P1 P1 Wiggy: Overpromise & Underdeliver, *P1's response in Post #135*
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 Apr 16 2009, 07:34 PM
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Senior Member
1,185 posts Joined: Feb 2008 From: Not Found   
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Is buying a GTR (R35) that go up to 300km/h+
But is only allow up to 140km/h. unless is on ciruit is limit is remove. Meanning Buy 10mb get 5mb unless you are beside the antenna then get full~ |
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Apr 16 2009, 07:39 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy 
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I'll continue to provide technical information until I give up on forumers who are ignorant (exist in both sides of the argument).
155Mbps can be realized by providing a microwave link (this is a very mature technology). You are guaranteed 155Mbps to the operator's core but I guess there will be bottleneck all the way to the source of your download. New microwave links can go up to 400Mbps. All of this comes at a condition, your connection is fixed and you will need to install dishes double the size of Astro dish at your roof. This is not mobile BB, this is fixed BB. I doubt this service can be provided with the price of RM1000. This post has been edited by bysquashy: Apr 16 2009, 07:41 PM |
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Apr 16 2009, 08:11 PM
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Senior Member
1,188 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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QUOTE(stringfellow @ Apr 16 2009, 01:10 PM) » Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «  wonder what happen remain wiggy user, all silent only & no complain  since staff is reading this, treat all yr customer complain fair n square u better watch out & don't let yr guard down next complain from m33  i'm not even subscribe for service  Added on =off topic= QUOTE(bysquashy @ Apr 16 2009, 07:39 PM) I'll continue to provide technical information until I give up on forumers who are ignorant (exist in both sides of the argument). nice sharing155Mbps can be realized by providing a microwave link (this is a very mature technology). You are guaranteed 155Mbps to the operator's core but I guess there will be bottleneck all the way to the source of your download. New microwave links can go up to 400Mbps. All of this comes at a condition, your connection is fixed and you will need to install dishes double the size of Astro dish at your roof. This is not mobile BB, this is fixed BB. I doubt this service can be provided with the price of RM1000. RM1K for local network without internet service. the equipment, installation & setup gone cost more than monthly service/maintenance. if customer willing to absorb all cost, it would be even cheaper. pls correct me if i'm wrong btw i'm just interested on wireless tech, no qualification or watever Added on |
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Apr 16 2009, 08:24 PM
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Junior Member
431 posts Joined: Dec 2006 From: Internet
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QUOTE(xMika @ Apr 16 2009, 06:48 PM) After viewing all the replies from all of you guys, there is something I have to say. I've been a P1 w1max promoter under authorised resellers. Have to admit that not all customers are satisfied with the service. In reality, is there something that can really fulfill your requirements ? What you want is faster download speed, larger amount of bandwidth capacity. If you want it, yes we have it. (special package, requires P1 specific base station to be build at your place). 100mbps speed is available. The bandwidth capacity is unlimited. Price is RM1k+. You willing to pay for it ? Just stop all your bullxxxx and stop defending P1. Yeap, we signed up for P1 Wiggy because we want faster download speed, and give a fresh try to new tech, i guess there's no harm to give a try right?? And who don't know about the "best effort basis" written in the contract?? We are not going to ask for full 10mbs speed for us, but at least don't try to mis-advertise about those bull 10mbs speed which most of the average user cant even hit 5mbs downloading speed. Ok, i don't compare to other countries.. i compare to a local ISP which i signed up for 4mbs package, although i cant get full 4mbs downloading speed but at least i still get 75% of the speed that they advertise. If P1 Wiggy cant even hit 5mbs and above, what for i signed up their 10mbs package?? Why not i just subscribe to their cheaper 1.2mbs package?? Since there's no speed difference between 1.2mbs with 10mbs, as 10mbs also cant hit 3mbs of speed. I don't find any reason that they need to set up those micro transceiver to cheat their customer if they really can provide 10mbs speed or maybe at least 7mbs+-. Before that, you think that setting up base stations are easy ? There are many procedures that we have to go through before we are able to set up the base stations. License and contracts have to be applied from that specific state/area government. You know, there are many residents that like to complain about radiowaves that will so-call harm our human body, cancer causing. Its not that we dont want to give you the 10mbps speed. If we can