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This post has been edited by macyhouse: May 7 2010, 12:47 PM

I have just watch the movie Sicko by Michael Moore and this really give me a very good sense of what insurance health care company are in america , many policyholders dont get to claim even though they have bought the medical card. It even have private investigator finding fault and turn down your claim. The worse is to deny you any payment and even if you manage to claim the expenses, Insurance companies will find way to terminate you either by increasing the price of the policy.
So even the policy is consider as Guaranteed Renewal as claimed , which is true, but when they increase the premium so high than, policyholders will got no choice but abandon it. So is it worth to get Insurance Coverage now ?

What does all the agent have to say about this? Are insurance company invented this plan is really on helping patient . if they do , than they should stick to the premium agreement and not subject to increase... this seems to defeat the Guaranteed Renewal clause. People just cannot afford high premium that has no limitation. I hope many agents will watch sicko and ask questions whether they are truly in this business to help the policyholders. if they really mean it than they should question the high cost of premium for old age. Shouldn't senior citizens get cheaper premium after 55 years old but instead the cost is beyond their mean already.

and also the govt policies to make profits from the citizens of America.

Three countries including a communist country actually gives free medical to the citizen. they are Canada, British and france. Guess wat, Cuba too.

oh by the way, govt in france pays nanny to take care of children for free and they even have doctors going to the house to treat you for Free.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 11 2010, 12:20 AM

well, be thankful we are in malaysia then! haha, but straight to the point, insurance in malaysia is still at its infancy stage, therefor the products and plans we get here are way better than those in other countries. for eg, not many countries have 36 diseases coverage covered,in fact japan onli has one, cancer!

on to your topic in regards to ppl with old age,i feel for u, but after being in the business, it is managed the way it is becoz old ppl tend to get hospital visits more.one of the reasons i joined insurance is due to my experience when my grandma was sick ,the usual send to hospital vs save cost arguement came in, mind you she was close to 90 then. if insurance companies do not control their funds and manage their premiums well for old age, chances are when we reach our golden years, there wont be much for us to claim already!! insurance companies are not bankrolled by petronas u know. and you also have to look at the lifestyle led by the majority of ppl in that country.


in america, needles to say most of them are unhealthy. thats why insurance there is very messy. i have claims being rejected by my company b4 for my client, and that was due to my client not divulging that he has certain operation procedures done b4. so in that instances he understand why i cant make a claim for him. many reject cases we here about , we onli hear one side of the story. sometimes the ppl who buy medical policies are those who already have pre existing health conditions, try to get a medical card to ease their burden, but then get caught, so where else to go but blame la the insurance ppl.

on to your question on free medical, well, in malaysia we dont have to pay high taxes vs those countries that u just mentioned.
lets just use sg as example, over there they have policy which allows their employess to contribute a certain % of their epf towards their future medical fund. meaning that they educate their ppl to prepare for their own funds already while they are young and still able to earn . difference in mindset helps. in malaysia, u try to do that and see the repercussions.

Fully agree.

The key to buy insurance is the the policy holders have to disclose everything on their health conditions. IF they do, then surely have no issues arising in claim.

i think you guys are not listening and if u still have a little bit of heart, please watch Sicko.

In the documentary, there were insurance agents who quit their job because they think it was wrong. If i were you , i hope you step back and ask this.

1) Insurance agency said they are here to help us? Are you guys contradicting when people like me can't even buy an insurance at all if i have fall under your category of diabetic, obese , snoring etc....

what do you mean by helping when some people cannot even buy a policy already and they were left to be on their own.

Insurance Agency are going after people who are young and no need medical attention yet am i right? The premium for people over 40s is already unaffordable to some who buy late. So i assume insurance agency are always targeting the safe zone customers . At the end of the day, the policy term and condition is their steering wheel .

I believe if insurance have to pay the policy holder early like RM 20K for the claim, i can say the next premium will be increase to recover back from patient and who will be so stupid enough to make losses in the business.

