holdings, and the safety of the fund's holdings, since we are dealing with High Yield bonds being the holdings of the funds here ?

[/quote]

Sorry.... I'm quite lost here

Have you been following the distribution discussion on FSM MY thread? Basically in the case of reinvested distribution, the dividends have no bearings in your IRR.

I always look at BID TO BID RETURNS
"The performance figures in the table above are calculated using bid-to-bid prices, with any income or dividends reinvested. Performance figures of over 1 year are annualised.(Eg. A 33.1% gain in 3 years works out to a 10% gain per year when annualised.)"

You could be paid monthly dividends, but if it is out of your capital, what is the point? The total return is at a loss actually

Some guides frm FSM Msia V12

Put it simply, dividend is just "left hand go right hand"; there is ZERO IMPACT to the investor's value of holdings.

- Fund XYZ has 100,000 units issued, initially issued at RM1.00
- Current NAV price is RM1.02
- XYZ declares a "10% dividend" of 10 sen a unit
- After the dividend, the NAV will go down to RM0.92

For sake of illustration, we assume that dividends are paid out in cash (not reinvested), and no tax on the distribution.

Ali says: "Eh XYZ very good, gave me 10% returns..."
Answer:
WRONG! The 10% is expressed by reference to the Initial Offer Price of RM1.00 (RM1.00 x 10% = 10 sen). It does not mean that the fund made a profit of 10% for investors. In this scenario, the fund actually only made a return of 2% (RM1.00 + 2% = RM1.02) during the period.

Simply said, just imagine you pass me RM100 to invest in a trolley cart. 1 year later the trolley cart become worth RM92, and I collected rental income of RM10 on your behalf. The value of your investment is now RM102. I then decide to return 10% i.e. RM10 to you. So now u have a RM92 trolley cart and RM10 in cash on hand. The "dividend" that I decided to give you has ZERO IMPACT on the net worth of your investment, which remain at RM102.

Here's another variation to the scenario above; your RM100 investment could actually have incurred a loss, and I could still decide to "reward" you with a 10% "dividend". Let's say a wheel on your trolley was damaged, now your trolley is only worth RM60. The value of your investment is now RM60 + RM10 (rental income received in cash) = RM70. But I could still proudly say that I'm declaring a 10% "dividend" to reward you brows.gif

Key Lesson Point
A unit trust fund can declare dividend even when it has actually made its investors@unitholders poorer. By regulation, a unti trust fund can only declare dividend out of its REALISED INCOMES (interest income, dividend income, net proceed from sale of investments, rental income etc). Gains from market price fluctuations are not realised, i.e. they're "paper gain/(loss)". So, you could be having
(a) Fund A got realised incomes from which to declare dividends, even though during the same period it has huge paper losses.
(b) Fund B made lots of paper gains from market price movements, but it cannot/decided not to declare dividend to unitholders because of insufficient realised incomes. Bear in mind, some funds actually have a "no dividend" policy, and they are great performers. wink.gif

Offer to bid is after deducting standard sales charge; which is higher than FSM's
Bid to bid is without deducting sales charge; that's the number I look at

one should just simply ignore the divident/distribution effect in UT.

What is Offer to Bid Returns (%) & Bid to Bid Returns (%)?
This is on the subject of investment returns of Unit Trusts.

Best Answer
The easiest way to translate this is bid to bid (BB) means before charges (such as broker fees) and offer to bid (OB) means after charges. So a return on a Unit trust that is calculated OB is the return after all of the charges have been taken into account.

My Equity funds holding as at Nov 2015 :

1. Nikko AM Japan Div
2. First State Dividend Advantage
3. Pinebridge India Equity
4. Unitrd Globalhealthcare fund

prince, dasecret and yck,... Thank you for your inputs.

In essence, what I gathered from the inputs is that dividend payouts are actually 'left-pocket-to-right-pocket' moves, and these moves are damaging to the nav. So, it is better to buy funds which do not give out dividends.

