Hi Guys, what an opportunity. This should be fun. I was actually planning/ executing a "hobby-scale" experiment to check the feasibility of farming freshwater fishes. Open to all suggestions / help. My initial plan was to try out Tilapia as I've researched that the retail prices varies from $10.50 to $12.50 at my area. We have a disused bathing pool and we had converted it to a small pond.



The pool is approximately 4 ft X 12 ft and depth is approximately 3 feet. Pool is felt by a dripping freshwater, piped in, gravity feed (not too strong, but i think is sufficient). We had installed an overflow pipe to discharge the access water. We have a water pump (petrol driven) and a small creek nearby should there be any water disruption (a frequent occurrence). The 'In' pipe is elevated to 3 feet above the water level to create a drop as to increase the oxygen level. There are no electricity supply at the moment. The water temperature is pretty warm / hot in the afternoon. Preparing to add a shade netting to lower the heat from the sun.

Farmer has little / no fish farming experience. These are the conditions at the moment. Kindly suggest
1) Improvement to be made to the pond ( already planning to build a shading net and a net preventing the fish from jumping out)
2) Type of fishes to start with (ease of farming, commercially viable, short maturing period)
3) Farming density (no air pump as no electricity at the moment)
4) Type of feeds (low cost)
We intend to market the final produce as live freshwater fishes locally.
So guys, please post your suggestion and share our knowledge. Maybe by running this experiment, it'll save others some time & funds and used as a starting point.

Hi guys,

I havent been here for a long time. I'm currently looking for new ideas for my future agriculture projects since my serai project failed and my gaharu project hasnt generate any income for me yet. I wont be doing it now due to financial constraint. Maybe a few years from now. In my opinion, planting vegetables such as bendi and chilli is a better option because both these veges can be harvested in a few months. What do you guys think?

OMG, sorry I can not offer much as I'm also very new into Farming. I was just adventurous enough to jump into this without without much proper thinking / planning. In Cantonese it's called Moung Cha Cha

MrFarmer:

Sorry, I'm unable to view your photos on my network. But I can comment on the other aspects.

Your bathtub-pond is rather small, and shallow at that too. Without a proper filtration and aeration system, I'm afraid your biological load cannot be big. Couple that with the fact your water temperature tends to rise to the point human hands can feel warm, I'd say you're really gonna need a tough fish species. Shading might not solve the problem, as the surrounding soil will draw in the heat, and become like an insulator. But it could reduce the temperature flux.

Normally, the suggested load is about 40kg target weight per cubic meter, but without aeration and filtration, that'd be reduce to maybe about 4kg. Your tub is about 4 cubic meter, so maybe 4-6 fishes that can reach between 600g to 1kg. Air-breathing fish, such as gourami, climbing perch, and catfish are likely candidate. Tilapia are also good candidates, but a little more difficult, as water depth also influences their growth size. However you might be able to get weights of about 600g in your present setup.

As for feed, all the above are omnivores, so earthworms, chicken manure, standard fish pellets, etc would be fine. If you can breed mealworms, they'd be fine additions, and quite low cost too (if you breed them yourself).

From my experience, catfish species are the fastest growers with the least requirement for inputs. I recall some figures when I raised African catfish and basa in my old backyard pond, sloping at 4-6 feet deep, and 15 feet diameter (approx. 24kg harvest load). Do note, this pond also did not have aeration or filtration, and was directly exposed to sunlight. I placed 10 fingerlings of African catfish, and 10 patin fingerlings, both averaging 100g individual weights sometime in January a couple of years back. Fed them nothing more than ornamental fish pellets. By the week before Christmas, my family was harvesting African catfishes weighing in between 1.3 to 1.5kgs each, while the patin were a little smaller, at about 1.2 kgs each. Cost wise, we finished one large package of feed about every 2-3 weeks, or about RM16 per month, so the average price per fish would be about RM8.80, or about RM6.76 per kg liveweight. If I'm right, the current price of patin is about RM12-RM15 per kg, while African catfish is about RM13 per kg. More information can be found on AgriBazaar's facebook page:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Agribazaar-2...213559122000211

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Added on July 27, 2011, 1:40 pmamirbashah:

I'm so sorry to hear that your venture petered out. Don't worry, what does not kill us, will usually make us stronger.

