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 Best manager of our time?, Best manager

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Jason_T
post Jun 8 2008, 12:35 PM

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Where is Steve McClaren?
I vote for him!
he is famous man...he makes new record for england...I vote for him!
Jason_T
post Jun 8 2008, 12:39 PM

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QUOTE(SeaMonster @ Jun 8 2008, 12:37 PM)
Lol....

New Record?Made England Team Be Watcher For This Euro Cup?
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laugh.gif hehe...he is the best ^^
@TS: Add Steve Mcclown pls notworthy.gif
Jason_T
post Jun 9 2008, 03:00 PM

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In terms of signing, hughes and harry should tops~
Jason_T
post Jun 10 2008, 01:27 PM

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I did say Roy Keane is another good manager.He saves sunderland and promoted them to BPL...
smile.gif
Jason_T
post Jun 10 2008, 01:38 PM

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QUOTE(Duke Red @ Jun 10 2008, 01:36 PM)
Steve Coppell did the same with Reading. Keep in mind that Keane did bring in a lot of players which was helped by the Nial Quinn led Irish Consortium. Let's see how they do in their second season.
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coppell did well too..but after sidwell leaves them, the whole team loses confident...hope they do well in championship. sad.gif
Jason_T
post Jun 10 2008, 10:02 PM

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Seriously, I dun think the best manager should SOLELY depends on the numbers of the trophy won.... smile.gif
Others factors should come in consideration when we choose the best manager.
The number of trophies cant prove anything.Different era different level of gameplay.
I did like to mention years years ago, there is not much talented players that good in silang2 kaki like ronaldo.
Now, we have whole bunch of thems.The game standards varies by years.Hence, there is no such thing as BEST MANAGER cos HE WON THE MOST TROPHIES
smile.gif
and there is no way you can compare a club achievement with an international squad achievement.
World Cup undoubtedly is way way more difficult than BPL..
and dun tell me you going to compare Scottish league with BPL...no offence..but not the same standard..

hence, no point of arguing who is the best manager when the conditions isnt that fair to any other manager.
smile.gif
I did say the 1st Malaysian manager that able to bring Malaysia to world cup to be the best manager tongue.gif

Can I? drool.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 10 2008, 10:07 PM
Jason_T
post Jun 10 2008, 10:37 PM

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Just wanna highlight...different league different standard...Eg, if I won Scottish league 30times, u rate me higher than SAF?
Jason_T
post Jun 12 2008, 09:06 AM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 11 2008, 05:44 PM)
in case if u dun know, that is called stepover cool2.gif
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i prefer to say it that way... laugh.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:12 am
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 11 2008, 01:24 PM)
i doubt it. spl had been dominated by 2 club far too long. walter smith won a combined honour of 15 with rangers, yet he
'phailed' with everton. while moyes had been doing pretty well.
martin o'neill won about 6 combined titles with celtic and he is doing great at villa at the moment. best bet!
ferguson won titles with st mirren, aberdeen and manchester united. staying for 20 years without being sacked is already a commendable achievements.
traps won titles with juventus, inter, bayern munich and a few other clubs.
so does lippi and a few others.
maintaining the success rate in the long run with different set of players is fundamental.
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I do agree that maintaining different sets of playes is fundamental.
But still, the standard of BPL and SPL is totally different.
The likes of celtic and rangers can be champion in SPL, can they do it at BPL?
The same heres.
Take an ori kit compared with thailand handmade ciplak kit...there must be certain difference between those 2.
Winning titles in aberdeen in 80's doesnt mean you can win the title again with aberdeen now.
The football nowadays is totally different from what football is in the past.
The standard of football varies by league.
It is the truth.
Hence, the best manager shouldnt just solely depends on the numbers of trophy..
Many things have to come to consideration.
and to me, there is no such thing as THE BEST MANAGER.
Everyone loses at least 1...BEST MANAGER should never lose whistling.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:19 am
QUOTE(ellimist @ Jun 10 2008, 05:00 PM)
Refering to him keeping his job in a top 4 club despite the lack of trophies?
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Trophies doesnt mean anything...
especially those winning with small gap...there isnt anything actually to proud of at all...
Luck do play some part.....if u ask me laugh.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:27 am
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 10 2008, 05:44 PM)
wenger's squad doesn't cost a bomb, he assemble a squad made up of talented but underperforming youngsters.
he does have a good eye for a gem. buying on cheap and selling on high price but he could learn a thing from aulas.
flamini; one of arsenal's most improved player off to milan for free.