If we intend to diversify our investments by including funds which give out dividends for our cashflow, what can we do ? Or are we saying here that this is actually a bad idea, and that there is no such thing as a fund (or a unit trust) that gives out dividends, and still to continue to perform well in the long run ?

Edited by adding to the third para to make the statement clearer and more precise.

This post has been edited by Hansel: Nov 4 2015, 12:35 PM

Same thing, focus on bid-to-bid returns. But hor, past returns are not indicative of future performance
Shortlist funds that you are happy with; then within those funds, if you prefer those that payout dividends for cash flow purposes, choose those lor. Just bear in mind if you don't reinvest the dividends, your capital would not really grow, or might shrink if the dividend payout is greater than IRR

Or, if you like a fund that does not do distribution, you can DIY dividends by selling some units on a periodic basis to simulate the dividend payout

What others equity funds that u think is performing besides First State Dividend Advantage (Asia Pac Ex Jap)?

This post has been edited by prince_mk: Nov 5 2015, 07:26 AM

What others equity funds that u think is performing besides First State Dividend Advantage (Asia Pac Ex Jap)?

I wanted to ask you this question but you beat me to it

I also have First State Asian Growth fund, but both funds are from the same sector, so up and down together one
The US and europe funds all sky high dy so I don't dare to masuk la...limited bullets

What others equity funds that u think is performing besides First State Dividend Advantage (Asia Pac Ex Jap)?

I would suggest to look up at https://secure.fundsupermart.com/main/fundi...olnumber=AMD015
for global equity sector. I used to hold my long favorite Aberdeen Global Opportunities but recent months I switch all holdings from Aberdeen to Amundi Fund.

The main reason for the switch between this two fund is due to the strategy of the fund. The First Eagle Amundi International fund adopts a value investing approach and focuses on financially strong or monopolistic companies. The fund does not have any restrictions in terms of market capitalization or geographical allocations, current allocations are due to the stock and value selection process the manager adopts. The fund also holds a small portion in gold to act as an event hedge in case stock markets were to face an unexpected correction, in addition they can also hold significant amounts in cash or treasuries if their stock selections are not at attractive valuations.

As I have observed from the fund’s past performance against the Aberdeen Global Opportunities, the strategy has historically allowed them to experience lower levels of volatility without sacrificing their ability to generate returns for investors. However do note that in extremely bullish conditions, the First Eagle Amundi International fund can potentially underperform due to its more defensive investment approach. So pick your own choice.

Please read Post #1 on FSM Malaysia thread to understand more on distributions/dividends in the context of unit trusts. It has got no impact at all to your net worth, so it's neither good nor bad.

^
He said it well.

E.g. your target have RM2K a month from your investments. Then every month just sell RM2K worth of units to "pay yourself".

But make sure your funds are growing at rate greater than that, else you will be withdrawing from your capital, which will shrink over time from your withdrawal action.

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 4 2015, 06:57 PM

The following reply would be most relevant to my current research :-

Then what's the point of dividend distribution since units and NAV price has negative correlation?

Distribution is very relevant especially to retiree investors who want a source of income. For this type of investors, basically what they can do is to invest in a fund that has a distribution policy, and elect to receive distributions in the form of CASH. To an investor who elect to receive distributions in cash, distributions are a form of income, a cash inflow; gains in NAV price are capital growth.

E.g. upon retirement you have RM1mil which you invest in a fund. The fund that you invested in made a return of 10% and declares 8% as dividend for the financial year, that's RM80,000 of cash inflow for you! Of course, when a distribution is declared and paid, the NAV price will drop proportionately. The balance of 2% that are not declared as distribution will be reinvested for future growth.

I would like to mention a HY Fund which I have invested in since 2007. It pays out a monthly dividend.

I bought the fund at an average price of EUR11.04 back in 2007/2008. The price as of today is at : EUR11.24.

