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 Terran Strategy discussion V 1.0, The Last Mankind on Galaxy

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cupmee2nd
post Dec 27 2010, 05:11 PM

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QUOTE(quest_5692 @ Dec 27 2010, 05:10 PM)
anyway you would ALWAYS noe its coming because your scouting scv should be jalan-jalaning in his base till you saw suddenly he pulls off the mineral lline.
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SCV kena rape by 10 probe
quest_5692
post Dec 27 2010, 05:18 PM

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probe? its drone here la....and if you saw they raping you, you noe wassup lur....XD
westley0214
post Dec 27 2010, 05:37 PM

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QUOTE(gehound @ Dec 27 2010, 04:51 PM)
Counter for drone rush : lift Command center n all SCV attack zerg base. if drone come back for defence retreat all ur SCV n close off.
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Nice one. Never think of this before.
mules
post Dec 29 2010, 04:30 PM

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attacking his base with my scv and lifting command center is not working. He just leave one drone to follow my base and i cant land the command center anymore unless i fly out.

Attacking his base is worse cause he can make more drones if he lost some and fight on creeps?

Tested but not so good. Best way is still run all scv to opne space and fight with him and micro to see who can surround who first.
quest_5692
post Dec 29 2010, 04:31 PM

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lol, the best fangasms in the world might be today realizing big names like Renson was from my high school and just 2 years elder than me lol wtf.....
westley0214
post Jan 9 2011, 03:03 PM

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Have been experiencing great success going mech build vs. Zergs who never scout and just go purely for Mutaling. Just get like three Thors and move out with blue flame hellions companion and the Thors are basically invincible and crush everything. SEA server players seldom get roaches. Banelings are so cost ineffective vs. mechie.

This post has been edited by westley0214: Jan 9 2011, 03:07 PM
jeffvip
post Jan 11 2011, 12:14 AM

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QUOTE(westley0214 @ Jan 9 2011, 03:03 PM)
Have been experiencing great success going mech build vs. Zergs who never scout and just go purely for Mutaling. Just get like three Thors and move out with blue flame hellions companion and the Thors are basically invincible and crush everything. SEA server players seldom get roaches. Banelings are so cost ineffective vs. mechie.
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mech is the way to go against traditional mutaling. Thor can punish those mutalisk, hunting down overlord and drinking acid spray from baneling like coconut drink rclxms.gif So far 8 games against mutaling zerg, only lose 1 game due to super FE of zerg
quest_5692
post Mar 10 2011, 07:11 PM

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owh hi!
smartleader
post Mar 11 2011, 12:48 AM

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QUOTE(jeffvip @ Jan 11 2011, 12:14 AM)
mech is the way to go against traditional mutaling. Thor can punish those mutalisk, hunting down overlord and drinking acid spray from baneling like coconut drink  rclxms.gif  So far 8 games against mutaling zerg, only lose 1 game due to super FE of zerg
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Try do a 2 rax pressure early on?
quest_5692
post Mar 11 2011, 07:26 AM

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Jeff, i will write my thought in TvP later in the afternoon...
jeffvip
post Mar 11 2011, 08:38 AM

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QUOTE(smartleader @ Mar 11 2011, 12:48 AM)
Try do a 2 rax pressure early on?
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Must be continuously pressure so we got the time to tech up on our side.


___
QUOTE
Recently I have alot of problem dealing with Protoss, Colossus + High Templar seems like sure win for them. Eventhough my ghost successfully emp all of his HT, twice, I will still lose the battle due to insignificant Vikings for Colossus. If I get enough Ghost for HT and enough Vikings for Colossus, my main army strength reduce which will also pawn by them. Going Mech seems hard to as the Immortal is sick against Mech army.

I have concluded there are only few ways to win against Protoss ( not including rush)
i) Timing attack when their HT and Colossus is still on the way.
ii) Keep denying expansion of Protoss (This solution applies to all races anyway  )
iii) Tech switch to Tank when Protoss army still stay with Colossus and HT and hopes they are not fast enough to get Immortal.
iv) Build More Raven but it is too costly and too much to micro (too many units involve). Ghost and Vikings is a better spent resources IMO

At the end, I find it hard to achieve the above solution too.