Have you guys ask yourself these question? Who was the one invented Medical Insurance Policy?????? Like i said , if you guys are robot, i can't help you. Watch Sicko. If you guys want to take the blue pill , be my guest.

The guy who legislate this Medical Insurance Policy was Richard Nixon and they wanted to to sell this idea to American so that the govt will be reducing their cost and increase the production of medicine industry for profits. My god!! Can you imagine crook like this guy legislate it and we still buy this idea? He is untrustable president in that time.

I cannot continue further but still if we want to get the right insurance policy for surgical and diagnostic of cancer and other critical illness which rarely occurs than get it early for your child . For adults , we got to think for other alternatives or fight for the govt to provide cheaper treatment in future.

And let me said this last, not all medicine, drugs, machines for treatment, oxygen tank , monitoring machines will be covered in the medical insurance policy. Just like you buy a handphone or Iphone but you still need to get Car Charger, Casing, Video Cable output, Microphone and other Apps.....

Be prepare for such cost.

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Added on May 11, 2010, 8:00 pmForumers and agents out there...
Don't argue with me on this.... this is not a joke or something...if you believe we can fight for better and cheaper cost of medicine , coverage, better treatment and drugs than lets do it and ask more question why this, why that, why why why? You are inside the agency, u know y some people got rejected. u can blame them for not disclosing their problem in the end , if this is the thinking than don't even start this business and claim we are here to HELP!

I hope you and i will not have to pay all our savings to medicine or treatment and enjoy the final day traveling instead.

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Added on May 11, 2010, 8:04 pmToday honestly im telling you agents out there that im diagnose with Sleep Apnea and in your policy stated very clearly that i will have problem with applying for Insurance policy. I dont give a shit anymore , if i cant be help than i wont buy . I will fight for my life on my own. Soon i will do medical check up and i will probably have my application rejected for obese and diabetic.

Can i still buy a policy?

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 11 2010, 08:04 PM

most insurance companies will not cover your for diabetes. obesity they will consider you for life coverage with perhaps loading, but definitely not for medical policies. in regards to sleep apnea, fair to say it will depend on how serious the condition is, exclusions and loading perhaps imposed.

thank u kidzac, i wish i am still in the matrix and not taking the red pill. Virtual world is a wonderful place to live in. I will find it hard at first trying to keep any secret but soon i realize that the game is subconciously work like that. The payout was awesome, the coverage was awesome to the extent that you are like a freeman walking into the hospital and walking out freely as you don't need to pay at all unless Mr Death visit you early and insurance co have no other choice.

I won't blame the instituition for "One Arm In , One Arm Out " if not the company will be losing money.


I did recall this in the movie "Sicko"

Healthcare is not a Privilege , Healthcare is the rights of human being.

Brits believes that every penny was spent to kill German Soldiers in the past be transform to saving lives instead. That's y British get Free Medical and they dont carry medical card at all.

i totally agree with u that healthcare is a right, not a privelege. but end of the day it also means dollar and cents. but here is the thing to ponder, doesnt that include education as well? as well as food? as well as every other nessasaries in today's modern life?

i find it weird that no one has ever complained about the ever increasing cost of education. where as insurance cost has always been the there and abouts the same.

insurance cost okie, not cost of getting medical treatment.

kidzac,

people are realistic with education, they know they pay the college to get the education. whereas insurance is paying for something that is not yet deliver or fulfill. And like i said, if you want to do better in your field, give us the testimonial, give us the data of number of payout to people diagnose with cancer, diabetic? Well , you can blame us for something you haven't proof beyond your professionalism. I never force for such information with all the agency i have counter yet but in reality we have to do it . This is call informed consumer. Only Informed Consumer can make you better and forward.

if you want to sell better and excel in your job , u have to be more proactive and really beat your goals to sell data, info , testimonials and statistics to the buyer.

did insurance company emphasize that certain drugs , sprays, machines , treatement are not included? did u give us this list???? Can we get subsidy???

