Here is a follow email from Liana
To: adrianlwk@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Fighting Spiders
From: "Liana Tze Ann TANG" <Liana_TANG@nlb.gov.sg> Add Mobile Alert
Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2008 09:55:37 +0800
actually, i managed to breed my spiders last time because it was part of my research to observe mating and to make the females produce eggs. but you must be really really patient and do not disturb them while they are courting.
first you must make sure the female is mature. you can do this by observing if their epigyne on the underside of the abdomen is clearly visible. then try this trick -- to prime the area u are gonna put them in, you try and leave her inside for 4 hrs or more (overnight also can) before introducing the male. this allows for the air in the container to be saturated with her pheremones. this may facilitate courtship. the most important part is to make sure you put them in a quiet and undisturbed environment, bearing in mind that these spiders have such good sensors of vibration and eyesight, any movement from you will distract them.
for my experiments, some took very short, abt 15minutes to mate, but most took more than half an hour to mate. but once u see them being very aggressive to each other, they probably wont mate. sometimes, they will come together and mate one more time after the first time, so you may want to leave them inside the area for a while after the first mating.
my setup was a room with a table that had dark curtains around it, and i had holes cut into it for my ease of observation. that was how i avoided visually distracting them. as these spiders are sensitive, its probably wise to turn off sound sources like music while u are at it.
my spiders eggs all managed to hatch, except a few where the female decided to eat the eggs. i left them in the same cage as i believe the female might play a role in cleaning the egg nest of fungus and mites, but this is not proven or observed.
some tips to help spiders survive better in captivity - try and include some plant clippings like a leaf or two in the cage. make sure the leaf is not some strong smelling one that may be toxic when u cut it. also make sure there is enough humidity, like put a freshly wet cotton ball in the cage regularly. cos spiders do need a lot of water.
its nice to meet a fellow biologist. CMB is tough! hope you have some luck with the spiders. hope you can help keep the love for nature and the environment alive in these enthusiasts.
<adrianlwk@yahoo.com>
04/04/2008 11:14 PM
To Liana Tze Ann TANG/RSI/NLB@NLB
cc
Subject Re: Fighting Spiders
Office Ext
Thanks for replying.
Good idea getting virgins by capturing them as
juveniles. As i think u know too, the adult females
are almost impossible to get them to breed.
Thanks for the insight that babies cannot be reared in
captivity. Somehow it gives me more determination to
find out why and HOW to be able to rear them in
captivity. For something so common, it bewilders me to
think that it is so difficult to rear a full life
cycle of these spiders.
Anyway, if you ever think of doing any other research
on Thiania again, you can know for sure, I'll be the
MOST interested person in the WORLD to know.
Cheers
Adrian
PS. I am from NUS too in 1993. Stayed in Sheares Hall.
Did science, majored CMB and zoology. Stressed but
really enjoyed studying there. My favourite place..the
science library, biology section. Favourite canteen,
Arts though.
-----------------------------------
I am getting worse results than Liana. The batches that i had all failed to hatch...including Bighead generation.
Something is wrong.
Differences between the conditons of eggs I have and in the wild.
1. No female
2. Not on a leave but on plastic
3. Too bright?
I think as Liana said, the female is important because some of the batches of eggs had black fungus growing on the web and they failed to hatch. Most of them turn brown and sort of dried/wrinkled up.
Maybe having the eggs on a living leave is important. I had a female out in my garden which laid eggs on the underside of a leave. All the eggs i think successfully hatched because a lot of slings came out. (but now dunno where they go, all dead i think) Gaseous exchange? Or maybe the plastic have toxic that somehow harm the eggs?
Even the batch of eggs given to me by Viper which was also laid on plastic doesn't look good. The female is still there guarding the eggs.
The eggs i kept under certain shade with tape also failed to hatch. How bright is bright? In the wild i also see nest being made in leaves that are not that shaded, so there is a certain amount of light being able to penetrate those thin leaves too.
could it be the food i feed the my females? There is a batch of eggs which was laid(also on the plastic container) probably one or two days after i caught the female... even that failed to hatch.
Are the eggs not fertilized?
In the end, i think the most obvious reason is probably the plastic and light.
My next strategy is to follow Liana advice to make the environment as natural and as disturbance free as possible.
If i fail to be able to breed FS, i feel as i am doing a disfavour to FS. Not only have i failed to enhance their genes but by catching them and keeping the best, i am taking out the best genes out from the wild. Hence the wild will have weaker fighters to breed with the females. As a result it will be difficult to continue the hobby with lousy fighters around in whatever leftover natural places we have in our urban environment. As such, the hobby will also die out slowly. It becomes unsustainable. Of course, even if there are 50 people playing FS like viper and me, i doubt FS will pupus from Malaysia. But it becomes more difficult. From history we can see the most popular pets are pets that are able to be selectively bred by man. Guppies, Bettas, Discus, FlowerHorn, Koi etc and all types of cats and dogs are all bred for their beauty and uniqueness. Fighting animals although mostly frown upon are also bred for their strength and fighting ability. A special case is Murai(magpie robin) which is still imensely popular in many parts of malaysia(usually old chinese area) and even hongkong too despite, like FS, they are also, if i am not mistaken, caught from the wild as babies. I have yet to hear of a Murai breeder. But with such stakes and popularity in Murai fighting, i am surprise there isn't one. Maybe there is. Here are some forums on Murai.
http://www.pet-cockatiel.com/Dboard/viewforum.php?f=62If, however, someone can find out the secrets to breed FS effectively and have a relatively simple way to bring up the slings to adulthood, and if a few people get into it, then FS hobby will have a new meaning, a new life... afterall more and more people stay in condos and FS keeping doesn't take up much space. It also means the hobby can travel all round the world.
This post has been edited by mindstorm: Apr 15 2008, 02:06 AM 
Apr 14 2008, 09:59 AM
. Hades getting better in fights. 
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Cheers, 
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scary.. 
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