one thing we does remember about wenger is that he fielded an entire team made of foreign nationality in bpl. beautiful football doesn't always show results. effective play is more synonymous with modern game.

btw,  arsenal's trophy collection under him isn't something to shout about either.
3 bpl title and 4 fa in 10 years is comparable with mourinho's 2 bpl title and another 2 league cup + 1 fa in his short stint at chelsea; albeit, on the highly expensive assembled squad. ranieri never win any....
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if u take mourinho's porto, then is comparable...but chelsea?
doh.gif
how much they spent in the past and how much arsenal spent?
for the past few years, i can only see them selling their star and buying 2-3 players which cant even compared to 1 31m shev..
and you said the achievement is comparable?
doh.gif
speechless


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:33 am
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 9 2008, 04:54 PM)
marcelo lippi won titles with juventus and italian national team while alex ferguson done it with st mirren, aberdeen and manchester united.
but winning a title with national team of course is a bonus. then again, italy does won the wc thrice before and their team always rise to the ocassion.

lets see...... lippi collected around 14 title including the wc
and ferguson easily had more than 30!  brows.gif
here you go...

St.Mirren 1974–1978
Domestic competition ;
Scottish First Division:
Winner: 1976–77

Aberdeen 1978–1986
Domestic competition ;
Scottish Premier Division:
Winner: 1979–80, 1983–84, 1984–85
Scottish Cup:
Winner: 1981–82, 1982–83, 1983–84, 1985–86
Scottish League Cup:
Winner: 1985–86
Runner-up: 1978–79, 1979–80
European competition

UEFA Cup Winners' Cup
Winner: 1982–83
UEFA Super Cup:
Winner: 1983

Manchester United 1986–
Domestic competition;

Premier League:
Winner: 1992–93, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2000–01, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08
Runner-up: 1994–95, 1997–98, 2005–06
Football League First Division:
Runner-up: 1987–88, 1991–92
FA Cup:
Winner: 1989–90, 1993–94, 1995–96, 1998–99, 2003–04
Runner-up: 1994–95, 2004–05, 2006–07
League Cup:
Winner: 1991–92, 2005–06
Runner-up: 1990–91, 1993–94, 2002–03
FA Charity/Community Shield:
Winner: 1990 (shared), 1993, 1994, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2007
Runner-up: 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2004
European competition

UEFA Champions League:
Winner: 1998–99, 2007–08
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup:
Winner: 1990–91
UEFA Super Cup:
Winner: 1991
Runner-up: 1999
International competition

Intercontinental Cup:
Winner: 1999
Individual Awards

FA Premier League Manager of the Year:
1993–94, 1995–96, 1996–97, 1998–99, 1999–2000, 2002–03, 2006–07, 2007–08

giovanni trapatonni a close 2nd. he won over 20 titles with a few different clubs including bayern munich,inter, juventus and benfica. still shorts of ferguson's achievements.
lippi comes in 3rd.

wikipedia is indeed a great source. it help us refresh our memory. you do the math, dude  icon_rolleyes.gif
btw, i was a mu fan since i was a kid back in the end of 89. what a coincidence!  smile.gif
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As you mentioned before, maintaining the success rate in the long run with different set of players is fundamental.Hence, it proves that lippi done a great job, isnt it?]
and reading your post, indirectly, you are telling us the numbers of trophies should be the priority of judging the best manager instead of the quality of the cup?
oh my, then pls hail anyone who win more cups than SAF even if it is u18 team or u12 team...
doh.gif doh.gif doh.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:37 am
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 9 2008, 05:42 PM)
ferguson does won the uefa cup winners cup and super cup with aberdeen back then. he results with 'em is more consistent compared to his manchester united's ratio.
agree with you about the contenders. arsene wenger and jose mourinho isn't up there with ferguson, trapps and lippi.
jose mourinho won the euro cl cup with porto but he 'phailed' when he have everything at his disposal with chelase. wenger was a near man back in 05.
btw, success are measure from the number of titles won, is it?  hmm.gif
even though i am a mu fan, am surely not being biased when it comes to judgement. history speak for itself.
unlike italy and germany or it's neighbour; england, scotland isn't really had a good history in international football. but the rest of us sure wanted to see ferguson managing the england team, aren't we?