provide you the speed, why not ? Its not like we will get less profit or what-so-ever. You paid & we know that you should the get speed we promise. Best effort basis is written on the contract. You signed it, that means you know it. 8mbps and above is reachable in certain places. But, we did mentioned that you will get a minimum speed of 1.2mbps or else money-back guarantee. Did you get below 1.2mbps speed ? If yes, go return it. I'm sure that you are not a small kid anymore, what a promoter say is always sweet-talking. SEE ! CAN REACH 8MBPS WOR! TRY LA, SPEED SO FAST. Conclusion, after you signed a contract, theres no way back unless you were penalised. Remember, 10mbps is on best afford basis not guarantee speed. Note: This is Malaysia. Dont compare with other countries. A few months back, I have a customer coming to me & say : whats the speed of USA's internet ? Singapore ? Korea ? P1 w1max ? So what if you compare with other countries ? Can you get their internet speed ? Go connect a 1000km optic fiber cable from singapore to your house if you want to. And bysquashy, i agree with what you say. RM 1k for 100mbs and unlimited bandwidth is absolutely a bull. AFAIK, RM 1k cant even cover the bandwidth cost. And 1k for 100mbs is really nothing if u really can provide such fast speed connection. P1, do something and don't let us, your customer down. Don't just providing such lousy service and walk away with our hard earned money, and of course we're not those kena bully also don't dare to voice out kind of customer  I am expecting to see improvement or i'm bringing this case to authorities.. There's nothing curious to see alot of forumer/blogger defending P1 as P1 do take care most the blogger nicely.  This post has been edited by victor87: Apr 16 2009, 08:32 PM |
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Apr 16 2009, 08:57 PM
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Senior Member
974 posts Joined: Jan 2009
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QUOTE(xMika @ Apr 16 2009, 06:48 PM) Before that, you think that setting up base stations are easy ? There are many procedures that we have to go through before we are able to set up the base stations. License and contracts have to be applied from that specific state/area government. You know, there are many residents that like to complain about radiowaves that will so-call harm our human body, cancer causing. WADR, in general, the users should not care about what problems a company has setting up or providing a service. Not just P1, any company. The user wants what is advertised or promised for the payment that is being made. It is up to the company to figure out whether they have the capability to provide the services. If they don't, or there is many stumbling blocks and the user is not going to get what is advertised, then don't say you can provide the service.QUOTE(xMika @ Apr 16 2009, 06:48 PM) Its not that we dont want to give you the 10mbps speed. If we can provide you the speed, why not ? Its not like we will get less profit or what-so-ever. You paid & we know that you should the get speed we promise. Best effort basis is written on the contract. You signed it, that means you know it. 8mbps and above is reachable in certain places. But, we did mentioned that you will get a minimum speed of 1.2mbps or else money-back guarantee. Did you get below 1.2mbps speed ? If yes, go return it. "Best Effort" has to have a more meaningful definition. How do you define it? What is the lowest figure that you consider as best effort? 80%? 70%? 50%? If you say 10Mbps, then are only able to guarantee 1.2Mbps, does that mean your worst "best effort" is at 12%?Best effort has become a convenience for companies providing such services. It is being used to protect them in case they fail to provide the expected service. Even using best effort should have some sort of relevant minimum level of expectation. Does signing a contract based on best effort automatically make a service provider no longer responsible to provide the level of service that has been advertised? Can a user negotiate or change any terms of the contract before signing? No, its take it or leave it. QUOTE(xMika @ Apr 16 2009, 06:48 PM) I'm sure that you are not a small kid anymore, what a promoter say is always sweet-talking. SEE ! CAN REACH 8MBPS WOR! TRY LA, SPEED SO FAST. What criterias define best effort service? Distance from the base station? Number of subscribers in an area? The weather?Conclusion, after you signed a contract, theres no way back unless you were penalised. Remember, 10mbps is on best afford basis not guarantee speed. On a related note, do you know what sort of international links / backbone P1 uses? I asked about 6 salespersons at PC Fair recently, none of them could answer. What sort of capacity does P1 have for international traffic? Do they have their own circuits / links? If so, to which countries? Is there enough international bandwidth capacity to support users for 10Mbps connections? Or is the 10Mbps figures mainly only apply to local access? |
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Apr 17 2009, 12:12 AM
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Junior Member
94 posts Joined: Dec 2008
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Confusing statement... on the 1st part u say user dun care abt problem faced by the isp..
