Hmmmm, I wonder about your comments, the basic fact is that TMnet is currently not providing the service that has been contractually agreed by all of us as users. Further to this TMnet is currently breaking the law/rules according to the "Internet Access Service Provider (IASP) Sub-Code for the Communications and Multimedia Industry Malaysia"

I also think that your argument about what is offered in other countries is a moot point, I have lived in several countries(including Australia) and I have always been able to get UNLIMITED internet at speeds that would knock the socks of TMnet. The government here in Malaysia is trying desperately to achieve certain goals to further advance this beautiful country and with TMnet monopolizing the internet then providing the horrible performance that they are now, they are going against everything the government is trying to achieve.

For TMnet to be subjecting its clients to this sort of treatment is nothing short of criminal, we have yet to see press release notifying us all about the need to take measures such as "controlling the use" or "throttling internet". I have only seen some statistic that has been seemingly pulled from thin air with no supporting evidence that "17% of the users are using 80% of the bandwidth".

I cannot download all my email tonight because my "control of use" has me limited to 5-10KB/sec, I cannot connect to MSN messenger. My connection was working wonderfully right up until they started messing with our internet access approx. 3 months ago and has been as frustrating as hell ever since. I have called TMnet so many times that I think they know me by my voice now when I call, I have written emails, contacted "higher ups", written to newspapers, and am just about ready to go postal if I don't get what I have been so used to having since I got broadband in this country 3 years ago (two years of dialup before that nearly killed me)

TMnet really does need to be held accountable for what it is doing to us all, but who is going to hold them accountable? I'm guessing like most laws in this country that the ISAP is more of a guideline that no one will really ever enforce. Does anyone know a good lawyer that would be interested in fighting our cause?

Yes unlimited is a very general word, but there has never been any mention anywhere of any limitations to this term regarding TMnet's terms and conditions. Yes they have the right to alter their TOS, BUT they have to tell us that they are doing so and they must not contravene the IASP http://tinyurl.com/yh797n

Ahhh yes you do, although you have enlightened me to a few facts (thank you).
How could we f*k tm? Is speed a small thing? (Many on here don't think so) And haven't we all been very tolerant of what is being done to us all? A mature nation would expect high standards from all of it's service providers whether its water, power, sewage, rubbish collection, or ISP. That is what makes us better than a 3rd world country.

So are you saying that TMnet should be more greedy? Why? Because they have created a bigger demand within this country for a service that they monopolize? TM profited 4.5 billion ringit I think I read somewhere, I'd be interested to know how much of that came from TMnet, I can guarantee you that they run nothing at a loss and a good deal of Rakyat money (petronas) has been used to build the infrastructure they are now profiting from.

The big issue with Malaysia is that, we are the piracy capital of Asia. Like it or not, we p4wn even China in terms of %P2P traffic / %total traffic. Malaysians are pretty averagely smart. They know what Bit Torrent is. They want to watch American TV series, anime, Chinese serials, cartoons, download full versions of s/wares. I'm sure we have twice as many percentage of the population who are broadband subscribers and know how to suck bandwidth.

Obviously TM forgot to take this into consideration when offering their packages. They assumed 1:10 bandwidth contention ratio should be sufficient, like most nations including piracy-laden China, or technologically-matured nations like Singapore, Japan, South Korea, UK and Europe. We are still babies in the internet life cycle, so to speak.

Right now, our 1mbit lines are shared with at least 100 other people during peak hours. We simply do not have the capacity. It wasn't planned 3-5 years ago when TM Management and IT guys sat down and decided the RM 88 / 1 mbit / unlimited price point. Obviously the intention is that we can chat 24/7 without worrying about phone bills. We want to be technologically advanced like our neighbours.

But due to this P2P-craving factor that they didn't take seriously, our international pipes became too squished. If there is a window of opportunity for a serious legal challenge to sue TM Net, I'm sure Karpal Singh and all those pissed of lawyer Streamyx users would launch a class-action lawsuit of some sort. If their chances of winning are high, then surely someone must have thought of it, and made frontpage news. No, its not happening. Think about the possible reasons why.

TM worded their contract so sneakily that we cannot push them. You want something that is 90% efficient, and bandwidth is available to you 24/7, like I said, TM offers Direct. Go enquire about bringing a line to your home.

The state of home broadband is terrible, I agree. But then again, there's nothing TM can do without closing shop! Nothing. Unless they throttle. Don't worry, if their promises come true, they'll double their 18gbit capacity to a more decent 36gbit. TIME has some serious fiber, so if the management knows what to do, they'll implement it as necessary.

