well yeah but the price is still on the high side.

Wondering why Samsung as a big chip manufacturer themselves still playing with TLC instead of MLC or even SLC...

My point is that do MLC/SLC really much pricier than TLC even Samsung manufacture the chips themselves?

This post has been edited by Human10: Dec 9 2014, 08:50 PM

shhh its business point of view

why would they sell you something that can last long, when they can sell you something that couldnt?

capitalism ho!

Boikot, jangan tak boikot!!!

from what i have read, 85% of the manufacturing costs of a ssd actually go to nand flash chips. yes it's pricey i guess.

i think their idea is to make tlc chips more cost-effective on their end (reduced manufacturing costs. tlc chip is inexpensive to produce compared to the other two). another thing about the other two is physical limitations. slc/mlc requires more physical space. as things go smaller each day, there might be a problem to house 2tb mlc/slc in a m.2 form.

furthermore, there are plenty of rooms to improve tlc it seems. with further improvements in reliability and endurance, they can mass produce tlc chips in very large quantity to bring the costs even lower. when the qualities of tlc chips are very close to mlc (or slc if that's even possible. we already know ram can be used to serve as internal cache. it's basically indestructible), all we can get from the market will be tlc-based, while slc/mlc will be used for enterprise-class only.

the above are just my clueless thoughts. don't take it seriously hehe

yes i agree that it's about business. however, 850 evo is now said to have 2k p/e, with 5-year warranty. i believe there are still rooms for improvements.

3D NAND is doing good there

but im still not convinced of it being TLC

lol! yeah i myself am not fond of it also hahaha! still, i think time will tell meanwhile, mlc FTW!

thats the only thing preventing me from purchasing the 840 Evo, when i was first hunting for SSDs

i saw good speed and software support, but TLC NAND, then endless debate within myself

then wanted to opt for 840 Pro, but too pricey (that time was 400+ for 128GB)

then in the end, purchased Intel 530 at RM369


PS: wanted to try Corsair Force series but Intel seems more "reliable"

tbh, at present tlc ssd's has evolved to become good enough for most of us. since 840 non-pro, every release showed significant improvements compared to old ones. 840 evo is not bad actually for general use. (since the slow read bug got fixed my pair is working well)

by the way samsung magician has been upgraded to 4.5.

i have little knowledge about corsair drives. i have a very small corsair ssd (forgot the model) but i rarely used it now.

TLC will be the future of large and cheap SSD, i read the article bout it somewhere.
also larger SSD has longer life span if the SSD controller and the OS is doing it right.

HDD capacity can increase as large as they want as i dont really care, you dont wanna lose 60TB of data at once do you?

is it my imagination, or is it that I see every time Samsung releasing a new SSD, they touted that it would be more "cost efficient", "cheaper to manufacture", "performs better with lower cost" etc etc but in reality, all I see is still their drives are still on the high side? Plus, Samsung is ocntroling all the process of manufacturing SSD, from the NAND production to the controller and firmware designs, and historically a company that can control all of the process by itself often manages to bring their products' cost lower compared to other collaborated manufacturers. But it just doesnt seem like it's the case here....

Samsung, when can your drives with those awesome performances (on paper) can also matches the prices of those of MX100 or Ultra II?

Hmm.... I think rulling out that HDD are definitely going to die is a subjective matter, I think when talk about failing rate, yes, HDD has a higher falling rate, due to the spinning plater and the magnetic arm, there are also SSDs that failed, and there are HDD that really performs well.

So in my opinion, i still being conservative regarding the reliability of HDDs compared to SSDs. Just my 2 cents

bingo

i actually suspect the issues about bad ssd's are due to other factors than nand. nand is never the limiting factor in terms of endurance. (ssd has different components inside it, and nand is not the only thing that gets worn out)

if you looked at samsung's case closely, you will find that they introduce new technology every time. with that, there will be at least 2 costs sunk into the total. one is r&d, another is manufacturing. (different processes) this will always happen when a new technology is used in production. the price will be high, until it gets stabilized with appropriate volumes in production.

controlling the whole process is an advantage mainly for technology development. lowering production costs might come later.

for now, we still have plenty of options. just wait until the technology becomes mature and harvest it at the right time. (it might be sooner than you thought )

as for hdd, it's still the cheapest option for years to come. just make sure you have redundancy, including cloud-based backups.

The current state of HDD tech seems to stalled, they only introduce larger capacity every year, there are no news about transfer rate improvement, only the SATA 6Gbps gimmick which they could never be achieved.
Also the drive with >2TB has higher failure rate, they just reduce the warranty period, there is no new tech for the hdd protection.
You want longer warranty and longer MTBF? get enterprise drive, double the price with same capacity.

And you guys seems forget there is a thing called RAID
forget about new SATA 6Gbps SSD, they're for laptop that don't have m.2 slot or lousy AMD mobo.
get a dual cheapo SSD and RAID the hell out of it if your mobo support TRIM on RAID 0 array, or just get XP941.

This post has been edited by 1024kbps: Dec 10 2014, 02:04 PM

oh. hdd is a perfect example when technology is mature: very affordable, but going nowhere. as long as it does the job, i think it should be fine.

raid can boost speed alright. it's a good choice for those who need it. however to me (as a home user), even a single sata ssd is fast enough hehe

TLC is the future for consumer SSD

but not at the current pricing, i mean, would you get a TLC NAND SSD when its priced the same as other MLC NAND?

might as well get the MLC right? at least its proven to have higher endurance

hmm.... true enough.... guess we just need to let time to bring the cost down for those new tech

hahaha.... yea, now that you mention it, but RAID has many different array types, RAID 0 is the fastest, but is also the most riskiest, because the strips are in different drives, one strip down, whole thing down, but guess that is not much of an issue for those HDD meant for 24/7 operations or those SSDs...

it's always like that, whether we like it or not :/

anyone know if there are SSD deal at pc fair ah?
I know it is unlikely there are any "PC/Tower PC" related things at pc fair nowadays hehe.

only booth i think you can ask is IdealTech and APES afaik

the rest are mostly, laptops, smartphones, tablets, powerbanks etc