Actually, care to "remind" us why? Still kind of puzzled after these years of your postings, swaying from camp to camp. But i don't deny that your much earlier years' postings are more fair. You don't sound like a commentator now, as the opinions are solidly favouring 1 camp and you don't want to touch on the other camp's point. This behaviour is akin to a spokesperson/ambassador.

Well, the passat low spec turbo talk applies to all competition in the segment, especially more so to the japanese as they hold the major market share.

Please don't refer other country's car prices la....99% of models irrespective of brands will be relatively higher than ours.

Just consider the following regarding the price :

1) this is CBU, not CKD
2) no EEV incentive, automatically +10k for this segment of cars
3) lower bulk discount volume compared to camry/accord as they can buy in much higher quantities from japanese principle
4) this car has an turbocharger, and all the additional associated parts will add up to at least +5k

In fact, we should be questioning why toyota/honda are pricing cars so highly when they can pass down the savings from multiple avenues.

This post has been edited by wkc5657: Jun 20 2017, 11:27 AM

anyone test drive it? feel like wanna have a try after watching bobby's review..

The Camry is designed for comfort and reliability. Giving it a more powerful engine wouldn't be of much benefit.

I'm not sure what the Optima is designed for. The general perception is that Koreans make 'me too' products. Toyota and Honda have D Segment sedans so the Koreans make D Segment sedans. It doesn't have to be better or have competitive advantages because they'll sell it cheaper.

The Optima GT finally has a competitive advantage in the D Segment but it's an old model which will be replaced soon. VW brought out their GT with the launch of the new Passat.

you are right. current accord and camry have been here around 4 years ago i think so the next gen will be competitive. new accord will be previewed soon in next month IINM with the rumors of putting turbo,etc

nowadays, automakers are focusing on efficiency instead of power

New Accord have 2.0 Turbo (Civic Type R engine tuned differently), 10 speed auto and Honda Sensing, not sure will it be here or not but, the spec eats Optima GT. Just waiting for availability & price.

Assemble here does not mean manufacture here. Important vital parts are brought in from the actual country they are from. Only simple things and not so technical parts are manufactured locally. Leather seats are sub to local vendors.

The people here don't see any difference between Passat and Optima reliability and long term ownership which is why VW beats the Korean car sales. Do you know that Korean marketing staff been attacking VW unreliable for the past few years but failed. Only end up Japanese being the winner at the end.

People would take Passat 1.8TSI at rm158k vs Optima GT rm180k. If Passat 2.0T at rm189k, people would top up 9k for Passat. Since both future also similar, they would take the Passat that has better FC, better ride and comfort. Nothing beats conti in NVH and handling.


FYI, Volvo technology derived from Ford and Mazda with their own recipe. Volvo is actually more reliable than VW, probably beats Korean too.

This new Camry with new dual vvti probably GDI is on its way to launch in America in 1-2 months time before summer ends. Existing Camry is losing to Accord in local market , Toyota will surely launch this new Camry early to get back into fight maybe 2 months after US release. US Camry 2.5L is powered by 8 speed conventional gearbox. Hope we get 8AT too. Camry 2.0L, could be 6AT or miraculously 8AT if Toyota suddenly generous.

If Camry gives us 2.0T at rm180k, ofcourse will sell. Not because of performance but secured long term ownership with good RV.

This post has been edited by jayraptor: Jun 20 2017, 11:05 PM


Attached thumbnail(s)

i doubt 2.0 turbo will reach here. if honda still got sell 3.5l v6 accord like many years ago then it's possible.

most likely 1.5 turbo with 190hp replacing the 2.4

Electronic parking brake requires electricity to operate. Since it could release parking brake without having to release, it means it is linked to multiplexer or ECM which is not good failsafe and not practical nor reliable. When car is old, electronic problem, it means there's possibility that driver cannot engage or disengage the parking brake? Foot parking brake and handbrake are at least reliable for long term.

As usual, the Koreans and their Malaysian principals are all delusional.

If Camry 2.0 turbo reach here it will be priced >rm200K.

This optima GT is new model launched in 2016, not the old one, just that have some design semblance. If you read up history, the new passat was internationally launched late 2014. It was actually the passat that was later into the game.

Honda will definitely turbocharge all the variants from civic onwards, they can be experimental in doing so for the city/jazz if they want to. That's how they want to one up Toyota and be one step ahead in engine development department.

Drive-E is new development after getting Geely money la, gearbox from Aisin = Toyota

If really reference from Ford during the time of development, it will be more fuel guzzling.

America's Camry version is never the same as the Japanese/global version, only the basic chassis engineering is the same. They have their own development and design bespoke to the markets there. And seems like they are putting in Lexus design elements in it, may look aggressive to the intended market here. Honda looking like this more acceptable, rather than toyota.

What we should be looking at is the japanese camry. So not possible that the camry will be launched/assembled in time with the 2 months timeframe after US launch you stated earlier. Malaysia is usually quite late into the game, and need to coordinate with Thailand's operation to optimise and coordinate supply chain in the region. If Thailand on, singapore got, then will only be Malaysia's turn.

This post has been edited by wkc5657: Jun 21 2017, 11:18 AM

The Japs tend to give us old technology. How long has Toyota socked Camry buyers with 4 speed AT? I think it was up to the previous model before the existing Camry model. Now Koreans have started to turbo their engines and Japs are playing catch-up. The Honda Civic and new CRV are a start but where is Toyota? Still thinking they can leverage on their brand name to give us old technology? But come to think of it with people saying they will buy an outdated Camry instead of an Optima GT for the same price I think Toyota may be right.