I think we should cut TM some slack. I'm sure right this moment, many crews of contractors are digging holes, marketing staff are negotiating bringing in more international bandwidth to Malaysia. They don't like to be internationally known as a sucky ISP. They are doing something about it. It just takes time. Its like teaching a stupid spastic boy how to do algebra. It takes lots of time, ok? And it won't happen overnight.

If you think you know how to manage TM, by all means, go ahead! Try running a company, morphware. Just try it.

oh, btw.. there is something wrong with your connection, and its not related to this nationwide BT cap. ON HTTP / Mail / MSN / FTP traffic, I get a full 160KB/s on my connection, most of the time. Need proof? Sometimes u gotta check your config.. Then again, my area could be lucky and yours, not so lucky!

Oh, and your e-mails must be huge! 10KB/s not enough for you. Perhaps you waited an hour for it to download? Damn... that's 36megs assuming an hour's worth of waiting. Hope you have gmail

Hey, Malaysia is a free nation (almost)... if you don't like Streamyx, get the Maxis 3G home broadband thingy. Onlly RM 68 / mth, no time limits!! Available anywhere, modem cost rental included!!! NO PHONE LINE NEEDED!!! NO NEED TO DEAL WITH F*KING TM!!! Nice 3GB cap per month OR go with Jaring BB or Webbit or Time Shyt. Gluck, mate.

o/t: You know what i noticed in school? people are more frustrated becuz their daily supply of puretna.com is lessened with this torrent cap. Must be lah, or else why they're so moody and emotional??? Hahaha....

This post has been edited by excit3: Oct 27 2006, 06:31 PM

You raise some interesting points, yet I doubt your logic with some of what you have to say. Oh and Malaysians are very smart people by the way.

First Malaysia is NOT the piracy capital of the world, sure there is piracy here but there is piracy in EVERY single country of the world. For someone who appears so net savy, you should at least try to google these things to substantiate them before posting. Try http://www.bsa.org

You look at the IPs in your P2P client next time you use it and see what countries you are connecting with, P2P is universal, it has been around for quite some time now, and TMnet were asked by their provider(globenet I think they are called) to purchase more bandwidth a long time ago. There is no excuse I can think of that would be acceptable for TMnet to let the situation get to this. They have tools to monitor network saturation and usage, they employ specialists to maintain the integrity of the network, yet the management ignored these people (hence the reshuffle) and we are all kept in the dark, fed a bunch of lies when we ask why and then expected to just deal with it.

TMnet can do plenty, thats why they are there, and they cannot "close shop" they have a responsibility to this country and this countries' government as the monopoly provider. Did you take the time to read the IASP? It angers me so much that even with this document in place a company as big as TMnet and a company that represents Malaysia on a global scale can get away with flaunting the rules themselves. Its just like most of the laws in this country, there are plenty of them but they are all very selectively enforced and even then you can probably buy your way around them.

As for the high flying lawyers you mentioned, I have no idea what their take might be on this whole situation, I can be fairly sure they aren't P2P users so the issue wouldn't mean much to them like it does to all of us. Maybe all it would take is that someone go and ask for their help and they would step up, I have no idea, and I would never try to second guess any lawyer.

HAHA you sure have faith in TMnet don't you

"I'm sure right this moment, many crews of contractors are digging holes, marketing staff are negotiating bringing in more international bandwidth to Malaysia."

I doubt they are doing doing anything much at all myself, it's been an ongoing problem for months now and I know that if I had such a critical problem with the network I was administering it would have been fixed a hell of a lot faster than this. I won't cut TMnet any slack, if we all take this sort of treatment lying down they won't treat it with any urgency at all, we need to make more noise! Write to TMnet's CEO, service and the newspapers, tv channels, your local member of parliament, call them all as well, if it gets them to move and fix this problem faster GREAT mission accomplished but until then I am doing whatever I can to have my service restored to it's once properly working glory.

FYI, I have managed several companies, I am not a schoolboy as you seem to think I am. Oh and I have a thorough working knowledge when it comes to networks as well, so no there is nothing wrong with my connection as it all checks out fine to the DSLAM up the road beyond that who knows. My connection is sporadic yet my DSL link is solid, I have high SNR and very low attenuation, I get 10KB/sec on P2P and HTTP downloads and webpages will lock up intermittently as well. Yes I do get some large emails, and yes I have a gmail account or two, I also have a web server or two and a mail server, but timeouts suck in any language. I have great bandwidth to Singapore, yet none to the UK or the US, and average to Australia.

I like DSL, those other technologies you mentioned are not suited to me, I liked Streamyx and will again once it is fixed. And I am not going to pay RM12K for what I should be able to get as a regular user.

