Use 2 post ok lor UW

I agree. Binding has a cost. It can cost your life, It can cost your assets... But of course, there is a reward in heaven for those who pay the price.

For protestant, i think the best verse is: Pick up the cross, pay the price.
For charismatics, remember joseph prince teaching about grace ? try to park those activities under GOD's grace perhaps damage will be minimal.

and for both churches: Give glory to GOD , we don't deserve it...

I've not heard from the slip disc friend. Our timezones tak ngam. He lives in Australia and don't always come online.

But now another prayer request urgently needed.

My friend is working with a good Christian boss. But they've not been doing well. They do systems security.

Despite his best efforts it's like everything is against him. Either this is a bad way, or Satan is blocking him.

If can give a moment of prayer, will help a lot. Their deadline is the end of December. Otherwise got to jual everything.

James 3 talking about tongue... especially 5 n 6

in practical don't say like this to malaysia: aiyoo my country die lahh... difficult lah... racism lahh... now gasoline oso increase... now property buble ...

instead you say: my country malaysia is blessed... it's work in progress... GOD bless malaysia ... similar tone n attitude lahh...

I've never disputed against pointing out what is sin. But always reaffirm as how Paul preach it.
You are already saved, why still act and live like a sinner? Remind the believers, they are already cleansed and made righteous, through their faith in Christ
made as a child of God, why degrade yourself and live who you are not meant to be?

That is the correct way to reach out and correct believers. Not these condemnations.




What I'm disputing against, is judging like this for example:
You're evil, you're no good, you're bla bla bla, condemning how bad the guy is while seeing how good and righteous upon himself in contrast.
That is how the bible define judging others.

We may think we don't really judge like this but sometime it's a subconscious thing, just need to be careful.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Nov 3 2014, 05:28 PM

I just wish that one day the Malaysian malay muslim can have the free will to choose his/her own religion in this country.

How come from english collonial can ended up a federal with moslem as official religion ? Can share me the historical material ?

there must be some activity by malaysian forefather to principalities in the air in order to secure whole semenanjung... i mean the gravity of whole semananjung in spritiual realm is not peanut size... look how many soul lost every day...

This post has been edited by de1929: Nov 3 2014, 05:12 PM

pm me their names, will pray later tonight.

Binding and releasing...

basic concept:

http://www.gotquestions.org/binding-loosing.html

some practical application to deal with witch craft bonded person. Just to get the idea of how to implement in ministry or our discussion context, binding RONA.

http://truthinreality.com/2012/08/15/praye...-of-witchcraft/

wow heated debate..

i think ultimately if a christian believes
1) he is a sinner and needs God (not by works)
2) only Jesus can be that bridge as savior (by faith)

a lot else is cherry picking (sort of). aren't we at the end of the day, made to worship God and share the good news

a lot of what was mentioned is important, but let's not deviate from what is important
-which finally leads to making disciples

malaysia is formerly a bunch of states ruled by the sultans which is Muslim religion..........
then come the colonial starting with melaka sultanate fall to Portuguese invasion on Melaka, this is the beginning of colonial occupation on other states of Malaya, which begin many years later as the internal conflicts begin to brew in which lead to the British East India intervention, which lead to the installment of British Residents on allied states and British advisors on non allied states

Can get pretty sensitive topic

but wiki can find some like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumiputera_(Malaysia)

Ok... let's me give my analysis

1. 200 years, the natives of british colonialized countries have become minorities and discriminized... (ngai wiki post above)
well this is almost 6 generations ? a bitterness inherit a bitterness... a generation curse...

2. in 1957 article 153 issued, to secure bumiputera rights... after 200 years malaysia bumiputera become minorities, somebody fights and win.
generation curse is not being cancelled, but bumiputera wins... at what cost ? now chinese and india have lesser privileges.... a typical eye for eye law has been applied spiritually.

-----------------------------
ok lah that's the past...
-----------------------------

-- talking about future, what can we do for malaysia :

somebody must pay the price for revival in malaysia. ...
cancel the generation curse,
heal the wounded heart,
forgive our forefathers

and i am talking about continuing processes, not 1 minute bind release things...

Well.
It seems on surface, we are in agreement.

Unfortunately the truth is narrow.

"why still act and live like a sinner?"

The thing is, if you look at the Gospels.
Jesus said that only the sick(sinners) need a doctor.
The pharaisees think they are not sick and thus they do not need one.

Also, it's stated explicitly that Jesus ate with sinners.

Only sinners recognize their inadequacies. They recognize that they are really nothing. Only sinners recognize that whatever they did before are not profitable. Sinners are able to forgive others because they recognize that they themselves are a sinner.

In other words, they recognize that God is justified in condemning them. But then because of God's grace, they are not condemned anymore.

Even Paul says that he is a sinner. He never used the word was
But I received mercy because I had acted ignorantly in unbelief, 14 and the grace of our Lord overflowed for me with the faith and love that are in Christ Jesus. 15 The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost.

