Lol... so i'm gonna pick up little pink dumbells weighting just 2.5 kgs are doing endless reps to get the pump, but hey... i'm gonna do it within an hour, i guess it'll still be productive.



How do you define maximum poundage and how do you define progressive poundage? You can't categorize in absolutes.

No, you're still like those teens from bb.com who disregards good advice and stubbornly keeps sticking to what you're doing wrong. We're jsut trying to help out based on experience and saving you the trouble of making the many mistakes we did.

Oh yeah, at least that much i agree. So you prefer to grow at a slower rate, as long as you're growing right? But hey... y'know, musclemass and i are giving you the same advice Terry Gallyot was giving to Joey Kun when we visited his gym, but I guess it's your right to try doing things your own way. Good luck.

This post has been edited by darklight79: May 7 2007, 01:15 PM

Lesson of the day, compounds+eat+rest=grow

Heh... I also like my usual sentence:-

Food + more food + time + genetics + exercise = growth

dude even progressive poundage u'll reach your maximum poundange in the last set la if not what for doing it?

Haha. Good one.

Sorry. Perhaps, I wasn't clear in my statement.

IMO, any sort of weight lifting movement coupled with progressive poundage wouldn't be counterproductive if you can pull them off well within an hour. (The anabolic period for workout session )



Let us take for e.g: Dumbbell Concentration Curl

Maximum poundage : The amount of poundage you can curl WITHOUT pre fatigue of your biceps from compound movement.

Progressive poundage : To beat the maximum poundage you can curl WITH pre-fatigue over time.




Nope. In fact I was planning to try on the 5X5 routine sometime after this to see out the difference in it.

You had your logic in your advocacy , I had mine too. Yours could be more superior than mine.



Respect to you, Musclemass,your friend Terry and everyone here. No doubt about this. And I'm certain Joey will do well with you guys.

But, I prefer to beat my own logic with tangible results.

At the moment, I would stick on my routine to chart the progress I would yield.....and then compare them to the 5X5 routine.

Slow it might be, but at least I proved myself wrong with MY OWN tangible results.

And yeah, I'm not like those stubborn & blind teens from bb.com.

I might be stubborn , but not blind. I learn from mistake.

Okie. Thanks!

MIA till June 19.

This post has been edited by Unlimited: May 7 2007, 04:44 PM

u r really stubborn .

anyway in order to prove u r right too, u will be likely more determined to achieve the goal. this is sort of ur own motivation to drive u forward...

then...... dont bother arguing with us. since u want to try out your own concept so much..

I rest my case

This post has been edited by musclemass: May 7 2007, 07:42 PM

u noe what.....i think this is the first time i'm gonna write off someone.
really cannot believe there's actually people this stubborn.

This post has been edited by pizzaboy: May 7 2007, 07:01 PM

Okie. I was wrong. I made a mistake. A big one.

Upon reading more from

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...4&postcount=386

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...9&postcount=784

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...7&postcount=133

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...1&postcount=647

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost...0&postcount=234

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...8&postcount=783

http://www.drdarden.com/readTopic.do?id=394848

http://www.geoduckies.com/elitemadcow1/Topi...ning_Primer.htm

My concept was TOTALLY FLAWED (insufficient frequency, incorrect definition of over training, the ignorance of dual factor theory) from the start.

To Darklight, Musclemass, Pizzaboy, Jones007 , T+1 & everyone here:

Hey guys. I hope my gesture wasn't taken in the wrong lights. I have to admit, I was stubborn AND BLIND. I was overwhelmed with my newbies gain & flawed concept that causes me to ignore the fundamentals to optimal growth.

Sorry.

I would start on the program Today! Hehe!

I was thinking to start with Bill Starr 5X5 according to the excel template.

Or should I start with Rippetoe's Variation as posted by Darklight?

Thanks for showing the light to the blind!

lol... that was fast.. only 1-2 days and u realised u r wrong? haha. do rippetoe 3x5. good program. u lurk in elitefitness forums as well?

Haha.

Cause I was surprised by the insistence on scrapping my hypertrophy concept. I thought there must be some solid reason behind the advocacy.

The concept I used to devise my workout was totally inadequate and of course partly incorrect.

I thought the gist of 5X5 routine was to incorporate big, heavy compound movement ONLY. Hence, I thought I can still carry on with my program upon some minor tweak.
The tweak being emphasis on heavy compound movement.