Chili a little more difficult lar... Yields can be impressive and likewise the returns, but really need constant care. I tried on hobby scale before, but fruit fly infestation, anthracnose outbreak, mealybugs etc. really wreaked havoc on the commercial varieties. I mostly gave away the chilies, but the one good thing that resulted from this was that the breed I developed made it through unscathed. Not many seeds have been passed around, and I don't know if any of those I gave away are still being cultivated. Not sure if many people want to plant a 5 foot tall chili plant that bears white-colored chilies with a fragrance of apricots and peaches.

Bendi might fare better. I believe the latest hybrid okra released by MARDI is really good. Bought some seeds at the last National Seed Symposium. Didn't disappoint me.

This post has been edited by Michael J.: Jul 27 2011, 01:40 PM

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Added on July 27, 2011, 1:40 pmamirbashah:

I'm so sorry to hear that your venture petered out. Don't worry, what does not kill us, will usually make us stronger.

Chili a little more difficult lar... Yields can be impressive and likewise the returns, but really need constant care. I tried on hobby scale before, but fruit fly infestation, anthracnose outbreak, mealybugs etc. really wreaked havoc on the commercial varieties. I mostly gave away the chilies, but the one good thing that resulted from this was that the breed I developed made it through unscathed. Not many seeds have been passed around, and I don't know if any of those I gave away are still being cultivated. Not sure if many people want to plant a 5 foot tall chili plant that bears white-colored chilies with a fragrance of apricots and peaches.

Bendi might fare better. I believe the latest hybrid okra released by MARDI is really good. Bought some seeds at the last National Seed Symposium. Didn't disappoint me.

[/quote]

I agree with you, it's not easy to plant chili. I've heard a lot of bad stories especially regarding the pest and virus associated with the plant. I did a lot of research on different crops (banana, sugar cane, bendi etc) but havent decide which one to choose. From my past experience, the most important thing is not to jump on the bandwagon when everyone starts doing something which is popular at that time. It happened to me with my serai venture. I got conned and the guy still owes me RM10k

This post has been edited by amirbashah: Jul 27 2011, 02:06 PM

for me, at my new site am planning the below

1) place to plant herbs that would be given out for free to help people

2) planting for banana

3) planting of nangka madu

4) fertigation

5) small fish pond

Para:

Speaking of which, I received some very nice pumpkins and squash from Green World Genetics today. They are varieties yet to be released to general public. Really huge fruits. Took some pictures, but can't upload.

Oh by the way, if anyone wanted to get seeds for pilot planting, or even commercial planting, you could talk to Dr. Manaf, the Senior Vice President of BiotechCorp. He's connected to GWG.

Email: manaf.radzi@biotechcorp.com.my

You're such a good person trying to help other people. Speaking of nangka madu, I stumble upon a website where this guy is planting nangka madu and other crops. Here is the link. He's doing really well I guess.

HI amirbashah, can share why your Serai project failed? I dis plant some Serai a few months ago alone the perimeter of our farm, only as a supplementary corps. It shall be interesting for me to learn from you. Also the Gaharu, I've heard many people talking about it and the Indons even swear by it, cliaming to have medicinal value. I have in my possession a couple of plant-lets and have not decided on what to do with it.

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Added on July 27, 2011, 7:04 pm[quote=Michael J.,Jul 27 2011, 01:27 PM]
MrFarmer:

Sorry, I'm unable to view your photos on my network. But I can comment on the other aspects.

Your bathtub-pond is rather small, and shallow at that too. Without a proper filtration and aeration system, I'm afraid your biological load cannot be big. Couple that with the fact your water temperature tends to rise to the point human hands can feel warm, I'd say you're really gonna need a tough fish species. Shading might not solve the problem, as the surrounding soil will draw in the heat, and become like an insulator. But it could reduce the temperature flux.

Normally, the suggested load is about 40kg target weight per cubic meter, but without aeration and filtration, that'd be reduce to maybe about 4kg. Your tub is about 4 cubic meter, so maybe 4-6 fishes that can reach between 600g to 1kg. Air-breathing fish, such as gourami, climbing perch, and catfish are likely candidate. Tilapia are also good candidates, but a little more difficult, as water depth also influences their growth size. However you might be able to get weights of about 600g in your present setup.

As for feed, all the above are omnivores, so earthworms, chicken manure, standard fish pellets, etc would be fine. If you can breed mealworms, they'd be fine additions, and quite low cost too (if you breed them yourself).

