i must say managers should be credited based on his success..well, unlike football players, who have their missions or tasks on the field varied depending on their positions, managers meanwhile have only a single task..to WIN!!
if a manager didnt win enough honours, then he should be counted out..as that may suggest that throughout a single season, he might have done bad tactical decisions or bad transfer decisions etc..
some may say certain managers doesnt have the luxuries of big money generated by some oil derricks or whatever..err b4 u say this, please check how much villareal have spent each summer in recent years, and they got 2nd place in la liga, continuously in top 10 placings since 2003/2004 season and even reached the UCL semis several years back..
their signing of the season all was signed through free transfer..and do you know how small is villareal c.f??fyi, villareal is a port city where its whole population won't fill up old trafford(wikipedia: 49,045 (2007))..and their stadium is just a 23000 capacity stadium..for me Manuel Pellegrini have done really well here, his achievements is admirable considering the size of his club

guys, managers are appointed to bring continuous glories to their club and country, and whoever have done exactly that, then he should be considered..for me, this award should go to only this 2 persons Sir Alex ferguson(manhester united) and Marcelo Lippi(juventus and italy)

i am barca's fan, and i hate the way SAF play his team against us in UCL semis, especially in the 1st leg, really , but i must say his achievements are simply incredible..i wont make my judgements based on my interest on my club..and i think all LYN voters should do so too..

i bolded that name bcoz if arsene wenger have his name in our shorlist, that guy with that bolded name should also be on our list

This post has been edited by matyrze: Jun 12 2008, 01:27 PM

manuel pellegrini and mauricio pellegrino is almost identical.
manuel pellegrini is the one who win the title with river plate. is it?

yes, u are right

best /bɛst/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[best] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective, superl. of good with better as compar. 1. of the highest quality, excellence, or standing: the best work; the best students.

What it mean is that given a group of managers such as the list, which one is of the highest quality, excellence, or standing.

Which means there are such thing as THE BEST MANAGER.

Thanks. And yeah, I hate our approach against Barca in UCL's semifinal. I'm with your and DukeRed's sentiments.

i'd prefer mu to be more advanterous too. ultra defensive style isn't mu usual style.
then again, sometimes manager need to come out with something different against an equally good team.
as mourinho describe it ' parking the team bus infront of goal'

I guess we each have our problems. If our owners decide to high tail it back to Yankland, we need someone willing to clear our debts.



Ferguson's team also plays entertaining football, much like Liverpool did in the 70's/80's. Ultimately fans would want their teams to pummel their opposition into submission with exquisite football, but that isn't always the case. Chelsea don't play the most attractive football but they did enough to squeeze through a number of encounters one nil on their way to the Premiership. I do not think that playing beautiful football and winning trophies are mutually exclusive but I do think the latter is most important. The game has gotten more technical and I do think this has sometimes resulted in football matches being as interesting to watch as a game of chess.

I get what you mean when you say "entertaining" team but what is your definition of "historic" in this context?



Given the two options you have presented me with, I'm leaning towards the latter. Although each manager will have his preference in terms of style of play, I do think they know better than to change a winning formula. Liverpool played practically the same football under Shankly, Paisley, Fagan and Dalglish and I think it's safe to assume then that they built on the foundations laid down by the Shanks. The Bootroom, the all-red kits, the "This Is Anfield" sign are just some of the traditions that was started by the Shanks. The bond between the players and coaching staff stemming from when Shankly famously proclaimed that Liverpool is the people's club and that fans matters most. The day when Shankly bought a ticket and stood at the Kop as a fan after his retirement. When asked he said it was where he felt he belonged, with the fans, the people. These attribute to the foundations of the club, and it's blue collared background. These are some examples of what I refer to as "foundations" as some of it is still practiced.



Thanks for the enlightenment.

Fairplay. This may lead to an era of dominance soon, who knows?

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Added on June 12, 2008, 5:27 pmI brought up the same question in the "Best Buy" thread. It appeared that the general concensus was "$ to goal ratio". What about intangible values, or contributions that aren't recorded? What if a player had completely changed the shape of a team which led to them winning more games? He doesn't have to score goals for them to win. His teammates play better with him. How do you rate players like these without seeing them play every week?

