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 All About Harddisk Thread V4

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TSeverling
post Apr 2 2012, 12:15 AM

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QUOTE(krel89 @ Apr 1 2012, 10:28 PM)
if i do that, would it cost me greatly??
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They will only test if the HDD is good or not. They will not do data recovery. Testing and advice is a free service in my experience, but there are strings.

  • Some external HDDs have their warranties void if you open the casing. You technically lose your right to a free warranty replacement if this is the case.

  • Some external HDDs uses non-standard connectors. I have come across one external HDD that had its built-in standard SATA connectors replaced with USB connectors, this allows a small external case, but you're out of luck if the USB is damaged.

QUOTE(krel89 @ Apr 1 2012, 10:28 PM)
ahhh, rather lose that data then spend some money when i can buy two 2TB at the same price..
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A 2TB HDD now costs about RM400.

But yes, most people tend to give up on the data than to pay for expensive and uncertain data recovery; data recovery is not guaranteed. It's much cheaper to buy two HDDs.
krel89
post Apr 2 2012, 11:20 AM

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QUOTE(everling @ Apr 2 2012, 12:15 AM)
They will only test if the HDD is good or not. They will not do data recovery. Testing and advice is a free service in my experience, but there are strings.


  • Some external HDDs have their warranties void if you open the casing. You technically lose your right to a free warranty replacement if this is the case.
  • Some external HDDs uses non-standard connectors. I have come across one external HDD that had its built-in standard SATA connectors replaced with USB connectors, this allows a small external case, but you're out of luck if the USB is damaged.


A 2TB HDD now costs about RM400.

But yes, most people tend to give up on the data than to pay for expensive and uncertain data recovery; data recovery is not guaranteed. It's much cheaper to buy two HDDs.
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after heard ur advise.. i want to buy new HD
any advise.. im an extreme person, so i afraid if i slip my HD, it become unusable again.. any advice which is prefer brand??
sI Taufu
post Apr 2 2012, 12:36 PM

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QUOTE(krel89 @ Apr 2 2012, 11:20 AM)
after heard ur advise.. i want to buy new HD
any advise.. im an extreme person, so i afraid if i slip my HD, it become unusable again.. any advice which is prefer brand??
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WD black;
NEVER go for WD green if afraid its reliability sweat.gif

This post has been edited by sI Taufu: Apr 2 2012, 12:42 PM
TSeverling
post Apr 2 2012, 02:19 PM

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QUOTE(krel89 @ Apr 2 2012, 11:20 AM)
after heard ur advise.. i want to buy new HD
any advise.. im an extreme person, so i afraid if i slip my HD, it become unusable again.. any advice which is prefer brand??
*
If ruggedness is more important than capacity, how about an SSD?

Then again, SSDs are wasted if put in external casings.

If buying external HDDs, 2.5" HDDs have better toughness than 3.5" HDDs, but treating them as fragile items is still strongly recommended. Other than that, I have no specific HDD recommendations.
harryfoo
post Apr 2 2012, 09:23 PM

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QUOTE(sI Taufu @ Apr 2 2012, 12:36 PM)
WD black;
NEVER go for WD green if afraid its reliability sweat.gif
*
Well, Black is way more expensive than Green.

QUOTE(everling @ Apr 2 2012, 02:19 PM)
If ruggedness is more important than capacity, how about an SSD?

Then again, SSDs are wasted if put in external casings.

If buying external HDDs, 2.5" HDDs have better toughness than 3.5" HDDs, but treating them as fragile items is still strongly recommended. Other than that, I have no specific HDD recommendations.
*
That's true. My 500gb 2.5" still working find after 2 years, but I never drop it on the floor though.
SUSlogit85
post Apr 2 2012, 10:19 PM

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QUOTE(everling @ Mar 30 2012, 11:24 AM)
Both of my WD Green 1TBs have passed their third year of life. *touch wood*
Interpreting the data is difficult, especially as it doesn't seem to adhere to a single standard. This is why I don't read too deeply into the SMART data and so I haven't learned it. If you wish to learn, you'll have to look from other sources. Furthermore, a Google white-paper (linked on the first post of the topic) suggests that SMART data does not adequately predict impending HDD failures, making it less useful to learn.
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i have woory Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 1TB abit bad resuit rclxub.gif

pls explan me about it
what threshold
1tb threshold 6 if high number like 50 or 100 will be bad
0 mean very good ah

spin retry count current 100 and worst 100 threshold 97
both 100 and worst 100 same so be good or bad ???
threshold 97 good or bad ???

explan let say spin retry count current 100 and worst 250++ more then that mean both diffrent number resuit so be very bad right
super macgyver
post Apr 3 2012, 09:29 AM

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QUOTE(logit85 @ Apr 2 2012, 10:19 PM)
i have woory Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 1TB abit bad resuit  rclxub.gif

pls explan me about it
what threshold
1tb threshold 6 if high number like 50 or 100 will be bad
0 mean very good ah

spin retry count current 100 and worst 100 threshold 97
both 100 and worst 100 same so be good or bad ???
threshold 97 good or bad ???

