Quick update, carried out more tests last night.

The reason why the delay in posting the charts is because I have been getting very weird results using the Reon. I need to verify if it was my Pioneer DV-600 or the Reon. The Pioneer DV-600 has 3 colour options on the HDMI. Full RGB (0-255), RGB (16-235) and YCbCr(4:4:4). My findings show that Reon alters the colour most when fed with a YCbCr(4:4:4) signal. When fed with a RGB signal there is not much of a colour shift. The colour shift using YCbCr is massive (reds become more orange, colour luminance shifts almost 100%). I verified this colour shifts by watching some material as well. Very clear in animations like Cars, Toy Story and slightly apparent in movies where the skin tones are not correct. So in order to confirm if this is true, I plan to run the Pioneer DV-600 direct to the Plasma to confirm this. The positive thing to take out of this is that the Reon does not shift the colour space too much when sent an RGB signal. The colour shifts can be calibrated out.

I saw the same issues when fed with a HD 1080i/60Hz signal. The luminance and the x,y shifts in the colour were very apparent. The only good thing is that the Reon does not touch a 1080p/24Hz signal at all.

I can imagine why a lot of users do not use Reon option in the 875, especially those who calibrate their displays over in the US/UK. I believe it has been confirmed that the 876 does not have all these problems and Onkyo has fixed these bugs. I also wonder if it can be corrected by a firmware revision but I doubt it, since Onkyo has released almost 8 firmware revisions for the 875 and it is still there.

Sorry for the all the words and no charts, but I will get round to it this weekend

This post has been edited by anfieldude: Nov 21 2008, 08:38 AM

any feedbacks from 805's user reporting audio delays or unsynchronizing with video? heard from an AV guys pointed out to me,make me undecided of purchasing 805...

got av syn problem??? What player u r using? So far no such problem with 875 which is similar to 805. Have a look at my 'review' in my signature.

hmmmm so far i myself dont have any prob. y not u try it out b4 buying.

This issue was real, but that was from older firmware. All models now (old or new) should have the latest firmware, don't worry about it.

There was a reported AV sync issue with the earlier Onkyo 805s. The issue has been fixed with newer firmware. From what i understand, the latest Onkyos in the market already hv the latest firmware. Bought my 805 abt a month ago and hv had no problems so far myself.

Check out this post on the AVS Forum - Onkyo 805 audio delay / lip synch problem.

Finally, managed to complete the calibration to iron out the Onkyo Reon Colour Space Issue.

Attached is a pdf of my tests.

I did not attach the greyscale charts since there was no difference among all.

My video chain.
Pioneer DV-600-AV DVD Player (updated firmware : allows BTB/WTW)
Pioneer PDP-428XG Plasma
Onkyo SR-875
PS3 40G (Not used in this test)
Connection : HDMI
No changes were done in the display as far as settings were concerned.

My calibration equipment/software:
EyeOne Pro
Calman

1st 2 charts are direct hookup of DVD Player to plasma. Tested 2 different options on the DVD for HDMI Color.
No differences seen between RGB (16-235) vs Component (YCbCr 4:4:4). Signal 480i from DVD Player. Colour Luminance a little high but this is the reference (I could have reduced it by reducing Colour but did not want to change anything)

3rd-4th Charts
Hooking up the DVD player to the Onkyo 875 and turning on Reon/off Reon. On Reon means upscale to 1080p. Off means sending 480i to TV (Through). DVD player set to RGB.
By turning off the Reon, you can see that there is no change to the colour compared to sending direct to Plasma.
Once the Reon is turned on, there is a big change in Luminance. The colour saturation increases. However, this can be calibrated out, since all colours increase in saturation, in essence, by turning down the colour/chroma/saturation this can be reduced.

5th - 6th Charts
Now the DVD player is set to output component (YCbCr 4:4:4) and check is done with and without Reon.
Without Reon, no change to colour, same as running the DVD player direct to TV
However, switching on the Reon changed a lot of things. Firstly, the primary colours move, especially red. Secondary colours also move quite a bit. The most important is that the luminance increases significantly in Red, Blue and reduces in Green. This cannot be calibrated out by merely reducing the colour/saturation/chroma. To fix this you need to have a display that has a full CMS (Samsung LCD x50 series, some high end LG). Pioneer does have a limited CMS but there is no lightness function.

The differences can be seen in movies that have use of colours predominantly. Also if the Reon is turned on for YCbCr the colours become imbalanced.

Nearly all material (DVD, BD) are mastered in YCbCr (4:2:0). All displays are RGB. The transformation of YCbCr must be done somewhere either your DVD player, AVR or TV. Also bear in mind that most DVD players might not have the RGB (16-235), most of them have only 2 choices for HDMI colour, RGB (0-255) or Component (YCbCr)

In short, the implementation of the Reon on the Onkyo 875 is flawed. If you want to use the AVR to upscale, you need to make sure you select the right options on your DVD player and you also need to check the colour saturation. Avoid sending a YCbCr to the Reon.

I will post charts showing that there is a similar change happening when a HD (ie, from PS3) 1080i signal is sent. Theoretically, this should not happen. The AVR should only de-interlace the signal and send it to the TV but there is some additional processing that is messing up the colour as well. I can also confirm that the Reon does not touch a 1080p/24Hz signal.

More later

This post has been edited by anfieldude: Nov 24 2008, 09:26 AM


Attached File(s)
 Onkyo_Reon_Colour_Space_change.pdf ( 397.35k ) Number of downloads: 21

thx for all the feedback:)
so with the latest firmware, is the issue solved or the delay was not so noticeable?

would like to know more on the 805, is there any downside for this avr?

side issue, can the latest denon2309 consider same par with onkyo805?
the pricing is quite near, still deciding which avr to get..

get the onkyo 906..

heat loh

thanks for the effort

This heat issue can easily be solve by a simple DIY cooling fan. Not a big issue.

yap

If lazy to DIY (like me),buy a laptop 7.5" single fan(low noise) cost < 50, solved ( if really lazy and dun wan to spend any $$$,leave it as it is,not an issue also,brother aiman04 did explaint that b4)

im still using ori..... means no fan nothing

That lappy 7.5" fan now only Rm29 & it look much better then my DIY!

any photo for the 7.5" fan ???

No photo as I didn't buy it since I already got my own DIY. It is the same as any lappy cooler with base powered by USB port but instead of two small cooling fan it just got one big 7.5" fan..........some more got bling bling led light! Using this I am sure will make ur Onkyo Amp very 'colorful'!!!!

The max temperature I have seen the Onkyo go to is 62C.

RM29 for the fan is cheap,i bough at RM48 if not mistaken ( Dun get the one with LED if u're using PJ to watch movies,it's very annoying )

On a air-con room,the max temp i got on 876 is arround 60C,with the fan on < 40C now

I didnt took the pic but i remembered someone post in the same thread in previous page,should be somewhere 80+ page,sorry....

This post has been edited by myqd: Nov 24 2008, 11:43 AM