The problem is that if you think you are not a sinner, then why would you need to repent.

Our Father in heaven,
Hallowed be Your name.
10 Your kingdom come.
Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
As we forgive our debtors.
13 And do not lead us into temptation,
But deliver us from the evil one.
For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.

If we are not a sinner, why do we need to ask our Father to forgive our debts?

The thing is, even though we recognize that our sins have been forgiven because Jesus has died for us, but then we acknowledge that we are currently still sinners. We still commit sin. And we still need forgiveness.

In fact, because we are believers, we should recognize even more that we are sinners. We do things that displeases God. We make mistakes. We entertain evil thoughts. etc.
Since we are now even more sensitive to sin, we recognize even more that many of what we do daily are not acceptable and that is why we ask for God's forgiveness even more. We understand the inability of overcoming our sins by our own strength. So we ask God to help us in this.
We recognize that before we were believers, we do many things that shamed God's name. We really deserve death, etc.
It's only when we recognize that we are sinners, that we can only come to God with a humble heart. That we are able to recognize God's grace even more.

If you think you are no longer a sinner, why would you need God's grace?

This post has been edited by sylar111: Nov 3 2014, 06:43 PM

Okay let me try to be extremely simple with this...

I understand your point, you're saying that we shouldn't call people out if we're not sure what they're actually preaching. But before this you went on and on about how we shouldn't even spend our time rebuking other preachers(when I posted a video addressing some of Osteens writings), but then you shifted from that stance and now you're saying that if they're really preaching heresy, they should be publicly rebuked,THAT is how you shifted. Now you're asking me to prove that Joseph Prince preaches the propserity gospel, and I posted a link to a shop where he DESCRIBES one of the products (sermons) that he's selling and yet you insist that it isn't sufficient evidence although he clearly says himself on his own website that "Do you know that God has provided a guaranteed path to prosperity and good success?". The sermon is 30 ringgit btw.

Now here's where you're being iffy:

1) First you say that Prince wasn't teaching the prosperity gospel here, although it's already implied in his own statement. For goodness sake, the title of the sermon is called "God's guarantee for your prosperity"

2)Then you shift your stance and you say there's nothing wrong with prosperity and that my understanding of what prosperity is wrong ALTHOUGH it's the MEANING of the word prosperity in English. If you THINK Prince defines prosperity OTHER than how the english language defines it, then the burden of proof is on YOU to prove it.

What do you have to prove? That Joseph Prince, in his statement that God guarantees your prosperity, he doesn't mean "materially rich as in having millions of $$$". The original definition of the word from the dictionary has already been shown to be against your argument, so it's on you to provide the defense.




Now let's deal with your own theology of prosperity: If you yourself don't believe that prosperity doesn't mean getting rich financially, what then do you think the word means?

Without using the word prosperity, let me lay out my argument: Being a Christian DOES NOT GUARANTEE you being financially rich, or healthy or to have a succesful career or the like. If you agree with my argument, then we have nothing to argue about over what we believe about prosperity.

Pretty funny sylar111... i tot we have discussion on this. UW mindset different with u.

sinner: if you kill someone, without Christ, you ended up in hell.
debt: if you kill someone, but already received Christ, you ended in heaven, cuz you ask forgiveness

kill represent and of doing something prohibited by law, either moses, major / minor law. any single law.

Yes, Church first (because ecclesiology is so important, the idea of us as a people of God). But my church is pretty much reformed, so I haven't met anyone as close to some of the people here.

Well here's where we might differ. Yes, we shouldn't be too "repent or go to hell!" to our friends, but an essential part of the gospel is that we were saved from God's wrath, so we ought to tell them that if they refuse the grace of christ, then they will not be saved by God's wrath. It's not something that random people will be willing to hear though, but with regards to best friends...

I used to believe in passive-evangelism (wait for people to come to you), but it didn't look very scriptural to me: Don't think Paul could've done what he did by being passive in his evangelism: it looked like he actively approached people to preach the gospel.

And if the gospel is the most important message that our dear friends need to hear, shouldn't we be actively trying to preach? Also, Jesus loves sinners and wants to see them repent, shouldn't we as his disciples want that too?

believer = disciples = Christian = saint?

Yep! In many of Paul's epistles, he starts it by stating who the letter is for e.g. "To the saints in...."

From that itself, we can understand whether the letter was written to a Christian audience or mixed audience or not.

Joseph prince teaches about radical grace, not prosperity teaching. About RM 30 things ? it's nothing compares to kennetch copeland prosperity teaching.

If you don't know UW, better shut up and go elsewhere honestly. I am tired with stone thrower. and I reserves rights to complain to Christ about your attitude

You already said you have problem understanding the English language, and I don't blame you for that. Please don't interrupt our discussions if you don't understand what we're talking about, thanks