franz beckenbauer and carlos alberto perreira was another example of very capable coach.
btw, if grant was to win the bpl's title, cl and carling cup, prolly' his name will be be on the list too  brows.gif
scolari won the wc with brazil but whether he can do it with portugal with quite a resources on tap, remain to be seen.

credit should go to otto rehagal to for parking their greece's team bus infront of goalpost in the last edition of euro competition, yet they take home the euro holygrail. laugh.gif
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That's 06 shakehead.gif
QUOTE
but the rest of us sure wanted to see ferguson managing the england team, aren't we?

Not me...scolari is one of the best eg...he is good in international...he sucks in club team...

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 12 2008, 09:37 AM
Jason_T
post Jun 12 2008, 09:42 AM

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QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 9 2008, 03:44 PM)
jm didn't wnn everything with chelsea. but he does landed the euro cup with porto. his failure to bring the euro holygrail to stamford bridge with better team compared with porto cost him dearly.
grant was a near man.

still, jm is a great manager. he created that sort of aura of invincibility
at chelsea.
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before man u winning cl, where is MU when chelsea qualify for semi? laugh.gif
Given JM the same amount of time, he will deliver the same number of trophies for chelsea as well..
SAF took 10years+(since he joining since 80's) before winning in 1999(CL..which is called STEADY while liv 2005 is called LUCKY) give JM 10 years..ops...nono..just compare the years..hw many years JM in porto before winning CL? you do the maths.. laugh.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:45 am
QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:38 AM)
hmm, i wonder if saf's trophy cabinet is big enough for his medals and trophies laugh.gif
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hmm.gif I remember mANU fans telling me that quality counts before quantity.
They said every year liv signed quantity players and mANU signed quality players...

now now, take back the words, eh? laugh.gif
I wonder quality or quantity should come 1st...

Comparing the achievement in SPL with BPL/La Liga/Serie A is totally nuts, if u ask me.. laugh.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 12 2008, 09:45 AM
Jason_T
post Jun 12 2008, 09:46 AM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:38 AM)
hmm, i wonder if saf's trophy cabinet is big enough for his medals and trophies laugh.gif
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and i doubt saf can keep trophies at home...medal can la..trophies?u think his hse is OT a? doh.gif
and i dun think medals can fill up a cabinet as well... icon_idea.gif
Jason_T
post Jun 12 2008, 09:47 AM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:46 AM)
mu lost to milan in semifinal
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1 time semi?
and can u pls do the maths of JM in porto compared with SAF before winning his 1st CL? biggrin.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:49 am
QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:47 AM)
the awards like manager of the month u call it what?
he won it numerous times
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so did AW, AG,JM...I did never hear their fans say the cabinet is going to be full...
That's typical arrogant, if u ask me smile.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 12 2008, 09:49 AM
Jason_T
post Jun 12 2008, 09:55 AM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:51 AM)
porto is banned from ucl next season, caught setting up the match

and if not for scholes valid goal considered offside by referee, i doubt chelsea will go for mourinho that time
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so, cant the same thing applies to Liv?
In 2007 cl final, ac milan might be setting up the match as well since they was caught the same years...and surprisingly they still get the chance to play. doh.gif
Hails rafa then?
Nono..There is nothing to do with it.Won means won it.
There is no such thing as they set up the match and so on cos even if they did, they r not going to return the trophies, are they? whistling.gif


Added on June 12, 2008, 9:56 am
QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 12 2008, 09:51 AM)
if u know what is the meaning of joking, u wont post that
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i cant sense the joke...maybe abu laugh.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 12 2008, 09:57 AM
Jason_T
post Jun 13 2008, 12:53 AM