From my experience, catfish species are the fastest growers with the least requirement for inputs. I recall some figures when I raised African catfish and basa in my old backyard pond, sloping at 4-6 feet deep, and 15 feet diameter (approx. 24kg harvest load). Do note, this pond also did not have aeration or filtration, and was directly exposed to sunlight. I placed 10 fingerlings of African catfish, and 10 patin fingerlings, both averaging 100g individual weights sometime in January a couple of years back. Fed them nothing more than ornamental fish pellets. By the week before Christmas, my family was harvesting African catfishes weighing in between 1.3 to 1.5kgs each, while the patin were a little smaller, at about 1.2 kgs each. Cost wise, we finished one large package of feed about every 2-3 weeks, or about RM16 per month, so the average price per fish would be about RM8.80, or about RM6.76 per kg liveweight. If I'm right, the current price of patin is about RM12-RM15 per kg, while African catfish is about RM13 per kg. More information can be found on AgriBazaar's facebook page:

I was targeting 30 to 50 fishes on my bath-tub pond Looks like I need to sort out the high temperature of the water first. Then have to look into the aeration and filtration. Was thinking that with fresh water supply and dropping it from a height, it'll help to increase the dissolved Oxygen Level and ease the biological loading.

This post has been edited by MrFarmer: Jul 27 2011, 07:04 PM

I can't agree more on the BOLD statement. But i realised that with the rapidly growing demand of poultry production & processing in our country, more and more efforts have been implemented and carried out by gov to meet this increasingly higher demand.

The whole industry i have been exposed to while on my intern, even the food processing aspects.I realized that GMP, HACCP, ISO 9001, are all important safety guidelines which food industry need to abide to. ISO Auditor Certification? do you mind to explain more? I think food industry company will sponsor the workers especially from QA/QC dept to undergo the training and obtain the certs right?

A few effort which i see is the current efforts by UPM researcher,from faculty of agriculture and animal sciences which recently come out with an idea of lactic acid fermented feed which could be used in animal feed.

We have know that the use of antibiotics in animal feed, causes development of resistance in a number of pathogenic
bacterial in the exposed animals. Furthermore, they have indirect adverse side effects with implications for human health. Thus a new alternative need to be penned down in order to produce a high quality and of minimal health effects due to the use of antibiotics in poultry diets.

Lactic acid fermented feeds are often suggested as alternatives to the use of antibiotic growth promoters.
It has made up a significant portion of poultry diet and nutrition. Fermented feed is characterized by high numbers of lactic acid bacteria, high number of yeast, a low pH and high concentration of lactic acid.

A good study by UPM here: http://www.pjbs.org/pjnonline/fin126.pdf

MrFarmer:

As with any agriculture business, aside from the direct management of the land and crop, the most important aspect is the marketing part. If you got crop, but no one to take the crop, or got person who take the crop but is lousy pay-master, I'm sure you can imagine the final outcome.

On the bath-tub pond thing, you are quite right. If you put in the proper setup, the biological load is around 40 fish. But again, you really need to consider the nature of the specie, and even the variant you choose. Tilapias are good fish, but make sure you choose the more domicile breed, as cichlids are by nature highly territorial fish. Catfish on the other hand are usually very tolerable of each other.

As for dissolved oxygen level, dripping water by itself does not do much to improve the condition. Water temperature, surface area, mineral content, and biological load (including microbes, algae, nitrates etc.) all influence this. That is why it is more profitable to do land-based aquaculture in cold-water regions (eg. Norway and China) rather than in the tropics, as the dissolved oxygen content in cold-water regions are very high, while the mineral contents tend to more balanced, and the biological load lower.

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Added on July 28, 2011, 9:25 amOMG:

You are on the right track.

ISO Auditor Certification, as you mentioned, is often sponsored by the company that hires the QA/QC exec. However, that is very often the "cheaper" way to do things on the Company's part, as it costs less to hire a fresh grad as a QA, then send the person for training. However, if you are an independent Auditor for say KPMG or Moody International, then you are not bound to a single company. Also, you would be limited to just poultry sector, if say your certification is applicable for food sector in general.

Yes, I've come accross lactic acid fermentation feeds. But I'm sorry to say, UPM is a little too late in coming up with the study. There are already existing companies in Malaysia commercializing the product. Their technology was adapted from research work of Thai scientists and universities. Yet, it is always possible that UPM could improve on those technologies.

This post has been edited by Michael J.: Jul 28 2011, 09:25 AM

To those who are interested to take some course in agriculture

http://www.umcced.edu.my/DIP/EDIP.html

Executive Diploma in Plantation Management by UMCCED

-----------------------------------------

Anyone has information on Training Course for Fertigation ??