last part, u r askin their backbone/ international gateway. i doubt if u ask any isp reseller or isp staff.. u can get straight answer from them. u sound like tryin to ridicules the sales staff. its like.. u asking technical stuff abt airplane at the ticket counter... or asking mcdonald's annaul revenue at the counter. U simply asking the wrong ppl. And generalize the whole company as failure. |
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Apr 17 2009, 12:19 AM
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Junior Member
440 posts Joined: Oct 2007
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hohoho...i tot streamyx already sux 9 9..but P1 also sux 9 9...no internet service provider in malaysia is reliable at all
Added on April 17, 2009, 12:27 am QUOTE(bo093 @ Apr 16 2009, 07:34 PM) Is buying a GTR (R35) that go up to 300km/h+ why not just say..buy 10mbBut is only allow up to 140km/h. unless is on ciruit is limit is remove. Meanning Buy 10mb get 5mb unless you are beside the antenna then get full~ get 1mb unless you are beside the antenna then get full~  we pay for wat we get...even if we subcribe 10mb..we expect around 70-80% of the speed to TS: u can actually take action against them..but im not sure who u shud report to as our gov is as sucks as them This post has been edited by wongth7: Apr 17 2009, 12:27 AM |
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Apr 17 2009, 01:05 AM
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Elite
1,428 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(bysquashy @ Apr 16 2009, 07:29 PM) BTW, many have problem with setting up an indoor base station for coverage. I guess they don't realize that for tall buildings like KLCC (my office), indoor system is used to provide GSM/UMTS coverage. Indoor coverage is meant to be covered by indoor BS. If P1 did not place the BS there, the speed test that the user do will be flawed. Please don't tell me your house is as big as KL Convention Center and you have more than 10K people walking around your house. This echoes what I heard from P1 staff. P1 doesn't get to choose where the PC Fair is held. If they want to be at the PC Fair, they are going to have to be in the KL Convention Centre, surrounded by tons of metal and thousands of active RF devices. It's a hostile environment for demonstrating wireless internet access. A portable base station was really the only way they could do demos, unless they walked each customer out into KLCC park with a netbook to run speedtests. Don't forget, all the other WISPs mobbing the hall (Celcom etc.) most likely had portable base stations in place as well. P1 had three choices: 1) Not bring a portable station, and then demo performance which is considerably worse than users within coverage areas would normally get. 2) Bring a portable base station, run it at its normal configuration just a few metres from the booth, and demo performance which is considerably better than users within coverage areas would normally get. 3) Bring a portable base station, and throttle the speed down to match what users within coverage areas would normally get. They did #2, but they probably should have done #3. |
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Apr 17 2009, 01:16 AM
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Senior Member
11,305 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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The choice is actually easy: do a speedtest outside that hall. Their collection booth for the Wiggy modem on the ground floor itself is outside the hall, and can connect to their WiMax network. If they are sincerely want to be truthful about it, they can ask the customer to wait the one-hour period to activate, and ask them to come around that booth once their modem is activated for a speed test. Ignore all the noise other providers are making about their own avertised speeds, and concentrate on winning your own customers. The other providers can make it all glitzy and sensational all you want, but once the hype dies down, the most important things will come back to haunt them: whether their actual speed tallies with the expectations of the customer you are allowing subscription to.