explan let say spin retry count current 100 and worst 250++ more then that mean both diffrent number resuit so be very bad right
*
Count of retry of spin start attempts. If the HDD can't start its spindle on the first try (to make HDD work) it makes another try - and so on while the spindle will not rotate normally. This attribute stores a count of start retries.
dma0991
post Apr 5 2012, 07:53 PM

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IDC: HDD Output To Reach Preflood Levels, But Prices Will Stay At A Postflood Premium
QUOTE
Good news for all you mechanical drive freaks out there: the beleaguered and washed-out hard disk drive industry is on track to pull its head back above water in the second half of the year. Yay! Bad news for all you mechanical drive freaks out there: even though HDD output will fully catch up to previous levels, HDD prices are still going to stay above the "dirt cheap" range they were at before the Thailand floods.

The news comes courtesy of IDC, who says that "HDD vendors are taking advantage of this opportunity to reset prices and recover some of the excessive price erosion that began in 2009." Don't speak business-ease? Basically, HDD manufacturers will be taking a cue from the gas companies and keeping prices at a high level now that they know people will pay the premium. Hopefully they nudge down a bit from where they're at now, though. (We'd like to send our kids to college someday.)

John Rydning, IDC's hard drive guru, claims that the higher price points will let HDD manufacturers pump R&D cash into newfangled HDD technology, but the possibility of a more power-efficient hard disk two years down the line probably won't help to quell the hurt your wallet feels when you're trying to fill a NAS box today.

To be fair, though, HDDs were getting ridiculously cheap before the floods. What are your thoughts about the "reset HDD prices"? Is it a fair move, price gouging, or something in between?

TSeverling
post Apr 5 2012, 08:49 PM

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Just because they seem to be ridiculously cheap, doesn't mean they are ridiculously cheap. Until the manufacturers reveal the actual unit costs, I'm going to assume price gouging. Especially since they were willing to let the prices fall so far in the first place, that price gouging makes their investors happy because of larger profits, and Seagate has already indicated that they prefer to keep the prices high.


Added on April 5, 2012, 9:03 pm
QUOTE(logit85 @ Apr 2 2012, 10:19 PM)
explan let say spin retry count current 100 and worst 250++ more then that mean both diffrent number resuit so be very bad right
*
The raw SMART numbers are impossible to decipher as they make no sense.

Take a look at your 1TB graph. Why is your Power On Hours values are 100='current', 100='worst' and 12='data'? The 'current' does not hold the real current value. Check the other attributes. Why is the Raw Read Error Rate's data value of 57921982 not highlighted in yellow or red? In one of my HDDs, my Raw Read Error Rate's data value is 0.

They do not make any sense. If you can learn the secret to reading raw SMART data, that is great. I don't know about the others, but for me, I'll just depend on my tools to interpret the raw data and tell me if SMART reports a problem. And in your case, reading your screenshots reveals no real problems to my knowledge.

This post has been edited by everling: Apr 5 2012, 09:06 PM
dma0991
post Apr 6 2012, 12:12 AM

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QUOTE(everling @ Apr 5 2012, 08:49 PM)
Just because they seem to be ridiculously cheap, doesn't mean they are ridiculously cheap. Until the manufacturers reveal the actual unit costs, I'm going to assume price gouging. Especially since they were willing to let the prices fall so far in the first place, that price gouging makes their investors happy because of larger profits, and Seagate has already indicated that they prefer to keep the prices high.
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I'm pretty sure that the manufacturers could recoup some of their losses by selling them in large volume and cheaper price as opposed to small volume and higher price. As long as there is a steady drop in price, I wouldn't mind if they want to keep the prices steady for a while. If it remains constant for the next year or more, then they are shooting themselves in the foot. With the current price, their profit margin is huge. If they could sell it at the price before the flood, that would mean that their manufacturing costs aren't that high as no company would sell their product for less than what it needs to produce them.
kelvyn
post Apr 6 2012, 09:44 AM

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QUOTE(dma0991 @ Apr 6 2012, 01:12 AM)
I'm pretty sure that the manufacturers could recoup some of their losses by selling them in large volume and cheaper price as opposed to small volume and higher price. As long as there is a steady drop in price, I wouldn't mind if they want to keep the prices steady for a while. If it remains constant for the next year or more, then they are shooting themselves in the foot. With the current price, their profit margin is huge. If they could sell it at the price before the flood, that would mean that their manufacturing costs aren't that high as no company would sell their product for less than what it needs to produce them.
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but, if all the hdd manufacturers agrees to sell them at higher price, we as the consumers will have no choice. Of course, we will be putting of any purchase as long as possible. But there will come a time when the need arises and even at the higher price, we still have to get them.
It a matter of who will be able to wait it out....

dma0991
post Apr 6 2012, 09:25 PM

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QUOTE(kelvyn @ Apr 6 2012, 09:44 AM)
but, if all the hdd manufacturers agrees to sell them at higher price, we as the consumers will have no choice. Of course, we will be putting of any purchase as long as possible. But there will come a time when the need arises and even at the higher price, we still have to get them.
It a matter of who will be able to wait it out....
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I don't think they can come to an agreement that they should sell at this price which is higher. There exists a monopoly between the big players like Seagate and Western Digital but they are almost equal, not the 90/10 kind of monopoly we would see with Intel/AMD. HDD vendors are still competing with each other and sooner or later they will reduce the price to cut each other.