Insurance coverage is not only about Room and Cost of Surgery..... i don't know about the overseas but i knew Americans are thinking that far till they get the best treatment after they diagnose with the disease or viruses.

Like i said, if you still have not watch Sicko and research it web info, you still belonging to where you are and will never even fight the right and constituition. Im collecting all details and info of interviews, chats, my medical experience and cost to fight for better treatment, better medical benefits and reverse all the orthodox in probably 3-5 years time if i have to do it alone. either u agree with me or not.

And i feel education payout is guaranteed a seat in any university , whereas insurance can still be rejected or deny. I have Lonpac medical card and i know they are probably going to ask alot of question soon and if they can fork out RM 8K for my CPAP machine for my treatment , i will work for insurance company tomoro.

I just heard a statement from an insurance agent "For hospitalization benefit better to get from Life insurance company rather than from General insurance company because they are more expert in this area". when asked to explained, she said:

1. the premium is cheaper because it is not guarantee renewal-this is wrong since there are companies offering medical card with renewal guarantee
2.another point, it is difficult to file a claim, company did very deep investigation before grant a claim. often they asked patient to pay first and claim later. * this part I'm not sure, hope anyone can share their experience

any ING agent from JB? feel free to pm me coz interested in health insurance (medical n critical illness)


p/s : government hospital pay onli RM1, but service

I'm from ING but I'm from KL, not from JB branch.
However, if you have any inquiry can ask me as well. My e-mail address is cheahyang_0@hotmail.com and you can feel free to ask me anything regarding insurance or ING products. I'll reply to your inquiry no matter you're my customer or not.
Hope that you'll find a good servicing agent soon.



Regards,
Gavin Lim

Hi Bro, heard you from ING. Heard ING medical card there is no cap is it true? If yes, can i get a quote for you as follow. Age 30 (This year 31), i'm looking at the following:

1) Annual limit of RM100-120k
2) Lifetime limite of RM400-450k
3) Critical illness of RM80-100k
4) Death of TPD around RM80-100k
5) Do not need those hospital cash back

I have an existing medical card with another insurance co. I wanna get another one as top up. Also got question for you as follow:

1) Medical card guarantee renewable? Until age?
2) Is the insurance and other insurance surcharge fixed as per ING Schedule (means it will not be revise by ING. I understand most insurance co will increase their charges as year goes by and some will not guarantee and even revise it if you claim it before).
3) Any co-charges and co-insurance?
4) Is it investment-link?
5) What is the allocated amount for the first 1-7 yrs (I understand usually first 6 or 7 yrs there is certain % unallacoted)

Kindly email me at calcom21@hotmail.com

Many thanks

Regards
-Calcom21-

Hi Calcom21,
I think the cap that you mean is for kidney dialysis & cancer treatment, is it?
Yes, it is as charged, subject to not exceeding the annual limit and lifetime limit.


ING medical card is guaranteed renewable. Stand alone medical card is up to age 70 whereas medical card rider of ILP is up to age 80.
For stand alone medical card, it is subject to a self-deductible of RM50 whereas for medical card rider of ILP, there's no co-insurance.



Please check your e-mail for more information. Thanks!


Regards,
Gavin Lim

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...9985&sec=nation

I saw this advertisement in the star and i found that this piece of news can be very useful for me to find out the insurance coverage policy that i am still no confidence yet.

Im doing some research and also interviews lately and it will be interesting enough soon that i will post some interesting facts in my new blog on medical care and insurance guidelines.

But let's disect the information provided in this news. The questions i am gonna ask the agents in low yat is going to help us to built more confidence with insurance companies and clearly educated by it.

There are few agents here who are prominent enough already such as Ronnie Chew, Gavin_Lim and even KidZac. I cannot speak for others i do not know yet but you guys may also be part of the discussion group.

Im going to talk about H&S Medical Card only. Let's leave other thing later.

