"If they cannot find jobs, what is the point? You own a degree, but so what? That you can't eat it. If that cannot give you a good life, a good job, it is meaningless,"

http://www.straitstimes.com/breaking-news/...on-wan-20130505

So to answer your question, degree holder = no class

Macam a little misleading leh...

According to the link it should be...

Degree holders who can't find job = No class


Anyway... I think depends on industry la... For me in construction, as of my experience, a fresh grad degree holder is just like a medium between lower class (construction workers, site supervisor, site coordinator etc) and the higher class (the boss and client)

Like the fillings of a sandwich

Remember cheaper, better, faster ? (pick all 3 not 2 )
http://www.ntuc.org.sg/wps/wcm/connect/173...1b2f75ef3647d50

Degree holder not cheap, better nor faster

Or there might be too many degree holders OR too few jobs going around for them hence the statement.

Lazy read la...

You mean SG degree holder? M'sia degree holder quite cheap in SG wor (Maybe just me?) Can be better and faster depends on person.


Too many degree holders... Probably... Not to mention that degree holders from all over the world is pouring in. I attended my BCSS course with people from M'sia, India, Indonesia, Myanmar... From their appearance, I must admit I have the prejudice that they just started as construction workers with maybe O level or even lower... But no... I looked at the attendance list, only 1 or 2 or them don't own a degree. That 1 or 2 have diploma too...

Have to admit that I'm judging them by their look because if I meet similar looking ppl in M'sia, I won't expect them to have a diploma nor degree. Will only expect them to work in computer shop/construction. Coming to SG really do open up my mind quite much It's just so different Other than having to leave my family and friends to work here, not much complaint.

The safety course? How was it? Taught by who? Quite cheap leh 30 plus hours for 100 plus sgd? Maybe I enroll too I work at site but I never attend hehe.

Ya the safety course. Taught by who? I forgot the name d. Indian trainer. Tips give kaw kaw but not by the Indian trainer, by another chinese trainer that take over the last lesson, then group evaluation, just part with some pro. I just copy during the evaluation. Although I did study for it and will also pass on my own la but since there's free meal, take it lo

Er... 4 days course from 8 to 6 (but normally around 8.30~9 only start, 4.30~5+ leave d) so yeah 30++ hours.

100 plus? Which centre offer that price? The one I attended is 260SGD after don't know how many % discount. Company pay I don't care


Name, FIN/IC number come I go report MOM!!!

maybe I should lead MOM to read this thread here.

This post has been edited by IwanAGP: Sep 21 2014, 10:44 PM

BCA Academy? Saw it last time. Not compulsory for me but I heard site people talking about it.

What's your position? I thought anyone that need to go into site have to attend safety course? Either CSOC for workers or BCSS for supervisors.

Your company EHS department no care one?

Site supervisor too but consultant's side. Maybe rules change and I don't know but no people ask me to go for the safety course so far.

So you everyday at site one? Consultant side Means? Scare contractor do not good, you go there monitor quality along with main con's site supervisor?


Not sure about you but my safety officer, if anyone will station/work at site, he will ask for BCSS course cert and keep a photocopy for documentation purpose.

Something like that see work done according to drawings. Everyday read newspaper, read forum if nothing to do. Tomorrow need to ask colleague later MOM say illegal worker send me to jail.

Aiya very normal already. People at site either grow a snake backbone so can bend over to do a self blowjob, or grow an iron one so people can make you work for satan in hell.

Work procedure is ok. I got no complains about that.

In projects not everything goes according to plan. That is where people get f***ed by client.
Is all about $$ to the client side, that is where people need to draw a thin red line as boundary.
You pay peanut, you get monkey. Is that simple.

Those are what the sub-contractors usually like to say.

But then again, before a project begins, the contractors would bid on it and if the client agrees on the price and the contractor has a reputable reputation and meet the standards and requirement set forth by the client.

Money isnt as issue since they have already agreed to the do the work according to the clients request on the price which both parties have agreed upon prior to commencement of the work.

So if the contractor fails in its duty to perform as it has promised, you cant give the excuse that your being paid peanuts since the price was agreed upon for the task at hand, they could not accept the work if it wasnt worth their time and effort.

This usually boils down to the contractor and their staff, on the client side, you are already given the specs, so it stands to reason that you would be prepared to follow them as per the contract.

Its not like i as the client am asking you to do something out of the project work scope, i just ensure that people do the work accordingly, which sometimes doesnt happen which is why people need constant reinforcement.

This post has been edited by crapp0: Sep 22 2014, 10:29 AM

All that talk is typical of EPC/EPCM work. Even than people never understand the complexity of the job and assume things will go according to "design plan". That is why site work and office work is 2 different worlds. Every site engineer will tell you the same remark. We will do our best to solve the problem, but dont expect it to be the same as the first initial agreement. That why EPC/EPCM always have revisions on drawing designs and work specs. Meeting every week upon work progress status.

A matured engineer will understand what to do when changes comes and will not complain about the initial agreement that was made. We learn to be more flexible until the boundary of cost is too much, then we stop and re think/re evaluate our job scope.

Money is always an issue regardless what size of the project you do. An estimate for changing a pipe is not the same during installation and during removing. That is only one small example of the many i had in mind. That is why initial estimated cost must be multiplied by a factor, and that factor is always good enough to be used for the time and cost to cover for delays and over shot budgets.

or that people are lazy and dont want to follow proper procedure. So they take short-cuts.

yeah we do encounter those as well. that is where you come in as a client.

In singapore shipyards, its a constant game of dissapointment that alot of the work done is very shoddy, i noticed alot of screw-ups are due to negligence and poor communication among departments.

And when SHTF, the blame game starts. I usually have to step in and ask them to stop the blame game and give me solutions on how they are going to fix the problem.

At least here in korea, their more professional about their work, less of a headache for me.

You believe what ministers say ah ? You go see those SG MP CV, not OxBridge then HarPenn liao. Like the rich people tell you money no use one so much for what. Degree no use one, go get some sub par cert and act big can already with chicken feather as command arrow.

I know what you are talking about I am stuck at the same situation as well. But I try my best to continue, never to waste a second in lay around doing nothing or fighting. I am not the type that like to sit around, I will end up sleeping. That is what I am, even boring job makes me sleep.

Sometimes it is as simple as a 25 mm X 25 mm X 10 mm plate in the end i get a 250 mm X 250 mm X 10 mm.

You are right they always play the blame game. But sometimes you just need to set their mind in the correct direction.

I havent been in Korea shipyard. They seem to do things a lot better there, look at Shell Prelude FLNG.