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 The Official Subwoofer Thread v3, Everything you need to know about bass!

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jchong
post Aug 8 2010, 07:53 AM

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QUOTE(gtafan @ Aug 4 2010, 11:57 AM)
exactly..any idea to connect this baby to a AVR ?
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Not sure how it can be connected to AVR. I see a pre-amp input port, but the connector is unusual.
anfieldude
post Aug 8 2010, 08:11 AM

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jchong and I spent some time listening to the eD a7-650 yesterday...

Powerful is one word to describe the bugger.

We actually got it to bottom out even with the SVS AS-EQ1 (that did a fabulous job with integrating the 2 subs for all scenes except the IronMan scene) in the mix.

The sound signature is so very sealed sub, fast and did I mention powerful...

pierreye, I think we need to spend some more time understanding what actually goes on during the scene and maybe move the sub, even 2 ft maybe that will help.
pierreye
post Aug 8 2010, 08:34 AM

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I'm trying to get some help from eD and HometheaterShack on some of the issue I observed. I'll shift the sub around 1.5 ft to the left and re-measure. I still had problem my Onkyo 805 sub output over saturating my BFD sub input. I also notice when the peak is overloading, it will overflow to the second channel. Maybe I need to use a RCA to XLR cable with the ground cable lifted. I suspect ground is tie to all channel which cause the signal overflow to other channel.

Anfieldude, if you don't mind, another test I want to try is swapping out the receiver. I suspect the voltage output from the sub out is too high that cause my BFD to overload. The max input for BFD input is 1.6 vrms.


Added on August 10, 2010, 11:24 amI managed to solve the BFD input clipping issue. Just switch the sensitivity from -10db to +4db and voila, no more RED clipping light.

Now, I have to solve the bottom out issue. I found a good place for the sub with very good freq response but it's outside the false wall. I'll try a few combination first before deciding.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Aug 10 2010, 11:24 AM
ckf8829
post Aug 21 2010, 11:30 PM

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Hi,

Is B&W ASW610 a good subwoofer? I have read a review that this sub is good for both music & movie. Anyone can comment? What is the reasonable price for this sub? i found ~RM2600.

Thanks alot
clkok
post Aug 25 2010, 03:24 PM

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Proud to be owner for Velodyne CHT-12Q.. smile.gif
ronnt88
post Aug 25 2010, 10:01 PM

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QUOTE(clkok @ Aug 25 2010, 03:24 PM)
Proud to be owner for Velodyne CHT-12Q.. smile.gif
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congratz... nice to have new toys smile.gif

This post has been edited by ronnt88: Aug 25 2010, 10:02 PM
paskal
post Aug 26 2010, 08:15 PM

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QUOTE(lightning69 @ Jul 17 2010, 06:04 PM)
Paradigm DSP-3400 vs SVS PC12Plus

Ok.  I have tested both sub side by side on the 14th July 2010 in my friend's house.  My opinion on both sub is base on real life listening with only one calibration done on both the Paradigm DSP-3400 vs SVS PC12Plus i.e. setting the volume level to equal loudness using SPL meter.  No room adjustment or calibration is done during the test.  For the same SPL measured, my SVS volume level is set at half way at 12 while the DSP-3400 is set at only slightly above 10. 

Listening material used:

1. Eagles Farewell Tour 1
2. Finding Nemo - Darla Taps Tank (1:18:16) & Whale Spouting (1:12:04) 20Hz
3. Kung fu Panda: Fight between Po and Tai-lung & Po escape
4. Transformers: Ironhide Sweep
5. Golden Compass  during the Polar Bear fight & Airship entering city.
6. DTS Demo DVD - Omar Hakim - Listen Up

We tested by playing above with one sub and then replay it imediately with another sub so there are a lot of sub switching during the test.

For music, both subs gave very similar performance.  Its good to hear that the Paradigm DSP-3400 is not boomy just like the SVS PC12-Plus and both produce clean and tight bass.  It really very hard to tell any difference between the 2 subs.

For movies, most of the test materials I use really push the subs to its limit and both sub can handle what we throw at it.  Most of the people present prefer the SVS more as its seems to give more kick than the Paradigm.  However the Paradigm DSP-3400 is great sub too as it can handle all the above with room shaking bass too.  It just feel that the SVS dig slightly lower(maybe) therefore giving the feeling of more punch.