When you read this news,

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...9985&sec=nation

Are you all confident enough that when a patient who get the lung disease will get diagnose , transplant of organ, buy blood or buy organ etc claimable from the insurance agency?
When we read the news, there are specific name for the diseases. So usually, insurance policy may also reject the claim if the name of disease is not as popular as diabetes or cancer.

What worries alot to us is that many of the heatlh problems are unknown and not getting proper name which can be coverd by insurance. There are many specific names which insurance agents would love to look into when someone is making claims.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 22 2010, 11:19 PM

To answer your question if insurance policy will reject the claim if the disease if not popular,or the so called exotic diseases, I suggest you look up the various definations in insurance companies under the clause TERMINAL ILLNESS. For those who are too lazy to do it, pm me for the answers. I dont like making things too easy for ppl.

Secondly, i don't recall the the patients in the papers that u mentioned never complaining about not being able to claim for medical insurance. What was highlighted was there is a lack of donors, and that there is a long waiting list that some ppl even die waiting. Which part of that is the insurance companies' responsibilities? Donate their staff's organ to make the claim possible? force their staff' to sell their organs so that the patients' can make a claim?

what you should be asking for the many ppl out there is:-

1. is my medical insurance adequate
2. is my critical illness coverage sufficient to allow me 3 years of time out from work waiting for a possible donor to come along.

insurance companies have been around for many many years, some as old as 100 years old. i dont think there is a need for us agents to even need to tell u about the credibility of the company.

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Added on May 23, 2010, 9:59 amIm not going to hang around and make defensive statement next. so don't need to attack or whatsover. just reply on the policy , consumer rights and the holistic approach in the insurance claims. im not interested to troll around on the same issue . thank you.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 23 2010, 10:22 AM

generally,
yes the agent is. But also need to depend on the company

Hackwire,

IMHO, the coverage provided for by medical insurance plans would state in writing what is covered and what is excluded. As a general rule, they would usually exclude pre-existing illness and if these illness you have mentioned fall onto that category then the medical plan would not cover it.

I agree with you when you say that there're 1000++ diseases and surely this cannot be listed one by one. The main purpose of medical insurance is to provide medical fund when you're struck with illness whether exotic or not. I know for a fact that medical costs relating to a disease would be covered as set out in the medical policy contract. As this varies from company to company as well as various type of plan, it would be difficult to discuss all terms and conditions.

I also believe it's not only the number of years the company is in business that count but rather how successful the company is in these years. Say X company, a 100 year old company has made profit 80 out of 100 years and another Y company profited 5 out of 5 years. Which one do you think is better to go with?

Cheers,

HH

HH,

Yes you did shed some lights for people who know nuts about buying insurance policy. Coming out and confront the fear is not easy as it takes lots of courage to undo the complexity and simplify it - Edward De Bono.

Been a salesman at the age of 18, i know what we cannot tell to the client as it will jeorpadized most of the closing sales strategy. Most Sales books that talks about Closing a Sales share one thing in common. Principle No 1 - Never over do or Talk more than it's needed.
Y? the more you talk about it, you might as well don't work in the sales line and be a monk in the temple already preaching the truth. That's the reason y most Insurance company website or any multinational website would not want to have a Forum in their website...haha..except for a few companies lah .

the Main Question we should ask is How to avoid buying Insurance that you won't get claim or get the peace of mind?

As for now, i am now getting some picture of how certain people able to claim and some cannot due to the history of the diseases in the family. IF everyone would be honest to tell the insurance company that their family had cancer or heart stroke, i wonder if the insurance company will still accept this application?

It will be great to learn more things about the disease people had while they had insurance coverage. what was the common one that attacks the lifestyle of the person . How many people actually care of all this and how many agents out there driving mercedes benz or BMW actually gives you the record for free. Mostly they will invite you to their office . I would love to see more info disseminate in the blog or website of the insurance company. I didn't survey it yet but will try soon.

This post has been edited by hackwire: May 24 2010, 10:37 AM