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University Useful information for prospective law students, A basic guide to become a lawyer

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z21j
post Oct 30 2009, 11:37 AM

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QUOTE(alsree786 @ Oct 30 2009, 10:52 AM)
well firstly, mr xxx would need to complete pupillage before he becomes a "lawyer". Imho, little justification to take CLP without going thru the next step and getting admitted. During pupillage, he'll probably have to take a massive pay cut for the duration of pupillage since this must be completed full time whilst having no other employment (unless with the Bar's consent) tho this can be easily circumvented.

It would be a good advantage, tho I dun really get your question of "in term of money perspective"? Well if you mean would he make alot of money, that boils down to how good he is, how good his business skills are and how good his networks are. To start off your own firm, you will need the three criteria mentioned above to succeed (dosh aside).

But generally I would say having an Accounting and Law combination works out well if you know what your focus is on. Your work must require knowledge and skill that you will have obtained from doing the said courses. No point doing accounting and law and then specializing in say financial accounting or Criminal Law/Land Law/Constitutional Law. Will help if you're in Audit and Compliance or Company law/Taxation Law etc. But juggling two separate professions may be hard if one intends to become a practicing accountant and lawyer per se. As i said engage in work that harnesses skills and knowledge that can be acquired from both courses. 

If passing LLB and CLP in 4 yrs is deemed lucky, well....then good luck to all current students incl myself.  biggrin.gif
*Will add on to this when time permits
*
alright thank q. This is a real case. but the fact was this mr xxx obtained a MBA after getting Bachelor of Accounting. Then after few yrs working in accounting field, he study law... til now clp holder... i wonder how it can make sense. I think if mr xxx capable then he may have 2 qualifications? In my view, maybe no1 will be clearer than him about company, contract, tax law in a big firm that deal with both accounting & law
edennature
post Oct 30 2009, 03:07 PM

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Bar professional training course accepts students from overseas law degree?UOL student needs to come to London for graduation ceremony,i am asking for someone.
minshuen
post Oct 31 2009, 10:20 PM

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how long will the bar vocational course last?
edennature
post Oct 31 2009, 10:26 PM

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BPTC would replace BVC next year,would be difficult to enter so i now also aim to become Barrister in northern ireland or become solicitor in northern ireland or scotland since i want to practice in sarawak


Added on October 31, 2009, 11:10 pmany lawyer in malaysia takes Bar Transfer Test in uk?may i know the details about bar transfer test for overseas lawyer

This post has been edited by edennature: Oct 31 2009, 11:10 PM
toux
post Nov 6 2009, 02:07 AM

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QUOTE(edennature @ Oct 31 2009, 10:26 PM)
BPTC would replace BVC next year,would be difficult to enter so i now also aim to become Barrister in northern ireland or become solicitor in northern ireland or scotland since i want to practice in sarawak


Added on October 31, 2009, 11:10 pmany lawyer in malaysia takes Bar Transfer Test in uk?may i know the details about bar transfer test for overseas lawyer
*
standards for entering the bvc already so high...what more the bptc? So sad for transfer students, especially those who aspire to be barristers sad.gif
khiahsu
post Nov 6 2009, 11:17 AM

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hmm.
out of curiosity,is anyone aspiring for the solicitor route in the UK?
edennature
post Nov 7 2009, 08:19 PM

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i also think of that route but training contract is difficult to get as a foreigner.


Added on November 10, 2009, 11:05 ama level's ELS and tort law is same as in LLB year1?do we study the same or the basic one in a level?

This post has been edited by edennature: Nov 10 2009, 11:05 AM
fuchunkuzhi
post Nov 11 2009, 11:33 AM

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schizophrenic , i 've read all the threads that u had post and found out that u are an intelligent person. im facing problems in my option and my future, i truely wish that u can give me some advice.

I finished my LLB from UOL at ATC, and i got only a 3rd class honor, i know now its impossible for me to get into clp. btw, im from sarawak.

1. i heard if wan to be a lawyer in sarawak , we dont actually need a CLP, as long as we get admitted to practice in any commonwealth country it is enough. is it?