It's subjective which is why I always encourage posters to articulate their reasons. As you can see I am having a conversation with FOLLOW N and he is able to reason why he thinks Wenger is the better manager, although he doesn't have that many manager. I may or may not agree with his points, but they are still valid points. It then comes down which points are most valid, those in favour of Ferguson, or those in favour of Wenger. It's when you see posts like "Ferguson, end off", that fail to convince other posters.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Jun 12 2008, 05:27 PM

mourinho instilled a winning mentality into the players in his first season.overcoming that psychological barrier was an achievement in itself.he made the players believe they're good enough to win trophies.lots of em.' that's why in a lot of chelsea fans' hearts he's already a legend.for liverpool and manutd fans who have tasted countless successes before,this might be a difficult fact to understand as they've never been in the same position.i'm just glad there are some here who recognise jose's amazing talent for managing a group of players.

I hear that mate and I've no doubt over his managerial abilities. His players respect him and he protects his players. It's just when you mentioned...

"he made the players believe they're good enough to win trophies."

... they weren't exactly a bunch of mugs to begin with and they went really close under Ranieri Maybe he didn't attain much success but under Ranieri, Chelsea got more points than they did in the previous season, in each of his 4 seasons at the helm. Who knows? He may have finally got it right if he had another season.

John Terry, Petr Cech, Arjen Robben, William Gallas, Eidur Gudjohnsen, Claude Makalele, Frank Lampard... that is a talented bunch.

yup they were no slouches allright.pity ranieri didn't get to utilise robben at all as he suffered a horrifying tackle from olivier dacourt during pre-season.it ruled him out for all 38 games
well the thing is under ranieri the team lacked some steely determination and defensive discipline in their style of play which culminated in our champions league semi-final exit to monaco where we gave away a 2 goal lead to draw 2-2 at home.mourinho instilled that in the team but given more time,it is quite possible ranieri would've nailed it eventually.there was a slight uproar when he was dismissed but the swift manner in which jose got the fans to forget about him is commendable.i'm still greatful to ranieri for being one of the key people in laying the foundation for chelsea though

This thread starter is a true noob in football. He maybe don't know Bill Shankly, Brian Clough, Kenny Dalglish, Johann Cruyff, Franz "Libero" Beckenbauer and other notable name.

I ask to compare CL cup..and u r telling me cl cup differ every year? OMG!!!!

Thats what I mentioned earlier din I?
mANU 1999 is called STEADY and ours is called lucky..
Thats typical self defence by some arrogant fans...


so, u r telling me u r taking N95 to compare with the Tai Ko Tai phone?

you guys got owner that willing to spend...RICH owner
and we got kiam siap owner...
how much u guys spend and how much we spend?
and this is not mere excuse...



To compare,thats is HOPE from fans rather than arrogant.and please if such post is called BANTERS or jokes, i wonder what happen to sportsmanship nowadays..and hell yeah, u r telling me those idiots jumping over fences to post " glory2 mu" is banters as well?

and for the 2 points, i did say...won is won...but luck do help, din i say that earlier?

Thx I knew that since ages ago

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Added on June 13, 2008, 12:57 amThats mere example that I wish to highlight NUMBER OF TROPHIES not the main factors of deciding whos the best manager around.
Can those manage U12 and U18 included in the best manager list if they won them over 30times?
thats what i m trying to highlight

QUALITY OF THE LEAGUE SHOULD DECIDES

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 13 2008, 01:02 AM

How the hell does "United fans can now see the real UCL trophy at Anfield" is a hope? How does "UCL FINAL, Moscow : Liverpool vs ?" is another one? Funny, as I remember, no one mentioned that 1999 is a steady team. Even SAF said "Football, bloody hell". Where's the statement of steady or even arrogant in it?

And you were criticizing regarding our 2 points advantage over Chelsea in last season's BPL. You did said "What can be so proud of that?" Clearly, you don't even know what banters are and simply saying that United fans are arrogant. How's UCL Moscow Final statements is not arrogant? Surprising. Hell, I bet you wouldn't even mentioned regarding the 2 points advantage if Liverpool is on top. You'll probably say something like "Win is still a win. I can be proud of that."

It's pretty simple, if you can't take some, so don't give some. And, I can really sense you hatred towards United. Well, what to be expected?

To be fair he did say, "Best manager of our time". Even I wasn't around when Shankly was manager.

To be honest I love this statement. At least we're still around after these 18 years. It may hurt falling behind our rivals but I do take pride in the fact that our loyalties have not wavered. If anything my support has grown stronger over the years and I'm sure some posters here feel the same. Weird how our lack of success has attributed to this. I can't begin to explain it. It's easy to say things like, "Once a red, always a red..." but some of us have proved it. I've said this before, I'm not only a fan of Liverpool, I'm a fan of Liverpool fans. It may sound corny but it's the truth. Maybe it's the fact that we're a defiant lot that has attributed to this.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Jun 13 2008, 11:10 AM

of coz la saf...see the fact..hard to beat his managing style lo..i hate manager setan merah (red devil)..