On that note I hope you get that job in TMnet when you finish school, you would do them proud as a service rep marketing their obviously inadequate network.

hmmmm anybody know what is tmnets profit record? so far, no losses yet????

what losses? those tmnut baboons only know how to take money and not spend it on something we call bandwidth.

morphware, don't waste your time arguing with that tmnut schoolboy. OMG now we know why tmnut is a mess because they hire schoolboys to run their company!!!!!!!

I think we can all agree that TM Net is wrong for over selling their bandwidth and that TM Net is wrong for providing such poor service. Why don't all work from that common ground?

For me, I believe a few things would be in order.

1. Refunds for all customers due to TM Net not providing the service they promised.

2. Revamp of all unlimited packages to introduce download caps. This would mitigate any spikes in demand for download bandwidth and eliminate the need for throttling Streamyx users.

3. Upgrade their network and put in place safeguards, so that this over selling does not happen ever again.

But of course, I must be living in dreamland to be expecting this from TM Net.

Alright come on. Let's all stop flaming each other and focus on our common enemy - TM Net. We mustn't start bickering amongst ourselves as that would be what the Dark Lord would want. We must bring The One Ring to Mordor and ---- urm .. sorry got carried away ...

Statistics lie. Everyone knows that! Numbers can be manipulated to lie. Lets say a Mafia statistics study came out in 3 different countries...

In Brazil, they say Italy has highest % of mafia / population.
In Italy, their study claim China is the mafia king.
In China, they claim Afghanistan.

Are you to say these 3 reputable (assuming...) studies are all wrong? Partly. Maybe the Brazilian study is referring to mafia:population ratio And the Italian study is referring to number of TOTAL mafias and the China study is referring to the net impact of mafias, and the severity.

BSA's numbers might be partly true, but if you think about it, we should think in terms of % of pirates / % of population, because that's what ultimately determines congestion and saturation. To put simply, imagine this:

PRETEND that in China, there are 1000 net users (sample size). All 1000 of them are office workers who go to Cybercafes and all they do is chat on MSN. The measured usage per month, 10GB for everyone per month. 10GB/month is good enough for China.

PRETEND that in Malaysia, the study take 1000 users, this time from LowYat forum. We download all the shyt there is on BT. We need at least 10GB down a day per member! Shove out the calculator and you'll see that's 300 Tera! (40 times more!)

This sort of surveys take samples, so its not a true reflection. You need to use your analytical and logical skills when coming to conclusions when looking at data sets.

malaysia has 0.025 b people. There are 6 b people. Do the math. Of course we'll need to connect to the world to get our "stuff". I can't tell you what i'm DL now, but I see about 40 peers. About 7 of them are Malaysians. If your statistical analysis is right, 17.5% of P2P users in world are Malaysians (!) And you know its not true. And it does not mean Timbuktu or Australia doesn't use P2P because they're not on my peerlist.

RM 88 is only about US$25. Seriously, how much b/width can you get for that money? The only way is to oversubscribe / commit lah! Think of all the external and operating costs associated with running an ISP, and I'd dare say that only US$2.50 of our fees is budgeted for international pipes. Ok, lets collect 2,000 lowyat members and with this US$2.50 each , go to Cogent, Global Crossing, Level 3 and tell them "Hey dudes, we want 2 Gbit bandwidth to feed our Torrent-lust".

US$5,000 buys a 0.1 Gbit pipe at best, and you gotta transport the bandwidth from U.S. or Jap, or SG to Malaysia, further additional costs to light up the fiber.

Its nice to have network specialists looking at the network. If TM decides to do this, (*and I'm sure they have), they will disable / pretend a network maintanance on the bottom 90% of Streamyx bandwidth users and only let the top 10% users connect to the network to stress test. I'm sure even with our multi-gigabit international bandwidth capacity, they'll see their graphs at 90-95% utilisation, even with 90% of Malaysian Streamyx subscribers DISABLED! Haha, that's how serious it is. Ok, so the techies found out, they have their meetings, what can they do? Since you have CEO / management experience, especially in Network some more, go help them kautim lah! Talk is easy, actions are a different ballgame altogether!

Responsibility? Monopoly provider? Who is to say Microsoft is wrong, if Uncle Bill decides to sell everything to Steve Jobs for US$1 and retire a happy life? Microsoft will chap-lup (close shop) and 80% of the world's computer users will be left in the dark? Is Microsoft socially irresponsible? Maybe. Are they wrong? OF COURSE NOT! They are not your slaves ok?? You don't pay them RM 88 so that they MUST sell you expensive international bandwidth at peanuts!