2. if the above question is yes, i know that if i switch to australia i would need to take some few subjects which is decided by the bar council there and the problem is do our legal system accept student i mean graduate from uol then switch to australia then come back to sarawak to practice? coz it seems like a bit cacat achievements like that.

3. I would also want to know about the qualification to be a judge in sarawak? Do i need Clp to be a judge? or is there any post like a judge which does not need a clp so that i can enter into it and get few years experience then i can have higher possibility of getting back to CLP again?If yes, who and how can i apply for it?

4. Please let me know about the qualification to become commissioner of oath, and is it a good paid job?

5. Do u have any knowledge about the police structure? i heard some of my uncle said that i can enter into police and straight become an inspector and with my law degree i have more chances to get a higher post in the future. I also heard that they need a lecturer in police department to teach police laws? and if i wan to take that post, is it means that i need to become a police 1st?

6. if i become a police, can i apply to enter into some sort of legal department? or is there any possibility the government will allow to me take CLP that time?

7. If all the above choices that i consider above is not reasonable, for a student only with 3rd class honor in LLB UOL, what is your suggestion to do in my career. i would like to have some job which enable me to upgrade my post in the future and not paralegal or clerk which will be doing the same work for the whole life.

I wish my question will get your attention and its open to everyone who can give me valuable opinion, thank you
edennature
post Nov 11 2009, 01:32 PM

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4. Qualifications for admission of advocate in Sarawak and Sabah


(a) he is a member of the Bar of England, Scotland, Northern Ireland or the Republic of Ireland;

(b) he is a solicitor or attorney of a Superior Court in a British Possession to which the Colonial Solicitors Act 1900, has been applied by Order in Council and who by virtue of the said Act and of any Order in Council thereunder may be admitted as a Solicitor of the Supreme Court in England, Scotland, Northern Ireland or the Republic of Ireland without examination and without service of articles of clerkship;



© he is a solicitor of the Supreme Court in England, Northern Ireland or the Republic of Ireland or he is a Writer to the Signet, Solicitor to the Supreme Court or a Solicitor in Scotland;




(d) he has been admitted to practise as a legal practitioner (by whatever name called) by a Supreme Court or High Court exercising jurisdiction in any place within any territory within the Commonwealth

yes.your choice may not only australia and nz but also northern ireland,scotland and ireland.If you wish to go to australia you need to take 'Priestly 11'.
Priestley 11 subjects

* Criminal law
* Torts
* Contracts
* Property - (including the Torrens System for land)
* Equity (including trusts)
* Administrative law
* Constitutional law (State and Commonwealth)
* Civil procedure
* Evidence
* Corporations or company law
* Legal ethics and professional conduct
Places offering Priestley 11

Currently, the Priestley 11 are offered by the following law schools -

In the Australian Capital Territory (Canberra):

* Australian National University College of Law
* University of Canberra Faculty of Law

In Tasmania:

* University of Tasmania

In New South Wales:

* University of Technology, Sydney

In Victoria:

* Monash University
* Deakin University
* La Trobe University
* Victoria University, Australia
* The University of Melbourne
* RMIT University

In Queensland:

* James Cook University

In South Australia:

* Flinders University of South Australia
Then,you may proceed to 6 months professional legal training course at college of law australia or other universities which offer the same course.After you complete the course,you may admit to the Supreme court of any state as Barrister and solicitor.Lastly,you can come back for pupilage straight away.
fuchunkuzhi
post Nov 11 2009, 07:26 PM

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thanks for your reply edennature , i appreciate it so much, but if i want to go to Queensland University of Technology, do they have priestley 11 subjects? cause i did consult with the Uni and they told me to send over my cert and they will help me to get it assessed by the bar council over there to decide what subjects i still need to take. But the problem is, it costs about 500ausd...-.- do you know what subjects will they offer me? i know its hard for you to tell me exactly but just assumption is enough for me.
mimiko1997
post Nov 11 2009, 09:26 PM

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hai everyone..i m new here. i m planning to go for uol LLB at atc next year.. izzit recommended? btw,for uol LLB, which college's better? atc? brickfield? kdu? thx for help
alsree786
post Nov 12 2009, 02:52 PM

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@ edennature

How does one become a member of the respective Bars of Scotland, N.I and Ireland?

