Is it ok to take out and insert the mirco usb cable on the keybpard? Can it withstand for at least 5 years if i put out and insert say once a day? Using V60 now..

First post material

You make some good points, but there are a couple of things I just can't accept.

This is (quite literally) a double-standard right from the off. How can there be "two standard layouts", normal and Winkeyless? Doesn't make sense to me. It is ridiculous to see some people griefing others for using gaming keyboards, while at the same time they worship Winkeyless. I find that very hypocritical, especially since Winkeyless keycap sets aren't easy to find either.

Besides, I don't think it's a coincidence that Massdrop's "community chosen design" for their Infinity keyboard shares the same bottom row layout as Razer. A substantial amount of people actually want this layout.


Yes, the whole quality issue is subjective. Having said that, ALL my old Razer mice from 10 years ago are working fine. I just make sure I clean them from time to time and lubricate the switches once a year. My 2013 BW TE has only ever acted up once (keychatter) but that was easily fixed with a can of compressed air on ntw's suggestion. It baffles me when people don't clean their gear, expect it to last forever and bitch & moan when they fail.

As for the whole issue of their marketing and hype, personally I don't find anything wrong with it & give them credit for that.


Referring back to point #1, why not blame those Winkeyless users for contributing to the fragmentation as well? They are equally responsible for keycap GBs not being able to hit MOQ as it won't fit their precious Winkeyless boards.

As much as I hate Razer's fanboys (a lot of them are Cinabeng), I can't stand Winkeyless / korean board fanboys either who call each other god, tailo, sifu. Not lame meh?


This is another very important point. Many keyboard users just don't give a sh*t about changing keycaps, so the whole argument of "you can't buy aftermarket keycaps if you buy a Razer MKB" really doesn't apply to them. Hence, it shouldn't be used as a stick to discourage people / beat people with. I myself enjoy swapping keycaps but am perfectly happy just changing out the WASD & arrow keys on my Razer. I don't see the need to change every single keycap, and I'm sure many others are the same.

Don't mind me, I'm just here for the caps.



This post has been edited by a\/enger: Dec 6 2015, 06:43 PM

Thanks. I tried on all broken keys. Found out the traces got problem. diodes and switches are okay.

davey.havoc

1) Rip off or not, but most groupbuys for keycaps in GH, DT, MD, China forums, Korean forums, they all have supported layout for Wk and Wkl, hence they are dubbed as Standard Layout since it's easily available from most keycaps gb.
Wkl (Winkeyless) comes about because most of the older vintage mechanical keyboards uses that layout. For example, the infamous IBM Model M and some Cherry vintage boards. The early adopters of mkb likes the look of the vintage wkl keyboards and hence they have made it into standard due to popular demands and the availability from big keycaps manufacturers such as SP and GMK.
Initially the groupbuys for keycaps starts with Standard Wk layout, thanks to Moogle, and later on, thanks to Tsangan, somehow because of him we have Wkl kits available in groupbuys and now we can see most of the current groupbuys have Wkl kit included by default.

I have no comment on the Infinity keyboard as I didn't follow the start and progress of it at all, but I think it's a good step towards a globalisation standard for future keycaps groupbuys!

2) Yes, quality is subjective since it's a hit and miss for anything that is manufactured through mass production. 2 keyboards of the same make doesn't necessarily means they have the same quality. This applies to reputable keyboard maker such as Filco and Ducky as well, their products too have defects. I personally didn't own a Razer keyboard before, but this information is what I have seen across a few forums and reviews from users, the complains ranging from key chatter, dead led, malfunction board, and to the rubberized surface finishing starts to peel off. Kailh switch already has bad reputation from the start with it's switch being inconsistent and the stem easily breaking apart. To hear them making switch for razer's new line up is too much for some people, but to be honest I have yet to hear such horror stories from the "new razer" switch. I guess they have up the quality this time around.

3) I agree with you on this, they deserve the credit for the marketing hype they have created.
I guess this can be quite related to the eternal battle between Android and Apple, lol!

4) I have explained some of it in #1. Wkl kit/layout was introduced not long after Wk standards have been made into regular groupbuy. Most people who joins the groupbuy buys the Wkl kit as well even if they are not using it, because this makes it easier to resell them as it covers for both Wk and Wkl users. So there's really no problem or fragmentation for Wk and Wkl.

For the gaming layout mkb users, they can't really change the full keycaps because there's no 6u or 6.5u spacebars included in groupbuys, YET.
This will discourage them from buying/joining the groupbuys because they can't get a fitting spacebar for the colour theme of the keycaps groupbuy unless they don't mind having an odd looking spacebar. Due to this, it reduces the number of potential groupbuy participants as there is a lot of gaming mkb out there.

About the god tailo sifu thing, lol! There's fanboys everywhere. At the moment, the Koreans have the best custom keyboard designers, so their custom keyboard are very expensive and rare due to them making it limited editions. Some of the rare boards are extremely difficult to get even if you can pay for it as they make it exclusive only for Koreans. (If there's anything I dislike about Koreans, it's the way they make keyboards rare, exclusive and expensive, and also kimchi.)

I did mentioned though that changing keycaps is only important to those who likes to change keycaps, so yes, not everyone give two hoots about changing keycaps. Maybe only if their spacebar and wasd legend starts to fade/peel off like this, then they might consider.



