i think the debate was, even if u use fully syn, some quarters say, fully syn, whack until 10k. but u should still change it at 5k.

some oils, people know would already degrade by 4k, dont use lor. ( like n@$@ oil maybe.)

This post has been edited by ultramaman: Aug 13 2012, 12:38 PM

there wasnt even a debate. more of i had keywords in my post (7.5k km oci for semi syn for example) and he came in with his mouth frothing eyes red and all telling me i'm wrong lol.

i mean, i didnt even say i wasn't wrong, it was something i've done in the past, which i also want to point out to people on mainstream engine oils.

or tldr all that: what you pay is what you get. (again, assuming you're not being scammed etc)

Yes, regardless of Fully Synthetic or Mineral, all MUST be changed at the same time. If manufacturer said OCI is 5K, then no such thing as Synthetic 10K and Mineral 5K nonsense. That is No.1 engine oil myth in Malaysia.

Currently i'm using Total Quartz 7000 Semi Synthetic. After the oil change, the engine running is ok but gets noisy after 3k rpm. Currently been running more than 1200 km and the engine starts to get lazy to rev and get very noisy after 3k rpm. I think this the first and the last time i'm gona use Total.

That's the problem. Sometimes they just want to sell oil and make their dealerships money.

Evos in the US and Germany require servicing every 5000km.

Australian Evos in harsher conditions require 7500km.

UK Evos need a service every 16000 km.

All the same model of car, same model of engine. I'd trust the manufacturer for viscosity numbers, but service intervals are a tad bit more sus

I would say that the time to change depends on many factors but I usually go by 10000kms.

that, and he did not addressed on good engine oil that serve majority of continental cars that has their manufacturer recommendation of 10k km (or more)

so, if the oil is going to be sluggish or have its additives breaking down etc, are the manufacturers stupid? or the engine oil companies are lying/scamming crooks?

You must be talking about a Cap Ayam brand?

It is a given that one should use an oil of certain API or ACEA etc and not a Cap Ayam brand.

i dont think brands like shell are cap ayam brand and i am pretty sure they have the latest API certifications too

I have never seen an engine oil related problem amongst my group of friend with combined experience of a few decades and most of us drive tough turbo diesel which are harsher on engine oils than gasoline. All they did was to stick to manufacturer OCI and use the cheaper Mineral (all with proper API certification and of course no Cap Ayam brand) and never use any after market additives. So we don't see any need for expensive Synthetic.

BTW, none of us drive Ferrari or BMW or any exotic cars nor use our car in the Arctic or Sahara. For those, may be Synthetic is needed.

it's not so much PROBLEM i am talking here. the engine may very well still operate, and gets you from point a to point b. however if that's all i want, like i said, i'll just take a public transport.

as hard as it may see for you to believe, my aged old iswara can redline on demand pretty easily, and that car can go 160km/h without too much effort (it takes a lil time, that's all)

when i am having crappy "non-cap-ayam" oils in my engine, past 3-4k km its that much harder to even push a red line rev, and i am not even sure if my car did anything past 150km/h before needing to slow down due to traffic or i need to make a turn and so forth.

we're not talking about ferrari's either however it is still apparent that DESPITE butt dyno's going on, a smoother engine is a smoother engine. pushing redline and going at 160km/h is just that, and without better engine oil that doesn't happen. it is as SIMPLE as that.

bottom line: point a to point b driving, i really cannot give a shit.

Well, our record is 1/2 million km engine oil problem free driving using our cars as workhorse. That is good enough for us. On the other hand, may be if we want to keep our cars up to 1 million Km, then may be consider Synthetic.

as salam,


either 5000km,10000km,15000km or even 20000km OCI, all are depend on what type of base oil been use by manufacturer.....the rule is simple....the pure the base oil, the better the oil retain it fresh property...

also depend from where is the additive package come from??the good the additive package, the better the engine oil..


last time using synthetic blend one, i manage to get 17000km....so i sending the oil for UOA(via my sifu)....and the result was unbelievable...the oil still can be use actually, the VI not degrade so much, the TBN also in good number, the viscosity/grade is not degrade so much....


what are your engine oil base oil purity??

sarjantulang

Assuming.....

Synthetic Base Oil last 100,000-km.

Additives last 10,000 km.

When do you change engine oil?

