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 Battle of the +/- rm7k TVs, + Discussion on Sharp UE630X

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AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 11:48 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 11:29 AM)
Any idea if it is edge lit or back lit?
*
back lit according to this:
http://www.stuff.tv/my/news/sharp-releases...tvs-in-malaysia

should be it is not as thin as some other tv's.

TSDannyOP
post Feb 2 2016, 02:26 PM

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thats good, that partly explains for the better picture quality. Begger's can't be choosers I guess, coz next step up with capability of perfect uniform colours will be the LG 65" Oled at RM20k.

This post has been edited by DannyOP: Feb 2 2016, 02:36 PM
TSDannyOP
post Feb 2 2016, 02:35 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 11:38 AM)
been playing with the audio functions of sharp ue630x, a summary:

.. all 4 hdmi's used as inputs, hdmi1 not used as arc.
.. optical output set to bitstream.
.. optical output connected to avr as input.
.. netflix - can get dd5.1, good (with hd/4k video).
.. direct usb tv playback give good results - for both dts and dd.
.. same files playback with standalone android/media player audio pass thru- only dd is produced on avr, good; dts downgraded to lpcm, poor.

it is strange why direct tv usb playback can produce dts at optical but not when using hdmi input from another player.
anyone has an explanation?
*
When you connect your source file via USB, what programme do you use to view the video?
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 02:57 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 02:35 PM)
When you connect your source file via USB, what programme do you use to view the video?
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the native app "media" on tv launcher where see netflix, manual, sharp...
SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 03:26 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 11:48 AM)
back lit according to this:
http://www.stuff.tv/my/news/sharp-releases...tvs-in-malaysia

should be it is not as thin as some other tv's.
*
TVs normally can't send out 5.1 audio when the source is through HDMI.
Only when the source is the TV itself then it can send out 5.1 audio. Also, most of the time only DD not DTS.

SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 04:11 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 11:48 AM)
back lit according to this:
http://www.stuff.tv/my/news/sharp-releases...tvs-in-malaysia

should be it is not as thin as some other tv's.
*
I don't see the article specificly mentioning that this TV is backlit.
The term LED back lit is genericly used to denote LED backlighting / edgelighting. Also, the article is a very casual press release. Does not go into any details whatsoever, so I believe they are using the term "backlit" loosely.
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 04:23 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 03:26 PM)
TVs normally can't send out 5.1 audio when the source is through HDMI.
Only when the source is the TV itself then it can send out 5.1 audio. Also, most of the time only DD not DTS.
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1. when source is from the tv like netflix, it can send out dd5.1 from optical out.

2. when source is usb direct on tv, it can send out both dd5.1 and dts5.1 from optical out.

3. when source is hdmi input from ext device, it can send out only dd5.1 and not dts from optical out.

i am curious why 3 cannot achieve dts while 2 can for the same files playback.

i guess it is either due to hdmi input like u said or dts licensing is not complete for optical output while dd is.



so... if above is true, it means most tv's having external hdmi input can't do optical out dts to avr?

i am curious about this becos this is the first time i m playing with optical out from tv... never had the need before! biggrin.gif
TSDannyOP
post Feb 2 2016, 04:56 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 04:23 PM)
1. when source is from the tv like netflix, it can send out dd5.1 from optical out.

2. when source is usb direct on tv, it can send out both dd5.1 and dts5.1 from optical out.

3. when source is hdmi input from ext device, it can send out only dd5.1 and not dts from optical out.

i am curious why 3 cannot achieve dts while 2 can for the same files playback.

i guess it is either due to hdmi input like u said or dts licensing is not complete for optical output while dd is.
so... if above is true, it means most tv's having external hdmi input can't do optical out dts to avr?

i am curious about this becos this is the first time i m playing with optical out from tv... never had the need before! biggrin.gif
*
If you have AVR and external device, you can connect the external device direct to the AVR, you don't need to connect to TV.
SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 05:02 PM

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The Cnet article I linked earlier mentions that DTS never gets passed-through in their testing. They tested with HDMI input to the TV and optical out.

http://www.cnet.com/news/20-tvs-tested-whi...to-a-sound-bar/

voncrane
post Feb 2 2016, 05:03 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 04:11 PM)
I don't see the article specificly mentioning that this TV is backlit.
The term LED back lit is genericly used to denote LED backlighting / edgelighting. Also, the article is a very casual press release. Does not go into any details whatsoever, so I believe they are using the term "backlit" loosely.
*
It's Back-lit... Sharp Malaysia's website confirms it.. Check the specs listing... If it were edge-lit, they'd specifically mention it and the light at the edge of the panels would have been noticeably brighter (not dimmer) than other areas, when a grey background is displayed.