From my 5 minutes of googling, for Scotland, i came across:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solicitor#Scotland

http://targetjobs.co.uk/career-sectors/law...ate-in-scotland

http://www.advocates.org.uk/downloads/beco...ochure_2009.pdf

All of the above links highlight that for one to become an advocate or solicitor, he/she needs a llb in Scots law. If so, then that option, i can safely presume, for most of us is out of the question. Please clarify since you have been researching this route for yourself as well. Have i missed something?

@ fuchunkuzhi

For OZ, what subjects u will need to take to satisfy the Priestly 11 requirements, depends on what subjects you took during your LLB. For a student who has taken the following subjects for UOL LLB: Criminal, Contract, CLRI, Public, Land, Tort, Trust, Commercial, IP, Juris, Succession, Company, based on an assessment in Griffith Uni, Queensland, he/she will have to pursue the following courses:

Constitutional Law;
Equity;
Introduction to Public Law;
Law of Associations;
Property Law 1;
Property Law 2;
Civil Procedure;
Evidence;
Criminal Procedure;
Administrative Law; and
Legal Professional Practice

Use this as a guide. And according to edennature's post about the Unis that offer the Priestly 11, I doubt it's a conclusive list. Just check with QUT whether they offer the Preistly 11.







edennature
post Nov 12 2009, 06:50 PM

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To admit to the Bar of Northern Ireland,a person needs to gain an approved law degree.Below is the link for LLB which is approved by the bar.

http://www.qub.ac.uk/schools/InstituteofPr...d,141842,en.pdf


You're right as scot's law llb is recognized only by faculty of advocates.

Furthermore,a level's ELS and tort law is same as in LLB year1?do we study the same or the basic one in a level?Thanks


Added on November 22, 2009, 8:01 pmold law books can still be used? this is because they are keep updating right?if so we need to order the same book every year from the publisher?

This post has been edited by edennature: Nov 22 2009, 08:02 PM
teh tarik kurang manis
post Nov 26 2009, 07:10 PM

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I will be getting my LLB(hons) from victoria university in New Zealand soon. I want to work in Malaysia, but I dread having to go through CLP and 9 months pupillage. It takes only 3 months to do the professional legal training course in NZ, after which I can get admitted as barrister and solicitor in NZ. My question is, can I find decent legal work in Malaysia if I get admitted to the NZ bar without having to go through CLP and pupillage? I know that for Sabah and Sarawak, CLP isn't required, but I grew up in West Msia and have never set foot in East Msia before. What're the chances that they'll allow me to practice there? Thanks!
fuchunkuzhi
post Nov 27 2009, 07:36 PM

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besides of australia, i wish to switch to New zealand as well as i know that the money rate is not as higher as aus. but anyone can pls tell me which uni in newzealand is recognised? so that i can move on to my research. thanks.. i need it quite in a rush. thanks for anyone who can kindly list me down the newzealand uni which can be recognised here in sabah and sarawak.
wornbook
post Nov 28 2009, 08:58 AM

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QUOTE(teh tarik kurang manis @ Nov 26 2009, 07:10 PM)
I will be getting my LLB(hons) from victoria university in New Zealand soon. I want to work in Malaysia, but I dread having to go through CLP and 9 months pupillage. It takes only 3 months to do the professional legal training course in NZ, after which I can get admitted as barrister and solicitor in NZ. My question is, can I find decent legal work in Malaysia if I get admitted to the NZ bar without having to go through CLP and pupillage? I know that for Sabah and Sarawak, CLP isn't required, but I grew up in West Msia and have never set foot in East Msia before. What're the chances that they'll allow me to practice there? Thanks!
*
Very low. I believe you need to be a citizen or PR of Sabah or Sarawak to practice there.
Imagine the number of West Malaysians who would be flooding the East otherwise, all trying to avoid CLP.