There is your answer as to which factor determines when to change engine oil

that's why i mention before it depend from which company the additive are come from....

pure base oil + good additive package will give longer OCI for your EO....and superb performance for the engine...

and it is also depend on how your engine feel after reach at certain KM...if it still smooth and give the performance you want, then why not give a extended OCI??

if you say the additive can last 10000km, then why some of the engine oil are still give the good result and performance to the engine after reach more than 10000km??

i have a friend using a good mineral oil for 20000km OCI....4 times already repeat that OCI....he is very satisfied with the eo...


engine oil especially from very2 good and realiable brand maker are specialy blend with high performance additive that can last longer...it is not from the early age of engine oil are invented....the technology are keep improve and the engineer and tribologist are doing what their capable of in produce some of the most performance EO

then again, grab one of the most reliable name in EO, then give a try....brand like Motul, Redline, Torco, Liqui Moly and others are known to give a very good OCI and extended drain interval....

just my 34.5sen


sarjantulang

sorry bai... i would stick to car manufacturer's recommended oci .
assuming you use a reliable engine oil ( it might not be the best in the market) , it should be able to serve you based on the recommended oci. which is by mileage or duration of months. .

at the end of the day, assuming your car under warranty, the warranty is provided by the car manufacturer , not the oil manufacturer. so. of course follow what car manufacturer say

again base on what data we can determine the additive life?in the western world avg 50,000 km OCI for diesel engine is very normal  (of course together with VOA & UOA), and many had recorded million miles without engine failure.

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Added on August 14, 2012, 3:29 pmdear sarjantulang, you are right provided you have done the UOA, and data to back you up. If we can prolong the OCI, why not?? you can save some pocket money, and reduce the waste oil disposal which is also harmful to the mother nature.



This post has been edited by pumpman: Aug 14 2012, 03:47 PM

why always "Assuming??"....why not give the real life field test??

but yes i agree...."recommended by OEM"....

like Proton, they state for Saga BLM, OCI is every 10000km.....then if you use, cheapo mineral oil, are you dare to do that??

but again, warranty IF ONLY YOU SERVICE at SC....what if you already do your service at bengkel bawah pokok??your waranty already void....what ep are the workshop selling you??original or fake??if original, then it is ok to follow...

a fake one surely can't last like what the OEM recommended...


everything is depend on experience and field test....you'll never know if you never try....once you try, you'll know the differences....

that's why, i'm testing any kind what people say myth, lie or not proven.....cooking oil in engine??done...moth ball as fuel saver??done...hdeo??done....more than 10000km oil myth??done...

oil manufacturer warranty??i know one company who give non-nonsense warranty of their engine oil...because they believe in their eo...

just my 34.5sen

sarjantulang

Here is real life fact.

In practically all real life situation, the lifespan of additives is almost ALWAYS much much shorter than Base Oil lifespan. In other word, the lifespan of Base Oil never comes into play when one determine OCI.

That is why one can actually recycle the Base Oil. Take the used engine oil and remove off all the impurities etc, you will still ended up with usable Base Oil. This is proof that Base Oil can last far far far longer than Additives.

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Added on August 14, 2012, 4:04 pmIf I am not mistaken, what they did is run UOA and then top up the required additives. Again proving additives has far more influence on when you need to change engine oil, not type of base oil. Of course we are not talking about Cap Ayam brand oil.

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Added on August 14, 2012, 4:06 pmNot on Proton but on intercooled turbo charged diesel engine. Manual said 10,000-km but have occasionally went as far as 15,000-km (ya, engine was sluggish so really have to change) because no time to change. Engine still fine now at 200,000-km on odometer but to be fair, it's mainly for long distance driving. Of course using very good quality Mineral oil, no Cap Ayam brand.

That is why, based on our experience, we see no need for expensive Fully Synthetic. We strongly believe if one stick to manufacturer's OCI using good quality Mineral of correct grade/viscosity, there should be no problem. Not even the Protons. I don't know about the BMW or Ferrari because we never have those.





This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Aug 14 2012, 04:11 PM

oh so you DO OCI at 10k km! and not half a million km!
then why were you harping about half a million km half a million km day in day out?

some more when people (like me) are OCI'ing at 5k km, according to manufacturer, you still point fault at that.
lol?

and of course, lorry/trucks (or large vehicles...?), do you like umm... i dunno redline the thing and whack corners with it?

hope you at least see the point some of us (like me) has been trying to point out

You nuts or something? Where got people do OCI at half a million km? You know the difference between OCI and ODOMETER? They are not the same, you know?

I said I have a circle of friends. I did 5K and my friends do 10K or more. You know the difference between "I" and "we"? Apparently you don't.

Now tell me, which is harsher to engine. Proton or turbo diesel? Assuming you do know their differences.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Aug 14 2012, 05:22 PM