GM car may have oil sump of 10 liters.
Your Proton has oil sump of 5 liters.
The more oil you have, the longer is your oil change interval. It's the same as saying, the more water you have, the more dirty cloth you can clean.

That is why it is very funny hearing people say "Synthetic last 10K but Mineral 5k". They are basically saying, expensive Distilled Water can hold twice more dirt from dirty cloth than Tap Water of the same volume. Where got logic?

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 25 2012, 03:22 PM

Yes, Synthetic base oil last longer but reason to change oil at 5K or 10K has nothing to do with how long the can base oil last. Rather, it has everything to do with additives depletion and contamination and on both these 2 counts, Synthetic and Mineral are the same, hence same OCI.

It says the "base oil" can last longer. Everyone, including me, agree.

But Synthetic's additives and soot holding capacity is exactly the same as Mineral. There are no documented proof to say otherwise. Therefore OCI are the same for both.

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Added on February 25, 2012, 5:28 pmGet a good diesel engine oil to clean up the sludge. They contain better detergent than petrol engine oil. Very cheap also.




This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 25 2012, 05:28 PM

That is probably because Synthetic oil are more slippery to begin so it felt 'better'. But feeling can be deceptive.

Allow me to give a analogy. Assuming I give you a powerful painkiller and use sandpaper to rub your skin, does that means your skin will remain intact even though you feel no pain?

Likewise, just because it feel slippery does not mean it is safe for your engine. Because when the additives (anti-rust, anti-foaming etc) get depleted, you engine lost some protection. If you really want to do extended OCI, you best do a oil analysis.

Combustion of Hydrocarbon and oxygen produces water vapor. Some of which contaminates the engine oil.

I think additives make up 1/3 of an engine oil

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_additive

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 25 2012, 07:26 PM

I often see Synthetic oil company saying their base oil is superior and that is true. But hardly ever come across one saying their additives are superior to Mineral. I wondered who is being delusional. You have been reading too many conspiracy story and not looking at established facts.

Fact is, some additives has problem dissolving in Group IV and V Synthetic base oil (I do not consider Group III being Synthetic but some sucker do). To over come this problem, they will dissolve those additives first into Mineral oil and only then add into Synthetic base oil. So there are even possibilities Synthetic has inferior additives package compared to Mineral. That is why whenever there are newer and tougher API or ACEA rating coming out, it's often the Mineral that will fulfill the newer spec earlier than Synthetic. This is especially true for Diesel engine oil because those are hardly to fulfill than Petrol engine oil.

As for higher price of Synthetic. Ever heard of the saying "there is a sucker born every minute"? Those who buy Synthetic for their vastly superior stability for use in the cold Arctic are smart. But not those who bought Synthetic thinking they have superior additives.

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 25 2012, 11:31 PM

Delo 400. 15W40. Group II+ base oil. RM10 per liter in 18 liter drums. Primarily for diesel but is also certified for petrol but may not be that suitable for petrol engine with catalytic convertor due to higher amount of Zinc.

API or ACEA do not give out their rating just for fun. If they give their seal of approval, they stand by it to be OK for petrol.

Think about it. If you do not trust those certification authority, who can you trust?

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Added on February 28, 2012, 7:19 pmIt is supposed to be heavier than you xw30 because it is a xw40. If it is not, then there is something wrong.

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Added on February 28, 2012, 7:58 pmGolden rule of marketing: If you have it, tell everybody about it. If you don't have it, keep quiet.
FS base oil is superior so they tell everybody about it. But ever heard FS telling people their additives are superior than Mineral? No? Then they better keep quiet about it. Just don't let your imagination runs wild.

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 28 2012, 08:01 PM

Since FS themselves never said their additives are better, then we can only conclude FS additives are no better. But since you say they are better, then the onus is on you to prove otherwise because you are making it up yourself.

You keep insisting you know more about FS additives package than the FS manufacturer themselves. FS manufacture never dare to say their additives are better but you keep insisting they are better. FS paid you to spread misinformation?

Have you it ever occur to you the reason why you can't find info is because there are no differences. If there are no differences, why keep insisting one is better than the other?

AFAIK, the only difference is, FS oil has less Viscosity Improver than Mineral due to it's superior base oil.

And if you do care to do some research, they all tell you to change OCI at same interval.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 28 2012, 10:08 PM

Good to know you admit you are wrong. Now done with you.

BTW, Valvoline goes on record to say all additives break down at the same rate. Hence same OCI for both FS and Mineral. I have never come across a counter claim form a reputable oil company. Only Cap Ayam brand will says "FS 10K but Mineal 5K".

http://www.kitcarmag.com/techarticles/synt...tech/index.html

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 28 2012, 11:49 PM

IMO, people are getting unnecessarily worried about engine oil. Talking from experience, as long as you use oil with the:
1. Right Viscosity
2. Right API/ACEA/JASO rating.
3. Change at the 5K or 10K according to manufacturer recommendation (the exception would be those super long BMW OCI).
4. Not a race track driver

There is not going to be any engine oil related engine problem. My friend and I had used RM10/liter good mineral oil for up to 1/2 million kilometer with no problem. So RM30/liter to us is super expensive already.

I don't know about VTEC etc but I do know on diesel engines with intercooling and turbocharging, never experienced any problem with good Mineral Oil. Of course, our experience only goes up to 1/2 million kilometer so can't say what will happen beyond that mileage. And diesel engine are known to be tougher on engine oils than petrol engine. That is why I said many people are unnecessarily worried about nothing over engine oils.

Since we do not have extreme cold like Alaska nor the extreme heat like the Sahara desert or drive a Ferrari, I bet the majority of people do not need FS oil. It's simply a waste of money IMHO. And oil salesman tried to justify the higher cost by telling lies about being able to extend OCI with FS.

As for the VTEC issue. I suspect it is due to using oil of the wrong viscosity/rating rather than FS or Mineral.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 29 2012, 10:57 AM

Imagine a cook cooking a special dish. While you do know he uses salt, sugar, oil, vinegar, pepper etc as ingredient, he will not tell you how much quantity to use and when you use them. It could be vinegar must come before pepper or pepper before salt. It's his secret. So if you add too much vinegar, the taste will be totally off and ruin the dish the cook had carefully prepared for you.

Likewise, while we do know what additives a oil manufacturer use, we can not go and add more of the stuff ourselves. Doing so may ruin the engine oil. That is why I tell people, don't go add additives by yourself because you are going to ruin it. Too little not good. Too much can be not good also. Oil manufacturer spend billion to concoct a special recipe so don't be a smart *** to spoil what they created.

When these people unknowingly bought fake oil and bring it to official service center and insist on using it, and when engine problem starts, they insist car manufacturer must honor their engine warranty.

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 29 2012, 05:48 PM

There are Synthetic xW50 as well. Would be just as bad dragging performance as Mineral.

For extreme cold and hot environment, FS would be superior to Mineral. But many Malaysian think we are driving in the desert so must have FS. Guess they never read the thermometer.


This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Feb 29 2012, 10:50 PM

I suspect European cars have bigger oil pan capacity than Japanese so have longer OCI.

Motorcycle?

Do you understand car more than car manufacturer? If no, I would just stick to what car manufacturer says.

And if you really wanted a better oil, try 5W30 or even 0W30. But they are going to be more expensive because these will be Fully Synthetic. And don't be fooled by mechanic saying these FS that cost twice as much can last twice as long because there are no such thing.

One reason Proton list 10w30 instead is because those are cheaper Mineral oil but will do the job just fine.

This post has been edited by Optiplex330: Mar 4 2012, 07:28 AM