Throughout the years, I have been receiving dividends every month without fail, though the amount given out goes up and down. I received the dividend amount for October 2015 two weeks back, which came to EUR 0.0390 for the month of Oct, 2015.

Annualised for EUR 0.0390 came to EUR 0.468. Hence, yield = 4.23%.

I have cap gain as well as monthly dividend for this HY fund. This fund has done well over the European Crisis too, not to mention other crises that came about in the past 7 - 8 years.

Would you agree that this should be the type of fund that we should hunt for ? Alternatively,...should we rather look at it as : if this fund does not pay out dividends, the nav price could have reached EUR 13.00 today ?

No be frank, I stopped reading at paragraph 3 of your post...then I re-read the whole thing when I see the last line.

Yes, that HY fund u mentioned would be 100%, definitely and surely valued at a way higher NAV price had it not distributed dividends. Basically the NAV would be around

Current NAV price add back all the dividends distributed = NAV price had it not distributed any dividends

A mutual fund does not behave in a same way as a stock. In fact, it does not even have a "behaviour", so to speak of.

The NAV price is a very scientific, mechanical calculation = assets less liabilities divided by the number of units

Whereas a stock can trade higher and lower than its underlying valuation from the bidding and offering process in the market, i.e. there are many variables that can affect the price of a stock.

U really need to read up more and understand better WHAT IS A UNIT TRUST/MUTUAL FUND'S NAV PRICE.

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 4 2015, 09:55 PM

I get it - let me add this,... a fund can be made up of equities (an equity fund), or bonds (a bond fund) or a mixture of equities and bonds (a balanced fund).

Let's take an equity fund as eg. The nav would be the total book value of all the equity counters in the fund divided by the number of counters in the fund.

Thank you,.. rest assured that I will do my homework before I wasted more of your time,.. I'll be honest that yes, I intend to pick-up more via discussions.

Eh, wrong!

NAV price of an equity fund would be sum of MARKET VALUE of all its equity counters, its cash, less its liabilities divided by the no. of units the equity fund has in circulation.

A stock is an ownership in a company.

E.g. ABC Berhad net assets (total assets less total liabilities) are worth RM10M. It has 10M shares in circulation, hence NAV of RM1 per share. Yet it is perfectly normal for it to be traded on an Exchange for RM5, RM10 or even RM20. Just take a look at DiGi.com Berhad for example.

But a mutual fund is different. A mutual fund can only be bought and sold at its NAV price, nothing more, nothing less.

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 4 2015, 10:18 PM

From FSM thread Post #1

Go study Post #1 THOROUGHLY and u should have a basic picture on what is a unit trust.

Pinky, I appreciated your reply... so, an equity fund is not equal to a mutual fund ? What are the underlyings of a mutual fund ?

Edited by adding : did not see your immediate previous post when I replied to this. Okay,..I'll take it from here. You don't have to answer the above. Anyway, I am into Bond Funds,.. so I'll focus into bond funds, specifically High Yield Bond Funds.

The 'images are very clear now'.

This post has been edited by Hansel: Nov 4 2015, 10:35 PM

mutual fund = unit trust fund
different name for the same thing

While a unit trust fund can be an equity fund, bond fund, balance fund, or a money market fund

Same.

Bonds are either valued at market value or yield-to-maturity amortised cost (well, this is an accounting/finance term, go learn more if u keen ).

A mutual fund's NAV is the aggregate of its assets less its liabilities.

Hence, NAV price is NAV divided by no. of units.

Glad to have helped

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 4 2015, 10:43 PM

Thank you, Pinky,... appreciated it.

Btw our Ponzi2 is available in FSM SG anyone buy this fund hehehehehe

I was advised by CIS that choose one of them coz they are having same mandate.

What i understand frm FSM Msia thread, sky high price means u get lesser units. when choosing a unit, u should see its performance instead of its price correct me if wrong.