Im with you Duke Red. Personally I dont like to see flaming between the fans of any clubs, why cant we have a healthy discussion ?

Regarding your statement "I'm not only a fan of Liverpool, I'm a fan of Liverpool fans",

IF, if particular Liverpool fans doing wrongs e.g flamebaiting, couldnt get into healthy discussion without insulting,dissing or belittling the other club, will you still support him/them ? Ok, support might not be the best word here, as even if man utd fans doing wrongs, somehow I will support them too but will advice them not to do so. I hate other clubs fans insulting my favorite team so I do expect the same thing from them too.

Firstly, there will always be bad hats in any group and I can only refer to the general bunch. Liverpool fans did themselves no favours at Heysel but this was at the height of the era of "hooliganism". Since then however, we have cleaned up our act and let's face it, there will always be a problem with discipline when passions are running high. We do thing without thinking sometimes and we as humans are all fallible, what more when we are drunk on emotion?

When I say I am a fan of Liverpool fans, I refer to those I see on tv, and those who post on international forums. I refer to those who save every hard earned pound from their blue collared jobs to follow the team around the world. I would have killed to be amongst those at Istanbul, especially during half-time (my mate was lucky enough to be there the **** ). 3-0 down and "YNWA" rang out around the stadium as our fans let our boys know that they were still with them. I even like the Liverpool people because when I was there and having a few pints at the Albert, I found them to be a friendly bunch and made friends with the barkeep and a few of his mates that were at the bar. One particular gentleman called Charlie stood out and even he was amazed that someone like me would travel all the way to watch a football match. They have never had a good impression of OOT's (Out Of Towners) mind you but when you get to talking and they see you know your stuff, there is nothing but genuine respect.

Since hooliganism has been eradicated, Liverpool fans have made a lot of friends over the years. After the game at Anfield against Barcelona in 2007, both sets of fans exchanged scarves and sang "YNWA" in unison. After we had beaten Bayer Leverkusen in 2005 at the Bay Arena, the German's played "YNWA" over the loud speaker as both sets of fans again came together as one. When we visited Olympiakos in 2007, Liverpool fans paid tribute to the 21 Greek lives lost in their own tragedy (http://www.redandwhitekop.com/article.php?id=3850989). Against AC Milan in Athens, we (yes, even those of us watching here did) stayed back to applaud AC Milan as they went up to claim the trophy.

I can go on and on mate but I've digressed for too long I feel. There are always negatives and positives to each situation. It's up to you to choose which to focus on. For me, the positives far outweigh the negatives.

to be honest, back then, i'd like to see the kopites managed by the dubai consortium; even if it's purely on businees purposes.
at least they could do much better than the two wankeryankees presently in charge.
their personal claims is ridiculous. and they're not doing much for the club either.
at any rate, keep rafa. this guy know how to win in europe.

even though i'd been supporting mu for the past 19 years, for some reason, i still prefer the kind of football we used to play
back in 90s. with ince, kanchelskis and later, cantona and co. nowadays, the style seem to be too predictable and at times, bored.
arsenal was a good example of exciting style with their free flowing attack. thanks to wenger. too bad their players can't put it together when it matter most. wenger need to instill a self-belief to his players. just like what mourinho did with chelsea.
grant was lucky to inherit an 'almost complete squad'. failure to win in 3 fronts only shows grant inability to maintain the momentum.

just wonder if will ever see those kind of football play by pele, de stefano, puskas, muller, cryuff and co.
youtube video is too blur...but then, it's free

This post has been edited by yngwie: Jun 13 2008, 12:45 PM

u noe wat....is better to be emotionally retarded than to be a supporter that idiots that follow trends jump on bandwagon just because the team is winning...
and it is even better to see that a team that had not been winning can still fans supporting them like hell...something we cant see in a manure mANU team.

now now...this is a joke as well? boxsystem...maybe u should noe wats arrogant and wats joke before u posts...

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Added on June 14, 2008, 12:16 pmI hate people label liv fans as "emotional retarded" and i believe u wont want us to label ur team as freaking arrogant retards hence, i do hope u will spend some time advise the retarded madrealjr...
just because he is mad doesnt mean he can be disrespectful to others...it might start another flame war and ur beloved ts aka moderator alien2003 might need to do OT to delete posts,ban and bla bla bla again eh?

we'd love to see him apologize here ...


p.s: i can use the word on him as well i think?with slash on the word itself after that...


To mods: the words i use above got NO INTENTION to insult/troll...just an EXAMPLE..but then if u want to ban, just ban

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 14 2008, 12:26 PM

so when this thread has wavered away from the subject?