I will be infinitely grateful and support them wholeheartedly without question if they do it this way. For everyone else's info, the speed test I've done at the collection booth area, on the second day of PC Fair 2009 clocks around 2.4Mbps. That alone would have given a realistic perspective on what to expect on their service. Whether they're really ignorant about other possibilities of speedtesting or does their speedtest with hidden agendas, the fact remains that they overpromised, and underdelivered, by a significant margin. |
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Apr 17 2009, 01:24 AM
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Senior Member
974 posts Joined: Jan 2009
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QUOTE(pil @ Apr 17 2009, 12:12 AM) Confusing statement... on the 1st part u say user dun care abt problem faced by the isp.. pil , let me clarify.last part, u r askin their backbone/ international gateway. i doubt if u ask any isp reseller or isp staff.. u can get straight answer from them. u sound like tryin to ridicules the sales staff. its like.. u asking technical stuff abt airplane at the ticket counter... or asking mcdonald's annaul revenue at the counter. U simply asking the wrong ppl. And generalize the whole company as failure. My first part was a general statment, I even pointed out it was not only about P1. My last part was asking the question to xMika as an agent/reseller if he knows the info since I didn't get an answer from the salesperson. Note I said "on a related note...". I did not ridicule the salespersons or the company as a whole. This is not purely about P1, it seems to be about misleading advertisement in general, using P1 as an example. Using your examples, you don't ask about the airplane at the counter because you are there just to check in. You don't ask about revenue at McDonalds because you are there just to buy the food. At an exhibition or fair like this, it is a place to get more info about the service, not just to signup only. So you should ask more questions. A company should have people for sales and to anser any technical questions too to give a better impression of the company. I have posted in another thread about how all broadband companies at PC Fair who didn't seem to have proper representatives apart from the salespersons. Please do not make it seem I am targeting P1. I am not even a customer. Just giving my opinions in this thread. What companies don't seem to realise is that users / customers / consumers have become more aware of their rights and want more detailed info and ask more questions these days. Yes, not all customers, but many more now than long time ago. Some companies have still not changed to meet this new demands. They are still focused on the selling part only. Many years ago, people don't question ads very much. Nowdays, people do and check on things more carefully. It could also be that ads these days have become less clear in what they mean, so people have to question more. It works both ways. Sorry if you felt I was ridiculing salesperson or the company. Not my intention. |
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Apr 17 2009, 02:36 AM
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Senior Member
2,465 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Bukit Jalil, migrated to Paldea.
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If:
- If I pay RM80 for petrol, I must get RM80 worth of petrol as shown in the oil pump meter. Tumpah sikit or meleluwap sikit rugi RM3, nvm I can accept. -If I pay RM200 for electricity, I must get RM200 worth of electricity as shown in the electric meter. - If I pay RM30 for water, I must get RM30 worth of water as shown in the water meter. - If I buy coke small bottle, I must get 500ml as shown in the bottle. If the bottle that I bought is less a bit that other bottle when compared, nvm I can accept because the bottle is unopened. - If I reload RM5, I must be able to get the airtime worth RM5 as stated as the call package that I'm currently in. - If I buy N 300Mbps wireless router + receiver, I must get 300Mbps as advertised. If I only got 220-250Mbps, nvm I can understand. Lower than that, I request refund. - If I buy hard disk 40GB, I must get 40GB as advertised. If i got only 37-38GB, nvm I can understand. Lower that that, I ask for explaination. - If I pay RM66 for StreamyX 1.5Mbps download speed as advertised, I must get 1.5Mbps. If I got only 1Mbps, nvm I can understand. Lower than that, I complain and they rebate me. - If I pay RM88 for 3G 3.6Mbps download speed as advertised, I must get 3.6Mbps. If I only got 1-2Mbps nvm I can understand. Lower than that, I might as well pay RM66 for 384kbps and save my money and if I'm paying RM66 for 384kbps, I must get 384kbps, if I got only 256kbps, nvm I can understand, lower than that, I'll getting really angry. So tell me, why the fish some wannabe blogger here asked to let it go and be happy with it when I paid RM149 for 10Mbps but did not get 10Mbps as advertised? If only get 7-8Mbps, nvm I can understand, but I only got 2-3Mbps and I'm in the center of the coverage area, might as well save my money and opt for 3G la! U ingat duit senang cari ka watafish P1! Unlucky me, now only see this thread. Will cancel it and take back my money 2moro. |
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Apr 17 2009, 04:05 AM
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Senior Member
1,651 posts Joined: Dec 2006
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almost fall for P1 trap. thank god i visit here first.