Personally, this is a deal breaker to me if I want to ensure my keyboard's longevity or 2nd hand resale value but I'm sure not everyone agrees with me.
Also, I like to have different look on my keyboard by changing the keycaps, which is a wallet breaker thing

Some of the points is what I gathered from various forums and reviews, not entirely from myself. I'm just interpreting and consolidating the information that I've seen so far, with some of my own thoughts into it as well.

Microusb seem to more fragile than Mini USB.
I have had Microusb failed on my phone, but haven't seen any Mini USB failed on my watch.

Anyway, while microUSB is rated to 10000 cycles, I do not think it is a very good idea to cycle it every day.
But on the bright side, when it breaks, if you can fix it, then it is fine.

Nice Krap bruh

Standard layout we only defined for layout like Filco, Ducky layout. (1.25x modifiers)
Winkeyless is not standard, but able to solve with tsangan kit. Need a deep wallet if go to custom.
Like you said, WKL keycaps set not easy to find and with a high cost because mostly comes from groupbuy.

Nothing wrong with the gaming layout, because they really don't looking to buy any after-market keycaps set.
I may say most of them not enthusiasts like us that like keycaps in different design, different font, different materials. They don't hype of keycaps thing.
Their concern is the gaming branding, they proud of it. As long as, the branding is there, they feel motivated.
But they still will buy some small keycaps package like wasd, esc.
For this part, purely based on my experience in selling keycaps to gaming layout users.

These 3 kinds of layout (standard, custom, gaming) co-exists for very long. At the end, all of them contribute to the a lot to mechanical keyboard development.
Standard layout promote typing quality, custom promote quality build, gaming promote bling2 and fancy features.

justnits, appreciate you taking the time to write a detailed reply. This is the kind of discussion our MKB thread needs.

This is something I really don't see. Admittedly I only have 3+ months of MKB shopping experience & spend most of my time surfing non-groupbuy sites. The Massdrop keycap GBs I join are mainly for the cheaper stuff (NPKC / Keycool / Tai-Hao) that don't include WKL options. However, the Signature Plastic GBs I've seen end up having only 1 buyer for 7u spacebar or can't even reach unlock point for WKL adapter kit. Quite a joke really. Hence I'm not really convinced that there's as much demand for WKL as you're telling me.

Of course, those WKL users could all be hiding in GH / DT or foreign language forums, maybe I should start hanging out there.




This looks a bit suspicious to me, as if somebody purposely used their fingernail to scratch the keycap surface. The rest of the keys still look somewhat new.

to be fair, i didn't browse much on Md's keycaps groupbuy recently. my wallet is broke at the moment.
i've looked at the link you provided for the joker theme and the otaku theme.
it feels a bit of a blast into the past lol! that looks more or less like what GH's groupbuy is a couple of years ago!
i remember that i tried to avoid the path of Wkl as it means having to spend more on keycaps....ugh!
you just made me realized, i haven't seen much SP's groupbuy in Gh anymore, i think PMK and MD is the preferred medium for SP's keycaps.
but now i get it why you don't see wkl as standard..haha!

the wkl kit always have lower order because of the expensive price tag and there's without any doubt more standard wk user compared to wkl user.
i usually see moq of 25 or 50 for wkl kit. i don't recall seeing anyone setting 100 moq for wkl kit.
some groupbuy organizers in GH attempt to make it easier for everyone by including wkl kit into the base tkl kit.

SA Retro
Taihao GB

also, all of GMK's and cherry profile PBT dyesub keycaps comes in full set for standard 104 + wkl.

one word of caution, lurk GH at your own risk...or in this case, your wallet's risk.
2 reasons.
1) the groupbuys in gh will make your wallet bleed
2) some of the groupbuys in gh will make your wallet bleed without receiving your end product.

be cautious of popular groupbuy as of recently, they are taking groupbuy participants as donors.
they will delay you for 1-2 years. replacing your missing keys take just as long.
i'm trying my best to be patient with them until i receive all my sets, and then i'm not joining the gb organized by them any more unless there's more rules to make the groupbuy organizers more responsible.

EDIT:
oh, i doubt it's finger nail scratching, but there's other example of worn out keycaps which you can Google.


This post has been edited by justnits: Dec 7 2015, 08:58 AM

guys i plan to buy a 2nd hand mkb
since haven have any job yet
budget tight
mind to ask how to check the condition of the keyboard?
think to get 2nd hand cherry mx blue razer black window ultimate

Test the typing to make sure no key chatter and all the click works as it should.
Tap more on the bigger modifier keys.
Fire up 10fastfinger.com or any typing test thingie to make sure you like it and feel comfortable with it.
Then see if all the led is alright and consistent, meaning no flicker or dim led.

I think these are some basic ones that I would do. Hope it helps

ok
XD
cause buyer say provide 1 week warranty for me
and i find out he mention the cable got bit sign of tear
price rm200 for 2nd hand unit is it ok?
for cherry mx blue , razer black window ultimate

i would definitely try to nego more, probably RM180.. yea, i am cheap i guess

guys,

MMKB tshirt XL size extra available. pm me for details.

haha i thinking to nego that price too
cause quite old item XD
hope seller ok xD

XC Cable in purple white

guys wan to ask
if razer keyboard wire have a bit torn
is it possible mod other stuff to make it nicer?
and razer blackwidow ultimate i saw video they say can install other keycap
can i get any keycap and install on that keyboard by myself?