At that point, I was really surprised to see all of you condemning my concept. I thought this should only be the case if there's solid reason behind them.

So, after completing my lab report. I thought to do a bit more reading into the 5x5 routine, in order to develop greater understanding on your point of view.

Here's my initial conclusion upon my findings:

1. Lack of frequency on compound movement (Lack of stimuli)

2. Incorrect definition of overtraining (Thus hitting each body part once a week)

3. Incorrect definition of hypertrophy rep range (Hence emphasis on range of 6-10)

4. Incorrect assumption of muscle fibre recruited for rep range less than 6.

5. Ignorance on the MANY benefits of compound movement on our musculature

6. Incorrect duration required for muscle recovery

7. Ignorance on the benefit of Dual Factor Theory

Okie. Nope. Was there to read some of the thread only.

So I will try on the Rippetoe's Variation 3X5 as posted by Darklight.

Workout A:

3x5 Squat
3x5 Bench Press
1x5 Deadlift
2x5-8 dips (only add weight if you are doing >10 bodyweight dips)

With 2 Warm up sets(Half the weight of Real Sets) before the Real Sets.

Daily accessory work:
-45 degree Decline bench weighted situps, 3x5 (hold body parallel to ground for static 5 seconds each repetition on the way down, then go down slowly and come back up)

Rest in between sets. 1-2 minutes.

This post has been edited by Unlimited: May 8 2007, 05:15 PM

Dual factor is a concern for advanced trainee, not beginner

there is a god after all.....

are u a science student? u soudn hella etailed.

Oh. Okie. I read about it. That's why I was wondering whether I should start with Bill Starr 5x5 or Rippetoe's variation as the former incorporates dual factor theory.

Wow, the logic behind it seems flawless.

Upon understanding dual factor theory, now I know why supercompensation (Single Factor Theory) should be replaced. (Hence , no more 1 body part per week)

Yeah. I'm a mechanical engineering student. How about you?

Will update my workout in a while. Just got back. SUPERB WORKOUT!

international business student. sounds cole nough, ain't no tight degree.

do update.

rocket science post again just finish my workout damn tired. later i'll read it and interpret your concept and lab research result again hahahaha

Tuesday: Workout A


Warm up- (2 Sets x 55kg)- [Mistake, too heavy] 3x5 Squat (60kg ATG)

Warm up- (2 Sets X 30kg) - 3x5 Bench Press (65kg)

Warm up - (2 Sets x 30kg)- 1x5 Deadlift (67.5kg)

Warm up- (2 Sets X 8) 2x 8 dips

Daily accessory work:

3 Sets of Crunches (no weights): 45-30-30

Rest in between sets. 1-2 minutes.

All weights are without bar.

This post has been edited by Unlimited: May 8 2007, 11:30 PM

Hey Guys.

I have question on Workout B.

Workout B

3x5 Squat
3x5 Standing military press
3x5 Pendlay Rows (or power cleans for 5x3, 5 sets of 3 reps apiece)
2x5-8 chinups ***if you do the power cleans, do 3 sets of chinups***

Can we replace Standing Military Press with SEATED Military Press?

I have had bad experience with the standing version. Upon completing the exercise, I experience pain on the upper back. Very bad. Not sore, but pure pain. Not sure why.

As for Pendlay Rows, is it compulsory for us to deload the weight? Why is that?

And one more problem...Hehehe. My gym doesn't have a chin up bar. So can't do chinups... Any exercise to replace that?


To Pizza Boy:

Okie. On holiday now? or preparing for exam?

To Jones007:

How many weeks have you been on Rippetoe already?

This post has been edited by Unlimited: May 8 2007, 10:44 PM

prep exam

Pendlay, yes, deload the weight, you cannot get two reps of pendlay with right form/grip if you do not deload

Yes u can erplace the MP with seated. If u do it seated, it's even harder, because u cannot put any leg drive.

On the chinups, do you have a smith machine? or a power rack?
U can always do chin/pullups on those racks.

---

Added on May 8, 2007, 10:52 pmprep exam

Pendlay, yes, deload the weight, you cannot get two reps of pendlay with right form/grip if you do not deload

Yes u can erplace the MP with seated. If u do it seated, it's even harder, because u cannot put any leg drive.

On the chinups, do you have a smith machine? or a power rack?
U can always do chin/pullups on those racks.

This post has been edited by pizzaboy: May 8 2007, 10:52 PM