This post has been edited by LaskarCinta: Apr 17 2009, 04:06 AM |
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Apr 17 2009, 06:16 AM
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Newbie
0 posts Joined: Apr 2009
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QUOTE(stringfellow @ Apr 17 2009, 01:16 AM) The choice is actually easy: do a speedtest outside that hall. Their collection booth for the Wiggy modem on the ground floor itself is outside the hall, and can connect to their WiMax network. If they are sincerely want to be truthful about it, they can ask the customer to wait the one-hour period to activate, and ask them to come around that booth once their modem is activated for a speed test. Ignore all the noise other providers are making about their own avertised speeds, and concentrate on winning your own customers. The other providers can make it all glitzy and sensational all you want, but once the hype dies down, the most important things will come back to haunt them: whether their actual speed tallies with the expectations of the customer you are allowing subscription to. Totally agree with you. I also felt cheated by p1. Shocked that they actully used an indoor base station to show us the imaginary speeds which one will never get in the real world. I also did the speedtest at the PCfair and was so excited thinking I can get at least 8mbps when I got home. I only live 350 meteres from the base station. I am also getting 1.6mbps to 2.4 mbps in the evenings which is ridiculous. I can get around 4-5mbps in the early morning but it's still not good enough. P1 just needs to increase their bandwidth, capacity or whatever it takes and deliver what they promise. I am also curious to know where I can get close to 10mbps as promised.I will be infinitely grateful and support them wholeheartedly without question if they do it this way. For everyone else's info, the speed test I've done at the collection booth area, on the second day of PC Fair 2009 clocks around 2.4Mbps. That alone would have given a realistic perspective on what to expect on their service. Whether they're really ignorant about other possibilities of speedtesting or does their speedtest with hidden agendas, the fact remains that they overpromised, and underdelivered, by a significant margin. P1 needs to either drop the 10mbps claim or add a disclaimer. The disclaimer must let us know the actual speeds one can expect during peak and non peak hours. They aslo must let us know what is needed to achieve the 10mbps speed. If they do that, then I am sure we won't be so disappointed. They have really absued the word "best effort" so that they can get away with their crappy speeds. The authorities nedd to clamp down on them. I hope all you guys who have wiggy and felt cheated will go personally to their HQ at jalan templer to voice your complaints and demand answers from them. I did that and still not satisfied with their best effort excuse. They don't reply to emails. |
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Apr 17 2009, 09:24 AM
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Junior Member
94 posts Joined: Dec 2008
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QUOTE(mylinear @ Apr 17 2009, 01:24 AM) pil , let me clarify. Ic, in tht case, im sry too as i guess i miss out those words. I rly wan to point out tht, most on field sales person hv very little knowledge on their own product. As i work in a smiliar field b4 long ago in banking sector.My first part was a general statment, I even pointed out it was not only about P1. My last part was asking the question to xMika as an agent/reseller if he knows the info since I didn't get an answer from the salesperson. Note I said "on a related note...". I did not ridicule the salespersons or the company as a whole. This is not purely about P1, it seems to be about misleading advertisement in general, using P1 as an example. Using your examples, you don't ask about the airplane at the counter because you are there just to check in. You don't ask about revenue at McDonalds because you are there just to buy the food. At an exhibition or fair like this, it is a place to get more info about the service, not just to signup only. So you should ask more questions. A company should have people for sales and to anser any technical questions too to give a better impression of the company. I have posted in another thread about how all broadband companies at PC Fair who didn't seem to have proper representatives apart from the salespersons. Please do not make it seem I am targeting P1. I am not even a customer. Just giving my opinions in this thread. What companies don't seem to realise is that users / customers / consumers have become more aware of their rights and want more detailed info and ask more questions these days. Yes, not all customers, but many more now than long time ago. Some companies have still not changed to meet this new demands. They are still focused on the selling part only. Many years ago, people don't question ads very much. Nowdays, people do and check on things more carefully. It could also be that ads these days have become less clear in what they mean, so people have to question more. It works both ways. Sorry if you felt I was ridiculing salesperson or the company. Not my intention. Although its the job of a sales to convince or provide adequate or at least provide as much info as possible. If a sales unable to answer, he/she shud try to look for some who could. But tis oso require user's initiative as well to wait and understanding. But some are juz too ignorant, they do not ask for more info or wait for the sales to get info and when go home, they complaint. |
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Apr 17 2009, 10:32 AM
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Junior Member
6 posts Joined: Apr 2009 From: KL
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Owh. No wonder la the speed in the hall was so fast. I've heard also that during their roadshows, they can easily set up a station in their van or something because the station is so small. Con men!
Added on April 17, 2009, 10:32 amOwh. No wonder la the speed in the hall was so fast. I've heard also that during their roadshows, they can easily set up a station in their van or something because the station is so small. Con men! This post has been edited by laiweekiat: Apr 17 2009, 10:32 AM |
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Apr 17 2009, 10:49 AM
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Senior Member
2,657 posts Joined: Feb 2008 From: Highbury House, 75 Drayton Park, London
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QUOTE(laiweekiat @ Apr 17 2009, 10:32 AM) Owh. No wonder la the speed in the hall was so fast. I've heard also that during their roadshows, they can easily set up a station in their van or something because the station is so small. Con men! When something sounds to good to be true, it probably isnt. P1 you liar liar. Hope ur business tapaus in the next few mthsAdded on April 17, 2009, 10:32 amOwh. No wonder la the speed in the hall was so fast. I've heard also that during their roadshows, they can easily set up a station in their van or something because the station is so small. Con men! |
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Apr 17 2009, 10:52 AM
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Senior Member
2,516 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Uarla Umpur 
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QUOTE(ericpires @ Apr 17 2009, 10:49 AM) When something sounds to good to be true, it probably isnt. P1 you liar liar. Hope ur business tapaus in the next few mths too bad not everybody comes to lowyat.. we need to print and place posters around and inform the public abt cheating marketing tactics.. |
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Apr 17 2009, 12:37 PM
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Senior Member
11,305 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Did someone just edited this thread? Some of the posts are missing, especially the ones after JinXXX.
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Apr 17 2009, 12:48 PM
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Senior Member
2,516 posts Joined: Feb 2007 From: Uarla Umpur
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QUOTE(stringfellow @ Apr 17 2009, 12:37 PM) Did someone just edited this thread? Some of the posts are missing, especially the ones after JinXXX. yeah mods are slaves to P1 legal department... |
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Apr 17 2009, 01:33 PM
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VIP
6,008 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(stringfellow @ Apr 17 2009, 12:37 PM) Did someone just edited this thread? Some of the posts are missing, especially the ones after JinXXX. Yeah I invised a post that quoted Pip's 20-line post in its entirety and added "great comment..+1 for u!". That's what the good/bad buttons are for.Added on April 17, 2009, 1:41 pm QUOTE(JinXXX @ Apr 17 2009, 12:48 PM) yeah mods are slaves to P1 legal department... We're not. Fact: we've never received take-down notices from any of the broadband corps here before.But you're free to believe as you wish. I can only advise you to think. |
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