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QUOTE(boxsystem @ Jun 12 2008, 11:37 AM)
your statements contradicts to each other. first you said, spl is nothing like epl, then you asked us to compare JM's time in Porto?
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I ask to compare CL cup..and u r telling me cl cup differ every year? OMG!!!! shocking.gif

QUOTE
Awww, come on. And yeah, luck does play part in everything. same can be said when Liverpool winning the UCL in 2005?
Thats what I mentioned earlier din I?
mANU 1999 is called STEADY and ours is called lucky..
Thats typical self defence by some arrogant fans... icon_rolleyes.gif

QUOTE
don't you think, same can be said as, where was Chelsea before they win the EPL? or, since you like to banter so much, I can say something like where's Liverpool for this 18 years?

so, u r telling me u r taking N95 to compare with the Tai Ko Tai phone?
shocking.gif
you guys got owner that willing to spend...RICH owner
and we got kiam siap owner...
how much u guys spend and how much we spend?
and this is not mere excuse...

QUOTE
It's just banters. If you can't take it. Ignore it. One thing, I did noticed a couple of Liverpool's fans having their siggy like "Moscow, UCL Final : Liverpool vs ?" or "United fans now can see the UCL trophy in Anfield". Learn to give and take.
So, won is won eh? same can be said by winning the league with 2 extra points of the runners up?


To compare,thats is HOPE from fans rather than arrogant.and please if such post is called BANTERS or jokes, i wonder what happen to sportsmanship nowadays..and hell yeah, u r telling me those idiots jumping over fences to post " glory2 mu" is banters as well? whistling.gif

and for the 2 points, i did say...won is won...but luck do help, din i say that earlier? wink.gif

QUOTE
You're totally unbelievable.  shocking.gif
Thx thumbup.gif I knew that since ages ago whistling.gif


Added on June 13, 2008, 12:57 am
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 12 2008, 12:42 PM)
those titles listed doesn't included the kiddo stuffs. get the fact right. i never mentioned about u18 or even u21.
Thats mere example that I wish to highlight NUMBER OF TROPHIES not the main factors of deciding whos the best manager around.
Can those manage U12 and U18 included in the best manager list if they won them over 30times?
thats what i m trying to highlight icon_rolleyes.gif

QUALITY OF THE LEAGUE SHOULD DECIDES

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 13 2008, 01:02 AM
Jason_T
post Jun 14 2008, 12:11 PM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 13 2008, 10:44 AM)
some pool fans cant think properly.. they r emotionally retarded hurt since 18 years ago whistling.gif
*
u noe wat....is better to be emotionally retarded than to be a supporter that idiots that follow trends jump on bandwagon just because the team is winning... biggrin.gif
and it is even better to see that a team that had not been winning can still fans supporting them like hell...something we cant see in a manure mANU team.

QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 13 2008, 10:44 AM)
some pool fans cant think properly.. they r emotionally retarded hurt since 18 years ago whistling.gif
now now...this is a joke as well? boxsystem...maybe u should noe wats arrogant and wats joke before u posts... laugh.gif


Added on June 14, 2008, 12:16 pm
QUOTE(mizivincible @ Jun 13 2008, 11:24 AM)
Im with you Duke Red. Personally I dont like to see flaming between the fans of any clubs, why cant we have a healthy discussion ?

Regarding your statement "I'm not only a fan of Liverpool, I'm a fan of Liverpool fans",

IF, if particular Liverpool fans doing wrongs e.g flamebaiting, couldnt get into healthy discussion without insulting,dissing or belittling the other club, will you still support him/them ? Ok, support might not be the best word here, as even if man utd fans doing wrongs, somehow I will support them too but will advice them not to do so. I hate other clubs fans insulting my favorite team so I do expect the same thing from them too.
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I hate people label liv fans as "emotional retarded" and i believe u wont want us to label ur team as freaking arrogant retards hence, i do hope u will spend some time advise the retarded madrealjr...
just because he is mad doesnt mean he can be disrespectful to others...it might start another flame war and ur beloved ts aka moderator alien2003 might need to do OT to delete posts,ban and bla bla bla again eh?

