The newspaper ranking, do you mean the Setara ranking? If so, Monash & Nottingham are in Tier 5, and are only in the list based on alphabetical order.

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...post&p=34931135

This post has been edited by entryman: Jul 31 2010, 04:20 PM

and if notts uk is ranked higher in UK, does it matter to malaysia campus'?



This post has been edited by rubrubrub: Jul 31 2010, 04:28 PM

Yep. Because we're being awarded the same, identical degree.

To further confirm it, (at least for the business school) EQUIS and AMBA accreditation of Nottingham UK take into account the programmes delivered in Malaysia and China.

link to arwu: http://www.arwu.org/ARWU2009.jsp

this is how qs-times calculate their rankings: http://www.topuniversities.com/university-...simple-overview

this is how arwu calculate it: http://www.arwu.org/ARWUMethodology2009.jsp

compare for yourselves

ah thanks.

lolz. that survey is 100% based on academics which is unfortunately not quite suitable in todays world.

we are talking more about graduate attributes, about high employment rates of students who graduated from that uni.

not how many Nobel Prize winners that uni has. 20 marks for this criteria. astounding. having a Nobel Prize winner does not guarantee quality education for the students.


* For institutions specialized in humanities and social sciences such as London School of Economics, N&S is not considered, and the weight of N&S is relocated to other indicators.
see, these rankings dun even cover those aspects. what? means LSE is bad because it does not have scientific research?

on the other hand, if you wanna look at research and work in the acedemic field for the rest of your life, then yes, please follow that arwu rankings.

having Nobel prize winners and whatever award holders as your lecturers will certainly make a lot of difference in your thesis and research work..

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Added on July 31, 2010, 5:18 pmnot only times.

entryman has posted few other ranking bodies in his previous posts and monash outranks nottingham in general.



This post has been edited by zstan: Jul 31 2010, 05:18 PM

[quote=zstan,Jul 31 2010, 05:16 PM]
lolz. that survey is 100% based on academics which is unfortunately not quite suitable in todays world.

we are talking more about graduate attributes, about high employment rates of students who graduated from that uni.

not how many Nobel Prize winners that uni has. 20 marks for this criteria. astounding. having a Nobel Prize winner does not guarantee quality education for the students.


* For institutions specialized in humanities and social sciences such as London School of Economics, N&S is not considered, and the weight of N&S is relocated to other indicators.
see, these rankings dun even cover those aspects. what? means LSE is bad because it does not have scientific research?

on the other hand, if you wanna look at research and work in the acedemic field for the rest of your life, then yes, please follow that arwu rankings.

having Nobel prize winners and whatever award holders as your lecturers will certainly make a lot of difference in your thesis and research work..

That is why certain unis are specialized in certain course. Research courses are going to do well with a nobel prized lecturer.

But I do hope you get the idea that a 2nd tier university will always possess the good of a 2nd tier, and never a 1st tier.
2nd tiers are usually on par in quality and prestige (overall), with some societies favouring one over the other.

This post has been edited by entryman: Jul 31 2010, 05:23 PM

Is Monash Tier 1?

I wouldn't say so.

I would say.. Imperial is.



Simple, take our results for example, for your undergrad you could have got into Monash/Nottingham, but not Imperial.

And you wouldn't want to go to Curtin/Swinburne.

And after you have obtained your undergrad degree, and got at least a second class upper, and in many instances a first class, only then are you considered into places like MIT/Imperial (1st tier) for graduate studies.

(just making a general assumption and comparison of "tiers" here).

This post has been edited by entryman: Jul 31 2010, 05:32 PM

half of the qs ranking is based on online survey and nobody really knows what the sources are and the result can easily be faked/biased.

-http://research.qsnetwork.com/qs_surveysystem/index.php?viewonly&order=normal&partnerset=0&survey=52&jump_to_section=3

from the above webpage you can see QS-times ask for research quality in the peer review survey too (40%), but this is very inaccurate as there is no data backing it up, just a personal "feeling".

Here is a direct quote from the webpage:

"Please select up to thirty universities from our international list that you "regard as" producing the best research in the XXX subject area"

And I don;t see how faculty:student ratio (20% of the ranking) can denote quality. Simply having more lecturers does not make a university good (quantity ≠quality) An addition 10% is made up of international faculty and students. If they all come from, say Africa, then it will also be included in the ranking and no way does this reflects how "internationally" attractive it is.

You talk about graduate attributes which can no way be reflected from these rankings. Research/nobel prize means innovation, and having Nobel prize winners and whatever award holders as your lecturers probably means having a higher chance that creative graduates would be produced.

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Added on July 31, 2010, 5:56 pmI didn;t catch this the first time. QS-Times and Arwu are the two most popular rankings that are mostly reffered to.


This post has been edited by exzau: Jul 31 2010, 05:56 PM

ah well, everybody can say that the results can be faked. but if that's the case, why can't the lower ranked uni fake the survey as well?

what have got against students from africa? those who managed to got into those top uni in UK and australia are even better than you and I.

producing creative & innovative students doesn't mean they will succeed in the working world.

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Added on July 31, 2010, 6:19 pmTier 1 in what? the setara ratings?

This post has been edited by zstan: Jul 31 2010, 06:19 PM

aiyo, in the end of the day, a degree is to cari makan ma. Can cari makan enough lo.

*takes cover b4 anti-IPTA come shoot me*

@zstan, no, the 'tier' thing in Setara is terbalik from what is the norm in international standards. So, internationally, Tier 1 is like the elite schools.

UNott is considered Tier wat ah? Nottingham Trent is Tier-3, right?

This post has been edited by DJFoo000: Jul 31 2010, 06:55 PM

who classify them into respective tiers?

yeah agree a degree is to cari makan. it doesn't entirely define who u are and if u really wanted to gain more knowledge. There are ton's of cheaper means to do that. anyway i've checked out monash and nottingham. I'm going to enrol to nottingham this september in social science department studying applied psychology with management studies.

In terms of general consensus on the respective "place" and "prestige" in social system.

Let's say, in the UK is would be something like..

Oxbridge/Imperial/LSE/ Warwick/UCL/etc.
Durham

Bath Loughborough
Nottingham and the likes
etc.

Nottingham Trent
Oxford Brookes
etc.

Not exactly sure about the above accuracy of placings, but it's something similar.

This post has been edited by entryman: Jul 31 2010, 09:30 PM

not really..

graduating from a prestigious uni gives u an upper hand when u apply for MNC.. quoted from entryman

Not only that. Some jobs, in fact many jobs that you may have not heard about, only take in students with degrees from "top tier" universities. Nottingham/monash also very tough to get in, if it's even possible.

This post has been edited by entryman: Jul 31 2010, 09:22 PM

Ah I thought a good analogy. Tier system is much like the social class in society. It's not official, but it's just taken as it is.

But locally, Nott and Monash graduates are considered competitive candidates, right?

It's not official. But it's in the life and blood.

What else can be better, locally?