MARDI has one but it is ALWAYS not enough participants

[quote=MrFarmer,Jul 27 2011, 07:00 PM]
HI amirbashah, can share why your Serai project failed? I dis plant some Serai a few months ago alone the perimeter of our farm, only as a supplementary corps. It shall be interesting for me to learn from you. Also the Gaharu, I've heard many people talking about it and the Indons even swear by it, cliaming to have medicinal value. I have in my possession a couple of plant-lets and have not decided on what to do with it.

I did intercropping with the gaharu trees. It was due to the soil condition of my land plus I got conned by the people supplying the serai. I didnt plough the soil before planting the serai. The soil was really hard and water can't get through. Moreover the supplier promised he would come to my land once a month to fertilize the serai and for weeding. Unfortunately he only went there once or twice in 6 months. That's my sad story.

Is the serai market doing good now? During the time I started the project, the serai was oversupplied causing the price to drop.

I've received a lot of mix reaction regarding gaharu. Some say they can fetch a lot of money but some sceptics dont believe it will happen. Currently I have around 2000-3000 trees on my land. Not sure how many trees survived. I havent visit my land for a few months now and now my land is 'semak' already.

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Added on July 28, 2011, 4:20 pm[quote=ParaOpticaL,Jul 28 2011, 09:57 AM]
To those who are interested to take some course in agriculture

http://www.umcced.edu.my/DIP/EDIP.html

Executive Diploma in Plantation Management by UMCCED

-----------------------------------------

Anyone has information on Training Course for Fertigation ??

MARDI has one but it is ALWAYS not enough participants

[/quote]

Seems like an interesting course. Can finish in a year. I'm doing my MBA now and most definitely wont be taking it right now.

This post has been edited by amirbashah: Jul 28 2011, 04:20 PM

amir, is serai lemongrass? even the price of the plant itself raised a lot. lemon grass drink is now spreading wide in the market...are they difficult to cultivate? how long is it from the harvest?hehe...i can google it but experience from you would be more useful i guess

Thank Michael,
Not too worried about marketing at the moment as I'm just on an experimental stage and my produce is very minimal (most are not maturing yet). We have ready reseller requesting to buy as our farm is located in front of the access road to 4 more farms Talk about location. We have buyers from the village market, town market and also buyers who buy and send down to Kota Kinabalu. Am also contacting buyers who claim to offer 'higher prices' but wants quality products for the Brunei market.
On the bath-tub pond, I shall re-work like building a roof to lower the water temperature, check if I can increase the water flow (free mountain water by gravity feed). Hopefully the shall also help on the temperature & the biological load. By the way, discussing this with you actually got me thinking that I could re-route the overflow water to run through the small slope of our Yam patch. Those Yam at the top of the slope is growing slower that those growing next to the creek. I think most probably due to water shortage. Also I could most probably increase the land size of the Yam patch to near the water run off. Work on this as soon as I'm back at the farm.

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Added on July 29, 2011, 8:24 pmAs far as I know, Serai does not need much maintenance. We planted ours by just making a hole about 1X1 ft 6ft apart and planted a few strand 3 months ago. Did weeding twice and fertilize once. If I remember correctly when we planted, it was about $0.50 per kilo.

Better go check on the Gaharu, here we have people even stealing rubber trees clone. You'll need to do some maintenance otherwise weeds shall grow taller than the trees (vine type) and deprive the Gaharu of sun light. You have workers staying on site?

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Added on July 29, 2011, 8:29 pmHi Chenyin, Yes Serai =Lemongrass. I didn't know that you can make drinks out of it. It's suppose to be easy to cultivate, with not much care required. Make a hole, plant 3 ~ 5 strands, water for the first week, harvest ~ 8 months latter. Keep some for replanting.
Say what sort of current market price are we looking at?

This post has been edited by MrFarmer: Jul 29 2011, 08:29 PM

yeap instant lemongrass drink now in market...i'v tasted before, not bad. good for health too. cosway is selling them, i guess other similar franchises are selling them too

Mr Farmer:

Good idea to reroute it to the yam patch. Fish pond water is rather nutrient rich.

yam drink you mean? wonder how would it taste

To Para :

Nutrient Deficiency Symptoms



This post has been edited by kianwei8: Aug 2 2011, 01:31 AM

Para :

Nutrient Deficiency Symptoms