They price it so high, it has a domino effect on other vendors as well. OEMs that make laptops would either have to profit less or pass down the costs to the consumer, both of which they do not want. They would surely want their profit to increase as well and passing down the costs would only make it more expensive and less likely for someone to buy it. SSDs with increasing capacity are posing a threat to HDDs and it is only a matter of time when we would reach to a point where a reasonably priced SSD at a certain capacity would be a better choice than a HDD, if they decide to be arrogant about it and peg the HDD price sky high.
yinchet
post Apr 6 2012, 11:21 PM

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QUOTE(dma0991 @ Apr 6 2012, 09:25 PM)
I don't think they can come to an agreement that they should sell at this price which is higher. There exists a monopoly between the big players like Seagate and Western Digital but they are almost equal, not the 90/10 kind of  monopoly we would see with Intel/AMD. HDD vendors are still competing with each other and sooner or later they will reduce the price to cut each other.

They price it so high, it has a domino effect on other vendors as well. OEMs that make laptops would either have to profit less or pass down the costs to the consumer, both of which they do not want. They would surely want their profit to increase as well and passing down the costs would only make it more expensive and less likely for someone to buy it. SSDs with increasing capacity are posing a threat to HDDs and it is only a matter of time when we would reach to a point where a reasonably priced SSD at a certain capacity would be a better choice than a HDD, if they decide to be arrogant about it and peg the HDD price sky high.
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It just matter of time to have a 240GB SSD below RM900. brows.gif
TSeverling
post Apr 7 2012, 12:33 AM

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QUOTE(yinchet @ Apr 6 2012, 11:21 PM)
It just matter of time to have a 240GB SSD below RM900. brows.gif
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RM769. Mushkin Callisto Deluxe SATA2. At Viewnet.

I think it is this one: Callisto deluxe 240GB Solid State Drive - MKNSSDCL240GB-DX, SF-1200 controller

Otherwise it may be this one: Callisto deluxe 25nm 240GB Solid State Drive - MKNSSDCL240GB-DX2, SF-1222 controller

The current SF controller version is SF-2281. The versions before SF-2281 were plagued with reports of BSODs. Do you feel lucky? brows.gif
yinchet
post Apr 7 2012, 12:35 AM

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QUOTE(everling @ Apr 7 2012, 12:33 AM)
RM769. Mushkin Callisto Deluxe SATA2. At Viewnet.

I think it is this one: Callisto deluxe 240GB Solid State Drive - MKNSSDCL240GB-DX, SF-1200 controller

Otherwise it may be this one: Callisto deluxe 25nm 240GB Solid State Drive - MKNSSDCL240GB-DX2, SF-1222 controller

The current SF controller version is SF-2281. The versions before SF-2281 were plagued with reports of BSODs. Do you feel lucky? brows.gif
*
still not fixed the problem yet??
TSeverling
post Apr 7 2012, 12:39 AM

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QUOTE(yinchet @ Apr 7 2012, 12:35 AM)
still not fixed the problem yet??
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I do not know. I haven't heard of any news that all the bugs in the old SF controllers have been killed.
yinchet
post Apr 7 2012, 12:42 AM

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QUOTE(everling @ Apr 7 2012, 12:39 AM)
I do not know. I haven't heard of any news that all the bugs in the old SF controllers have been killed.
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I read some review from guru3d they said there were no need worried about the sf controllers. hmm.gif
TSeverling
post Apr 7 2012, 12:36 PM

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QUOTE(yinchet @ Apr 7 2012, 12:42 AM)
I read some review from guru3d they said there were no need worried about the sf controllers. hmm.gif
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Got links?

In any case, it is up to the individual. I'm pretty sure that there are hundreds of thousands of satisfied SF-1200 users, otherwise OCZ and a lot of other SSD manufacturers would have closed shop by now. But I am not willing nor desperate enough to risk it.
harryfoo
post Apr 7 2012, 06:52 PM

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I thought people use SSD as their boot disk only, why you need 240GB?
dma0991
post Apr 7 2012, 07:16 PM

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QUOTE(harryfoo @ Apr 7 2012, 06:52 PM)
I thought people use SSD as their boot disk only, why you need 240GB?
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No written rule that SSDs should only be used as a boot drive. It can be used for storage, just that it is still too expensive to consider it as a form of storage and we have yet to reach 1TB SSD that is affordable for mainstream users.

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