IASP or whatever crap that is, yes its nice on paper. Emron, Mc Donald's, almost everyone has this similar crap about their policy and vision and shyt. SO what? Doesn' mean Emron is clean. Doesn't mean Mc Donald's REALLY REALLY comply with their standards. This is a sinful world, i mean, there's no perfection.

Haha, you'll be surprised on how many lawyers pirate stuff. I personally know many, and yes.. they buy their $10 DVDs along teh pasar malam as well. The cops too, we are Malaysians, we pirate! The problem gets worse as we are so cheapskate that we need to download it via Torrent. The net is meant for education, information and exchange of information (communication), it has turned into a piracy trading den! The problem is particularly worse in Malaysia. That's it.

You're probably a network engineer. I understand your frus. Administering 100s of users with a 4mbit corporate pipe (at best) and all of them want fast download speeds. Amatuers!! If a company in the U.S. has 100s of employees, they'll call up Cogent or Level 3 and get a 100mbit company line (specially for downloading big files) for a mere US$1000/mth, peanuts compared to what TM has to pay for bandwidth.

Btw, I never mentioned you're a schoolboy. Sorry if you perceived that way and I've offended.

May I suggest using EventID 4226 patch? Regular Windows XP updates will cause max connections to be limited to 10 (even though you have hacked it earlier). Otherwise try updating your modem and router's firmware to hack it to enable more simultaneous connections. Just a suggestion.



See, its like I've just bought a Ferrari and bashing it kaw-kaw! Compain that top speed is only 250km/h, suspension too stiff, steering too heavy, braking not responsive, interior looks cheap, legroom insufficient... BUT WE ULTIMATELY LIKE IT, and WE DON'T WANNA BUY A TOYOTA OR SOME OTHER SHYT CUZ ITS "NOT SUITED FOR YOU". hahaha, irony isn't it? I'm not saying Streamyx is as good as Ferrari for ISPs, but you get the point. Its easy to point mistakes, and when we're enjoying the 100KB/s for years, we never complained a bit!

I'm into Finance. So I'll be making Financial decisions when I graduate. Marketing doesn't interest me. But I appreciate your good wishes.

Yupp... Ferrari refunding your RM 4 mil because it doesn't live up to your expections It sucks when we can't do anything. But as per topic, Download Caps are the way to go!

Hope you don't mind some kiddy insults:




"School kids google. Net Savvy people read WSJ, Wikipedia, Digg and THG"




A bigger HAHAHAHAHHA to you, bro! You know TM Net sucks balls, but still stick with them. Its like my wife is abusing and cheating on me, but NOOOOO.... I still love her and wanna be with her because she's a monopoly! Or, putting all your money on Liverpool to win the EPL this season! (peace, cops!!!)

[sidenote]
I wrote to TM about their bandwidth capping. They're smart. They replied that they do not cap anything, which I really truly believe them. The possible explanations are:

1. TM's tier 1 bandwidth providers are capping / shaping, maybe in Singapore, maybe elsewhere. But the link from your computer -> TM -> TM's international gateway, that is uncapped / unthrottled.

2. Priority. Capping and restructuring priority are two different things. You see 160KB/s downloads on HTTP and other protocols. BT protocol has been put to EXTREMELY low priority. So sometimes you see decent speeds to American peers on your Torrents, but most of the time, you can still connect to them, but its very slow.

Well, I wouldn't think of it the way you do. I think of it as Ferrari selling me a Wira in place of an Enzo. Obviously I'd demand a refund. But to each his own.

Haihz, I think I'll just sit back, eat some popcorn and enjoy the show.

But +newbie+, for the past 2-3 years before the throttling, you were getting an Enzo. Only now, the performance is like Wira... and you still want your RM 4mil!

Yeah.. just sit back and enjoy! Come January, if they still don't buck up, then I'll start my own ISP!

really ?? don't forget about those FREQUENT and COMMON problems TM ( unreasonable line disconnection and unreasonalbe speed slow down ---- all happened without any prior notice ).

I think we are start to use "wira" at the very beginning.

Since we were at Wira at the very beginning, why is there so much complaints now that our performance has dropped to that of a 10 year old Wira? Not much difference right?

Thing is, deep down inside, we've been enjoying our Enzo for the past 2-3 years, now TM seems to be robbing us of what we deserve. But do we deserve 90% efficient 1mbit lines 24/7/365 for RM 88 montly?

The consumer would say "hell yes!". The business and management people would say, "F*ck, WHAT??????" and the unbiased person will say, "Lets compromise; lets cap by data usage."

agree with this.
After all, customer is the BOSS. TM must follow what customers ask for. If TM failed to fullfil customer's need, then TM must be F*uck off. As simple as that.