we'd love to see him apologize here ... laugh.gif
wink.gif

p.s: i can use the word on him as well i think?with slash on the word itself after that... shocking.gif


To mods: the words i use above got NO INTENTION to insult/troll...just an EXAMPLE..but then if u want to ban, just ban wink.gif whistling.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 14 2008, 12:26 PM
Jason_T
post Jun 15 2008, 12:00 PM

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QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 14 2008, 12:46 PM)
i already said some, not all.. in malay words, "siapa yang makan cili dia yang terasa pedasnya"
if u r not, then good.. keep supporting ur team and dont bash united fans
i know some of them r just glory hunters and annoying but well, there are more of us who are real supporters

i didnt started all these, u were the one
and if u r reading properly, its emotionally hurt not emotionally retarded whistling.gif
cant read properly? laugh.gif  laugh.gif
u contradicted urself already, u already called united fans as arrogant way before my post.. what u give u get back.. it is karma
*
which u mean i can use any offensive words with slashes? eg: son of the b1tch
That's not going to work.Thx for teaching me. So, mod can confirm about this?As long as i use slash on words, i can scold wat i wan? whistling.gif


Added on June 15, 2008, 12:01 pm
QUOTE(yngwie @ Jun 14 2008, 02:01 PM)
off topic......
how long you had been supporting the kopites?
we know there are a lot of wanker glory hunter around. the most recent example was some chelsea supporter!
i'm glad i'd been with mu since i was a kid back in 89. we're not too bad nor does topping the bpl back then. the kopites and forest are the talk of the town. but i am done with my choice and i can only look forward to every season with hope.
i know there are a few team in bpl with loyal fan base... esp. the kopites and i respect 'em so much.
duke red and a few other senior was a fine example  icon_rolleyes.gif

btw, i just don't understand why the winning team create so much hatred!
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FYI, i had been supporting them even before they won the treble... whistling.gif


Added on June 15, 2008, 12:05 pm
QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 14 2008, 12:46 PM)
i already said some, not all.. in malay words, "siapa yang makan cili dia yang terasa pedasnya"
if u r not, then good.. keep supporting ur team and dont bash united fans
i know some of them r just glory hunters and annoying but well, there are more of us who are real supporters

i didnt started all these, u were the one
and if u r reading properly, its emotionally hurt not emotionally retarded whistling.gif
cant read properly? laugh.gif  laugh.gif
u contradicted urself already, u already called united fans as arrogant way before my post.. what u give u get back.. it is karma
*
and I doubt u are..

QUOTE(MADReaLJL @ Jun 14 2008, 12:46 PM)
i already said some, not all.. in malay words, "siapa yang makan cili dia yang terasa pedasnya"
if u r not, then good.. keep supporting ur team and dont bash united fans
i know some of them r just glory hunters and annoying but well, there are more of us who are real supporters

i didnt started all these, u were the one
and if u r reading properly, its emotionally hurt not emotionally retarded whistling.gif
cant read properly? laugh.gif  laugh.gif
u contradicted urself already, u already called united fans as arrogant way before my post.. what u give u get back.. it is karma
*
I believe is the fact that YOUR POST previously is rather an arrogant statement than a joke...why dun we set up a poll and see how?
Some people can pull it off and said that was a joke which I believe was a damn lame excuse to be used.
and for karma, i do believe karma but i dun think it applies here...
dun simply use it as a weapon to argue...it doesnt work that way.. smile.gif

This post has been edited by Jason_T: Jun 15 2008, 12:05 PM
Jason_T
post Jun 16 2008, 07:43 PM

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QUOTE(munky @ Jun 15 2008, 07:46 PM)
some ppl never get enough eh ?

damn noobs
*
I do admit that a certain facts from fellow reds might be a bit over...for instance Liv vs ?? in moscow...
but i believe those insulted people in the 1st place should bear more responsibilities of "NEVER GET ENOUGHT"
nod.gif

 

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