QUOTE
Jeff, i will write my thought in TvP later in the afternoon...



Any idea? Dominion forces need help.

Timber2k7
post Mar 11 2011, 09:19 AM

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it is hard to justify @ late game. it all come down to ur micro n gameplay
cuz during late game any unit will oso come out, there is no hard counter to a unit to win the game instantly
jeffvip
post Mar 11 2011, 10:22 AM

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QUOTE(Timber2k7 @ Mar 11 2011, 09:19 AM)
it is hard to justify @ late game. it all come down to ur micro n gameplay
cuz during late game any unit will oso come out, there is no hard counter to a unit to win the game instantly
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The problem is that I can't see a working solution for TvP in the late game.
I wanna go into history if you guys are not familiar with SCBW. Protoss traditionally have been a strong late game races since SCBW days. But during that days, Terran have got a tough SIEGE TANK to defend ground army. Protoss have to get Arbiter to Froze split the Tank line and HT to storm the tank.On the Terran part, we have to make sure the EMP goes off from Science Vessel. Protoss too have the Reaver for long range attack. That is when you will say come down to ur micro.

In SC2, Immortal can just ram in to the siege line like nothing is gonna happen. Ghost is very vulnerable and yet bcos it is a ground army, he have to some how "get of the way" of other units (not like SCBW science vessel which fly around freely) and that somehow slowing down the EMP. By the time Ghost reach the front line, usually Siege Tank have been completely taken out d.

I was so shock during my 1st game of SC2 seeing whole bunch of Protoss army engaging directly with my Tank. I'm thinking "wtf, is this Protoss Noob? He engage my Siege Tank directly with the vision of Xel'naga Tower. Is just a few seconds later I realize my Tank line completely destroyed and I have to GG with dumbfounded expression on me watching the score screen.
Timber2k7
post Mar 11 2011, 11:13 AM

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ic..sorry i was scbw noob..i like to play vs ai with cheat code on bgh though
ThereWasOnceAGirl
post Mar 11 2011, 11:55 AM

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Hello there fellow Terrans, how hard is it to perfecting and how effective is it start Marine>Hellion>Ghost with nuke against Zerg opponents? Anyone using it? hmm.gif

This post has been edited by ThereWasOnceAGirl: Mar 11 2011, 11:55 AM
Timber2k7
post Mar 11 2011, 12:25 PM

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unfortunately no, or low chance. heat seeking nuke missle might work!
westley0214
post Mar 11 2011, 12:33 PM

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Actually some progamer from Europe try Ghost against Zerg, but with only small percentage of success. No doubt Ghost is effective sniping Mutas and doesn't take bonus damage from Blings, but if opponent goes Roaches it's hard.
quest_5692
post Mar 11 2011, 01:21 PM

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lol at heat seeking nuke.

anyway for TvP now.

the standard army a terran will have is marauder as main unit, vikings to snipe collosus and ghost to EMP. basically just marauder medivac vikings and ghost. that is the mid-late game of most terrans from what i can see la.......

if a terran go mech build against a protoss nowadays, its not standard AT ALL, only Jinro and TLO does it...seriously. about the imba immortal, the effective counter of it in mech build will be thor's 500mm cannon. if you want to play mech you must fking know that the cannon 1 shot collosus and immortal. AND stun the enemy unit in the same time. its a fking big deal man....immortal kena stun, kena 1 shot means their immortal and collosus will not release any damage in your big battle. but then mech build is hard because the gas management is insane. u need 4-6 running gas to fund 5 factories....
owh ya, blue flame hellion works perfectly well against zealot and doesnt take bonus damage from immortal, so they are perfect mineral dumps to soak immortal's damage.

for the standard marauder based TvP, with good EMPs, you should win the battle ;D

This post has been edited by quest_5692: Mar 11 2011, 01:23 PM
evofantasy
post Mar 11 2011, 02:43 PM