101% correct

I have been with FSM for quite some years, just simply because of it low sales charge, 0.5% for lump sum and 0% for RSP unlike most of the sg local bank like UOB offer me 2.5% for the sales charge.

I still doing a RSP every month to bought into below 5 funds, the amount will be auto GIRO from my SG account. 0% sales charge why not right ?

1. Allianz Europe equity growth
2. Allianz income and grow
3. BlackRock multi asset income fund A6 sgd hedged
4. First state dividend advantage SGD
5. United greater China fund

Basically buy in every month is to do a dollar averaging.
This act as my satellite portfolio as you can see only BlackRock GMAI is a core fund, others 4 are tactical.

This post has been edited by terence_say: Nov 5 2015, 08:29 AM

Doing the sAme way on monthly RSP, just got GIRO deduction from my saving account for this month.

If you are going to a regional tactical fund.
Europe market and Japan market with QE is worth a look.

Europe may can have a look at Allianz Europe equity
Japan may can look at Eastspring Japan dynamic

If higher risk taker, Indonesia and India pure equity fund is suitable for long term, try to choose those accumulate and without dividend payment for tactical equity.

But ofcourse, first state DIVA are all the way the best selling fund especially for CPF OA investment. Constant divident, 1% of NAV every quarter with proven upside possibility is the best selling point.

If you are higher risk taker and looking at a sector fund
Healthcare sector may a good area to consider
Eg: United health care fund.

Yup, I just checked my account, the GIRO just go through. They GIRO 3 business day before the subscription date which normally is 8 of every month unless 8 is a non business day then become 9

could you mind sharing which fund is in your RSP list?

This post has been edited by terence_say: Nov 5 2015, 08:47 AM

Oops, wrong term... I mean already at very high valuations... anyway... no bullets how to buy?! I transferred some long term money to Singapore for capital protection from the declining forex, so looking for not so high risk funds. So likely I wont go into HY funds, but the Amundi fund sounds good. Thanks for the recommendations!

Btw, for a 28 year old chap you are doing very well in terms of investing
I still blur blur at that age

TQ boss to help explain

I don't belong to this thread...

But u can call on me anytime to explain on the technical stuff on UTs

Wont consider putting some money into Singapore? SG REITs I was told is not bad too...

Wait next year bonus baru fikir, my MY investments serving me well thus far

Wait, next year bonus dunno got or not...times are bad

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 5 2015, 09:29 AM

Of the five funds that you have listed, please be careful of the Allianz Income and Growth Fund, the Platform Fee in FSM Sgp follows the structure for Equities Fund. This Platform Fee thing started back ard 2010/2011, and for those who purchased Fixed-Income Funds, the Platform Fee is 0.05% of your holdings amount per quarter, deducted around the middle of the months of Mar, Jun, Sep and Dec.

This equates to 0.20% of your holdings amt per year.

I don't recall the Equities Fund Platform Fee, but it is higher than the one for Fixed Income Funds !

Bonds are tradeable, when the price of a bond goes up or down, the annualised coupon payout of the bond when divided by the current mkt price of the same bond goes up or down too. This in turn, gives rise to the yield of the bond.

This is called the : yield-to-maturity = YTM.

The YTM amortised cost of the same bond is related to this movement as the bond undergoes buying and selling in the marketplace where it is traded upon as it apprached its maturity date day-by-day, if it is not a perpetual bond.

But be careful of a bond that is redeemable, where it can be called back by the issuer at the pre-agreed terms of the issuer. We must understand the terms.

Whether to value a bond at market value or at amortised cost is a matter of accounting policy.

If the holder i.e. the fund intends to AND have a history of holding bonds to maturity, it has the OPTION of valuing its bond holdings at amortised cost, but if the fund displays history/trend of selling for profit i.e. trading bonds, then it has to value at market value. This is what I learned from my accounting studies.