Overall I highly recommend the Paradigm DSP-3400 for its price and its performance.  The one we tested cost RM3800 vs the SVS PC12+ which retail for RM5400 in Malaysia.  Without a side by side comparison, you can hardly tell any difference in performance from the 2 sub so for those budget concious people, please do check out the Paradigm DSP-3400.  You won't be disappointed.
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quoting the previous impression made by lightning69.

user posted imageuser posted image
a good friend of mine have just bought a new Paradigm DSP3400 for RM3300. yes you read that right, RM450 cheaper than SVS PB12-NSD which are selling from official Malaysian distributor reseller for RM3750.

i (we) have audited the PB12-NSD last 2 weeks at a friend's house in penang for 2 hours listening to his PB12 playing various scenes from Terminator Salvation, Cloverfield, David Foster & Friends, Die Hard 4.0 and some music tracks.
this DSP3400 beats the PB12-NSD sounds better than the PB12-NSD. it goes deeper, have more weight to it, better slam and more pronounced.

the PB12-NSD is rated to go until 18Hz. this DSP3400 is rated to go until 19Hz. but FWIW, this DSP3400 sounds like it goes deeper than the SVS. lightning69 say it holds ground to PC12+ (RM5550 from official reseller) which are rated to go till 16Hz.
considering that the new PB12NSD fitted with the newer DSP amp might increase in price for another 5-15% (source), might as well go for this DSP3400 for at least RM450 cheaper.

and owh, you guessed correctly; this DSP3400 does come with a DSP amp. that's why the 'DSP' moniker is in the DSP3400 model number.
so for RM450 less, you get 2" larger woofer than the PB12-NSD and a DSP amp. and not forgetting better weight, better slam and more pronounced bass.
jchong
post Aug 26 2010, 09:25 PM

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Wow, sounds like the DSP3400 is the sub to beat in the 3K+ range.
ronaldjoe
post Aug 26 2010, 09:29 PM

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I always like the look of Paradigm sub... fat rubber lips wub.gif very sexy
anfieldude
post Aug 26 2010, 09:30 PM

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QUOTE(paskal @ Aug 26 2010, 08:15 PM)
quoting the previous impression made by lightning69.

user posted imageuser posted image
a good friend of mine have just bought a new Paradigm DSP3400 for RM3300. yes you read that right, RM450 cheaper than SVS PB12-NSD which are selling from official Malaysian distributor reseller for RM3750.

i (we) have audited the PB12-NSD last 2 weeks at a friend's house in penang for 2 hours listening to his PB12 playing various scenes from Terminator Salvation, Cloverfield, David Foster & Friends, Die Hard 4.0 and some music tracks.
this DSP3400 beats the PB12-NSD sounds better than the PB12-NSD. it goes deeper, have more weight to it, better slam and more pronounced.

the PB12-NSD is rated to go until 18Hz. this DSP3400 is rated to go until 19Hz. but FWIW, this DSP3400 sounds like it goes deeper than the SVS. lightning69 say it holds ground to PC12+ (RM5550 from official reseller) which are rated to go till 16Hz.
considering that the new PB12NSD fitted with the newer DSP amp might increase in price for another 5-15% (source), might as well go for this DSP3400 for at least RM450 cheaper.

and owh, you guessed correctly; this DSP3400 does come with a DSP amp. that's why the 'DSP' moniker is in the DSP3400 model number.
so for RM450 less, you get 2" larger woofer than the PB12-NSD and a DSP amp. and not forgetting better weight, better slam and more pronounced bass.
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Cool. I hv not heard the DSP3400 before, but I hv seen it in the shop. If it works for ur friend and u, thats the most important. Sound is very subjective as there are no real standards defined. I hv heard some Paradigm subs before and was not impressed, but the DSP3400 seems to be well regarded.
pierreye
post Aug 26 2010, 09:41 PM

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Replacement driver is here yesterday and done the installation. Test out the iron man cave scene and no more clanking sound even at reference level (volume at 0db)!
jchong
post Aug 26 2010, 10:40 PM

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QUOTE(pierreye @ Aug 26 2010, 09:41 PM)
Replacement driver is here yesterday and done the installation. Test out the iron man cave scene and no more clanking sound even at reference level (volume at 0db)!
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Congrats! It's now working as it should. U must be enjoying it.
ckf8829
post Aug 26 2010, 10:44 PM

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QUOTE(ckf8829 @ Aug 21 2010, 11:30 PM)
Hi,

Is B&W ASW610 a good subwoofer? I have read a review that this sub is good for both music & movie. Anyone can comment? What is the reasonable price for this sub? i found ~RM2600.

Thanks alot
*
Can anyone help to comment on this?