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QUOTE(quest_5692 @ Mar 11 2011, 01:21 PM)
lol at heat seeking nuke.

anyway for TvP now.

the standard army a terran will have is marauder as main unit, vikings to snipe collosus and ghost to EMP. basically just marauder medivac vikings and ghost. that is the mid-late game of most terrans from what i can see la.......

if a terran go mech build against a protoss nowadays, its not standard AT ALL, only Jinro and TLO does it...seriously. about the imba immortal, the effective counter of it in mech build will be thor's 500mm cannon. if you want to play mech you must fking know that the cannon 1 shot collosus and immortal. AND stun the enemy unit in the same time. its a fking big deal man....immortal kena stun, kena 1 shot means their immortal and collosus will not release any damage in your big battle. but then mech build is hard because the gas management is insane. u need 4-6 running gas to fund 5 factories....
owh ya, blue flame hellion works perfectly well against zealot and doesnt take bonus damage from immortal, so they are perfect mineral dumps to soak immortal's damage.

for the standard marauder based TvP, with good EMPs, you should win the battle ;D
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^ this

u can see every1 keep going MMMV late game vs toss late game when toss late game (colossus and HT) roll it (except lolders since they can soak storm alot)...
lyn went MMMV-G and the 2 emp wreck his toss opponent in his recent GSL game (top 16 was it?)
immortal seemed really good on paper till u actually use em due to their range5 and clunky movements (they are without a doubt good early game PvT when army size are small and thus they cant be burst down)...
proper tank spreading with some bio cover will wreck the toss ball easily (saw how mc's immortal based army died to jinro's mech in LT?)...
and ya the 250mm cannon from thor 1 shot with a stun build in which so far only a selected few terrans used (like redarchon)...
wut bout blue flame hellions? (see the blue flame hellion marauder raven/ banshee allin and u can see why they are soooo good)

the real late game TvP imho is ghost + mech...
of cource u can get lucky with MMMV but really y force it?

let me ask u this, if u see zerg going blings, would u still stick to bio and claimed that bling is imba?
u get tanks...
why cant terran do the same vs toss (no doubt lolders are good vs toss ground)

ps: tanks in sc2 are smart, they dun overkill unlike sc1

This post has been edited by evofantasy: Mar 11 2011, 02:47 PM
jeffvip
post Mar 11 2011, 03:19 PM

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QUOTE(evofantasy @ Mar 11 2011, 02:43 PM)
^ this

u can see every1 keep going MMMV late game vs toss late game when toss late game (colossus and HT) roll it (except lolders since they can soak storm alot)...
lyn went MMMV-G and the 2 emp wreck his toss opponent in his recent GSL game (top 16 was it?)
immortal seemed really good on paper till u actually use em due to their range5 and clunky movements (they are without a doubt good early game PvT when army size are small and thus they cant be burst down)...
proper tank spreading with some bio cover will wreck the toss ball easily (saw how mc's immortal based army died to jinro's mech in LT?)...
and ya the 250mm cannon from thor 1 shot with a stun build in which so far only a selected few terrans used (like redarchon)...
wut bout blue flame hellions? (see the blue flame hellion marauder raven/ banshee allin and u can see why they are soooo good)

the real late game TvP imho is ghost + mech...
of cource u can get lucky with MMMV but really y force it?

let me ask u this, if u see zerg going blings, would u still stick to bio and claimed that bling is imba?
u get tanks...
why cant terran do the same vs toss (no doubt lolders are good vs toss ground)

ps: tanks in sc2 are smart, they dun overkill unlike sc1
*
That will be a very gas heavy build. Might work in super late game, gotta build PF across the map just to gather gas though. But other problem might arise like it will be a tough task to defend the expansion from high mobility protoss army with ghost+mech.



p.s.the only good things bout SC2 tanks compare to SC1 is just the mobility of SC2 tanks. SC1 tank can hardly move over a narrow choke. SC2 tanks kill it's own unit lesser because the damage of SC2 tanks is reduce to just half of SC1 tanks.

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