A little article I wrote. Hopefully it will be published on front page!!

Solution for TM Bandwidth Problems
by excit3 (exciting.spam@gmail.com)

Sunday, 28th October 2006

just one question here:
Is quota based on " best effort basic" ??
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
@@ everything just like a fairy tale .... interested to read on but surprised me with the last sentences:
"excit3 is a 20 year old kid studying at Taylors Business School, Subang Jaya."
Hi .... Hi .... r you telling us that you r a genius ?

This post has been edited by work_tgr: Oct 28 2006, 06:51 PM

Nice theory you came up with! I believe many countries such as Australia are using such a plan but instead of being capped back to 128kb isn't it better if after finishing your quota you'll have to pay for extra bandwidth based on a table eg. 100mb 50 cents etc.

This post has been edited by JackX: Oct 28 2006, 07:01 PM

excit3 you are one of the most on the fence people I have come across in the longest time, one minute your putting shit on TMnet then your saying poor TMnet.

I have said what I want to say, if you don't like it too bad, it is my opinion and I really feel it reflects a lot of other peoples opinions as well. I am going to speak to my lawyers this week and see what they have to say, surely I can get something back for all the trouble they are causing and the lost productivity I have suffered.

I couldn't even remote admin one of my servers in Shah Alam the other day, had no hope of reaching any of the others. Even Maybank2U will 404 sometimes how is that excusable?

There is certainly nothing wrong with my system and I have 3 different brand modems and a high end gateway here that all produce identical symptoms. My half open connections are also set properly. I can send and receive files with my neighbor perfectly, I can create a remote season to his system also with no trouble, the problems seem to be further upstream. I think it feels like a dodgy router, router table, or cable, I wish I could go to the TMnet data center and do some of my own diagnostics, but I highly doubt thats going to happen even with the people I know.

Good luck with your Ferrari, won't last long on Malaysian roads I guess thats the Caps on the Ferrari huh?

Hey, I can't control what you say, think or want to think. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, your and mine included. If you think of me that way, so be it!

Nice idea. It was thought of by many ISPs who cap long ago. People complained about the high montly bandwidth bills. So it wasn't a popular option. Maybe that can be an option, you tick a checkbox and TM will charge you accordingly.

I'm the type of people who offers solutions. I'm not the average Malaysian who f*cks this and that and DEMAND a resolution from the offended party. If my boss comes to me, tells me a problem, I don't go dissing him and wishing he would die a painful death. I just tell him what I think it can and should be resolved? Got a problem with that, dude?

My stance is clear. I acknowledge a problem and I offer a solution. It doesn't mean I love TM at all. I'm quite neutral, but I believe with this bandwidth caps, I will love this ISP who brought me American TV series, American pr0n and South Park week in week out. I love TM for that.

I never said nor implied that your opinions stink. I love to hear what you have to say. I want to be like Abdullah, let Dr. M (you) do the talking and not rebutting you line-by-line so that I can give one clear and un-contradictory statement and let it be over with. Goodluck with your lawyers, and if you don't appear on front page news in 7 days time, then you're a big bluff! Everyone here has evidence and will just laugh you off! Proof me wrong, dude....


Whoa.. you're a server admin and don't even know how a Network works? You think you have a direct connection via Streamyx to your servers in Shah Alam?? Heck no. Its your computer -> your modem -> your DSLAM -> hop 1 -> Kelana / Cyber -> hop 2 -> hop 3 -> some router -> some other ISP -> some other ISP's mama's router -> some server -> some bandwidth provider -> your server provider -> your server.

ANYTHING CAN GO F*KING WRONG in between ok? And its totally wrong to diss TM becuz of that.

I have Maybank and RHB. Neither 404'ed on me. Must be your connection, you're pushing your Max TCP with your plethora of server services!!! All your connections (100 or 200 TCP) are probably idle / dead.. meaning all connections at around 0 K/s. So that's the root cause, I suspect.

Cool. You won't believe anyway, but my dad owns a computer shop and I have at least 4 different brands of modem to test at any given time as well as high end Linksys, Dlink, and Belkin shyt. But that doesn't matter. If your physical phone wire to the pole stinks, then no Cisco router can save you. Haven't thought of that, have you? I know you told me about SNR and attenuation, but line, node and local network conditions are more than that.

I love to break the speed limit. I love to zoom in the NPE, NKVE, Kesas, bring it on, baby! Caps are there for a reason. And if you're too noob to figure out, then you're just wasting EVERYONE on lowyat's breathe trying to explain to you that, as well as matters pertaining to bandwidth costs.

Gnite, mate!