The NZ profs are not recognised in West Malaysia. You'll be on equal footing with any graduate who has no CLP. On a side note, NZ must have one of the world's easiest professional legal course. rclxms.gif


Added on November 28, 2009, 9:02 am
QUOTE(fuchunkuzhi @ Nov 27 2009, 07:36 PM)
besides of australia, i wish to switch to New zealand as well as i know that the money rate is not as higher as aus. but anyone can pls tell me which uni in newzealand is recognised? so that i can move on to my research. thanks.. i need it quite in a rush. thanks for anyone who can kindly list me down the newzealand uni which can be recognised here in sabah and sarawak.
*
Google?

Though it's worth considering this: - Singapore only recognises Uni of Auckland and Victoria Uni of Wellington's LLBs. So if you think you might want to work in Singapore in the future...

This post has been edited by wornbook: Nov 28 2009, 09:02 AM
teh tarik kurang manis
post Nov 28 2009, 07:11 PM

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QUOTE(wornbook @ Nov 28 2009, 08:58 AM)
Very low. I believe you need to be a citizen or PR of Sabah or Sarawak to practice there.
Imagine the number of West Malaysians who would be flooding the East otherwise, all trying to avoid CLP.

The NZ profs are not recognised in West Malaysia. You'll be on equal footing with any graduate who has no CLP. On a side note, NZ must have one of the world's easiest professional legal course.  rclxms.gif


Added on November 28, 2009, 9:02 am
Google?

Though it's worth considering this: - Singapore only recognises Uni of Auckland and Victoria Uni of Wellington's LLBs. So if you think you might want to work in Singapore in the future...
*
Thanks wornbook. I know of someone who did her profs in NZ and went back to Singapore to work as an associate lawyer or sth. She's doing pretty well even though she didn't go thru the Singapore legal training and hence isn't qualified as a lawyer in Singapore. She's a singaporean citizen though. Guess I was hoping that there'd be stuff like that to do in Malaysia too. I would consider working in Singapore, but I'm not a Singaporean PR nor citizen. Anyone have any idea if they welcome Malaysians in the legal profession over there?
wornbook
post Nov 29 2009, 08:47 AM

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QUOTE(teh tarik kurang manis @ Nov 28 2009, 07:11 PM)
Thanks wornbook. I know of someone who did her profs in NZ and went back to Singapore to work as an associate lawyer or sth. She's doing pretty well even though she didn't go thru the Singapore legal training and hence isn't qualified as a lawyer in Singapore. She's a singaporean citizen though. Guess I was hoping that there'd be stuff like that to do in Malaysia too. I would consider working in Singapore, but I'm not a Singaporean PR nor citizen. Anyone have any idea if they welcome Malaysians in the legal profession over there?
*
I know someone who did the same - just went back this year. I hear she's planning to qualify for the Singapore Bar as well though. Doesn't hurt to have more options.

I'm not sure how it'll work for Malaysians in Singapore. But from how easy it is from Malaysians to find jobs/get PR there, I don't think it'll be impossible.
Anyway, I guess you could always work as a legal associate in Malaysia. Or an in-house counsel.

What about trying NZ? The market is tough, but it could be worth a shot.

This post has been edited by wornbook: Nov 29 2009, 08:48 AM
andi_1983
post Dec 2 2009, 08:02 PM

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hi schizophrenic

very nice job. really helpful


Added on December 2, 2009, 8:10 pmfrom what i have read, since i am a PR of Sabah, surely i can practice in Sabah without taking the CLP

if i were to practice in West Msia, i know that CLP is a must.

I have heard that if a lawyer is practising in East Msia, he is unable to practice in West Msia, is this true?

anyone can enlighten me on this matter?

thanks


This post has been edited by andi_1983: Dec 2 2009, 08:10 PM
wongjy
post Dec 5 2009, 06:04 PM

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Planning to take econs, accounts, law, and english lit for A levels.
Considering subbing accounts for business.
Heard that Law @ A levels is a "soft" subject. Is it still worth taking? :/
I do want to study about it in A levels, but if it proves disadvantageous then..


Wanted to take history for A levels as well but I can't find any colleges offering it as a subject.

Looking to study law in UK after the 1.5 years.

Are my chosen subjects a good combination?
I know english lit and econs are staple subjects.
I'm not too sure about the rest.

This post has been edited by wongjy: Dec 5 2009, 06:37 PM

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