For me, if you remove the chairs, remove the music, remove the drums, whatever, I can still worship God.
Been a worship leader, so I know which takes priority.

But as Tozer mentioned, This is not about worship styles. The issue is not traditional versus contemporary versus blended worship. It’s not about organ versus worship band. That discussion misses the point completely. This is about the heart and focus and intent of worship.

It's not an issue really, how modern or how contemporary worship music has evolved today.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Jan 28 2015, 08:44 AM

The world (cosmos - one of the meaning) is a system created by Satan.

The created things of the earth were ordained by God so that man could live for Him, but the systematized things of the world were ordered by Satan to usurp man so that man could not live for God. Satan arranged the world using the things that God ordained for man’s existence. These things have become the components of Satan’s system. He systematizes all the persons, things, and matters that God ordained for man’s existence along with some of his own inventions to organize the world so that he can usurp man.

Satan has mixed the world and the things that he invented with the things of the earth that were ordained by God so that it is difficult for man to distinguish between the two. For example, marriage, children, family, food, and other matters of man’s living are all ordained by God for his existence on the earth so that he can live for God. But Satan has taken the things that man needs for his existence and incorporated them into a worldly system in order to usurp man so that he would not be free to live for God. Originally, marriage, children, family, food, and other matters of man’s living were ordained by God so that he could live for God. Now marriage, children, family, clothing, food, and other matters have become things of the world to usurp man so that he cannot live for God.

In addition to the basic necessities of human existence, Satan also invented things that are not necessary for human living but which tempt people to the extent that they are even more fully systematized and usurped. For example, when some marry, they feel that they must ride in a decorated vehicle, have a certain kind of ceremony, or wear a certain kind of veil. Others feel they must celebrate when a child is born by eating special foods. Still others feel that they must wear special clothes in celebration of a new year or other festivals. None of these things are needed for human existence; they all were invented by Satan to further systematize us in relation to basic human necessities. Although marriage and childbearing are necessary for human existence, riding in a decorated vehicle, wearing a fancy veil, eating special foods, and wearing special clothes are not necessary for human living. Satan has added these items to our basic human necessities in order to further systematize and usurp us.

This post has been edited by pehkay: Jan 28 2015, 10:09 AM

Jesus said? You mean He has talked to you...directly?

I find your incoherence a lil' too unbearable sometimes.


But do you agree on how concert-esque, contemporary music may have been providing a somewhat, wrong message to worshippers?

I sincerely think that Satan is only responsible for arousing the desires exponentially in human beings so that one is to be apart from God, and not the responsible agent of the of the inventions, innovations, and the creations of non-metaphysical stimuli in the world. And I find it rather distasteful to blame too many things on the Devil, because in the end, it is our own sins that produces the consequences we all see today, and while the Devil will be judged as noted in the book of Revelations, we too, are to be judged accordingly, and no amount of, "Oh! It's Satan's fault, not mine" can redeem oneself easily from one's own sins.

The earth is not created by God? Acts 17:24

Hi have you tried ETF like tapping therapy? It helps to deal with unexplained pain. My friend is a qualified therapist. Let me know if you wanna try.

Depends on the content of the message, if it leads people to Christ, how can it be wrong?
God can use any form of vessels for his Glory and Work. For example, He did use heathen people like False Prophet Balaam or Persian King Cyrus.
I mean if unbelievers can be used, what more contemporary form of worship music.

If you're worried that it'll drain spiritually mature worshiper, my take is that, those who are spiritually mature will naturally seek elsewhere.
Same thing with preachers like Joel Osteen, though much criticized, but if you read testimonies on Lakewood Church web page of how people on the verge of giving up on life came back to God through his preaching, I say He is used by God. If He is used by God it also means his preaching is anointed by God.

Same thing goes to worship group like Planetshakers, HillSongs, Jesus Culture, Worship Central, Bethel Church, etc. God can use them.



This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Jan 28 2015, 02:53 PM

I wonder where do local churches get their supply of communion hosts and altar wine?

lucky you met me here hahaha... i have been working with many pastor, and yes there are some pastor just like that.

Fortunate for you, there are a lot of church in malaysia with pastor that do job exactly like what i wrote.

So pastor are human, and human does have personalities.

If your pastor acts like what you wrote, then it's time to ask HS what steps need to be done. I will continue with you later on, on this issue.

---

in the meantime, look at this link to have a broader view on what is a "bad-pastor". Again, for every material that you read, ask HS what is it that you need to eat, and what to not eat.

http://www.sharefaith.com/blog/2011/07/bad-pastor/

What i mean is John 10:11
"I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.

thx for clarification, it helps me to understand more abt ppl here...

Ah, yes of course. I should've thought of it that way.

Thanks.

It will help if you can be a lil' more precise at certain times.

You are not gonna tell me the bible verse is out of context right ? hehe: just kidding ...

This post has been edited by de1929: Jan 28 2015, 03:14 PM

ETF is Emotional Freedom Techniques

He is ETF therapist

For more info and details, you can check it out here - http://www.akusihat.com/eft-tapping-therapy/

His charges is reasonable. Not expensive. After learn, you can be your own therapist.

It is just like acupuncture but without needle.

anti depression medicine won't help you for long term and it comes with side effect and dependency. medicine/drug is always the last resort when all fail.

This post has been edited by ngaisteve1: Jan 28 2015, 03:44 PM

IMO, it is never always something is this and not the other. Yeah, I will amen that Satan works within us as the sinful nature but/and also without, being systematized in a world system (1 John 5:19; John 12:31; Eph. 6:12)

So, no escape ...

Also, the thought of absolving all blame because "it's Satan" is kinda foreign to me. I am always condemned when I found that I am still worldly in many aspects.

Also we will be judged on whether we experienced His full salvation in the matter of being saved from the world.

Cheers bro!

Not Earth, system of the world.

If you see for example, in the Movies, TV Shows, even Media Writings, the values being portrayed today, so accurately anti God.
It's no coincidence.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Jan 28 2015, 03:59 PM

I must be sleeping .. yeah thx

This post has been edited by pehkay: Jan 28 2015, 04:12 PM

Dude, you asked him offline lahh... how big your church ? if 2000 members sure there are body guards. then it's different approach.

if it's too rude, then ask him lunch lah... asking lunch means you appreciate his ministry... again how big your church ? if 2000 members sure there are body guards. then it's different approach.

ha, depends on the Church.

Some is just biscuits and ribena which you can get from anywhere.

Lol the methodist church just use wafers and blackcurrent. I rmeembered as a kid we use ribena.

I tot the bread has to be without yeast and the 'wine' should be 'grape juice'? Ribena is blackcurrant.

Yeah.

Not important from biblical POV because whatever substance that we use, God will anoint it just the same when we take it in remembrance of our Lord Jesus.