*Remarks: LED TV refers to LCD TV with LED Back-lit.

This post has been edited by voncrane: Feb 2 2016, 05:03 PM
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 05:18 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 04:56 PM)
If you have AVR and external device, you can connect the external device direct to the AVR, you don't need to connect to TV.
*
biggrin.gif of course.

but.. there are exceptional cases... like...

... old avr
... no hmdi input.
... 1 coaxial + 1 optical input
... 4 devices! laugh.gif

so, if TV optical output can do the job for both dd and dts, very handy. just connect all 4 devices to tv via hdmi, optical to avr, viola! tongue.gif
SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(voncrane @ Feb 2 2016, 05:03 PM)
It's Back-lit... Sharp Malaysia's website confirms it.. Check the specs listing... If it were edge-lit, they'd specifically mention it and the light at the edge of the panels would have been noticeably brighter (not dimmer) than other areas, when a grey background is displayed.

*Remarks: LED TV refers to LCD TV with LED Back-lit.
*
I suppose this model is backlit then. But I would always caution skepticism when reading specs to avoid disappointment smile.gif

" *Remarks: LED TV refers to LCD TV with LED Back-lit."
The above is a common disclaimer to say that LED is not a new panel technology, it just means the backlight is LED instead of CCFL. Backlight here can mean both Edge lighting or backlighting.


AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 06:10 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 05:02 PM)
The Cnet article I linked earlier mentions that DTS never gets passed-through in their testing. They tested with HDMI input to the TV and optical out.

http://www.cnet.com/news/20-tvs-tested-whi...to-a-sound-bar/
*
thanks, good read.

but that's 2013, some tv's have improved! biggrin.gif

QUOTE
If you're looking for a TV that can pass a true 5.1 signal, then based on our results you'd be smart to stick to Sony, Toshiba, and Vizio models. Regardless of cost, all of the televisions from these three manufacturers that we examined were able to pass-through Dolby Digital 5.1 signals via their optical output.

well, the sharp ue630x now can do dd5.1, whether direct usb or ext device hdmi input.

QUOTE
A few things stood our from our testing. One is that DTS signals were downconverted to stereo PCM by every TV. So even in the best case scenario, TVs will downconvert surround sound to stereo for movies that only include a DTS soundtrack.

not entirely true since direct usb on my tv can do dts! laugh.gif

but i will accept it can't do dts for ext devices. smile.gif
SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 06:41 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 06:10 PM)
thanks, good read.

but that's 2013, some tv's have improved! biggrin.gif
well, the sharp ue630x now can do dd5.1, whether direct usb or ext device hdmi input.
not entirely true since direct usb on my tv can do dts! laugh.gif

but i will accept it can't do dts for ext devices. smile.gif
*
That's the thing, TVs seem able to do DTS with the tuner, built-in apps & USB but not external HDMI.
So many years has passed and support for such basic things are still problematic and improvements seem very incremental.

This is why we need AVRs and separate boxes to get things done but the costs can add-up very quickly. sad.gif
I was previously very happy with my setup since I can get everything connected to my AVR and do what they are supposed to do. Now, I have to use the TV apps for 4K video and simple things like ARC and DTS don't work. We are not even talking about HD audio or Atmos/DTS X. Audio support has always been dodgy and it continues to be so, just to find a box that supports HD audio pass-through is a pain as there are only a few that are able to do this and they are all buggy with some major weaknesses.



AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 06:47 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 06:41 PM)
That's the thing, TVs seem able to do DTS with the tuner, built-in apps & USB but not external HDMI.
So many years has passed and support for such basic things are still problematic and improvements seem very incremental.