Thanks
paskal
post Aug 27 2010, 04:36 AM

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QUOTE(jchong @ Aug 26 2010, 09:25 PM)
Wow, sounds like the DSP3400 is the sub to beat in the 3K+ range.
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i'm gonna let it run it for a couple of weeks then make a freq response graph for it. if indeed it goes lower than 19Hz, then IMO it's a better buy than the SVS PB12-NSD.

QUOTE(anfieldude @ Aug 26 2010, 09:30 PM)
Cool. I hv not heard the DSP3400 before, but I hv seen it in the shop. If it works for ur friend and u, thats the most important. Sound is very subjective as there are no real standards defined. I hv heard some Paradigm subs before and was not impressed, but the DSP3400 seems to be well regarded.
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hearing how people are dissing the DSP3400 previously (when lightning69 posted his impressions) and making fun of it, i really think people should hear a different opinion.
i do agree sound is a very subjective issue, but thoughts about a competing product can't be dissed-up (if the word even exists) entirely just because it is a different product compared to those which we are familiar with.

i think forumers should be (more) free in sharing their opinions and should not be scared to post and telling others about it.
if people are still shooting blindly like how lightning69's impressions are being shot at, we won't hear any other opinions about any competing products because fear of being shot down.

bro if you have seen then sub, then i reckon maybe this time you will ask the shopowner to power it up and hear how it performs. you won't regret that few minutes of your time.
pierreye
post Aug 27 2010, 07:44 AM

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I think one of the reason is traditionally most of us will think a branded sub performance will never surpassed a ID sub at the same price range. In fact, base on the review, Paradigm DSP3400 looks like a very good bargain below RM 5k range. I'm interested in DSP3400 now as if I were to DIY a ported 13Av.2 single sub, I estimate at least RM 500 for cabinet and another RM 2.5k for a 1kw amp plate. Might as well get a DSP3400 and call it a day. Anyone had a chart of the freq response of DSP3400? Max SPL before major distortion kick in?

We are here to share information. Not that we worship a single brand. If you ask me, Am I happy with A7s-650? Yes. Is there any other brand I'm interested? Definitely... especially the Submersive HP... if only Mark is responsive.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Aug 27 2010, 07:47 AM
shuto1
post Aug 27 2010, 08:53 AM

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QUOTE(pierreye @ Aug 27 2010, 07:44 AM)
We are here to share information. Not that we worship a single brand. If you ask me, Am I happy with A7s-650? Yes. Is there any other brand I'm interested? Definitely... especially the Submersive HP... if only Mark is responsive.
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LOL, I agree with that last part. More than 2 weeks and no reply. What the?? rclxub.gif
TShtkaki
post Aug 27 2010, 09:35 AM

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Probably he is busy making the subs for the bulk order from OZ tongue.gif

paskal, the PB12-NSD and DSP-3400 belongs to the same owner?

ronaldjoe, the Sub25 is the sealed sub to beat. It's price is surprisingly good over here. If for me, I would try it out instead of Submersive given those reviews.

This post has been edited by htkaki: Aug 27 2010, 09:38 AM
jchong
post Aug 27 2010, 09:39 AM

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Yup, Mark definitely has to improve his response time. Imagine all the extra business he could get... or maybe his demand in USA is so good that he has less time for overseas queries? smile.gif Except maybe for large bulk orders...

This post has been edited by jchong: Aug 27 2010, 09:40 AM
TShtkaki
post Aug 27 2010, 09:44 AM

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QUOTE(jchong @ Aug 27 2010, 09:39 AM)
Yup, Mark definitely has to improve his response time. Imagine all the extra business he could get... or maybe his demand in USA is so good that he has less time for overseas queries? smile.gif
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probably. I think it is high time for him to expand.

Bro, still cracking your head over your room acoustic issue?

I think it is better for you to make time and come over to have a listen first before I ship the Ultra to you. At least, you know the 'benchmark' smile.gif .

The other day, I went to a customer place. His room has really bad acoustic and limited space to place the sub. I told him to rectify it first coz he ain't going to get much of the potential from his system with that kind of square room.

Anyway, I am glad that more and more HT enthusiasts place importance on room acoustic rather than 100% on the gears alone.
anfieldude
post Aug 27 2010, 09:48 AM

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QUOTE(htkaki @ Aug 27 2010, 09:35 AM)
Probably he is busy making the subs for the bulk order from OZ tongue.gif

paskal, the PB12-NSD and DSP-3400 belongs to the same owner?

ronaldjoe, the Sub25 is the sealed sub to beat. It's price is surprisingly good over here. If for me, I would try it out instead of Submersive given those reviews.
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How much is the sub25 in Msia?

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