Having a turbocharger doesn't mean that it is latest technology, but it is the trend now. It gives performance but the fuel consumption will end up just slightly better than similar powered (albeit larger cc NA engine). The fuel savings only occur during super low engine loads or when idling. Other than these small condition frame, fuel consumption is thrown out. In any given set of driving condition, after taking out some mechanical loss from internal components, weight savings and also transmission loss, real fuel consumption savings are really REAL when there is increased valve control and gains in thermodynamic efficiency. And as we know, within the past decade or 2, the thermodynamic efficiency gains in combustion engines are nothing to be proud of, but valve timing controls did make a leap.

I feel that real genuine approachable gains in the current environment can be found in camless engines such as the Freevalve concept/Qoros Qamfree. Power band can be wider and higher, no cam components means lesser component friction and the engine will be noticeably lighter from taking out these mechanical cam components. Proton could have made a desperate ditch effort in employing that.

But anyway, most people just want driving appliances that are durable. And the perception of toyota/honda on that in the world is rock solid. Used to be diamond solid, but new generation buyers are willing to try other stuffs rather than the conventional default choice. Nothing wrong with that, but markets with more conventional tastes are missing out on new developments.

Turbocharging an engine may not result in better fuel economy but it makes the car more driveable with max torque coming in at low rpm. This makes it much more fun to drive and safer for overtaking plus you will feel less tiring driving a car with adequate power over long distances. In Malaysia our road tax structure means that turbo cars are more practical to upkeep than large cc cars.

It isn't new technology as European cars have been using it for so long but the Japs have been slow to adopt it. I think it is only due to Koreans pushing ahead with turbo that the Japs now feel compelled to go turbo too for fear of being left behind. Even then it is only Honda tip-toeing cautiously into this field with lightly boosted turbo and frequent reminders to service in case their engines explode while Toyota, Mazda and Nissan are still locked in the past as far as our market is concerned.

Previously to drive a powerful turbo car you need buy a Conti car with scary reliability and costly maintenance. For non-luxury segment that would be a VW, Peugeot or Ford and for luxury segment a Merc, BMW or Audi. Such cars are not for the faint hearted or the not so deep pocketed. You can drive a powerful Continental car but you drive in fear.

But the game has changed with the Koreans adding turbo to their C and D segment cars. The Optima GT puts the exhilarating power of a 2.0L turbo engine within reach of mere mortals. The beauty of its styling is matched by the beauty of its engine. Korean cars have arrived and they make no apologies for their quality and features. Those still mired in brand snobbery against Korean cars can give way to the Optima GT zooming past while sedately driving their NA Camrys and Accords.

This post has been edited by KennyKB: Jun 22 2017, 09:44 AM

All turbodiesels aside, Toyota and mazda have turbo cars in their current lineups, just that toyota brought none into our markets.

Toyota : auris 1.2T
Mazda : CX9, Mazdaspeed

The Koreans are not delusional here only but also in China and America. Which explains their losses in the 2 major countries that they have been bragging how good they were. If thing continue like this, they'll drop out of China league faster than expected.

Korean brands' strength falls
By Li Fusheng(China Daily) Updated: 2017-04-10 10:10:12
m.chinadaily.com.cn/en/2017-04/10/content_28857380.htm

China cars been getting help from Japanese, American, European technology with money. Koreans bought their technology from Japanese, later American. The rest depends on how well they reverse engineered and learn from the assistance they could get. Seems like Korean brand already started behaving like conti (think themselves superior and ignore feedback from customers) that they will stuck at that level. The serious fall in deteriorating sales is evidence of their failure, so is the way they hire staff that are vital to Korean cars success in overseas.

This post has been edited by jayraptor: Jun 21 2017, 10:14 PM

Present FL Camry 2.0 is actually new dual VVTI 6AR-FSE with D4-S direct injection mated to 6AT gearbox
Output 165ps@6500RPM
Torque 199Nm@4600RPM
(Refer local Toyota website)

That is why people still buy Camry despite boring look. New 2018 Camry will use this new engine carry forward along with its 6AT gearbox.

Toyota has turbo but prefer giving something practical with ease of maintenance. If new Camry giving us the 2.5L non-hybrid 2AR-FSE with 8AT priced at rm170k, people will go for Camry for the good fuel saver with little power than uncertain future Optima.

Correction: this Optima GT is as old as the Sonata LF that was already revealed in 2014 and launched in Korea followed by America. We get Sonata LF only in early 2015. Optima only released here after more than 2 years, going to be 3 years where Sonata new rise 2018 is about to replace Sonata LF. Which means Optima too will come up with replacement as answer to new Camry 2018.

Before Volvo was sold to Geely China, the Ford ecoboost dual VVT and Mazda SVT technology already available. You said Volvo high FC by judging from Ford and Mazda older generation engine seems inaccurate.

The Camry didn't take long to release in Malaysia and Thailand. Quite on time, same goes to Honda and now Mazda also on time already. Instead, Korean end up like Nissan, launch new models only when about to phase out and keep selling old models.

i expect korean brand car to be atleast 20k cheaper than similarly spec jap car, only then will consider.
if same price, no chance

this is malaysian expectation in general

This post has been edited by one punch man: Jun 21 2017, 11:23 PM