This is why we need AVRs and separate boxes to get things done but the costs can add-up very quickly.  sad.gif
I was previously very happy with my setup since I can get everything connected to my AVR and do what they are supposed to do. Now, I have to use the TV apps for 4K video and simple things like ARC and DTS don't work. We are not even talking about HD audio or Atmos/DTS X. Audio support has always been dodgy and it continues to be so, just to find a box that supports HD audio pass-through is a pain as there are only a few that are able to do this and they are all buggy with some major weaknesses.
*
actually, 4 of my 5 boxes can do HD audio pass thru.

the oldest one is 4 yrs old, an AC Ryan Mini.

the other 3 are himedia androids, 2.5, 2, 1.5 yrs old. the newest one can do dd atmos too. they are excellent for playback, very good for popular apps but not so good for KODI.
SUSjdgobio
post Feb 2 2016, 07:11 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 2 2016, 06:47 PM)
actually, 4 of my 5 boxes can do HD audio pass thru.

the oldest one is 4 yrs old, an AC Ryan Mini.

the other 3 are himedia androids, 2.5, 2, 1.5 yrs old. the newest one can do dd atmos too. they are excellent for playback, very good for popular apps but not so good for KODI.
*
AC Ryan is old already. Those Realtek/Sigma chip devices were good for playing video and audio passthrough but the software has aged and there is no more support. If you go for Android, like the newer Himedias they come with their set of issues as well and most importantly no Netflix HD. Those streaming boxes like Roku can't handle most local files and also don't do HD audio passthrough. There is no perfect solution within reasonable cost and power consumption (rules out HTPCs). Everything is a compromise and will probably continue to be so for the foreseeable future.

Just to add, just because your Himedias can passthrough HD audio you shouldn't consider it as normal. Most android boxes including the famed Minix X8 don't completely support DD TrueHD and DTS HDMA passthrough. The Himedias are the exception rather than the norm. And the Himedia's have very little global support coz most of the info available are in Chinese and it is also not complete. Check out Iboum.com and you will see what I mean. So many boxes and there are still so many shortcomings.

This post has been edited by jdgobio: Feb 2 2016, 07:19 PM
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 07:40 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 07:11 PM)
AC Ryan is old already. Those Realtek/Sigma chip devices were good for playing video and audio passthrough but the software has aged and there is no more support. If you go for Android, like the newer Himedias they come with their set of issues as well and most importantly no Netflix HD. Those streaming boxes like Roku can't handle most local files and also don't do HD audio passthrough. There is no perfect solution within reasonable cost and power consumption (rules out HTPCs). Everything is a compromise and will probably continue to be so for the foreseeable future.

Just to add, just because your Himedias can passthrough HD audio you shouldn't consider it as normal. Most android boxes including the famed Minix X8 don't completely support DD TrueHD and DTS HDMA passthrough. The Himedias are the exception rather than the norm. And the Himedia's have very little global support coz most of the info available are in Chinese and it is also not complete. Check out Iboum.com and you will see what I mean. So many boxes and there are still so many shortcomings.
*
Yep, I get you.

There is simply no magic box for everything and future proof.

So, we just make use of whatever we have, at lowest possible cost for maximum benefits. laugh.gif
TSDannyOP
post Feb 3 2016, 10:50 AM

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Btw what video format can the UE630X read? I tried BDISO 40+GB file it could not detect.
AVFAN
post Feb 3 2016, 11:52 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 3 2016, 10:50 AM)
Btw what video format can the UE630X read? I tried BDISO 40+GB file it could not detect.
*
it can read all common formats incl m2ts.

the reader/player is slow and sensitive - need to switch on/off tv, try a couple of times to get it.

as with other players, cannot expect the tv to read it like a bd player will read bluray disc with full menu, etc.

zipped iso i have not tried, but it will read the unzipped m2ts files.

and u need to find the right main m2ts file!

with optical output, dd truehd->dd, dts hdma->dts.

the video quality is good, as good as other standalone players.

but navigation for audio tracks, subs is clumsy.
TSDannyOP
post Feb 3 2016, 01:23 PM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Feb 3 2016, 11:52 AM)
it can read all common formats incl m2ts.

the reader/player is slow and sensitive - need to switch on/off tv, try a couple of times to get it.

as with other players, cannot expect the tv to read it like a bd player will read bluray disc with full menu, etc.

zipped iso i have not tried, but it will read the unzipped m2ts files.

and u need to find the right main m2ts file!

with optical output, dd truehd->dd, dts hdma->dts.

the video quality is good, as good as other standalone players.

but navigation for audio tracks, subs is clumsy.
*
Aiyoo.. that's the sad part no wonder it could not detect some files. Thanks for your suggestion.

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