Benefit of valuing at amortised cost would be, market fluctuations won't hit your P&L. But I guess most bond funds would be trading bonds occasionally, this making amortised cost accounting inapplicable.

Wow, let's not stray into financial accounting stuff here, let's stop this topic here shall we?

I'll put it in more layman's terms. In Sgp,... we call the amortised cost as being the closest possible to the mark-tomkt value. Today, if I am to take a loan of any form in Sgp, my collaterals will always be evaluated frequently against the mark-to-mkt value. The mark-to mkt value dos change, though not it is not that volatile. If it is too volatile, then nobody would want to borrow in Sgp anymore.

BOnd FUnds - this is what I am into,... HY Funds. No,... Bond Funds do sell and buy and with this action - they are managing our portfolios actively. this activity of buying and selling is more apparent when the mkt is volatile and the rate of default goes up. This is to keep us safe, and the reason why we are paying the manager fees.

I would want them to buy and sell more frequently, since I have alaredy paid their charges. They should not just sit on their laurels and try to save on their side of the fees for buying and selling and managing their portfolios effectively - I have heard of certain bond funds trying to save on their fees, even when these fees are negligent.

Amortisation is a term closely related to an accounting event 'predicted' for the future, much like Depreciation. The contribution of the Amortisation effect is important for the purpose of calculation,... in our current debate, the value for investors. Hence, the Amortised Cost must be watched closely, and not to be taken lightly as if there is no movement at all.

Accounting can be captured fairly quickly and easily by 21st Century individuals. Sometimes, we need to dive into it when we wish to have safer investments.

I surrender

This post has been edited by Pink Spider: Nov 5 2015, 10:00 AM

Hi Hansel, thanks for your reminder
I always transfer out my unit to UOB every 6 months to avoid this so called "platform fees"

Okay,... gents, I need to rush to the airport,... the captain will issue just two calls after everybody has boarded EVEN though they declared they will wait for ALL 'front' passengers who have checked-in to board before they close the final doors for takeoff.

Pinky,.. appreciated your comments, Sir,... thank you.

you know the Ninja trick of SG version.
Another thing do you notice that there are no switching fees charges even you make inter-fund same tier switching between different fund house in Equity fund? This is so different from MY version that need to pay the initial SC again when you switch into different fund house and this could bring benefit to those investor that do regular switching from one and another fund for the saving of upfront fees.

Boss Pinky

I learnt frm you. Tks for useful posting in FSM Msia thread. But i m still picking up. Keep up the efforts.

Ya ,I started with FSM Msia and learn from him too. Sifu pinky

Yeah..the United Healthcare fund is top performing fund. Just went in thia fund last week.

How about Small Cap funds in FSM Sg ?

A FSM article recommending :

1. Threadneedle Lux Pan Euro SM Cap Opp Ash
2. BNY Melon Japan Equity SM Cap

Thinking to have this as sup portfolio.

How does this work? Buy from FSM SG and transfer to a bank for longer term holding? Banks have no platform fee I presume?

I like the services from FSM including switching etc though

Yes, buy from FSM to enjoy low sales charge and transfer to a bank such as UOB OCBC or DBS to avoid platform fees.

Bank do not have any platform fees, so is suitable for long term holding core fund.

Most of the banker will tell you cannot be done because it is a troublesome "sai kang" and do not earn them any revenue point, so find the right person is the crucial part.

In bank prospective view, they are more than happy to take in more unit from FSM because it count to their portfolio AUM.

Just topup First State Dividend Advantage and Allianz US HY today coz it was red.

Isnt the platform fee charged on quarterly basis? Even then fund is making loss also transfer back to bank ? Confused.

Transfer out the unit from Fundsupermart to one of the bank. Unit no more under Fundsupermart therefore no platform fees charge

Why Allianz US high yield

Most of the HNWI customer suffer big loss from this fund.
This fund was one of the focus fund introduce to UOB privilege banking customer last year, but had been remove from the favourite list and many customer suffer huge loss.